Transcripts For RT News 20240713 : comparemela.com

A very warm welcome to the program from all of us here at r t h q in moscow joining us this hour. The World Health Organization has declared that the corona virus can now be labeled as a pandemic. In the plants 2 weeks the number of cases. Increases. And the number of 52 countries. We have that. System and that 19 can be contacted i used as a pundit make. The number of infections has now tops more than 118000 across the globe with more than 4000 deaths across a virus has spread to 114 countries with numbers growing by the day. In the race to find a vaccine for the virus scientists in london are on the lookout for human guinea pigs to infect for money and the 1st test of its kind. We can announce that we have commenced the development of the worlds 1st commercial human coronavirus challenge study more to also known as controlled human infection model we are pleased to be able to try and assist in the battle against coded 19. The study 15. 00 to 24. 00 people with 2 strains of corona virus similar to cope at 19 but causing milder symptoms of scientists trying to develop a vaccine against the outbreak volunteers will be paid as much as 3 and a half 1000 pounds but only visits from doctors will break up their 2 weeks in isolation we asked one a nurse if theyd be tempted to take part. No i cant if i was younger. But im one of those so dont you one say going to kick the bucket say. You know. I havent worked for a month so really money. Wow. I dont know 10000. Too much. Corn to my so i mean i wont die from it but i hope that im not even tightly complaints to the statistics behind it its true anyway oh why not get infected twice to get twice as much at the age of 71. Now because i have hundreds of Health Conditions why would i if you have no i wouldnt. Really saying seriously to kiss now seriously now. You know you know the pope said shes pushy people are going to be changed do you think if youre healthy and. Then they would be a danger people here i would be we dont. Think. Theyre safe cost for my son whos much younger. But. I think of the beginning i thought people were over i think something on this time like how serious it was but when i heard like schools were being closed how many people go affected thats when i realized ok you see it doesnt serve me to scare mongering people for most people to sentiments are more like flu until yesterday i was thinking people were over reacting today im starting to realize that ive got to take it seriously course you have to like. Be taking care of it didnt like wash your hands and stuff but otherwise i feel its. Yeah its just too much i dont know for. A high profile right wing german politician appears to be the latest victim of Violent Attacks on lawmakers in the country and less fast from the alternative for Germany Party his car destroyed by arson in berlin there are reports on the worrying trend. This street is the scene of what is potentially the latest in a growing number of politically motivated crimes in germany this time its all the car the politician nicholas faced go up in flames last night a car caught fire in charlotte and bork the firefighters extinguished the blaze but could not save the car because of the suspicion of a possible political motivation were handing the investigation over to a specialist unit yesterday morning the Police Called told me that my car had been. Set on fire 2 in the morning and that was really damaged festers a member of the European Parliament for the anti immigration alternative that Germany Party hes pretty adamant that who he thinks is behind this im not the 1st victim of this kind of arson attacks this is really the signature. Of the anti fire and therefore its pretty clear although they havent really up to no they havent claimed this arson attack yet but its clear that behind this attack stance and a. F. P. Is a party have a polarizing effect on german Public Opinion there anti immigrant stance and deliberately provocative statements from so members has seen them rising in the polls and slammed by their rivals party which tolerates the far right extremists and lets call a spade a spade nazis and monitoring. The a. F. D. Is a racist and nationalist a military state party. Party which is openly nationalist they are against foreigners and they have members who are close to being fascists the cochairman of the even appealed to all journalists and politicians to tone down their rhetoric against the party after a rise in the number of violent incidents. Whenever a car set on fire or the apartment or house of. Attacked you can be sure this is an attack against. They tried to they tried to bully not only us but also people of who. You know who are letting their apartments to members of the in a democracy you have to. Come to terms even with members of parties which games you do not support its not just politicians from controversial parties that are facing up to the prospect of attack in germany 2019 so well over a 1000 politically motivated attacks on politicians with a recent poll of masm the country saying a large number of them had be insulted assaulted or simply threatened with quite a few saying they being beaten or spots us in 2015 independent mayor of cologne henrietta reckoned narrowly survived an assassination attempt by isnt a full of extremists who stabbed her in the neck the day before the election the attack was motivated by wreckers pro refugee stance last june seeing it see the politician fall to live was shot dead at his home in central germany a far right nationalist with possible links to a. F. He is facing trial for his murder the government says called for an increase in security for politicians serving the public who will increasingly finding themselves in the line of fire overall to believe. U. S. Coalition forces in iraq have confirmed more than 15 rockets have hit a base housing American Military personnel near baghdad and investigation has been launched the attack is the latest on u. S. And coalition facilities in iraq following unverified video claims to show the moment of the rocket attack on tuesday washington announced it would be deploying Missile Defense systems in iraq over fears of further iranian air tell it were attacks tensions in the region have remained high following the u. S. Air strike on irans top general earlier in the year. Or more were going to cross live now to middle east analyst mark walk off now American Military outpost have been a frequent target of attacks in the past few months do you think of be behind this one. We dont know theres no one claiming responsibility there is no one seeing what they mean by this it could be either way either. If its. Like the United States would like to say. Trying to harass American Forces not letting them feel at ease and so long hoary could equally be someone who wants the level of alert the level of pension between the United States and iran to remain high even though weve heard. Yesterdays state that you know there is deterrence against iran and so on and so forth the wall street journal did report that about a 1000 troopers were withdrawn from kuwait on the further 2000 troopers are to be withdrawn as well from American Forces comes over there because the level of threat in their opinion their. The level of threat from a literary retaliation for the assassination of general cause of so many has reduced and i could go back to 2 theories you could go back to hearing in affiliated militia as the United States would like to put it saying well actually has introduced not quite or it could be somewhat easy to desert them. Trying to you know. To steer a fight so to speak between the iranians and the americans so what we have is this antiamerican sentiment running high in iraq these attacks that weve been seeing how is the deployment of u. S. Air missiles going to be seen and even approved by the government there. In iraq there are certain dynamics inside the Iraqi Society so whilst i would argue the majority of iraqis would see america as a threat clear majority of iraqis would see america as a threat some iraqis might see america as an ally and this is a problem not caused by iraqi internal politics but probably due to meddling into your rocky politics by the United States by United States allies who would like to just to fire american prisons inside iraq the kurds for example would be not so happy if they see the American Forces back. But at the end of the day this is for the iraqis to sit together and as long as there is some sort of you want to institute of common interest then the United States wont be able to play on these divisions and actually deepen that it so all at the end of the day i dont think any iraqi feels on long term that the american presence is you know of a paramount importance probably most of them feel that this is actually hindering iraqi progress iraqi political system progress. And that the iraqis should be left alone to their own devices and instruments but then some people some of them might be the control and say ok were probably better off right now having the americans present rather than leaving to say. Im our walk off middle east analyst thank you for joining us on the program tonight. Joe biden heads the pack to clinch the Democratic Party nomination after the former u. S. Vice president chalked up big wins in the latest round of primaries for all those who have been knocked down all those have been counted left behind this is your campaign. Just over a week ago many of the pundits declared that this candidacy was did. Now are very much alive. One in mississippi michigan missouri and idaho 3 of these are delegate rich states which rival Bernie Sanders picked up in 2016 thats led to biden being presented by much of the media as the candidate best place to beat donald trump in november despite some notable gaffes along the way and explains. The race for the democratic nomination is down to 2 horses and its pretty clear where the bets are going there on joe biden the good guy its a time for us to beat donald trump and it became very clear to me that joe biden is the right person to do that hes the nicest person ive ever met he is just a good guy and why not have a good guy in the white house after all for the past 3 years the media has been working very hard to convince everyone that pure evil has overtaken the u. S. Presidency but it doesnt take very deep digging to discover that you can rub off joe bidens good guy shine take a look at how he insulted Detroit Assembly plant worker who questioned his views on gun rights. He also has hinted that he believes that race and intellectual ability are somehow connected to your kids you just as brady just as towns white kids on top of that he is known to just make things up and say things on the fly that have absolutely no connection to reality we choose unity over division we choose science over fiction we choose truth over facts and a lot of ways joe biden sounds an awful lot like donald trump lets see if americans can tell them apart i bet youre as bright as you are good looking. Thats actually joe biden surprise we choose truth over facts. I was actually joe biden also poor kids are just as bright and just as talented as white kids by the way without actually biden and youre a lying dog faced pony soldier. So its got to be true and actually biden. Also the narrative is supposed to be that donald trump is a big mean bully and joe biden is a lovable adorable grandpa with good intentions and hes supposed to be way better than that wild eyed radical Bernie Sanders except dont you remember how recently everyone was bashing joe biden i just think biden is declining i dont think he has the energy and he has been a skilled debater we saw him with sarah palin weve seen him in the past the question is does he still have his job and destroy native and is he how sure are busy can you imagine that man in a president ial did by we dont trump theres not enough popcorn in the world to do is how subtly biden inserts obama into every possible answer having significant mental faculties issues is everyone ok with biden being president of the United States when hes having difficulty remembering the name of you know politicians that hed be dealing with on a regular basis but now we are told that opposition to joe biden is a russian plot the kremlins english language media aim to influence americans on the tough activity promotes conspiracy theories targeting biden one lording trumps efforts to investigate a political opponent predicted detroit will win a 2nd term claimed that biden is called to be unraveling on some eyes that allegations of corruption are doing real damage to his president ial bid now the race is getting heated as the field has narrowed so the question is now will joe biden be able to keep that good guy image when its time to start taking shots at Bernie Sanders. R. T. New york. In an unprecedented move the u. K. Supreme court has found that experimenting with explosives can be legal and after a man was cleared by the court of terror related charges 22 year old Chaz Copeland who was diagnosed with autism was a are. Rested in 28000. 00 after making homemade bombs and conducting experimental explosions and his back yard he was initially charged with 6 counts of possessing information likely to be useful for an act of terrorism copeland was handed a 22 month prison sentence but has now been cleared of the more serious terror charges Supreme Court judges have now ruled that copelands actions were legal serving the purpose of personal experimentation and self education. Now joining us live now to discuss this further and break down all the subtleties is Senior Research fellow at Leeds Beckett University Law school and former Police Officer david low and human rights lawyer now if we could go ahead and start with you isnt this a dangerous precedent to be set the idea that experiment thing with explosives is illegal. No i dont think so in fact as the Supreme Court said this isnt an entirely new concept in any event obviously they went through the laws as we know them. You know the statutes of the law that parliament made and found that this wasnt something new that they were introducing for the 1st time in any event but 2nd you know i dont think so like they said specially obviously every case is different and we have to look at the facts of each case but for instance in this case the explosive substance that this 22 year old at the time perhaps even younger had made in in the unit in the garden shed in his house was just less than 10 grams of that substance and as the judge said as a Supreme Court said that even if he had to use it in an explosive in an explosion it would have caused quite an interest on shirt is the word they used. Explosion so there was there would be no harm caused and so i think thats basically what the court is saying that just because someone has in their possession you know any amount of any explosive substance doesnt mean that they should be guilty of a criminal offense or a tariff and so i think in fact its a proportionate sensitive sensible rational decision david would you call it proportionate. Nohant i was disappointed with the decision and afraid i sit with the 2 dissenting judges you know i look at it from from the aspect of terrorism this country the u. K. Faces a terrorist threat from 3 fronts there is a missed the extreme far right than they are nazis and of course across the i. O. C. In particular this is inside republicans that are lessons to give given this defense of experimentation and and education. My my main question is why would anyone want to have explosives in the 1st place but its not this side of it and im with the dissenting judges if you have this possession of explosives no matter how small its got to be lawful i think that really was as i said disappointing for me that the of the 3 judges went the other way. What would you say about the fact that even if it wasnt an idea of him being a danger to others he would be a danger to himself. And one of us i think thats what he has to prove and thats what the judges then said that you cant just dismiss it immediately just say you know because you possessed it we cant see any lawful reason for you to have this substance therefore you cant defend yourself therefore thats what youre guilty of the offense and i think thats basically what the judge said that he should at least have been allowed to defend himself run that defense it can be a lawful defense theyre not saying it would be a lawful defense in every case regardless of the substance regardless of the amount regardless of what that person does and what theyre saying is it can be lawful and i think i agree with that also im just picking up on the point just now i think the issue also is which i see. You know not a great thing and that is the overexpansion and disproportionate use of terror legislation you know you dont give you know border officials for your phone or i pad or computer or laptop password you dont give it thats a criminal offense people who are protesting against Climate Change thats a credit thats a terrorist offense so i think this over use and over Expansion Expansion of terror fences i think this is a good at least a good 1st step to say that no i dont everything where you see explosives or where you see something where you dont quite understand what the person is doing or what their motives are it doesnt mean that theyre they should be treated as a terrorist suspect. David do you agree with that point the idea that the terrorism charges are really whats at issue here go ahead. You know not really i mean you know via mental protests i mean i think she might be mistaken for some of the World Health Organization<\/a> has declared that the corona virus can now be labeled as a pandemic. In the plants 2 weeks the number of cases. Increases. And the number of 52 countries. We have that. System and that 19 can be contacted i used as a pundit make. The number of infections has now tops more than 118000 across the globe with more than 4000 deaths across a virus has spread to 114 countries with numbers growing by the day. In the race to find a vaccine for the virus scientists in london are on the lookout for human guinea pigs to infect for money and the 1st test of its kind. We can announce that we have commenced the development of the worlds 1st commercial human coronavirus challenge study more to also known as controlled human infection model we are pleased to be able to try and assist in the battle against coded 19. The study 15. 00 to 24. 00 people with 2 strains of corona virus similar to cope at 19 but causing milder symptoms of scientists trying to develop a vaccine against the outbreak volunteers will be paid as much as 3 and a half 1000 pounds but only visits from doctors will break up their 2 weeks in isolation we asked one a nurse if theyd be tempted to take part. No i cant if i was younger. But im one of those so dont you one say going to kick the bucket say. You know. I havent worked for a month so really money. Wow. I dont know 10000. Too much. Corn to my so i mean i wont die from it but i hope that im not even tightly complaints to the statistics behind it its true anyway oh why not get infected twice to get twice as much at the age of 71. Now because i have hundreds of Health Conditions<\/a> why would i if you have no i wouldnt. Really saying seriously to kiss now seriously now. You know you know the pope said shes pushy people are going to be changed do you think if youre healthy and. Then they would be a danger people here i would be we dont. Think. Theyre safe cost for my son whos much younger. But. I think of the beginning i thought people were over i think something on this time like how serious it was but when i heard like schools were being closed how many people go affected thats when i realized ok you see it doesnt serve me to scare mongering people for most people to sentiments are more like flu until yesterday i was thinking people were over reacting today im starting to realize that ive got to take it seriously course you have to like. Be taking care of it didnt like wash your hands and stuff but otherwise i feel its. Yeah its just too much i dont know for. A high profile right wing german politician appears to be the latest victim of Violent Attacks<\/a> on lawmakers in the country and less fast from the alternative for Germany Party<\/a> his car destroyed by arson in berlin there are reports on the worrying trend. This street is the scene of what is potentially the latest in a growing number of politically motivated crimes in germany this time its all the car the politician nicholas faced go up in flames last night a car caught fire in charlotte and bork the firefighters extinguished the blaze but could not save the car because of the suspicion of a possible political motivation were handing the investigation over to a specialist unit yesterday morning the Police Called<\/a> told me that my car had been. Set on fire 2 in the morning and that was really damaged festers a member of the European Parliament<\/a> for the anti immigration alternative that Germany Party<\/a> hes pretty adamant that who he thinks is behind this im not the 1st victim of this kind of arson attacks this is really the signature. Of the anti fire and therefore its pretty clear although they havent really up to no they havent claimed this arson attack yet but its clear that behind this attack stance and a. F. P. Is a party have a polarizing effect on german Public Opinion<\/a> there anti immigrant stance and deliberately provocative statements from so members has seen them rising in the polls and slammed by their rivals party which tolerates the far right extremists and lets call a spade a spade nazis and monitoring. The a. F. D. Is a racist and nationalist a military state party. Party which is openly nationalist they are against foreigners and they have members who are close to being fascists the cochairman of the even appealed to all journalists and politicians to tone down their rhetoric against the party after a rise in the number of violent incidents. Whenever a car set on fire or the apartment or house of. Attacked you can be sure this is an attack against. They tried to they tried to bully not only us but also people of who. You know who are letting their apartments to members of the in a democracy you have to. Come to terms even with members of parties which games you do not support its not just politicians from controversial parties that are facing up to the prospect of attack in germany 2019 so well over a 1000 politically motivated attacks on politicians with a recent poll of masm the country saying a large number of them had be insulted assaulted or simply threatened with quite a few saying they being beaten or spots us in 2015 independent mayor of cologne henrietta reckoned narrowly survived an assassination attempt by isnt a full of extremists who stabbed her in the neck the day before the election the attack was motivated by wreckers pro refugee stance last june seeing it see the politician fall to live was shot dead at his home in central germany a far right nationalist with possible links to a. F. He is facing trial for his murder the government says called for an increase in security for politicians serving the public who will increasingly finding themselves in the line of fire overall to believe. U. S. Coalition forces in iraq have confirmed more than 15 rockets have hit a base housing American Military<\/a> personnel near baghdad and investigation has been launched the attack is the latest on u. S. And coalition facilities in iraq following unverified video claims to show the moment of the rocket attack on tuesday washington announced it would be deploying Missile Defense<\/a> systems in iraq over fears of further iranian air tell it were attacks tensions in the region have remained high following the u. S. Air strike on irans top general earlier in the year. Or more were going to cross live now to middle east analyst mark walk off now American Military<\/a> outpost have been a frequent target of attacks in the past few months do you think of be behind this one. We dont know theres no one claiming responsibility there is no one seeing what they mean by this it could be either way either. If its. Like the United States<\/a> would like to say. Trying to harass American Forces<\/a> not letting them feel at ease and so long hoary could equally be someone who wants the level of alert the level of pension between the United States<\/a> and iran to remain high even though weve heard. Yesterdays state that you know there is deterrence against iran and so on and so forth the wall street journal did report that about a 1000 troopers were withdrawn from kuwait on the further 2000 troopers are to be withdrawn as well from American Forces<\/a> comes over there because the level of threat in their opinion their. The level of threat from a literary retaliation for the assassination of general cause of so many has reduced and i could go back to 2 theories you could go back to hearing in affiliated militia as the United States<\/a> would like to put it saying well actually has introduced not quite or it could be somewhat easy to desert them. Trying to you know. To steer a fight so to speak between the iranians and the americans so what we have is this antiamerican sentiment running high in iraq these attacks that weve been seeing how is the deployment of u. S. Air missiles going to be seen and even approved by the government there. In iraq there are certain dynamics inside the Iraqi Society<\/a> so whilst i would argue the majority of iraqis would see america as a threat clear majority of iraqis would see america as a threat some iraqis might see america as an ally and this is a problem not caused by iraqi internal politics but probably due to meddling into your rocky politics by the United States<\/a> by United States<\/a> allies who would like to just to fire american prisons inside iraq the kurds for example would be not so happy if they see the American Forces<\/a> back. But at the end of the day this is for the iraqis to sit together and as long as there is some sort of you want to institute of common interest then the United States<\/a> wont be able to play on these divisions and actually deepen that it so all at the end of the day i dont think any iraqi feels on long term that the american presence is you know of a paramount importance probably most of them feel that this is actually hindering iraqi progress iraqi political system progress. And that the iraqis should be left alone to their own devices and instruments but then some people some of them might be the control and say ok were probably better off right now having the americans present rather than leaving to say. Im our walk off middle east analyst thank you for joining us on the program tonight. Joe biden heads the pack to clinch the Democratic Party<\/a> nomination after the former u. S. Vice president chalked up big wins in the latest round of primaries for all those who have been knocked down all those have been counted left behind this is your campaign. Just over a week ago many of the pundits declared that this candidacy was did. Now are very much alive. One in mississippi michigan missouri and idaho 3 of these are delegate rich states which rival Bernie Sanders<\/a> picked up in 2016 thats led to biden being presented by much of the media as the candidate best place to beat donald trump in november despite some notable gaffes along the way and explains. The race for the democratic nomination is down to 2 horses and its pretty clear where the bets are going there on joe biden the good guy its a time for us to beat donald trump and it became very clear to me that joe biden is the right person to do that hes the nicest person ive ever met he is just a good guy and why not have a good guy in the white house after all for the past 3 years the media has been working very hard to convince everyone that pure evil has overtaken the u. S. Presidency but it doesnt take very deep digging to discover that you can rub off joe bidens good guy shine take a look at how he insulted Detroit Assembly<\/a> plant worker who questioned his views on gun rights. He also has hinted that he believes that race and intellectual ability are somehow connected to your kids you just as brady just as towns white kids on top of that he is known to just make things up and say things on the fly that have absolutely no connection to reality we choose unity over division we choose science over fiction we choose truth over facts and a lot of ways joe biden sounds an awful lot like donald trump lets see if americans can tell them apart i bet youre as bright as you are good looking. Thats actually joe biden surprise we choose truth over facts. I was actually joe biden also poor kids are just as bright and just as talented as white kids by the way without actually biden and youre a lying dog faced pony soldier. So its got to be true and actually biden. Also the narrative is supposed to be that donald trump is a big mean bully and joe biden is a lovable adorable grandpa with good intentions and hes supposed to be way better than that wild eyed radical Bernie Sanders<\/a> except dont you remember how recently everyone was bashing joe biden i just think biden is declining i dont think he has the energy and he has been a skilled debater we saw him with sarah palin weve seen him in the past the question is does he still have his job and destroy native and is he how sure are busy can you imagine that man in a president ial did by we dont trump theres not enough popcorn in the world to do is how subtly biden inserts obama into every possible answer having significant mental faculties issues is everyone ok with biden being president of the United States<\/a> when hes having difficulty remembering the name of you know politicians that hed be dealing with on a regular basis but now we are told that opposition to joe biden is a russian plot the kremlins english language media aim to influence americans on the tough activity promotes conspiracy theories targeting biden one lording trumps efforts to investigate a political opponent predicted detroit will win a 2nd term claimed that biden is called to be unraveling on some eyes that allegations of corruption are doing real damage to his president ial bid now the race is getting heated as the field has narrowed so the question is now will joe biden be able to keep that good guy image when its time to start taking shots at Bernie Sanders<\/a>. R. T. New york. In an unprecedented move the u. K. Supreme court has found that experimenting with explosives can be legal and after a man was cleared by the court of terror related charges 22 year old Chaz Copeland<\/a> who was diagnosed with autism was a are. Rested in 28000. 00 after making homemade bombs and conducting experimental explosions and his back yard he was initially charged with 6 counts of possessing information likely to be useful for an act of terrorism copeland was handed a 22 month prison sentence but has now been cleared of the more serious terror charges Supreme Court<\/a> judges have now ruled that copelands actions were legal serving the purpose of personal experimentation and self education. Now joining us live now to discuss this further and break down all the subtleties is Senior Research<\/a> fellow at Leeds Beckett<\/a> University Law<\/a> school and former Police Officer<\/a> david low and human rights lawyer now if we could go ahead and start with you isnt this a dangerous precedent to be set the idea that experiment thing with explosives is illegal. No i dont think so in fact as the Supreme Court<\/a> said this isnt an entirely new concept in any event obviously they went through the laws as we know them. You know the statutes of the law that parliament made and found that this wasnt something new that they were introducing for the 1st time in any event but 2nd you know i dont think so like they said specially obviously every case is different and we have to look at the facts of each case but for instance in this case the explosive substance that this 22 year old at the time perhaps even younger had made in in the unit in the garden shed in his house was just less than 10 grams of that substance and as the judge said as a Supreme Court<\/a> said that even if he had to use it in an explosive in an explosion it would have caused quite an interest on shirt is the word they used. Explosion so there was there would be no harm caused and so i think thats basically what the court is saying that just because someone has in their possession you know any amount of any explosive substance doesnt mean that they should be guilty of a criminal offense or a tariff and so i think in fact its a proportionate sensitive sensible rational decision david would you call it proportionate. Nohant i was disappointed with the decision and afraid i sit with the 2 dissenting judges you know i look at it from from the aspect of terrorism this country the u. K. Faces a terrorist threat from 3 fronts there is a missed the extreme far right than they are nazis and of course across the i. O. C. In particular this is inside republicans that are lessons to give given this defense of experimentation and and education. My my main question is why would anyone want to have explosives in the 1st place but its not this side of it and im with the dissenting judges if you have this possession of explosives no matter how small its got to be lawful i think that really was as i said disappointing for me that the of the 3 judges went the other way. What would you say about the fact that even if it wasnt an idea of him being a danger to others he would be a danger to himself. And one of us i think thats what he has to prove and thats what the judges then said that you cant just dismiss it immediately just say you know because you possessed it we cant see any lawful reason for you to have this substance therefore you cant defend yourself therefore thats what youre guilty of the offense and i think thats basically what the judge said that he should at least have been allowed to defend himself run that defense it can be a lawful defense theyre not saying it would be a lawful defense in every case regardless of the substance regardless of the amount regardless of what that person does and what theyre saying is it can be lawful and i think i agree with that also im just picking up on the point just now i think the issue also is which i see. You know not a great thing and that is the overexpansion and disproportionate use of terror legislation you know you dont give you know border officials for your phone or i pad or computer or laptop password you dont give it thats a criminal offense people who are protesting against Climate Change<\/a> thats a credit thats a terrorist offense so i think this over use and over Expansion Expansion<\/a> of terror fences i think this is a good at least a good 1st step to say that no i dont everything where you see explosives or where you see something where you dont quite understand what the person is doing or what their motives are it doesnt mean that theyre they should be treated as a terrorist suspect. David do you agree with that point the idea that the terrorism charges are really whats at issue here go ahead. You know not really i mean you know via mental protests i mean i think she might be mistaken for some of the Police Forces<\/a> that were starting to put on the potential prevent agenda you know the we have made environmental protests a terrorist issue the key through the 3 terrorist issues the 3 that i mentioned the fact is that you know terrorism legislation has to be why because when the key things of mistrust free preventative measures and so on is and ive been there myself when youre investigating you want to prevent with the small pay you want to prevent an attack from happening the last thing you want to do is detect and you need wide powers of surveillance you need all the areas to do that successfully. Job is there any blame to be placed on the parents this is she said that her son had autism that it was just obsession over f. B. I. Movies and whatnot should she not have been monitoring the situation a little bit closer. To be honest no i dont think so i mean like we saw in our the situation many years on now we can look at it with the benefit of hindsight this person this boy this man and he did not harm himself he did not harm anyone else he was a 1000000 experimenter obviously i mean because of his condition he might have had you know it does cause a person to become antisocial perhaps he was withdrawn perhaps he was an introvert he wasnt able to join the army as he wanted to because of this condition so was mainly experimenting. In his garden shed so he didnt cause anyone else any harm and i think thats what the Supreme Court<\/a> said i would agree with that you know it was just experimentation it was just learning as the Supreme Court<\/a> said you know self learning i mean if anything its a benefit but i dont see any harm that came from it so i dont think there was anything wrong with the parents saying you know fine as long as youre safe and everyones safe and theres no harm then you know find you pursue your interest pursue your hobby. David i can see shaking your head there i have to do is. Have to disagree you know we were talking about an individual in the shed with the explosive being he was also make initiators and detonators and becomes technical and i want to know why would anybody in their right mind. Just want to have explosives on their own property because theres no legitimate reason its like with firearms mobey 5 issues in the past weve introduced legislation to patel use of firearms. To me its just that this is not normal on the no charge copeman was suffering with autism and maybe that should have been a mitigating factor in the sentencing may be that you know the way to look at it was to give a victim but maybe just either sense and see how the on remand or suspended sentence i mean the courts have done this in the past. The fence has been committed i look at jack lets parents yes they they they were guilty of funding terrorism but they would give. A suspended sentence may be those factors that charge talking about would be more mitigating but to me its just incredible that you know the 3 judges in the Supremes Court<\/a> made the decision the dude. Shirley or you pointed out the fact that he wanted to be in the military he dreamed about he was not able to because of his autism and that this was more of a hobby for him and hobbies are well and good but arent there certain things that are just too dangerous to be obvious no but i think i mean like i said now that you know at least we know now it wasnt dangerous dangerous it didnt prove to be dangerous i mean i suspect david said now you know they can be no legitimate reason so thats exactly what the court said that they can be theyre not saying that they always is theyre not saying anyone who have a does that regardless of the circumstances must be acquitted what theyre saying is that they can be as was in this case and i think thats the important issue here that we cant just arrest someone or convict someone or call someone a terror a terrorist or a terror suspect or an extremist just because they have they possess those substances and i think thats the important thing thats the distinction the court made that it doesnt mean that. Anyone who does that will be innocent but similarly doesnt mean that not everyone who does it is guilty and i think thats a very important useful helpful you know precedent that the Supreme Court<\/a> set. And im sure thats what was on their minds david the idea that innocent until proven guilty. Well its an absolute fundamental. Concept in our judicial system and our legal system and im always for that it is the case and certainly in my previous occupation my job was to get the evidence give it to the c. P. S. So we could not only charge but have sufficient evidence to prosecute and its absolutely essential people and instances down to the state to prove that but i think we have to look at this from a source of my parts im looking at more pragmatic view i look at the nature of what Charles Copeland<\/a> was doing on a said to me ok on this occasion that may have been in substantial amounts of explosives. A major disaster to happen but i dont think thats the point i think its that for me its the legal point of the fact that you have these explosives and ok that could be a defense but with the 2 dissenting judges you need a lawful ringback purpose and thats what they said and i agree with them. I think thats really whats at issue here is this idea that there could be a reason to but theres also the concern and the overwhelming fear and the world that we live in today that this guy was able to buy the right equipment to build a bomb successfully that other peoples could do it as well and use this ruling to open the door to say that theyre innocent that it was just a hobby. No but thats the thing i mean obviously you have to prove that its not just about came again you have to prove it in this case we know why we know why he developed the interest we know about his background we know about his life obviously there were witnesses there was evidence you know we do we know why he was doing what he was doing now obviously in another case where someones trying to hide it were not quite sure if someones motives then they would question uninvestigated in a different way but the whole point is that it can be an innocent it can be an innocent hobby it can be just for self learning is that that is not impossible and i think thats why its important that the. Supreme court took this view just because someone is found to be in possession doesnt automatically make them guilty at least give them a chance to defend themselves and thats investigated and i think thats the right thing to do. Gentlemen were going to have to leave it there dr david low Senior Research<\/a> fellow at Leeds Beckett<\/a> University Law<\/a> school and former Police Officer<\/a> and a show of common human rights lawyer thank you both for joining us on the program to discuss this. Now we do need to bring you some breaking news as u. S. Coalition forces in iraq have confirmed more than 15 rockets have hit a base housing American Military<\/a> personnel near baghdad for the reports claim 2 american soldiers and one british servicemen were killed in that attack and investigation has been launched and the attack is the latest on u. S. And coalition facilities in the country. Well be bringing you more on that as it comes in. As your breakdown of todays top headlines for now if youre looking for more you can always head to our web site artie dot com i will be bringing you more on that breaking news at the top the hour. Time after time corporations repeat the same mantra sustainability its very important to excel or transitions to sustainable prize board sustainability stay number man at a more equitable and sustainable world. They claim their production is completely hamas. Leave it to us. Companies want us to feel good about buying their products while the damage is being done far away and this is something ill just let the point any minute i need money. Since im in and you missed me doing 20 min and im stymied seem to be based on disconnect with who is going in","publisher":{"@type":"Organization","name":"archive.org","logo":{"@type":"ImageObject","width":"800","height":"600","url":"\/\/ia802900.us.archive.org\/14\/items\/RT_20200311_200000_News\/RT_20200311_200000_News.thumbs\/RT_20200311_200000_News_000001.jpg"}},"autauthor":{"@type":"Organization"},"author":{"sameAs":"archive.org","name":"archive.org"}}],"coverageEndTime":"20240716T12:35:10+00:00"}