Week . No. Good. Other than the fact that you are achieving new levels of perfection every day. Youre always ascending, right . So heres the thing. Im coming from a different undisclosed location this week. Its supposed to look like all of my unclosed locations. This one is a couple thousand miles away from my last undisclosed location. Rachel, heres the thing. Heres the thing. Its the first time im not going to say where i am. Its the first time in a year and a half that you and i have been doing our shows in the same state. So we can just kind of Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/leave-it'>Leave It at that and youre in narnia too . We havent been this close since 2020. Its like, february, first week of march 2020. It takes me back. I totally thought that i had locked up the wardrobe and i was the only one who could broadcast from narnia. But now that i know youre here, im going to come find. You the same state. Thank you, rachel. Thanks, compadre. As of tonight, and this could change because things could take a dramatic turn for the worst at any moment. But as of tonight, president Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/joe-biden'>Joe Biden is managing the most successful Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/american-military'>American Military evacuation from a war that america lost. As of tonight, the biden administration and the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/american-military'>American Military have managed to evacuate 7,000 people from afghanistan after the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/capitol-city'>Capitol City of kabul came under the control of the people who won the war. In vietnam in 1975 after saigon, then the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/capital-city'>Capital City of Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/south-vietnam'>South Vietnam fell under the complete control of the north vietnamese army, republican Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/president-gerald-ford'>President Gerald Ford was able to get absolutely Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/no-one'>No One out of vietnam, Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/no-one'>No One. In those final days before the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/last-american-helicopter-left'>Last American Helicopter Left saigon, leaving thousands of our allies behind, the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/ford-administration'>Ford Administration and the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/american-military'>American Military were able to evacuate a total of 7,000 people. The Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/bidenrun-evacuation'>Bidenrun Evacuation is well on its way to evacuating many more people than the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/american-military'>American Military was able to evacuate from vietnam in the final days. In vietnam, Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/the-americans'>The Americans were being driven out of the country at gunpoint. In afghanistan so far, the taliban have not fired a shot at the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/american-military'>American Military. In both desperate Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/lastminute-vaugsz'>Lastminute Vaugsz evacuations, the military did its very best. The final days in both are filled with stories of american heroism, but they are also demonstrations of Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/the-americans'>The Americans ability to invade a country, spend 20 years losing a war, and then evacuate in a way that meets with the approval of an Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/american-news-media'>American News Media filled with people who think they know how to do what the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/american-military'>American Military has never been able to do. What youre not hearing in any of the critical analysis of how the biden administration and the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/american-military'>American Military have handled the evacuation of afghanistan is the example of who has done this sort of thing better. No one is telling you that the russians did a much better job of invading afghanistan, losing the war there, and then evacuating. No one is holding up the russian evacuation of afghanistan as the model. No one is holding up the evacuation of any defeated army from a foreign country as the model. And of course Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/no-one'>No One is holding up the american evacuation of vietnam as the model of how to do this because the american evacuation of vietnam was much, much worse in every way, by every measure. Every war produces a limitless flow of tragic individual stories. The end of every war produces a similar flow of tragic, individual stories. But no individual story can tell you what your Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/war-policy'>War Policy should be or should have been. If this is your first experience with watching people left behind in war, then use it to decide whether you will support the next american war. But if you use it as an example of something you know how to do better than the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/american-military'>American Military, then you are making the mistake of believing that the madness of war can be managed. The Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/american-military'>American Military does not know how to manage the madness of war. Catch22 is a pHrase that has entered our daily vocabulary to describe impossible situations. 60 years ago, Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/joseph-heller'>Joseph Heller put that pHrase in our vocabulary tHrough the title of his Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/war-novel'>War Novel catch22, which captures the clumsy and inefficient processes of the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/american-military'>American Military, which he experienced first Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/hand-serving'>Hand Serving in Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/world-war'>World War ii. Armies are not efficient machines. Armies are not run like automobile affects when the ceo of ford became the secretary of defense during the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/vietnam-war'>Vietnam War. That organizational master, Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/robert-mcnamara'>Robert Mcnamara was lost in that job, as lost in that job as any of the the other secretaries of defense during the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/vietnam-war'>Vietnam War. The Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/american-military'>American Military is a massive bureaucracy that does some things well. But the thing that it does not know how to do is the same thing that no military in the world knows how to do, and that is organize a dignified and honorable retreat and full evacuation from a war that we lost in a foreign country without leaving anyone behind. When someone tells you that the evacuation from afghanistan could have been run better, ask them why that has never happened before in history. Ask them why this should be the very first time in history that a desperate, lastminute Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/military-evacuation'>Military Evacuation from a lost war should not be chaotic and messy. President biden is now being criticized for saying he knew it would be chaotic. President biden was a united Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/states-senator'>States Senator when he watched the chaotic exit from vietnam. Of course he knew this was going to be chaotic. And of course he could not say that publicly grt chaos developed because such a statement by the president would have immediately created the chaos. The Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/american-news-media'>American News Media is very good at telling you the tragic individual stories of war, and it is very good at forgetting those stories. So far n all the tragic stories being presented to us about people struggling to get out of afghanistan, people who deserve our full sympathy and support, there is no story quite like the story of two friends who were left behind in vietnam. Gorgeous, Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/gorgeous-blue'>Gorgeous Blue eyes. Long eyelashes of which i was very envious. Thats how darwin Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/judges-sister'>Judges Sister remembered him. Darwin judge was a Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/19yearold-lance'>19yearold Lance corporal in the marine corps from Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/marshaltown-iowa'>Marshaltown Iowa who spent less than two months in vietnam before he was killed. He did not die alone. His 21yearold marine corporal buddy, Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/charlie-mcmahon'>Charlie Mcmahon, from a suburb of boston, was right besides him when they were both killed in a rocket attack. That was Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/charlie-mcmahon'>Charlie Mcmahons Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/11th-day'>11th Day in vietnam. Charles mcmahon and Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/darwin-judge'>Darwin Judge became the answer to Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/john-kerrys-family'>John Kerrys Family question in his senate testimony as a Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/vietnam-veteran'>Vietnam Veteran against the war, how do you ask a man to be the last man Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/to-die-for'>To Die For a mistake . It turns out, there were two men, Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/charles-mcmahon'>Charles Mcmahon and Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/darwin-judge'>Darwin Judge, hit by the same rocket attack. They were in vietnam to help manage the final desperate exit. They were there to protect the people trying to get on those final helicopters. They might have been on that final helicopter on april 30th, 1975, if they had lived just one more day. The day after Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/charlie-mcmahon'>Charlie Mcmahon and Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/darwin-judge'>Darwin Judge were killed in action, the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/last-american-helicopter-left'>Last American Helicopter Left saigon. And left their bodies behind. In a hospital in saigon. It was a mistake. It was the kind of mistake the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/american-military'>American Military can make in a situation like that. The Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/american-military'>American Military did not just leave behind friendly interpreters in vietnam, they did not just leave behind interpreters who helped reporters in vietnam. They did not just leave behind friendly allies who helped the military and worked on Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/american-military'>American Military bases. They also left behind hundreds of babies and children who were fathered by american soldiers over the 18 years of the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/american-military'>American Military involvement in vietnam. And they left behind the last two men Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/to-die-for'>To Die For the mistake of the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/vietnam-war'>Vietnam War. They left Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/charles-mcmahon'>Charles Mcmahon and Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/darwin-judge'>Darwin Judge behind. Massachusetts senator ted kennedy went to work for his constituents, the mcmahon family, and a year later he managed to secure the return of the soldiers. Senator kennedy never criticized Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/president-ford'>President Ford for leaving them behind. Senator kennedy never said he had a better idea about how to manage the evacuation of american troops and american allies from a war that we lost. The democrats did not attack republican Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/president-gerald-ford'>President Gerald Ford for how he handled the exit from a war lost by democratic and republican Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/president-s'>President S. The governor of georgia, who was an Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/annapolis-graduate'>Annapolis Graduate and a navy veteran, was running for president on the day that the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/last-american-helicopter-left'>Last American Helicopter Left vietnam, and he did not criticize. How republican Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/president-gerald-ford'>President Gerald Ford managed that evacuation, because Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/jimmy-carter'>Jimmy Carter knew there was no good version of an evacuation from a lost war. No one was surprised by the chaos and the dishonor of the american Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/final-exit'>Final Exit from vietnam. The world was not surprised. Every day of the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/vietnam-war'>Vietnam War was chaos, including the final day. Just a year after the evacuation from vietnam, at the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/democratic-national-convention'>Democratic National Convention in his Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/acceptance-speech'>Acceptance Speech for his president ial nomination, Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/jimmy-carter'>Jimmy Carter said this. Ive never had more faith in america than i do today. We have an america that involved dylans pHrase, is busy being born, not busy dying. [ applause ] in that speech, Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/jimmy-carter'>Jimmy Carter did not criticize Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/geralds-management'>Geralds Management of the evacuation from vietnam. None of the antiwar protesters that demand a withdrawal from vietnam attacked his management of the final withdrawal from vietnam. No one in the antiwar movement, including the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/vietnam-veteran'>Vietnam Veterans, believed that they had a better idea about how to evacuate a lost war or that the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/american-military'>American Military was capable of doing a better job of evacuating from a war that they lost. The lesson of the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/vietnam-war'>Vietnam War and the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/war-in-afghanistan'>War In Afghanistan, including the last days of those wars is not that we have to teach Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/west-point'>West Point classes of future generals how to safely and honorably evacuate from our lost wars without leaving anyone behind. The lesson for a country that has not won a war since 1945 is, stop launching wars of dubious legality and unclear moral purpose that we do not know how to win. The people who own the american exit from the afghanistan war are the people who advocated launching that war and, more importantly, the people who never learned, the people who never stopped advocating for continuing that war. Leading off our Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/discussion-tonight'>Discussion Tonight is someone who was there in the thick of our politics in the immediate aftermath of the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/vietnam-war'>Vietnam War, Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/james-fellows'>James Fellows a speechwriter for president ial candidate Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/jimmy-carter'>Jimmy Carter and then speechwriter for president Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/jimmy-carter'>Jimmy Carter. Hes now a Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/staff-writer'>Staff Writer for the atlantic. Thank you for joining us tonight. I find discussions that do not involve memories that range as far back at 1975 this week to be rather frustrating, so im glad youre here. One thing im fascinated by is how the evacuation of vietnam did not become the political football that the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/afghanistan-evacuation'>Afghanistan Evacuation has become instantaneously. Thank you for the setup you did. I agree with everything you were presenting about the horrors of that Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/war-generations'>War Generations ago, and of course there are horrors now, but when you start a war, you buy into Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/the-end'>The End of that war. And i agree the solution Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/jimmy-carter'>Jimmy Carters finest achievement was that he did not go to war when he was in office. As you probably recall, as a very young man then, the mid1970s there were horrors on every front. The first american president in history to resign, Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/richard-nixon'>Richard Nixon, the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/watergate-scandal'>Watergate Scandal after the fall of saigon, there were, again, the horrors of the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/khmer-rouge-onslaught'>Khmer Rouge Onslaught in cambodia. That part of Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/carters-campaign'>Carters Campaign as part of the democratic nomination and against Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/gerald-ford'>Gerald Ford was to talk about the tragedy of Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/vietnam-and-cambodia'>Vietnam And Cambodia as opposed to the tactically failure of the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/ford-administration'>Ford Administration, those final days, and that the united states needed not to put itself in that situation again and to learn from that tragedy and to do better as opposed to, you know, what we have been seeing in the last week, as you pointed out. We have a polling now saying that 62 now believe that as of a couple days ago anyway that fighting the afghanistan war was not worth it. Its hard to imagine, you know, support for the afghanistan war going up from there at this point. And so the president is doing something that 62 of the country thinks should be done. When you say not worth fighting, that means theyre saying it shouldve been done years ago. Should have been done. I think theres a whole separate debate about the date when the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/war-in-afghanistan'>War In Afghanistan was lost, and i think that was in Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/december-of-2001'>December Of 2001 when the leaders of the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/bush-administration'>Bush Administration decided Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/o-stop'>O Stop concentrating on afghanistan and began preparing for the invasion of iraq. Everything since then has been a sequel from that time. I think there has been what Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/joe-biden'>Joe Biden said in his remarkably blunt speech earlier this week was that he realized that he was not going to be he was not going to pass this Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/war-onto-a-fifth'>War Onto A Fifth president , it having been on the watch of four Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/president-s'>President S, including him. So i think the polling and just they suggest most people in the u. S. Even recognizing the tragedies that are happening right now, that even recognizing that there are this was not not a wise use of american power. I want to use both of your hats. As someone who worked in the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/white-house'>White House and as someone who worked in the news media. Many in the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/washington-press'>Washington Press corps have been relishing in the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/gotcha-moment'>Gotcha Moment with the president and they think they got a Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/gotcha-moment'>Gotcha Moment because Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/joe-biden'>Joe Biden is saying after the fact that hes not surprised that theres chaos. He obviously is old enough to have seen the vietnam chaos, hes not surprised by the chaos. He didnt say that before the fact. Now, i made the point that a Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/president-of-the-united-states'>President Of The United States could never say before the fact that there will be chaos possibly or likely in a situation like this. What is it like for you as a member of the press when you watch a Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/president-kind'>President Kind of trapped in the presidency, as it were, and not being able to say things as certain points that he can say as events develop, which is what were watching here, and then the news medias complete inability to process whats actually happening in that, the news medias feigned native tay about hes in a huge contradiction with himself . I think a very astute point you made earlier on is about what would have happened that is something weve been inured to in the past couple years. We had a president that could say anything and had no sense of the gravity attached to normal Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/president-s'>President S words. Normal Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/president-s'>President S of any party and any inclination he knows as his eight years as Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/vice-president'>Vice President is theres great consequence to what a normal Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/president-s'>President Says. You can imagine just the additional chaos apart from what were seeing if biden had said what many people in the press want him to have said now beginning a week ago a month ago, or whatever. So yes, i believe this is a kind of kabuki. James fellows, thank you very much for joining us tonight. Your perspective on this is invaluable. Your experience in 1975 with the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/parking-lot-campaign'>Parking Lot Campaign at that time is an invaluable window for us. Thank you so much for joining us tonight. Thank you, lawrence. Thank you. Coming up, once again, a Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/trump-supporter'>Trump Supporter terrorized the capitol, this time its a guy with a Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/pickup-truck'>Pickup Truck and said Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/donald-trump'>Donald Trump was going to be reinstated as president. Congress is not in session today. When theyre in session next week, theyre going to take up the infrastructure by thats next. Just two pills for all day pain relief. Aleve it, and see whats possible. With a Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/pickup-truck'>Pickup Truck and said with a Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/pickup-truck'>Pickup Truck and said millions of vulnerable americans struggle to get reliable transportation to their medical appointments. Donald trump was going to be Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/donald-trump'>Donald Trump was going to be i started medhaul. Citi launched the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/impact-fund'>Impact Fund to invest in both women and entrepreneurs of color like me, so i can realize my vision and give everything ive got to my company, and my community. I got you. For the love of people. For the love of community. For the love of progress. Citi. Every single day, were all getting a little bit better. Were better cooks. Better neighbors. Hi. Ive got this until you get back. Better parents. And better friends. No no thats why comcast works around the clock constantly improving americas largest gigspeed broadband network. And just doubled the capacity here. How do things look on your end . Perfect because were building a better network every single day. Heres something the taliban did not do today. A Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/trump-supporter'>Trump Supporter terrorized Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/capitol-hill'>Capitol Hill saying he had a bomb. 49yearold floyd Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/ray-roseberry'>Ray Roseberry of Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/north-carolina'>North Carolina drove a Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/pickup-truck'>Pickup Truck onto the sidewalk in front of the library of congress. Multiple buildings were evacuated, including the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/canon-house'>Canon House office building. Mr. Roseberry told police he had a bomb and surrendered after officers negotiated with him for about five hours. Officers collected, quote, possible bombmaking materials. During the standoff, floyd Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/ray-roseberry'>Ray Roseberry lived streams streamed on facebook from inside the truck, Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/buzzfeed-reports'>Buzzfeed Reports in the live extremes the man demanded that president Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/joe-biden'>Joe Biden and democratic politicians step down, accusing them of killing america. He identified himself as a southerner and called on other patriots and southerners to join him on Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/capitol-hill'>Capitol Hill to begin a revolution. Talking points memo reports in a video posted yesterday, floyd Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/ray-roseberry'>Ray Roseberry says trump will be reinstated as president once Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/joe-biden'>Joe Biden is driven from office. When members of the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/house-of-representatives'>House Of Representatives returned return to next week, as long as there are no demented Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/trump-supporter'>Trump Supporters tHreatening to blow up the capitol, Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/speaker-nancy-pelosi'>Speaker Nancy Pelosi plans to have the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/house-begin-voting'>House Begin Voting on the biden Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/infrastructure-legislation'>Infrastructure Legislation. Joining our decision now, congressional Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/historian-and-emeritus'>Historian And Emeritus scholar at the american enterprise institute. John holland, msnbc national Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/affairs-analyst'>Affairs Analyst and host of the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/hell-and-high-water'>Hell And High Water podcast. John, let me start with you. The Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/infrastructure-bill'>Infrastructure Bill in the form of the be about vugs one of the things thats supposed to be cued up for the houses return next week, but thats pending how many Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/pickup-truck'>Pickup Trucks of Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/trump-supporter'>Trump Supporters might be negotiating with cops about exactly when theyre going to get out of their trucks or blow up the capitol. Yeah, lawrence, thats a very optimistic, rosy picture you paint there. But unfortunately, seems to be right on. You dont get cases that are clear than this one. We all understand what the tHreat is that the postjanuary Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/6th-tHreat'>6th THreat and weve now seen multiple attacks on the capitol and multiple people who want to do damage to the capitol. The capitol has become a prime target for the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/maga-right'>Maga Right and the white Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/grievance-crowd'>Grievance Crowd that are out there. And, you know, i think theres no reason to think that its going tHref='https://vimarsana.com/news/o-stop'>O Stop anytime soon. I think as you know, im predicting a new era of political balance, unfortunately, for a while. And today is just one more piece of evidence were not getting further away from that but were getting closer to it. In fact, i think, you know i am bracing for worse ahead, not only on the domestic legislative front but people keep coming back to that building and trying to do damage to it, unfortunately. One thing that could help would be for Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/house-leader'>House Leader Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/kevin-mccarthy'>Kevin Mccarthy next week or sooner to get out of his republican members together to make a statement that Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/president-trump'>President Trump is not going to be reinstated ever. Hes allowed to run for the office again, but theres no such thing as reinstatement. Now, what are the chances of Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/kevin-mccarthy'>Kevin Mccarthy actually doing that, and are they equal to or less than the chances of Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/kevin-mccarthy'>Kevin Mccarthy supporting the biden Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/infrastructure-legislation'>Infrastructure Legislation . Its about the same, which is a big fat zero. And we should note here that the republican Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/representative-mo'>Representative Mo brooks issued a statement pretty much supporting this violence that was tHreatened by this bomber, somebody who had been sflofld helping to instigate the insurrection. What i would also like to see Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/kevin-mccarthy'>Kevin Mccarthy do, which is equally unlikely, is to denounce his own member for, in effect, giving into violence. Thats where we are now in those politics. You know, to segue to the infrastructure plan, one would hope that these nine democrats who have said theyre not going to support anything involving that larger ambitious Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/infrastructure-package'>Infrastructure Package, the 3. 5 trillion one, unless and until they get first the bipartisan package, it would be very nice if they made a statement that really was against this kind of insurrection and said were going to support legislation that improves america. Pelosis putting them on the spot by packaging these things together and saying you wanted to vote on your package . Were going to put it together with the other one and well see if they respond. John harmon, Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/nancy-pelosi'>Nancy Pelosi has been so good at navigating these kinds of legislative courses in the past that it feels to me like theres an awful lot of confidence about, oh, Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/nancy-pelosi'>Nancy Pelosi will put it all together next week in the house with the nine democrats who want a different procedure from all the rest of the democrats and make peace between them and the more progressive democrats. I dont know. I have that feeling, but in any other world in the past, if we had nine democrats taking a stand like this, we would say, wow, this things in trouble. Well, right. More than that, lawrence, i think, you know, weve part of the confidence, i think, people had, i think people still have the confidence youre talking about and they have good reason to have the confidence Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/nancy-pelosi'>Nancy Pelosi and again, ill observe for the 400th time, the kind of incredible lockstepwell organized, whole life orchestrated juggernaut that so far has been the biden Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/white-house'>White House and its staff with all of that experience that it has, the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/ron-klains'>Ron Klains of the world Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/working-hand-in-glove'>Working Hand In Glove with Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/nancy-pelosi'>Nancy Pelosi and chuck schumer, have been the only reason why this whole Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/highwire-act'>Highwire Act that you and i have observed all along we havent seen anything like it. Theres never been anything this costly. The combination of these two pieces of legislation historically off the charts in terms of Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/dollar-values'>Dollar Values and then the complexity of trying to get them tHrough, trying to land the two planes at the same time. Without that kind of coordination and that kind of skill and experience, they would have no chance. Instead we sit back and say, of course Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/nancy-pelosi'>Nancy Pelosi will pull it off. Again, as i said, theres good reason to think that, but the reality is right now that all of that complexity just got magnified or multiplied by the fact that moderates suddenly woke up in the house and realized they had as much leverage in terms of trying to extort differences both in Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/process-and-outcome'>Process And Outcome as progressives had all along. That should be your correction. Oh, my god, this thing was already this hard to do, its now impossible, and yet i think somehow the stakes are so high that i think the combination of pelosi, schumer, and biden and what would happen, the cost of failure, the political cost of failure in addition to the substantive cost of failure, it might just make this thing all too big and too complex in some ways to fail. Norm, what do you think . You know, i dont think its out of the question that this could go down on a vote when it first comes Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/up-next'>Up Next week. I think it would be really bad given the fact that so many democrats have criticized Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/joe-biden'>Joe Biden. Your statement to begin this program was very powerful. Over whats happened in afghanistan. It would not be a great thing to happen. But i do believe that pelosi has a Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/backup-plan'>Backup Plan if that happens. And we might come back with something that we talked about earlier in the week f. What they want is a standalone vote on just that one narrower package, bring it up with just one small change so that if they vote against that a second time, they really are looking like nothing but people going for extortion and being obstructionists. But if you do that, then theres time at least to go tHrough with the larger Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/infrastructure-package'>Infrastructure Package. And of course this also would mean that the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/john-lewis-voting'>John Lewis Voting Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/rights-act'>Rights Act would go down if they vote against it. Shes added on a lot of pressure on these members, and ultimately i just have to believe that pelosi is going to find a way to prevail. But dont be surprised if it takes axial longer than next week. All right. We need you both on standby for next week. Thank you both very much for joining us tonight. Thank you, lawrence. Thank you. Coming up, Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/jason-ferman'>Jason Ferman was the chairman of president Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/obamas-council'>Obamas Council of economic advisers. And hes seeing things in the biden economic recovery that hes never seen before. His Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/oneword-description'>Oneword Description of the economic picture is, quote, wonderful. Professor Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/jason-ferman'>Jason Ferman joins us next. Made a choice. To take charge of their health care. With an Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/aarp-medicare-supplement'>Aarp Medicare Supplement Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/insurance-plan'>Insurance Plan from unitedhealthcare. Medicare supplement plans help pay the outofpocket Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/expenses-medicare'>Expenses Medicare doesnt. Giving you greater peace of mind. 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Heres something youve never heard an economist say. Quote, i have yet to find a blemish in this jobs report. Ive never before seen such a willfully set of economic data. Thats what Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/harvard-professor-jason'>Harvard Professor Jason furman said about the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/july-jobs'>July Jobs report, and now the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/employment-picture'>Employment Picture is looking better. Joining us is jason furman, currently professor of the practice of economic policy at harvards kennedy school. Professor ferman, in all my hours with economics professors, i dont ever remember the word wonderful being used for anything. Its called the dismal science for a reason. What is going on here . You know, 8 30 a. M. The Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/jobs-numbers'>Jobs Numbers come out. I open them the second they come out. The first number i saw, 943,000 jobs, thats just a really high number. I then went and checked about 11 other numbers, the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/labor-force-participation'>Labor Force Participation rate, the black Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/unemployment-rate'>Unemployment Rate, the wage number, the number of people working part time. Every one of those numbers improved in the month of july, all moving in the direction we want them to move. And we have unemployment go ahead. The Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/unemployment-number'>Unemployment Number now, while were still in the pandemic, its just extraordinary. Yeah. I mean, if you would have asked me a year ago, six months ago, i would have thought it would take a lot longer to where we are now. Were definitely not all the way there. We have a lot to Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/go-on'>Go On the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/unemployment-rate'>Unemployment Rate right now, 5. 4 . Prior to the pandemic it was 3. 5 . Theres no reason we cant get back there. Hopefully we can get a lot of the way back there by Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/the-end'>The End of this year, but after the damage the economy went tHrough last year, its healing more quickly than weve seen in previous recessions, many of which werent as bad as this recession was. There is more fuel coming to the economy and the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/infrastructure-package'>Infrastructure Package gets tHrough the congress in whole or in part. Yeah, absolutely. The Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/president-s'>President Says build back better for a reason. If we could return the economy to exactly where it was in february 2020, that would be pretty good. But it wouldnt be good enough. That was an economy that had a lot of inequality, that had not enough opportunities for, you know, people to work, too many children not in preschool and, of course, an economy that wasnt green enough. So all those things need to change. We dont just need to repair the damage. A lot of whats coming next is to build something better. And of course, in the nature of infrastructure spending, its not its not a oneyear spending program. You know, this kind of building goes on for many years. The building that will be authorized by the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/infrastructure-bill'>Infrastructure Bill. And then the economic benefits of that work Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/go-on'>Go On for years after the construction itself is completed. Yeah. Thats exactly right. And its such a great opportunity right now. A lot of this is being paid for. The president has proposed Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/tax-increases'>Tax Increases on highincome households and some rollback of the corporate Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/rate-reduction'>Rate Reduction under Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/president-trump'>President Trump. But also, frankly, i think we can borrow. The federal government can borrow at a 1. 3 rate right now. Thats actually lower than the inflation rate. And so when youre making an investment, the question is, is that investment going to pay off over time . Is it going to create economic growth . Is it worth the cost to that borrowing, and its an awful lot of investments that pass that test. Another thing built into the cost of this Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/infrastructure-bill'>Infrastructure Bill is there hasnt been Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/infrastructure-bill'>Infrastructure Bills for several years. So if you neglected the maintenance, if youve neglected the upkeep, of course its going to be more expensive than doing regular maintenance. Thats exactly right. I mean, again, you look at the federal debt, the federal debt doesnt include deferred maintenance. It doesnt include the cost of not investing in children and children that dont go to preschool dont Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/grow-up'>Grow Up and succeed and have the earnings they would otherwise have. We have a lot of costs out there and part of this is recognizing them, addressing them sooner, and thats a smarter, more costeffective thing to do. Professor jason furman, thank you very much for joining us tonight. Appreciate it. Thanks lot. Coming up, the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/delta-variant'>Delta Variant has upended our previous thinking about the coronavirus and how long we will be living with it and how many shots of vaccine we will need to get tHrough it. Up next, Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/harvard-epidemiologist'>Harvard Epidemiologist who has been studying this will join us. Who has been studying this will join us. Harvard epidemiologist who has been studying this will join us. Iolo studying this will join us spraying flonase daily stops your body from overreacting to allergens all season long. Psst psst all good oh, son of a poppyseed ah, theres no place like panera. Enjoy the cool, refreshing strawberry poppyseed salad. Panera. Order on the app today. 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All in the hope that you never need any of it. Cdc reported 157,000 cases in the united states. THree of those cases are senators. Onlier wicker, democratic senator Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/john-hickenlooper'>John Hickenlooper from colorado, Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/lindsey-graham'>Lindsey Graham also tested positive this month. All four senators had been fully vaccinated before they were infected. Alabama, the state with the lowest vaccination rate, has run out of Icu Beds Due to the surge in coronavirus infections in the state. The Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/alabama-hospital'>Alabama Hospital association said there were 29 people in the state on wednesday being forced to wait in Emergency Rooms for an open icu bed. The Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/mississippi-department'>Mississippi Department of health says theres only Seven Icu Beds available in the state and 96 patients need them. Yesterday the biden administration announced continued effectiveness of the vaccines will now depend on getting a third Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/booster-shot'>Booster Shot for the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/moderna-and-pfizer'>Moderna And Pfizer vaccine. There is no guidance yet on a Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/booster-shot'>Booster Shot for the recipients of the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/johnson-johnson-singledose'>Johnson Johnson Singledose vaccine. Joining us now is dr. Michael mina, epidemiologist with the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/harvard-school'>Harvard School of public health. Dr. Minna, thank you very much for joining us tonight. The issue on the vaccine Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/booster-shot'>Booster Shot raises the question of just how protected vaccinated people are. I, for example, have never stopped wearing masks indoors, at stores. I now know that in november ill eight months away from my second shot of moderna. So the effectiveness of this vaccine is kind of on a downward slope during that period of time, apparently. Thats my understanding of the science. So what should vaccinated people be doing in protecting themselves as we head toward our third shot, our Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/booster-shot'>Booster Shot . Thats a great question. Vaccinated people right now should on the one hand recognize that just getting the vaccine at all that see has given you a massive leg up to ensure if you do get this virus, you will not end up in the hospital. Its the most likely scenario. However, it really scales with age. As you say, as we move further away from the date you got your vaccine, unfortunately the oldest individuals in our society are going to be likely the quickest to have their protection start to wane, which is why the boosters are starting to be recommended. And also why its become controversial are recommended and it is controversial whether everyone needs it or just the older individuals and immunocompromised, recognizing that the vaccines may not be sufficient to prevent transmission is important. We have to recognize that the virus is able to transmit in some people who are vaccinated and we have to be aware of that as we move around and what our expectations are. If it were getting, it is really a medical benefit to help us not end up in the hospital. It is becoming less and less effective against delta in terms of limiting spread. Is breaktHrough the right word for describing vaccinated people who get infected . We call it a breaktHrough like we should be surprised or shocked that somehow the virus got tHrough the vaccine wall. I dont think that breaktHrough is the right word for somebody who becomes asymptomatically infected and connected to a test. The vaccines were not indicated or designed tHref='https://vimarsana.com/news/o-stop'>O Stop transmission. But when people become symptomatic, that would be defined as a Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/breaktHrough-infection'>BreaktHrough Infection because thats the indication that these vaccines have. Thats what the trials measured. And i would say that none of this is surprising. We expected, or at least many people expect these vaccines will wane over time. The tremendous efficacy of 90, 95 that we saw was right after people got vaccinated. Thats when you have the most antibodies circulating. And naturally, just like in any vaccine or infection, waning is an expected outcome. If we were not developing, lets go to a hypothetical universe. Were not developing new variants and the vaccine was still fighting the same old variant it began fighting in say, Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/february-box'>February Box that have anything to do with the length of effectiveness of the vaccine . It would for sure. The mutations that are rising that have now led To Delta and will inevitably lead the further variants down the road are certainly giving the virus a leg up to both transmit more readily but also appear to be giving it an ability to start to chip away at our immune protection. And enable it to infect individuals a little easier. If we were still dealing with version one of this virus, and that really matched the vaccine as well, whereas now the vaccine thats weve gotten and including the boosters, it is based around a virus that is no longer in circulation. Weve now moved on To Delta and thats a slightly different sequence. Thank you very much for joining us tonight. We really appreciate it. Absolutely. 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I will not pass this responsibility on to a fifth president. I made a commitment to the american people when i ran for president that i would bring americas Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/military-involvement'>Military Involvement in afghanistan to an end. While it has been hard and messy, and yes, far from perfect, ive honored that commitment. President biden gets tonights last word. The 11th hour starts now. Good evening once again. Day 212 of the biden administration. Theres mounting pressure to speed up the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/air-lift'>Air Lift to get people out of afghanistan as new reports indicate the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/white-house'>White House was warned about the disaster that would quickly unfold after the official u. S. Withdrawal. Tomorrow president will speak to the nation again about these evacuations. As the administration tries to ramp up the mission, they still lack a Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/firm-count'>Firm Count of the number of americans in afghanistan. We dont have a precise number. The reason is we asked americans to register with the u. S. Government when they arrive