it's saturday, november 25th, and you are watching velshi on msnbc. i'm charles coleman junior, filling in this weekend for my friend and colleague, ali velshi, and we have got a lot to talk about. we start off following breaking news this morning on day two of a fragile pause in the war between israel and hamas. today, we are expecting a second exchange of hostages and prisoners. we are waiting word on when exactly that exchange will happen, and how many hostages taken by hamas will be exchange for palestinian prisoners held and israeli presence. we are going to bring this to you, along with all of the latest developments with live pictures and reporting from how nbc news team on the ground in israel. but check in with that team in just a few moments. but first, let's get up to date on the multiple trials of donald trump, we are new developments this holiday week may have slipped under the radar. for starters, there is the ongoing legal battles over a pair of gag orders against the former president. now, in the new brief opposing the temporary pause of the gag orders in the civil -- case in new york, a quarter official with judicial threats, assessment, unit detailed the torrent of harassment that judge -- offered and his clerk have also been receiving. i gotta say that again, because it's a mouthful, and it is likely something you haven't heard of. that judicial threats assessment unit. the fact that you haven't heard of it is probably a good thing. but it is and it does just what it sounds like. it -- threats to judges, clerks, and other court employees to basically ensure protection and safety of all of these employees as they simply do their jobs. and now, the same unit is being called, in no small part, the former president of the united states can't seem to resist the urge to attack those who are simply trying to make sure that justice is served while he's on trial. let that sink in for a moment. the brief that was filed by the state attorney generals office noted that the close personal cell phone and emails have also been compromised. and as a result, quote, she has been subjected to, on a daily basis, harassing, disparaging comments, and antisemitic tropes. and quote. the court official added the threats are considered to be serious and credible, and not hypothetical or speculative. this filing includes the records of some of those messages, much of which i cannot say on television because, basically every word is an expletive or some the rock a tory term. i like my job and my mom watches me. this gag order in new york is paused at least till monday, where we expecting our judges in a new york appeals court will consider the issue. but what's happening in new york is the kind of harassment that prosecutors down in d.c. are also trying to prevent in the federal election interference case against the former president. in fact, prosecutors sent that very same brief the d.c. court of appeals as part of their own bid to get the gag order in their case reinstated. this past monday, judges at the d.c. court of appeals signaled they were open to keeping a narrower version of the order in place. but, those judges had yet to issue a final rule. meanwhile, there are growing concerns at a florida judge's slow walking the classified documents case. and that is judges, perhaps, opening a door for the trial to be delayed. now, if you have been keeping score at home, yes. this is the same judge who happens to be a trump appointee. and, it is the same judge who got reversed on appeal after she performed legal somersaults trying to stretch the law in response to that conflict of a special master in the same case. and that happened way before the doj had even finish this investigation and indicted the former president. and yes, this is also the same judge who pushed the trial date for this documents case way into may of 2024. now, even with that may 2024 dates, still technically looming on the calendar, critics have pointed out that judge aileen cannon has been taking her sweet time deciding on motions and has postponed some key pretrial deadlines. the concern with all of this, that could add up and result in the trial eventually being pushed back, perhaps when you push back even further, the 2024 presidential election. with me now is david e. graham, staffer for the atlantic, david, thank you for joining me this morning. you have written basically that all of the trump cases, and the classified documents matter, this one is the one that is open and shut. but that jack smith may have gotten the short straw in terms of getting judge cannon as a sitting judge, providing over the case. what are your specific concerns about her and what she has done so far, in terms of moving this forward? >> i think you laid it out there. procedurally, you see we are doing very thing very slowly. you see her being very -- through events, which is not necessarily a flaw in a judge, we want a -- fair system. but repeatedly, you saw her getting reversed in the investigative process. and then, you see this slow walking. it's a problem because not only is this an open and shut case, but you are depriving potentially voters of the ability to have the right information when they decide if donald trump committed a felony crimes in absconding with these documents and refusing to turn over. voters deserve to know that before they cast a vote. and to try to get the schedule, slipped it write letters of good, off the voters will get a chance to decide before the -- >> it seems like one of the go-tos, other than the delay tactics, that is in donald trump's defensive back, is the first amendment. it seems like he is using that as a sort and a shield, and that's one of the things his lawyers have been trying to frame this issue around. here in colorado, or on the 14th amendment case, and the defense, there and pretty much all over the place, do you think that is going to be a convincing argument for them, going forward? >> you see judge chutkan saying is he is the first amendment, but he's a criminal defendant. criminal defendants don't have the same rights to speech everybody else does. and it's interesting to see the d.c. circuit court considering that, and seeming to find some value in that, but not total. i think they are concerned he is a presidential candidate. they don't want to be seen as doing election interference, which, of course, is what he says is going on. so, it's a potent talking points. but i think you know, there just needs to be an acknowledgment that when you are a criminal defendant, there are things you can't say, no matter what the person says. it doesn't matter if your presidential candidate or a joe on the street. this is the way the law works. >> it's got to squeeze in one last question. you've also written recently about some of the things that donald trump said, basically unhinged, being also his threats against judges and prosecutors as well as the alarming changes he said he would make if he gets a second term. how seriously should the public be taking these things, project 2025 and everything else he's been saying? >> i think we really need to take him very seriously. he tried to do a lot of the things he said he would do in 2016, and the things you are saying now are much more serious. and much more dangerous. i think he has a real edge, on those preventers he didn't have before. so, i think these things are very real. we can't just look at him as sort of somebody saying silly and impede and things. it's somebody with some really dangerous ideas that he wants to put in the practice. >> atlanta staff writer david graham, thank you so much for joining me this morning. and now, i want to bring in congresswoman jasmine crockett, who is a member of the house oversight and accountability committee. jasmine, congresswoman crockett, so good to see you and have you. we are still a few months away from the scheduled start of the four criminal trials against donald trump. can you talk about how important it is for these cases to proceed on time, and try before we get to the actual election? >> yeah, so first of all, good morning. it's great to see you as well. and one of the things that honestly i want to stress is, and charles, you know this. the fact that donald trump has been treated unlike anyone that we have ever seen before. i was just having this debate yesterday about the fact that anyone else would be under the deal by. now even type of note that emotion for contempt, of course, would have been filed. and he would have been jailed. and honestly, he is violating gag order after a gag order, and for some reason, he is still walking around, and not truly being treated like any criminal defendant. but it's important for the people to see the evidence against donald trump before they can hopefully make a fully informed decision. i'll be honest with you, though, there's a certain amount of people. it doesn't really matter how much evidence you show them and they still want this tyrant to be over our country. we talked earlier about voting rights. the degradation of any freedoms have funnel trump supreme court it's the one that has gotten rid of our reproductive access, gotten rid of affirmative action, and, now they are going after section two after we finally had a few cases that were in the w column for us, whether it was louisiana or if it was alabama, or potentially, georgia, it is always the south. it is someone who comes from texas. trust me, i can tell you i am so upset that we don't have section five, and we absolutely have to make sure that section two is kept intact in that way it always has existed. >> now congresswoman, you brought up texas. so, we gonna stay there, because this is your district. and your home state. donald trump has already talked about what he wants to do around immigration, and i'm staying in texas because it's a border state. so, are you concerned or do you have the confidence that there are currently enough guardrails in democracy from him, you know, going into some of these most extreme policies around immigration? what are your thoughts there? >> i'm glad you brought this up, because obviously, i spent a lot of time talking about israel. you know, there's a lot of people that are saying hey, we have issues with the president, talking about president biden, and its handling of israel, and they're saying, we are going to stand down. we're not going to support him. i do want to point out that donald trump was the one who was actually pushing forward with a muslim ban. a muslim ban that did not go forward, because he did not have the court of his choosing. donald trump is made it clear he wants to go ahead and re-urge that muslim ban. so, for those that believe they have issues with president biden, and i'm not saying that you don't have issues, i'm saying you should have a few more issues with the person that literally wants to ban muslims in this country. he has always tried. he has tried it before, and he said he will do it again. this is not the type of leadership we need. and i know that people are frustrated right now, because they feel like they are cities are being overrun, and this is a federal government problem. you know, yesterday, i had an opportunity to listen into twitter spaces. it was my first time, and i was actually listening to george santos from your state, and honestly, i was shocked, because it was the first time he was talking a lot of truth bombs, and one of them was the fact that this has been the most ineffective congress this house has been the most, ineffective in the history of the congress. and it is because we have not passed any bills of consequence. including if the republicans really wanted to fix the immigration, they would be pushing forward with on right now. they don't have solutions. all they have is more problems for the american people. >> i see what you did there, in terms of trying to slip in george santos being from my home state. that's okay, because i did not have you agreeing with george santos on my saturday bingo card, and there it is. you are congressman crockett, a freshman member, along with your freshman classmates, who you just mentioned. george santos. you all have had a run in terms of your first year in congress and your first term. but last time we spoke on air, was before we had gotten the cr that was taking us to november 17. we now have another one that is taking us further. what are your thoughts on moving forward, since you were talking about the federal government, in terms of the ability to actually get a budget approved without having to do these continued stopgaps under the current leadership in the house? >> you know, honestly, i have said twice that the government was going to shut down, and i was very confident in saying that. i must say it again, because at least when i say, it it's not true, and so, that is a good thing. but i don't have any confidence in the speaker. when we were there, before we came home for the thanksgiving break, there were two appropriations bills that never made it to the floor, because the speaker didn't have the votes. the week before that, there was another appropriations bill that didn't make it to the floor, because he didn't have the votes. so, you, know you can change whoever the head is of the circus, but it's still a circus. , so until analyst the speaker decides he wants to sit down with the democrats, which the democrats have proven that we are down for governance. we actually want to make sure that we protect the american people, that see hours that have passed have passed overwhelmingly, because of the support of democrats. democrats are ready to work and serve. if the speaker wants to go ahead and decide that he will neglect the extreme side of this party, if you can even call it a party at this point in time, and he wants to actually get to the work of the american people, the democrats are there. and another amazing congressman, hakeem jeffries, out of new york, it's always ready into owing to work. so, we are ready to work. but i don't really see that happening anytime soon. >> there was another amazing congresswoman in your background, the late, great surely chisholm. give it up for her. also from new york. a little texas two step this saturday morning with congresswoman jasmine crockett. thank you so much for joining us on velshi. still ahead, hamas and israel are expected to release a new batch of hostages and presenters today. this as the temporary truce between the two sides enters its second day. antoday's meeting of the velshi banned book club with ali velshi. he is going to speak with a man who's been fighting for access for lgbtq stories to be heard they will discuss just how important those books are. i am charles clements junior and this is velshi on msnbc. lshi on msnbc. lshi on msnbc. m who makes, everyday products, designed smarter. genius! like 2.5% cash back on purchases of $5,000 or more, so sam can make smart ideas, a brilliant reality! chase for business. make more of what's yours. ♪♪ i was looking at my ancestry traits the other day. i figured it out why i never actually made the football team. yeah, because you're 5'8”. wait robbie, go look at the sprinter gene. i wonder if you have it or that's why you didn't make the team. let me see. let me pull it up. don't have it. yup, i knew it. what else does it tell you? no, hold on, i'm going to find some athletic gene in here. endurance, no. speed, average. i would say below average. give the gift of family heritage with ancestry. the subway series is getting an upgrade. the new #33. the teriyaki blitz. with double cheese and teriyaki-marinated meat. it's like a perfect steak spiral in the double cheese coverage. if you say so, peyton. who knew the subway series could get even better? >> welcome back. i'm charles clement junior and you're watching velshi on msnbc. we are continuing to follow the latest breaking developments out of israel, where another group of hostages is set to be released by hamas in exchange for a group of palestinian prisoners held in israeli prisons. you are taking a live look right now at the rafah crossing. now, this is between egypt and the gaza strip. the hostages that are going to be released today are expected to be transferred through this very crossing. now, the situation is very fluid, so it's unclear where this exchange is going to happen, or how many hostages are going to be released. friday's exchange saw 13 israelis, ten tight nationals, and one filipino released for 39 palestinian prisoners amidst a four-day pause in military action. joining me now is an nbc news correspondent, erin mclaughlin in tel aviv, as well as nbc news correspondent, david noriega in ramallah, in the west bank. aaron, again, so glad to have you with us so you can let us know exactly what is going on. what do we know more about what we can expect, regarding this exchange today? >> well charles, we are still waiting for news this time yesterday, some 13 israeli hostages had been handed over to the red cross and crossed through the rafah crossing into egypt, into israel, to begin that healing process. we have not heard anything from government officials about today's release. earlier today, we had heard from a diplomat with knowledge of the process say that the expectation was that 13 israeli hostages would be released today, though that was not confirmed by the israeli government. the israeli government, reluctant to hand out every list of identities of the hostages that were expected due to the fragility of this process. remember, these negotiations have been going on between israel, qatar, the united states, and hamas. hamas being a terror organization and seen as volatile and unreliable. so again, we have no news other than that one diplomat saying that they had expected this process to go forward today, charles. >> now david, israel has been very clear that it is fully expecting and preparing for fighting in the war to resume after this four-day pause is over. but the people you spoke to in ramallah are really hoping that this was perhaps the beginning of the end. is there a difference in terms of the expectation between the two sides after this exchange takes place? >> charles, you are right. i have spoken to several people here in the west bank who said that they are hopeful that this temporary truce is the beginning, the seed of a longer process that ultimately leads to lasting peace. however, it's important to remember that this conflict is not just about october 7th and everything that's happened since then. for the people that i've spoken to here in the west bank, for them, there won't really be lasting peace until there is an end to the occupation. it's not up to them when or if there is an end to the occupation. when it comes to the parties actually involved in the fighting, the idf and hamas, you know, hamas has also indicated that as long as the idf continues its military campaign in gaza, they will continue fighting as well. so, for ordinary palestinians, the sorts of people i've been speaking to the last couple of days, their hopes, unfortunately, are just that, they are hopes. charles? -- >> erin, to that point, there is some palestinians who have started returning to their homes or what used to be their homes in northern gaza. israel has warned them not to do that because that is, in part, an active war zone. what is driving palestinians back north, despite these warnings? >> well, charles, palestinians in gaza just simply want to go home. they want this fighting to stop. they are facing this desperate humanitarian situation, shortages of all the basics. food, water, medicine, and fuel. to that and, part of this agreement was for trucks full of humanitarian aid to cross from egypt through the rafah crossing into gaza, badly needed there. that was, as i said, part of this agreement. we heard from hamas earlier today voice their displeasure at the number of trucks that had crossed yesterday. today, according to the palestinian red crescent, more than 61 trucks crossed as part of the largest convoy of aid since the war began. and humanitarian organizations are saying much more is needed. they've been calling for a five-day pause. the irc has been calling for a five-day pause at minimum, and would like to see a full cease-fire, given the desperate situation there in gaza. >> david, we've heard from the palestinian red crescent, whose announced a convoy of 61 trucks of aid have been dispatched to northern gaza. can you talk about the significance of this air drop to that region? >> yeah, charles. first of all, i should say that the situation on the ground in gaza is very unclear. we don't know how many of those 61 trucks have actually been able to reach the north. however, the larger question of aid reaching the north is in itself, very significant, because that is where the bombing and the fighting has been concentrated. and it has not been possible for meaningful aid to reach the north at all, while the hostilities continue. so, the very idea of eight reaching north is the result of there being a cease-fire. -- significant simply because there are still people in the north, right? we know that at least 1 million people were displaced to the south, but we are hearing estimates that some 400 to 500,000 people remain in the north. for them, this kind of aid could be life saving. i should also say that from the perspective of the palestinian red crescent, which is in charge of delivering this aid, they say it's still not enough. you know, given the scale of the devastation and the suffering, they say it is not enough. but again, any aid from, their perspective, is better than none at all. charles? >> that was nbc news correspondent, erin mclaughlin and david noriega. thank you to you both. we are going to continue this conversation with someone who has been covering the israeli, palestinian conflict for over two decades. we will be right back with more velshi on msnbc on the other side of this break. n msnbc on the other side of this break side of this break how's the heart? good. you sure? i think so. how do you know? let me show you something. put two fingers right on those pads. look at that! that's your heart! that is pretty awesome. with kardiamobile, you can take a medical-grade ekg in just 30 seconds, from anywhere. kardiamobile is proven to detect atrial fibrillation, one of the leading causes of stroke. cyber monday starts today. kardiamobile is now just $69, our lowest price ever. get it for yourself or a loved one at kardia.com or amazon. and wake up rejuvenated. with purple's new mattresses- fall asleep 20% faster have less aches and pains and sleep uninterrupted. right now save up to $900 off mattress sets during purple's black friday sale. visit purple.com or a store near you today. honey... honey... nyquil severe honey. powerful cold and flu relief with a dreamy honey taste. nyquil honey, the nighttime, sniffing, sneezing, couging, aching, fever, honey-licious, best sleep with a cold, medicine. in order for small businesses to thrive, fever, honey-licious, best sleep with a cold, they need to be smart, efficient, savvy. making the most of every opportunity. that's why comcast business is introducing the small business bonus. for a limited time you can get up to a $1000 prepaid card with qualifying internet. yep, $1000. so switch to business internet from the company with the largest fastest reliable network and that powers more businesses than anyone else. learn how you can get $1000 back for your business today. >> welcome back. comcast business. powering possibilities. joining me now is no good on a poll ski. nobody is an independent journalist who's been covering the conflict between the israelis and the palestinians for more than two decades. her work has focused on both human rights and the united states's involvement in the middle east. her voice in perspective has been invaluable, as we have followed this war over the last several weeks. no good, so good to talk to you again. what are you hearing about today's developments regarding the hostage exchange? >> thank you, charles. well, we have basically breaking news that it is not good news. hamas has announced that it is delaying, not suspending, but delaying the release of the hostages today. they have not yet been handed over to the red cross in gaza, despite reports about an hour ago that they had been. and hamas is saying that israel is not respecting the terms of the agreement. in two respects. they say that not enough aid trucks have arrived to the northern gaza strip and they also say that something israel has not done, something regarding the release of prisoners. palestinian prisoners from israeli jails, but they haven't given details about these issues. >> now, have you heard anything regarding this report from the idf, in terms of what they are saying in response to this apparent delay from hamas? >> the idf has yet to respond to this. in fact, this has really happened in the last ten minutes or so. there hasn't been any israeli response. i have to tell you that israel seemed pretty confident that this exchange was underway. confident enough that in the last hour, the family members of the hostages who are on this list for today, the list handed over by hamas, had been told to please head over to the hospitals, where their loved ones were expected to be taken after crossing the border from egypt. so, it seems that at least on the israeli side, this is quite unexpected. >> noga, this is such a fragile and tenuous time. if this does not happen, what does that mean for the four-day pause and fighting, and any potential future negotiations between israel and hamas around additional prisoner swaps? >> look, if today does not happen, it would be a pretty bad sign, i have to say. because that would mean that of the initial four-day planned, just one went smoothly and this, you know, really lift the hopes of israelis. it was the first bit of good news israelis have gotten since october 7th, that the hostages, first of all, are alive, and secondly, that the release could go smoothly. so, yesterday, there were real moments of jubilation in tel aviv, in jerusalem, and if this does not work today, and especially this kind of torture is heartbreak of families who have been called to get to the hospitals, to meet their newly released loved ones. if that does not go through, i expect that the reaction, the popular reaction tonight at the rallies of the hostage families will be pretty sharp and i'm not sure how many margins of error the israeli government really has on this one. >> now, to be clear, nbc news has not been able to confirm independently that information regarding the potential delay in today's exchange. but we are monitoring the situation and if and should we get confirmation, you will all, in our audience, be the first to know. noga, last night, you tweeted, quote, joe biden says hamas's latest list of hostages to be releed tomorrow will arrive shortly. hamas has never before experienceda thrill comparable to that of having the president of the united states has an opening act. tell me, what's the significance of president biden announcing hamas's list of hostages? >> it is hugely significant. if you know, hamas is a terror group. their aim, their stated aim in their manifesto, in their founding document, is to kill israelis, to end the israeli state. so, they are really rejecting, they are outcasts on the world stage. and all of a sudden, following the october 7th attack, in which 1200 israelis were killed, hamas has become a player. we saw last night not only to the president of the united states say, we are waiting for hamas's list, as if hamas, you know, and the united states are handling this matter, and israel isn't even a player. but yesterday, we saw ismail -- a hamas leader, having a lovely meeting in qatar with the iranian foreign minister, iran and qatar are the principal sponsors of this terror group. so, they are really riding high. they are imposing the rules of the game for this exchange. they are making their demands, you know, internationally acceptable. and that is something that is, i think the whole world actually is going to have to respond in some way to the legitimization of this terror group. >> now, noga, one of the things that players a notion for fighting around the narrative, there is a fight on the battlefield and then, of course, there's the messaging fight at both sides, they're trying their best to control. palestinians were released yesterday by israel and these are palestinians that the israeli government has characterized as prisoners. but many of whom are minors who were detained with no actual charges. can you talk a little bit about how that plays into the messaging and accuracy, in terms of who's being transferred in exchange for who? >> yes, so the palestinians, the 39 palestinians released yesterday, we're all prisoners. they were all held in israeli prisons, so by definition, but you are absolutely right that i think at least half of them had not been charged. they were held in what it's called in israel administrative detention, which is basically a military method for holding people when you suspect them, but either you can't be bothered to go to trial, or you think you might not win at a trial. and it is something that is very problematic, that is really human rights -- fight against and the world sees as an absolutely illegitimate use of state power in israel. so, when these people were released yesterday, israel defined them all as terrorists, but the fact of the matter is that not even half of them had been convicted of anything like terror. >> independent journalist, noga -- thank you so much for joining us. we will continue to follow these developments outside of israel and gaza and as soon as we get any new information or video, we will bring it to you right away. in the meantime, we are going to switch gears. ali velshi left us a meeting of the velshi banned book club and after a quick break, you will be treated to an important conversation about just how crucial access to books written by lgbtq+ authors actually is. our charles coleman junior and this is velshi on msnbc. nbc. nbc. (christmas music) ( ♪♪ ) weathertech gift cards have the power to wow everyone on your holiday list. offering a variety of american made products... weathertech! nice! like floorliners... cargo liner... seat protector... boot tray... cupfone... sink mat... pet feeding system... anti-fatigue comfortmat...and more. order the weathertech gift card instantly for the perfect gift at weathertech.com. velshi banned book club, with other remarkable lgbtq+ authors and their amazing stories, like jarred conley on boy erased and david in on two boys kissing made it very clear that it was not just johnson and the poignant memoir at the center of this storm. it was all of these lgbtq+ stories. according to our friends at pen america, a nonprofit dedicated to the freedom to read and write, 26% of all literature removed from public school libraries last year feature lgbtq+ characters or themes. why does this direct and unmitigated attack on the lgbtq+ community matter? i got another even more painful number. according to the trevor project, the leading crisis intervention nonprofit for lgbtq+ people, an lgbtq young person between the ages of 13 and 24 attempts suicide every 45 seconds. every 45 seconds. someone's daughter or son, or best friend tries to take their own life. people can be hateful. the world can be isolating and cruel, especially when you're 13 years old and the only get in your class, literature can help that vulnerable, young person feel like they are not the only person in the universe. the right book in the right moment can save their life. >> even one email i got from one student, when the book came out in 2016, he said that he found the book and he had wanted to commit suicide, and when he read the book, he no longer wanted to. >> it would be easy to sort of tried to hide it away, call the book something else, and let people find it secretly, but i love the power of a kid walks into a library or school, sees that book on the shelf, and they know they are represented. >> to say like oh, i don't want my child to read about this, it's like yes, but if your child is already 16, and i was 12 when i dealt with this, your child could already be dealing with this. >> now, imagine how it might feel to witness an adult attack these books. condemn these authors and blasts you for who you are and for who you love. imagine how it might feel to live in a state where the government agrees that you under community or so deplorable, you may not even read about it. today's meeting of the velshi banned book club will not be focusing on one single title, but rather the community left most foreigner will buy this increasingly inaccessible literature. this is so much more than a so-called culture war. for some people, this is life or death. so, right after a quick break, i will speak with someone who's battling lgbtq+ censorship every single day. brian bond is the ceo of p flag national, it's the first and largest organization dedicated to supporting, educating, and advocating for lgbtq+ people and their families. don't go anywhere. don't go anywhere. don't go anywhere. tely feels like somebody's poking directly on the nerve. i recommend sensodyne. sensodyne toothpaste goes inside the tooth and calms the nerve down. and my patients say you know doc, it really works. are you tired of clean clothes that just don't smell clean? downy unstoppables in wash scent booster keep your laundry smelling fresh way longer than detergent alone. get 6x longer-lasting freshness plus odor production with downy unstopables. try for under $5. ♪ i wanna hold you forever ♪ hey little bear bear. ♪ ♪ ♪ i'm gonna love you forever ♪ ♪ ♪ c'mon, bear. ♪ ♪ ♪ you don't...you don't have to worry... ♪ ♪ be by your side... i'll be there... ♪ ♪ with my arms wrapped around... ♪ ♪♪ we're not writers, but we help you shape your financial story. ♪♪ we're not an airline, but our network connects global businesses across nearly 160 markets. ♪♪ we're not a startup, but our innovation labs use new technologies to help keep your information secure. ♪♪ we're not architects, but we help build stronger communities. ♪♪ we're not just any bank. we are citi. ♪♪ the subway series? it's the perfect menu lineup. just give us a number, we got the rest. number three? the monster. six? the boss. fifteen? titan turkey. number one? the philly. oh, yeah, you probably don't want that one. look, i'm not in charge of naming the subs. >> today's meeting of the velshi banned book club -- i'm joined by brian vaughan, ease the chief executive officer of pete flag national, the largest organization dedicated to supporting, educating, and advocating for lgbtq+ individuals and their families. before joining p flag, brian served in the -- administration's deputy director for the white house's office of public engagement. he was the primary liaison for the lgbtq+ community, the first person to ever serve in that role. brian, it's great to see you again. thank you for being with us. >> thank you for having me on, i really appreciate it and appreciate all that you do. speaking about these important issues. >> thank you, it was sort of a sad introduction, but when i was with you at p flag and we were actually talking about book banning, it was not sad. there were, in fact, a lot of parents and families who believed very strongly in this cause of making sure that literature that celebrates gay, lesbian children's out there and it's free to read. but there was almost an optimism, which i saw manifest in the recent off year elections that showed that parents and families are willing to go out there and fight these bans on a local level. >> i think that's absolutely true. you know, to your point earlier, this is a really challenging time. it's extremely difficult out there. but there is a resilience to this community, to the lgbtq+ community, and our allies to speak out, to use our voices in support of our kids out there. you know, p flag is 50 years old this year, as you know, and we started by a mom, a schoolteacher, no less, who took to the street to defend her kid, her gay son, and that's what we've been doing ever since for the last 50 years, and a good example, might be this. i know you've reported on this, but the central bucs school district, there, you know, you had a lot of amazing parents, pete flag parents, and other parents who went together and mindy freeman, her daughter lily, they could use their voices and their passion to speak out. this is, let's be honest here, and you've talked about this when you are with us, this is a small group of people. well organized, well funded, built filled with hate, candidly. and bullies. but the more we get the message out there, the more you do what you do, the more parents that lift up their voices in support of their kids, the more we will be able to push back on this. as you know, 70% of the country is opposed to banning books. so, we've got things on our side. we've just got to continue to keep organizing. >> i was talking about all boys are not lose by george and johnson. there is something else notable and surprising when i spoke with george all those months ago. the members of this club, the velshi banned book club who wrote to us with the strongest reactions who had the most gratitude for george and johnson's willingness to tell their story were white, cisgender, middle aged viewers, which a lot of my viewers are. it was not just lgbtq+ kids who say thank you for showing me, in your book. it was a whole bunch of people who are saying, thank you for telling me about life experience that i know nothing about. >> georgia's book is extremely impactful for so many reasons. you know, i obviously, as a black queer man, i have a different jury than -- but i grew up in rural missouri and, you know, i was thinking about, as i was getting ready for this, i looked really hard p to find a book in a library that put me in a positive context. i never found that and that's part of the reason i think we all do what we do today, to ensure that opportunity exists. you know, we are really fighting on two fronts here. if you don't mind me saying this, one is to make sure that some lgbtq+ kid out there can see themselves, be themselves, and thrive. and second is really to defend our democracy. you know, these are the same people that are trying to chip away at the cornerstone of our freedoms and we have to be in this fight and it's a daily passion for us at p flag, for sure. >> i want to touch on that second one because we talk a lot of books about that intersection of book banning and degradation to our democracy is a key one, because at this point, it's like, i don't make kids reading this because the book is going to make them gay. it's actually not about the book and what it will make you or what it won't make you. it's about your right to make that decision for yourself or for your family, and not offering that right to the state. that's the distinction. i've had lgbtq+ parents, parents of lgbtq+ kids, trans kids in particular, who have said to me that my biggest fear right now is the state, not my neighbors. not the public, not the people out there, not the media. it's my actual state that's telling my child that they are, in some fashion, illegitimate or invalid. >> there is, as you know, a full throttle attack on lgbtq+ people right now, especially trans kids. in states across the country. this is an attack on freedom, on freedom to parent, to learn, and it's a slippery slope once you start going down, when you start banning books, when you start banning things. it's not just happening in the book area, it is across the board, and i don't think most people, candidly, you know, it is undemocratic and it is un-american. >> let me ask you about the things that happen when there is good literature available that reflects lgbtq+ authors, characters, or stories. what is that? you touched on this from personal experience a little bit, is that validation? is that recognition? is that legitimacy? is it safety? what is it? >> i think it's all of the above. people need to see themselves and it is extremely hard right now for kids out there when they are hearing all of these things that you spoke to earlier about them. kids need to see themselves. they need to know that they will be okay and candidly, their parents need to see that too. they need to know that their kid can thrive and kids are thriving out there, despite everything that's going on. i see community every day, in fact, in the last year, 36 new p flag chapter started in this country, all in towns of less than 50,000 people. so, to your original point, though, we need to see ourselves, and that allows people to know, at the end of the day, they are going to be okay, they are going to be able to do this. this literally is about saving lives. >> brian, you are so wonderful. your organization is so wonderful, thank you for allowing me to meet some of these great family members out there. i wish the whole country could see the pride in meeting the parents of these lgbtq+ people, the pride in meeting the parents of trans kid. it will change a lot of people's views when they understand that everybody's family, everybody just wants a chance to live their best lives. brian, good to see you, as always. thank you for being with me. -- >> thank you so much. >> brian bond, the chief executive officer at p flag national. >> a fantastic segment, indeed. that's going to do it for me. stay tuned for more msnbc with alex with reports, coming up right after the break. if you want more velshi, you can tune in right here every saturday and sunday from 10 am to noon, and i am charles coleman junior. thank you for watching, ali has the weekend off. i will be back tomorrow. i will be back tomorrow. i will be back tomorrow. solved symptoms? it may be time to see the bigger picture. heart failure and seemingly unrelated symptoms, like carpal tunnel syndrome, shortness of breath, and irregular heartbeat could be something more serious called attr-cm, a rare, underdiagnosed disease that worsens over time. sound like you? call your cardiologist, and ask about attr-cm. the power goes out and we still have wifi call your cardiologist, to do our homework. and that's a good thing? great in my book! who are you? no power? no problem. introducing storm-ready wifi. now you can stay reliably connected through power outages with unlimited cellular data and up to 4 hours of battery back-up to keep you online. only from xfinity. >> a very good day to all of home of the xfinity 10g network. you from msnbc world headquarters here in new york. welcome, everyone, to alex witt reports. we are beginning with this breaking news and a flurry of activity in the middle east. anxious families still waiting for the release of a second group of hostages by hamas, while israel prepares to release a second group of palestinian prisoners. this is th

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