Transcripts For MSNBC American Voices With Alicia Menendez 20240709

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President biden urged unity as america reflects on the attacks. Everybody says, biden, why do you insist on bringing the country together . Thats going to affect our wellbeing and how The World responds to us knowing that we can actually, in fact, lead by example. I think we can do it. Meantime, former President George Bush honored the lives lost on flight 93 in shanksville where President Biden also paid his respects to the victims. Contrast all this with the most recent former president , native new Yorker Donald Trump didnt attend any ceremony paying tribute to the victims today. However, he visited a new York City Fire Station and released a Video Statement to mark the anniversary where he discussed the attacks for about 30 seconds. Spent more than double that time slamming President Biden over Americas Withdrawal from afghanistan. Well, other president s honored the victims Today And Trump plans to wrap up his Day Comment take thing on a pay per View Boxing Match in florida. Former President Bush warned about the rise in domestic terrorism a message strikingly different than trump defending the actions of some of the rioters on January 6th. We have seen growing evidence that the dangers to our country can come not only across borders, but from violence that gathers within. Theres little cultural overlap between violent extremists abroad and violent extremists at home. And then theres disdainful pluralism and their disregard for Human Life in their determination to defile national symbols. They are children of the same foul spirit and it is our continuing duty to confront them. The former President Speech comes as the guardian reports, quote, in the 20 years since 9 11, farright extremists killed more people in the u. S. Than did americanbased islamist fundamentalists. An intelligent report warned that racially motivated extremists pose the most lethal domestic terrorism threat. Breaking News Tonight in the most recent example of domestic terrorism. The u. S. Capitol police just announced they finished their internal investigations into Officer Conduct during the January 6th insurrection and handed over files to the Department Of Justice. While the report found no evidence any officers committed crimes, Capitol Police are recommending disciplinary action against officers in six cases, mostly for conduct unbecoming of an officer. So two decades after September 11th, how does the threat of terrorism inside our own country compare to the threat in 2001 . Joining us now to discuss, msnbc national Security Analyst Clint watts and Msnbc Daily columnist dean obeidallah. Breaking news that capitol have finished their investigation, just anything that jumps out at you there . Yeah. I think its been an open question just based on some of the video from January 6th where you saw officers in what indeed sympathetic positions opening gates. It was very confusing throughout the videos why they indeed almost on the side of the protesters. I cant say that thats what happened within these six cases because i havent seen it yet, but theres always been an underlying question about was Everybody Part of the defensive plan on that day or were some people, you know, possibly helping or just wanting to be part of the protests . I think it will be interesting to see how this shakes out. Clint, i bring that up both super its Breaking News and i want to bring up those images because it to me speaks to the way in which the contours of terrorism, the contours of our understanding of terrorism have evolved in the past 20 years. Can you sort of walk us through that . Yes. Whats been fascinating and the Counterterrorism Juggernaut we built, especially in those first Ten Years After 9 11, everything from the national Counterterrorism Center to technological advances like unmanned drones and how we went so aggressively at every one of those terrorist networks. All along, yes, there were sympathizers in the u. S. , but it was mostly overseas. Today, what you see is domestic terrorism inside our own perimeter. Its not coming from afar or even foreign. And when you look at the threat of terrorism, i think this is important to note, we dont have a domestic Terrorism Organization Distinction process that doesnt bring charges of terrorism conspiracies. Above that, these are individuals that, as weve seen on January 6th and many other places, have access to weapons, have access to targets, and have the motivation to actually good idea and carry out an attack. This is different from the foreign Terrorist Threat of Al Qaeda and the islamic state. We talked about in the last half of the decade, it just isnt the same. Today were looking at our neighbors rather than an Osama Bin laden thats far off in afghanistan. Its just a remarkable change over the last 20 years. Dean, you have a great new column out on Msnbc Daily, and you write, quote, in post9 11 america, republican politicians made the lives of Muslim Americans a Living Hell All In The Name Of appealing to the gop base. Lies and accusations against us ranged from insist that go we knew who the terrorists were but refused to turn them in to claiming that some of us cheered the 9 11 Terrorist Attacks to saying our own communities were a Trojan Horse indicating to attack america. You also, of course, lay out the stark contrast between how republicans responded to 9 11 compared to how they responded to what happened on January 6th. Tell me more. Sure. I mean, you know, ive written about Gop Hypocrisy for years. But this is very personal. Im muslim. What the gop did in ginning up hate against our community for political gain was despicable. The result was reallife consequences of some there was Hate Crimes against muslims, our places of worship were attacked. Women with hijabs punched, literally plots to kill us in groups. And you had that just to get a point of reference, right after 9 11 there was a spike in Hate Crimes. There was a lull after the first year. It went back up in 2011, 2012, and 2016 because the gop began saying minimums want a postsharia law. Donald trump took it to levels saying minimums cheered on 9 11 to saying we know who the terrorists are, to the crescendo, calling for the ban of minimums. And then you have the January 6th attack by trump supporters, hes defending them as peaceful and loving. Thats a Love Fest between him, his supporters, and the police, and we watched his supporters savagely beat the police. You have other republicans, Paul Gosar who demonized our community, republican from arizona, now defending the attackers. Marjorie Taylor Greene and the list goes on. Theres hypocrisy and then realworld consequences. The gop went in 20 years to leading the War On Terror to now leading the defense of the January 6th terrorists. Thats where they are as a party. Dean, it would be easy to have that Reflexive Question of asking why you saw President Trump defending the January 6th insurrection at the same time that he was targeting muslims, but the answer, i mean, the why is baked in, right . Absolutely. I mean, clearly if its brown minimums, were terrorists. Go get us. When its white maga supporters, theyre his friends, its Love Fest, its peaceful. These a patriots. Think about if Muslim Americans defended the 9 11 terrorists the same way Donald Trump was defending the January 6th terrorists. I think its so important that we talk about January 6th the Way Fbi Director Christopher Wray has, it was an act of domestic terrorism. Everyone who attacked the capitol is a terrorist. Dean, we have that sound, so i want to play it for you and for you are a ouchblts take a listen. I was appalled at you, our countrys elected leaders, were victimized right here in these very halls. That attack, that siege was criminal Behavior Plain and simple. Its behavior that we, the fbi, view as domestic terrorism. The problem of domestic terrorism has been metastasizing across the country for a long time now and its not going away anytime soon. Dean, with that color, pick up where you left off. Sure. It was an affect domestic terrorism. The Word Terrorism means more to us as americans. January 6th was a terrorist attack. Everyone who attacked that capitol was a terrorist. Donald trump incited a terrorist attack. Donald trump is a terrorist. The problem is some people in the media, not you, some people dont want to call white people terrorists but have no problem Calling Minimums or black people terrorists. It makes us less safe as a nation. Our Number One threat right now are domestic terrorists, primarily rightwing extremists. Im not calling all white people terrorists, if theyre involved in terrorism, call them a terrorist. It makes us safer as a nation. George bush says youre with us or the terrorist. Its unreal and its hard to intellectually comprehend. Theyre separating this man at rallies again this week in georgia and iowa, a man who said January 6th wasnt a terrorist attack. Dean invoking President George Bush. How significant did you think that speech was . I was shocked in the sense that 20 years later it would be George Bush that would call it like it is in terms of domestic terrorism in this country. It really was stunning and it was an excellent Speech Way it was written. What i find remarkable is this embrace of the idea of, hey, dont follow the law. Attack the capitol. Dont listen to, you know, new rules based on Vaccine Mandates. That is all, you know, that primers the fuel for the extremism well see. We dont have this One Type of domestic extremism, were talking about three or four different strains of domestic terrorism in our country. That was not the case. In the 90s we had domestic terrorists. Jim cavanaugh was on earlier talking about some of them. They were oneoffs. There are large militia groups planning for violence. Others are looking to protest at state and local municipal buildings. When i look at the White Supremacist forums, theres a lot of talk about Afghan Refugees and relocation into the united states. Im deeply worry about this current of domestic extremism and that plays into with a dean was talking about. Its racebased and religiousbased and its about white nationalism and trying to push that forward for political change. That is absolutely domestic terrorism. I want to remind everyone, you can read dean obeidallahs oped on republicans and the insurrectionists at msnbc. Com. Theres also a lot of great stuff we didnt get to get to that i hope youll go and read. Dean, clint, thank you so much. President bidens push to vaccinate america with mindboggling backlash from the gop. Were going to ask a doctor. Speaking of science, Climate Change waits for no one. Well talk to Congressman Ritchie torres pushing to get Infrastructure Reform passed despite some in his party calling for a pause. Later, the trial of Elizabeth Holmes and how alleged deception plays into the downfall of the Girl Boss era. First to Richard Lui standing by with the other stories were watching this hour at msnbc. Alicia, good saturday to you. Breaking news on the January 6th attack tonight. The u. S. Capitol police say it recommended disciplinary action against six of its officers for conduct during the riot. Capitol police conducted an internal investigation into dozens of cases from January 6th. No criminal charges will be filed against any officers. The taliban left its mark this September 11th. They painted their flag on an Entry Gate to the former u. S. Embassy complex. The groups new Prime Minister attended flagraising ceremony at the afghan president ial palace. Planes carrying Afghan Refugees to the united states have been halted after four refugees were diagnosed with measles. Doctors discovered the cases when the refugees arrived at u. S. Military bases overseas. The pause has not affected flights carrying americans out of afghanistan. More American Voices right after a break. And one we explore one thats been paved and one thats forever wild but freedom means you dont have to choose just one adventure you get both. Introducing the Allnew 3row Jeep grand cherokee l jeep. Theres only one. Age is just a number. And mines unlisted. Try boost® High Protein with 20 grams of protein for muscle health. Versus 16 grams in ensure High Protein. Boost® High Protein also has key nutrients for immune support. Boost® High Protein. An Amusement Park is like whooping cough, its not just for kids. Whooping cough is highly contagious for people of any age. 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Kick pain in the aspercreme. Gop backlash ensues over President Bidens Vaccine Mandate. To hear republican governors tell it, biden does not have the legal authority to protect americans from the deadly virus. The power delegated for it federal government, that is power for states to decide. In South Dakota were going to be free. We have a responsibility to stand up for the constitution and fight back and we are doing that in the state of florida. [ cheers ] the governors threatening to Sue Biden over his new covid plan, the president s response is short and to the point. Quote, have at it. If republicans do head to court over this, experts say the president s plan has a strong chance of surviving legal challenges. Once again, sobering new data from the cdc shows the dire need to get more shots in americans arms, finding unvaccinated adults are 11 times more likely to die from covid than those who contract breakthrough infections. Joining me, medical Contributor Ebony Jade hilton, medical director of good Stock Consulting and Associate Professor at the university of virginia. Hey, dr. Hilton, you have republican lawmakers claiming that the federal Vaccine Mandate, quote, ignores the science. That hurts my head and im not even the scientist. New england two of us. How do you counter that. What is your place of employment in that the gop, what they have to realize is they literally are killing their own base. What we know for sure is that 30,000 americans died of covid in august. Were on track to see 40,000 americans dying in september. We know that 30,000 children were diagnosed literally the entire month of august, 1,000 kids diagnosed today. If youre looking at whos getting these cases, those states led by the gop are two times higher Case Rate if youre looking at those counties run by trump by more than ten points. We know kids that are in those predominantly republican states are four times higher chances of seeing infections because of the low Vaccination Uptake of those states. And so it has consequence, that is not even politically favorable for them, so it makes absolutely no sense. President biden showing his frustration with the unvaccinated feeling that many americans share. Take a listen. What more is there to wait for . What more do you need to see . We made vaccinations free, safe, and convenient. Weve been patient, but our patience is wearing thin. And your refusal has cost all of us. Dr. Hilton, you have been very cautious and you have reminded me many times about the challenges of drawing a line between the vaccinated and the unvaccinated. You also have the White House now requiring major companies to offer employees paid leave in order to get vaccinated. Your sense of how much of a difference it will make to those final holdouts . It would make a tremendous difference. I think there are certain people holding out because they wanted someone to push them to the edge that they may have wanted to because of their social circles who are afraid to get vaccinated. But i think its just the right thing to do. We have to hold employers also accountable. I love that he did say you have to give a person a paid Leave Day to be able to go and get vaccinated. When were talking about rolling these out to our schools, we need to think about those single parents who will have to take their children to get vaccinated. They too should not have to be held accountable and lose pay because of that because theyre trying to do the right thing. But thats going to be the only way were going to get over this hump. As far as our national efforts to be a part of this global plan of ending this pandemic, its by getting every american vaccinated and it needs to happen sooner rather than later. Dr. Hilton, you talked about schools. An l. A. School district just announced a Vaccine Mandate for students ages 12 and up. I wonder if you think that is something well be seeing in more School Districts and what that would mean for the return to the classroom. Yeah, i think we have to. Unfortunately, what were seeing is that more and more of our children are being infected. We see in hispanic how were having outbreaks literally every other day. In South Carolina i just heard a report thats where my family lives. One of my cousins is a teacher in lancaster county. A 16yearold died. Were seeing teachers getting infected. We know we have a shortage of educators and they are literally preparing our future to be able to remain this Power House globally. So we cant afford to handicap our exsystem because of this pandemic and the inability to vaccinate both our staff and then getting down to our children. We talked a lot about testing and thats coming into focus again, especially as we head into Cold And Flu season. The biden administration increasing production of Rapid Covid tests, and thats despite some brands having a high rate of false negatives. Can you just talk us through thE Tradeoff between testing access, which theres clearly a need and an appetite for, and accuracy at this point in the pentagon . Right. I think even if we have false negatives, any testing we can do is going to be the best thing. What i do caution this administration, we oftentimes Center Privilege with our action. If youre looking at it f were offering those tests at cost in walmart, you also mentioned amazon and other agencies saying were going to offer it at cost, well, unfortunately right now were seeing millions of americans facing eviction. They dont have the money to afford that test. These need to be readily available and free in their location. Even if were replacing those in pharmacies and within the kroger of The World, we know black and brown communities are four times less likely to have a Grocery Store within their community. Theyre twice as likely to not have a hospital within their community. And those mobile clinics we Saw Littering the streets in january and february, theyve now gone. Theyre no longer in the Church Parking lots. Theyre no longer sitting in the Grocery Store as you entry. How are we approaching equity and black and brown children are literally three to five times likely more to die in comparison to white children. Are we looking at the cause of why theyre getting infected in the first place and when theres no Ventilation Or Window to open. We have to attack those and become real in approaching equity. Dr. Hilton, appreciate your emphasis on equity. Thank you so much. Next, the proof is before us. Americas infrastructure is not ready for the elements Climate Change is bringing us. Well talk to Ritchie Torres about his push for Infrastructure Reform as one of his fellow democrats calls for a pause. They are no, sir, ceo Elizabeth Holmes gets her day in court, one of many examples are saying gibe to the era of the Girl Boss. Saying Gibe Ttohe Era of the Girl Boss. Limu Emu Doug got a couple of bogeys on your six, limu. They need customized Car Insurance from Liberty Mutual so they only pay for what they need. What do you say we see what this bird can do . Woooooooooooooo. We are not getting you a helicopter. Looks like were walking, kid. Only pay for what you need. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Dont settle for products that give you a sort of white smile. Try new Crest Whitening emulsions for 100 whiter teeth. Its highly active Peroxide Droplets swipe on in seconds. Better. Faster. 100 whiter teeth. Crestwhitesmile. Com trelegy for copd. 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That was laid bare by the flooding we saw in new York City when remnants of Hurricane Ida slammed all five boroughs in new york alone more than a dozen were killed, including children. Some of the victims trapped by flooding in their Basement Apartments. Joining me now, new york Congressman Ritchie torres who represents the South Bronx. Congressman, before we get into the politics of this, i just want to know, as you toured your own district, as you talked to your own constituents, what sort of struck you most . Weve been through so much here in new York City between the mass graves in the early period of covid19 and the almost biblical flooding from the remnants of Hurricane Ida. Theres a sense in which we feel like were living through the apocalypse as new yorkers. In my opinion, Joe Manchins pause is a suicide pact. Climate change is making the planet less livable. It is causing more wildfires, more heat waves, more flash floods, leading to death and displacement. Climate change is not taking a strategic pause and neither should we. In new York City we saw two record rainfalls in the span of one week. Tshld be a Wakeup Call to all of us that we cannot afford to be complacent about Climate Change and we have to build an infrastructure for the 21st century. Heres the thing. It has become very common now this is a good thing to talk about Climate Change as a racial justice issue. And it feels to me watching what we saw happen in new york, watching the intersection of the realities of housing, who lives in that housing, the reality of where these floods hit, it all was illustrated so clearly, right . Its not as though talking about Climate Change and talking about racial justice and talking about infrastructure are talking about three different topics. These topics merge together to impact peoples lives, congressman. No question about it. Communities of enclose are in places like the South Bronx will bear the greatest burden of Climate Change. Climate is not only about the environment, it artifacts every aspect of our life. New York City is living at the intersection of the Climate Crisis and the housing crisis. As the city has become less and less affordable, more and more people are living in illegal Basement Apartments which became Death Traps in a world of Climate Change. Can you give us a sense because this Infrastructure Bill is, of course, sprawling and massive, the changes if this bill were passed what it would mean for a district like yours, what it would allow you to do. Well, the build back better act includes a host of policies beyond Climate Change, but it would enable us to create resilient infrastructure, hopefully more posture pavements, more green roofs so we can absorb water and prevent severe flooding. It would expand the child tax credit, which would cut Child Poverty in half and create more affordable housing so that people no longer have to live in illegal basements which become Death Traps during periods of heavy flooding. And it would prepare us for the next Pandemic And Shore up our domestic manufacturing of critical supplies. Senate democrats pushing to Claw Pathway to citizenship in the package. Of course we are all watching and waiting to see what the Senate Parliamentarian will decide. How would that actually help the economic recovery that we keep talking about in the wake of this pandemic . Many of i consider them fellow americans. Many of our fellow americans living In The Shadows were essential workers who put their lives at risk during the peak of the pandemic so that most of the country could safely shelter in place. And we owe them the opportunity to become citizens and to go through a legal process. It frustrates me were at the mercy of the Senate Parliamentarian and i hope that we can provide a legal pathway to citizenship to reconciliation. All right. Congressman Ritchie Torres, as always, thank you for joining us and thank you for your time. Next, rising from the ashes, a church resurrected after being demolished on 9 11. From one of the churchs faithful, resurrecting st. Nicholas could not be more personal. Tuned] welcome to allstate. [band plays] a place where everyone lives life wellprotected. And even when things go a bit wrong, weve got your back. Here, things work the way you wish they would. And better protection costs a whole lot less. Youre in good hands with allstate. Click or call for a lower Auto Rate today. Youre in good hands with allstate. We did it again. Verizon has been named americas most reliable network by rootmetrics. And our customers rated us 1 for Network Quality in america according to j. D. Power. Number one in reliability, 16 times in a row. 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And now it is being as a national shrine. Nbcs Gabe Gutierrez has the remarkable story of the resurrection of st. Nicholas. When the towers fell and faith was tested, in Lower Manhattan one House Of Worship endured the unthinkable. You saw this kind of evil that was beyond comprehension. How could any Human Being do such inhuman acts against innocent people. Reporter In The Shadow of Twin Towers, st. Nicholas stood defiantly, Turning Out Buyout offers from eager developers. It was founded in 1916 when greek immigrants turned a tavern into a church. St. Nichols was this tiny church in a parking lot, and he knew the hours that it was opened. Either before work or after work, he would swing by and light a candle. Reporter her brother, john, was a Bond Trader who worked on the 104th Floor of the north tower. What do you miss moat about him . I miss his smile. I miss the way he would walk into a room and just light it up. I miss his childish antics. I miss his hugs. Reporter on the ground, his church would also soon be lost. This image shows part of a Planes Landing Gear in the parking lot. Everyone inside the building escaped in time, but this pillar of the greek community was thought to be destroyed under a pile of steel and ash. Then came a realization. We couldnt have our brother back, my brother back, but we knew that st. Nichols would be resurrected. Reporter for 20 years the greek Orthodox Church has struggled to rebuild st. Nichols nearby, this time as a national shrine. We thought it would be a 25 Million project. It was actually about a 55 million, 60 Million project. Reporter the father watched the Construction Begin in 2015, but the money and private donations ran out. Some money was spent on other expenses was the archdiocese. I was surprised. I quickly addressed it with the archbishop. There was an error of judgment made. All of that has been restored. Reporter Michael Seros funds a nonprofit, friends of st. Nichols which raised the rest of the money. It is literally the triumph of light over darkness. Reporter crews had been working virtually around the clock to install translucent greek marble, even unfinished, the dome is majestic. And last night, two decades since The World came crashing down, a church once In The Shadow of the Twin Towers shined its light for all to see. The resurrection of st. Nichols will bring so much Hope O into our lives because it will be a beacon of light for so many. Greek and Nongreek Orthodox alike. And i think hed be really proud and really happy that it would bring some sort of comfort to his family. Wow. That was Gabe Gutierrez reporting. Well be right back. For skin that never holds you back dont settle for silver 1 for diabetic dry skin 1 for Psoriasis Symptom Relief and 1 for eczema Symptom Relief Gold Bond Champion your skin ever notice how stiff Clothes Gold Bond can feel rough on your skin . 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Holmes has no extensive medical background and the devices she spent years touting, they never worked. In fact, this week prosecutors cited cases of those who got inaccurate results from her machine to explain why her scheme was medically dangerous. But to hear her lawyers tell it, their client is not a liar, just a failure. Nbcs Natalie Morales has more. Im the Founder And Ceo of this company. Anything that happens in this Country Company is my responsibility at the end of the day. And i hold myself responsible for that. Reporter that was Elizabeth Holmes in 2016, well before her world and her company, theranos, collapsed. She graced magazine covers as a Game Changer who started a Health Care Tech company at 19. With the idea to draw and analyst analyze blood with a tiny pinprick, turning it into indiana 9 Billion business. John kerry broke the story in the Wall Street Journal in 2015, exposing the companys allegedly faulty technology and reporting on what the u. S. Attorney called a scheme to defraud investors, doctors, and patients. Id say where she crossed the bright Red Line is in fall of 2013 when she commercialized a product, a medical product that she knew did not work. Reporter holmes and theranos coo Sunny Balwani were indicted on two charcoals of conspiracy to commit Wire Fraud and multiple counts of Wire Fraud. Both deny all charges against them. But shocking new Court Documents reveal her defense will likely present her as a victim, claiming a decadelong abusive relationship with balwani, her exboyfriend. Holmes attorneys writing that Balwanis Control included monitoring her calls, text messages, and emails, physical violence such as throwing hard, sharp objects at her, restricting her sleep, monitoring her movements, and insisting that any success she achieved was because of him. And further claiming mr. Balwani controlled her so much, essentially dominating her and erasing her capacity to make decisions. I think its an opportunity for her to get the jurors to sympathize with her. She does have incredible charisma. She can put on a terrific act. Reporter balwanis attorneys are firing back saying ms. Holmes allegations are deeply offensive, devastating personally to him. That was Nbcs Natalie Morales reporting. Zoom out the ant. If theranos wasnt a scam, it would be easy to consider its disgraced ceo a Girl Boss, celebrating women in positions of power. But the Girl Boss trope now faces a reckoning. Former Teen Vogue Executive editor joins me now. You took so many things that were in my brain that i have thought about this and put them on paper. So im really glad that were going to get a chance to talk about this. But i want to start with what we see in the case of Elizabeth Holmes. How is it possible that someone could have an idea that is nothing more than a dream and get it to this point . Right. You know, i think its really important to look at the bigger systemic issues here. I now think Elizabeth Holmes is maybe not the best example of the kind of Hashtag Girlboss. These allegations are far more grave than merchandise thats, like, a little too chirpy and pink. But i do think that, you know, you do have to look at this bigger ecosystem that props up certain Figure Heads and doesnt hold them accountable. And you have to wonder, you know, why did the investors never say, you know, youre not a doctor. Like, how do you know if the Technology Works . What kind of qualifies you to actually do this . And i think that one of the things weve seen in startups is that especially for womenled startups, women become these faces, these icons, and its very easy for them to fail because theyre not always, as we see here, fully fact checked or vetted. Lets do some termsetting for me. What are you defining as a Girl Boss . So to me Girl Boss is synonymous with the idea of house holed culture, Hashtag Girlboss and it means a woman whos unapologetic about getting ahead in her career, wanting kind of, you know is openly and nakedly ambitious. But i also think its, you know, the next generation of, you know, girls having it all, the next iteration of lean in. So it really is a Pop Culture Reference to a real experience for women, i think, which is how do you kind of get ahead in the workplace, but not have it be to threatening. Part of why it was popular is women are often disparaged if theyre power hungry or too ambitious in the workplace. So calling them a girl, making it a cute little Hashtag Makers it a lot more accessible to say, you know, i work hard, im cutthroat, but Hashtag Girlboss. At the end of the day, they were building businesses and there was an assumption that because they were women building businesses, the businesses were inherently going to look different. There is of course the other side of the equation, which is the investors that are saying were giving you money to build quick and to show us results. That part of story did not get as much attention. Absolutely. So its very easy, again, when you have these kind of figureheads to cancel them, to hold them accountable. Thats not to say that many of these Girl Boss reckoning have had extremely credible and quite dubious work environments. So i think we do need to hold that, and especially if your business is espousing it. But the other is that many of these behaviors are things that are celebrated in men, right, to pivot, to be a little bit indecisive, to be the disruptor, especially when you have an influx of venture capital money. If someone gives you 75 Million for you to build the company of your dreams, thats a tremendous amount of pressure. You have the investor pressure. Weve seen it happen with a lot of startups, not just womenled startups. It just happens to be that the women are the ones that seem to be on the hot seat these days. Because i wrote a book called the likebility trap, i am obsessed with your article because it offered what seems like a third way, that you could navigate these questions of being seen as too assertive or too aggressive by putting cute labeling on things and then having it sort of soften up the overall image. The problem, of course, was that this just created a new and different trap. Talk to us about what that looked like. Absolutely. So part of my motivation to write this piece is, you know, i have been again, i worked at Teen Vogue so i worked with a lot of Young Women. While i thought its important were having this moment in journalism where were holding powerful people accountable, i felt in a there was a missing piece of the conversation, which is a lot of the Young Women that absolutely benefit from these narratives. Whether they benefit or not, i think, is still tbd. We know many of us are Navigating Smgz that are unfair and using a Hashtag Isnt going to help us advance in these fairly big structural inequalities like the pay gap. However, when you are a young woman trying to navigate, especially a young woman of color, you may not have access to funds or Infrastructure And Support to get ahead in the workplace. The idea of hustling to get where you want to go is actually very valuable. You have to kind of fake it till you make it, which they say a lot in the theranos documentary. I cringed every time they said it. But its true. On some level, there is an aesthetic to it and a manifesto that helped a lot of Young Women and i didnt want to lose that because we should be criticize critiquing these systems and always be looking at the bigger structural inequality. But as one of the women i quote in the piece says, helping women, ask for more money in the workplace, ask for more power, ask for more determination over their Work Day is never a bad thing. I got 30 seconds left in which to ask you a super complicated question, of which you are writing about. How, then, do you actually create a workplace that works for women . Absolutely. And i think that this is, you know, obviously a much bigger conversation in terms of, you know, the role that i think, you know, Workplace Organizing can take in advocate for employees, the conversations that we need to start having with our managers, but also recognizing that these are systemic issues. And so individual advancement, while it is important, it will not ultimately change a broader system but, frankly, benefits from women being paid less. And i think as long as we keep pushing that bigger conversation, that is the first step, while also recognizing that us as individuals still have to negotiate when we are offered jobs. Yes. It is that exact Core Tension of what is happening now and the structural change. At the top of the hour, its the week with joshua johnson. Hell talk to Raja Krishnamoorthi about the biden administrations new push to get americans vaccinated. That is 8 00 p. M. Eastern only on msnbc. And one we explore one thats been paved and one thats forever wild but freedom means you dont have to choose just one adventure you get both. Introducing the Allnew 3row Jeep grand cherokee l jeep. Theres only one. This is how you become the best [music youre the best by joe esposito] [music youre the best by joe esposito] [triumphantly yells] [ding] dont get mad. Get E Trade and take charge of your finances today. Youve been taking Mental Health meds, and your mind is finally in a better place. 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Com in business, its never just another day. Its the big sale, or the big presentation. The day where everything goes right. Or the one where nothing does. With Comcast Business you get the network that can deliver Gig Speeds to the most businesses and advanced cybersecurity to protect every device on it all backed by a dedicated team, 24 7. Every day in business is a big day. Well keep you ready for whats next. Comcast business powering possibilities. Back with a live look at Lower Manhattan and the Tribute In Light to those wo died in the September 11th attacks 20 years ago today. Tonight, a special look Tailgates Day through stories of those who survived. Catch an Encore Presentation of Memory Box echos of 9 11 tonight, 10 00 p. M. Eastern, only on msnbc. Thats all the time i have for today. Im alicia menendez. See you back here tomorrow, 6 00 p. M. Eastern for more American Voices. For now, i hand it over to my colleague, joshua johnson. Hello, joshua. Hello, alicia. Thank you very much. Hello to you. It is good to be with you this evening. Tonight, america mourns the attacks of September 11th just days after ending the war in afghanistan. 20 years later, what have we lefthander about the limits of Military Power . President bidens new Vaccine Plan comes as covid deaths average more than 1,000 per day. What difference could his mandates make . Congressman Raja Krishnamoorthi is here to discuss. And the Department Of Justice is suing over the new Abortion Law in texas. How likely is it to stop the law or just delay the end of roe v. Wade . From nbc News World Headquarters in new york, im joshua johnson. Welcome to the week

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