Transcripts For MSNBC Zerlina 20240709 : comparemela.com

Transcripts For MSNBC Zerlina 20240709



confirmation from the kentucky governor confirming it was a deadly night of destruction active and deadly tornados. >> i fear there are more than 50 dead in kentucky. confirmation still coming in. we're going to lose over 50 people, probably closer to somewhere between 70 and 100. it's devastating. this shows you what we believe will be the longest tornado touchdown in terms of distance in our history. you all the way down to the bottom of the screen, and that's where it first touched down, and then it stayed on the ground, that entire line, causing significant devastation. this is incredibly rare to see, and it is one of the reasons that this was so devastating here in kentucky. >> so we just heard from the kentucky governor, they fear there could be as many as 70 to 100 dead from the night of tornados. we know there are about four tornadoes total, the one the governor just talked about, a 227-mile tornado touchdown. it stayed down. we know one of the areas hardest hit in kentucky was mayfield, particularly a candle factory in mayfield where 110 people were inside at the time, the governor saying in that press conference, they believe they'll lose dozens of people in that billing alone who were working the second shift. people were given advance warn, but the governor said this with us a storm of the likes we have never seen, calling it a widespread weather event. water trucks are on the way to impacted areas. shelters are being set up. the video is just incredible. way tonight go right now to richard lui who's listening closely to the press conference. richard, i know one of the horrifying facts to you is 227 miles when yushdly a tornado stace on the ground for a couple of miles. >> the governor delivered, lindsey, with great calm, but that number is gargantuan. it's not only roughly half the width of the state, which is about 400 miles, but 200 miles on the ground. one tornado, of course, i'll have to verify this. they'll have to do this when the sun rises. they'll get the data from the national weather service. the average of a typical tornado, if you can say there is one, according to the national weather service, lindsey, is about one or two miles on the ground. so this thing, if it is actually as long as they estimate it to be as you saw in that one full screen, the one slide that the governor was showing, is 100 to 200 times greater than average, and we don't even know the width. but we heard from emergency management officials out of kentucky during that same very briefing, 25 minutes long as we were watching it overnight is that he was comparing it to what we call the great 1925 tornadoes. that's march 18th, 1925. in that particular incident on that day, they did see one tornado that was up to a mile wide. now, they didn't indicate how wide this particular 200-long-mile path was, but you can just imagine because the typical tornado width is 50 yards. so when they say this could break all records, and it seems like they definitely do believe so, the unfortunate reality of all that, lindsey, is the number that they fear are injured or have died, closer to 70 to 100 people is what the governor said and what you were saying as well. the numbers are clearly in big question. and when the sun rises in about an hour and 45 minutes, that's when they can, if you will, get out the slide rulers. they can figure out what exactly happened there in tornado alley. you know, it's been just a really rough night certainly for emergency management officials. national guard did also come out at about 5:15 a.m. you're watching it as well. and what we heard from them is they're already bringing in the water trucks when they see this kind of damage. i was listening to some eyewitness accounts. what you see on our screen here is what they're seeing with wide swaths. so not like hunt and pick. this is wide swaths of everything being flattened. you heard the words before, it looks like a war zone. those are words being used by eyewitnesses on the ground. again, this is just kentucky. this is a quad state, at least according to what we're hearing from the kentucky emergency management officials damage situation. so four state at least. as you were mentioning, there are other potential areas of damage, not only the candle factory that's in the state. there is also the amazon warehouse that's in neighboring areas in illinois, for instance, north, where they had at least 100 emergency vehicles getting to that location. they believe that most of this particular warehouse, an area -- a wall that has -- according to the "associated press," the length of a football field completely collapsing as well as the roof itself. so a lot of unknown questions because they just have these certain areas where they can get light up. of course, when you have in addition to that tens of thousands if not hundreds of thousands of people without power in this area, what we were saying yesterday is that the estimation is this particular storm could affect 16 million people. the number could have gone down by now. according to the national weather service, according to their hazardous weather outlook, they expect the tornado watch to be in effect until 9:00 a.m. eastern. so we still have three more hours, lindsey, of potential damage if the national weather service and, again, their tornado watch stays in effect. >> right. richard, for anybody joining us, we are discussing the overnight devastating tornados that impacted the central u.s. caused tornado warnings in five different states. at one point more than 200,000 homes and businesses without power. we know aid is on the way, water trucks, shelters being set up as well. we know kentucky was hit particularly hard overnight. we also know, for example, as richard was saying, the am is son facility in illinois, their roof was ripped off. in arkansas, a nursing home was hit killing at least one person. and particularly mayfield in the western part of kentucky has been particularly hit hard. it's only a town of about 1,000 people. the death toll across the state could be 50, but could rise to 70 to 100 by the time the devastation and the damage is surveyed when dawn breaks. just as richard was saying, we know the storm system is still sparking tornados right now. several states are under a tornado watch until 11:00 a.m. richard, as we're watching just these devastating images here, what other help did the governor say was on the way for these people? >> when we were listening to the people, again, that was about an hour ard. they were getting on the ground as of midnight when they were deploying. that's a good measure of time they were able to deploy all of their resources. according to resources who mentioned there was help on the ground in kentucky, they felt that help in terms of the number of emergency and first responder vehicles that were there were numerous. i heard one account i was listening to of an eyewitness who was close to that candle factory saying that, indeed, they say dozens, close to a hundred emergency vehicles that were already on location. so the state of emergency which was declared around 1:00 a.m., lindsey, therefore, gave them about three or four hours if, again, we're following the clock up until now. but the national guard saying they were able to deploy their forces and resources in time. we heard two water trucks. there could be more that are certainly being mobilized right now. but with the state of emergency now being five hours old in the state of kentucky alone is what i'm alluding to here, the number of resources and personnel on the ground had some time to prepare and get there. as you were mentioning earlier, the governor was warning the state earlier in the day, this is going to be potentially a historic event. and that, of course, activated more of the resources in the state. but in terms of reflection of where that big tornado that they were mentioning, just one of the four, it was tracking directly toward where the governor was based, where he was giving his reports today. it lifted, according to the map that they were showing, you know, about what could be maybe 40, 50 miles away from the capital and where he was at. but that was certainly something he was watching as it was heading toward where they were at emergency management early this morning, lindsey. but the resources now deployed. it's going to be, of course, in addition to that all of the utilities that have to get out and try to get electricity and utilities back working in these various parts of the state. by the way, finally, i was looking at the population density of the area of this mega tornado that could be that they're talking about. good thing, as you were looking at the density, it wassen to head toward the more denser parts of kentucky. there were a couple of spots along that way that could certainly be concerned of where the tornadoes could be touching down on, but for the most part, when they were showing us the map of the red circles, it was areas that had lower population densities, lindsey. >> certainly they got advance warnings, but the storms were hitting when it was dark out. some may have gone to bed. it was about 8:30 at night. we do see somebody being pulled. this is video coming in from overnight. this is devastating. the facts even more devastating. we're going to have much more coming up on msnbc coming up at the top of the hour. my thanks to richard lui. we'll get you back to your regular broadcast. u back to your regular broadcast. ng america. and now through the subaru share the love event, we're helping even more. by the end of this year, subaru will have donated over two hundred and twenty five million dollars to charity. this is what it means to be more than a car company. this is what it means to be subaru. ♪ limu emu... & doug ♪ ♪ superpowers from a spider bite? i could use some help showing the world how liberty mutual customizes their car 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(gasps) ♪ did it work? only pay for what you need ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪ spider-man no way home in theaters december 17th at fidelity, your dedicated advisor will help you create a comprehensive wealth plan for your full financial picture. with the right balance of risk and reward. so you can enjoy more of...this. this is the planning effect. 24 hours before the insurrection, donald trump laid out various options to try to keep trump in office even though he lost the election. he could declare a national security emergency to delay a certification of votes or he could claim that other countries had messed with the election and declare all electronic voting invalid, you know, totally normal stuff. that powerpoint presentation was among the thousands of documents submitted to the january 6th investigation by mark meadows. as a reminder, mark meadows went from cooperating with the house panel to refusing to cooperate with the house panel. now he's suing the members. next week, the house could refer mark meadows to the justice department for possible criminal prosecution on charges of contempt of congress like steve bannon. joining me now is former federal prosecutor and msnbc analyst. is there reason to believe that the doj will hit mark meadows with contempt of congress now that he's not cooperating? >> they should, zelena. if he had shown up and testified and answered every question that did not arguably implicate some privilege, either an executive privilege which he has by and large waived or privilege which he undeniably has because this is just the latest. this is just the latest in a conspiracy to create crimes in the united states. all of this put together has to be put against the backdrop of bill barr, donald trump's own attorney general, telling him there is no evidence undermining joe biden's win, so, you know, you can start from the proposition that everything they were doing after learning definitively this was not a rigged election was a crime. it was a conspiracy against the united states by overturning a presidential election, and mark meadows should go the way of steve bannon. he should be voted in contempt, referred for prosecution, and indicted. >> we spoke the day steve bannon was actually held in contempt on the day the doj took action against him. was that a signal that folks like mar meadows need to get in line here, and are you seeing any other signals from the doj that they're planning a bigger conspiracy something because there's so much information? it trickles out. it reminds me a bit of the russian investigation. it's coming out, trickling out, and it looks like it could make a crime. but the doj is the one who determines that. >> i hope the doj is conducting a vault-like investigation into all of this i know we see no outward signs of it, but, frankly, if it's being done right, we would not be seeing outward signs of it. bob mueller conducted his investigation in a vault. we knew because he was publicly appointed as special counsel to do so. i can't believe they could see a guy like jeffrey clark, for example, a high former doj official, announcing he committed crimes against the united states, and if he was forced to testify truthfully, he would incriminate himself, and the department of justice standing idly by and saying we're not going to investigate the crimes of one of our own former high officials. that doesn't make any sense to me. i think that are investigating. they would have lawyers. talks would occur, leaks would occur. then bewould hear what's going on. there are ways to do this. only presenting the testimony of, firefighter example, fbi agents to at this stage inform the grand jury of what they're learning before they begin subpoenas civilian witnesses such that it's bound to leak. so i believe it's ongoing. we just don't know about it yet. >> i will remember what you said here today if something should occur in the future because i think a lot of people are looking at all the details coming out, and they're like, you know, throwing up their hands because it appears that these folks have gotten away with it. but as you said, if there is an investigation, we would not know about it. so i want to ask you as well about the is ups. they subpoenaed six people including two men. robert peede jr., mac miller, brian jack, bryan lewis, ed martin, and kim. who are these people? >> the committee is fast and furious. it feels lewis the house investigation is heath up. they're deploying aides. they're moving through funders and planners of the january 6th rally that preceded the attack on the capitol, and i think there are well over 300 interviews now, and we sit here frustrated because we don't know what's going on behind those closed committee doors, but you know what, zerlina? this is precisely how it should be unfolding, and here's why. they're taking thousands and thousands and thousands of hours of depositions, and i don't think americans have the attention span if thousands of hours were being televised, for example, to sort of go through it themselves. they're cure rating this information. as liz cheney said, beginning in january, they're going to offer up weeks of public facing testimony that will bring to the attention of the america people in vivid detail what happened every minute of the day, not just at the capitol, but here's the important part, at the white house. so, you know, get ready for that show. get your popcorn. because i think that is when we're going to see in full color exactly what donald trump and his criminal associates are responsible for. >> well, e look forward to that da and i'll have good snacks ready. i always had good impeachment snacks. thank you for being here and helping. thank you for helping us understand all of this. police stay safe. >> joo coming up, the right to evoke is under attack, and so are the people who oversee our elections. one of them joins me next. we'll be right back. e of them j. we'll be right back. healthier is seeing a healthcae pro whenever you may need one. doctor: the fever should break... or...trying to. ♪♪ ♪ this is what healthier looks like ♪ ♪ my songs know what you did in the dark ♪ ♪ so light 'em up, up, up light 'em up, up, up ♪ ♪ light 'em up, up, up ♪ ♪ i'm on fire ♪ ♪ so light 'em up, up, up light 'em... ♪ like pulsing, electric shocks, sharp, stabbing pains, or an intense burning sensation. what is this nightmare? 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well, today president biden laid out his plan as he closed out his two-day summit for democracy. >> here at home, that means working to make real the full promise of america, including by enacting both the freedom to vote act and the john lewis voting right advancement act because what's true around the world is also true in the united states. the sacred right to vote, to vote freely, the right to have your vote counted as the threshold liberty for democracy. >> but in the aftermath of the 2020 election, we've seen it's not just the right to vote that's under attack. the people in charge of running elections are under attack too from death threats to armed protests, election officials across the country are literally putting their lives on the line to do their jobs. in colorado, the threats against secretary of state jenna griswold have been so constant and specific that she's now requests an annual budget of $200,000 to address security concerns. joining me now is colorado's secretary of state jena griswold. thanks for being here. >> of course. nice to see you, zer lina. >> you're asking for money and for folks to monitor threats. that sounds serious. what have you and your staff been dealing with over the past few months? >> well, election officials over the nation have been dealing with increased threats. you know, the big lie has morphed into the big threat with tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands of death threats and other threats going to election workers across the nation, and it's to a point, zerlina, that 30% of election workers countrywide say that they're scared to do their job. and in pennsylvania from the beginning of 2020, over 30% of election workers at the county level have actually resigned. so this is one of the attacks on democracy. it's trying to get good people who are there to make sure that every vote counts, to step down. so we take that seriously. and here in colorado, i've asked for increased funding to make sure that my office is safe and we're doing what we need to do to continue to do our job of overseeing elections. >> i think the irony here is that republicans basically are perpetuating the big lie under the guise that they're trying to boost election security, but the people who run elections like you are requested security for your own safety because of the violent threats that have stemmed from the big lie. i mean, how concerned are you about future elections given the threats out there and the normalization of the political violence as an option if you're upset about election results? >> well, i'm extremely concerned. i think these threats need to be taken very seriously. they've been really focused on largely democratic women secretaries of state. i know you referenced my colleagues in arizona and michigan. and largely secretaries of state who are leaning in, pushing back against the voter suppression, pushing back against the attacks on democracy, are facing threats to our lives. i am concerned. i think the doj needs to take it seriously. they're processing those who are causing violence. states need to take it seriously. again, this is part of a larger ee tack. we're seeing the slow erosion of america democracy. this is a piece of it, but the alarm bells should be going off for the entire country, especially the u.s. senate that could pass voting rights reform. >> well, i hope those swing votes in the u.s. senate are listening to your warnings. you said in an interview last week that these warning signs, they're blinking red for a slow motion coup. earlier we were talking to glenn kirschner about a power poipt that laid out a coup. are we watching them set themselves up for stealing an election coming up next year and also the one coming out in 2024, and they're doing it out in the open? it's not in a secret powerpoint, it's just happening? >> that's exactly right. none of this is behind closed doors. it's all very visual, and we're seeing the groundwork making it harder for voters to vote in 2022 in the future, we're seeing bills to subvert the vote. arizona is considering a bill that would allow the legislature to overturn the will of the people. we're seeing the attack on elections themselves from election officials to insider threats to people like steve bannon recruiting in election deniers to volunteer to sign up for jobs in our offices or as poll watchers. and the attack on confidence. so the next time there is a january 6th, it will be harder for americans to have their voice heard to start off with and it will be harder to stop it. that's why it's so important to me that we're sounding the alarms right now. and the last thing i'll say on this is that in every swing state where we have a secretary of state's race, there is someone running who is spreading the big lie. we need to make sure election administrators believe in democracy. i encourage all of your viewers to really pay attention in 2022. >> imagine that the line we need everybody to meet is believing in democracy. that's a really true testament to the state of affairs, but i think to your point, the emergency that we are in. secretary jena griswold. thank you so much for being here, and, please stay safe. coming up, america expands eligibility for the covid booster as some states call in the national guard to help with covid surges. we'll be right back. we'll be right back. ent in the y of small business bookkeeping. having someone else do your books for you. i'm linda, your quickbooks live bookkeeper. let's do this linda! sounds good! a live expert bookkeeper who understands your business. felipe, i've categorized last month's hair gel expenses. steve, i just closed your books. great, how are we looking? 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>> right. thanks so much for having me on this evening, zerlina. we don't have tons of data. this is all based on preliminary data, and most of it is based on lab studies. and essentially what we see is when you mix essentially the blood of people who are vaccinated versus people who are unvaccinated, omicron decreases the effectiveness of those vaccines, and so it's really important for people to understand we're seeing with these lab stories is that people who are vaccinated and previously infected or fully vaccinated and boosted actually do really well up against omicron, but this is just the lab data. what we're waiting for is real-life data, and we won't have that for several weeks. >> that's such a good point, and i think the distinction between how it works in the real world and how it works in a petri dish -- i don't know if that's what it's in technically. >> right. >> if you know what i'm saying. how bad in your view is it a sign that states are enlisting the national guard for assistance? i mean there are five states doing this right now. again, we're not out of this pandemic. thousands of people are dying every day and hospitals are still overrun in these states. >> right. i mean things are really, really bad, and there are certain states that the delta surge is hitting harder than others. you know, obviously with omicron also here and still remains to be seen whether it will overdominate delta, we're in another crisis. we're in the beginning of a surge, and something has to happen. yes, the biden administration is encouraging people to get vaccinated if they haven't been vaccinated, to get boosted if they've been fully vaccinated. and now we're seeing some states like new york state institute mask mandates. and so what we need to also recognize is that policy is important. we need policies to decrease the spread of the virus while we encourage people to get vaccinate and boosted. it's so hard to think about the fact that a thousand people are still dying every day and somehow people are, i don't know, under some sort of illusion that this is over. and you mentioned something really, really important that i want to sort of flush out a little bit. what you said is that these hospitals in these five states, they're at capacity due to the delta variant. can you just explain for the folks at home? >> right. >> we've been talking about omicron for two weeks, since thanksgiving, and we've been afraid of that, but the delta variant is still the dominant variant. that's what's keeping the hospitals full of patients at the moment, but omicron could overtake it. >> right. >> help the folks at home understand what's happening. >> that's the interesting part. there's still so much to learn about omicron, but delta is here and has been here, and it's highly contagious. what we're seeing is because of the colder weather people are moving indoors. we know delta is hardier, lasts longer in colder weather. we're seeing increasing cases, and we've seen increasing hospitalization. as you mentioned, over a thousand people are still dying a day. so we have not done a good job of getting delta under control, which is why the fact that omicron here is potentially even scarier, because if our systems are at capacity, what happens if omicron arrives and dominates? again, we really need to get these surges under control, and, yes, we need to increase hospital capacity, but that's not the solution. the solution is preventing people from going to the hospital, from getting infected in the first place. >> that has been my goal from the beginning. i don't want to survive covid. don't want to catch covid. that should be the goal. everyone take the steps toward ta goal. >> always. >> dr. uché blackstock, thanks for being here as always and helping us figure this out because we're going to survive this pandemic. please stay safe. kellogg's say they're going to replace workers who went on strike, and president biden is not happy about it. the former labor secretary robert reich joins me next. retay robert reich joins me next ♪ ♪ ♪ hey google. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ hi, i'm steve and i live in austin, texas. i work as a personal assistant to the owner of a large manufacturing firm. i've got anywhere from 10 to 50 projects going at any given time. i absolutely have to be sharp. let me tell ya, i was struggling with my memory. it was going downhill. my friend recommended that i try prevagen and over time, it made a very significant difference in my memory and in my cognitive ability. i started to feel a much better sense of well-being. prevagen. healthier brain. better life. learning about our history with ancestrydna®, inspired us to learn more about our culture and where we come from. ...right here? ohhh my god. where? discovering things that were a mystery, that's what ancestry® did for our family. ♪♪ discovering things that were a mystery, things you start when you're 45. coaching. new workouts. and screening for colon cancer. yep. the american cancer society recommends screening starting at age 45, instead of 50, since colon cancer is increasing in younger adults. i'm cologuard®. i'm convenient and find 92% of colon cancers... ...even in early stages. i'm for people 45 plus at average risk for colon cancer, not high risk. false positive and negative results may occur. ask your provider if cologuard is right for you. better skin from your body wash? try olay body wash with skincare super ingredient collagen! olay body wash hydrates to improve skin 3x better, from dry and dull to firm and radiant. with olay body, i feel fearless in my skin. do i need to pretreat my laundry? nope! with tide pods, you don't need to worry. the pre-treaters are built in. tide pods dissolve even when the water is freezing. nice! if it's got to be clean, it's got to be tide. kellogg's employees went on strike. they said they wanted significant rises because they routinely work 80 hours a week and kent plants running throughout the pandemic. this week the company announced a majority of its employees turned down an offer that produced a 3% pay bump. kellogg's responded by saying it's going hire permanent replacements for workers who went on strike two months ago. one person who is not happy about that is the president of the united states, joe biden. he released a statement today saying, quote, permanently replacing striking workers is an existential attack on the union and its members' jobs and its livelihoods. jorming me now is the former labor secretary robert reich and co-founder and professor at california, berkeley. what is your reaction to kellogg and their decision and the employees to say no and they turned it down? >> well, zerlina, they have been working, as you pointed out, 80 hours a week. kellogg's has been doing gangbuster business, record profits. so it's surprising kellogg's workers are saying, wait a minute. and for kellogg's to say we're going to replace all of you, it's a real slap in the face. ite's slap in the face to all workers, it seems to me, and kellogg's is not just any company. it has a lot of brand names. it depends on consumer good will. it just can't treat its worker this way. it's legal technically, but i think it's morally questionable. >> right. you say that it is legal, but is that what should matter in this particular moment? i mean is it unethical? and as you said, consumers can make a judgment as to whether or not they want to support this company based on their ethics and how they treat their workers. >> absolutely. these companies in a consumer marketing business, they spend fortunes developing their brand, and part of their brand is sort of feel good. you want to feel good about a company you're buying breakfast cereal from or buying a whole bunch of other things from. well, if they're beheching unethically toward their workers who are putting in huge numbers of hours and have put in a huge number of hours throughout the pandemic, then i think consumers are going to have second thoughts, quite frankly. >> look. i'm looking at all of those folks who went out into the world who put their lives at risk so the rest of us can have food on the table t rest of us can have things we need to take care of our families. those folks need to be paid a living wage. if they're not, something is wrong with this entire system, and i think you speak to this often. president biden today urged the two sides to work out their differences. how important do you think it is you have a president weighing in on a situation like that? how much influence do you think he has? >> it's very rare for a president to weigh in on a labor dispute. i think a president does have a lot of moral authority, even if you don't agree with the president in terms of his politics. for a president of the united states to say something like this is very, very important. and by the way, zerlina, it's not just kellogg's. it's also companies companies l starbucks or companies like amazon. i mean, their workers have really put in a huge number of hours, very difficult working conditions particularly over the last 20, 21 months. many of them have been striking or attempting to strike for better wages and working conditions, and, again, it's a matter of ethics. it's a matter of public relations if you want to boil down to it to the kind of minimum kind of quality of what's at issue here. but ultimately, it is about the morality of how we treat each other in this economy. >>. >> it's so, so, true and i think the about the power shift that's happening in this pandemic. do you think that the power shift is going from the bosses to the workers? because you mentioned starbucks, john deere, frito lay, mcdonald's, you know, they've all had workers walk off the job and push for better working conditions and higher wages. do you see that power shift happening? >> well, we are in one of these very rare moments in labor history when workers do have some more bargaining leverage because consumers have a lot of pent up demand for all kinds of products and goods and services, and employers have got to get more workers in order to meet that demand, but at the same time, a lot of workers are saying, hold it, you know, i have been through this pandemic. i've been putting in extra hours. i want to re-evaluate where i am. i'm not sure i want to stick in this old job, and many workers, if you look at the quit rate, which is the rate that people are quitting their jobs, and you look at also the labor participation rate, the number of adults who are eligible to work who are actually in the labor force, you know, what you're seeing and then the strikes obviously, what you're seeing is a picture of a labor force in the united states particularly on the lower wage end of the labor force who are saying i'm really fed up. i'm not going to take it anymore. i want something better. i deserve something better, and i think that this could be a fundamental, you know, it's overused all the time. the inflection point. i think this is an inflection point in terms of labor relations in america. >> i hope so because i think that it was very much out of balance. you also have the role of social media in this particular moment, a tiktok activist sort of created code in this kellogg strike. what do you think about the engagement of social media folks, people on reddit and tiktok to support the workers in these cases? >> hugely important. it is a new factor, and a lot of companies, a lot of management are kind of scratching their heads. you know, we didn't think consumers and others out there, particularly young people, would be that interested, but it turns out that if you look at the country as a whole, 65% of americans now approve labor unions. this is a new high, record high even though a record low percentage of americans are actually in unions because there has been so much union opposition by corporations over the last 30 years, 30 or 40 years. you also find many young people who are saying i want to be an activist and i can be an activist by alerting the public as to what some of these companies are trying to do to their workers. >> well, i think it's cool to speak up for those who may not be able to. you know, everybody can utilize their skill set to do work for the greater good. i kind of like that. robert thank you so much as always for being here. please stay safe. coming up, this is not an onion ed line. kanye west publicist pressed georgia election worker to confess to bogus fraud charges. we will take you inside this incredible story next. to protect people. to help them save. with a home and auto bundle from progressive. ahh. i was born for this. and now it's prime time. cut. jamie, what are you doing? you're not even in this one. i thought it was thursday. sorry. -it is. -i thought -- i thought it was last thursday. growing up in a little red house, -it is. -i thought -- on the edge of a forest in norway, there were three things my family encouraged: kindness, honesty and hard work. over time, i've come to add a fourth: be curious. be curious about the world around us, and then go. go with an open heart, and you will find inspiration anew. viking. exploring the world in comfort. bye mom. my helpers abound, i'll need you today. our sleigh is now ready, let's get on our way. a mountain of toys to fulfill many wishes. must be carried across all roads and all bridges. and when everyone is smiling and having their fun i can turn my sleigh north because my job here is done. it's not magic that makes more holiday deliveries to homes in the us than anyone else, it's the hardworking people of the united states postal service. ♪ i see trees of green ♪ ♪ red roses too ♪ ♪ i see them bloom ♪ ♪ for me and you ♪ ♪ and i think to myself ♪ ♪ what a wonderful world ♪ a rich life is about more than just money. that's why at vanguard, you're more than just an investor, you're an owner so you can build a future for those you love. vanguard. become an owner. [uplifting music playing] vanguard. ♪ i had a dream that someday ♪ ♪ i would just fly, fly away ♪ ever notice how stiff clothes can feel rough on your skin? for softer clothes that are gentle on your skin, try downy free & gentle downy will soften your clothes without dyes or perfumes. the towel washed with downy is softer, and gentler on your skin. try downy free & gentle. what if i told you someone who worked for kanye west as a publicist tried toe get a georgia election worker to admit to voter fraud in the 2020 election. would you believe me? i mean, that is actually crazy even by today's standards, right? but according to a new report in reuters, it actually happened. reuters reports that just weeks after the election this publicist went to the suburban home of ruby freeman. she had been facing death threats because donald trump falsely accused her of manipulating votes. raymond was told to either con vesz to trump's allegations or people would come to her home in 48 hours and she'd go to jail. reuters obtained this information through body cam footage provided by the police. yes, this is on videotape. at one point freeman was told, quote, you are a loose end for a party that needs to tidy up. you know, just like house of cards. i mean, this is like stranger than fiction. neither the woman accused of threatening freeman nor kanye west himself responded to requests for comment, and reuters wasn't able to confirm whether the publicist still works for kanye and in what capacity. it turns out ruby freeman was right to be concerned. a day after the publicist paid her a visit, the fbi reached out to freeman and told her to leave, leave her home because she wasn't safe there. the next day a pro-trump mob surrounded her home shouting at her through bull horns. as if we needed more proof? we are really, really living in a time that is wild. it is stranger than fiction. not really happy about it either. that does it for me, i'm zerlina. you can find me monday through friday at 6:00 p.m. eastern on peacock. on the choice from msnbc. be sure to follow us on facebook, twitter, tiktok and youtube. more news is coming up right here on msnbc. good morning, everybody. we begin with breaking news. a devastating outbreak of tornados pounding several states overnight leaving dozens of people dead. at the moment it appears kentucky was hit the hardest, four tornados swept through the state, one of which stayed on the ground for 227 miles after touching down. now, here's what governor said. >> the city of mayfield has been devastated, a roof collapse at a candle factory has resulted in

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Transcripts For MSNBC Zerlina 20240709

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confirmation from the kentucky governor confirming it was a deadly night of destruction active and deadly tornados. >> i fear there are more than 50 dead in kentucky. confirmation still coming in. we're going to lose over 50 people, probably closer to somewhere between 70 and 100. it's devastating. this shows you what we believe will be the longest tornado touchdown in terms of distance in our history. you all the way down to the bottom of the screen, and that's where it first touched down, and then it stayed on the ground, that entire line, causing significant devastation. this is incredibly rare to see, and it is one of the reasons that this was so devastating here in kentucky. >> so we just heard from the kentucky governor, they fear there could be as many as 70 to 100 dead from the night of tornados. we know there are about four tornadoes total, the one the governor just talked about, a 227-mile tornado touchdown. it stayed down. we know one of the areas hardest hit in kentucky was mayfield, particularly a candle factory in mayfield where 110 people were inside at the time, the governor saying in that press conference, they believe they'll lose dozens of people in that billing alone who were working the second shift. people were given advance warn, but the governor said this with us a storm of the likes we have never seen, calling it a widespread weather event. water trucks are on the way to impacted areas. shelters are being set up. the video is just incredible. way tonight go right now to richard lui who's listening closely to the press conference. richard, i know one of the horrifying facts to you is 227 miles when yushdly a tornado stace on the ground for a couple of miles. >> the governor delivered, lindsey, with great calm, but that number is gargantuan. it's not only roughly half the width of the state, which is about 400 miles, but 200 miles on the ground. one tornado, of course, i'll have to verify this. they'll have to do this when the sun rises. they'll get the data from the national weather service. the average of a typical tornado, if you can say there is one, according to the national weather service, lindsey, is about one or two miles on the ground. so this thing, if it is actually as long as they estimate it to be as you saw in that one full screen, the one slide that the governor was showing, is 100 to 200 times greater than average, and we don't even know the width. but we heard from emergency management officials out of kentucky during that same very briefing, 25 minutes long as we were watching it overnight is that he was comparing it to what we call the great 1925 tornadoes. that's march 18th, 1925. in that particular incident on that day, they did see one tornado that was up to a mile wide. now, they didn't indicate how wide this particular 200-long-mile path was, but you can just imagine because the typical tornado width is 50 yards. so when they say this could break all records, and it seems like they definitely do believe so, the unfortunate reality of all that, lindsey, is the number that they fear are injured or have died, closer to 70 to 100 people is what the governor said and what you were saying as well. the numbers are clearly in big question. and when the sun rises in about an hour and 45 minutes, that's when they can, if you will, get out the slide rulers. they can figure out what exactly happened there in tornado alley. you know, it's been just a really rough night certainly for emergency management officials. national guard did also come out at about 5:15 a.m. you're watching it as well. and what we heard from them is they're already bringing in the water trucks when they see this kind of damage. i was listening to some eyewitness accounts. what you see on our screen here is what they're seeing with wide swaths. so not like hunt and pick. this is wide swaths of everything being flattened. you heard the words before, it looks like a war zone. those are words being used by eyewitnesses on the ground. again, this is just kentucky. this is a quad state, at least according to what we're hearing from the kentucky emergency management officials damage situation. so four state at least. as you were mentioning, there are other potential areas of damage, not only the candle factory that's in the state. there is also the amazon warehouse that's in neighboring areas in illinois, for instance, north, where they had at least 100 emergency vehicles getting to that location. they believe that most of this particular warehouse, an area -- a wall that has -- according to the "associated press," the length of a football field completely collapsing as well as the roof itself. so a lot of unknown questions because they just have these certain areas where they can get light up. of course, when you have in addition to that tens of thousands if not hundreds of thousands of people without power in this area, what we were saying yesterday is that the estimation is this particular storm could affect 16 million people. the number could have gone down by now. according to the national weather service, according to their hazardous weather outlook, they expect the tornado watch to be in effect until 9:00 a.m. eastern. so we still have three more hours, lindsey, of potential damage if the national weather service and, again, their tornado watch stays in effect. >> right. richard, for anybody joining us, we are discussing the overnight devastating tornados that impacted the central u.s. caused tornado warnings in five different states. at one point more than 200,000 homes and businesses without power. we know aid is on the way, water trucks, shelters being set up as well. we know kentucky was hit particularly hard overnight. we also know, for example, as richard was saying, the am is son facility in illinois, their roof was ripped off. in arkansas, a nursing home was hit killing at least one person. and particularly mayfield in the western part of kentucky has been particularly hit hard. it's only a town of about 1,000 people. the death toll across the state could be 50, but could rise to 70 to 100 by the time the devastation and the damage is surveyed when dawn breaks. just as richard was saying, we know the storm system is still sparking tornados right now. several states are under a tornado watch until 11:00 a.m. richard, as we're watching just these devastating images here, what other help did the governor say was on the way for these people? >> when we were listening to the people, again, that was about an hour ard. they were getting on the ground as of midnight when they were deploying. that's a good measure of time they were able to deploy all of their resources. according to resources who mentioned there was help on the ground in kentucky, they felt that help in terms of the number of emergency and first responder vehicles that were there were numerous. i heard one account i was listening to of an eyewitness who was close to that candle factory saying that, indeed, they say dozens, close to a hundred emergency vehicles that were already on location. so the state of emergency which was declared around 1:00 a.m., lindsey, therefore, gave them about three or four hours if, again, we're following the clock up until now. but the national guard saying they were able to deploy their forces and resources in time. we heard two water trucks. there could be more that are certainly being mobilized right now. but with the state of emergency now being five hours old in the state of kentucky alone is what i'm alluding to here, the number of resources and personnel on the ground had some time to prepare and get there. as you were mentioning earlier, the governor was warning the state earlier in the day, this is going to be potentially a historic event. and that, of course, activated more of the resources in the state. but in terms of reflection of where that big tornado that they were mentioning, just one of the four, it was tracking directly toward where the governor was based, where he was giving his reports today. it lifted, according to the map that they were showing, you know, about what could be maybe 40, 50 miles away from the capital and where he was at. but that was certainly something he was watching as it was heading toward where they were at emergency management early this morning, lindsey. but the resources now deployed. it's going to be, of course, in addition to that all of the utilities that have to get out and try to get electricity and utilities back working in these various parts of the state. by the way, finally, i was looking at the population density of the area of this mega tornado that could be that they're talking about. good thing, as you were looking at the density, it wassen to head toward the more denser parts of kentucky. there were a couple of spots along that way that could certainly be concerned of where the tornadoes could be touching down on, but for the most part, when they were showing us the map of the red circles, it was areas that had lower population densities, lindsey. >> certainly they got advance warnings, but the storms were hitting when it was dark out. some may have gone to bed. it was about 8:30 at night. we do see somebody being pulled. this is video coming in from overnight. this is devastating. the facts even more devastating. we're going to have much more coming up on msnbc coming up at the top of the hour. my thanks to richard lui. we'll get you back to your regular broadcast. u back to your regular broadcast. ng america. and now through the subaru share the love event, we're helping even more. by the end of this year, subaru will have donated over two hundred and twenty five million dollars to charity. this is what it means to be more than a car company. this is what it means to be subaru. ♪ limu emu... & doug ♪ ♪ superpowers from a spider bite? i could use some help showing the world how liberty mutual customizes their car 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(gasps) ♪ did it work? only pay for what you need ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪ spider-man no way home in theaters december 17th at fidelity, your dedicated advisor will help you create a comprehensive wealth plan for your full financial picture. with the right balance of risk and reward. so you can enjoy more of...this. this is the planning effect. 24 hours before the insurrection, donald trump laid out various options to try to keep trump in office even though he lost the election. he could declare a national security emergency to delay a certification of votes or he could claim that other countries had messed with the election and declare all electronic voting invalid, you know, totally normal stuff. that powerpoint presentation was among the thousands of documents submitted to the january 6th investigation by mark meadows. as a reminder, mark meadows went from cooperating with the house panel to refusing to cooperate with the house panel. now he's suing the members. next week, the house could refer mark meadows to the justice department for possible criminal prosecution on charges of contempt of congress like steve bannon. joining me now is former federal prosecutor and msnbc analyst. is there reason to believe that the doj will hit mark meadows with contempt of congress now that he's not cooperating? >> they should, zelena. if he had shown up and testified and answered every question that did not arguably implicate some privilege, either an executive privilege which he has by and large waived or privilege which he undeniably has because this is just the latest. this is just the latest in a conspiracy to create crimes in the united states. all of this put together has to be put against the backdrop of bill barr, donald trump's own attorney general, telling him there is no evidence undermining joe biden's win, so, you know, you can start from the proposition that everything they were doing after learning definitively this was not a rigged election was a crime. it was a conspiracy against the united states by overturning a presidential election, and mark meadows should go the way of steve bannon. he should be voted in contempt, referred for prosecution, and indicted. >> we spoke the day steve bannon was actually held in contempt on the day the doj took action against him. was that a signal that folks like mar meadows need to get in line here, and are you seeing any other signals from the doj that they're planning a bigger conspiracy something because there's so much information? it trickles out. it reminds me a bit of the russian investigation. it's coming out, trickling out, and it looks like it could make a crime. but the doj is the one who determines that. >> i hope the doj is conducting a vault-like investigation into all of this i know we see no outward signs of it, but, frankly, if it's being done right, we would not be seeing outward signs of it. bob mueller conducted his investigation in a vault. we knew because he was publicly appointed as special counsel to do so. i can't believe they could see a guy like jeffrey clark, for example, a high former doj official, announcing he committed crimes against the united states, and if he was forced to testify truthfully, he would incriminate himself, and the department of justice standing idly by and saying we're not going to investigate the crimes of one of our own former high officials. that doesn't make any sense to me. i think that are investigating. they would have lawyers. talks would occur, leaks would occur. then bewould hear what's going on. there are ways to do this. only presenting the testimony of, firefighter example, fbi agents to at this stage inform the grand jury of what they're learning before they begin subpoenas civilian witnesses such that it's bound to leak. so i believe it's ongoing. we just don't know about it yet. >> i will remember what you said here today if something should occur in the future because i think a lot of people are looking at all the details coming out, and they're like, you know, throwing up their hands because it appears that these folks have gotten away with it. but as you said, if there is an investigation, we would not know about it. so i want to ask you as well about the is ups. they subpoenaed six people including two men. robert peede jr., mac miller, brian jack, bryan lewis, ed martin, and kim. who are these people? >> the committee is fast and furious. it feels lewis the house investigation is heath up. they're deploying aides. they're moving through funders and planners of the january 6th rally that preceded the attack on the capitol, and i think there are well over 300 interviews now, and we sit here frustrated because we don't know what's going on behind those closed committee doors, but you know what, zerlina? this is precisely how it should be unfolding, and here's why. they're taking thousands and thousands and thousands of hours of depositions, and i don't think americans have the attention span if thousands of hours were being televised, for example, to sort of go through it themselves. they're cure rating this information. as liz cheney said, beginning in january, they're going to offer up weeks of public facing testimony that will bring to the attention of the america people in vivid detail what happened every minute of the day, not just at the capitol, but here's the important part, at the white house. so, you know, get ready for that show. get your popcorn. because i think that is when we're going to see in full color exactly what donald trump and his criminal associates are responsible for. >> well, e look forward to that da and i'll have good snacks ready. i always had good impeachment snacks. thank you for being here and helping. thank you for helping us understand all of this. police stay safe. >> joo coming up, the right to evoke is under attack, and so are the people who oversee our elections. one of them joins me next. we'll be right back. e of them j. we'll be right back. healthier is seeing a healthcae pro whenever you may need one. doctor: the fever should break... or...trying to. ♪♪ ♪ this is what healthier looks like ♪ ♪ my songs know what you did in the dark ♪ ♪ so light 'em up, up, up light 'em up, up, up ♪ ♪ light 'em up, up, up ♪ ♪ i'm on fire ♪ ♪ so light 'em up, up, up light 'em... ♪ like pulsing, electric shocks, sharp, stabbing pains, or an intense burning sensation. what is this nightmare? 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well, today president biden laid out his plan as he closed out his two-day summit for democracy. >> here at home, that means working to make real the full promise of america, including by enacting both the freedom to vote act and the john lewis voting right advancement act because what's true around the world is also true in the united states. the sacred right to vote, to vote freely, the right to have your vote counted as the threshold liberty for democracy. >> but in the aftermath of the 2020 election, we've seen it's not just the right to vote that's under attack. the people in charge of running elections are under attack too from death threats to armed protests, election officials across the country are literally putting their lives on the line to do their jobs. in colorado, the threats against secretary of state jenna griswold have been so constant and specific that she's now requests an annual budget of $200,000 to address security concerns. joining me now is colorado's secretary of state jena griswold. thanks for being here. >> of course. nice to see you, zer lina. >> you're asking for money and for folks to monitor threats. that sounds serious. what have you and your staff been dealing with over the past few months? >> well, election officials over the nation have been dealing with increased threats. you know, the big lie has morphed into the big threat with tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands of death threats and other threats going to election workers across the nation, and it's to a point, zerlina, that 30% of election workers countrywide say that they're scared to do their job. and in pennsylvania from the beginning of 2020, over 30% of election workers at the county level have actually resigned. so this is one of the attacks on democracy. it's trying to get good people who are there to make sure that every vote counts, to step down. so we take that seriously. and here in colorado, i've asked for increased funding to make sure that my office is safe and we're doing what we need to do to continue to do our job of overseeing elections. >> i think the irony here is that republicans basically are perpetuating the big lie under the guise that they're trying to boost election security, but the people who run elections like you are requested security for your own safety because of the violent threats that have stemmed from the big lie. i mean, how concerned are you about future elections given the threats out there and the normalization of the political violence as an option if you're upset about election results? >> well, i'm extremely concerned. i think these threats need to be taken very seriously. they've been really focused on largely democratic women secretaries of state. i know you referenced my colleagues in arizona and michigan. and largely secretaries of state who are leaning in, pushing back against the voter suppression, pushing back against the attacks on democracy, are facing threats to our lives. i am concerned. i think the doj needs to take it seriously. they're processing those who are causing violence. states need to take it seriously. again, this is part of a larger ee tack. we're seeing the slow erosion of america democracy. this is a piece of it, but the alarm bells should be going off for the entire country, especially the u.s. senate that could pass voting rights reform. >> well, i hope those swing votes in the u.s. senate are listening to your warnings. you said in an interview last week that these warning signs, they're blinking red for a slow motion coup. earlier we were talking to glenn kirschner about a power poipt that laid out a coup. are we watching them set themselves up for stealing an election coming up next year and also the one coming out in 2024, and they're doing it out in the open? it's not in a secret powerpoint, it's just happening? >> that's exactly right. none of this is behind closed doors. it's all very visual, and we're seeing the groundwork making it harder for voters to vote in 2022 in the future, we're seeing bills to subvert the vote. arizona is considering a bill that would allow the legislature to overturn the will of the people. we're seeing the attack on elections themselves from election officials to insider threats to people like steve bannon recruiting in election deniers to volunteer to sign up for jobs in our offices or as poll watchers. and the attack on confidence. so the next time there is a january 6th, it will be harder for americans to have their voice heard to start off with and it will be harder to stop it. that's why it's so important to me that we're sounding the alarms right now. and the last thing i'll say on this is that in every swing state where we have a secretary of state's race, there is someone running who is spreading the big lie. we need to make sure election administrators believe in democracy. i encourage all of your viewers to really pay attention in 2022. >> imagine that the line we need everybody to meet is believing in democracy. that's a really true testament to the state of affairs, but i think to your point, the emergency that we are in. secretary jena griswold. thank you so much for being here, and, please stay safe. coming up, america expands eligibility for the covid booster as some states call in the national guard to help with covid surges. we'll be right back. we'll be right back. ent in the y of small business bookkeeping. having someone else do your books for you. i'm linda, your quickbooks live bookkeeper. let's do this linda! sounds good! a live expert bookkeeper who understands your business. felipe, i've categorized last month's hair gel expenses. steve, i just closed your books. great, how are we looking? 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>> right. thanks so much for having me on this evening, zerlina. we don't have tons of data. this is all based on preliminary data, and most of it is based on lab studies. and essentially what we see is when you mix essentially the blood of people who are vaccinated versus people who are unvaccinated, omicron decreases the effectiveness of those vaccines, and so it's really important for people to understand we're seeing with these lab stories is that people who are vaccinated and previously infected or fully vaccinated and boosted actually do really well up against omicron, but this is just the lab data. what we're waiting for is real-life data, and we won't have that for several weeks. >> that's such a good point, and i think the distinction between how it works in the real world and how it works in a petri dish -- i don't know if that's what it's in technically. >> right. >> if you know what i'm saying. how bad in your view is it a sign that states are enlisting the national guard for assistance? i mean there are five states doing this right now. again, we're not out of this pandemic. thousands of people are dying every day and hospitals are still overrun in these states. >> right. i mean things are really, really bad, and there are certain states that the delta surge is hitting harder than others. you know, obviously with omicron also here and still remains to be seen whether it will overdominate delta, we're in another crisis. we're in the beginning of a surge, and something has to happen. yes, the biden administration is encouraging people to get vaccinated if they haven't been vaccinated, to get boosted if they've been fully vaccinated. and now we're seeing some states like new york state institute mask mandates. and so what we need to also recognize is that policy is important. we need policies to decrease the spread of the virus while we encourage people to get vaccinate and boosted. it's so hard to think about the fact that a thousand people are still dying every day and somehow people are, i don't know, under some sort of illusion that this is over. and you mentioned something really, really important that i want to sort of flush out a little bit. what you said is that these hospitals in these five states, they're at capacity due to the delta variant. can you just explain for the folks at home? >> right. >> we've been talking about omicron for two weeks, since thanksgiving, and we've been afraid of that, but the delta variant is still the dominant variant. that's what's keeping the hospitals full of patients at the moment, but omicron could overtake it. >> right. >> help the folks at home understand what's happening. >> that's the interesting part. there's still so much to learn about omicron, but delta is here and has been here, and it's highly contagious. what we're seeing is because of the colder weather people are moving indoors. we know delta is hardier, lasts longer in colder weather. we're seeing increasing cases, and we've seen increasing hospitalization. as you mentioned, over a thousand people are still dying a day. so we have not done a good job of getting delta under control, which is why the fact that omicron here is potentially even scarier, because if our systems are at capacity, what happens if omicron arrives and dominates? again, we really need to get these surges under control, and, yes, we need to increase hospital capacity, but that's not the solution. the solution is preventing people from going to the hospital, from getting infected in the first place. >> that has been my goal from the beginning. i don't want to survive covid. don't want to catch covid. that should be the goal. everyone take the steps toward ta goal. >> always. >> dr. uché blackstock, thanks for being here as always and helping us figure this out because we're going to survive this pandemic. please stay safe. kellogg's say they're going to replace workers who went on strike, and president biden is not happy about it. the former labor secretary robert reich joins me next. retay robert reich joins me next ♪ ♪ ♪ hey google. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ hi, i'm steve and i live in austin, texas. i work as a personal assistant to the owner of a large manufacturing firm. i've got anywhere from 10 to 50 projects going at any given time. i absolutely have to be sharp. let me tell ya, i was struggling with my memory. it was going downhill. my friend recommended that i try prevagen and over time, it made a very significant difference in my memory and in my cognitive ability. i started to feel a much better sense of well-being. prevagen. healthier brain. better life. learning about our history with ancestrydna®, inspired us to learn more about our culture and where we come from. ...right here? ohhh my god. where? discovering things that were a mystery, that's what ancestry® did for our family. ♪♪ discovering things that were a mystery, things you start when you're 45. coaching. new workouts. and screening for colon cancer. yep. the american cancer society recommends screening starting at age 45, instead of 50, since colon cancer is increasing in younger adults. i'm cologuard®. i'm convenient and find 92% of colon cancers... ...even in early stages. i'm for people 45 plus at average risk for colon cancer, not high risk. false positive and negative results may occur. ask your provider if cologuard is right for you. better skin from your body wash? try olay body wash with skincare super ingredient collagen! olay body wash hydrates to improve skin 3x better, from dry and dull to firm and radiant. with olay body, i feel fearless in my skin. do i need to pretreat my laundry? nope! with tide pods, you don't need to worry. the pre-treaters are built in. tide pods dissolve even when the water is freezing. nice! if it's got to be clean, it's got to be tide. kellogg's employees went on strike. they said they wanted significant rises because they routinely work 80 hours a week and kent plants running throughout the pandemic. this week the company announced a majority of its employees turned down an offer that produced a 3% pay bump. kellogg's responded by saying it's going hire permanent replacements for workers who went on strike two months ago. one person who is not happy about that is the president of the united states, joe biden. he released a statement today saying, quote, permanently replacing striking workers is an existential attack on the union and its members' jobs and its livelihoods. jorming me now is the former labor secretary robert reich and co-founder and professor at california, berkeley. what is your reaction to kellogg and their decision and the employees to say no and they turned it down? >> well, zerlina, they have been working, as you pointed out, 80 hours a week. kellogg's has been doing gangbuster business, record profits. so it's surprising kellogg's workers are saying, wait a minute. and for kellogg's to say we're going to replace all of you, it's a real slap in the face. ite's slap in the face to all workers, it seems to me, and kellogg's is not just any company. it has a lot of brand names. it depends on consumer good will. it just can't treat its worker this way. it's legal technically, but i think it's morally questionable. >> right. you say that it is legal, but is that what should matter in this particular moment? i mean is it unethical? and as you said, consumers can make a judgment as to whether or not they want to support this company based on their ethics and how they treat their workers. >> absolutely. these companies in a consumer marketing business, they spend fortunes developing their brand, and part of their brand is sort of feel good. you want to feel good about a company you're buying breakfast cereal from or buying a whole bunch of other things from. well, if they're beheching unethically toward their workers who are putting in huge numbers of hours and have put in a huge number of hours throughout the pandemic, then i think consumers are going to have second thoughts, quite frankly. >> look. i'm looking at all of those folks who went out into the world who put their lives at risk so the rest of us can have food on the table t rest of us can have things we need to take care of our families. those folks need to be paid a living wage. if they're not, something is wrong with this entire system, and i think you speak to this often. president biden today urged the two sides to work out their differences. how important do you think it is you have a president weighing in on a situation like that? how much influence do you think he has? >> it's very rare for a president to weigh in on a labor dispute. i think a president does have a lot of moral authority, even if you don't agree with the president in terms of his politics. for a president of the united states to say something like this is very, very important. and by the way, zerlina, it's not just kellogg's. it's also companies companies l starbucks or companies like amazon. i mean, their workers have really put in a huge number of hours, very difficult working conditions particularly over the last 20, 21 months. many of them have been striking or attempting to strike for better wages and working conditions, and, again, it's a matter of ethics. it's a matter of public relations if you want to boil down to it to the kind of minimum kind of quality of what's at issue here. but ultimately, it is about the morality of how we treat each other in this economy. >>. >> it's so, so, true and i think the about the power shift that's happening in this pandemic. do you think that the power shift is going from the bosses to the workers? because you mentioned starbucks, john deere, frito lay, mcdonald's, you know, they've all had workers walk off the job and push for better working conditions and higher wages. do you see that power shift happening? >> well, we are in one of these very rare moments in labor history when workers do have some more bargaining leverage because consumers have a lot of pent up demand for all kinds of products and goods and services, and employers have got to get more workers in order to meet that demand, but at the same time, a lot of workers are saying, hold it, you know, i have been through this pandemic. i've been putting in extra hours. i want to re-evaluate where i am. i'm not sure i want to stick in this old job, and many workers, if you look at the quit rate, which is the rate that people are quitting their jobs, and you look at also the labor participation rate, the number of adults who are eligible to work who are actually in the labor force, you know, what you're seeing and then the strikes obviously, what you're seeing is a picture of a labor force in the united states particularly on the lower wage end of the labor force who are saying i'm really fed up. i'm not going to take it anymore. i want something better. i deserve something better, and i think that this could be a fundamental, you know, it's overused all the time. the inflection point. i think this is an inflection point in terms of labor relations in america. >> i hope so because i think that it was very much out of balance. you also have the role of social media in this particular moment, a tiktok activist sort of created code in this kellogg strike. what do you think about the engagement of social media folks, people on reddit and tiktok to support the workers in these cases? >> hugely important. it is a new factor, and a lot of companies, a lot of management are kind of scratching their heads. you know, we didn't think consumers and others out there, particularly young people, would be that interested, but it turns out that if you look at the country as a whole, 65% of americans now approve labor unions. this is a new high, record high even though a record low percentage of americans are actually in unions because there has been so much union opposition by corporations over the last 30 years, 30 or 40 years. you also find many young people who are saying i want to be an activist and i can be an activist by alerting the public as to what some of these companies are trying to do to their workers. >> well, i think it's cool to speak up for those who may not be able to. you know, everybody can utilize their skill set to do work for the greater good. i kind of like that. robert thank you so much as always for being here. please stay safe. coming up, this is not an onion ed line. kanye west publicist pressed georgia election worker to confess to bogus fraud charges. we will take you inside this incredible story next. to protect people. to help them save. with a home and auto bundle from progressive. ahh. i was born for this. and now it's prime time. cut. jamie, what are you doing? 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[uplifting music playing] vanguard. ♪ i had a dream that someday ♪ ♪ i would just fly, fly away ♪ ever notice how stiff clothes can feel rough on your skin? for softer clothes that are gentle on your skin, try downy free & gentle downy will soften your clothes without dyes or perfumes. the towel washed with downy is softer, and gentler on your skin. try downy free & gentle. what if i told you someone who worked for kanye west as a publicist tried toe get a georgia election worker to admit to voter fraud in the 2020 election. would you believe me? i mean, that is actually crazy even by today's standards, right? but according to a new report in reuters, it actually happened. reuters reports that just weeks after the election this publicist went to the suburban home of ruby freeman. she had been facing death threats because donald trump falsely accused her of manipulating votes. raymond was told to either con vesz to trump's allegations or people would come to her home in 48 hours and she'd go to jail. reuters obtained this information through body cam footage provided by the police. yes, this is on videotape. at one point freeman was told, quote, you are a loose end for a party that needs to tidy up. you know, just like house of cards. i mean, this is like stranger than fiction. neither the woman accused of threatening freeman nor kanye west himself responded to requests for comment, and reuters wasn't able to confirm whether the publicist still works for kanye and in what capacity. it turns out ruby freeman was right to be concerned. a day after the publicist paid her a visit, the fbi reached out to freeman and told her to leave, leave her home because she wasn't safe there. the next day a pro-trump mob surrounded her home shouting at her through bull horns. as if we needed more proof? we are really, really living in a time that is wild. it is stranger than fiction. not really happy about it either. that does it for me, i'm zerlina. you can find me monday through friday at 6:00 p.m. eastern on peacock. on the choice from msnbc. be sure to follow us on facebook, twitter, tiktok and youtube. more news is coming up right here on msnbc. good morning, everybody. we begin with breaking news. a devastating outbreak of tornados pounding several states overnight leaving dozens of people dead. at the moment it appears kentucky was hit the hardest, four tornados swept through the state, one of which stayed on the ground for 227 miles after touching down. now, here's what governor said. >> the city of mayfield has been devastated, a roof collapse at a candle factory has resulted in

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