Transcripts For MSNBC Deadline White House 20240709 : compar

executive power exists in perpetuity. but president right side not kings, and plaintiff is not president. trump's legal team has appealed the decision and is asking for the emergency stay of the judge's order until their appeal can be heard. but as of now, the national archive is set to start handing off trump's records to 1/6 committee on friday. while those records could help answer some of the lookest looming questions around january 6 including exactly what trump was doing that day, the committee is exploring practically every single facet of the capitol attack. brand-new reporting in the "new york times" pulls back the curtain on the committee's work, its scope. quote, in recent weeks the committee hired new investigators, pored over thousands of documents, and heard privately from a stream of voluntary witnesses from rally planners and former trump officials to the rioters themselves. the panel has learned details about how stop the steal rally organizers used deception to obtain per mitts from capitol police to hold rallies near the capitol how mr. trump and white house officials coordinated with organizers of the raleigh whose attendees who later storm the capitol and how deeply chief of staff mark meadows was involved in pushing false claims of widespread election fraud. liz cheney reminded people in a speech last night, the stakes of their investigation could not be higher. watch. >> we are also confronting a domestic threat that we have never faced before. a former president who is teaming to unravel the foundations of our constitutional republic aided by political leaders who have made themselves willing hostages to this dangerous and irrational man. in the months since january 6th i have sometimes heard people say something like, well, what happened was bad. but it wasn't that big a deal because our institutions held. to those people, i say, our institutions do not defend themselves. we, the people, defend them. >> a burst of momentum in the investigation by the january 6th select committee is where we start this hour. betsy woodruff swan is here of politico and msnbc contributor. also with us, luke broad water, and harry litman. luke, this is your reporting. take us through it. >> hi, yes. nicole, in recent weeks the january 6th committee has really ramped up its efforts, especially this week. we've seen now 35 subpoenas go out, 16 of those were just in the past two days. we have seen more than 150 witnesses come in. we have seen new investigators be hired. in fact, i believe the whole investigative team is now in place. and so they are really -- in the first couple months of the committee, they felt like they were sort of building the plane as they were flying. now they feel like they have their whole team in place, they have a strategy, they have different assignments for different investigators, and they are really getting moving now. and i think your seeing that this week with this latest round of subpoenas. >> you know, in reading your reporting, luke, i was reminded of the mueller probe which was split into -- andrew weismann was working on the outside the collusion track, others were working on the obstruction track. it seems like the investigation is now in these separate buckets. i am going to ask you to take me through them. but i want to read some of the color because it is interesting to those of us covering this for many months. working out of a non-script office building at the bottom of capitol hill the committee's investigators divided themselves into color coded teams to pursue avenues of inquiry. they are looking into the money trail. investigators are scrutinizing the groups that funded the protest that preceded the violence. planned meetings. the panel is pressing for answers about gatherings at the willard and other washington hotels for mr. trump's allies who were involved in the effort to overturn the election. foreknowledge of violence. the most difficult piece of the investigation involves unearthing evidence that mr. trump or anyone in his inner circle had foreknowledge that violence was a possibility on january 6th and whether they took any steps to either encourage or discourage the storming of the capitol. i want to ask you about that one, luke, because it seems like we though the answer to knowledge of violence while it was happening. but explain this effort to understand knowledge of what would happen ahead of time in light of the kinds of things they were saying, trial by cam about. flynn's speech the night before. donald trump's using the words "fight, fight, fight". what are they really skrut niesing in that effort? >> right. so the examples of what many people would consider incitement, certainly the house impeachment managers believe it is inassignment are in the public report. we know about rudy giuliani saying let's have trial by combat. we know people -- mo brooks exor thing the crowd to kick ass. we know people were encouraged to march down to the capitol. but there's a question under way about whether there was anything more direct, any foreknowledge that any members of trump's inner circle would have this crowd could turn violent and whether they took any steps to stop that or encourage it. so that is a key question that investigators are probing as they do these interviews. of course it will depend how much cooperation they get from some in trump's upper circle whether they can put those questions directly to people. as we know, steve bannon, jeffrey clark have both refused to now cooperate with the committee. i think betsy broke the story about jeffrey clark. so, they do need cooperation. but they are getting some. they are getting witnesses coming in. some witnesses that have actually surprised -- [ no audio ] >> we lost luke's shot. i am going to bring you in, betsy. your reporting was cited. we covered it here. something that i have been curious about and been asking all of you about is this idea of voluntary witnesses. we know from great reporting from all of you and some of the great books that have come out since the insurrection that pat sip lenny then the white house counsel thought donald trump would be arrested that day. we know acting attorney general jeffrey rosen voluntarily testified before the senate judiciary committee for their report. know that he has testified and cooperated with the 1/6 committee. i wonder if you can sort of give me the buckets of individuals that you are looking at or sort of following and trying to figure out if they are among the cooperating witnesses that luke reports on today? >> one of the most interesting buckets are people who actually participated in violence that day. politico reported that the committee has been in touch with people who were engaged in violent rioting to talk to them about how exactly things went down and why they became so horrible. in fact, federal judges -- at least one judge has said during court proceedings that she encourages rioters to engage with the committee as a way of showing that they feel some sort of contrition for the horrific violence they were involved in. that has sent an important signal to the hundreds of people facing federal charge force the violence that played out that day. one thing that's always considered in criminal sentencing processes is whether or not the person who was convicted feels contrition over what they did. and now there has been this signal that, hey, if you cooperate with the january 6th, select committee, that's something that could result in your sentence being slightly more lenient than it would have been otherwise. that's a key thing that we are focusing on. of course also looking at the fascinating different categories of people who the committee is reaching out to. keeping an eye on potential involvement from folks on the organizing side. for instance there were a lot of people involved in organizing the rally who did it more from kind theettes nuts and bolts technical side than from the idiolodge he can couple fire breathing messaging side. we expect some people that fit in that category will have information that the committee won't have to vie particularly hard to secure. then also people who were involved on the legal side, those senior d.o.j. officials most of whom with the very important exception of jeff clark lined up, got in, and testified as quick as they could before trump could take legal action the try to keep them from testifying. it's just a big, interesting, varied group of people the committee is going after that we know they are just getting information from all sorts of different sources and vantage point. >> harry litman, i want your thoughts on these two big developments today. we will start with luke's reporting. let me recite these three buckets again. the color coded teams are pursuing several avenues of inquiry, the money trail. this is something congressman eric swalwell has been talking about since that second impeachment of donald trump. planned meetings. this is what the trump folks called command center at the willard and other washington hotels. and this question we have been trying to drill down on, foreknowledge of violence during the insurrection. your thoughts? >> two points. first, on the opinion, it's really thorough and sure-footed. and if it holds up, nicole, basically, it blows out of the water not just trump's claims, but also those of the bannons and clarks of the world. so it is potentially very significant. on the point you made on the bucket. >> let me ask you a question about that. harry, do you think merrick garland was waiting for this opinion before making a decision about charging bannon? >> no. i can follow up if you like. >> please. >> but on the buckets. okay. first on the buckets. so many to talk about. the most important is this latest round of subpoenas. we have a lot of knowledge about a lot of the evenings. something we are relatively impoverished on is just what trump was doing, his potential coordination, which the subpoena letter puts out there as for another witness. and his apparent jubilation that day. any possible coordination with the insurrectionists. the last ten, the millers, karricks, et cetera, those really go directly to the heart of what is trump doing here, thinking here, trying to arrange here, so they go as it were very much to the top. back to garland. look, i wrote this at this time, it is a very methodical process. there is law on the other side. part of it, though, chut kin dealt with, the law out there for previous presidents, when properly said this doesn't apply when there is the push comes to shove aspect as we have here where biden says no. he's the person who makes the final call. she made that clear. but also things on the facts. and it's just a really elaborate process potentially involving hearing from bannon's lawyer. people shouldn't be surprised. even though i know they are, that he is being methodical and taking a fair bit of time. >> luke, we have been talking about your reporting while you have been trying to re-establish contact in the zoom era of cable. thank you for running your own i.t. drill there. i want to move to the national archives response to the opinion last night. presidential records belong to the united states, not to any individual, and the former president was fully aware the presidential records that he generated like those of his predecessors will largely become public and that all three branches of government may have access to them to conduct the business of government during the unrestricted period. plaintiff possible it is no argument here that the court has not already previously rejected. the legal stonewalling is not going well for former president donald trump. when i lay that over your three buckets it seems like what the committee might want to know is money that went from the trump campaign or trump affiliated groups to any of the insurrectionists, planned meetings and trump's calls into the willard, we know from the great reporting from you, from betsy, from others, that there was lots of contact, almost a direct line. and in this third bucket. it tells like that might be the thing that trump was trying to protect, his records, from being turned over, that that might be a real opportunity for the committee to understand what trump knew ahead of the insurrection. can you talk about the documents and your reporting together? >> sure. so president trump has -- former president trump has cited 770 pages of documents that he's trying to keep secret here that unless there is some sort of court order by friday will go to the committee. and there is some potentially explosive things in this batch of documents. there is some draft executive orders which we believe may have to do with the seizure of voting machines or the declaration of martial law or perhaps even trying to rerun an election. we know that's some of the advice that donald trump was getting from his allies in the lead up to january 6th. we know there is handwritten notes about january 6th. we know that there is draft speeches. we know that there are some communications with michigan officials. this is all the documents that the president does not want the committee to have access to. so we don't know exactly what these documents are yet until the committee sees them. but from the description in the court filings it sounds like they are very high interest and potentially could be very useful to the committee's investigation. >> betsy, listening to luke speak about this, we know from the mike flynn letter that accompanied mike flynn's subpoena yesterday or the day before yesterday, that those orders are something they already have some information about. his letter specifically cites a meeting in which he recommended seizing voting machines. we know the committee already has a lot of information. and i wonder where you put their sort of -- their effort to plug the holes with these documents? >> there is no question that the level of documentation that trump is trying to block the committee from getting is voluminous. and that language in the letter to flynn that accompanied his subpoena is certainly -- it certainly raises your eyebrows a little bit because it suggests they do have access to some document we top know the committee yet has. we don't know how they might have gotten access to those documents. it certainly sends up a little bit of a signal people are cooperating not necessarily just by walking in or hopping on zoom with investigators and saying what they know but potentially also by sharing materials. remember, many of these subpoenas that have gone out for individual people have ask not just for them to come in and sit for interviews but also to turn in documents, papers, anything in writing that would have tracked out what was happening both this the leadup to that day and on that day itself. some of this stuff, it is hard to imagine how people could have gotten those materials to the committee without the committee going through the national archives. that's because the presidential act makes it impossible for people to walk out of the white house and talk lap tops or papers. a lot of the documents belong to the institution of the presidency, belong to the national archives. if someone somehow faired those records out and then gave them to the committee that would be extraordinary. these are extraordinary teams, extraordinary situations, you can't rule anything out. at the end of the day there is no question first the committee has a lot of interesting stuff, second there is a lot more they won't be able to get unless a federal judge orders the national archives ultimately to turn over all of this paperwork to the helm. >> normal white houses have sister staff with a political laptop and a government laptop. you can imagine a scenario where on the political computer a lot of the 1/6 materials might have existed. but i take your point about government profit. every email you send is automatically bcc today records. harry, president biden has been introduced at this event ear veering to. i want to ask you a quick question. what should we be watching for in the coming days. >> the main thing, will the court of appeals enter a stay? will it be very brief or longer in the chut kin opinion? that matters the most. secondly, who are the 150 people who a playing a carrot and stick game who are voluntarily cooperating and what are they saying. >> harry, luke, thank you so much. president biden in baltimore. >> my father was raised here in baltimore, they say baltimore. and so, you know, although any never worked at the port, they did work at the bay and along here. so, you know, this has been -- this is one of the oldest ports in the country, continuously running, and one of the best ports in the country. so, tony, thanks for that introduction. and mayor scott, thanks for the passport into the city. i appreciate it very much. and i want to thank governor hogan for being here, and members of the delegation. i want to start off with one of my best buddies and i think one of the most effective people in the united states senate chris van holiday anderson. if you want something, he knows how to get it done. also dutch rubersberger, and the guy who i knew him when he was a kid. he doesn't remember me, i am getting so old. i knew his dad. congressman sarbanes, congressman brown. you have a first rate delegation. i want to thank him for being here today and thank him for all the help in getting the members of the house and getting the legislation passed. it's a big deal. it's going to make a big difference. the reason i started calling this build back better is we are the only country in the world -- we underestimated ourselves, we are down on ourselves the last ten years or so. we are the only country in the world as a matter of history that every crisis we have faced we have come out better on the other side. we not only beat it -- not a joke. think about it. we have come out better than we were before we went into the crisis. and the economic and political as well as health crisis we found with covid, i was determined when we got elected. we have got to build it back better than it was, because the world is changing so rapidly. so rapidly, man. we've got keep up. we are in competition to determine whether or not we can still remain the most powerful economic force in the worlds. today i am here to talk about one of the most prescient economic concerns of the american people. and it's real. that is getting prices down, number one. number two, making sure our stores are fully stocked. and number three, getting a lot of people back to work while tracking and tackling these two above challenges i mentioned. today's economic report showing unemployment continued to fall, but consumer prices remained too high tell us the american people amidst this economic crisis the recovery is showing strong results but not to them. they are still looking out there, everything from a gallon of milk to a gallen off gas costs more. we have to face the challenges and tackle them, head on. on the good side we are seeing the highest growth rate in decades, the fastest decrease in unemployment at this point ever since 1950. jobs are up, wages are up, values are up, savings are up. but we have got problems, too. many people remain unsettled about the economy. we all know why. they see higher prices. they go to the store on line, or they can't -- they go the store or go on line, and they can't find what they always want and when they want it. and when we are tracking these issues and trying to figure out how to tack 'em them head on. my administration with the help the folks on my left over here has a plan to finish the job of getting us back to normal after the pandemic and having a stronger economy than we ever had before. let me explain the part that the ports play, why they are so critically important. it starts with a piece of good news. infrastructure we can has finally arrived. how many times have you heard over the last five years, infrastructure week is coming? yeah, uh-huh. anyway. but last week, we took a monumental step forward as a nation. and we did something long overdue and long talked about in washington. but almost never actually done. the house of representatives passed by bipartisan infrastructure bill. along with the other plans that i am advancing, this bill is going to reduce the cost of goods to consumers, businesses, and get people back to work, helping us build an economy from the bottom up and the middle out. where everybody is better off. you know, i'm tired of this trickle down economy stuff. i come from delaware, just across the line up here, and you know, we have more corporations in dl wear than every other nation in the state combine. so i understand big business. the fact of the matter is it is time they start paying their fair share. the fact of the matter is you had 55 corporations last year that made $40 billion and didn't pay a single penny in taxes. nobody is going to pay more -- if you make less than 400 grand, you are not going to pay anything more in taxes at all, period, guaranteed, including gasoline tax -- additional, from a federal government standpoint. so, look, this is a once in a generation investment, to create good paying jobs, modernize infrastructure, turn the climate crisis into an opportunity. when i talk climate to other world leaders i say think one thing. we are dealing with climate, think jobs, good jobs, because that's how you beat the climate crisis. put us on a path to win the economic competition of the 21st century. we face with china and the rest of the word. china is outspending us on research and development, china is outspending other countries as well. here's when i am going to do i am going to create good paying union jobs, union. not $12 an hour, not $15 an hour. 45 bucks an hour and up with good benefits so you can raise a family on and build the middle class out. and jobs that cannot be outsourced. you can't outsource these jobs. we are going to transform our transportation system with the most significant investment in passenger rail in the past 50 years. in roads and bridges, the most significant investment in 70 years. and investments in public transit, we've done over the period -- it's going to modernize our ports, with $17 billion in investment. $17 billion in investments. we are going reduce congestion. we are going to address repair and maintenance back logs, deploy state-of-the-art technologies and mack our ports cleaner and more efficient. we are going to do the same with our airports and freight rail. we are going the create jobs replacing lead water pipes here in maryland and every other state in our union poisoning our kids and others. we are going to make high-speed rail available everywhere in america. those of you with kids in school, we have gone to the hybrid thing, how many times have you driven your kids to the parking lot in mcdonald's and sat there using the mcdonald's internet so you could hear? i am not joking. think of this. in the united states of america, for god's sake. folks we are going to build the first ever national network of electric vehicle charging stations all across the country. ibew is going to put in over 500 thousand charging stations across the country. guess what. that's in the recovery act -- excuse me, that's in the build back better bill, which is not going to raise taxes one single cent. it is totally paid for. totally paid for. by making taxes work for people who make over 400 grand and just do their fair share. i am a capitalist. you should be a millionaire or billionaire if you can. but pay your fair share. pay something along the lines. i am going to get americans off the sidelines of ever inning, solar panels, winds turbines, energy to store paper and barts in electric vehicles for school buses and electric vehicles. we are going to make investments in natural disaster cleanup and remediation. i travelled all over the country. do you know there is $99 billion in losses being of storms this year? $99 billion. did you ever think you would hear somebody stand up and say the colorado river is being drained? did you ever think you would see more wildfires in the west and land lost, homes lost, burned to the grounds. i have groan over them in marine 1, than in the entire state of new jersey, from the cape all the way to new york. that's how much we've lost in america. so far. so far. according that economic experts, this bill is going the ease inflationary pressures, lowering the cost of working families. 17 -- excuse me d gnaw, 17 nobel laureates in economics wrote a letter to me about ten days ago saying this is going to affect -- bring inflation down, not up. best of all, the vast majority of these jobs that we are going to create don't require a college degree, don't require it. this is the ultimate blue collar blueprint to rebuild america. i'm not waiting to sign a bill to start improving the flow of goods from ships to shelves. yesterday i announced a port plan of action. it lays out concrete steps for my administration to take over the next three months to invest in our ports and relieve bottle necks. this bill is on the progress we have already made. last month i reached a deal with two of the largest ports of america. the port of los angeles and long beach. i met with you guys, with the longshoremen there, and we worked out a deal between the port owners and the longshoremen to move toward operating those two ports at 40% of everything in the pacific comes through those two ports. and they are lined up -- ships are lined out, 70-some lined up out as far as you can see. we all agreed they are going to go to 24 hours day, seven days week. it is already paying off. last week the number of container ships in the docks for more than nine days fell by over 20%. and now worry announcing steps to improve ports on the east coast to provide support for the port of savanna, the fourth largest container port in the country to help reduce congestion. with our help, they will now have the funds they need to set up five new inland port sites in georgia and north carolina so goods can get closer to their final destination more quickly. and other ports across the country will have the resources to make these kinds of immediate investments as well. the challenge we need to meet here and that my plan is going to help address has to do with the supply chain. you hear a lot about the supply chains in the news, but, frankly, not a lot of people have a clear understanding whether we have a ph.d. or they didn't go to school, about how a supply chain works. it is easy to talk about, but what's the impact on the economy? let alone how to fix it. it is perfectly understandable because supply chains are incredibly complex. as long as goods and materials are getting to where they need to go on time, there is usually no need to worry about the supply chains. but when global disruptions hit, like a pandemic, they can hit supply chains particularly charred. covid-19 stretched the global supply chains like never before. suddenly when you go the order a pair of sneakers or a bicycle or christmas presents for the family you are met with higher prices, long drooi delays or they don't have any at all. the reason for that last year has a lot to do with most companies make their product -- how they make their products today. in simple terms, supply chain is just a journey that a product takes to get to your doorstep. raw materials, plus labor, assembly, shipping, everything it take to create the finished product. these supply chains are complex. even products as simple as a pencil can have to use the wood from brazil, graphite from india before it comes together at a factory in the united states to get a pencil. sounds silly but that's literally how it happens. all of a sudden you have got covid crisis in brazil. you can't get the product maybe because the plant shuts down. that's what's happening. products like smart phones often bring together parts from france, italy, chips from the netherlands, touch screens from new york state, camera components from japan. a supply chain that crosses dozens of countries. that's just the nature of modern economy, the world economy. the global supply chains have helped dramatically bring down price we pay for thing we buy. but they also made us much more reliant on what happens in other parts of the world. so if a factory in malaysia shuts down due the a covid outbreak, which they have, it cause as ripple effect that can slow down auto manufacturing in detroit. why? they can't get the computer chips they need. it's a climate disaster to chose the port in china it can reduce the shipment of furniture and clothing worldwide and drive up prices here in america. the ironry is people have more money now because of the first major piece of legislation i passed. we all got checks for $1,400. you got checks for a whole range of things. if you are a mom and you have kids under the age of 7, you get $300 a month. if it is over 7, to 17, they are getting 360 dlds a month. like wealthy people used to do when they get back tax returns. i changed people's lives. but what happens if there is nothing to buy, you have got more money, you compete for getting the goods there. it is a problem. on one hand we are facing new disruptions to our supplies. at the same time we are experiencing higher demands for goods because as wages are up as well as -- as well as people have money in the bank. because of the strength of our economic recovery, american families have been able to buy more products. but guess what? they are not going out to dinner and lunch and going to local bars because of covid. so what are they doing? they are staying home, ordering on line, and they are buying product. well, with more people with money buying product and less product to buy, what happens? the supply chain is the reason, and the answer is you guys -- i will get to that in a minute. but what happens? prices go up. so we have got nearly 20% more goods coming into the country than we did before the pandemic struck n. 19 -- covid-19 has changed the way we spends our time and our money. more products are being delivered than ever before. that's because people have more breathing rom than they did last year. that's a good thing. but it also means we have higher demand for goods at the same time we are facing disruptions in the supplies to make those goods. this is a recipe for delays and for higher prices. and people are feeling it. they are feeling it. did you ever think you would be paying this much for a gallon of gas? in some parts of california they are paying $4.50 a gallon. that's why it is so important that we do everything in our power to stabilize the supply chain. here's the good news. yesterday i spoke with the ceos -- personally spoke with the ceos of the major retailers, walmart, target, and the leading freight movers, fedex and ups. they assured me the stores will be stocked this christmas because they signed on to 24/7 as well. they are getting more of their containers off the ports quicker than ever before because a lot of stuff on the ports that was sitting around staying there, why, because it no longer was the product they need at this moment. and it doesn't cost them anything to leave it sitting at the port rather than in their warehouse. that's moving as well. part of the reason why is because my port envoy, john pikaary has worked with the operators, the shippers -- shipping companies and unions and retailers to speed commerce so they can get products to stores and to your doors to get the shelves fully stocked this holiday season. instead of pointing fingers, we are seeing folks start to work together. railroads, ocean liners, labor, state and local governments. progress has already begun, and now we've passed the bipartisan infrastructure bill, the deal. it is only going to accelerate. you have heard me say it before. infrastructure. infrastructure used to be rated in the united states as the best in the world. when i got to the congress. today according to the world economic forum do you know where we rank in infrastructure? 13th in the world. 12 countries in the world have more modern, efficient infrastructures than the united states of america. by investing in our roads, our bridges our ports and so much else, this bill is going to make it easy for companies to get goods to market more quickly. here in baltimore you have got a port that's older than america itself and that's been operating for 315 years. any former marines in raise your hands. well, if you are here as a marine, happy birthday. it is the 347th birthday of the united states marine corps. they deserve some applause. [ applause ] look, this port is connected to the nation's oldest rail line, the b. & o railroad, which, in turn, relies on the tunnels that are about 126 years old, those tunnels. okay? the tunnel has become a major bottleneck to the port. now the port of baltimore will be getting a $125 million grant to upgrade that tunnel. so freight trains can come double stacked through that tunnel. double stacked with these cars, containers on too much them. twice as much. it will move out a hell of a lot more quickly if they are imports going out. but if they are exports going across the ocean. that means in addition to more good jobs being filled more products on shelves delivered faster and lower prices. it's about taking a long term view of our economy to deliver lower costs, more jobs, and assure our shelves are stocked with product. the longer term view means building greater resilience to withstand both the shocks and disruptions we can anticipate as the world continues to change. pandemics, weather extremes, cyber attacks, whatever else comes our way. and they are all going to come our way. you know it. we need to be ready. we need companies throughout the supply chain to create and support good-paying jobs for people that they can grow in, build skills in, join a union, make a decent living. that's when disruption hits. so when disruption hits, companies can quickly adapt, because they are invested in their workers, their skills, their training and strong foundation of what i always think unions in my family, i think of dig knit and respect. that's what it's about, dig -- dignity and respect. that's what it is about, dignity and respect. when i got elected i said, i get to spend, quote, unquote, $600 billion of your money making everything from aircraft carriers to balloons. but guess what. so much of it has been going out and getting foreign contractors to do it. well, this administration has been doing -- we set new rules to strengthen our domestic supply chain with new made in america requirements in the white house. never again should we have to rely on one company or one country, particularly when the country doesn't share our values. i have said it before. we are in a competition for the 12:21st century. who is going to own it? america still has the most roekt productive workers in the world and the most innovative minds in the worlds. that's not hyperbole. that's a fact. but other countries are closing in. we risk losing our edge if we don't act now. this nfrtsds bill is a big step forward. it represents the biggest investment in ports in american history. for american families it means products moving faster and less expensively from the factory flew through the supply chain and into your home. the fact is this, with the bill we passed last week and the steps we are taking at home and abroad we are set to make significant progress. we are already in the midst of historic mick recovery. very soon we are going to see the supply chain start catching up with demand. so not only will we see more record breaking job growth. we will so lower prices and faster deliveries as well. this work is going to be critical as we implement the infrastructure bill, as we continue to build the economy from the bottom up and the middle out. bypassing the build back better plan we need to unlock the file might and dynamism of our economy, guys, and of our people. i really mean it. and with this plan, we have set in motion -- that's exactly what we are going to do. we are going to build a better america. not a joke. we are going to lead the world again. not a joke. we are going to be in a position where we once again own the 21st century. because when we own it everybody does better. everybody. not only america, but around the world. sorry to take so long. the sun is down. you don't have a sweater on. you are going the freeze. i am going to stop talking. a man with as little hair as mine took his hat off. put it back on, you are going to get cold if i don't step down. all kidding aside, i want to thank the longshoremen, you all bruning me to the dance, man. you stuck with me from the first time i ran, and you have stepped up every time you have been asked, every time you have been asked. and i want to personally thank you while i am standsing if front of you. god bless you all, and god bless all the workers to keep our economy going. and may god protect our perhaps. thank you so very much. thank you. [ applause ] >> president joe biden at the port in baltimore articulating some of the problems people are feeling and expressing about the economy and beginning what many democrats hope will be a sustained evident to tout that help is on the way from that giant infrastructure package. joining our coverage, editor at large of the bull work, charlie sykes is here. a former white house press secretary joins us and former congresswoman donna edwards is here. all three are msnbc contributors. robert gibbs, it was a speech whose message could not be more important to this president at this moment. and i wonder how you would score it. >> well, i thought it was quite effective. and i think what you are hearing from the president is not just talk about the future investment and the benefits of infrastructure finally coming to fruition. but i was really intrigued by how he grounded it in inflation and the supply chain concerns that we know americans are having the forefront -- have in the forefront of their minds quite now. usually when we talk about economic slowdowns the american public are focused on job creation. while i think they still are, it is become secondary a bit to inflation and supply chains. i think it is interesting he put that argument forward while also not forgetting to talk about what's in the plan that's yet to pass congress, the build back better agenda. i think it's terribly important that the president continue to do this and put the substance ahead of the process which quite frankly to this point has overwhelmed the discussion. >> donna edwards, what did you think? >> first of all, i agree with robert. i thought it was really important for the president to connect people's everyday experiences, our lives right now, in terms of being able to access goods and products because of the problems with the supply chain and connect that to where we are going and rebuilding our infrastructure and providing support for families and workers through build back better. so i thought it was actually really effective. and it was very joe biden. plain language. i thought his explanation of why we are all concerned about the supply chain was highly effect ive. for those of us who don't understand the details of those things. and i think that this begins the president's, you know, drive across the united states, talking about these things in plain language so that this american people can begin to absorb that. we are going to have to hear it seven, eight, ten, 20 times between now and november 22. >> charlie, i watch any politician's speech as a former communicator. my concern was with what is distilled out of this, what is in not just the baltimore paper tony, but every newspaper tomorrow. as someone who is a hard core democracy partisan i am very hopeful that the democrats can sort of fine-tune this message and use it to address people's real concerns about stuff being more expensive and stuff taking long to come, refocus their attention on the indicators that are good. i'm not sure this was quite a finished product yet in terms of that message. what did you think? >> no. that was exactly my takeaway from this. look, this speech is necessary but it is far from being sufficient. it is necessary he does focus on the supply chain, which is a huge problem, especially coming up to christmas. it is crucial that he focuses on inflation which is now at a 30-year high. and you look at the polls, and people are overwhelmingly concerned about it. he needs to address this. and then he needs to sell what's in that infrastructure package. and one speech doesn't do it. and i think -- again, this is necessary, but this has just got to be the down payment on what needs to be a massive sales job, not just by joe biden, but by the democrats, to convince americans that they have actually done something. you know, it is something that you listen to focus groups, you look at the polls and a lot of voters don't think the democrats or the biden administration has delivered, and they don't necessarily think joe biden has been paying attention. i am not saying whether that's fair or not. but right now, he's facing some significant head winds on all of this. and i think that this is an indication that he understands what the problems are. but i also agree, he's going to have to be more -- look, he's joe biden. he is going to go on. he's going to be long winded but i think he's going to have to hone this and be able to punch these lines again and again and again. look, none of us miss donald trump. but donald trump knew how to be a salesperson. he knew how to tout it. he knew the need for the pageantry and repetition. and i think the biden administration needs to understand that as well. >> i mean, donald trump ran down the country led to unnecessary deaths and covid. i think there are better examples on the message side but i take your point. robert gibbs i want to be constructive and i want to come to you, congressman maloney wanted this exact version of president joe biden out there articulating both that i feel your pain and that help is on the way or i have your back. and i understand this is the first of many events this white house plans. but i wonder if we can be constructive and prescriptive here. what is your advice for strengthening and sharpening this message? >> well, look, i think to some degree they are going to have to do this a bunch of times. and they are going to have to pick individual instances. today the port. again, i don't think that was by coincidence. but picking each individual aspect of this. the challenge with these omnibus pieces of legislation, with big things that have lots of stuff in them is there isn't necessarily one thing you can hone in on, there is a lot of different things. nicole, i think to your point and to charlie's point -- look, if i had a nickel for every time i said this -- i bet you have said this as well. you know, the american people around going to start hearing the message until the messenger is absolutely dead tired saying the message. right? >> yeah. >> so this is the beginning. it's not the end. it's going to have to happen dozens and dozens of times. the cabinet is going to have to get involved. the entire party has to get involved. frankly, you probably need to have paid advertising around this as well. >> it is such a conundrum. it is worth pushing on this here among all of us because we know both sides of this. we have been mess i thinkers and we have covered the message. this president actually has delivered, delivered shots in the arms, and there are still checks in bank accounts as a result of policies he pushed that the democrats have passed out republican collaboration and cooperation. this bill has some scant republican support. and that's a great thing in terms of its marketing, it's a great thing in terms of this president and this white house. it may cost some republicans their jobs based on the way kevin mccarthy and donald trump are going after them. but when you have strong facts and you still have the public missing out on all that you have done what in your experience as a politician is the most effective way to bridge that gap? >> well, i think it's what charlie and robert have said, repetition, repetition, repetition. if people don't hear it over and over again, they don't really begin to absorb it. and i think that it is going to be incumbent on democrats to come up with at least part of the message that is consistent and succinct all across the country even as they individualize their experiences. i also think it helps to have people who are story tellers. you know, those longshoremen, i want to know who they are. you know, the workers who are in the steel factories who are building american steel. i want to know who they are. and i think that the more who t. over and over again that the more the american people will take in. i think we lost a lot of ground from the american rescue plan because democrats are not always really good at patting themselves on the back. not just once, but multiple times. so we've got to get, democrats have to get much better at doing that because when people hear it and hear it again, then they begin to absorb it. >> it does, charlie, reveal the differences in each party's chutzpah factor, if you will. the republicans will brag about a win, a historic loss. democrats have delivered all this stuff and they can't sort of sell it and i wonder having come from the other side of the divide what your advice would be. >> donna made a great point when she said they have to be story tellers. it's amorphous. it's not compelling. so what they also have to do is find a way to break it down. tell the stories how it creates jobs, makes americans more competitive. how it puts america back up on top. so while everybody's focused on the top lines, believe it or not, people will react to the much more tangible stories. maybe it's not going to be the biggest ticket item, but if you can show how it turns around a community, how it gives people hope, how it puts people back to work, all of those traditional american values that have been ignored in all of the culture wars. joe biden needs to go into rural america and talk about rural broadband. he needs to go into the blue collar areas and say look, you know what, the other guys want to talk to you about big bird. they want to go after mr. potato head and they want to talk about all kinds of other things. i want to put you back to work and give you good paying jobs and i want to put america ahead of china. those are the kinds of messages that i think you know, might actually resonate, but so far, they really haven't been made, but again, this is just the beginning. this is just the down payment. >> robert gibbs, you did that with healthcare. for president obama and i wonder if you can sort of speak to what maybe happening right now as we're having this conversation right now behind the scenes at this white house? >> yeah, look, i think there's a lot that's going on and i think you know, in politics, it's really about what have you done for me lately. i think there was a tough, been a tough period of time in the white house from august until this infrastructure bill passed and lots of things have combined to change and make the economy more complicated but i do think they understand the need to explain this. we all understand the aspects of this, if you talk to a pollster, they say they're all popular. but then the same pollster says well, nobody knows about them. that's the breakthrough. if you're joe biden, put him on places that are not just in front of ports in front of big crowds. go on talk shows. do interviews. get in front of people where they exist and explain to them. >> donna, in that vain, ron klain will do this show and explain. i think what frustrates democrats, don't know exactly what the direction is, how to do that. i wonder if you can speak to the stakes of getting this right. >> you know, the sales pitch needed to start and it has. it's going to have to be all hands on deck for democrats. i want to see them in those rural districts with moms and dads who were driving their children to the mcdonald's in order to get internet. these are things that will capture the attention of the american people. again, repetition and i think every democrat wants to figure out a way that whatever the -- is in their district, in their state. >> charlie, robert, donna, thank you for watching along with us. for spending some time with us. for keeping it real. white house chief of staff will be our guest in the next hour, which starts after a very short break. don't go anywhere today. y short break. don't go anywhere today. no, he's not in his room. ♪♪ ♪♪ dad, why didn't you answer your phone? ♪♪ your mother loved this park. ♪♪ she did. ♪♪ ♪ christmas music ♪ ♪♪♪ ♪♪♪ if your dry eye symptoms keep coming back, what?! no! over the counter eye drops 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that millions of americans have been tragically misled by former president trump. who continues to this day to use language that he knows provoked violence on january 6th. >> hi, again, everyone. it's 5:00 in new york. i love my party, but i love my country more. words that stand out in today's gop. with two few exception, cheney's love of country leaves her at odds with her own caucus leader as well as her party leader. this fealty to party over country has real world consequences. we saw them on january 6th. but there are also future threats created by one party making it its mission to sew distrust of our country's elections. the gop's feverish campaign to convince their voters that not only was the 2020 election result fraudulent, but to further erode faith in future elections that haven't happened yet. it now poses a national security risk. that's the claim of officials who write to congress in a new letter. those officials who served in administrations of both parties write that republican-led efforts and spread of disinformation make our elections more vulnerable. quote, in the course of our careers, many of us have analyzed the threats posed by unstable democracies elsewhere, never imagining we would see similar threats at home. sadly, that moment has arrived. we have strong democratic institutions and traditions but they're being placed in severe jeopardy in the current climate. we call on you to put in place the defenses that will safeguard the integrity. two of that letter's signers, james clapper and michael hayden reiterate their concern in a new op-ed in "the washington post." they stress what must be done to protect our country writing this, quote, meanwhile, congress must provide adequate funding to state and local governments to help them secure their election infrastructure against malicious foreign and domestic actors. legislators should also immediately enact safeguards we know will make our federal elections more resilient, such as paper ballots in the event of a dispute or attempted sabotage. as well as election workers fnd penalties for those who manipulate an election. some of these proposals have been introduced in congress and there's no excuse to delay. their letter comes just as the dhs has updated its terrorism advisory bulletin today. it states that domestic extremists continue to exploit these false narratives to promote violence online, as well as call for attacks against members of congress, public health and school officials. the national security risk posed by the republican-led assault on our democracy is where we start. john heilemann is here, host an executive producer of the circus and host of a podcast. julie davis, "new york times" congressional editor and matt miller. now an msnbc justice and security analyst. john heilemann, i keep waiting for a day when there aren't enough new developments in the threat to the homeland from the republican party, but that day was not today. >> look, nicolle. we're both very patient people. actually, i don't think any one of us are patient. we're both kind of banging our shoe on the table about this every day. no patience here. you know, but we're not getting anywhere. the thing i keep thinking is you look at these warnings, it's that the warnings about the threats grow every day. i have this inescapable sort of premonition of all of us, i mean all of us, i don't mean just the people who come on this show and fret about this openly, the country looking back on this. it wasn't like the fact we couldn't see it coming. and it wasn't like this stuff was happening below the radar. it's all happening in plain sight and so we watch it happen and liz cheney gives a speech and bipartisan groups of national security officials write letters and other people write op-eds and then nothing happens. and you know, that's sort of the, that's a story that's as old as literature, right? the story of ignorance. every time i see these warning shots fired and no one responds, i just keep thinking, a day is going to come. we're going to look back and say what are we thinking? all these people were calling it out. we did nothing. >> this a day's going to come sort of theory has been positive here, but we're in post tragedy times. are we going to look back or have built new bunkers? >> well, i mean i think the day might come where we have not yet had a free and fair national election. we've not yet, so far, as all of these authors and even the most frightened of them, the most cassandra like are saying you know, our democracy has strong institutions. it survived donald trump. the guardrails got tested, but it's still here. still standing. we were living in apock liptic times on a few different levels. we can make a list of things that are happening that sort of feel like end times. not just in america, right? i think the thing i'm worried about is that day when we look at next year's midterm election or the 2024 presidential election and we have an illegitimate government of the united states of america and everyone looks at and says well, that guy didn't win the popular vote, the electoral college, but he's in there and we realize we're no longer a democracy. >> yeah. >> we see from the 1/6 that effort was underway. the trump campaign had officials calling michigan and asking them to do just that. i want to read more from this terror advisory bulletin. to the remainder of 2021 and into 2022, racially or ethnically motivated violent extremists and anti-government, anti-authority violent extremists will continue to pose a threat to the united states. law enforcement have expressed concerns that the broad sharing of conspiracy theories that endorse the use of violence will continue to gain transaction, resulting in individuals or small groups embracing violent tactics to receive their desired objectives. what part of that does not describe mr. gosar? >> none of it. absolutely. the fact he's a sitting member of congress reveals the depth of the problem. there's such an obvious comparison with the problem the obama administration was facing with home grown terrorism. people would go online and be radicalized. they would watch youtube videos by clerics overseas and go out and conduct an act of terrorism. we had a whole of government response to respond to it. part of it was a law enforcement response where you were trying to respond to threats effectively when they happened, but part of it was countering propaganda. you can't do that in the same context when it's coming from one of the two political parties inside the united states. it's not the same. you can't fight it the same way you can fight al-qaeda or the same way you can fight isis when it's coming from the leader of the republican party. donald trump is still very much the leader of the republican party. it's coming from elected officials inside the house of representatives and it goes to this sickness inside the country and inside the republican party, which there are a lot of, there are things we can do about it. you talk about the election piece. the officials that are calling for hardening our elections against foreign attacks. very much something we need to do. there's very much more we can do to police and disrupt domestic terrorism. but actually addressing the sickness is going to take a change in the country and going to take a change in the republican party, which is why i think the thing you started this segment with, the video of liz cheney, is so important. it's clear there are people who stay in the party and fight for democracy, the rule of law, and for commitment to objective truth. a lot of people in the country who aren't going to listen to me, they're not going to listen to you, they're not going to listen to anyone in the democratic party. they're not all going to listen to liz cheney, but let's hope some of them well. >> julie, and it's wonderful to have you back on this program. very nice to see you. my question is about whether liz cheney speaks just for liz cheney or whether there are others in her caucus who see the world just the way she does. >> i think there are other people in the caucus who see the world liz cheney does, but there are very few who are willing to speak up and say what she's saying and if you look at you know, just the small segment of republicans who have been willing to vote for the creation of this investigation of the january 6th attack who were willing to vote for impeachment. who were even willing to vote for policies like infrastructure. it's a small group of people and the incentives are all in the other direction for them politically. what you're seeing is most of the people willing to speak up and say the things she's saying are people who are retiring. are people who for whatever reason have their own sort of political identity that they think they can afford to do that, but it is a real risk and i think there's a much larger really more silent sort of rank and file, i don't know if you want to call them a majority, but there are large numbers of republicans who know that this is a very damaging place for them party to be. who don't want to have the next, you know, year and a half be about how the 2020 election was stolen and you know, the next election is also going to be stolen. they don't want to talk about that. they don't even really believe that, but they are not willing to speak up and say that because it's so politically risky. the discourse in the republican party has gotten to the point where there's no room for that to be voiced. >> and to julie's point, "the washington post" reports on the 13 republicans who voted for the infrastructure package and i don't know where you would live in this country that you wouldn't think that infrastructure needed to be addressed. even donald trump tried. let me read this reporting ant how donald trump singled them out. this is from "the washington post," at a private event monday night in florida, trump took time out of his 90-minute speech to focus mostly on his baseless claims about the election anned attacking biden and took a jab at the 13 lawmakers who supported the infrastructure package. quote, i love all the house republicans. actually, i don't love all of you. i don't love the 13 that voted for biden's infrastructure plan, trump said. again, you lay that over the terrorism advisory bulletin. these are people that are anti-government, anti-violent extremists being name checked by donald trump as someone inside the government seems like putting people at an extraordinary risk. >> there was this donald trump guy who talked about a trillion dollar infrastructure plan. that's what he said when he ran for president in 2016. he loved the idea of hard infrastructure. he loved roads and bridges and all the stuff that's in this bill is all stuff that donald trump in another lifetime was for. he was not some radical. his public posture at least was not that he was a radical, anti-government, tear it all down. he wanted to build stuff. then he got into office and didn't want to do it. he's now adopting the posture which is that any republican who votes for anything that has to do with any positive kind of government activity essentially a socialist, is a markist, is effectively a terrorist who's trying to tear america down to the studs and that is of course in the context of the threat warnings and what, we didn't have those official warnings. just what we've seen out in america. i've been out a lot this year making the circus. the meanness, the violence, the threat of violence. the just under the surface anger aggression, people kind of on the verge of wanting to punch someone over a political difference is more than i've ever seen in my time covering politics and i'm sad to say it's 30 years. it's all out there. it's a dry tinderbox out in america right now. so donald trump of course is encouraging and i'll say one last thing about what julie said. i don't disagree with her reporting in the sense that there are republicans who will privately say, hey, you know, i don't agree with some of the stuff. i'm not, you know, an insurrectionist. i don't think, i don't want to election to be stolen. i want to have free and fair elections. but the bottom line is where if you believe the election is in crisis, it doesn't mean anything to have a private set of view. that you're too scared to vote on. those people are collaborationists and they're fully complicit in the kind of rhetoric and kind of anti-government stances and the things that endanger the country. i just have no time for them anymore. the ones who say on the down low, i'm for democracy, but in public, oh, no, that's far too dangerous for my political career. they might as well be donald trump. >> julie, i can see you nodding. you want to respond? >> it's actually more dangerous, right, to have people who privately may disagree with these things who are in the end, as you say earlier, john, the only people who are going to listen to you in that party. not being willing to say, you know, i think that this is all a load of buckets. this is the -- >> should be able to swear on this show. >> this election is real. i'm not going to say it on the air. but it is important for people who hold those views, who have been republicans, who have the trust of their voters to say you know, what is true and what is not true. and the reality is that many of them feel that it's too politically risky to do that, which doesn't excuse it at all. in fact, it makes it more dangerous and perpetuates the cycle because what they will say privately is that their constituents will never tolerate it and that in the end is what being a leader is. is being willing to you know, say no, no, this is not reality, this is what you need to know. i'm in the political arena. and i can see the risks here to the democracy and people need to know about that. so i agree with that completely. but i think that is sort of the essence of the problem that the republican party faces right now. that if there is -- this needs to be confronted. there are not enough people like liz cheney who are willing to step forward and do that. >> matt, you made this point, too. it's why we started with liz cheney's sound. right now in america, serving on a school board is dangerous. there are threats gens people who serve on school boards. right now in america, being an election worker is dangerous. right now, in america, being a nurse or a doctor is dangerous. there are reports in newspapers all across the country of er doctors and nurses changing out of their scrubs before they get on public transportation. right now in america, it is dangerous to be one of the 13 republicans who voted for infrastructure. something donald trump scrapped and begged for for five years and mark meadows, the ex-white house chief of staff, endorsed punishment of those members. of them being stripped of their committee assignments. this is like the mean loser boys club. what is going on? >> look, violence an threats of violence and intimidation are now a tool of the modern republican party. which is not to say that every republican supports violence or threats of violence, of course not. but they're willing to overlook it. they're willing to look the other way or condone it. and to this point about where the republican party is and what most republican party officials believe, i think the decision to far has been right. there are a lot of them still who just quietly and cowardly don't say anything. but i actually think more and more of them have adopted the tenants of trumpism. if you look at the energy in the party now, the senate candidates who are running for senate this cycle who are going to be the nominees next year and some will end up in the senate, all the energy is around the same kind of ideas. not really ideas, the same kind of demagoguery, the same kind of attacks that donald trump launched. trumpism is keen in the republican party and you see that from the senate to the house on down to officials running for local elections. it is now a party that has at its core attacking democracy. attacking truth. attacking anyone who disagrees with it and even turning to violence when they have to. >> there was an unbelievable moment. thank you all so much. when we come back, president biden's warning to republicans who continue to put party over country. we'll have a top house democrat what's happening on capitol hill. the stuff we don't see. next. plus, now that the president's sales pitch on infrastructure has begun, we'll ask white house chief of staff, ron cline, if getting things done will be enough. and kyle rittenhouse takes a stand in his own defense. don't go anywhere today. his owe don't go anywhere today. bye mom. my helpers abound, i'll need you today. our sleigh is now ready, let's get on our way. a mountain of toys to fulfill many wishes. must be carried 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infection and headache may occur. tell your doctor about your medicines, and if you're pregnant or planning to be. otezla. show more of you. we're making the fagioli! and if you're pregnant or planni♪ ♪to be. ♪ ♪ this looks great. awesome. alright. thank you! what... what recipe did you use? oh. my nonna's! she a good cook? -no. instantly clear everyday congestion with vicks sinex saline. for fast drug free relief vicks sinex. instantly clear everyday congestion. and try vicks sinex children's saline. safe and gentle relief for children's noses. last night, a warning from president biden for today's republican party for whom the work of governing has practically become a political crime. punishable by threats and shame. the president and now gop are reportedly working to punish their colleagues for voting for the bipartisan infrastructure bill. the president saying this, quote, i've never seen it before. it's got to stop for the sake of america. then the topic of bipartisanship, he said, quote, i know i get in trouble when i talk about it, but it's important. if we don't generate consensus in america, we're in trouble. joining us now, congressman jim hines of connecticut. a member of the house intelligence committee. i want to start with the threats against these 13 republican colleagues of yours. congressman fred upton received a threatening voice mail that we're not going to play here for the purpose of not amplifying the threat, but it has been verified as authentic. john catco, republican of new york, had to defend his vote. he said this. it will help improve the atrocious state of infrastructure while his office has received quote, a substantial amount of troubling phone calls. reagan cut deals all the time for the good of the country. that is what we're supposed to do. this isn't a zero sum game. punch bowl news is reporting that mark meadows has green lit a plan to punish these republicans, strip them of their committee assignments and more. >> yeah, well, it's a really sad state of affairs. you don't need to be too experienced in washington to know that just 50 years ago, nothing would have been less controversial on infrastructure and roads and bri bridges and y there's broadband and electric vehicle infrastructure, that's a new thing, but this was always bipartisan and now not only is it bipartisan, at least if you listen to people like mark meadows, it was in fact, we got a bunch of votes in the senate and house from republicans, but now this is being turned into a betrayal of donald trump. we know where he's coming from. joe biden got this done. donald trump will never be able to live with that. there are republicans like mark meadows who are being very honest that they would much rather see the american people suffer with old roads and bad bridges than actually give joe biden a win. but what really scares me about this is the language. the death threats. the republicans who voted are traitors, that it's communist. you're hearing this from somebody who lived through january 6th. it is a matter of time before a less responsible follower of donald trump or less responsible republican is going to pick up a weapon and kill someone. and i never imagined that i would be concerned about that, but here we are. i think that's a very real threat and if the republicans can't tamper back their, dial back their rhetoric, that's where this is going to end. >> you sit on the intelligence committee, i need to ask you, are you, let me just re-read what i started this hour with. the dhs national terrorism advisory bulletin was updated today. it says this. to the remainder of 2021 and into 2022, racially or ethnically motivated violent extremists and anti-government extremists will continue to pose a threat to the united states. law enforcement has expresed concern that conspiracy theories that endorse the use of violence will continue to gain traction, resulting in individuals or small groups embracing violent tactics to achieve their desired effects. so the bulletin reached the same conclusion and i wonder what sorts of things specifically go into a warning like that being made public. >> well we've just been through four years where the president of the united states gave license to those groups and we've run through the whole -- when he was asked to reputeuate the proud boys, he said stand back and stand by. all the way back to charlottesville where he said there were good people on both sides of the protests by white supremacists. they've been given license. they've been encouraged by the establishment wing of the republican party and maybe some of my republican friends would argue with that, but again, what the president of the united states says matters and when they tolerate language, we haven't even talked about the fact that one of my colleagues, representative gosar of arizona published a meme that showed him killing alexandria ocasio-cortez and attacking the president and by the way, nobody's calling for him to be sanctioned. they're calling for the folks who helped with bridges and roads to be sanctioned. i'll say it again. if this continues, somebody's going to get killed and while my colleagues will try to wash their hands of that responsibility, make no mistake, the language that is being used, the rhetoric that is being used is going to result in people being killed or hurt. >> i want to press you on paul gosar because kathy griffin, a comedian by trade, that is what she did. and i don't remember all the details. i don't want to get them wrong, but there was some imagery that got her in a lot of trouble with the united states secret service and with the justice department, law enforcement. were you aware of any efforts to follow up with mr. gosar about images just as harrowing? >> well, so i thought you know, one thing that's really important here is we can't both sides this. you can't excuse gosar's behavior because kathy griffin did something. what she did was disgusting, horrible, implied violence. let's be very clear. anyone on either side of the aisle that implies that violence is a solution to our political problems needs to be condemns as explicitly that i am condemning the imagery that comedian put forward years ago. at the end of the day, gosar is going to say it was just satire, i was screwing around with cartoons. what i want to hear is from the republican leadership saying we will not tolerate this because somebody is going to get killed. steve scalise was shot on a baseball field because you had some lunatic that thought this was okay. it is our responsibility to call that out in explicit terms, to make it clear there's no circumstance under which violence can be anything other than aggressively condemned in our political society. >> i guess my question was more about law enforcement. if they responded to an image of the ex-president that was graphic, should they not respond to an image of alexandria ocasio-cortez and joe biden that is equally graphic? >> the answer is yes and no, right? so the secret service and the police have a responsibility. there's a credible threat of violence to investigate it. now, i don't think that either kathy griffin or representative gosar was saying i want people to go out there and kill the president. or alexandria ocasio-cortez. the reason that's important is because we have a first amendment that sadly protects some pretty rotten speech. so yes, law enforcement should make sure that neither of those individuals, kathy griffin or representative gosar were explicitly threatening violence in a credible way. what we're talking about is the normalization in our political dialogue of images of violence. if that's okay and it's not. people need to start saying that loud and clear starting with kevin mccarthy. >> have you heard anything from kevin mccarthy? >> he's not checking in with me on this issue. >> nothing to say about mr. gosar. nothing. >> we've been tolerating this stuff, somebody's going to get killed. >> i hate to even say this out loud, but i fear the same thing. congressman jim himes, thank you for spending time with us. president biden has begun the selling of his huge infrastructure package with republicans fuelling culture wars and punishing those who voted for the package, how does this president convince all the voters that he needs to reach that getting big things done matters more than all that other stuff? ron klain will be our next guest to break all that down. stay with us. real short break. all that down stay with us real short break ♪ there are beautiful ideas that remain in the dark. but with our new multi-cloud experience, you have the flexibility you need to unveil them to the world. ♪ i brought in ensure max protein, with thirty grams of protein. those who tried me felt more energy in just two weeks! 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>> yes, we're inviting everyone. democrat and republican who voted for this bill. members of the house and senate. republican governors and democratic governors. republican mayors, democratic mayors. republican and democrat business leaders. they're all going to be invited to the white house to thank femme for the work they did to get this done. presidents have been talking about overhauling our infrastructure since eisenhower. this is the larnlest investment in our roads since then. in our history. largest investment in broadband, in cleaning up lead pipes. this was an historic thing. it was very, very hard to do. president trump promised we'd have infrastructure week every week. we finally got it done and we're going to thank everyone. democrat and republican, who were involved in delivering this win for the american people. the president spoke out about the dangers of singling out the republicans who voted for the bill. what are his concerns for this version of the gop? >> i think it's tragic to see the kind of division we're seeing. we were grateful. we had 19 republicans in the senate vote for the bill. that's roughly half their caucus. including the republican leader, senator mcconnell, who voted for the bill, and to his credit, went to his state of kentucky and praised this bill and talked about the jobs it would bring. we got less in the house. a lot of credit goes to the 13 republicans who did sign up and support the infrastructure bill. but it's just not healthy. infrastructure should not be a partisanship. the parties are divided on taxes, on all kinds of social issue, but there isn't really a democratic or republican bridge. there isn't really a democratic or republican road. and this is the kind of thing the party should come together, get done together. that's what president biden did. it took a little longer than president biden would have liked. it was harder than we hoped, but it takes a lot of work. joe biden said that's what he would do whenever possible and this bill is a stunning example of the success of that approach. >> before you were in charge of sort of making sure that all the levers of the federal government ran and having that job 24/7, you were a very astute political observer on these programs and many others here. your analysis on what happened last tuesday for democrats. >> i understand that voters are frustrated. we inherited a mess from donald trump. we inherited 4,000 people a die dying from covid. only 50,000 jobs being created a month. giant supply chain problems. all these problems. i'm proud of the progress we've made in these ten months, but i totally respect the view of the voters that we haven't made enough progress yet. haven't gotten enough done yet. covid is down by 75% from when we came here, but it's not done all the way. so i think we voted for saying on tuesday was you know what, not enough yet and we need to do more and that's what we're doing. again, starting next monday, signing the infrastructure bill. working with the house to pass the build back better plan. which will help bring down inflation. bring down the cost of living. bring down people's expenses. you know, we are not at mission accomplished by any stretch of the imagination, we have a lot of work to do. that's what we're doing. that's what we're about. i respect the fact that voters haven't seen enough from washington to feel good about this. >> your theory is that it's deliverables. what do you feel about youngkin's ability to sort of harness a lot of the biden voters around these visceral issues around critical race theory? >> i think it's important to learn lessons from tuesday, but not to overlearn lessons from tuesday, also. no president in his first year in office has won the election in virginia the past eight presidents in a row. up the road in new jersey, phil murphy became the first democrat in 44 years to be re-elected governor of new jersey. in 2009 when i was hear with president obama, we lost the mayoral election in new york. we won it this time. i think overall, the message from both parties to voters were frustrated that these problems aren't fixed. you need to work together. you need to deliver results. that's what we're doing. that's what we're going to continue to do. that's what we're standing for and i think if we do that, i think our political standing will improve. >> i heard the president today really trying to feel people's pain around supply chain, frustration. i don't know if i could have explained what that meant or the causes of it six months ago as well as inflation and i wonder how much of your time is spent in that building not just addressing the policy fixes, but how people are feeling about the economy because so much o the economic data is so strong. the jobs reports. they see your tweets all the time. there's so much data that goes against what people feel in their guts about the economy. >> i think we have to start with the reality of the economy, which as you say, the it was a mixed bag. there was a negative inflation report, i accept that. but there was also an inflation report that showed six weeks of decline in filings. almost back to the pre-pandemic level. the unemployment rate falling the fastest since the 1950s. what i add up in that is we're doing great job on the jobs recovery. we need to show similar results on the inflation recovery. we need to deal with the supply chain issues. that's what joe biden was elected to do. we have work left to do. that's what we're going to continue to work on at the white house and throughout the biden harris administration. >> ron klain, every problem in the world is up on your desk so i appreciate your taking some time to come out and talk to us. >> thanks very having me. >> when we come back, a dramatic day on the stand in kenosha, wisconsin. kyle rittenhouse speaking in his own defense as he faces homicide charges for killing two people during the social justice riots there last summer. the very latest on that is next. . the very latest on that is next. at t-mobile for business, unconventional thinking means we see things differently, so you can focus on what matters most. whether it's ensuring food arrives as fresh as when it departs... keeping crews connected as they help build communities... or providing patients the care they need, even at home. we are the leader in 5g and a partner who delivers exceptional customer support and facebook advertising, on us. network. support. value. no trade-offs. unconventional thinking, it's better for business. we're making the fagioli! ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ this looks great. awesome. alright. thank you! what... what recipe did you use? oh. my nonna's! she a good cook? -no. ♪ feel stuck and need a loan? move to sofi and feel what it's like to get your money right. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ move to a sofi personal loan. earn $10 just for viewing your rate — and get your money right. ♪ a dramatic and disturbing day in the courthouse in wisconsin. kyle rittenhouse took the stand, telling jurors he had no choice because he himself was under attack that night. >> i didn't intend to kill them. i intended to stop the people who were attacking me. >> by killing them. >> i did what i had to do to stop the person who was attacking me. >> by killing them. >> two of them passed away, but i stopped the threat from attacking me. >> the 18-year-old became emotional under questioning by his lawyer describing the moments before he shot one of his victims. >> once i take that step back, i look over my shoulder and mr. rosenbaum, mr. rosenbaum was not running from my right side and i was cornered from in front of me with mr. zimenski and there were -- there were -- people right there -- >> our reporter for wisconsin public radio is here. take me through this day. >> it was a surprise to everyone that mr. rittenhouse took the stand and he's been testifying all day. his lawyers started out by painting him as this go gooder life guard volunteer with the police department and ems and then it quickly turned to him going through pretty methodically the events of august 25th, 2020, and as you saw, he did fall apart briefly on the stand talking about his fatal encounter with joseph rosenbaum. all afternoon, he's been under cross-examination and it's much of what you just saw with the prosecutor trying to just get him to say you know, that he kind of had this intent to kill. and it's just been very tense all afternoon. >> harry, around which legal issues will the ultimate sort of disposition of this trial turn? >> what it should turn on ultimately under wisconsin law is whether rittenhouse is able to retreat. that's because he did insert himself, but i think that all goes out the window today when a witness and this witness in particular testifies in his own defense, what came before and what's going to come after in legal instructions all goes by the wayside. it's who wins this skirmish, this chapter. if prosecution wins and the jury buys what they're painting, then he'll be convicted. if they don't, he won't. and that's the high drama of a defendant taking the stand in his or her own defense. everything now turns on this and the rest receives. >> corri, what is sort of the sense of the judge? i see a lot of analysis on social media, but it breaks along partisan lines. what is your sense of the role the judge is playing? >> it has broken along partisan lines and today, the judge has played a big role because right after lunch, the defense asked for a mistrail. and a lot of this has been based on the prosecution trying to bring up things that in pre-trial hearings, the judge has ruled against. so this would be what mr. rittenhouse did in the days and weeks leading up to the shooting and so the judge has just been admonishing the prosecution. of course this is when the jury's out of the room, but a lot of these decisions that you know, really are coming into play with what the jury will continue to hear. >> harry, kyle rittenhouse has been celebrated by the right and what, if any role, does the partisan divide and the celebration of him by the far right play? >> you sure hope it plays none, that's the whole point of having a jury to independently assess the facts and the law, but this is what, the tenth kind of case in the last few years that play out completely on polarized ground. there are very specific issues of law it should turn on. i don't think it will. it should very much be in the courtroom and how people feel about that specific encounter. i have to say, as your reporter just mentioned, there's been some real blunders, i think, by the prosecution to date. hopefully that all gets left behind them, any polarized political feeling was either widowed out or they leave it behind. will they for certain? hard to say. we're talking beyond a reasonable doubt, unanimity requirement, that is the thing i think will be most likely to disconnect with the political partisanship that's driving this in the twittersphere. >> quick break for us. we will be right back. back. this is the greatest idea you'll ever hear. okay, it's an app that compares hundreds of travel sites for hotels and cars and vacation rentals like kayak does for flights. so it's kayak. yeah, like kayak. why don't you just call it kayak. i'm calling it... canoe. compare hundreds of travel sites for thousands of trips. kayak. search one and done. no, he's not in his room. ♪♪ ♪♪ dad, why didn't you answer your phone? 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eggland's best. the only eggs with more fresh and delicious taste. plus, superior nutrition. which is now more important than ever. ♪♪ because the way we care... is anything but ordinary. only eggland's best. ♪♪ donald trump today became our 45th president. 34 days now into the trump presidency. day 103 forred trump administration. day 454 this was. day 936 of the trump administration. good evening, once again, day 1,460 of the trump administration. joe biden becomes 37 hours from this moment our 46th president. >> from beginning to end that is how brian williams started his program "the 11th hour" nearly every night of the trump administration, and now on day 295 of the biden administration. it is for me, though, day one of how the hell are we going to do this without you, brian? brian announced last night he's leaving this network after 28 years. brian is the funniest, most generous colleague among any of us. you will see on twitter as the news broke last night, there was an outpouring, countless colleagues telling their stories about being lifted up by brian williams. i have been lifted up by brian in more ways i can count here today. i sat with brian for some of the political stories of our time has been the privilege of my life, from inauguration to state funerals to two impeachments, an insurrection and airlift of a covid-infected president over the skies of washington, d.c., i cannot imagine covering this vivid and bizarre period of american politics without you. congratulations on an epic run here. we are much less without you. i can't wait to see your next act. quick break for us. we'll be right back. it even if you're sensitive to dairy. so anyone who says lactaid isn't real milk is also saying mabel here isn't a real cow. and she really hates that. 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"the beat with ari melber" starts right now. hi, ari. hello, thank you for being with us. and we're talking about a lot. legal fireworks as indicted murderer kyle rittenhouse takes the stand in that big clash of a trial. we have a special report on that later. plus live on "the beat," the potential star witness and a local trump criminal probe dealing with the sloppy coup. we begin now with the president. moments ago he was out promoting this big spending bill, the biggest investment of the american economy in decades. the president will sign it into law monday. >> infrastructure week has finally

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