that is all in on this wednesday night. alex wagner tonight starts right now. good evening, alex. good evening, chris. we have in the forthcoming block, a fairly robust discussion about media that is apparently changing its policies to further a bed trump's lies in the context of what he is saying about paul pelosi in that attack. it is a combustible mix. >> it really is. >> thank you, my friend. >> and thanks to you at home for joining me this hour. before he was even elected president, donald trump had a journalist kicked out of a press conference just for asking a question. >> okay, who is next, yes? please? >> [inaudible] >> excuse, me sudden, you are called, sit down. -- i have >> the right to ask a question. >> sit down, please. >> you weren't called. >> trump looks over at his staff, a bodyguard walks over, and ushers ramos out of the news conference. >> sit down, sit down, go back to univision. the journalist that trump had his security kick out from that press conference was jorge ramos, one of the most prominent latino journalists in the country. now, ramos has conducted extended interviews with george h. w. bush, george w. bush, bill clinton, and barack obama, or a ramos is a huge deal. but donald trump wanted nothing to do with him. ramos repeatedly and publicly asked trump to sit for an interview, and trump not only declined, but he posted a photo online of a letter that ramos had sent him, claiming that ramos and his employer univision were begging, begging him for an interview. trump's relationship to ramos and univision stayed icy throughout his presidency. in 2020, the trump campaign even put out this press release, titled, univision is not a news network. it is a leftist propaganda machine. and a mouthpiece of the democrat party. and that history is why it was so shocking last week when univision had an hour-long interview with donald trump in which he was thrown softball questions like this one. >> talking about posts, the new york times, cnn, they came out this week, it has you with a solid lead in five of the six states that could decide the election. but it also has you with 42% of latino voters support, that is unprecedented for a republican candidate, what do you think the message voters are saying with these numbers? >> now the only thing weirder than asking, why are you doing so well with latino voters, it's probably trump's response to that question. >> well the latina voters are so incredible, because they are unbelievable people, they have incredible skills, incredible energy, and they are very entrepreneurial, all you have to do is look at the owners of univision, they are unbelievable entrepreneurial people. and they like me. >> trump's praise of univision and its owners was strange, but it's more reporting that's come out about this, interview and things have gotten even stranger. last week -- three top executives at univision and its new parent company tel aviv to where in the room during that interview with trump. now that is not entirely crazy on its own, sometimes executives just show up one high profile interviews are happening. but this week, the washington post reports that that wasn't the only strange thing about that interview with trump. according to the, post univision canceled a booking with president biden's hispanic media director, bianca kaskitayo, who is scheduled to respond to the trump interview after it aired. maybe most significantly of all, univision canceled ads that had already been purchased by the biden campaign and scheduled to run during the trump interview. inhibition told the washington post that's decision not to run those biden ads came from an unannounced policy about opposition advertising in single candidate interviews, and that there would be no trump advertising allowed if president biden gave univision an interview. so far, there is no plan to interview with president biden. and all week, we have been getting alarming stories alleging that univision has been making editorial and business decisions that seem to directly benefit donald trump, and then tonight, just a few hours ago, one of the networks most prominent anchors, león kraus, he announced that he has left the network. now, we should say that krause has not yet announced why he has left univision. but the timing here, just a day after the post reporting about univision shifting its approach to donald trump, that timing raises some questions. because beyond the ethics questions on the table here, univision's audience matters a lot politically. last, year you division had the seventh biggest network audience in all of tv, it is the most watched spanish language network in the united states. univision is the channel of choice for a key demographic in this country, and one that seems increasingly up for grabs in the next election. if it is executives that are really shifting the networks approach to covering trump, asking softball questions, not pushing back on trump's lies. then that could have a real impact on the 2024 election. and univision isn't the only media company that appears to be softening its approach to donald trump. today the wall street journal reports that meta, the parent company of facebook, threads, and instagram, quietly changed its policy to allow ads that claim past elections were stolen. that means that the trump campaign can end is running ads that say things like this. >> we are wanting 2016, we had a rigged election in 2020, but got more votes than any sitting president. >> that ran as part of an ad on facebook in august. matt has old policy didn't allow ads that claim voter fraud is widespread and or alters the outcome of elections, its new policy states that the platform doesn't allow ads that call into question the legitimacy of an upcoming or ongoing election. elections are apparently fair game. this follows youtube in june announcing that has similarly stopped removing claims of widespread fraud in the 2020 election. so, you know, feel free to erode public faith in america's democracy, as long as you are using examples from the past. it is unclear why a company like meta believes that trump's false claim about the election being stolen is all about the past, because quite clearly that big lie is laying the groundwork for the next election in 2024. and here is donald trump yet again stoking fears about election fraud in another ad, one that is still live right now on instagram. >> but it may also be the last election that we ever have, if this election doesn't work, if this election is rigged and stolen, if bad things happen, our country will not survive, we will have become a dictatorship where your president is chosen for you. you will no longer have a vote, you certainly won't have a meaningful vote, and you could say, frankly, that has already begun. >> joining me now, -- national political reporter covering, campaign, congress and the national -- he is piling on the story about univision, michael, it is great to see you. thanks for being here tonight. there are a lot of questions that i have about this sort of relationship that has developed between donald trump and the owners of arguably the most important spanish language channel in the united states, can you talk a little bit a bit more about your reporting? >> there are a number of unusual, things you mentioned a couple of them. another one that you didn't mention was the jared kushner presidents son-in-law who has not really been involved this time in former president trump 's campaign, unlike his two previous rounds. he did kind of intervene with the campaign this time, according to our reporting, summarizing some people inside the campaign to help set up this interview. and that is notable, because during the trump administration, one of the executives who was there when former president trump praised them at mar-a-lago was a guy named bernardo gomez who is a senior executive of tel aviv in mexico city, who actually hosted a dinner between jared kushner and the mexican president during the trump administration, pella visa, i mean, a lot of the concern about this is that olivia has a long reputation in mexico dating back decades of being very friendly with whoever is in power in that country. and univision, when it was established in the united states, very intentionally defined itself against that. tried to set itself up as an american style news network that was going to talk truth to power, that was going to be more aggressive. four years there has been this sort of give and take with tel aviv. a lot of the programming on univision's tel aviv says telenovela such are very popular, but the actual corporate control was not overseen by tel aviv to. until relatively recently when essentially the two companies merged. and now you have this blinding, which is causing significant consternation in the univision newsroom in miami. >> michael, do you have any insight into the resignation of leone krause who departed univision this evening, and we don't know why, is it potentially related to these changes? >> we don't know, why the timing is notable. the verb he used in his statement was my time with innovation is concluded. the only statement that tel aviv the univision put out, simply congratulated him for his time and wished him the best of luck in his nest endeavor. i think right now this is very much an open question. it is -- financial concerns -- a number of people, there is fear of layoffs coming in the future. but there was no indication that that was the reason. he was the only person, as far as our reporting pinto, who let's go yesterday. or resigned, we don't know. and so we are continuing to pursue that. >> and no word yet from jorge ramos who, of course, it's one of the gourd standard for interviewing as far as univision in three years for presidential students. i got to ask about the biden ads that were polled. conveniently for the, i'm from infinitely for president biden. is there further detail on whether there is going to be a biden sit down? whether that was part of donald trump's ask in order to give univision the sit-down interview with him? >> we don't know, we do know that from univision, they said it wasn't the newsroom that made that decision it was a corporate decision from above them. presumably someone didn't like the look of an ad running like that. it is typical to have opposition ads run, like during the presidential debate you will have a democratic ad run, during a rolling debate. but univision said it standards here, what is interesting, i, mean it's worth noting, if this wasn't just a normal, interview they took out the ten pm hour last thursday. which is their highest rated hour. it's an hour for tele-novellas. they promoted this interview, they did that behind the scenes the next day. this was a network special. it was a special, event and it was happening for, donald trump was leading republican, candidate but he is not the republican nominee for president. not right now. now, they have said, univision and said that they have made a number of requests to speak with the president biden, the biden campaign said they had not received a request until after that interview, the campaign itself had no request mentioned an hour-long sit-down. i think that's another shoe that's gonna drop, how the biden campaign and univision figure out how to move forward. from this point. because there is clearly a lot of anger on the biden side. >> right, anger that is complicating, given the fact that biden is still very much needing to speak to the innovations audience. michael, share great, great reporting. thank you so much for being here tonight. >> thank you. >> it is not difficult to see where the developments innovation could be problematic for the biden campaign. according to the latest new york times cnn poll, biden's margin of support among hispanic voters is a 50% versus trump's 42%. which is an eight-point margin, and which is fairly close given the new reporting from the new york times about trump's plans for a second term. including his pledge to launch the largest deportation effort in u.s. history. , by preparing eight and more years -- removal that does not require due process hearings. and by creating massive camps to hold immigrants while they await removal. but there is one man who remains quite confident in president biden's chances. at reelection. jim messina, the man behind barack obama's successful 2012 reelection campaign. and he is with me now, jim messina, ceo of the massena group. and of course, as we just, said the man who successfully ran president obama's 2012 reelection campaign. jim, it is great to see you, i first wonder what your reaction is to the news we have, the new reporting about the ways in which media, not just univision, but social media as well, maybe changing policies in a faction that could directly help donald trump and certainly provide a bigger platform for his lies? >> it is incredibly concerning, right? . these are some of the things that happened in 2016 when donald trump kind of liked at the first time, he clearly misused facebook and other things that were apologies made with the damages to democracy, it was all there. we kind of thought the people had gotten the lesson here. but now, you know, people are hedging their bets. and starting to change their policies. with the theory that donald trump could actually win this election, and in the middle of all of this, with democracy at stake, it is incredibly concerning that the same companies are now starting to do this all over again. >> i wonder what you make a, if you know, as we talk about univision, and its audience of latino voters. how critical, i mean, how much the biden campaign should be ringing the alarm bells in terms of its support among voters of color. i believe it is 42% of hispanic voters were leaning towards trump, 50% leaning towards biden among black voters. 22% of black voters and six key swing states said they would vote trump over biden and, i mean, that is a function of trump just basically being in a courtroom most of the time? and not on the stump in a more public way? saying the same sort of demagogue xenophobic things that he did for his four years as president? and is that sort of just amnesia? what is that? >> you are exactly right. people just sort of forgotten how bad and how crazy that this guy is because he has not been on the stage. right now, you know, everyone is comparing biden to the almighty. but next year there will be an actual choice between two candidates. and that, i think, until that happens, i don't gonna see much movement in the polls. you and i have talked before about my concern and criticism of polls thus far. it is here before the election and they are historically wrong, barack obama was put on the cover this week during his reelection ten years ago by the new york times magazine, he said he had a 17% chance to win, and that he was toast. and clearly he won that election handily. so i am not concerned with the polls. i am concerned that we get our message out, and that is why think the biden campaign is doing exactly what they should be doing. they have really big buys in the african american and latino and young communities right now. talking about the presidents, record talking about what he has gotten done. and i think that that is smart. no one has ever gone this early, and i think it shows you how serious they are taking these issues. >> i want to circle back to that in a second, but you have a peace and political that's basically like, stop bed-wetting democrats, i am paraphrasing greatly here. and you talk about the x-factor, the black swan events that are almost inevitably somewhere on the calendar next year. one of the things that you mentioned is trump, and the criminal trials, you, right will trump go to prison, it's possible. can you campaign from behind bars? i wouldn't even call these october surprises. you can almost guarantee that something big and unexpected will happen next year. the polling shows that a conviction for trump would actually maybe be enough to swing the election to biden. how much should democrats think about that as they move forward in the coming months? >> they shouldn't, because what i learned running a presidential campaign, alex, being in the white house, you can't plan for a black swan event. you have to control your message, you have to do the things you have got to do. what we have to do is move an economic message that makes sense. focus on turning our base out and sort of not worrying about what is gonna happen with donald trump, we can't control the myriad of trials in the 92 felony counts, and you can't assume those things were gonna happen. you know, some of them are going to happen. but what you can do is control your own narrative and run your own place. and that is the kind of sugar rush that donald trump presents as a threat to democrats. you could just boil away on him every single day, and it's fun, and makes you feel better. but it doesn't talk about what you are going to do to make the country better. , and i give the president, credit he is trying to stay to that message. but it's hard. >> axios is reporting that the biden campaign is not investing in door to door ground game strategy in the same way that, for example, barack vomited. and they are effectively putting most of their money behind tv and digital ads. is that a mistake? >> i don't think that's the plan next, here i think right now, i give them this advice to. you know, although i love the campaign iran, and we won an election, if i to do it over, again we probably spent too much money on the ground in the off-year. and so i think they are going to hold that money, they are going to have a massive ground operation next year. they have people who really know how to do this. and i think that they will do that. but they are going to do it at the appropriate time and they are gonna save their powder. and right, now they are doing but i think they should be doing. which again is talking to the african american and latino youth communities. about what this president has done. and save the ground game for next year. >> talking to some of them on channels that do not rhyme with snow in a vision. -- thank you, sir, for your time and wisdom. it's great to see you in here for now. >> thank you very much and have a good night. >> coming up, president biden takes questions on the israel-hamas war tonight, on the west coast, as capitol police in washington d.c. say that they are making arrests and responding to approximately 150 people who are illegally and violently protesting outside of the democratic national committee building. that is next. >> tech: when you get a chip in your windshield... trust safelite. ♪ upbeat, catchy music ♪ >> tech vo: this couple counts on their suv... as they travel for their small business. so 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[dog barks] no it's just a bunny! only pay for what you need. ♪liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty.♪ in order for small businesses to thrive, only pay for what you need. they need to be smart, efficient, savvy. making the most of every opportunity. that's why comcast business is introducing the small business bonus. for a limited time you can get up to a $1000 prepaid card with qualifying internet. yep, $1000. so switch to business internet from the company with the largest fastest reliable network and that powers more businesses than anyone else. learn how you can get $1000 back for your business today. i'm not a fortune, teller can comcast business. powering possibilities. tell you how long it is gonna last. but i can tell you, i don't think it will and until there is a two state solution. i made it clear to the israelis that i think it's a big mistake for them to think they are going to occupy gaza and maintain gaza, i don't think that that works. >> that was president biden in the last hour speaking about the ongoing war between israel and hamas, while over in washington d.c. outside the democratic national committee headquarters. u.s. capitol police have been making arrests. responding to approximately 150 people who are protesting, calling for a cease-fire in gaza. capitol police claim the protesters were demonstrating illegally and violently, nbc news has not yet verified that claim. this comes as 24 democrats in congress today are calling on president biden to seek that cease-fire, we write to you, they say, to express deep concern about the intensifying war in gaza. particularly grave violations against children and our fear that without an immediate cessation of hostilities in the establishment of a robust bilateral cease-fire, this war will lead to further loss of civilian life, and risk dragging the united states into dangerous and unwise conflict with armed groups across the middle east. joining me now is one of the members who signed that letter, calling for a cease-fire. congresswoman primala jayapal, a democrat of washington state, and leader of the progressive caucus in the, house congresswoman jayapal, thank you for being here. let me first just get your reaction to president biden's statements, or his response this evening in california. saying that he made it clear to the israelis that he thinks it's a big mistake for them to think they are going to occupy and maintain gaza and reiterating that he believes this ends with a two state solution? >> well, alex, i think that was important for him to make it clear that israel occupy gaza is not going to hope anything. it's only gonna make things worth. it's not tolerable from united states perspective. but i would like to see the president being stronger in his comments. some of his comments in the past days frankly were stronger than i heard tonight. so i think -- back and forth a little bit -- important for the united states to be, clear as the president said before, israel needs to follow international humanitarian law. on the hospital, foaming refugee camps, preventing water and fuel from entering gaza is absolutely not following international humanitarian law. we know there is over 11,000 palestinians who have already been killed, about 45% of them are children. we know that only 20% of the water needs are reaching the gaza strip today. we know that hospitals can't operate, because they don't have fuel. we know that premature babies, and i am the mom of a very preemie baby who is -- i know what that incubator means for a child's life. we know that babies are dying because they're incubators are being taken away. so this is extremely important. not only for the palestinians -- but also for israel to be successful in being able to get back hostages, very, very important to get all of the hostages back. to get humanitarian aid in. and to get to that two state solution that president biden is talking about. i don't think that happens through further military action. so it's very, important that we have a cease-fire. at minimum, a cessation of hostilities that could lead to that negotiation cease-fire. so that we can achieve peace and security for israelis -- -- >> and are not there in the, moment but they've been making arrests outside that the democratic national committee headquarters, i wonder as a democrat if you can talk a little bit about what has been happening inside the party in the context -- something that is fractured -- democrat talking about a democratic president -- how have you seen this conversation evolve among democrats in recent days? >> i think it's been very tough, a diverse set of views on how we are moving forward,, everyone wants peace, everyone wanted to states lucian or some solution where israel has security, the right to exist, and palestinians have security, self determination as well. i think it has been extremely difficult for everybody. i will say that for a lot of people across the country, protesters that are out there -- always peacefully. and i would just hope that everybody continues to remember that nonviolent protesters protest as some of the most effective protest. and i hope that we continue to see nonviolent protest it's part of our democracy for people to express where they are. i think the american people are in a very different place, by and large and where the conversation is right now in congress. many have called for a cease-fire, many more that are calling for the cessation of hostage -- these are all unified calls for an end to the violence. and the ability to stop de-escalating and try to get to a solution that we all desperately want. i think there are differences in opinions in terms of how we eradicate hamas. but not how we must -- i think going in and killing tens of palestinians and bombing gaza completely is not the way to eradicate hamas. you might be able to take some leaders out, but i have been having a number of, conversations including with the nfc, about our experiences around the world. about how you eradicate an ideology in an ideology organization. it's not about bombing -- you are gonna continue to push more and more people towards whatever the next version of hamas's. so i think it's extremely important that we stop, that we breathe, that we make sure that human beings are being treated -- tremendous trauma and pain of both israelis who suffered -- palestinians who are suffering a horrific attack now, with all the history that is behind all of that trauma on both sides. >> congressman prove still -- always good to see, you thank you so much for your time tonight. >> thank, you alex. >> still ahead, this evening. from throwing elbow shots at kidneys to threatening witnesses and promising to bite people, republicans in congress have been focused on aggression and inviting and a little less focused on funding the government. we are gonna have more on that with former senator claire mccaskill, coming up next. oming up next. rsv can severely affect the lungs and lower airways. but i'm protected with arexvy. arexvy is a vaccine used to prevent lower respiratory disease from rsv in people 60 years and older. rsv can be serious for those over 60, including those with asthma, diabetes, copd, and certain other conditions. but i'm protected. arexvy is proven to be over 82% effective in preventing lower respiratory disease from rsv and over 94% effective in those with these health conditions. 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anyway. the senate is set to vote on speaker johnson's bill this week, and if a pass, it they would've heard a government shutdown until, tiktok, february. in february, -- republicans managed to get done before skipping town tonight. the house canceled votes for the rest of the weekend began their thanksgiving recess early. before house republicans managed to secure funding to keep the lights on at the justice department and other federal agencies. now, if all of this is making senate republicans look good, look no further than oklahoma senator markwayne mullin. he is fresh off his attempt yesterday to fight a witness at a senate hearing. this is what the senator had to say today. >> by the, way i'm not afraid of -- i will bite. >> fighting? >> if i'm in a, fight i will fight, i will do anything. i don't care where a bite, by the way, it's just gonna be a light. >> joining me now is claire mccaskill, former democratic senator from missouri, and an msnbc political analyst. i too am blinking my eyes, like was that real? what we just saw, claire? do you remember the time in the senate where you had to clarify where you invite someone? i don't? >> no. we are into curlier territory. >> yes! >> and here is what is kind of interesting about, this, alex i'm gonna give you a quote. the quote is, same clown car, different driver in the house. now, guess who that quote is from? it is from a republican member of the house. and i think about that, i mean, i can't imagine when i was in the senate that i would go out and be that derogatory towards the leadership of my own party. they are not a functioning majority. >> yeah. >> they are schoolyard belize. and this has devolved into something that, you know, you don't know whether to laugh or cry, because it is so embarrassing for our country. you know what got this guy mad in the first place? the guy with two names? markwayne or billy bob or whatever his name is? >> mark, when senator markwayne, yes. >> you know what got him mad? because the head of the teamsters tweeted a tweet that showed he was standing at a platform to look taller at a debate. >> oh boy. i mean, the republican height obsession, that's its own television program. but clear, you say you don't know whether to laugh or cry, and you think we are at the stage right now republicans are managing to fund the justice department or other federal agencies, like it's a remarkable feat of partisan organization. they have left early on their thanksgiving recess. because they can't figure out how to get appropriation spells passed. this is, like, in the food chain of, like, legislating, this is pretty darn near the bottom, is it not? >> it is, it's as bad as it gets. the most important function that congress had this to appropriate funds for the government. everything works including -- veterans benefits, including social security, -- everything depends on appropriations. it is really unfortunate, they cannot govern. now, what's fascinating to me is that they are not moving to kick my johnson it yet. and so why didn't we get it all done in this first time? because guess what is gonna happen, the next time it all comes up, he is gonna need democratic votes. because these guys that are in the far right maga caucus can't count. they are in some kind of law law land that the senate is not controlled by democrats. and at the white house, it is not controlled by democrats. legislating as a team sport that depends on negotiations. half of the republican caucus will not negotiate and doesn't want to play a team's. >> i ask you, you, know you make the, point i think we should say it over and over again, nothing gets done without democrats really saving the day for the republicans in the house. what should democrats do in terms of drawing a attention to the dysfunction, the distasteful governing that seems to be the organizing principle of the modern-day gop, while also keeping the lights on? i mean, how do democrats, for lack of a better, turn play this one? right? they have got to save republicans. but they've also got to show the american public, this is the dna of the grand old party? >> they are going to have to keep being as strong and united as they have been. listen, we have some disagreements in our party. you just had on a guest that highlighted the fact that everyone doesn't agree on exactly how to deal with this horrible middle east conflict that has plagued the world for decades. but, you notice that almost all of the democrats voted together on this resolution but is going to keep the government open until after the first of the year. same things happening in the senate. they might have disagreements of policy in the senate, but nobody is threatening to fight somebody. and in the democratic party, i had -- hats off to the leaders in the house and the senate of the democratic party that is managed, which is not always easy, to keep the caucuses united. and i think that that helps the contrast. on one side, you've got the marjorie taylor greene, the crazy caucus, on the other side. you have a pretty united front about not cutting benefits to the middle class. making sure that the government gets funded, making sure that the least of everyone doesn't get left behind. those are the things that -- good at. and if they keep, adopting the contrast will come more and more clear. as the election gets closer. >> nobody on the democratic side of the aisle is threatening to bite anyone as yet, so that is one point in their favor. senator claire mccaskill, we never had to threaten to bite anyone ever, as far as we, no thank you for your time. it's great to see, you clare! >> you too, alex, thank you! >> coming, up the latest legal news coming out of fulton county georgia. that is coming, up stay with us. 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[interpreter] freeman and [interpreter] her daughter had been basically accused of secretly submitting fake ballots for joe biden when they counted ballots in the 2020 election. in early january of 20, one codefendant -- the publicist in this trio finally managed to get ruby freeman to talk to her. you can hear them here in the back of some police body cam video, as miss kuti gets harrison floyd on the speakerphone. >> [inaudible] [inaudible] >> in the, and -- did not need -- realized this was all a scam to help donald trump's steal the election. now, today, d.a. willis filed a motion to revoke harrison floyd's bond agreement, citing several interviews and social media posts that allegedly violate conditions of floyd's release by communicating with witnesses and intimidating witnesses in this case. >> prosecutors cited an interview and a podcast as one example of that, where mr. floyd trash talks one of his former codefendants who has not flipped. attorney general ellis. and then there is the state of mr. floyd social media posts, directed at ruby freeman, once allegedly containing experts from that conversation down at the police station. unfolding county judge scott mcafee sides with the dea on this, harrison floyd will have to go back to jail to await trial. meanwhile, floyd's alleged coconspirators here have remained remarkably defiant. trayvon kutti, again, publicist, according to the washington post, talks openly on social media about the headline making experience, taunting detractors and memes and suggesting that she should be trump's next press secretary. be careful of what you suggest. and then there is pastor stephen cliffgard lee. you can see him here in police body cam footage, after ruby freeman called the police on him and december of 2020. mr. li who calls himself america's chaplain reportedly appeared at a recent event to raise funds for his defense. saying, quote, i am not going to put out to a lie. i am not going to cooperate with evil. this is the lords battle and we have got to fight it. we are going to have more on the upcoming and ongoing battles down in fulton county, as the attorney for yet another codefendant issued a big mea culpa in court today. former fulton county assistant d.a. melissa redmon joins me to talk about all of that, next. are you still struggling with your bra? it's time for you to try knix. makers of the world's comfiest wireless bras. for revolutionary support without underwires, and sizes up to a g-cup, find your new favorite bra today at knix.com ♪♪ we're not writers, but we help you shape your financial story. ♪♪ we're not an airline, but our network connects global businesses across nearly 160 markets. ♪♪ we're not a startup, but our innovation labs use new technologies to help keep your information secure. ♪♪ we're not architects, but we help build stronger communities. ♪♪ we're not just any bank. we are citi. ♪♪ ♪♪ ♪♪ ♪♪ cargurus. shop. buy. sell. online. hey, doc, if you had to choose, would you give yourself a root canal or run payroll? oh, run payroll. paying my team with gusto takes just a few clicks. they automatically file my taxes for me too. can i run payroll too? choose payroll without the pain. 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what that practical implication of an agreed upon protective order will mean for bombshell pieces of evidence like the ones that have been released to the media? >> well, we have to remember that there are still 15 defendants left in this case. and there is a possibility that some of those defendants may be contemplating a plea that could possibly also entail getting a proffer. and you don't want those people to be intimidated and to not enter a plea or not give a proper -- released to the public outside of the court proceedings. of course, they won't know that at some point whatever they say is going to become public in the trial. it's going to be provided to the defense because it has to. but, again you want that to play out in the trial. we want there to be a determination from a judge, as to what evidence is emitted. and you don't want evidence out in that either. it may or may not actually be put before a jury who's gonna decide the guilt or innocence of these individuals. >> one other question, jack smith is probably interested in a lot of this material, especially that pertains to the special fake electors plot. will he have access to some of this discovery material? or is a church and stayed on the? >> well if there is a protective order, going to apply to everyone. and there may be some conversations as to how other investigations are complicated and in that protective order, but that would, i, mean i would imagine that when judge back of issues a protective order, is going to apply to the state as well as the defense. >> all, right so that means jack smith is going to have to get in line like everybody else. melissa, former assistant d.a. down in fulton county, thank you for your expertise tonight. >> thank you. >> that is our show for this, evening now it is time for the last word with lawrence o'donnell, good evening, lawrence. >> good evening, alex. we have the very best's pennsylvania election expert joining us tonight. his

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