Transcripts For MSNBC American Voices With Alicia Menendez 20240708

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>> but you see, president biden isn't the first to do this. donald trump vowed to nominate a woman during his presidency and followed through by nominating justice amy coney barrett. 1981, president ronald reagan made a campaign promise to nominate the first woman to the supreme court. when he followed through on that promise, he received complete bipartisan support, 99-0 in the senate. senator dick durbin, who will be overseeing the process this year, making the case for why bipartisanship should prevail. >> think back on stephen breyer. he worked as chief assistant to ted kennedy. when his vote came up in the senate he was approved 87-9, an indication of the good old days when there was much more bipartisanship. but my goal is to make sure we have a deliberate, timely hearing but also to reach out to the republican side and see if they can join us in making it a bipartisan nomination. i think that speaks well of the court and it speaks well of the senate if we can achieve it. >> just today, one republican senator praised president biden's vow to select a black woman and even expressed support for a particular nominee. >> i believe there are plenty of qualified african american women, conservative and liberal, that could go onto the court. so i don't see michelle childs as an act of affirmative action. i do see putting a black woman on the court, making the court more like america. >> joining me now, msnbc political analyst and democratic strategist juanita toll i haver. axios reporter alina train. and keisha blaine, a university professor at the university of pittsburgh and the author of "until i am free: fannie lou hamer." nbc news has confirmed there are 13 contenders for the supreme court seat. there's already been pushback against biden's pledge to nominate the first black woman to the supreme court. as we teed up in the intro, if you look at this in a historical context, reagan's pledge to nominate the first woman to the supreme court didn't garner any criticism at all. is that because we're at a different moment today? >> i think we are at a different moment, because of course whoever fills this seat will play a critical role in making decisions as it pertains to affirmative action, certainly abortion rights, just to make it a few. republicans are aware, as of course every single person in the united states is aware, that this is perhaps the most important appointment. and this comes at a critical moment in the nation's history. and so obviously republicans are going to push back. let's be honest. you know, it doesn't really matter who biden says he's going to appoint, republicans are going to resist. so we should not be surprised that they are now criticizing his pledge to nominate a black woman. >> juanita, it's sort of a grab bag of rationales for why they're making that critique. you heard senator susan collins trying to make the argument that it was inherently politicized because it was a commitment that president biden made when he was candidate biden. of course history shows that's not something only president biden has done. you also have heard this racist argument that choosing a black woman is only going to be a sign of affirmative action. i've heard you debunk that ten different times on our air, i welcome you to do it again. but really what i'm driving at, juanita, is given that backdrop, right, given that republicans are already out there on the attack, what then did you make of senator graham on television this morning making the counterargument? >> alicia, i was wondering what gave senator graham the talking points, right? i was fully surprised that he came out so supportive, especially for a specific potential nominee who we know is a graduate of university of south carolina law school. so the ties are clear. also senator graham has historically deferred to presidents and their selection of nominees. he's one of the three senators who supported ketanji brown jackson when she was up for the federal court last summer. but hearing the contrast between senator graham with what we heard from senator susan collins and senator wicker, i hope more of the gop decides to fall in the line of senator graham, because this is not a moment when they want to be continuously on the wrong side of history. and it's critical that they emphasize the importance of this historic nominee considering that in the existence of the court there hasn't been a black woman to serve. the gop will be divided on this and there is an opportunity for this to be a bipartisan effort as senator durbin mentioned on "meet the press" this morning. as the nominee starts to meet the rounds, after she's announced and makes the rounds with senators and is introducing herself and saying more about her record, that's when we should expect to see more gop senators, especially retiring gop senators, to jump on and start to support this historic nomination process. it is not in their best interests to criticize this potential nominee going into the midterms. even though we know they're going to kick and scream along the way, trying to put up racist arguments is only going to further confirm the notion that the gop has been taken over by more extremist figures, the gop has been taken over by white supremacists and white nationalist themes. and that is not something they want to truly stain their party going forward. >> graham mentioned judge childs as a highly qualified candidate who he would support. james clyburn also advocated for childs, she is of course from his home state of south carolina, as juanita pointed out. talk about why her name is so high on this list and which other names you're hearing buzz about. >> michelle childs, a judge from south carolina, so we saw of course whip clyburn from south carolina, senator lindsey graham, even senator tim scott, all saying favorable things about her. and also from the perspective of having someone from the south on the court. that's a key part of clyburn's argument and a key part of many other lawmakers from the south, why they think that she might be a good candidate to have. almost all of the judges, actually, justices on the court right now, none of them really are from the south. so they think she would bring a different perspective to how she would oversee a lot of these arguments. and that's why a lot of people, particularly congressman clyburn, pushing for her and making that case to the white house. the other names, like you said, there's 13 names on this list, and of course biden said he has until the end of february before he plans to make an announcement. but the other names we're hearing very much circulate on capitol hill are ketanji jackson, of course a dc district circuit judge, and leondra kruger, a california supreme court judge, both very qualified, both have gone to very good schools. that's where also michelle childs is a little different and why some lawmakers say they actually want to put her forward because she graduated from the university south carolina, not an ivy league school like harvard and yale like we've seen many justices graduate from in the past. so a lot of people advocating for someone with diverse backgrounds and of course an african american woman, the first black female justice. >> we're hearing the argument for childs be in part that she is being from the south, and the argument for kruger being from the west. one of the things that jumped out to me about the argument that senator durbin was making earlier this morning was, not just that it's good for the senate that this be a bipartisan effort, not just that it is good for this nominee that this be a bipartisan effort, but that it is good for this court to be a bipartisan effort. we know public faith in the court is at an all-time low. we know that is on the minds of the justices as they preside over these cases. my question to you is, given the last spate of confirmations that we have seen, they've all been highly political. is there a way to depoliticize the process, dr. blaine? >> i'm not sure there is. i think it will always be a political process, to be quite frank with you. how could it not be? i certainly think, you know, that this is a moment where we should take advantage of the opportunity to try to come together. but that's really just -- of course that's being optimistic. i don't think that's realistic, in light of everything that has already taken place leading up to this. already we have people making statements that, oh, this person will simply are a beneficiary of affirmative action, and making these kind of arguments to try to discount the qualifications of any black woman who would fill that role. obviously the person who fills this role will be fully vetted and they will be qualified. no one's going to put up anyone who is not prepared to be a justice. but the fact that those conversations are already taking place i think speaks to, you know, the political moment, speaks to just the tensions, the debates that quite frankly we will just continue to have in this nation. >> and i will spend a lot of time dissenting on that court. thank you so much for your time, dr. blain. the former president is back onstage floating pardons for january 6th rioters if he becomes president again. congressman rubin gallego on that and much more. and until the next hour, congresswoman pramila jayapal tells me how her new bill will protect workers cleaning up from climate disasters. we're just getting started here on "american voices." on "american voices. well, he may have friends, but he rides alone. that's jeremy, right there! we're literally riding together. he gets touchy when you talk about his lack of friends. can you help me out here? 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(vo) 5g ultra wideband is now in more and more places. verizon is going ultra, so you can too. a telling and dangerous temper tantrum by a former president. donald trump is starting to lash out as investigators work to hold him and his enablers accountable. between the 1/6 committee targeting fake electors, the georgia probe into trump's attempt to find the votes, the new york state investigation into his family's business, trump's back is against the wall. last night at a rally in texas, trump revealed how he's responding to that squeeze. riling up his supporters, suggesting they should take things to the streets should these investigations don't go his way. >> if these radical, vicious, racist prosecutors do anything wrong or illegal i hope we are going to have in this country the biggest protest we have ever had in washington, dc, in new york, in atlanta, and elsewhere, because our country and our elections are corrupt. >> i play that sound for you because i want you to hold it against what happened on january 6th. a pro-trump mob stormed the u.s. capitol after he told a crowd of supporters to, quote, fight like hell. last night trump once again defended those insurrectionists. he hinted at a 2024 run, saying he would pardon the defendants charged in connection with the capitol riot if he were to return to the white house. these comments too extreme even for trump ally lindsey graham. the south carolina senator had this to say this morning on cbs. >> i don't want to send any signal that it was okay to defile the capitol. there are other groups with causes that may want to go down the violent path if these people get pardoned. i want to deter people who did what they did on january 6th. and those who did it, i hope they go to jail and get the book thrown at them because they deserve it. >> joining me now to discuss trump's whitewashing of january 6th, arizona congressman ruben gallego, he also serves on the house armed services committee. thank you for being with us, congressman. your reaction to the former president's remarks? >> well, it's kind of like a mobster trying to tell some of his underlings that are under arrest, don't worry, i'll take care of you. much of what trump does is to act like a mobster but dumber. he's trying to incite people to violence in case the judicial process takes ahold and actually holds him accountable. that's not how any politician or certainly an ex-president should be acting. i've got to say, the idea that somehow there's going to be just protests on the streets and they're going to be able to somehow push their way into courthouses, those days are gone anymore. i think it's danger that you say trump is trying to incite crowds, because there's going to be pushback on the other side and we don't want to down that road. >> nbc news spoke to a trump supporter who envisions dark days ahead. take a listen. >> what do you make of how angry the country is right now at each other? >> let 'em fight it out. why not? you're looking at another civil war anyway. let 'em fight it out. america's not what it used to be. it used to be a great place to live and to be. now it's not. >> let them fight it out. other supporters, congressman, describe an america of good versus evil, the need to take back the country in the name of god. i wonder what your response is, i also wonder if you hear any of this from your constituents in arizona. >> no. i mean, look, my constituents are good americans, they believe in america. they believe the best days are ahead of us. people like that are just unpatriotic. i can't believe they've given up on america. my family came here from different countries because they believe in america and they still believe in america. the fact that you don't have your preferred candidate and suddenly because of that reason this country is horrible tells you a lot about who you are, not who the country is. most of these people hate america because they're losers and they want to give excuses for everybody else to why they're no longer doing well, and instead of looking internally and realizing they have some faults, they have to blame people of color, they have to blame a political party, when most of the time it's their own causes. this is what donald trump is good at, he's really good at finding these losers and giving them a reason to hate everybody else except themselves. if you want to be a good american, take responsibility and work at it and guess what, you'll succeed in this country. >> the ex-president floated pardons for january 6th rioters. does that raise the stakes and change the contours of the investigation? >> it shouldn't, because you should already understand the seriousness before he even opens his mouth. if you're someone like ag garland you should obviously not look at this and say we have to move harder and faster, because he should have already been doing that. this is nothing we haven't heard before. this man is corrupt, he has no concept of morals, he has no concept of standards. if given the opportunity, he will try to steal the election again. he will try to overthrow the government again. this is why you have to hold him accountable, get the case together, throw him in jail, and throw all the people that were his co-conspirators in jail. >> the newest developments, the 1/6 committee subpoenaing 14 fake electors including two from your home stateof arizona. i spoke to arizona secretary of state katy hobbs last night. >> i referred these to the attorney general a year ago, and nothing has happened with that. so i'm very thankful that the january 6th committee at least is taking this seriously. >> congressman, what do you make of the lack of action from republican elected leaders in your state and what are your expectations of the doj and the january 6th committee on this specific question? >> republicans won't take any action here because their political future is at stake. attorney general brnovich is trying to suck up to the former president and get his endorsement. even though what they did is prosecutable, he won't do it because he cares more about his political career than he does about surviving democracy. kelli ward, the chairwoman of the arizona republican party, soon after we evacuated the house floor, went on twitter and said that it was time to send the electors back to the states so they could choose. i don't think that was a coincidence. and i think there was a lot of work being done in coordination with whatever the attack was at the capitol. so, you know, the january 6th committee needs to be doing its work. the doj should be doing its work. there is a lot of reasons i think you could prosecute these fake electors and we should be doing it to at least make sure we get more information out of them. >> congressman, i want to turn to north korea firing a new missile yesterday, its longest range missile test since 2017. how concerned are you that north korea is ramping up its missile program while europe's attention is focused on eastern europe? >> north korea has always been trying to ramp up its missile system. there's not been a time when it's taken a real pause. and it uses these tests as a way to negotiate item item for more aid or for more diplomatic standing. neither russia nor china want to see a nuclearized pacific rim area. this is something that will be going on for a while, we need to work for quite a while to bring down tensions on the korean peninsula but also turn back the north korea capabilities of north korea. >> congressman ruben gallego, thank you. next, new details on how mitch mcconnell is hoping to return his party to power on capitol hill. plus what will michigan do about the fake trump electors from that state? i'm going to ask michigan's secretary of state that question in just a few minutes. s secretary of state that quesonti in just a few minutes. the majority of people taking rybelsus® lowered their blood sugar and reached an a1c of less than 7. rybelsus® isn't for people with type 1 diabetes. don't take rybelsus® if you or your family ever had medullary thyroid cancer or have multiple endocrine neoplasia syndrome type 2, or if allergic to it. stop rybelsus® and get medical help right away if you get a lump or swelling in your neck, severe stomach pain, or an allergic reaction. serious side effects may include pancreatitis. tell your provider about vision problems or changes. taking rybelsus® with a sulfonylurea or insulin increases low blood sugar risk. side effects like nausea, vomiting, and diarrhea may lead to dehydration, which may worsen kidney problems. wake up to the possibility of lower a1c with rybelsus®. you may pay as little as $10 for up to a 3-month prescription. ask your healthcare provider about rybelsus® today. 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>> yeah, i think one of the things that mcconnell and his party have going for him, and people remember trump had no second term agenda when running in 2020, and neither did the republican, they just said whatever trump wants to do is their agenda. the republicans are enabled in not doing things by being the party that can say, no, we don't want to do that. so it's always easier to do nothing than it is to do something. mitch mcconnell understands if he gets out ahead of this and refuses to outline any sort of policy agenda, then he can't be held accountable for it. it's the same reason people find new candidates appealing, if you don't say what it is you're going to do, nobody is going to vote against you because of it. because the republican party is focused on culture war stuff, it seems like it will work. >> cultural wars do end up taking up a lot of oxygen in the room. juanita, if the republicans are avowedly running on nothing, what does that mean for democrats and their message? >> i think democrats are going to try to come out and highlight that republicans are running on nothing, highlight how far republicans have gone to making fringe the mainstream, and emphasize their plan for the country, because there is still a lot of work to be done. phillip hid the nail on the head about accountable because that's what we do see right now, that democrats are being getting hit with in every poll that shows low approvals for the president and every poll that recognizes that democrats haven't made a lot of progress on their legislative agenda. the other thing democrats can emphasize is what the gop has already said they will do. mccarthy and others have already gone on record saying that the next congress, if they have control, will be about revenge, with unfounded impeachment proceedings, unfounded investigations into folks like dr. fauci, threats to remove democrats from committee positions, and the chaos that follows. i think that's something that democrats can absolutely lift up, to emphasize that while democrats are working to get something done, republicans will just create an environment of chaos and gridlock. >> elena, juanita makes an interesting point which is they may not have a policy agenda that they are clear or that they are televising, but it doesn't mean they haven't told us how they plan to governing should they take back power. >> that's exactly right, alicia. going back to mitch mcconnell, he and my colleague jonathan swan reported this last year in november. mcconnell was at a donor dinner with a lot of republican donors, some other republican senators, and make this clear. one donor asked him, okay, sure, you want to run against what democrats are doing and against the biden administration, but what about what we're going to run on? and he said, this has worked for us in the past, it worked for us in 2014 when republicans helped lead republicans back to the majority. we're seeing that mcconnell and people close to him say that they think it's a distraction to outline this policy that they will run on. instead he thinks it's up to the 2024 presidential nominee or republican nominee to set out that agenda and to be honest, they're doing a good job so far. i mean, biden's approval rating right now is sagging with inflation and the pandemic. these are things that democrats and democratic strategists acknowledge as well, they're hoping they can make back some of those gains in the midterms. republicans and particularly mitch mcconnell and the republican leadership on the senate side think they should just go in on all that have and continue to rail against democrats in the areas they've laid out, including inflation, the border, crime, those are the things they're just going to continue to hammer in their messaging ahead of the midterms. >> so phillip, let me just make sure i'm understanding this all correctly. they're going to largely go after problems that don't exist, they're going to offer no real policy vision of their own, they're going to get really worked up about things like minnie mouse's new outfit, and on top of that you're going to have the former president doing what he did last night where he says things like i'm going to pardon the january 6th insurrectionists if i get back into office. i understand that play as a play that potentially turns out their base. does that play appeal to anyone else? >> it's a very good question. but i think the rejoinder to that is another question, which is do they need to worry about anyone else. this is going to be a midterm election in which at this moment in time, what past trends tell us is the democrats are in a lot of trouble. just based on the fact this i an election during a presidency, which tends to go against the president's party. there are all these ways in which the democrats are already disadvantaged. so the republicans are poised to benefit from that. are they going to pick up a lot of moderate suburban voters? they might pick up some moderate suburban voters who are irritated with president biden, yes. i spoke with a republican consultant, very smart guy, who made a good point, which is that yes, it would be beneficial if candidates went out and talked to voters about bread and butter issues but that's not going to move people as much as talking about culture war stuff. that's why republicans win, they talk about things that inflame passions, get people irritated, turns out their base and the result is republicans are successful in places where you wouldn't expect it. >> phillip, you don't drop something like that when i have to say goodbye. thank you. michigan secretary of state jocelyn benson says fake electors from her state are part of a plot that went straight to the white house and she is sharing her info with the doj. later, congressman pramila gentleman pramila jayapal will join us in the next hour. a jayal fermentation? 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[announcer] there he goes. old spice works harder for longer. hey derrick man, you gonna be much longer? it's gonna be a minute, minute. hey derrick, quit playin'. derrick! the january 6th committee is targeting fake electors in seven states where trump lost in 2020. one of those states is democrat-controlled michigan where joe biden defeated trump by more than 154,000 votes. election audits further confirmed his victory. and yet, 16 michigan republicans, including kathy burden and myra rodriguez who were subpoenaed on friday, sent in a fake certificate falsely claiming trump won the state's electoral votes. the subpoenas asked both of them to appear before the committee on february 2nd. michigan's secretary of state jocelyn benson tells politico some of the electors may have been duped, saying, quote, i think it's heartbreaking to see individuals who were lied to and perhaps acted in furtherance of those lies put themselves in a position where they could potentially be legally culpable and in that way complicit in real, action election fraud. secretary of state benson joins me now. secretary benefit secretary benson, how would these electors end up in legal jeopardy? >> the voters clearly said who won the state of michigan for the presidency, and therefore in which directions the electors would vote. at the same time there was this shadow effort to lie to the federal government about who michigan's electors were and now we're wanting to ensure there's accountability and consequences for that effort but also so that we can connect the dots because we know we weren't the only state dealing with this and we know this possibly won't be the only election in which this is attempted. this was an attempt to lie and misrepresent the result of michigan's elections in 2022 to the federal government. i'm grateful we had our official electors into the national archives first so when the archives received the duplicate, they new clearly it was false. but that shouldn't discount potentially more sophisticated efforts to do the same in the future that might even have a greater chance of success. >> last week you sent a letter to the january 6th committee is and attorney general merrick garland saying you have more information on attempts to overthrow the election. can you explain for me, for the audience, the connection between the fake electors and trump's inner circle? >> a number of things. one, we have to remember that rudy giuliani was in the state of michigan on december 2nd, testifying before a sham election hearing in the state legislature. we're not an investigative body, my office is certainly just a witness to these weeks of attempts in december to interfere or tamper with the integrity of our elections and our accurate results. so we are submitting evidence like that, reminding the committee to look into who else giuliani spoke with while he was in michigan or also pointing out the fact that the trump campaign attorneys like sidney powell seem to have their hands on sealed documents from local cases in michigan that then made their way into and referenced into the draft executive order justifying the potential seizure of election machines. so there's a lot of connections that are yet to be made. my job as the state's chief election officer is simply, as a witness to all of this, provide the evidence, fully cooperate with the committee's investigation, and help them connect the dots and seek accountability for those who are culpable. >> you laid out a number of questions. how do you want to see the justice department move on the information you've provided? >> well, our goal is really threefold. one, ensure the truth emerges as to just how far and how coordinated, nationally coordinated these attempts to block the will of the voters and overturn the election, nullifying citizens who voted in 2020. this unprecedented election led all the way up to the tragedy at the capitol on january 6th. we want to prevent this happening from either side. we want to have clear truth and accountability now so we ensure this doesn't happen in the future. >> this is at the intersection of your personal life and your role here. you have seen firsthand the threats of violence that have been fueled by the big lie. this is not theoretical for you, it is very real. you put out a statement back in december 2020 detailing crowds audits your home, where you were with your young son. when you hear trump somewhere like last night, at that rally, saying to his supporters, if things don't go my way, i want you back out there on the streets, how does that land for you? what does that mean for you, both personally and what does it mean for the job that secretaries of state need to do to make sure that the next election is secure, safe, and free? >> yeah, first, we did walk through a fire in december of 2020. and we continue to be, those of us in election administration, in the center of an unprecedented multiple faceted, multiyear assault on our democracy that has manifested itself in effects on our lives, our families' lives. the vast majority of us have been emboldened as well, to protect the votes of our states and localities. that is our job. these attempts to intimidate us out of doing that job will not succeed. i am emboldened and determined and made more so by these threats. but we have to also recognize the consequences of misinformation and these lies that are coming from every direction. they are one step away from hateful rhetoric and one step away from violence that we saw transpire in many ways in december and january of 2020 and 2021, both outside my home, outside the state capitol in michigan, and outside the u.s. capitol on january 6th. >> michigan secretary of state jocelyn benson, thank you very much for your time. next, a wave of online threats against female journalists fueled by right wing media hosts. there is a new study out showing just how dangerous it is. teller lorenz of "the new york times" joins me next. and why pressure is mounting on president biden to choose a supreme court nominee who truly grasps what it means to be a regular, everyday american. first, a look at what else is ahead tonight on msnbc. on m. i'm ayman moheldyn. we're joined by david cicilline tonight at 9:00 eastern right here on msnbc. 9:00 eastern rig here on msnbc. for fast and soothing relief. pepto bismol for fast relief when you need it most. i don't just play someone brainy on tv - i'm an actual neuroscientist. and i love the science behind neuriva plus. unlike ordinary memory supplements, neuriva plus fuels six key indicators of brain performance. more brain performance? 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