the head of security for the court said threats are considered to be serious and credible. they are not hypothetical or expected. the limited gag orders have resulted in a decrease and disparaging messages. however, the number of threatening messages increased. the judge and his staff are being inundated with hundreds of harassing and threatening phone calls, for snow messaging that has resulted in the threat assessment unit, having to constantly reassessing evaluate. they have to put in place to ensure the safety of the judge and those around him. on thanksgiving, day special partner jack smith filed a copy of that statement. in the case of united states of america versus donald j trump where donald j trump is appealing a limited gag order, issued in that case by the trial course judge tanya. the appeals court, federal appeals court hearing in that case last monday indicated that the appeals court monday were in favor of preserving most if not all of the gag order issued by -- today donald trump's lawyers urged the new york -- which is considering donald trump's appeal of the gag order issued by judge arthur -- who is receiving -- he is the judge was receiving those hundreds of harassing phone calls a day. they completely overrule the gag order issued by the judge, they insist that death threats issued by donald trump's supporters because of things that donald trump has said about the people threatened are not donald trump's fault. the trump lawyers, right at base the disturbing behavior engaged by anonymous third-party afters towards the judge in principle who are publicly presiding over an extremely polarizing and high profile trial merits corporate security measures. however, does not justify the whole set aggregation of petitioners first amendment rights and proceeding of immense steaks. it's to petitioners which has been compromised by the induction of partisan bias on the bench. in essence, the constitution does not permit justice and born to curtail petitioners speech simply because people may react to things that president trump says. and so, there are donald trump's lawyers falsely accusing judging borne of having a bipartisan bias against donald trump. those lawyers know that the language they're using in that statement is, in and of itself, enough to create more death threats against judge. they are falsely and unethically accusing of having a bipartisan bias. today in washington d.c., once again he ruled against donald trump. this time for what the judge called a trump fishing net. telecoms criminal defense lawyers and washington d.c., federal case against him told the judge last fall that they wanted a party to obtain information from the house january six committee. it was just -- by the republicans now controlling the house. the trump lawyers were asking for a massive amount of material. they imagine, just imagine, the january six committee may have at some point possessed. in her order denying the trump lawyers request. defendant does not stay with any specificity. the in formation that he insists is important unrelated to the people associate with the select committee's work. therefore, the january six 2021 attack. the broad scope of the records of the defendant seek in the vegas corruption of this wellness, resemble less but good faith efforts to obtain identified evidence then they do a general fishing expedition. it attempts to use rule 17 see subpoena as a discovery to voice. for explanation of all of those new developments, return to former fbi journal counsel and chief of the criminal division. he's the co-host and a former u.s. attorney. a law professor at the u.s. michigan. also the co-host of the podcast, hash tag sisters in law. we they are both msnbc legal analysts. let me begin with you on the first point that i was raising tonight. the exact words. the exact words of the threats that one judge presiding over just one of the trump cases. we have those exact words because they were submitted by court security officers part of the file and donald trump's appeal of a gag order. it was designed to at least reduce and work in reducing those threats. they were using that same document provided by that new york court security official, to make the same case to the appeals court in washington d.c.. considering the gag order in that case. above just how dangerous donald trump's speech is when it reaches his devoted followers. and then they phone in those threats to judges. >> so, i think the way that i think about this is i don't think that this is a first amendment issue. and when people talk about how jaded people, are restricting the free speech right of somebody who is running for president. that is just not the correct framing for what the judge in new york and the district judge in d.c. are doing. they are restricting the bail conditions and the conditions under which a defendant is allowed release or, the new york, case a civil case. the defendant as a party and is entitled to speak about what is going on. i think if you think of it that way, it is not just some arbitrary restriction. it is by prophylactic rules. it is commonplace knowledge for every defendant in the barrel system to be told that you have no second amendment rights. i that is a right that you do not have once you are indicted. even then heavier gun back. we have your fourth amendment rights, in large part, when you are defendant you have to show up in pretrial. all of these are restrictions at the court is entitled to place on defendants to make sure they show up. to make sure that they are not a danger to the community. he should not be given more or less in the position. the record in for him to see, it's ample to see that his words lead to a classic response. they have deaths threats also all the time. there is one that is actually charged with threatening to kill him. that is the kind of thing the courts are allowed to take steps, prophylactic steps to make sure that it doesn't happen. we are keeping the integrity of our judicial system intact. >> it seems to me that there is something awfully close to proof in the filing of the new york case with these specific threats. it's to the new york judge, but more specifically to the judges clerk. it is impossible for donald trump followers to know who the clerk's. we're not for donald trump's public attacks on the clerk, that is how they know the clerk exists. that's how they know her name. that's how they know things about her. it makes them attacker directly. it seems there is a prove-able length between donald trump's public attacks on the clerk and then his supporters threatening the life of the clerk. >> yes, and i think that is exactly the reason that jack smith took that letter that was initially filed in new york court and shared it with the d.c. court of appeals. it is considering this gag order. because when they read the argument a week ago, what does it mean to target somebody, it means going out for the clerk by name we so that they are not harassing and threatening them. that's what it means to target them. they're using -- this they also talk about the fact that harm it might be speculative at this case. maybe you want to wait and see something actually happens. so, jack smith said it is happening. this is the evidence. do we need to wait any longer for any of this? here it, is it is happening. so, i think that by giving him that in court -- giving that kind of substance evidence, this is not a speculative harm. this is not who target someone. this court of appeals ought to affirm the gag order that the judge has imposed, before we see things that are going on new york. >> the fishing expedition that he wrote about today and her refusal to open up the subpoena authority that donald trump defense wires should have. it's in that case in seeking out from the january six committee. take us through that legally. what, to what extent does a defendant have a right to get the courts help and use subpoena power in obtaining evidence? like the kind that donald trump was describing in that plea. >> i am glad you asked that question. this is something that was going to be a loser from the moment i read it. here is the main reason. the government's response to donald trump's request to get what he alleged were purported missing transcripts was to say, we have given you all of them. the government actually said and represented. you have all of the transcripts. there is nothing missing. so, at that point, donald trump's argument was, okay, but now i want the busiest, not just the transcripts of certain ones. they have a lot of videos, but they wanted certain wants. the judge said, you haven't even gone through the written transcripts to tell me what relevant about them. if you had even said, here is why their demeanor, tone, might be relevant, you might have made an argument that i would agree to. you haven't even done that. so, the court basically was like, do your homework. no what was turned over to you. reveal it. don't make a motion, essentially, she wasn't, that is geared towards the court of public opinion where you can manufacture playing that there's hidden evidence, where an impact, that is not what is going on here. >> as you advisement, barbara, thank you so much for starting off our discussion. please stay with us across the commercial break for our next discussion. we already knew that jared kushner was running his own personal presidential pardon racket in the trump white house, which he used to grant his own father a pardon. we actually didn't know how bad the kushner pardon racket was. when it was very, very bad, but new reporting about new york times shows us it was even worse than that. and that reporting shows us how bad the pardon rocket would be. as every day and another trump presidency. that is next with andrew vestment and barbara holloway. biktarvy is a complete, one-pill, once-a-day treatment used for h-i-v in many 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(inspirational music) you want to be able to provide your child with the tools or tha resources they need.e. with reliable internet at home, through the internet essentials program, the world opened up. fellas, fellas. that's how my son was able to find the hidden genius project. we wanted to give y'all the necessary skills to compete with the future. kevin's now part of this next generation of young people who feel they can thrive. ♪ ♪ >> the guy in this picture with donald trump says it was just a coincidence, just a coincidence, that he ran into donald trump when trump -- 16 months after donald trump pardoned him on the last day of the trump presidency. jonathan braun served two and a half years of a ten year sentence on drug charges that he pleaded guilty to in 2011, managing to stay out of prison for several years. i have long running investigation during that time, he shifted from the drug business to predatory lending to small businesses in the new york times, according to court records, jonathan braun threatened some of the small business owners who owed him money with statements like, i will take your daughters from you. he told a rabbi that he would, quote, publicly embarrass him adding, i'm going to make you bleed and i will make you suffer for every penny. jared kushner decided to give the man of issue those threats of pardon. kushner was running his own pardoning shop in the white house, completely outside the justice department channels. william barr, donald trump's last confirmed general told the new york times, quote, when he took over the justice department, he discovered that there were pardons being given without any bedding by the department. one of the beneficiaries of the jared kushner pardoned shop was jared kushner's father, charles kushner, who was convicted of federal crimes involving hiring a prostitute so that he could secretly videotaped her with his brother-in-law to then blackmail his brother-in-law to prevent his brother-in-law from cooperating with investigators. that's life in the kushner family. jared kushner has said there is no one on earth he admires more than his grotesquely criminally minded of who, as it turns, there is a friend of jonathan brown's father. so, jonathan bronze father urging jared kushner's father to get a pardon for his son and attorney alan dershowitz calling jared kushner, asking for the pardon after appearing as defense counsel for donald trump in the first impeachment trial of donald trump, jonathan braun shot to the top of jared kushner's personal pardon list, even though prosecutors were pressuring jonathan brown to cooperate in another investigation, which he's facing possible federal criminal charges. jonathan braun and even more kushner connections and he probably needed to get this pardon. the times reports that jonathan braun was in the very first freshman class of kushner yoshida hospital in livingston new jersey, which was funded by jared kushner's father. jared kushner's youngest sister, nicole, was a classmate of jonathan bronze in that first freshman class. in a court filing, new york state attorney general has said that jonathan brought, quote, continues to commit usury. if there is another trump presidency, kushner pardoned shop is likely to be issuing pardons like that every day. possibly in effect selling parts like that in exchange for political contributions or contributions to donald trump's personal legal defense fund. donald trump was not the only possible criminal working in the trump white house. and you've eisman and barbara mcquade are back with us. barbara, as we've discussed this program before, the justice department runs a carefully structured pardoning process and application process and takes years to get a pardon from the application stage into the white house. in the trump white house, it went straight to jared kushner. >> yeah, this is a violation of the rule of law. the office a pardon attorney at the department of justice has a process and has protocols for who gets a pardon and who doesn't. the person generally must have completed their sentences and the passage of five years has gone by before someone is eligible for a pardon. they need to accept responsibility for their crime, show remorse ad be conducting an otherwise productive life. those are the factors that we look. at when you look at mr. brown here, he couldn't be further from this criteria. other part is that it's being done on a favor basis, that there is uniformity to the process. that they're looking at the whole landscape across the country and deciding who or where the candidates for part, it's not just whoever got facetime with the president or son-in-law. so, i worry, as you do, lawrence, that what has happen in the past for what could happen in the future. but the thing we saw donald trump do is grant clemency to another person -- corruption climbs to normalize that sort of behavior and all of that, i think, it is a threat to the rule of law in this country. >> he is already in effect promising what could be thousands of pardons with the january six defendants. this is more former attorney general barr told the new york times for this story. mr. barr added that he told trump aides that they should at least send over names of those being considered so that the department can thoroughly examined their records while the white house counsel's office try to do this so, it fell apart from partnering the -- final weeks of -- before mr. trump left office, according to direct knowledge of the process. and your heisman, those parting requests pouring in clearly what happened beginning in the first week of another trump presidency. >> absolutely. remember, donald trump has talked about pardoning the people participated with him in january six in terms of attacking the capitol, which was done at his behest. and to pick up on some voting barbara said, to underscore, but this is the end of the rule of law. there is a pardon power in the constitution that presupposes that the president is going to exercise it with judgment and discretion. and follow, this uniformity of doing this and finding the people and applying those criteria to everyone. that's not how donald trump did give pardons or jared kushner gave pardons. every single defendant who did not cooperate in the mueller investigation was pardoned. you have manafort, flynn, stone, bannock, alex van der sloot, people you've barely heard of a. love the people who didn't cooperate were parted. if you did cooperate with law enforcement, the head of the federal government was saying, you have a pardon. it's just a shocking example of someone who really didn't understand the rule of law. there is zero reason to think that he is not going to wield that power in a way to undermine everything this country stands for. >> andrew weissmann, barbara mcquade, thank you very much for joining us on our discussion. >> thank, you lawrence. >> coming, up the biden administration is insisting tonight that hostages have been released by hamas in a cease-fire has been established and extended thanks to american diplomacy and the direct daily involvement in the negotiations by president biden. that is next. s next part of the irresistible scent collection from gain! liberty mutual customized my car insurance and i saved hundreds. with the money i saved, i started a dog walking business. oh. 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>> now, i think american diplomacy was central to this because, essentially, you have a dynamic where only the united states had a set of relationships that could on lock a deal like this. obviously, united states is a close relationship with israel. the israeli government was not particularly focused on securing the hostages diplomatically because they were focused on launching military operation. the united states obviously invested a lot in that relationship with israel and can take, essentially, israel's proxy and some of these discussions with other arab countries that we have close relationships with. we've a relationship with qatar, which is key to this because there is a hamas office in doha and there are connections, obviously, between qatar and that hamas office and people in gaza. also, we have a relationship with egypt, which means the border crossing into gaza and has its on winds in as well. it's a three dimensional negotiation where we are trying to get qatar to make assurances via hamas, that hostages will be released and they will be released in a certain number and in a certain secrets. there's logistical pieces to that to get that red cross and in order to have the safe passage for the hostages. that, there is obviously the negotiation with the israeli government to allow for humanitarian aid to get into gaza and for the palestinian prisoners, which is obviously what i'm oxidized forward. what you are doing is communication with a variety of parties and trying to assemble the pieces of a deal like this that can come to gather in a very careful sequencing, lawrence, in a situation where there has been an ongoing bombardment and war in gaza. this is not easy. we are seeing the results date by day and any individual reconciliation's that are so emotional to watch. that is the proof that diplomacy can deliver. >> white house officials say that the only possible way that they could get israel to agree to a cease-fire was through the release of hostages. >> that is right. what we have had is inside of israel, lawrence, we've had a interesting dynamic we're on the one hand there is obviously a lot of support for the effort to go after hamas and to try to secure israel and prevent something like [inaudible] from happening again. at the same time, there is overwhelming concern about the hostages and the families inside of israel become very vocal and the fact of sorts of advocacy to prioritize hostage releases. the reality of the administration was contending with and was relayed to the israeli government is that it's far easier to get the hostages out through negotiation and a pause that it would be in the middle of an ongoing war. you can just imagine, it's logistically difficult in a place like gaza to look at these hostages together and trans for them to the red cross. that would basically be impossible in an ongoing war with bombs falling and fighting happening street by street. i think it's that combination of public opinion inside of israel, american diplomacy, and the israeli government saying, okay, we do need to prioritize those hostages. the two goals articulated by the israeli government for this operation, release the -- and try to get the safe return of the hostages. again, administration has persuaded the netanyahu government to move is to replace where they recognize, okay, we can get at least a vulnerable hostages, that women and children and some of the allergy -- and injured through negotiation. even if israeli government presumes their military operations. >> that was a week ago. tuesday night, actually, that you and i were discussing the first word about where this deal emerging, with background information from the white house saying that they expected 50 to get the release of 50 in a four-day cease-fire. they got 69 in that four days, which led to this now two-day extension. white house saying that they are hoping for an extension after that extension. >> part of what you're doing and diplomacy, lawrence, i've been in with parties that you don't trust, with adversarial countries. what you do is, you try to test to see if the other party can't deliver. we would call this in charting, confidence building measure. can the other side show that they can keep to a deal? i think once it was demonstrated that with [inaudible] pause and each release of palestinian prisoners, with each truck flowing into gaza, yes, indeed, there were hostages being released into israel and hamas was following through on their commitments. then you say, okay, let's see how far we can take this. let's see if we can extend this day by day, each day that you extend this pause is a day that more hostages can get out. it is a date, frankly, but also a lot of humanitarian aid can get in. reps lifesaving aid, to civilians and gaza who are under severe threat. i think the goal for the administration right now is to see how long can we extend as? how many hostages can we get out of this kind of diplomacy? how much a can we get into gaza? so, doing what kind of diplomatic channels kim establish that might be put to use for other negotiations going forward and what is a very complicated environment. this is by no means the end of the picture, lawrence. israeli commitment to resume this military commitment. huge questions about the long term future of gaza and what the israeli strategy is there. on this question of getting hostages out and getting civilians in gaza, they are proving that every day is precious because every life is precious and we are seeing lives literally saved through diplomacy. >> ben rhodes, thank you very much for joining us tonight. >> thanks, lawrence. >> thank you. for the first time that you are in a pharmacy? 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( ♪ ♪ ) start your day with nature made. the #1 pharmacist recommended vitamin and supplement brand. when you're ready to begin treatment for chronic lymphocytic leukemia, calquence helps you do the fighting. and you can do the exploring. you can do the splashing... ...the sightseeing... ...and the playing. calquence is an oral targeted therapy for cll. more patients begin with calquence than any treatment of its kind, and calquence is proven to work better than chemoimmunotherapy in patients with previously untreated cll. calquence may cause serious side effects, which may lead to death. these include serious infections with fever, chills, or flu-like symptoms; and bleeding problems that may increase with blood thinners. decreased blood counts are common and can be severe. new cancers have happened, including skin cancers. heart rhythm problems with fast or irregular heartbeat, dizziness, feeling faint, chest discomfort, or shortness of breath, have happened. tell your doctor if you have bleeding, heart rhythm, or liver problems; infection, or if you are or plan to be pregnant or breastfeeding. calquence helps you do the fighting. and you can focus on the things you're loving. ask your doctor if calquence is right for you. someone damon was in her first year of high school, she saw a pharmacy for the first time in her life. she went in and when she came out of that pharmacy, she knew what she wanted to be when she grew up. >> i want to start a pharmacy, i want to become a pharmacist and go into medicine, that's what i hope. >> why do you want to be a pharmacist? >> i just my ambition. i want to do that. >> why did you decide? why did you think, oh, pharmacist, that's what i want to do. >> when i was [inaudible] >> really? >> yes. >> were you in a pharmacy one day and thought, i might want to work. >> yes. >> really? was that the first time you saw a pharmacy? >> yes, it was the first time. >> she told me that in october at her high school where she got the highest scores on her exams of the 151 girls at her high school who are able to attend school thanks entirely to your generosity. established a kind fund, kids in need of desks, as a partnership between msnbc and unicef to deliver desks to schools in malawi, where the students had never seen desks and to provide scholarships for girls to attend high school because public high school in malawi is not free and the girls high school graduation rate is less than half the boy's graduation rate. she told me that the reason she worked so hard to become the highest testing girl in her high school was to make you feel proud for providing her with a scholarship. >> feel me like i should [inaudible] so that [inaudible] should feel proud, yeah? that is why i work hard. that's it. [inaudible] so that you should feel proud of me that your school fees didn't go to waste. it helped. >> your school fees did not go to waste. giving tuesday begins at midnight tonight. we hope this year, as many of you have in the past, you will keep the girls in malawi in mind along with the kids in elementary schools and allowing in need desks. you can contribute any amount at last word desks dot com, last word desks dot msnbc.com. no notice to small. you can specify that your kept is for desks or for the scholarship fund. you can make a contribution in the name of anyone in your holiday get plus and unicef will send them an acknowledgment of your gift. as i told you last week on the first day of the trip to malawi this year, i met with a group of girls who are now in college thanks to the scholarships you provided for them to complete high school. one of those girls is just ali, right there beside me in that photograph, she's appeared on this program since we've met her at her high school in malawi when she was a scholarship student. the next day, after that meeting with the girls and college, i shall this photograph to a group of high school girls who are currently receiving kind fund scholarships. i showed them a photograph of all of those girls in college now. i told them joyce's story about being sent home from school because she couldn't afford the school fees and then being able to go back to school thanks to our scholarship and pursue her dream of going to medical school, which is where joyce is right now. >> when you're our university student, we come back to visit you again, we see how you are doing, that's choice right there. >> the squeaking you might have been hearing was the birds just outside of the open windows. later, i asked the girls what they felt when they saw that photograph of girls just like them in college. >> what did it feel like when you saw that picture? >> i'm very inspired because joyce said that she was also sent home from school because she had school fees. it's the same like me also. at first, i was also sent [inaudible] she's like [inaudible] if she do this, i can also do this because of everything i need. they pay my school fees and [inaudible] >> what did it feel like when you saw this picture? >> i'm very happy because i would be like joyce. joyce was like me. she worked hard and there she is. >> and that can be you. >> yeah. >> that will be where [inaudible] >> i'm so special. >> joyce is now a role model. at the end of our meeting, the girls saying their gratitude. ♪ ♪ ♪ [applause] [silence] - with vraylar. some medicines only treat the lows or highs. vraylar treats depressive, acute manic, and mixed episodes of bipolar 1 in adults. proven, full-spectrum relief for all bipolar 1 symptoms. and in vraylar clinical studies, most saw no substantial impact on weight. elderly dementia patients have increased risk of death or stroke. call your doctor about unusual changes in behavior or suicidal thoughts. antidepressants can increase these in children and young adults. report fever, stiff muscles or confusion which may mean a life-threatening reaction, or uncontrollable muscle movements which may be permanent. high blood sugar, which can lead to coma or death, weight gain and high cholesterol may occur. movement dysfunction and restlessness are common side effects. sleepiness and stomach issues are also common. side effects may not appear for several weeks. ask about vraylar and learn how abbvie could help you save. i'm adding downy unstopables to my wash. now i'll be smelling fresh all day long. 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(music) have heart failure with unresolved symptoms? it may be time to see the bigger picture. heart failure and seemingly unrelated symptoms, like carpal tunnel syndrome, shortness of breath, and irregular heartbeat could be something more serious called attr-cm, a rare, underdiagnosed disease that worsens over time. sound like you? call your cardiologist, and ask about attr-cm. my mom's life is the most important thing to me. hi mom! i called my mom, "i have this gene and i think you need to get tested." she feels like it was truly lifesaving. with the freestyle libre 2 system know your glucose level and where it's headed without fingersticks. manage your diabetes with more confidence and lower your a1c. it's covered by medicare for those who qualify. ask your doctor about the freestyle libre 2 system. >> the hardworking high school girls of malawi get tonight's last word. the 11th hour with stephanie ruhle starts now.