Described Michael Cohen to prosecutors on the stand as the alleged affair became public. Asked the lawyers what the point of the line of questioning was because it opened the door to what we have been watching from the defense during crossexamination, which by the way, just ended. Theyre trying to use Michael Cohens onetime loyalty against him. Asking Keith Davidson about calling, he was devastated donald trump wasnt taking him to washington, d. C. , saying, quote, after everything i have done for the blank, you can guess what the word is, guy, i cant believe im not going to washington. Ive saved that guys blank so many times you dont even know. Davidson testified cohen complained to him, quote and that davidson thought he was going to kill himself. The defense wants cohen to seem like a spurned lover, out for revenge. The question is does that discredit what is at the heart of the case, falsified documents. Lets find out from our team covering all of this. Joining us now, Nbc News National Correspondent yasmin vossoughian, up first for us. So yasmin, as i mentioned, crossexamination is done. The redirect should begin soon. Just give us an update of what we saw at the end there. Reporter at any moment now, weve got about 90 minutes left in court. A couple of things that stood out. And they ended where i thought they thought. This David Dennison signature, which they did not get on the agreement with Stormy Daniels. They brought up the davidson had not signed the agreement between Stormy Daniels and Michael Cohen. And brought up that moment in the finality of their crossexamination in which they said, you see the signature, is David Dennisons signature there, no, do you know what happened with the document after it was signed, he said no, and they left it at that for redirect to come. The word of the day has been discredit. And you mentioned it, right, discredit Stormy Daniels. Discredit Michael Cohen, discredit Attorney Davidson while he has been on the stand today. Lets talk about his seedy past, how he seemed to be an ambulance chaser, per se, of celebrities they went through the whole roster, trying to discredit his testimony today. They talk about, for instance, his interactions with Stormy Daniels. Let me read a part of the interaction for you. In the context of the discussions, did you talk to cohen about Stormy Daniels having settlers remorse. Sometimes people get settlers remorse, does it reflect the recollection that you said that. You were talking about Stormy Daniels here, correct, and davidson says probably. Theres an objection, the objection is overruled. The judge says you can answer yes or no. Davidson says it certainly appears to be yes. Bove says you were using the word hypothetical, you can sit in a chair and say im not sure if i was talking about Stormy Daniels, implying in a way that davidson was possibly misleading the court by not saying outright yes or no and instead saying probably trying to discredit davidson as they have had throughout their crossexamination. Stormy daniels seeming as if shes looking for money and limelight than she is for the actual payoff. One more thing, katy, and that is Michael Cohen, the star witness for the prosecution, he has been discredited all throughout the day, setting it up for his testimony, talking about how hes been frantic, as you mentioned in the opening of the show, how he was incredibly loyal to the former president until he was no longer loyal when he felt the former president would not bolster him to go to washington, setting him up for a dramafilled testimony. So much about Michael Cohen. He has not yet testified. The defense trying to discredit him. Trying to dirty up, dirty might be the other word of the day, dirty up Keith Davidson, who he is as an attorney, what sort of Business Dealings he has, and at the end of the crossexamination, this pseudonym, David Dennison, it was all used for hulk hogan. Well get the significance of that in a moment. Yasmin vossoughian, thank you very much. Joining us now, former new york assistant attorney general adam pollock, and msnbc legal analyst, catherine christian. So redirect is beginning. Steinglass is questioning davidson. Well get updates as they come in. Lets end where i ended. This is what you brought up coming to air that this pseudonym, David Dennison was used in the past. Does that matter . It does matter. If the prosecution is saying we know this is donald trump, that was his pseudonym, it apparently was also hulk hogans. What the whole crossexamination, redirect, and probably a recross was to show that this witness is not very credible or not likable, and im surprised that the prosecution didnt bring up some of this witnesss bad acts on the direct examination. Like, for instance, he was involved in the federal investigation, involved with what he did as hulk hogan. That could have come up under direct examination so the jury doesnt think why didnt the prosecution bring this up. The prosecution has been good at trying to bring up things they believe is going to be problematic down the line. Why would we not hear about this . Its a little bit surprising, but it comes in the context of an entire day, an entire week, an entire trial about unseemly actors, about something a little bit sleazy. Maybe they didnt mention this. There was plenty more to cover. Theyre also asking right now, David Dennison, steinglass is, the prosecution on the redirect, about michael avenatti, and the wedge between stormy and her agent, gina rodriguez. Avenatti was trying to insert himself into things. Theres so many names, so many characters. Not all of them on the up and up. Michael avenatti is in prison right now. He didnt do well by Stormy Daniels. How do all of these dirty players read to a jury maybe . It could be both ways. One, you could say, well, thats who Donald Trump Associated with. The problem is donald trump did not have any direct contact with this witness. It was cohen. Donald trump had direct contact with mr. Pecker. What did mr. Pecker say, he dealt with cohen when it came to the payoffs. This is all about building reasonable doubt. One of the questions i still have is what directly links donald trump to any of this . You have Michael Cohen on paperwork, Michael Cohen having texts, phone call, theres not a lot of donald trump. The only direct donald trump conversations weve got so far was from the first witness, and that was david pecker. In the end, the lot of this is a side show. The key question is when trump directed those payments to be made to Michael Cohen and when he directed records to be made and if he directed records to be made, and false records to be made. Theres likely a witness from trump tower, inside the Trump Organization whos going to say, yes, trump said, write them to Michael Cohen, and heres how i knew. They need the witness to say as plainly as that . It cant be they knew. It cant be i assumed this because thats it has to be i saw this. Davidson said, he didnt say i know for a fact donald trump was going to be paying the 130,000. He said i assumed it was him or corporate affiliation, so it cant be speculation or assumption. Right now we have its Michael Cohen. And hes corroborated, yes he took out the 130. And all of his acts are corroborated. So far we have an audio tape of trump and Michael Cohen speaking but even on the audio tape. At the end Michael Cohen says no, no, no, ill take care of it. Thats the reasonable doubt that the defense wants to build in. Youre making that face. And the lawyers are not, this witnesss lawyer, he seems to be basically a shake down artist, you know, they used the word extortion. I dont like to, thats a crime, i dont want to accuse anyone of extortion. I dont recall is the hallmark of a witness who is not incredible. I dont recall because i dont want to answer it. So lets see how redirect is. You made a face a second ago, what was it about . I think theres a lot of fleas here. The prosecution can be successful in showing that donald trump was one of these many fleas, and the defense is going to try to show that he was above all of that, he didnt know what was happening. That Michael Cohen was off on a lark. Fleas. Fleas, Whether Trump was lying down with them. I like that. I hadnt heard that legal speak, legal jargon, legal color. Let me ask you about gag order stuff, and there was an interesting moment where the Defense Rephrase trying to get judge merchan to approve posts that donald trump might put out there in the future, is that normal . Does that normally happen . Thats not normal, and i think what susan necheles, a very good opportunity, probably was a conversation between her and her client, and she was saying, that violates the gag order, and its like, lets ask the judge. She knew. Shes an excellent lawyer, what would judge would sail, when in doubt, steer clear. Were going to get more into the gag order in a second. Stick around both of you, were going to continue to bring you any developments out of that courtroom. As we follow it. Weve got our google docs ready and were reading the updates as they come in. What President Biden said about the coasttocoast protests on College Campuses, shortly after hundreds were arrested at ucla, we are back in 90 seconds. Are back in 90 seconds new parodontax active gum repair breath freshener. Clinically proven to help reverse the four signs of early gum disease. A new toothpaste from parodontax, the gum experts. ella fashion moves fast. jen so we partner with verizon a new toothpaste from to take our operations to the next level. marquis with a custom private 5g network. ella we get more control of production, efficiencies, and greater agility. jen thats enterprise intelligence. vo its your vision, its your verizon. tony hawk skating for over 45 years has taken a toll on my body. I take qunol turmeric because it helps with healthy joints and inflammation support. Why qunol . It has superior absorption compared to regular turmeric. Qunol. The brand i trust. Wild protest is not protected. Peaceful protest is. Its against the law when violence occurs. Destroying property is not a peaceful protest. Its against the law. Vandalism, trespassing, breaking windows, shutting down campuses, forcing the cancellation of classes and graduations, none of this is a peaceful protest. Threatening people, intimidating people, instilling fear in people is not peaceful protest. Its against the law. President biden addressing the nation today making it clear where he stands in support of protests and feature, but against violence, vandalism and intimidation. What we have been witnessing at College Campuses is complicated. Not everyone is protesting in the same way, not everybody is breaking the law. But the ones that are vocal and visible. Heres whats happening right now at ucla. Students and campus staffers are cleaning up the quad after the lapd cleared up the encampment overnight. Officers in riot gear using flash bangs to break through the crowd. More than 200 protesters were arrested in the process. Its not clear how many of them were students. Joining us now from the ucla campus is nbc news correspondent dana griffin. So dana, what are you seeing right now . Reporter yeah, so katy, behind me, this is the effort to clean up this area outside of royce hall where students, faculty and outsiders created an encampment. Front loaders are rolling up gear, dumping them in large bins that you see behind me. You can see several crews tossing items in. They have been breaking down the tents that were posted here. And they made some headway here. This was full of items, and its mostly clear now. We know that Law Enforcement says about 209 people have been arrested so far. They are going to be charged with misdemeanors, and then released. The state of what they plan to do here on campus after being released is unknown. We know that classes have been moved online today and tomorrow. Because of the disruption that all of this caused. And theres still graffiti outside of this building. So what theyre going to do to try to clean this up, its going to take more effort over the next several days. We heard from Law Enforcement, they tell us that it is going to cost them millions of dollars just for their presence on this campus, from Yesterday And Today alone. So this has been a very costly protest for Law Enforcement, and for the people who were taken away, they will decide what happens to them next. Its unclear, ucla has not made any definitive remarks about whats going to happen to the students. Do we know what the breakdown of students to nonstudents were in the arrests last night . Reporter yeah, thats the big question. They have not given us those numbers. We are told ucla will likely be instrumental in helping to figure that out. We know that officers took photos of everyone that they took away as they were zip tied. Thats part of the identification process. Sometimes people will give false i. D. S or wont give a name. It could take several days if not weeks to identify everyone and well hopefully get the numbers soon. Dana griffin, thank you very much. Up next, were going to go back inside the courtroom where the prosecution is introducing new exhibits, Audio Recordings that Keith Davidson said Michael Cohen surreptitiously recorded of conversations that they had. Dont go anywhere. Rsations thatd dont go anywhere. Od digestion. It contains a probiotic to help relieve occasional bloating, plus vitamin b12 to aid digestion. Try align probiotic. ella fashion moves fast. jen so we partner with verizon to take our operations to the next level. marquis with a custom private 5g network. ella we get more control of production, efficiencies, and greater agility. jen thats enterprise intelligence. vo its your vision, its your verizon. Every shot is an opportunity. And success requires drive, resilience, wow. Get it there. And sometimes luck. But what if luck had less to do with it . 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So a moment ago, we talked about how there are calls being played for the jury inside the courtroom. These are calls between Michael Cohen and Keith Davidson. Keith davidson testified that these calls were recorded surreptitiously by Michael Cohen. Ill read you a little bit from the transcript, and bear with me because it can be hard to follow. Heres what it is. Michael cohen, saying would you write a book, break away from the entire trump, well call it the doctrine. Would you go completely rogue, its not just me thats being affected. Its my entirely family. Its that nobody is thinking about michael. I wasnt going to play penny wise. Im saying to myself, what about me, and i cant tell you how many times he said we did it, and everyone said it was the right move. What about me and i cant even tell you how many times. Thats a repeat, sorry. Steinglass asks Keith Davidson, who did you understand he to be a reference to in that Michael Cohen call. Davidson said mr. Trump. Steinglass said about what. Davidson, Stormy Daniels settlement. All right. Lets try to figure out whats going on here. Back with us, adam pollock and catherine christian. Were looking at the same transcript and trying to decipher it. Emil bove is trying to punch into this. What was the prosecution doing at first, playing this phone call and having Michael Cohen say what about me, what about me, what about me, and he keeps saying we did it. The prosecution is trying to bring mr. Trump into it. So i said before that we so far, no one is saying that trump is directly involved with ms. Daniels in the payoff or this lawyer. This is a back way. Keith davidson saying Michael Cohen told him that, and he cant even say that Michael Cohen told him it was trump. If his belief, he believes its trump. If im a defense attorney, ill tear through that. Your belief, the recross will be really . What makes you think its donald trump. You might think it. You dont know it. Also im struck by the tone of Michael Cohen here, this Scorned Lover that the defense wants to use to their advantage. Does the prosecution have a problem . Because Michael Cohen has been very vocal about how he feels betrayed by donald trump and the defense wants to say this guy is out for revenge. Does the prosecution have a problem with Michael Cohen as a witness . The prosecution has known since day one, since a year ago, since the beginning of the trial that Michael Cohen is a difficult witness for them. A difficult witness to rely on. Hes pled guilty to a crime, to lying to congress. He has lots of baggage as it were, coming into this, in his relationship with donald trump and the stuff that hes writing through today on social media. Hes a difficult witness. And theyre well aware of that, and theyve got to be planning for that. So Keith Davidson has stepped down, The Recross Finish and the redirect happened. We have gone back and forth a few times. The people are about to call their next witness. Im just watching to see who it is. How has davidson been as a witness for the prosecution . I think davidson is one in a line of difficult witnesses that already come before and are going to be coming in this trial. This is a messy trial, and sort of gives us all an insight, a crack into what this sordid world is about between the National Enquirer and selling stories. Its not pretty to watch. Catherine, what about you . He was helpful in that he established that there was a payoff and he negotiated with Michael Cohen, but he was helpful to the defense because he has, particularly since the prosecution didnt bring out some of his bad acts on their direct examination, he appears to be in the defense view, just a lawyer who shakes down people, whether it was hulk hogan or other people. Thats what he did and maybe thats what happened here. Thats what the defense will say. This was a shake down of donald trump. This wasnt about paying someone as an Illegal Campaign contribution. This was a shake down, and Michael Cohen, its an understatement to say how difficult of a witness he is for the prosecution. So we have our next witness. And tell me if you guys know him, a man named douglas douse, new York District attorneys office, hes a High Technology analyst. He processes digital evidence and extraction of digital devices. Hes a boring authentication witness. So theres some video, audio or some tape that they want to bring into evidence, and hes the one thats going to establish it was not tampered with or altered in any way. Theyre going to introduce a piece of evidence, and hes going to say this is legit and will there be a cross on this . You dont cross of that. We have an hour left of court. Well see if this guy goes quickly and see what hes there to authenticate in a moment. Donald trump has been unhappy with todd blanche. He wanted todd blanche to be more of a pit bull. He wants his roy cohn. Emil bove went after Keith Davidson pretty hard, dirtied him up, talked about the stuff he had been involved with. This payoff for someone stealing records about Lindsey Lohans rehab time. Putting him in a seedy world, making Tabloid Journalism clean in comparison, a seedy world of payoffs for celebrities who dont want information to get out there, and celebrities might be a friendly term. These characters were aspiring celebrities, put it nicely. How has emil bove done in the expectations of a Client Lining donald trump . Donald trump is obviously a challenging client. Many clients are challenging, hes probably one of the hardest. I think of todd blanche as a well known, very good attorney, but a former federal prosecutor. A federal courtroom is more buttoned up, more decorum classroom, classroom, excuse me, courtroom, and its maybe not the performance that donald trump is expecting, and as you said, a harder hitting crossexamination from bove is maybe what President Trump wants. And it was hard hitting but completely appropriate, and thats what you want for a crossexamination from a defense attorney. He knew what he was doing, and people on that jury, and you never want to read a jurors mind, they were left with the impression, oh, this guy is a sleazy lawyer, thats the impression, and hes not telling the truth. Again, he did not put himself and donald trump together. Its him, mr. Davidson, and mr. Cohen, really him saying i thought that he met trump is not that it was trump. Im still struck by the need of the prosecution to get somebody who witnessed or heard it directly from donald trump or witnessed them signing the documents and knew that it was an invoice for more than legal services. Who is that person going to be . They had rhona graff on a little bit earlier. She was only on for a few minutes. All she could say is these two women were in my contacts and i might have seen ms. Daniels in the waiting room. The charges, if youre going to go back to it is falsifying business records. Its not illegal in new york to put false entries in your business records, it becomes illegal if theres an intent to commit fraud or conceal another crime. The prosecution has to prove that beyond a reasonable doubt, and so far we havent gotten there yet. Were going to dive back into the courtroom in a few minutes. Catherine and adam, stick around. Coming up next, i want to talk about media silo, how people get their information and what thats going to mean for the upcoming election. Were still focused on this courthouse. Is anyone else . Dont go anywhere. Is anyone else dont go anywhere. Now with s, im all in with clearer skin. Things are getting clearer. i feel free. To bear my skin, yeah thats all me. Nothing is everything with skyrizi, 3 out of 4 people achieved 90 clearer skin at 4 months. And most people were clearer even at 5 years. Skyrizi is just 4 doses a year, after 2 starter doses. Serious allergic reactions. And an increased risk of infections. Or a lower ability to fight them may occur. Tell your doctor if you have an infection or symptoms,. Had a vaccine, or plan to. Nothing and me go handinhand, nothing on my skin, thats my new plan. Nothing is everything nows the time,. Ask your doctor about skyrizi,. The number one. Dermatologistprescribed biologic in psoriasis. Learn how abbvie could help you save. ella fashion moves fast. jen so we partner with verizon to take our operations to the next level. marquis with a custom private 5g network. ella we get more control of production, efficiencies, and greater agility. jen thats enterprise intelligence. vo its your vision, its your verizon. My frequent heartburn had me taking antacid after antacid all day long but with prilosec otc just one pill a day blocks heartburn for a full 24 hours. For one and done heartburn relief, prilosec otc. One pill a day, 24 hours, zero heartburn. Its time. Yes, the time has come for a fresh approach to dog food. Everyday, more dog people are deciding its time to quit the kibble and feed their dogs fresh food from the farmers dog. Made by vets and delivered right to your door precisely portioned for your dogs needs. Its an idea whose time has come. Joining us now, axios cofounder, and author of just the good stuff. Jim vandehei. Im not going to take it personally that youre not in studio, even though you were in studio with my friend Chris Jansing yelled. Next time for sure. Lets talk about media silos, im interested in your thoughts on this. Were covering this trial, trying to get to the truth of whats happening, but theres a question of who else is actually watching this, and in terms of the broader electorate. And what this means for november. I know there are people out there who have very strong opinions about this is a, you know, a game changer for november. This should be on top of minds of voters. They should be paying attention to this trial, others will say the exact opposite. Theres a big middle out there. Were in this really interesting moment, where, you know, you dont have to go back that far. Lets say ten years, where most of us were looking at the world through a very similar piece of glass, and it might have been tv, it might have been cable tv, a couple of stations, newspapers, but we were mostly looking at the same reality. Over the last decade, thats shattered into like 20 different pieces, and each one of those pieces defined by your politics, your age, maybe how much you make, what type of job you have and where you live. And so you could be sitting at a table anywhere, and depending on the age and location of people around you, you might not be getting any of the same information on a given day. If youre spending the day scrolling through tiktok, the issues you follow, the people you know, the people you trust, i dont know who they are. I dont use tiktok, and that person who uses tiktok might be sitting next to somebody whos on facebook or instagram who trusts a news source or an individual that that person or i wouldnt beware of either. And what happens is that you have a whole lot of different people, many of whom are highly educated. Not because theyre not paying attention or they dont care. Theyre living in totally different ecosystems and not interacting with the same even reality. And the real danger there is its very hard now, really other than like the super bowl, where you actually have a whole lot of this country watching the same thing through a very similar lens. And i think, listen, donald trump has benefitted from this. Theres a big chunk of his base that consumes content from podcasts that a lot of your viewers havent heard of. Not just truth social, other obscure, maga like platforms, web sites, that would be wholly unfamiliar to them. In those ecosystems, the way theyre looking at this trial, hes being persecuted, not prosecuted, right . Biden is animating it all, and it just gets them more fired up, you know, and theres another side which looks at this for what it is, a real case, and, you know, a serious case being brought against a former president , and theres a real legal case. Theres a jury. And so that, i think, explanation why theres so much confusion and often a big lack of trust in what is real. Thats what scared me most over the last couple of years. It used to be people that werent paying close attention who believed weird stuff. Theres highly educated people, man, you think thats true, and they do think stuff is true. Thats an issue. Its also part of the reason why congress is trying to get the chinese off owning tiktok because why have a Foreign Government own a piece of technology where a good portion of the population gets their news information. It can be very risky if you have somebody who could pull the levers. Let me ask you about something broader than just donald trump, one of the old adages that we trot out in the News Business is a healthy democracy needs a free press. Its essential to a healthy democracy. How do you have a democracy when not everyone is getting the same information . Again, i dont think its hyperbolic to say that were playing with fire. We really are. Like, when you start to lose faith in all of your institutions, and weve seen an emotion of faith in every American Institution over the last 20 years. People dont really trust the church. They dont trust the media. They dont trust government. They dont often trust technology. Boy scouts, girl scouts, all of these things that used to bind us and bond us together, you lose faith in those things, and then you start to question the truth or you want the amplification of your own truth or what feels soothe to go you personally. Where youre playing with fire, this is a complicated time in a complicated world, and there are moments where the public has to be able to focus on the same set of facts and say, listen, how big of a threat is china, how are we going to deal with it. My gosh, ai, might be bigger than the internet, more important than the invention of the smartphone. Should we regulate it, what should we know about it. You could go down the list, all of a sudden, because of technology, warfare is moving away from heavy artillery, and boots on the ground, and its moving to space and drones and satellites, so maybe these two big oceans on our shoulders no longer protect us. Should we recalibrate National Defense and what our risks are. You talk about banning tiktok. Theres a real threat that the chinese could take the algorithm and manipulate people at scale in our country, but theyre already doing that. I mean, people need to be awake. I run into people, oh, i read that on facebook, i read that on instagram. Dude, thats a pipe. And in that pipe is some really good content, and theres a lot of sludge, its not a source of news, and guess who knows that, the iranians, koreans, russians, chinese, and what do they do, create bots, fake accounts, were not that hard to figure out. They know exactly what gets us at each others threats, they make content meant to polarize us and paralyze our congress. They know were crushing them on the basics, right, democracy and capitalism are far superior to their crappy styles of government, but if we just sort of get at each others throats and we stop, like, governing, and believing in a common truth, then the bad things could happen. You say were playing with fire. It is scary. Jim vandehei, honestly, if you couldnt tell from the conversation, one of the smartest guys in journalism and media. Im going to plug your book One More Time just the good stuff no bs secrets to success no matter what life throws at you. Thank you very much for coming on and eloquently answering those two big questions. Now that you plug the book like that and said the nice things, im definitely coming on set. Thank you very much. Were going to have more from inside the courtroom in just a moment, but coming up in this world of certainty, one thing that the College Protests have exposed is that its very hard to take a complicated position. Quote, in a oneeyed world, the twoeyed are freaks. Dont go anywhere. Twoeyed are freaks. Dont go anywhere. Its doug. We help people customize and Save Hundreds on Car Insurance with liberty mutual. We got a bit of a situation. [ metal groans] sure, i can hold. Liberty Liberty Liberty liberty in theaters now. ella fashion moves fast. jen so we partner with verizon to take our operations to the next level. marquis with a custom private 5g network. ella we get more control of production, efficiencies, and greater agility. jen thats enterprise intelligence. vo its your vision, its your verizon. Imagine a future where plastic is not wasted. But instead remade over and over. Into the things that keep our food fresher, our families safer, and our planet cleaner. To help us get there, americas plastic makers are investing billions of dollars to create Innovative Products and new Recycling Technologies for sustainable change. Because when you push for smarter solutions, big things can happen. My frequent heartburn had me taking antacid after antacid all day long but with prilosec otc just one pill a day blocks heartburn for a full 24 hours. For one and done heartburn relief, prilosec otc. One pill a day, 24 hours, zero heartburn. ella fashion moves fast. jen ne and done heartburn so we partner with verizon to take our operations to the next level. marquis with a custom private 5g network. ella we get more control of production, efficiencies, and greater agility. jen thats enterprise intelligence. vo its your vision, its your verizon. Nothing dims my light like a migraine. With nurtec odt, i found relief. The only Migraine Medication that helps treat and prevent, all in one. To those with migraine, i see you. For the acute treatment of migraine with or without aura and the preventive treatment of Episodic Migraine in adults. Dont take if allergic to nurtec odt. Allergic reactions can occur, even days after using. Most common side effects were nausea, indigestion, and stomach pain. Its time we all shine. Talk to a Healthcare Provider about nurtec odt from pfizer. Power e trades awardwinning trading app makes trading easier. With its customizable options chain, easytouse tools and Paper Trading to help sharpen your skills, you can stay on top of the market from wherever you are. E trade from Morgan Stanley power e trades easy touse tools make complex trading less complicated. Custom scans can help you find new trading opportunities, while an Earnings Tool helps you plan your trades and stay on top of the market. E trade from Morgan Stanley 2024 is not 1968. Yes, the protests can look the same. Yes, they can at times sound the same. Yes, too many of us are wondering out loud if the results will be the same in the election this year. But this time is different. How and why . My next guest argues, well, its the certainty or as he puts it in a oneeyed world, the two eyed are free. Cornell professor of law and government and civil rights attorney, joseph margolis. Thank you very much. I love that quote. In a one eyed world, the two eyes are freaks. Explain what you mean by that. You know, we live in an intensely tribal moment, and the sense is that one has to pick a side, and that in this post october 7th moment, the challenge is to be either in favor of a victorious palestine or a triumphant israel. And there is no space for dialogue and understanding. And i, like many others, have been very frustrated with that dialogue, and i wrote the piece that you quote from, to communicate the idea that more important than israel or palestine, more important than israeli or palestinian, much more important than mine or yours is the shared commitment to the right to thrive. The universal commitment to the right to thrive, which is equal and equally urgent for all people at all times. The right to be treated with dignity and respect. And it is so in all places, it is so in all places. Its in gaza and the west bank and it is so in jerusalem and tel aviv, the right to thrive, and thats what we need to focus on. Rather than whether one side or another will win. One of the questions people have is whats going on on College Campuses right now . Can you debate any longer . Are questions being asked . Is critical thought welcome . Yes, you can. And some of the concern, at least at cornell, what i can speak to is overblown, much of the concern is overblown. I am in my office. I am looking out my window at the encampment at cornell. I was out there with students just a couple of hours ago. It is a small group of students dedicated to learning and Compassionate Care for each other and to peace. In fact, in honor of National Prayer day theres going to be a time of prayer at 5 30 this afternoon on campus. This is a group of people who are enormously committed to the idea of open and free dialogue. They are not in the silos that your last guest described. Professor, i wish i had more time with you, but im going to have to leave it there. Thank you for coming on and reminding us that you can have complicated emotions. You can have complicated thoughts toward a horrifying situation and that debate still is possible on College Campuses along with critical thinking. Thank you. Next time i hope we can do this and have a much longer conversation. Thank you very much. Happy to do it. Coming up after the break, well go back inside the courtroom. The Expert Witness is talking about Text Messages between Michael Cohen and hope hicks. Well tell you what they are, in just a moment. , in just a moment. Ill be okay. Does this look ok . ugh. How do i protect myself . With the new Scotts Healthy Plus lawn food. Its the only product that prevents 27 diseases while feeding your grass to help keep your lawn healthy this season. Want me to show you how to put it on . 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But if you do, making that appointment can help you get ahead of stroke risk. Contact a doctor and learn more at notimetowait. Com and theyre all coming . Can help you get ahead of stroke risk. Those who are still with us, yes. Grandpa whats this . Your wings. Light em up gentlemen, its a beautiful. Day to fly. Were going to go back inside the courtroom. Our reporters are still with me. Doug daus is authenticating Text Messages cohen 39d,000 contacts, more than that. Whats the point of having him authenticate this . He needs to get on the stand and say these Text Messages that were taken out of the phone, two of Michael Cohens phones, that these Text Messages are authentic. This photograph is aauthentic. And these recordings that were made, which were apparently made on his phone, that these are authentic. Theres a chain of custody. Were getting a little bit from this. Im trying to read this in realtime. Actually, no. Its a direct text from cohen to hope hicks. He had a direct line to the campaign. Does it mean he has 39,000 contacts . No. Its a lot of contacts. I have never heard that ever. The Text Messages between Michael Cohen and Keith Davidson were spicy. If they are spicy between hope hicks, do you expect Michael Cohen is Michael Cohen. Hope hicks, from all we heard and read about, it was very professional. They might be spicy between others. Theres also photos of him at the white house meeting at the white house, which shows corroboration of Michael Cohen at the white house and met with donald trump in the white house. So these all basically are texts, photos to corroborate Michael Cohens testimony. Is this just to say that, no, we didnt make up these Text Messages. No, donald trump cant go out there and say this is a lie. This is legitimate. We have made sure that this wasnt fudged with in any way. To a tremendous extent, not just that we have this phone and Computer Expert who previously served in iraq who is authenticating it, but he turn the phone on until he was in a secure room. As you said, that this is a completely not messed with phone. Okay. A fact witness, so its going to be pretty dry. Should we expect to see hope hicks sooner than later . If you are the prosecution, when are you calling in hope hicks . I would put her on sooner than later. Just to corroborate it depends on what she knows. Theres testimony she may have been in and out of the room during that august 2015 meeting with pecker and cohen and donald trump, but if her testimony is i didnt hear anything, shes not that useful. But if shes just there to corroborate there was a meeting in trump tower of these three men, then shes useful. Theres one text message we have seen so far, cohen to hope hicks on november 2016, call me. 7 00 p. M. , call me. Thats when they were not winning the election. I believe thats election night. Thats when they were not winning the election. It wasnt until 10 00 p. M. They started winning. Daus is saying that its unusual for somebody to have that many contacts being on a phone. He has ten pages of contacts for donald trump. Ten pages of contacts for him. He has dylan howard, personal security, Melania Trump is, gary farther farro. I imagine thats just underscoring how deeply engrained Michael Cohens was in the trump world. It will be interesting to see whether Text Messages between donald trump and Michael Cohen, do we know yet, should come out when Michael Cohen is called to testify. In my mind, november 4th is always election night. That was november 8th in 2016. I apologize. This was four day bfrs the election. Im curious to see if they are going to have any Text Messages about the Stormy Daniels story. After the access Hollywood Tape came out, the campaign was in crisis. There was so many reporters calling her. She was Donald Trumps right hand. She was the one that directly interacted most of the time with the press. I certainly emailed her seconds after i saw that tape before it went public asking the campaign for comment. Then Michael Cohen, the very next day makes an agreement with Stormy Daniels for her story for 130,000. Is it going to be meaning they are texting about Stormy Daniels. Its meaningful because shes press person for the campaign. So one would assume she would have had a conversation with donald trump. It would be better for the prosecution if theres a direct text message between him and donald trump, who apparently until now, didnt text or email. What a way to end the day. Thank you very much for hanging out with me. I appreciate it. Thats going to do it for me deadline white house starts right now. Hi, everyone. Welcome to thursday. St its 4 00 in new york. Day ten of the donald trump election interference hush money criminal trial. The sleazy underbelly taking center stage. The whole scheme to catch and kill stories specifically to help the Trump Campaign was exposed again. A wealth of evidence from lawyers, a porsche star and a