illegitimate," on his build back better program. the president says it is quote clear that he would have to break it up and mentioned two items he wants but may not get tax credit and free community college. he says vice president kamala harris will be his running mate. >> he gave reporters a lot of time. >> this is 4.5 hours and yeah, there were some good parts. they should have taken care of it in the editing room. it gave something to everybody. >> he was generous of his time. >> if you don't joe biden, you can pick out the clips that you hated and if you like joe biden, you can pick out the part. this was custom made for angry primetime for the news. >> luckily we are in the news here. and we are mellow. it was long but we are as reporters and journalists, that's what we want. we want two hours questions asked. he let everybody asking questions. he answered shows questions as well. there were some things about russia and ukraine caused some problems. the president predicted that vladimir putin will invade ukraine. but he raised eye brows by saying the least, "a minor incursion." if there is a military movement of troops by russia in the border, the united states will respond. joe biden have said if it is a minor incursion, he's going to go in anyway. that's what happens. the white house doing the clean up after the speech. >> it is a chilling moment. we'll talk about it much more. it was for people and myself i found it a chilling moment, there is no such they think as a minor incursion or invasion of russia. it would be catastrophic. it would send a message to the chinese hey guess what, you have a minor invasion of taiwan and everything is cool here. no, there is no minor invasion and that's quickly after the press conference. they cleaned it up and said an invasion is an invasion and they'll regret it and met overwhelming force and us and our allies. >> yes, it was mostly clear during the press conference. i mean it is a cyber attack. and jen psaki later said no. and katty, it was cleaned up afterwards and it was made clear that joe biden have misspoke. and those saying this is joe biden losing his mental facilities. where have you been for the past 40 years. give biden two hours, he's going to talk about 7-eleven stores and who's clean and who's not clean. it is just joe biden. >> he was given a couple of chances and kudos to the journalists who followed up on that realizing this needs some clarifications. he didn't clarify it when he was given that opportunity. he started talking about divisions within nato and i am sure president putin was aware of the fact. you don't broadcast that kind of thing when you try to present to the united front. in realtime we were getting responses from officials in kiev sending alarm bells, they were concerned that this may give someone green lights to russia if putin is on the defense. but, it is a moment of precariousness in europe and a clear united front for nato. we do not want this kind of confusion. >> it is important that we make ourselves clear across the board. if you believe that and i think president biden has said even the past four years that trump presidency did some damage and our ability to have our words impact and to mean something. it is important that the message to russia is clear as a bell or this could be a defining moment if russia invades ukraine and we are sort of waffling on it? and responding in little pieces? >> no, that's not possible. we can't do it. it was a terrible moment in the press conference when he talked about a minor incursion. there is no minor incursion. there is separation among the nato allies and ourselves on russia. there were separation because of the way we get out of afghanistan. here is the problem. biden seemed as weak from russia, china and our allies on afghanistan. if he's seen as being weak on ukraine, we'll be back here six months from now talking about that minor incursion in to taiwan. whole world is watching, afghanistan set a poor president for joe biden. fair or not. the biden administration will tell you for two hours they did exactly what they needed to do. it is success in the end and we'll tell historians debate that, putin and xi and our nato allies are not debating that right now. they see joe biden as weak. yesterday's conference did not help. they cleaned it up afterwards. if you are vladimir putin, you pay attention to the clean up. you really do. there are dire consequences if he does not paid attention to the clean-up. our nato allies wondering yet again is the united states going to waffle? >> yes, right, there is never in a situation in the press conference especially one that's as long as this one, where at the end of the conference, you have to put a statement out to clean up what's happening in the press conference. that's not a good thing. of the standpoint of military strategy and foreign policy, that cleaned up in addition to back channels and national nati security world and -- there are political consequences to this, too. if you look at our polling lines over the course of the last few days looking at biden's first year in office. where do the line crossed? where does it all changed? it all changes in august when the afghanistan withdraws and put aside substance but focus on a little bit on perception. that moment where it seems like in addition to the delta surge, it seems like where the strength and the resolve of the presidency and the competency of the presidency, that's where the moment where the poll line starting to crossed where the biden's first year started to go south. these things not only do they matter in terms of the world's stage or the national security. they matters in terms of the president's perception at home because how he looks abroad reflects back at his political consequences here at home. if you think at biden, he's on stage, for an hour and 45 minutes, if you are going to screw up one thing, if you are going to make one verbal cue is something at ukraine we are so much at stake. >> we are going to get to this. hen country kissinger said in politics, perception is reality. the reality hanging around joe biden now again is that we retrieved from afghanistan and it is that one day, one day of picture. nobody is paying attention to the historic are air lift, nobody is paying attention to all the things happening afterwards. just gunning it up over the blockades. >> yes, a lot of moments tragically. that's the day americans are going to remember. why are we drilling down on this? that's the day our adversaries and our allies remember. there can be no weak moments. >> must be clarity. >> any ambiguities for russia and ukraine or joe biden will pay for it or the ukrainians will pay for it as well. >> people are going to remember the first moment and not jen psaki's correction. to hear the united states conceding that yes, putin is probably going to go in was an extraordinary moment no matter how they clean it up. the fact the president biden could not ensure this midterm election this term will be free and fair echoed another president. >> absolutely. >> should not have said that at all. we'll talk about that as well. by the way, we are going to be showing an nbc poll, he's at 44%. i am tired of people doing analysis of where he is in january of 2022. it is just extraordinary irrelevant. i found a poll yesterday that showed bill clinton was at 42% in january of '96. >> of course everybody is saying well, he's no bill clinton. well, bill clinton was no bill clinton during that time. he was so pathetic that he went out and said i am still relevant. he was the joke of washington, d.c. and then about ten months later, he's the first democratic president reelected since fdr. those polls don't spin him in the head to head matchups. # 72% of the country thinks we are on the wrong track. a lot can happen moving forward. it is not so much what happens in the past but how he handled this year and learned from clinton and learns from the mistakes he made. >> i think as we are a culture collectivey overdosing on the apocalypse. he was never going to be the second coming of fdr. >> and they tried to set him up as the second coming of fdr. >> he tried to set him up in becoming fdr and his staff tried to set him up when he won as a moderate. i know a lot of people in the white house that may have worked for bernie and elizabeth don't like that. he's a moderate. like eric adams, he's a moderate. most of the disasters has happened is because it is is overreached. >> people in the white house will say time and time ago if you want to rearrange the furniture of the american government in the way that progressives and the democratic party wants to do, you will have to win more seats. if you don't win those seats, we don't have the number to do it. you have to have the mandate to do it. that was the mismatched. we did not hear from the president. did you overreach and he says no, no. >> there is so much to get to and in terms of the press conference in terms of trying to sum up his first year and some of the things he may have said about ukraine, we are weeks away from potentially a russian invasion of ukraine and the president said -- well, i think perhaps what was being said inside the white house and outside the white house and that's pretty stunning news. and could have a huge impact on how nato responds and on american leadership. >> and let me say by the way, he did say the quiet part out loud. i will say i am glad he did. if that's what they are thinking inside the white house, they are settings themselves for three more years of misery. xi is looking at ukraine and if they are as weak in 2022 as they were in 2014, they'll be dealing with xi and taiwan in a much more difficult situation six months from now. they can't seed one inch of ground in ukraine to putin. this is not even about ukraine. >> right. >> this is about china. this is about russia. this is about taiwan. >> nato. >> this is about iran. if you are so desperate for peace, if you are so desperate. chamberlin was desperate for peace. i am drawing no comparisons. if you are so desperate for peace that you won't consider war or at least aggressive counter measures -- they need to tell vladimir putin if you go into ukraine, oh, we are not going to send 100,000 troops in. we are going to send 2500 in here and 2500 there and we are going to send the same type of force that was in syria killed -- you don't want to go to ukraine. do i want more? i don't want us to be talking about taiwan six months from now. they need to start sending the right signals. they sent the wrong signals in 2014. they sent the wrong signals now. >> biden of course has been guilty of misspeaking on taiwan in the other direction, and jen psaki had to correct him two or three times at that point. it could be too robust or belligerent or too weak. biden is capable of misspeaking in both directions remember. >> yes. >> we'll be talking about ambassador michael mcfall about this and richard haas will come back. we got so much more to get to. willie. >> moments after that long conference wrapped up, there was big news out of the supreme court denied former president trump's request to block the release of white house documents. the decision was unanimous. the brief order written by chief justice roberts upheld the decision that trump would not be able to prevent the release of the documents even if he were the current president, a determination based from precedents of the watergate era forcing former president nixon turning over those tapes. it was not considered by the supreme court. justice brett kavanaugh wrote separately in support of the former president continuous stance of claiming privilege in some circumstances but it does not applied here. the records will not be released to the public. joe, what we are talking about here are notes from the chief of staff, mark meadows in and around january 6th, plans they were making and explanations why they thought the 2020 election was unfair and ought to be overturned. this is all the inner workings of the white house and now available and a lot of it is in the hands of the select-committee. >> big win for the select-committee and for those wanting to know what happens on january 6th. i agreed with brett kavanaugh's explanation. he was with the majority and he decided -- i am glad he did. brett kavanaugh said just because the current president does not recognize a former president's a claim of executive privilege basically undermines that claim because suddenly even the claim of executive privilege becomes partisan. so i thought this decision was well-written and well-explained and gives the january 6th commission what they need. >> it does. i am concerned of the clock being run out on the january 6th committee. this was fairly clear and swift and hopefully a similar ruling of mark meadows being subpoenaed to testify in the committee which is key and in the thick of things on january 6th. he was cooperating and he withdrew. it needs to be enforced. >> and john highland, obviously a big win for the january 6th commission, right? >> yes, huge. i think and i don't want to pair in their language too much. it is an important win for the rule of law and an important win for history and an important win in term of precedents. if you think about what this committee has to get done and i am with ed about still being concerned of the clock being run out, you think of all these people, the progress and the aggressive posture the committee has taken with all the requests for information and subpoenas going out and all of those things trying to call people in. that's a thing that could take a very long time as each one of those people decide to fight, they don't want to testify and they tried to fight and force to testify and they come into testify and they take the 5th. those things may not yield actual information to the committee. what yields actual information, real clarity about a lot of those in the white house is these records. this is in the end will be mostly a paper case and being able to access those documents is crucial to getting to the bottom of what happened on january 6th. so i can't actually imagine a more important development for this committee's ultimate mandate is trying to figure out what happened and figure out what the president's -- >> many of them will never testify and tell the truths but the papers will speak. now, there are no barriers of getting those important crucial and vital in revealing internal communications. it is all underway coming across the committee last night. >> we have to take a break, we are hearing from the white house about our conversations on ukraine, we'll get back to that and still ahead on "morning joe." will democrats renew their focus on build back better act to pass election reforms. what president biden saying about a strategy to get his economic agenda across the finish line. plus, a pair of senators joining us to discuss their recent trips to ukraine. senator shaheen and portman will be here. >> and boris johnson is faing calls for resignation. you are watching "morning joe." # cing calls for resignation. you are watching "morning joe. this is the new world of work. each day looks different than the last. but whatever work becomes, the servicenow platform will make it just, flow. whether it's finding new ways to help you serve your customers, orchestrating a safe return to the office... wait. an office? what's an office? ...or solving a workplace challenge that's yet to come. wherever the new world of work takes your business, the world works with servicenow. here we go... remember, mom's a kayak denier, so please don't bring it up. bring what up, kayak? excuse me? do the research, todd. listen to me, kayak searches hundreds of travel sites to find you great deals on flights, cars and hotels. they're lying to you! who's they? kayak? arr! open your eyes! compare hundreds of travel sites at once. kayak. search one and done. hey lily, i need a new wireless plan for my business, but all my employees need something different. oh, we can help with that. okay, imagine this. your mover, rob, he's on the scene and needs a plan with a mobile hotspot. we cut to downtown, your sales rep lisa has to send some files, like asap! so basically i can pick the right plan for each employee. yeah i should've just led with that. with at&t business. you can pick the best plan for each employee and get the best deals on every smart phone. by the way, i think shao-ping visited our house after this. ed, you know about that moment. put this picture up of young mika. which is really looking at you. >> he's so recognizable looking from the back of his head. >> yes, except for the lack of cigarettes. he was a chainsmoker, right? he didn't use cavier in his lap. >> he did. jimmy carter confirmed that at dr. brzezinski's funeral. >> i don't know how we are going to get from many to my brother's swearing in yesterday but on "morning joe," we make some sharp turns. so if you can imagine decades after my father was driven out of poland. my brother was sworn in yesterday as ambassador to poland. >> against all enemies. >> foreign and domestic. that'll i will bare truth faith and allegiance to the same that i take this obligation freely. >> that i take this obligation freely. >> without any purpose of evasion. and that'll i will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office which i am upon to enter. so help me god. >> so help me god. >> congratulations ambassador. >> with that we had an incredible family moment. a really as you pointed joe, a generational moment. >> it was a generational moment. 83 years ago, the brzezinski family were chased out by adolph hitler. the doctor went to this country and went to canada and had to learn the language and went to harvard and ran u.s. foreign policy that he was the cold warrior of cold warriors and how extraordinary he spent his life actually trying to liberate poland and now 83 years later, the brzezinskis going back to poland. it was an extraordinary moment. >> i feel like i should be asking mika here, i hope your brother speaks polish? >> he does. he went to law school and went to poland and lived there and wrote a book on the polish constitution and ever since he's been working. he's made for this job. if you watch his hearing, you will really understand why this position, this nomination is especially important in poland at this moment. it sends a message from the get-go and marks speaks fluent polish and immersed in the issue on day one from his swearing in. he was able to be instrumental in getting a veto so the network can continue in poland. >> it really is. mark is incredibly capable and what? >> the vice president was so generous of mark's daughter talking about her how at the same page she moved from california to montreal and really helped her feel more comfortable about such a big move. i am so grateful for that moment, she and we will remember it forever. >> it was a moving moment. >> mark brzezinski came back, he was in poland in '91 or '92. a couple of years. i always said he's a lot like madonna who lived in britain for a couple of weeks and came back with an accent. mark has had a poland access for 30 years. why do you act polish. he does. >> at 12 he would be like mom, are we going to the doc-toor. >> and odd enough he came back dressing like madonna, too. >> it had to be said and just watching that video how extraordinary a moment that is given the long arc of your family and i can't imagine how cool it is for you and joe being there. i was looking what was going through your mind as you watc this? >> i was thinking of my dad. they both have been involved in a lot of meetings together now because they both have shared interests and sort the same goal which is to take on the shared challenges that poland and america faced. >> and it is the timing is pretty extraordinary. again, obviously dr. brzezinski spent a career worried about russia's incursion into eastern and central europe. the timing is pretty remarkable. >> again, last night in the press conference the president pointed out were there to be any russia movement on ukraine which is the country that's going to get more troops is poland. your brother could not be arriving as ambassador at a time that's critical not just for poland but the rest of europe as well. >> it is a critical time in britain's house of commons. david davis called on the prime minister to resign, ahmad backlash of lockdown parties in his downing street home. >> i expect my leaders to shoulder the responsibilities for their actions they take. yesterday he did the opposite of that. so i will remind him of a quotation all together too familiar to him. you have stopped too long for all the goods you have done, in the name of go, god. >> of course, yes, who would not compare a garden party with hitler's invasion of poland? >> what? >> come on. >> a bit of an overstatement. >> it was a garden party. >> it is a little bit much. >> yeah. >> i am not sure if it works if he wheel the knife, make sure it kills the king. i don't think it did. i think boris is limping and all kinds of jokes. he's in downing street as in downing drinks. >> right. >> there is a civil servant investigating whether he lied about the party. she's a civil servant. she's not used to speaking truths. i suspect he's going to get off the hook for the time being and god's name may have to be invoked a couple more times. >> exactly. >> katty certainly he has helped when they're compaing boris johnson's garden party to munich. an overreach. i am surprised this is what takes him down. >> he came in and won brexit and it is going to take quite something to dislodge him from his position. it does not look like this is going to be the thing even though there is real outrage on behalf of the politic about his party taking place when they were losing loved ones during the lockdown especially on the eve of prince phillips -- they don't like it. it looks like he carries on. he'll be a weaker prime minister because of it. >> ed luce, thank you very much for being on. >> coming up, the response from former president trump's legal team after his organization was accused of lying about the value of several properties. and, ahead president biden's news conference, joe sat down with white house's chief of staff ron klain. that exclusive interview is coming up a little later on "morning joe," we'll be right back. ♪♪ on "morning joe," we'll be right back back ♪tory? 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[copy machine printing] ♪ ♪ who would've thought printing... could lead to growing trees. ♪ as a business owner, your bottom line could lead to is always top of mind. so start saving by switching to the mobile service designed for small business: comcast business mobile. flexible data plans mean you can get unlimited data or pay by the gig. all on the most reliable nationwide network. with no line activation fees or term contracts... saving you up to $500 a year. and it's only available to comcast business internet customers. so boost your bottom line by switching today. comcast business: powering possibilities. . i think the best way to look at what this new administration is, the president may have won the nomination but bernie sanders won the argument about what the new administration should be like. we are confronted with severe challenges from the new administration and a narrow majority of democrats in the house turning america to a socialist country. that's 100% of my focus. >> you said you were surprised by republicans obstruction of your agenda. didn't the gop took the same tactic when you were vice president to barack obama, why did you think they would treat you any differently than they treated him? >> first of all, they were not nearly as obstructionists as they are now. you stated that but we had a number of republicans we worked with closely from john mccain -- i mean a number of those republicans and even back in those days, lindsey graham. >> i did not anticipate there would be such an effort to make sure the most important thing that president biden didn't get anything done. think about this. what are republicans for? what are they for? name me one thing they are for. what's mitch for? what is he for on immigration? what is he for? what are they for? what is their agenda? the american public is outraged about the tax structure we have in america. what are they proposing to do about it? anything? have we heard anything? i have not heard anything. >> that's pretty good. >> we gotten that on the show. what's their plan for healthcare? they have not had a plan. they been attacking the affordable care act since 2009 and 2010, but have not put forward a unified healthcare. they don't have a plan other than obstruction according to a popular republican governor, new hampshire whose last name is sununu. let's bring in our eugene robinson. he quoted sununu and he came down here, what are we going to do? nothing. he's a loyal republican and he said well, okay so you are going to do nothing but why didn't you do something when you controlled the house and the senate in the white house in 2017 and 2018, he said they sat there dumbfounded. again, this is a republican with a 70% approval rating. he came down here and said these republicans don't want to do anything. >> it is nothing ideological from that. >> and so this is a party that like "seinfield" is about nothing. it is about stopping and from doing anything. it is about power basically power at sake. it is about regaining power. it is what they're trying to do and the way they try to do that is prevent joe biden's from moving the country forward and that should scandalize every american but it is the truth. by the way. donald trump himself said that earlier this week. there is no plan and no agenda. we just want to get into power. >> john, january 20th is the anniversary of president biden being sworn in as president in office. some of the history is about his history of being senator of twisting arms and working. that obviously has not happened, he got it on infrastructure but not many other places so was it fantasy in this era and climate of the way the republican party is today and now looking back to think that joe biden could be different in this moment? >> willie, i enjoyed it when you ask me questions of a one word answer. >> yes, of course it was. if you think about 2020 democratic nomination fight, every single one of joe biden's rivals screamed at him throughout the nomination fight that he was living in fantasy land when he talked about how republicans would have an epiphany and working with him. they pointed to his eight years of vice president, did you learn nothing? on november 7, 2020. a reporter stood up and asked joe biden, given the way you have experienced as vice president, why do you think republicans would work with you? and he said, they will. she asked given they won't acknowledge the legitimacy of your election for shattering over the course of the next year, if they don't acknowledge your election, why would they work with you. he said they will. it is a little rich to hear joe biden sitting here and saying well, you know, i didn't foresee it. well, if you didn't foresee it. you should have listened to all the people around you who were saying to you, these people were not going to work with you, look at your eight years of the obama administration, they are more radical now. it should not come as a surprise to joe biden. there is some possibility that his posture on this is a little bit of false naive. he's trying to convey the notion that hey, i was going to give them the benefits of the doubt. i was hopeful they would not change would be willing during this pandemic and economic crisis they would change their spots and willing to work for the american people. now i have learned that they are not willing to do that and so we are going to draw the sharp contrasts going into the midterm ls. that's what democrats around the country have been begging for. we started to see a little bit of a road map from him yesterday which is what have we done over the last year and what do we want to do more of on one side and republicans who don't want to do anything and intimidated by donald trump. that's the message for 2022. >> that being said, they passed the $2 trillion covid relief bill and infrastructure bill. they passed a bipartisan bill to face a challenges of technology with china. there were some bipartisan bills. it is kind of hard to expect bipartisanship when you start with $6 trillion bill after we have spent like $7 trillion or $8 trillion over the past couple of years. democrats need to do what bill clinton did to us. we didn't like him and we impeached him. i will be damn if he didn't keep on putting things on the floor that we had to vote. >> in february we'll have hearing on insulins, they just do that for an up or down vote. no, they won't. they can't afford it. what if the next thing you do is you take mit romney at his words, oh, you want $11.25 cents minimum wage in march. let's have hearings on that. there will be 10 republican senators that'll have to vote for $11.25 cents minimum wage. take joe manchin of his words. okay, you say you are for universal pre-k? okay, we'll put it in the recreational bill. it will be an extraordinary entitlement around for the next few years. they're talking about chopping it up and do what bill clinton did to us. give them offers they can't refuse. >> or even the electoral count act. and mitch mcconnell says that's something they can talk about. there are things they can do. the biden administration came in with the belief that it could have a mandate to be fdr from the mentally change the nature american society, the country didn't elect him to do that? they elected him to restore normalcy and get us through the pandemic and doing things like reforming. you say that to a progressive, oh no, no, we have to pass 27 things along with the electoral count act when it would taken care of what donald trump wanted mike pence to do on january the 6th. >> joe biden didn't take the opportunity to say right i am going with the span wing of the democratic party. i am going with the more moderate, smaller approach to government. he didn't take that opportunity. let's see whether he actually does it because the other roots have been shutdown firmly. it is not about voting rights, there were a whole load of other things now. gun reforms. he's going to have to take the more peaceful approach to government. >> reality is going to get anything done -- >> the reality is going to basically force the democratic party and president biden to split up build back better act and do it piece by piece. it is with that being progressive caucus is most of the democratic caucus. that's some reality. >> the democrats won them back in the house in 2018. it was the moderate democrats. >> the decision on whether the electoral decision on whether nancy pelosi is speaker of the house or kevin mccarthy is not whether aoc is going to win or not, she's going to win. if they want to know how to get republican votes. call abigail fanberger and the 25 democrats who are fighting in the white house. give us an agenda that'll help you win in the fall. >> abigail supported build back better act. those democrats that are in those swing districts and some are moderate more than others. the democratic party is pretty unite around their agenda and the question is how do you get that agenda and active. they got a bunch of stuff done in the past year, there is a whole bunch of stuff they would like to do. it is just reality that it is not going to go through. >> there you go. >> it is going to go piece by piece. >> and not all of the pieces will go through. that's the other thing the party have to face. >> some of it will go through and some won't. >> all you have to do is count 50. you don't have joe manchin's vote on the child tax credit. you are not going to do that his way. maybe you can do it mit romney's way? >> right. >> and basically more progressive ideas on that than joe manchin does. maybe you can do that sort of thing. but, you know we are where we are. it was so classic joe biden. that was the joe biden we all known for 40 years. >> it had some good moments. >> people were saying oh, joe is losing his mind. no, this is joe biden. >> that's exactly the guy we know. >> you give joe biden, two hours when he's 38 years old and you will walk away going -- my god. >> he's wonderful. >> when he's good, he's very good. when he's bad -- >> the old joke used to be that you would run to joe biden at union station here at washington and you get on the train with him and he's going home to wilmington and you ask him one question and he finishes the answer as he got off the train. >> he's as very nice, generous person. >> oh my god. >> you should have seen his interview, if you had joe biden for an hour in a college audience, you didn't have to prepare 20 questions. just one. >> who do i know is like that? >> maybe if he's got a sore throat or something. >> all right, eugene robinson, thank you very much. still ahead, we'll bring in a former top strategist from the biden white house. a colleague here symone sanders will be our guest on "morning joe," and michael mcfaul joins us and president's gasp, minor incursion coming into ukraine. "morning joe" is coming right back. ukraine. "morning joe" is coming right "morning joe" is coming right back only from discover. ♪ ♪ ♪ we are doing more now than a year ago. 375 million tests in the market in just this month. if you buy a test in the store, your insurance will reimburse you. we are making 1 billion at home schools are still open. you all phrase the question, i don't think it is deliberate in your part. you phrase the question while watching the television, my god, schools must be closing, what are we going to do? 95% are still open. back to "morning joe." you heard that. >> i did hear that. jonathan lemire. that's not the point. oh, yesterday proves that joe biden does that. >> you give him again as gene would say, you give him two hours in a press conference. you know give him 15 minutes. last question. sorry -- >> i need to put on my white house hat on first. two hours is great. if you give joe biden two hours when he's 38 or 48 >> yeah, the gap and the mistake on ukraine is obviously serious. they had said things earlier in the week where they said an invasion, this is an invasion. i will say though for those on the trump's right sitting there going oh my god, i can't believe he said this and that. it is as if he completely -- maybe they're the ones with dementia. they don't remember just what a lunatic donald trump was. >> how about abroad? >> one of the reasons why i think lemire is not going to damascus any time soon. >> remember helsinki and donald trump said in a press conference - yeah, stay here. you know donald trump saying stuff like you know he trusted vladimir putin more than the intel committee. so obviously you are going oh my god there are so many horrible deaths yesterday. >> thank you for the ballots. >> it is night and day. >> gasp as an hour of real crazy angry comments we get. we can critique it but i don't want to hear it from trump's apologists because they were just fine as crazies in the last four years. yes, jonathan lemire presented that question in helsinki and donald trump neglected on the world stage with if whole world watching and the country is seeing what he would say, declined to confront vladimir putin when given the chance by his side. as you said with joe biden, there is no such thing as the president will offer brief remarks. there is no brief remarks. reminded when they were test driving joe biden in 2018 to see if he ought to run for president again, they sent him out to events to see how he do, can you give a brief introduction, there were no brief introductions. just the way he is. there were some moments the white house had to go in and clean up. he said he could not be sure of the midterm elections would be legitimate. donald trump said the same thing. no comparison to a persist tant comparison. the comment that sets alarm bells around world. >> no comparison with a yearlong campaign to undermine election integrity but i would say after a yearlong campaign to undermine election integrity, the last thing you want to do is answer a question in a way that would suggest that there is some questions about election integrity in the next game and the next election unless your bills get passed. >> donald trump laid the ground work of fraud way back in 2016. but president biden yesterday was another remark white house aid sort of scramble to clean up a little bit. >> they're talking about it, of course, he's stressing about it and he believes -- we should trust the results. he did raise concerns about efforts to restrict access in a number of states and did offer his support again for efforts to ensure where the ballots are counted correctly as well which is the other danger here. their votes would not be counted and the white house is leaving behind an effort to push past electoral count act and change that. they hope to get something done. it went down at the feet last night. those democratic senators seemed unmoved. that's going to be a hard decline. >> joe, while a president should make it clear that we respect the results of the election, there are reasons for all americans wonder about that given what happens in places of the people who counts the votes. you want the president of the united states given what we have seen the last five years to assure the people they can trust the vote. with the caveat and this is what the president is getting at. there are people put in place and running for office supported by donald trump who would have given the chance in 2020 flip those fair elections back to donald trump. >> a great point you bring up here and again two things true at one time. you always want to talk about the confidence you have in the system. he has to fight like hell for these state legislatures who not only want to make it different difficult for people to vote but more dangerous than that is they want to decide who counts the vote and who does not count the vote. they did not like the fact that republicans counted the vote fairly in arizona. they didn't like the fact republicans counted the vote fairly in georgia. they want to change that a president has the right to say this is deeply concerning to me. >> also with us adjunct senior, and richard haas and former u.s. ambassador to russia now director of the institute for international study at stanford, michael mcfaul. another person that's not headed to moscow. >> the biden administration made it clear that an invasion is an invasion. after the conference, they said any invasion is going to be met with a strong response. joe biden during the press conference said things that obviously concerned a lot of people and i am sure concerned you. after they quickly get this statement out, any russian military forces move across the ukrainian border, that's a renewed invasion, it will be met with swift severe united response from the united states and our allies. first thing, thanks for reminding me that i was in hin ski. >> you may remember there trump at that conference when asked we should hand americans to be interrogated by mr. putin, he said that's a great idea. i remember that and i remember being there with jonathan. to your point that, they cleaned it up and they should not have used that word. everybody understands that. it underscores an analytic problem they have. if russian soldiers march all the way to kiev, a full comprehensive response the united states and our allies have will be on the table. there is no doubt about that. like wise in the extreme other way -- if putin used military force in a different situation, we know what that world is. in between those extremes are a lot of different options that vladimir putin have. not just using tanks like you show now but areal attacks and artillery attacks. something full scale intervention invasion and occupation, in that world they face pretty difficult challenge of keeping alliance together and keeping our european partners together to do and provide the adequate response. >> so richard haas, just to get the clean up here, jen psaki after she said if any russian military forces move across the ukraine border, that's a renewed invasion and we'll be met with severe response. president biden is right that putin has to do something and he'll move in at this point. if that's true, what's that swift severe response? >> it is up to mr. putin to decide whether he has to do. my own reading of mr. putin is he misjudged the u.s. response. he's leaning forward and he massed more than 100,000 troops. i don't think he anticipate the relatively strong response the united states has put together. so he may well feel quote on quote "the need to do something," our policy goal is to accept the diplomatic offering for him and agree some sort of arms control arrangement in europe, security architecture in europe. we don't want to suggest as a president did yesterday and then the white house cleaned it up that the off ramp is limited incursion. and ought not to be acceptable outcome. again, we want to strengthen deterrence and we want mr. putin to basically believe if he does anything that's coursed, he'll pay a price greater than the benefits. he does not get all of what he wants. we can't offer that but he gets enough of what he wants and that is quote on quote "safe." >> it seems that many in the administration and across washington believe that an invasion may happen the next two or three weeks. are you hearing that? >> i don't know, joe, why anyone would have the confidence to make that assessment and capabilities is one thing and we can measure that. intentions are not measured. putin had the capability mass for some time and he has not moved on it. it is possible. i think we have got a decision making system here of one. he's going to have to decide what he wants to do. he's institutionalized as mike mcfaul knows. if he wants to evade with 10,000 troops or 100,000 troops. he'll to it. i think our policy will assume that it is not a fate of complete. deterrence is essential and deterrence is both to push back and here is how you will pay a price if you go in economically and diplomatically and a stronger nato and the porcupine strategy. here is a diplomatic option for you and this is peripheral for you. we want to persuade mr. putin that he can realize enough of his aims without going in. that's what foreign policy is all about here. >> let me ask you mr. ambassador, help us try to get inside the mind of vladimir putin or close, give us your best guess. he understands the united states is about 20 trillion. russia is about 2 trillion. he understands in syria when 300 russians charged in syria, they were dead in about 5 or 10 minutes. no americans hurt. he knows militarily we can inflict such extraordinary damage and plain in helping insurgency insurgency. they would be humiliated. it makes no sense. what he's doing in china makes no sense. is vladimir putin at a state where he's so isolated that he's going to be so irrational that he'll make those mistakes? >> yes, i am glad you used the word rational verses irrational. you think about how sanctions will affect my country's economy, what about buying backs like you are talking about. they're not going to go war with us and tragically, they have tremendous advantages over ukrainians. he does not think that way. we super-impose on him on our way of calculating costs and benefits. he's been in power for 21 years. what richard says about him being isolated is really important. he sits out on the countryside and he does not listen to anybody. he thinks that he's got an idealogical mission here to rewrite the wrongs of 30 years ago when we were -- russia is not as weak as 30 years ago. he wants to redo it all. it reminds me after world war i and the germans baffled, wit a minute, we don't like this deal, we are stronger now and we want to rip it up. he got an obsession with ukraine. therefore he wants to reunify the nation and he's i think is obsessed that. >> that's not good. >> heidi, it is not news of divisions of nato and how to respond to this. he went further and officials does believe putin will go into russia. what's your assessment and what sorts of consequences could the u.s. offer off here? will it be enough of a deterrence? >> one of the responses is the crushing economic blows of sanctions of the russian economy. this is something where you need to look at again from putin's perspective, they spent a lot of time sanction-proofing their economy the past couple of years. they really pulled back on their dead exposure and the exposure to the dollar and so you need a united front with your allies which is why having your allies and partners there at your side is so critical. the other side is putin playing the energy card against europe and 40% of their gas and the gas prices are through the roof, the russians also have been doing a china pivot and so the big question here is if there is a military move of whatever description into beyond the dawn bus and beyond, what does china do here? do they backup russia? do they provide safety net for sanctions and given the reliance, the increasing reliance on china for exports, for russia's oil and gas. do they actually have a backstop now? >> so, listening to ambassador mcfaul and hearing the disturbing descriptions of the obsession of ukraine, when you have obsession and ego like vladimir putin has mixed together. that sounds like an invasion is imminent. it does not sound like there is a play with the pipeline or some strategic negotiations that can go on. what does deterrence look like in a situation like that and what sanctions could be put in place that's possible to collectively put in place, maybe through nato that would actually cripple in an imminent invasion? >> so there is a very robust basket of sanctions that we can layer on top of the robust basket of sanctions we already have on various russia and entities and sectors for a whole variety of infringement of cyber attacks and elections meddling. the question is whether they actually work and i think you can inflict significant pain on the russian economy. in their calculation, is that worth the hit for, are they worth taking the hit for. is this expansion back into what the former soviet union worst economic hit. i think the answer from putin's perspective is yes. >> my lord. >> heidi and rich and ambassador michael mcfaul, thank you for joining us. up next, senator shaheen will rob portman will be joining us. the cia is out with a preliminary report of havana syndrome, what it is weighing across the globe. we'll have that update, you are watching "morning joe," we'll be right back. l have that update, watching "morning joe," we'll be right back this is the new world of work. each day looks different than the last. but whatever work becomes, the servicenow platform will make it just, flow. whether it's finding new ways to help you serve your customers, orchestrating a safe return to the office... wait. an office? what's an office? ...or solving a workplace challenge that's yet to come. wherever the new world of work takes your business, the world works with servicenow. ♪ ♪ ♪ one of my favorite supplements is qunol turmeric. ♪ turmeric helps with healthy joints and inflammation support. unlike regular turmeric supplements qunol's superior absorption helps me get the full benefits of turmeric. the brand i trust is qunol. ♪ ♪ ♪ "how bizarre" by omc ♪ no annual fee on any discover card. ♪ ♪ what happened here? surging of omicron cases. chief justice denied asking gorsuch or anyone wearing a mask. it stands by its reporting, katty, the thing that people do not understand about supreme court justices and we learned this after justice scalia's death and of course scalia and ruth bader-ginsberg, he does not let anybody come between them. >> when they have a chance as they did yesterday to say actually we respected each other and we can befriendly, we disagree with the law and we are united against those who are trying to divide us. they'll take that opportunity and still standing by reporting on this. the court members and especially chief justice roberts, they do not want this subject to be a division over the rest of the country. >> the cia has ruled the mysterious symptoms known as havana syndrome are not the results of a global campaign aimed at hundreds of u.s. diplomats and spies. according to sources, the idea of a foreign power is responsible for widespread brain injury symptoms targeting americans on the world has been deemed unfounded. in about two dozen cases, the agency can't rule out foreign involvement. many of these cases of those originated of the u.s. embassy of havana sat the start of 2017. the cia declins to comment. >> i have talked to someone who suffered the consequences of havana syndrome. he knew this report coming out, not happy at all. a lot of people feel like the agency continue to push it down the road. >> that's a complaint that's growing and it will get louder after this record. they down played it and they don't want to turn it into an international thing. russia has always been the likely suspect on this. >> it is interesting here they say some of these people may have been targeted by a foreign power but i don't think it was widespread campaign. there are hundreds of people impacted by this, all corners of the globe and not just in cuba. so this is certainly going to deepen the mystery. >> there is a question about timing. the bi pyramid den administration being so careful not to do anything that's seen as provacative of russia. we don't have submission of any particular country. i know and i have spoken to several people that he's been in contact with, their attention is all focused on russia for reasons i won't mention here. they all have their own separate reasons. >> tony blinken takes it really seriously. if some people got it perhaps of a foreign power, how do these other people get it? that's a disconnect there. this is not a syndrome seems to have any other course. it is not like oh, well they caught the virus from the water or something else. we don't know where else you could have gotten this syndrome. i would have thought you have to look at that of all of the cases. >> a very clear complaint. and a clear explanation of what happened. it is very specific. this is not just happening. >> the thought would be microwaves is apart of this. the people that impacted by this does not believe it happened at all that it is symptomatic that they're are making it up and a lot of people who are suffering are -- >> a small comparison, i had really bad tinitis and at times it screeching in my ears. >> it is so loud and it is very hard. >> don't ever talk to a doctor who's a tendonitis specialist. it is a real thing. >> yeah. >> and unless you have it yourself. i learn it very quickly. to sit there and saying it is not real. i can't imagine these people sitting in our country not only have tendonitis -- >> i have heard stories from individuals that's really interesting to hear those stories. >> good point. >> coming up, the national press secretary for senator bernie sanders' 2016 presidential campaign, symone sanders joined the biden campaign in 2019 as a senior adviser before becoming a top aid in the vice president's office. the former white house strategist is joining us here as a colleague here on msnbc and she's our next guest right here on "morning joe." st right here on "morning joe. ♪♪ ♪♪ it's our january sale on the sleep number 360 smart bed. it senses your movements and automatically adjusts to relieve pressure points. ♪♪ and it's temperature balancing so you both sleep just right. save $1,000 on the sleep number 360 special edition smart bed, queen now $1,999. plus, 0% interest for 24 months. with relapsing forms of ms... there's a lot to deal with. not just unpredictable relapses. all these other things too. it can all add up. kesimpta is a once-monthly at-home 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position taken by bull conner that they were bull conner. >> and that's an interesting read. i assume you got it in the journals because you like to write. >> did you expect that would work with senator manchin or sinema. >> here is the thing, for certain thing that's so consequential, you have to speak from your heart as well as your head. i was speaking out forcefully on what i think to be at stakes. that's what it is. by the way, no one, no one forgets who was on the side of bull conner. don't think this is a freebie. you don't get to vote this way and somehow it goes away. it will stick with you for the rest of your career and long after you are gone. >> all right, and as expected, senate democrats came up short last night and their bid to overcome a filibuster on voting rights legislation or to enact a filibuster carve out for that legislation. president biden said he's disappointed but not deterred over last night's bill. >> no matter how hard they make it for minorities to vote, you will see them willing to stand in line and defy the attempt to keep that from being able to vote. i think you will see people who try to keep them from being able to show up and maing the sacrifices and in order to change the law back to where it should be. it is going to be difficult. we are not there yet. we have not run out of shopping yet. >> do you think they would any way be illegitimate? >> oh yeah, it would easy be illegitimate. imagine if in fact trump is succeeded convincing pence not to count the votes. >> regard to 2022. >> oh, 2022 -- imagine if those attempts to say that the count was not legit. you have to recount it or not going to count or disregard the following votes. i am not going to say it is going to be legit. the increase and the prospect of being illegitimate is a direct proportion of not being able to get these reforms passed. >> wow. joining us now former deputy assistant to president biden and senior adviser to vice president kamala harris, symone sanders. this spring she will post a show on msnbc weekends and on peacock, "the choice" on msnbc. we welcome you to the network here to "morning joe" and now we have a lot of questions. there is a lot to unpack there. there is some controversy of what the president said last night. if you unpack it, it is not hard to see. he's talking about the legislation that republican state legislatures -- >> yeah. >> we will count the votes the way we want to. that should be a concern for democrats and republicans. >> it is not just arizona, it is missouri, georgia, montana and there is as bill in arizona right now that says would allow politicians to say you know what we are going to take another look at these votes. there is another bill that says we'll allow the voters to vote again. this is not turning out right. there is a bill in georgia right now that says we'll do away with all drop boxes. if anybody remembers drop boxes were used extensively in the run off election last january as well as november 2020. i think that what the president was talking about was serious and sinister. often times democrats say oh, democracy is imperil and people are like you guys are acting like the sky is falling. the votes last night of what was on the table, part of it was establishing a floor and throwing some things on top of it like national voter registration. i think the president was very clear. >> jonathan, we at times have said here that the rhetoric of jim crow 2.0 is over-needed. cory booker made great comments last night with tim scott where he said wait a second, look at what's happening since 2013, shelby and look at what happens in texas, look how much harder for black people to vote in texas today than it was in 2013. the drop boxes are being pulled up in minority areas. cory booker also says why does it take a black american so much longer to vote on average than a white american? this is pretty clear cut. i don't like it -- i don't like anything that's out there called jim crow 2.0. i agreed with stacey abrams, they should have yanked the all-star plan in atlanta. georgia is easy to vote going into new york city. so we can hold that in one basket here and then we can go over here and see why the john lewis' voting rights has to be passed. since the protection of shelby were lifted, black americans -- it is so much harder for black americans to vote than white americans. it is just the objective facts, the numbers are the numbers and the facts are the facts. >> it is much harder for african-american voters to cast their ballots than their white counter parts and now they are concerned of whether those votes will be counted or post elections. so take us in the room in terms of how we got to this point and your sense of where we go from here. last night of course republicans stood against us and the votes went down. two democrats also made it clear they're not interested in changing the filibuster. seems like voting rights legislation is stalled. >> you heard from senaor warnock and senaor schumer. they put out statements noting that they will not be deterred and the fight goes on. you heard democrats said yesterday, we'll vote on every voting rights legislation. put people on the record, are you going to vote against voting day a national holiday or vote against that lunch should not belonger than 30 minutes. that's one of the strategies. the vice president's strategy has been to build a coalition. we talk a lot about black voters and white voters being able to vote but there is triable communities and young people. there was a bill in new hampshire that said you could not vote your college id as an id for residency to vote. well, there was a time when a lot of young people came out to vote in elections so long ago, some folks did not like that so they instituted a bill. she built a coalition for folks traveling across the country to highlight what's going wrong in some places but uplift what's going right. people expecting a lot in this white house not understanding what the tools that the president and vice president have. one of the biggest tools is the bully pulpit which is why the vice president presided over the votes last night. the fight is not over and the sky has not yet fallen. >> symone, good morning, it is willie, welcome to msnbc. you worked as vice secretary for bernie sanders, do you think that's a good idea, do they deserve primaries as many people pointed out, it is primary that joe manchin loses and democrats lose the united states senate. >> hi, willie, good to see. >> me, too. >> bernie sanders was speaking to a sentiment that a lot of folks around the country feels. folks in arizona and folks in west virginia are going to have to make that decision. joe manchin enjoys a lot of support in west virginia from democrats and independents. a lot of people on the ground demonstrated some disdains from what they see from their senators. i know that theongressman from arizona is talking about poten running against senator won't run again. it is too early to make that distinction. how do you folks in congress come together to move something forward. that's what the american people want. they want action. how do we make it happen? >> and one quickly, katty, we are talking about this debate on the floor last night between tim scott and cory booker. cory booker said don't lecture me about jim crow, his voice rising, i know this is not 1965 and that's what makes me so outraged. it is 2022. they are blatantly moving more polling places from the counties where blacks and latinos arover represented. that's something that texas have been doing consistently since 2013. >> that's a sense of urgency that symone has been talking about and in terms of the electoral count part of this, there is some kind of bipartisan deals to be done. it does not look like, well, there are clearly any deals to be done and what is happening around the actual process of voting. the administration of vote counts off afterwards. that's what i think is more important. the more alarming part is the health of the democracy is who administers the vote count and that becomes a partisan issue. if there is any silver lining at the moment and any optimism at the moment, there is a chance to do something about that. >> symone sanders, welcome and thank you very much for being on. >> up next, no shots, no problem. a major company changes their policies on covid vaccinations, we'll explain it next. a guest you will not want to miss. oscar winning actress goldie hawn will be with us live in the next hour. 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(naj) one that we don't take lightly. it's why our fees are structured so we do better when our clients do better. fisher investments is clearly different. for there is always light, if only we're brave enough to see it, if only we're brave enough to be it. if only we're brave enough. brave enough to live through two of the most difficult years many of us can remember. brave enough to pull ourselves up again, and again. america is the home of the brave. it's why we keep getting up, no matter how many times we get knocked down. like with our economy. it isn't all the way back, but it's getting stronger. we may be entering year three of a pandemic none of us wanted or expected, but we're moving. i was the first person to get the vaccine in the whole country. and now, how many people are vaccinated? over 200 million, right? that's what keeps me going, that i can feel the change. restaurants have opened their doors, shops and businesses are buzzing again all over the country. more jobs were created in 2021 than in any year in the last 80 years. we are stronger than we were a year ago today. we're bringing on new drivers...we're expanding. the fear that was there it's gone away. business is booming. it's exciting times for the auto industry. rebuilding our bridges, our roads, our transit systems. and the jobs...that's what this administration has been doing. from our toughest times, america has always built a brighter future. yes -- we are brave. brave enough to see the light. and be the light we need to rebuild this country. we are strong. we are courageous. we are resilient. we are america, land of the brave. i've long said it's never been a good bet to bet against america. and that's more true today than ever. i've never been more optimistic about america's future. there is nothing beyond our capacity if we do it together. new year, new start. and now comcast business is making it easy to get going with the ready. set. save. sale. get started with fast and reliable internet and voice for $64.99 a month with a 2-year price guarantee. it's easy... with flexible installation and backing from an expert team, 24/7. and for even more value, ask how to get up to a $500 prepaid card. get a great deal for your business with the ready. set. save. sale today. comcast business. powering possibilities. a rainy times square this morning. also rainy here in washington. the sun has yet to come up. boy, look at the lights and the colors in times square. a little more headlines at 52 past the hour. the white house chief medical adviser dr. anthony fauci says they could authorize the vaccine for children under the age of 5 in the next month. fauci says younger children will likely need three doses because two shots did not induce enough of an adequate response in 2 to 4-year-olds in pfizer's clinical trials. pfizer plans to submit data to the fda in the first half of the year if the study proves successful. starbucks is no longer requiring its u.s.-based workers to be vaccinated against covid-19 n. a memo sent to employees on tuesday the coffee company said it is a decision that is in response to last week's supreme court ruling, a 6-3 vote, that rejected the biden administration's plan to require vaccines or regular testing for companies with more than 100 workers. starbucks says it's a reversal from the policy announced earlier this month. and still ahead on "morning joe," joe's exclusive interview with white house chief of staff ron klain. plus, two members of the senate foreign relations committee, democrat jeanne shaheen and rob portman and the resolve to punish russia for an expected invasion of ukraine. "morning joe" is coming right back. f ukraine. "morning joe" is coming right back this is the new world of work. each day looks different than the last. but whatever work becomes, the servicenow platform will make it just, flow. whether it's finding new ways to help you serve your customers, orchestrating a safe return to the office... wait. an office? what's an office? ...or solving a workplace challenge that's yet to come. wherever the new world of work takes your business, the world works with servicenow. when a truck hit my car, wherever the new world of work takes your business, the insurance company wasn't fair. i didn't know what my case was worth. so i called the barnes firm. i was hit by a car and needed help. i called the barnes firm, that was the best call i could've made. i'm rich barnes. it's hard for people to know how much their accident case is worth. let our injury attorneys help you get the best result possible. ♪ the barnes firm injury attorneys ♪ ♪ call one eight hundred, eight million ♪ i would like to raise a delicate subject, but with the utmost respect for your life accomplishments and the high office you hold. a poll released this morning by politico morning consult found 49% of registered voters disagreeing with the statement joe biden is mentally fit. not even a majority of democrats who responded strongly affirmed that statement. the question i have for you, sir, if you'd let me finish, why do you suppose such large segments of the american electorate have come to harbor such profound concerns about your cognitive fitness? thank you. >> i have no idea. >> i think the takeaway from that is that he actually went to steve ducey at fox -- what's his name? what's his son's name? >> peter. >> not steve. we know steve very well. >> steve is very nice. >> it's happening to me. i've lost my memory. that happened a long time ago. willie, you know i'm not good with names with these people, but i called one of them geor. he went to the fox guy and the newsmax guy, that it was true he met the alien. so give him credit for going to people he knew was going to come at him with crazy questions. >> you watched newsmax's lineup that was as tame a question. but when your editor says you have to ask about cognitive ability you do what you have to do. he spent nearly two hours fielding questions. people said oh, he's only picking on the people approved. he went and took a question from anyone in the room who would ask one, to his credit. we've discussed problems with the answers he gave in some cases but he did spend two hours answering questions from everyone who asked one. >> yes, he did. >> was that a newsmax or a fox news question? >> yes. newsmax. >> so i just got everything wrong. >> that's okay, the question is was that same reporter in the trump news conference and did he ask the same question? probably not. let's move on. joining us now the ranking republican on the senate homeland security committee, senator rob portman of ohio is here. he's the co-chair of the senate ukraine caucus and democratic member of the foreign relations committee senator jeanne shaheen of new hampshire. she serves as the vice chair and we are honored to have you both here. >> it is great to have you both here. i will ask you the same question i asked ambassador mcfaul. the biden administration said earlier an invasion is an invasion is an invasion. afterwards jen psaki put out a white house statement that said -- well, if any russian military forces move across the ukrainian border that's a renewed invasion and it will be met with a swift, severe and united response. during the press conference the president talks about slight or mild invasion -- incursion. >> are we in a worst position today with russia and putin than before that slip-up or do the statements before and after send a message to putin? >> i think it's confusing not just to vladimir putin but our allies, ukraine. you heard their comments. it was unfortunate and it was unhelpful. i thought the cleanup was pretty strong. he made some other statements including predicting there will be an attack. nobody knows that. >> why do you think he did that? >> i think trying to prepare the american people for that possibility. that's not what we're about right now. we're about deterrence, how unified we are, how there will be devastating consequences should vladimir putin and russia decide to make this terrible mistake. >> could you explain how devastating the consequences could be, because we didn't get that last night at the press conference. but russia, god help us if we have another dustup with russia, i would like to us have more normalized relations -- >> we've tried. >> we have tried again and again and again and they keep -- georgia, moldova. talk about the severe consequences if russia does go in. >> number one, devastating sanctions the president has called unprecedented. the thought is financial sanctions that we have not previously used and this would not just be terrible for the russian economy but vladimir putin and his associates. second the military in ukraine is very different than it was in 2014 thanks in part to nato training, to the military weapons that are already there and, third, should there be an invasion that we, the united states, and other allies including, i hope, nato will fortify eastern europe in ways we've never done before and the president has been clear about that, there will be additional troops and military assets sent. not just ukraine having the ability. it will be a bloody conflict. it will be difficult. as you know russia is concerned about body bags going back east and even concerned with crimea which was a time in 2014 the ukrainians were not ready and we were not ready. >> and they have good reason to be concerned about that going into 2022. let me ask you, senator shaheen, about the president's, i believe, unfortunate comments regarding our allies. he said the quiet part out loud, having trouble with germany, with france. they are not shoulder to shoulder with us, unfortunately, at this critical time. what do we need to do? what does the president need to do to get germany and france in line? and i will say that, get them in line to help prevent an invasion of ukraine. >> we had a chance to meet yesterday morning. the delegation that went to ukraine, and he was very engages and we talked about our allies and clearly we need to have a united front. that's the best deterrent for vladimir putin. there's been a huge diplomatic effort ongoing for the last several months to shuttle diplomacy, to make sure our allies are aware as we are of what the intelligence says against the threat to ukraine. they are becoming more aware. obviously we would like to have more agreement on what kinds of sanctions would be invoked should putin go into russia in any form. the president yesterday was very clear we will do everything possible to hold russia accountable, and that means providing assistance to ukraine, it means working to unite our allies and it means supporting whatever happens in ukraine should russia invade. >> willie? >> senator portman, as you know, president putin has shrugged off sanctions every time they've come his way over the years. if the united states puts harsh be sanctions on him, he may shrug them off and continue his work in ukraine with that invasion. so what else is on the table from where you're sitting? what more could be done and what are the implications for people watching today, for americans? what happens? are there american soldiers who might be in harm's way, for example? >> willie, first, unprecedented sanctions, it would be something new. i kind of agree the russian economy has become sanction proofed because they've moved assets, which might now be something we can go after. so we need to be tougher about it. you've heard discussion of the so-called swift sanctions which has to do with electronic transfers on the financial services side. there are some things we could do we've never done before but having our allies with us is critical. unilateral sanctions. second, we need to have unity among our allies and that includes providing military assistance so ukraine can defend itself. >> what do we need from germany? >> let's talk about germany. it's a great question. three things, the ability for other nato countries to transfer arms to ukraine. they are blocking transfer of arms. >> why? >> because under nato agreements and the nato procurement system they are permitted to do that. >> but i'm asking, though, why would germany -- is it all energy? >> i would ask you to ask them, but i suppose they think it's provocative. 100,000 troops amassed on your border and more equipment and troops coming every day is provocative. >> yes, it is. >> i'm not sure how they would be further provoked. ukraine saying, please, respect our territory's integrity. second discussion about whether they're allowing over flights. the british cargo that we saw -- >> on the tarmac. >> the c-17 with anti-tank weapons, they had to go around german airspace because germany wouldn't permit it. some say that isn't true. you could see the transponder and they went around germany. that's outrageous. the third is the pipeline which is an issue republicans and democrats tend to differ. should there be an incursion, an invasion, the pipeline needs to be cut off. >> do you agree? >> germany has not said that would happen. >> i was a co-sponsor with ted cruz of the original bill, but the difference is that right now the most important thing is to try to present that united front. we don't want to take away the threat of sanctions against putin and we want to stand with our allies. i think there's no dote that there's strong bipartisan opposition to the long-term operation. it's not in the interests of the energy security of europe or germany. >> katty kay? >> senator shaheen, there is the new german foreign minister is a member of the green party and has been saying the kinds of things that may leave us room for negotiation over energy and seems less wedded to the policy of protecting that. there's a very interesting -- that has come out from the uk minister. he says if russia moves into ukraine we have to think what does that mean for all of us in europe, what it means the next time. if russia were to move into ukraine as president biden said last night, as the british defenseman minister fears he might do, are we looking at world war iii? paint the picture of why americans should sit up and take notice if this happens? >> this is the potential for the biggest conflict in europe since world war ii. if putin does not stop here, we saw what he did in georgia, what he tried to do in moldova, in the balkans to create disruption there. we are hearing from our eastern european allies, about their concerns and there is no guarantee on where he's going to stop and we can't allow vladimir putin and russia to decide for a sovereign country what their future will be. that's in the interests of every country in the transatlantic alliance. i think this is a real watershed moment and one of the things we heard from the ukrainians when we were there, they are ready to fight. this is not the same ukraine putin went into in 2014 when he seized crimea, where a lot of people were very supportive of russia, who were ambivalent about their future. they have a ukrainian identity. we need to make clear, and they need to make clear, and i think they are, to putin, they are ready to fight for their country. >> senator, i want to change subjects briefly -- >> may i mention something? i think this is global. i think this is not just about the stability of europe but if you talk to other countries they're scared to death of this. this is about the fight for freedom and it's about us saying as americans and as our allies around the world, the free world in general that we're not going to mitt this sort of thing. what happens to places like taiwan? what happens with regard to places in, let's say, latin america, even, where we have countries that are threatening other countries that are democracies. let's say that we do allow this to happen. what does it say both to those countries that would feel threatened and those aggressors? i think this is a bigger issue. i agree entirely with what senator shaheen said about the fact this does affect europe in a substantial way. >> and nato. >> let's finish changing topics quickly, about bbb, when you left the white house i believe you left and there were some provisions that would be anti-inflationary that raised some eyebrows on the right. what were you talking about? >> the infrastructure bill. >> oh, the infrastructure bill. >> i strongly believe that because the economic analysis shows these are long-term capital investments that will be more productive and counter inflationary. >> what about inflationary concerns for pre-k if that were passed? >> it's all about stimulus. what happens if you put more stimulus in the economy at a time when we already have supply issues. you're going to cause more inflation this is what larry summers said early on, democrats and republican, and that's clearly what happened. the $1.9 trillion was stimulus. bbb is stimulus. we need to back off on the stimulus and get our supply chain in order which was due to covid not anything the administration did. but they did push the stimulus side which created this incredible inflation we have right now that's affecting everybody. >> and senator shaheen, talk on the hill, democrats talking about splitting up bbb and maybe passing it piecemeal in ways you could get ten republican votes, is that a good strategy for democrats moving forward? >> i think the important thing is to get some of these investments done in ways that will be important to the country. early childhood education is one of those. and the build back better bill has all of those programs paid for. so the stimulus piece, i think, is important but the investment piece, making some changes that will better make our tax code fairer are really important in the long term. >> and, finally, senator portman, the cleveland plain dealer had an editorial that said, baby, please don't go. >> yeah, they can't quit you. >> they cannot quit you. >> they want you to reconsider -- >> will you reconsider your retirement? >> they weren't nearly as nice to me -- >> very funny. >> i've made my decision. good to see you both. >> thank you for coming in, both of you. senator portman and senator shaheen, thank you both. still ahead, the security denies the request to block the release of white house documents, what it means for the investigation into the attack at the capitol. joe's exclusive sitdown with white house chief of staff ron klain. unusual. don't usually hear from ron klain. you'll see that as you're watching "morning joe." y hear f klain. you'll see that as you're watching "morning joe. need to get your prescriptions 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wait. an office? what's an office? ...or solving a workplace challenge that's yet to come. wherever the new world of work takes your business, the world works with servicenow. welcome back. just a short time before president biden's news conference i sat down with the white house chief of staff, ron klain. here's our conversation. >> thank you for sitting down and talking. >> thanks for having me. >> i wonder if you like the timing of your one-year anniversary. >> i think we've had a year of historic accomplishment. the unemployment rate has fallen more this year. this is the first time in 20 years our economy has grown faster than china's. so we're seeing a lot of progress on the economy. the same thing with covid. 210 million americans fully vaccinated in a single year. 80 million with boosters, a new program to pass out tests and masks. voters say we have done a lot but there's still more to do. until we're in a better place they're not going to give us credit for those achievements. it is a record of historic achievement on covid, on the economy and a lot of other issues. >> a lot of americans wanted competency in the white house, a return to normalcy. you look at the poll numbers, they're not feeling that, why? >> i don't think america is back to normal. we're having to wear masks indoors, restrictions, pay more at the grocery store. the president and the vice president put in place a plan on covid, on the economy on other issues that will allow to us get back there. when we came in, joe, the economy was creating 50,000 jobs a month. we've been over 5,000 a month since we've been here. 75% of adults in the country are fully vaccinated. is the job done? no. that's why we elect presidents for four-year terms not one-year. there's a lot more work left to be done. >> so the biden administration admitted it was surprised by the delta variant, it also seemed to be caught off guard by omicron. why were you all not better prepared for omicron especially on the testing front? >> first of all, we weren't surprised by delta and were prepared for a future variant after that. what we did we ramped up dramatically on tests. >> why was it so hard for americans to find tests, though, going into the christmas vacation? >> well, because we ramped up dramatically -- there were zero at-home tests. zero. this pandemic had been going on for a year and there were zero at-home tests. we got up to 350 million at-home tests in december. the virus was bigger than that. that incredibly fast ramp-up wasn't fast enough. that's why the president said we will add 500 million more, we launched the website, covidtests.gov. we set up 20,000 in-person testing sites, there were 2,000 when we got here -- >> were you caught off guard by omicron or delta at all? >> we have been ramping up rapidly. with amazing, unparalleled speed. the virus got faster than us in december. no question about it. >> should americans expect another variant? should they be prepared for another variant down the road? >> we're prepared. we're increasing the production of tests, of masks. the president announced today there will be 400 million high-quality kn95/n95 masks available for free at drugstores, at community health centers. we have to be prepared for whatever comes next. i think one of the big breakthroughs, we have more on order than any country in the world this new pfizer pill that even if you aren't vaccinated and get covid, we can prevent it from being a fatal disease. there are a lot of steps left. we're making progress every day. we have done a lot to make progress in fighting this virus. a year ago i wasn't fully vaccinated. we're in a place where 75% of the country dons have that fear nick. >> i look at joe biden and i see a guy that was elected as the one moderate while others were promising to return america and to give free health care, look at eric adams up in new york, the same thing. moderation is selling in the democratic party. so why is it seems time and time again the president's overreached, moved too far left, and is not able to bring the two senators home? >> i think the president is right in the middle of where the country is. you look at what's in our build back better plan, bringing down the cost of child care is a moderate thing for families, reducing the cost of prescription drugs, you shouldn't have to pay more than $35 for insulin. that's an all american mainstream proposal. >> are you going to split that up? you're right, every one of those bills would be really hard for republicans to oppose. are you considering this next year splitting -- >> somehow republicans are opposing them. they are standing up and blocking action on the things i've talked about, a tax cut for middle-class families, the child tax credit, on republic deucing the burden of providing care -- >> would it be harder to stand up a standalone bill on insulin, on pre-k. i know a lot of moderate democrats want to you break out the bbb bill. are you considering that? >> we're trying to find the fastest way to pass it. we think there is a pass in the senate to pass the bill. on the one hand look at what happens to house representatives, every single democrat, liberal, moderate, conservative democrats, every single one except one voted for that build back better bill. that shows the unity i've never seen in my prior ten years at the white house where every democrat lines up and says, hey, this represents the center, the core of our party, what we need to do to help families. there are families out there, joe, that need this help. they need help with universal preschool. why is anyone against that? shouldn't every kid in this country have the chance to have a good education starting at age 3, 4, and 5. >> joe manchin said he would support that stand alone. is that a possibility? if the biden administration and democrats can deliver universal pre-k as a guarantee that would be an extraordinary accomplishment, an extraordinary achievement by itself. >> we need help with child care and eldercare. the reason we are doing it as a package, that enables us to use reconciliation. common sense things that requires us to use this tool to get them passed under senate rules. there is a great chance we can get this passed and deliver. >> why was joe manchin so personally insulted what happened before christmas break? >> you'll have to ask senator manchin that. i really enjoyed get to go know him this year. he was a key ally for us in passing the rescue plan. one thing we've done that hasn't gotten a lot of attention is confirmed more federal judges than any president in four decades. he voted for every single one of those judges. we're disappointed where he stands on voting rights. i think he has been a strong ally of ours. we will work with him whenever we can. we'll have our disagreements. we're honest about that. those disagreements are real. they're important. voting rights is a critical issue. i wish he would get there with us. >> you've been criticized, the administration, the president has been criticized for not doing more on voting rights. what else could you all have done than what you've already done? >> the president had voting rights in his joint address to congress last april. he gave a speech in philadelphia. it's a hard fight. it's an important fight. we're going to have a vote in the senate tonight -- we're taping this in the afternoon -- and we'll have a vote tonight. we're not going to give up the fight even if we lose the vote. we'll continue to press. the president likes to talk about the fact he was in the senate, one of the leaders in the senate the last time they took up the act was 98-0. all the republicans, all the democrats did it. not sure why the republicans are voting so hard against renewing it this time. >> the john lewis voting rights act, passing that -- how important is reforming the electoral count act. it's one of the few things i've seen them agree on. get it done. >> preventing subversion of election, the idea someone would just throw out the count or ignore the results is a very important thing to get done. so too, prtecting voting rights. >> is it possible that could be a stand alone bill? >> i think right now we want to try to get all these protections enacted. that's our goal. >> let's talk about ukraine. what more can the administration do to stop a russian invasion which would require this administration to make extraordinarily difficult decisions. >> the choice between diplomacy and de-escalation or serious consequences if he proceeds, and we've laid that out. we had a week of diplomacy in europe. we're going to make it clear that if he does this there will be serious and grave consequences, not just the united states but with our allies. >> and can our european allies do more? can germany do more? can france do more than they're doing right now? >> on ukraine? >> on ukraine, enabling the russians. >> we're working closely with them. i'm confident the allies will present a united front in combatting this threat from president putin. >> ron, thank you so much. greatly appreciate it. >> my conversation with white house chief of staff ron klain yesterday before president biden's news conference. >> the most consequential development yet in the house investigation in the january 6 attack on the capitol. the supreme court rejects former president trump's request to withhold materials. those developments are next on "morning joe." those developments are next on "morning joe." my name is d . i'm a writer/director and i'm still working. in the kind of work that i do, you are surrounded by people who are all younger than you. i had to get help somewhere along the line to stay competitive. i discovered prevagen. i started taking it and after a period of time, my memory improved. it was a game-changer for me. prevagen. healthier brain. better life. ♪ ♪ ♪ -capsule! -capsule! -capsule! capsule saves me money on prescriptions. capsule took care of my insurance. capsule delivered my meds to my doorstep. capsule is super safe and secure. get your prescriptions hand delivered for free at capsule.com biden: this is the challenge get your prescriptions hand delivered for free of our collective lifetime. and every day we delay, the cost of inaction increases. we have the ability to invest in ourselves and build an equitable, clean energy future, and in the process, create millions of good-paying jobs and opportunities around the world. there's no more time to hang back or sit on the fence or argue amongst ourselves. so let this be the moment that we answer history's call. this is elodia. she's a recording artist. 1 of 10 million people that comcast has connected to affordable internet in the last 10 years. and this is emmanuel, a future recording artist, and one of the millions of students we're connecting throughout the next 10. through projectup, comcast is committing $1 billion so millions more students, past... and present, can continue to get the tools they need to build a future of unlimited possibilities. growing up, bilal was obsessed, obsessed with superman! not because he could fly, but because superman stood up for people. maybe it's because of our family's own immigrant story, or he's just that nerdy. throughout his career in the obama administration and the private sector, bilal has never stopped helping others. we don't need a superhero to solve san francisco's biggest problems like crime and homelessness, just the innovation and courage to lead. join me. there was big news out of the supreme court which denied former president trump's request to block the release of white house documents to the january 6 select committee. under the claim of executive privilege. the panel already has begun receiving the long-awaited records according to a committee statement. the decision was nearly noon as justice clarence thomas was the sole member voting in favor of blocking the release and publicly objecting to it. the brief order written by john roberts upheld the appeals court decision that trump would not be able to prevent the release of the documents even if he were the current president, a determination based from the watergate era that forced president nixon to turn over the oval office tapes. the question whether a former president can maintain privilege when the current one denies it was not considered by the supreme court. justice brett kavanaugh wrote in support of a former president's continued claim of privilege in some circumstances but just said it does not apply here. a statement reads this way, the supreme court's action tonight is a victory for the rule of law and american democracy. the records will not be released to the public. so, joe, what we're talking about are notes from the chief of staff mark meadows in and around january 6, plans they were making, explanations of why they thought the 2020 election was unfair and that it ought to be overturned this is all the inner workings of the white house now available and a lot of it already in the hands of the select committee. >> yeah, a big win for not only the select committee but for those who want to know exactly what happened on january the 6th and that i thought the decision was skillfully written. i even agreed with brett kavanaugh's explanation. he was, of course, with the majority but decided -- and i'm glad he did because he, kavanaugh said, just because a current president doesn't recognize a former president's claim of executive privilege, it doesn't, basically, undermine that claim because then suddenly even the claim of executive privilege becomes partisan. so i thought this decision was well written, well explained, and gives the january 6th commission what they need. >> it does. i'm still concerned about the clock being run out on the january 6th commission but the supreme court ruling which is fairly clear and fairly swift, hopefully a similar ruling with mark meadows being subpoenaed to testify to the committee which is absolutely key. he is in the thick of things on january the 6th. he was cooperating, then he withdrew his cooperation. it needs to be enforced. >> john, a big win for the january 6th commission, right? >> yeah, huge. i don't want to parrot their language too much in the statement but i do think a really important win for rule of law, a win for history, an important win in terms of precedent. if you think about what this committee has to get done, and i'm with ed about still being concern about the clock being run out, you think of all these people, the progress, the aggressive posture the committee has taken over the course of the last couple of months with all these requests for information, the subpoenas that have gone out, the signals of future subpoenas going out, all of those things trying to call people in. that could take a very long time as each one of the people decides to fight. they come in and testify, they take the fifth. those things may or may not yield actual information to the committee. what will yelled actual information, actionable information, real clarity about what was going on in the white house are these records. this will be mostly a paper case. being able to access those documents is crucial. i can't imagine a more important development for the mandated remit which is to figure out what the president's complicity was, the chief of staff's complicity. this is where you'll find the answers is most likely, not in the testimony of steve bannon or rudy giuliani but this paper will speak and now there is no barrier to getting those crucial, vital and revealing internal communications. it's coming in as of last night. and coming up we'll talk to actress goldie hawn about a different kind of leading role. for two decades she's been pioneering mental health programs for students, and with the pandemic that work is more important than ever. goldie hawn joins us straight ahead on "morning joe." ahead on "morning joe. one of my favorite supplements is qunol turmeric. turmeric helps with healthy joints and inflammation support. unlike regular turmeric supplements qunol's superior absorption helps me get the full benefits of turmeric. the brand i trust is qunol. ♪♪ ♪♪ 46 past the hour. we are learning more about the extent to which the far right group the oath keepers was prepared to fight, the certification of president biden's electoral victory. in new court filings prosecutors accuse the group of stockpiling a massive amount of weapons and ammunition ahead of the january 6th attack on the capitol last year. according to the documents filed yesterday, the oath keepers had enough supplies to last 30 days including, prosecutors say, at least three luggage carts worth of gun boxes, rifle cases, and suitcases filled with ammunition. the organization stored all the weapons in a virginia hotel as part of a quick reaction force should its members need backup as they stormed the capitol. lawyers for several of the defendants have said their clients deny having planned to storm the capitol or overthrow the government. wow. we'll keep you posted on that. willie, our next guest is someone you spoke with for your sunday sitdown, goldie hawn. >> yes, the beloved oscar-winning goldie hawn. you know her from all the movies you love, but the initiative she's perhaps most proud of is something called mind up. almost 20 years since she started it and it focuses on the mental health and well-being of kids, schools, families and has that ever been more important than it is right now in the middle of this long pandemic. we will talk to goldie hawn next on "morning joe." o goldie hawn t on "morning joe. ♪ ♪making your way in the world today♪ ♪takes everything you've got♪ ♪ ♪taking a break from all your worries ♪ ♪sure would help a lot ♪ ♪wouldn't you like to get away? ♪ ♪ ♪ sometimes you want to go ♪ ♪where everybody knows your name ♪ ♪ ♪and they're always glad you came ♪ this is the new world of work. each day looks different than the last. but whatever work becomes, the servicenow platform will make it just, flow. whether it's finding new ways to help you serve your customers, orchestrating a safe return to the office... wait. an office? what's an office? ...or solving a workplace challenge that's yet to come. wherever the new world of work takes your business, the world works with servicenow. over the last 80 years we have seen a health revolution which has focused on the body. children all over the world have been taught the importance of a sound body, but what about the mind? mind up is leading this new revolution that focuses on the one organ that governs them all, the brain. by teaching children about their brains and how to care, nurture and most importantly rest their brains, we have a chance to help the next generations not just experience their world, but to create a better one. join us on this journey. >> goldie hawn's mind up for life is going digital. the signature program of the goldie hawn foundation has now launched an online platform designed to help address the global youth mental health crisis and the founder of mind up, academy award winning actress goldie hawn joins us now. i watched you on willie's show. it's so great to have you on. and i love mind up. i think the children across the world are all impacted so greatly by the pandemic that the mental health crisis is now at a point where almost every child has been touched. can you tell us about how going digital might help with that? >> well, first of all, it's been a dream of mine, right, to do this a long time -- going to schools, training schools, having teachers go to schools is lovely and in-person and wonderful but it's very heavy lifting. so the idea that we're going to be getting the program into schools is all about what we want to do in terms of scaling, okay? so it's the idea how do you scale these programs? and that's one of the bigger sort of, i guess, challenges that we have is you've got the great program, you want to be able to scale it. you want everyone to be able to have it. it works. it's evidence-based, you know, it's incredibly helpful for children, and also to give them the ability to manage themselves, right? so having digital is that we've already got 27 countries interested in actually doing the program, point being access it, you can get what you need from it, the teachers can actually get certified in mind up, take it to their schools. so there's no traveling, per se, but it's definitely also bifurcated so also you can have a teacher with you online and also the online program. but also there's a whole program for parents and that's another big issue to talk about because parenting is everything, as you know. >> it is. >> so we've brought help in all kinds of different areas. >> with the parenting, i wonder, this is probably brilliant because they need guidance. i mean, i saw you in the video there meditating with very young children. i know a family, one of my kids went to dinner there and they meditated before dinner for three minutes. what a great idea, but also teaching young children to rest the brain. >> right. because it's a brain break. we don't call it meditation because meditation is a little different, you know? i mean, it's similar and you're taking time out to regenerate really your brain, wake up it, actually. people think it's going to sleep, but it's not, it's actually calibrating your left and right brain and actually over time will -- in your cortex. so it's shown to being incredibly beneficial. we are not a meditation or mindfulness, what one would say, we're really based in neuroscience and the reason is that when a child understands their brain or we adults understand our brain, then we're able to manage it better. so they feel more personally connected to that amazing sort of organ that we have, the muscle, right? so that's what makes it a little different where we do brain breaks because every brain needs a break, we do it three times a day in the classroom, but it's not, you know, anything that's spiritual, it's really how we tend to our brain and it's a beautiful thing. it's so program really that has changed children's lives, also parents, and it's a very, very important to do that, to build really a better world, otherwise how are we going to get our children to be able to learn, to look at problems that are, you know, 30,000 feet up and make decisions and analyze. and most of all, get along with people, the ability of this -- us and them and so forth, it actually changes quite a bit. they work in a community in the classroom and i think we would like to have our world work that way, we would be able to make much greater strides when we do. mental health is everything. >> goldie, it's katty kay here. i'm so interested that you're basing this in neuroscience, not just that you're basing the program in neuroscience but you're actually taking neuroscience to the children. i think a lot of people may think kids are too young to learn about the brain. tell me how you get them engaged and actually learning about their brains. i think it's such a great idea that they are getting exposed to the science. >> what we do is that we started young, i started young. i wanted to build brain rather than to band-aid anything. so early, early education is where we are, okay? and that's where children learn about their amygdala, they love their amygdala. it is part of the brain that there is a barking dog and they learn that the amygdala is important, it saves us, it's there for a reason, but there is no lions, tigers and bears, oftentimes there's sadness or anxiety or anger or uncertainty and they know that when they feel that that the barking dog takes away all of the light, if you will, to the prefrontal cortex which is the wise old owl. so the wise old owl really can't hear and can't make decisions because the dog is barking too loud. they do their brains like they're doing the breathing. they really understand the power of breath now, they know that it calms them down and knows that it helps them learn better because of pfc, which they call it, is really online now, right? and they learn about the hippocampus and that is where we remember. so it's the part of our memory. it's the part of how we do remember. so we know that when we're not anxious we can remember better for school, for learning and so forth. also they learn about dopamine, we do the dopamine dance because dopamine gets emitted when you do acts of kindness, when you're laughing, feeling loved. dopamine is such a productive neuro transmitter and they learn about that. so we get happy, we do the dopamine dance. it's really important that everything we do in the program is connected to their academia. so when we do mindful of our senses, we can write, you know, things on it, we can write little essays, we can discuss these things and it keeps them focused because the brain loses attention. we lose our attention -- a girlfriend of mine wrote "peak mind." it really talks about attention and how our brain is really -- it's a challenge to pay attention, but our children are more able to pay attention for longer periods of time. so it's all about brain fitness, that's all it is. and what we have to do is create more brain fitness so our children are more resilient, they're more -- they listen better, they are more attentive and we have more fun. so the optimum experience is someone who can listen. hi, willie. >> goldie, hi. good to see you. unfortunately we're out of time but luckily i spoke to you last week for an hour about this. i encourage people to go to the sunday sit-down podcast to hear the full interview. so many people were moved by your interview on our show, goldie and were asking how to get involved, teachers asking, families asking, so they can go to mindup.org to the website and i encourage people to listen to our conversation. mind up for life is the signature program of the goldie hawn foundation. goldie, so great to see you and great to talk to you last week, thanks for being with us this morning. >> awesome. thank you, guys. i wish i could see you in person. i will one day. >> we will do it again soon. thanks. that does it for us this morning, we will see you right back here tomorrow morning. for now chris jansing picks up the coverage. ♪♪