out. >> i'll save it for the next election. >> yes, oh my god. [applause] >> a friendship so great, not even kornacki himself could have predicted it. and on that absolutely fantastic no, i wish you a very good night. from all of our colleagues across the work of nbc news, thank you for staying up late, a siena tomorrow. >> and thanks to you at home for joining me this hour. before he was even elected president, donald trump had a journalist kicked out of a press conference just for asking a question. >> okay, who is next, yes? please? >> [inaudible] >> excuse, me sudden, you are called, sit down. -- i have >> the right to ask a question. >> sit down, please. >> you weren't called. >> trump looks over at his staff, a bodyguard walks over, and ushers ramos out of the news conference. >> sit down, sit down, go back to univision. the journalist that trump had his security kick out from that press conference was jorge ramos, one of the most prominent latino journalists in the country. now, ramos has conducted extended interviews with george h. w. bush, george w. bush, bill clinton, and barack obama, or a ramos is a huge deal. but donald trump wanted nothing to do with him. ramos repeatedly and publicly asked trump to sit for an interview, and trump not only declined, but he posted a photo online of a letter that ramos had sent him, claiming that ramos and his employer univision were begging, begging him for an interview. trump's relationship to ramos and univision stayed icy throughout his presidency. in 2020, the trump campaign even put out this press release, titled, univision is not a news network. it is a leftist propaganda machine. and a mouthpiece of the democrat party. and that history is why it was so shocking last week when univision had an hour-long interview with donald trump in which he was thrown softball questions like this one. >> talking about posts, the new york times, cnn, they came out this week, it has you with a solid lead in five of the six states that could decide the election. but it also has you with 42% of latino voters support, that is unprecedented for a republican candidate, what do you think the message voters are saying with these numbers? >> now the only thing weirder than asking, why are you doing so well with latino voters, it's probably trump's response to that question. >> well the latina voters are so incredible, because they are unbelievable people, they have incredible skills, incredible energy, and they are very entrepreneurial, all you have to do is look at the owners of univision, they are unbelievable entrepreneurial people. and they like me. >> trump's praise of univision and its owners was strange, but it's more reporting that's come out about this, interview and things have gotten even stranger. last week -- three top executives at univision and its new parent company tel aviv to where in the room during that interview with trump. now that is not entirely crazy on its own, sometimes executives just show up one high profile interviews are happening. but this week, the washington post reports that that wasn't the only strange thing about that interview with trump. according to the, post univision canceled a booking with president biden's hispanic media director, bianca kaskitayo, who is scheduled to respond to the trump interview after it aired. maybe most significantly of all, univision canceled ads that had already been purchased by the biden campaign and scheduled to run during the trump interview. inhibition told the washington post that's decision not to run those biden ads came from an unannounced policy about opposition advertising in single candidate interviews, and that there would be no trump advertising allowed if president biden gave univision an interview. so far, there is no plan to interview with president biden. and all week, we have been getting alarming stories alleging that univision has been making editorial and business decisions that seem to directly benefit donald trump, and then tonight, just a few hours ago, one of the networks most prominent anchors, león kraus, he announced that he has left the network. now, we should say that krause has not yet announced why he has left univision. but the timing here, just a day after the post reporting about univision shifting its approach to donald trump, that timing raises some questions. because beyond the ethics questions on the table here, univision's audience matters a lot politically. last, year you division had the seventh biggest network audience in all of tv, it is the most watched spanish language network in the united states. univision is the channel of choice for a key demographic in this country, and one that seems increasingly up for grabs in the next election. if it is executives that are really shifting the networks approach to covering trump, asking softball questions, not pushing back on trump's lies. then that could have a real impact on the 2024 election. and univision isn't the only media company that appears to be softening its approach to donald trump. today the wall street journal reports that meta, the parent company of facebook, threads, and instagram, quietly changed its policy to allow ads that claim past elections were stolen. that means that the trump campaign can end is running ads that say things like this. >> we are wanting 2016, we had a rigged election in 2020, but got more votes than any sitting president. >> that ran as part of an ad on facebook in august. matt has old policy didn't allow ads that claim voter fraud is widespread and or alters the outcome of elections, its new policy states that the platform doesn't allow ads that call into question the legitimacy of an upcoming or ongoing election. elections are apparently fair game. this follows youtube in june announcing that has similarly stopped removing claims of widespread fraud in the 2020 election. so, you know, feel free to erode public faith in america's democracy, as long as you are using examples from the past. it is unclear why a company like meta believes that trump's false claim about the election being stolen is all about the past, because quite clearly that big lie is laying the groundwork for the next election in 2024. and here is donald trump yet again stoking fears about election fraud in another ad, one that is still live right now on instagram. >> but it may also be the last election that we ever have, if this election doesn't work, if this election is rigged and stolen, if bad things happen, our country will not survive, we will have become a dictatorship where your president is chosen for you. you will no longer have a vote, you certainly won't have a meaningful vote, and you could say, frankly, that has already begun. >> joining me now, -- national political reporter covering, campaign, congress and the national -- he is piling on the story about univision, michael, it is great to see you. thanks for being here tonight. there are a lot of questions that i have about this sort of relationship that has developed between donald trump and the owners of arguably the most important spanish language channel in the united states, can you talk a little bit a bit more about your reporting? >> there are a number of unusual, things you mentioned a couple of them. another one that you didn't mention was the jared kushner presidents son-in-law who has not really been involved this time in former president trump 's campaign, unlike his two previous rounds. he did kind of intervene with the campaign this time, according to our reporting, summarizing some people inside the campaign to help set up this interview. and that is notable, because during the trump administration, one of the executives who was there when former president trump praised them at mar-a-lago was a guy named bernardo gomez who is a senior executive of tel aviv in mexico city, who actually hosted a dinner between jared kushner and the mexican president during the trump administration, pella visa, i mean, a lot of the concern about this is that olivia has a long reputation in mexico dating back decades of being very friendly with whoever is in power in that country. and univision, when it was established in the united states, very intentionally defined itself against that. tried to set itself up as an american style news network that was going to talk truth to power, that was going to be more aggressive. four years there has been this sort of give and take with tel aviv. a lot of the programming on univision's tel aviv says telenovela such are very popular, but the actual corporate control was not overseen by tel aviv to. until relatively recently when essentially the two companies merged. and now you have this blinding, which is causing significant consternation in the univision newsroom in miami. >> michael, do you have any insight into the resignation of leone krause who departed univision this evening, and we don't know why, is it potentially related to these changes? >> we don't know, why the timing is notable. the verb he used in his statement was my time with innovation is concluded. the only statement that tel aviv the univision put out, simply congratulated him for his time and wished him the best of luck in his nest endeavor. i think right now this is very much an open question. it is -- financial concerns -- a number of people, there is fear of layoffs coming in the future. but there was no indication that that was the reason. he was the only person, as far as our reporting pinto, who let's go yesterday. or resigned, we don't know. and so we are continuing to pursue that. >> and no word yet from jorge ramos who, of course, it's one of the gourd standard for interviewing as far as univision in three years for presidential students. i got to ask about the biden ads that were polled. conveniently for the, i'm from infinitely for president biden. is there further detail on whether there is going to be a biden sit down? whether that was part of donald trump's ask in order to give univision the sit-down interview with him? >> we don't know, we do know that from univision, they said it wasn't the newsroom that made that decision it was a corporate decision from above them. presumably someone didn't like the look of an ad running like that. it is typical to have opposition ads run, like during the presidential debate you will have a democratic ad run, during a rolling debate. but univision said it standards here, what is interesting, i, mean it's worth noting, if this wasn't just a normal, interview they took out the ten pm hour last thursday. which is their highest rated hour. it's an hour for tele-novellas. they promoted this interview, they did that behind the scenes the next day. this was a network special. it was a special, event and it was happening for, donald trump was leading republican, candidate but he is not the republican nominee for president. not right now. now, they have said, univision and said that they have made a number of requests to speak with the president biden, the biden campaign said they had not received a request until after that interview, the campaign itself had no request mentioned an hour-long sit-down. i think that's another shoe that's gonna drop, how the biden campaign and univision figure out how to move forward. from this point. because there is clearly a lot of anger on the biden side. >> right, anger that is complicating, given the fact that biden is still very much needing to speak to the innovations audience. michael, share great, great reporting. thank you so much for being here tonight. >> thank you. >> it is not difficult to see where the developments innovation could be problematic for the biden campaign. according to the latest new york times cnn poll, biden's margin of support among hispanic voters is a 50% versus trump's 42%. which is an eight-point margin, and which is fairly close given the new reporting from the new york times about trump's plans for a second term. including his pledge to launch the largest deportation effort in u.s. history. , by preparing eight and more years -- removal that does not require due process hearings. and by creating massive camps to hold immigrants while they await removal. but there is one man who remains quite confident in president biden's chances. at reelection. jim messina, the man behind barack obama's successful 2012 reelection campaign. and he is with me now, jim messina, ceo of the massena group. and of course, as we just, said the man who successfully ran president obama's 2012 reelection campaign. jim, it is great to see you, i first wonder what your reaction is to the news we have, the new reporting about the ways in which media, not just univision, but social media as well, maybe changing policies in a faction that could directly help donald trump and certainly provide a bigger platform for his lies? >> it is incredibly concerning, right? . these are some of the things that happened in 2016 when donald trump kind of liked at the first time, he clearly misused facebook and other things that were apologies made with the damages to democracy, it was all there. we kind of thought the people had gotten the lesson here. but now, you know, people are hedging their bets. and starting to change their policies. with the theory that donald trump could actually win this election, and in the middle of all of this, with democracy at stake, it is incredibly concerning that the same companies are now starting to do this all over again. >> i wonder what you make a, if you know, as we talk about univision, and its audience of latino voters. how critical, i mean, how much the biden campaign should be ringing the alarm bells in terms of its support among voters of color. i believe it is 42% of hispanic voters were leaning towards trump, 50% leaning towards biden among black voters. 22% of black voters and six key swing states said they would vote trump over biden and, i mean, that is a function of trump just basically being in a courtroom most of the time? and not on the stump in a more public way? saying the same sort of demagogue xenophobic things that he did for his four years as president? and is that sort of just amnesia? what is that? >> you are exactly right. people just sort of forgotten how bad and how crazy that this guy is because he has not been on the stage. right now, you know, everyone is comparing biden to the almighty. but next year there will be an actual choice between two candidates. and that, i think, until that happens, i don't gonna see much movement in the polls. you and i have talked before about my concern and criticism of polls thus far. it is here before the election and they are historically wrong, barack obama was put on the cover this week during his reelection ten years ago by the new york times magazine, he said he had a 17% chance to win, and that he was toast. and clearly he won that election handily. so i am not concerned with the polls. i am concerned that we get our message out, and that is why think the biden campaign is doing exactly what they should be doing. they have really big buys in the african american and latino and young communities right now. talking about the presidents, record talking about what he has gotten done. and i think that that is smart. no one has ever gone this early, and i think it shows you how serious they are taking these issues. >> i want to circle back to that in a second, but you have a peace and political that's basically like, stop bed-wetting democrats, i am paraphrasing greatly here. and you talk about the x-factor, the black swan events that are almost inevitably somewhere on the calendar next year. one of the things that you mentioned is trump, and the criminal trials, you, right will trump go to prison, it's possible. can you campaign from behind bars? i wouldn't even call these october surprises. you can almost guarantee that something big and unexpected will happen next year. the polling shows that a conviction for trump would actually maybe be enough to swing the election to biden. how much should democrats think about that as they move forward in the coming months? >> they shouldn't, because what i learned running a presidential campaign, alex, being in the white house, you can't plan for a black swan event. you have to control your message, you have to do the things you have got to do. what we have to do is move an economic message that makes sense. focus on turning our base out and sort of not worrying about what is gonna happen with donald trump, we can't control the myriad of trials in the 92 felony counts, and you can't assume those things were gonna happen. you know, some of them are going to happen. but what you can do is control your own narrative and run your own place. and that is the kind of sugar rush that donald trump presents as a threat to democrats. you could just boil away on him every single day, and it's fun, and makes you feel better. but it doesn't talk about what you are going to do to make the country better. , and i give the president, credit he is trying to stay to that message. but it's hard. >> axios is reporting that the biden campaign is not investing in door to door ground game strategy in the same way that, for example, barack vomited. and they are effectively putting most of their money behind tv and digital ads. is that a mistake? >> i don't think that's the plan next, here i think right now, i give them this advice to. you know, although i love the campaign iran, and we won an election, if i to do it over, again we probably spent too much money on the ground in the off-year. and so i think they are going to hold that money, they are going to have a massive ground operation next year. they have people who really know how to do this. and i think that they will do that. but they are going to do it at the appropriate time and they are gonna save their powder. and right, now they are doing but i think they should be doing. which again is talking to the african american and latino youth communities. about what this president has done. and save the ground game for next year. >> talking to some of them on channels that do not rhyme with snow in a vision. -- thank you, sir, for your time and wisdom. it's great to see you in here for now. >> thank you very much and have a good night. >> coming up, president biden takes questions on the israel-hamas war tonight, on the west coast, as capitol police in washington d. c. say that they are making arrests and responding to approximately 150 people who are illegally and violently protesting outside of the democratic national committee building. that is next. respiratory disease from rsv in people 60 years and older. arexvy does not protect everyone and is not for those with severe allergic reactions to its ingredients. those with weakened immune systems may have a lower response to the vaccine. the most common side effects are injection site pain, fatigue, muscle pain, 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