were like, you know, this princess leia is a dud. let's give the emperor another shot. >> welcome to "morning joe." >> you don't understand that, do you? >> nope. >> yeah, okay. >> november 7th. we'll have a lot to get to. something with star wars, right? >> thank you for saying it. >> there it is. >> i was worried she'd say "star trek." thank goodness she said "star wars." >> ongoing confusion of those franchises, frankly, is unforgivable, "star wars" and "star trek." mika, we can't have it. >> oh, really? >> before we get to the start of this, also unforgivable. >> i'll give him a lightsaber for christmas. >> that'd be great. a little lightsaber light for the corner of the room. >> for the studio. >> also unforgivable for jets fans, willie, the situation at quarterback. it gets no better. in fact, much, much worse. >> yeah. they lost last night. i guess it was too late for the tabloids, but, yeah, lost 27-6. no offense to speak of. it is a shame. they have a great defense, but they're on the field the entire game. >> great defense. >> can't ask much more from those guys. it's bad in new york right now between the jets, the giants losing their quarterback. zach wilson, they're trying to prop him up, trying to give him ways to succeed. it's just not happening. they cannot get aaron rodgers back fast enough in new york. starting to look like a lost season on both fronts out of metlife stadium in the meadowlands. >> i'm surprised the jets didn't move for somebody at the trade deadline at quarterback that could actually keep them in contention. there were several out there. incredible, what happened this weekend where you had a quarterback who played for the -- was it dobbs who played for the cardinals? >> yeah. >> who got traded and turned the game around and won. i mean, the jets had a chance, didn't do it. it keeps getting uglier. >> that's the thing. as bad as things have been, they were 4-3 going into the game last night. they're a game out of first place in their division, which is staggering when you think about what they've been through this season. unfortunately, if he's under center, they don't have a chance to win, as we saw again last night. >> no. that's what mika was saying last night. >> i was thinking it. >> stayed up and watched the whole thing because that's what we do. >> nope. >> after the "star trek" marathon. >> until 2:00 in the morning. >> exactly. we have a lot to get to this morning. >> we end up with the "wrath of khan," and i'm like, we have two hours to sleep. >> what is that? okay. we'll have expert legal analysis on another contentious day in court for donald trump, with the former president testifying in the civil fraud trial for his business organization. it was a lot. let me tell you, yikes. >> that's a -- >> can't hold back. >> that's a sketch. look at that. >> also ahead -- yeah, no, he was not happy. the judge asked his lawyers to control their client. >> i wouldn't be happy if the s sketch artist made me look like at whoa, what's that? he looks like a character out of "star rs there. >> anyhow, i can't wait to ask our experts ahead exactly how any other defendant would -- >> they have the judge looking pretty good. also ahead, we have the latest on the ground offensive in gaza, as israeli prime minister benjamin netanyahu continues to reject calls for a cease-fire but appears to be open to strategic pauses. >> president biden continues to talk about the need to have humanitarian breaks in this to allow civilians to continue to move out, to protect civilians on the ground. netanyahu pushing -- >> very complicated. >> -- back on it, but they're right now talking about, quote, strategic pauses. whatever that means for the hostages and also for the gaza civilians. plus, it is election day in america. a big one. we'll break down some of the key races across the country and why they matter. >> willie, everybody has been talking about the polls, and they don't matter other than -- >> the races matter. >> -- a snapshot in time, right? we can see the trend lines are breaking against the biden white house. they should be scared as hell. voters shouldn't be if they support joe biden. they should just register, vote, get their friends to vote. these elections tonight, they do matter. i mean, they have shown over the -- during the trump era, they have shown republican failures in '17 that led to republican failures in '18. republican failures in the off years in '19 led to republican failures in '20. same with '21. republicans are on a seven-year losing streak. it's going to be interesting whether they can snap that tonight. >> yeah, the big snapshot is in the state of kentucky, where tin couple bent democratic governor, andy beshear, is running against the state's attorney general, daniel cameron. polling very close beshear is a democrat in a state that donald trump won by 25 or 26 points. donald trump has endorsed daniel cameron. both these guys viewed as stars in the party with big futures ahead of them. that'll be really fascinating to see which way that breaks, with donald trump coming into that race in support of the republican. >> right. the virginia race also going to be really telling, to see what happens in a lot of those legislative races. katty kay, especially the legislative races in northern virginia. there is a senate seat especially that matters. also, i know you, mika, and i are looking at the ohio abortion referendum. that's going to be a fascinating insight to see where voters are in a red, red state. >> yeah, both virginia and ohio are going to be a reflection of how much momentum there is on the abortion side. democrats, of course, still hoping that abortion is the issue that can mitigate some of that bad polling over the last couple of days for joe biden on the age front, on the economy front. they're hoping abortion will get people to the polls. i spent a lot of time in northern virginia. i'm out there two, three days a week. one of the key districts, district 31, where you have a race for the state senate, there have been yard signs up for months which suggest there's a lot of enthusiasm. yard signs on both sides. a lot for the democrat, perry, and a lot for the republican candidate. hard to say one candidate has more than the other. the one thing i note, for an off year election, i have not seen this much enthusiasm in the state for a long time. let's see who gets to the polls. >> interesting. >> jonathan lemire, we have seen, especially since dobbs, just a political earthquake. we've seen it in kansas. we've seen it in kentucky. we've seen it in wisconsin. we've seen it in one red state after another. one state that trump won in '16 after another. it's going to be fascinating to see what happens tonight again in ohio, in virginia, especially in northern virginia, in those suburbs. of course, if beshear can defy political gravity and win in a state that trump won by 25 points, democrats would see that as a massive victory, of course. i've got to believe the white house, i mean, they're knocking on wood, crossing themselves, throwing salt over their left shoulder. they're doing everything because a democratic win tonight in lot of these states will completely wipe away any talk of one "new york times"/siena college spade of polls. i will say, if republicans -- and i'll be saying this tomorrow morning -- if republicans win for the first time since 2016, then it really will be time for the biden white house to batten down the hatches and get ready for a storm ahead. >> a number of democrats said versions of the same thing to me yesterday. no matter how bad the polls look, what we have seen in the post 2016 era, what happens? democrats actually win elections. we saw that with the midterms in 2022 and a number of the special elections since then. certainly, abortion rights a big part of that. yes, there's a lot of concern among democrats right now, a lot of second-guessing about the biden campaign strategy to this pot. they have not gone after donald trump as hard, perhaps, as they could have. they sort of outsourced that to other republicans, primary contenders, thinking they'd take down donald trump. they chose not to. they have not attacked him, and we've seen trump maintain a massive lead. things could change today. the narrative heading in, one year out from 2024, could change today on a number of levels. if governor beshear would win, it's cement him as a rising national star. >> yeah. >> virginia expected to be close. abortion rights a big part of that. ohio, people i've talked to think abortion rights will be another victory in ohio, which would continue that streak and give democrats momentum and underscore yet again, joe and mika, even as we look at the battleground state polls, abortion, choice, is going to be such a major issue next year, too, as much as the names biden and trump. >> yup. >> you know, these elections can either underscore what these "new york times"/siena college polls were saying, or completely blow them out of the water. i just wonder, there were some political experts in the past couple of days who have said, oh, joe biden maybe shouldn't run. i wonder, why don't they wait for real evidence? isn't this election day, the outcome of it, a great sign of where things are going, opposed to a poll? >> it is. it certainly is. david axelrod has been critical of joe biden for years. >> wait two days. >> for years. certainly, david is respected, a friend of ours. truth is, though, he's always been critical of joe biden. always second-guessed him. there are people second-guessing him. i will say, what david axelrod is saying out loud, a lot of democrats are saying quietly. there's no doubt about it. but we've talked about this time and again. joe biden was doubted when he first announced in 2019. he was doubted throughout 2019. he was mocked and doubted after iowa. he was mocked and doubted after new hampshire. he was mocked and doubted after nevada. everybody said he needed to drop out of the race. then south carolina came. he swept through and won. then he was sweating in the basement, too old, but he beat donald trump. he was too old. blah, blah, blah. 2022, we were supposed to have a red wave. instead, it was an extraordinary night, historic night for democrats. a historic night for joe biden. you think he was the first president since fdr, a first term president whose midterm election went the way it did, as far as no governors of his party losing. then it's like, okay, he's good. then he is too old. then he delivers the state of the union address. >> let's see how it goes. >> joe biden has been underestimated his entire life and is being upside down estimated now. this is not a smart bet, to bet against him, but if people want to, they can, certainly. >> yeah. >> that's their right. i will say, following up, willie, on what john just said. the biden white house is actually debating whether joe biden should attack donald trump or not. this reminds me of 1988. michael due kau due dukakis saying, i'm going to not attack the flag factories across the country. pushing the lawn mower, i'm not answering those attacks. you have to answer the attacks. whoever inside the white house is telling joe biden not to attack donald trump, stop it. seriously, stop it. maybe start a lawn service with push lawn mowers. you don't know what you're doing. you don't know what you're talking about, and you're costing the president. you really are. you're costing him points. this is a political battle to the end. donald trump is trying to destroy joe biden. i'm not exactly sure, willie, who inside the white house is saying, "hey, when you go up against the champ, mike tyson in '91, muhammad ali in, like, '73, you should fight by marquess of queensberry rules." no! you've got to go after him. no holds barred. willie, they're still trying to debate, do we play nice in this campaign, or do we actually take it to a guy that stole nuclear secrets, has been accused of being a rapist by a new york judge, and has 91 felony counts against him charged. it's not hard. i don't think this is hard. i'm not sure who inside the white house is making this hard. >> well, it goes without saying that donald trump is not going to fight fair. he's going to go nuclear whenever he has the chance. he is doing that every day. did it yesterday outside the courtroom. the case from the white house, as jonathan knows, is we're going to run on our record. you can do both. you can say, "hey, the economy is pretty good. here's why." and you can also say, "the guy i'm running against might tear down the democracy, and here's why what he is saying about me is false." two things at once as we like to say on the show. speaking of the former president, yesterday, he defended his actions as head of the trump organization yesterday at the civil fraud trial in new york. nbc news senior legal correspondent laura jarrett has more on trump's testimony. >> reporter: a combative donald trump testifying for hours in a manhattan courtroom with his real estate empire on the line. >> ridiculous. >> reporter: mr. trump showing flashes of anger as he spared with the judge and the new york attorney general's office, brushing off accusations he doctored financial statements to inflate the value of some of his most well-known properties, like mar-a-lago, trump tower, and 40 wall street, all to defraud banks and lenders. >> at the end of the day, the only thing that matters are the facts and the numbers. and numbers, my friends, don't lie. >> reporter: already found liable for fraud, the former president now trying to fend off a $250 million penalty. growing heated when pressed about whether he overvalued assets found in the trump organization's annual financial statements. his face turning red, raising his voice, pointing directly at the judge seated inches away, yelling, "he called me a fraud, and he didn't know anything about me." a reference to the judge's pretrial decision that ruled in the state's favor. also going after the attorney general herself, watching on in the courtroom. mr. trump calling her a political hack. >> i will not be bullied. i will not be harassed. this case will go on. >> reporter: mr. trump did make some concessions, admitting he probably saw some of the disputed financial statements that went to banks and lenders while repeatedly dismissing them as not important, because they included certain disclaimers. saying that his net worth is actually far greater than what is reflected in his financial statements, touting the value of the trump brand. >> the numbers are much greater than on the financial statement. we've already proven that. they said mar-a-lago is worth $18 million. it's anywhere from probably 50 to 100 times more than that. >> reporter: the judge's patience tested at times by that rhetoric on the witness stand, calling parts of mr. trump's testimony irrelevant and rambling. warning the republican frontrunner, this is not a political rally. >> laura jarrett reporting there. let's bring in nbc news legal analyst catherine christian, a former assistant district attorney in the manhattan d.a.'s office, and former u.s. attorney and senior fbi official, chuck rosenberg. good morning to you both. catherine, as defenses go, "my accountants did it," is that convincing, compelling? >> it is not a good defense. accountants rely on information from the clients to prepare financial statements and tax returns. if the information is false, the financial statements, the tax returns are going to be false because the client gave false information. his testimony, trump's testimony yesterday did nothing to help his case. he was speaking to his base, to appease his base. nothing he said helped his case. >> so what about the theatrics, the judge turning to mr. trump's attorneys and saying, "get control of this guy or i will." the attorneys obviously have no control over donald trump. how does that play into the outcome of what we're seeing here? >> first, it was not a jury trial. if the jury had been in that courtroom, the judge would have shut him down. you can't have a jury hear irrelevant, inadmissible and prejudiced evidence. the judge was wise to stop engaging with him. at the beginning, the judge was engaging him and getting upset. at one point, just decided, just let him roll. there is no jury here. let him go. he is the judge and the trier of the fact, so if donald trump just wants to, you know, annoy the judge, let him do it. >> mika, here is what it looks like on the front page of the "wall street journal." trump in fraud trial spars with judge and defends business. you actually have a view inside the courtroom in "the new york times," taking us through all the key players there. but you turn it over, and the story talks about how donald trump admitted that he actually was involved in some of the conduct that is at the heart of the case. >> a question for chuck rosenberg. chuck, donald trump walked out and, you know, got lots of cameras clicking and rolling as he was saying things went very well in court today. so did that go well? did he have a good day in court yesterday? >> mika, they did not go well in court, not for mr. trump. look, he's really functioning, operating in two different venues. in court, he did poorly. his answers were rambling and incoherent. to the extent he's not answering questions, the judge can rightfully infer that the answers would not be helpful to mr. trump. as catherine just said, the judge is the trier of the facts. like, if you ask me, mika, did i steal a cookie from the cookie jar, and i tell you you're derange and had a fraud, and this whole process is a sham and a witch hunt, you can logically conclude that i stole the cookie from the cookie jar. in that venue, mr. trump did really poorly, but there was another venue which he cares deeply about. it was the one outside the courtroom. i think for his supporters and his base, the combative trump is what they love, what they saw, and what they got. you know, legally, no, it was a bit of a train wreck. politically, time will tell. >> chuck, he was even saying at one point, you know, and i hope the public is watching. very aware of the fact this has a tv audience around the country of people who might vote for him. what does this mean for future trials, and how can judges prevent this spectacle from becoming an extension of donald trump's political campaign? >> yeah, great question, katty. i think catherine eluded to the answer here. so there was no jury in this particular case. so the judge can hear irrelevant answers and ignore them and still make a decision on the merits, which i trust this judge will do. if a jury had been in the room, if the jury had been a trier of the fact, the judge would have had to really contain mr. trump much more than he did. look, i grew up as a federal prosecutor in a district where i don't believe any of the judges would have permitted this nonsense. so a trial in front of a jury, number one, katty, can look different than a trial in front of a judge. by the way, in a criminal case, and that's what remains for mr. trump in four instances, two federal and two state, in a criminal case, it is highly unlikely he gets on the stand. all this nonsense, all this rambling and incoherence, all this histrionichistrionics, theu saw in front of a judge is not something i think you're likely to see in a criminal case in front of a jury. >> jonathan lemire, it is a real split screen that we've been observing over the past six months or so, where you have donald trump, who, again, hurting himself legally, hurting himself in front of judges time and time again, but in many cases, that helping him politically. "the wall street journal" lead editorial this morning, "will donald trump be indicted back into office?" they cite an article that was in "politico" last week, that said the w