Filed. As Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/the-post'>The Post points out that deadline is a strong signal that Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/manhattan-district'>Manhattan District attorney Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/cyrus-vance'>Cyrus Vance and Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/letitia-james'>Letitia James now working together after each has spent more than two years investigating trumps businesses are considering criminal charges against the company as an entity. In fact, this comes after Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/nbc-news'>Nbc News reported on friday that charges are not only likely, theyre expected as early as this week. At issue are the socalled Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/fringe-benefits'>Fringe Benefits that the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/trump-organization'>Trump Organization doled out to its executives, including Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/cfo-allen-weisselberg'>Cfo Allen Weisselberg and his family. That includes free rent Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/worth-hundreds'>Worth Hundreds of thousands of dollars at a Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/luxury-apartment'>Luxury Apartment at Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/central-park'>Central Park as well as free tuition, all of which could carry serious tax implications. While that might be the tip of the iceberg given how wideranging the investigation has been, trumps attorney says otherwise. He told politico that prosecutors in fact dont have Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/anything-else'>Anything Else and that trump himself wont be charged, at least for now. So take that with a grain of salt. In their attempts to forestall an indictment. It also appears theyre trying to use their employees as a shield. Trumps lawyers are arguing that the people who will suffer the most are not trump or his Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/family-members'>Family Members but the 3500 employees like the dash Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/washers-dishwasher'>Washers Dishwasher and maids. All of this comes after the d. A. s office convened a Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/special-grand-jury'>Special Grand Jury in may which will sit for six months. In other words, that Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/grand-jury'>Grand Jury is on hand for another five months, so any indictment that comes down could just be an opening salvo. Joining me now, tim obrien and glen kirschner, former federal prosecutor. Glenn, i want to start with you. It is unusual for most people to see a company indicted, potentially, instead of an individual. What would be the indications . And i know we talked about this last week. Lets say that Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/trump-organization'>Trump Organization is indicted. Is that about putting pressure on the individuals involved in the company or could the company itself face separate financial implications just from being potentially indicted . You know, its actually about both of those things, joy, because once a company is indicted, the last Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/highprofile-case'>Highprofile Case that Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/we-saw'>We Saw was back during the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/enron-scandal'>Enron Scandal when the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/arthur-andersen-accounting'>Arthur Andersen Accounting firm was indicted for obstruction of justice. And what ended up happening . They folded. They went out Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/of-business'>Of Business. So part of it is because the authorities want to get at a corrupt enterprise, a corrupt business so it can stop committing the crimes that it is committing as an organization, but it also is very useful in pressuring and in leveraging employees in the company who may be criminally responsible themselves. So i actually think its serving two purposes. You know what, Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/donald-trump'>Donald Trumps lawyers can run around beating their chest all they want about how these are small potatoes charges. The fact is when we investigate, indict and try rico cases, conspiracy cases and gang cases, we start with a relatively small modest indictment. Sometimes it has a conspiracy charge, sometimes not, and then we build. We use it as leverage to flip people. The Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/big-fish'>Big Fish doesnt have to worry about the first indictment handed down by a Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/grand-jury'>Grand Jury, the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/big-fish'>Big Fish has to worry about the last or the final indictment handed down by the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/grand-jury'>Grand Jury. So this is just the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/starter-pistol'>Starter Pistol going off and it is still a long marathon to justice here. Yeah. Thats a really good point. Let me read you what politico is reporting about trumps attorney, more of what he has said. This is what he said to the point we were just discussing. He says we asked is there Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/anything-else'>Anything Else . They said no. He said Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/vances-team'>Vances Team told him they will not bring charges against trump himself when the first indictment comes down as we just heard glenn explain how this works. When this indictment comes down, he wont be charged, our investigation is ongoing. Tim, i guess the question would be lets say that the implication is theyre not getting the cooperation they expected from Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/allen-weisselberg'>Allen Weisselberg, despite the fact that he and his family are on the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/hook-and-trump'>Hook And Trump could point at him and say he did all of that, i had nothing to do with it. My question to you is having covered this operation for a very long time, how long would weisselberg hold out if he gets indicted . How long would any of these other executives hold out and not drag trump into it with them . Well, theres still so much we dont know, joy. Its really going to come down to the gravity of the charges. Fischetti is pounding his chest. Hes directly saying that right now the stakes in this case are very small and he cant believe the d. A. s office is wasting its time prosecuting it this way. I would find it very hard to believe that the kind of Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/firepower-cy-vance'>Firepower Cy Vance has assembled and the targets that he has in mind, which include falsification Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/of-business'>Of Business records, a number of Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/tax-frauds'>Tax Frauds and Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/bank-fraud'>Bank Fraud possibilities, theres even the possibility of Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/money-laundering'>Money Laundering here. But we just dont know until we see whats on the paper itself when an indictment is formally filed. Thats going to trigger decisions among everyone in trumps orbit. If Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/allen-weisselberg'>Allen Weisselberg is gambling that all hes going to be charged with are Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/tax-problems'>Tax Problems or Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/tax-frauds'>Tax Frauds related to unrecognized compensation from the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/trump-organization'>Trump Organization, he may believe he can beat that in court and he doesnt have to flip on trump for that. If Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/allen-weisselberg'>Allen Weisselberg is facing more serious charges, theyre going to wind up with him in a orange jumpsuit, i think he wont hesitate to flip on Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/donald-trump'>Donald Trump. It will be nanoseconds but we dont know yet. Lets talk about the way that you talked a little bit, glenn, about kind of the way it works when a company is indicted. This is what a former federal prosecutor said to bloomberg on friday. He said that any kind of indictment against a corporation could be the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/death-knell'>Death Knell as you mentioned. It means customers and vendors are going to stay away and contracts will be cancelled. Donald trump tried to tHrow his employees, which according to some great reporting in the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/new-york'>New York times, sometimes includes undocumented folks at his resorts which he says he doesnt like undocumented immigration but he hires folks or low paid people at places like maralago. What would happen in theory to a company that lets say the banks call in the loans and say if this company is in this much legal trouble you want you to pay us now. You cant pay us now and you start to go under so what happens to these llcs that Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/donald-trump'>Donald Trump has everywhere . Yeah, i think its all going to crumble like a house of cards. Tim certainly knows better than i how highly leveraged the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/trump-organization'>Trump Organization is reputed to be. But its impossible to conceive of how the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/trump-organization'>Trump Organization can survive a criminal indictment against Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/trump-org'>Trump Org because, as you say, clients will flee, contracts will be cancelled. Banks and financial institutions will have nothing to do with Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/loaning-them-money'>Loaning Them Money and, as you mentioned, they may call in loans. So, you know, if i were a betting man, a buck is my limit. I would bet a buck the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/trump-organization'>Trump Organization cannot survive a criminal indictment but that really is just for openers because the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/manhattan-district'>Manhattan District Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/attorneys-office'>Attorneys Office will be working his way up the criminal chain and he will go as high as he can go, as high as the evidence will take him. Two years of Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/tax-returns'>Tax Returns and financial documents that they now have in hand, i have to believe theres a lot of potential financial fraud in there. Glenn, can Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/donald-trump'>Donald Trump use the excuse of saying allen did the books and this had nothing to do with me . Oh, he almost certainly will. But isnt Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/donald-trump'>Donald Trump a sort of Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/infamous-micromanager'>Infamous Micromanager . The Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/trump-organization'>Trump Organization is Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/donald-trump'>Donald Trump. So i think he is going to be hard pressed to point the finger at weisselberg or to point the finger at his children and say, listen, those are the bad actors here. I had no idea what was going on under my nose in an organization that i ran day in and day out. He can try that. But you know what, that makes it all the more likely that an Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/allen-weisselberg'>Allen Weisselberg Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/will-flip'>Will Flip on him. Worst case scenario, put them both at Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/defense-counsel-table'>Defense Counsel Table shoulder to shoulder and let them start offering defenses where theyre pointing the finger at one another. I have had midtrial guilty pleas when that started because somebody wanted out and somebody now wanted a benefit from the prosecutors. Yeah, thats what Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/michael-cohen'>Michael Cohen predicted, theyll all start accusing each other. Tim, speaking of the children, Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/mother-jones'>Mother Jones has recovered documents, Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/david-corn'>David Corn over at Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/mother-jones'>Mother Jones has a piece where it shows that Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/ivanka-trump'>Ivanka Trump did not testify accurately in the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/inauguration-scandal-case'>Inauguration Scandal Case during a Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/december-1st'>December 1st deposition. Ivanka trump was asked if she had any involvement in the process of planning the inauguration. She replied i really didnt have an involvement. This wasnt accurate which indicated she was part of the decisionmaking for various aspects of the inauguration, including even the menus. She was involved in Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/recruiting-talents'>Recruiting Talents and pushing a womens Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/entrepreneur-reception'>Entrepreneur Reception which wound up being scuttled. How much loyalty actually exists in this family . It doesnt seem that Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/donald-trump'>Donald Trump is loyal to anyone, except maybe ivanka. Are they loyal in reverse . If people start getting in trouble for stuff like the inaugural, how many of them stick together in your view . Oh, i dont think any of them stick together. I think everyone understands that in Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/donald-trump'>Donald Trumps world, loyalty is a oneway street. He will tHrow anybody under the bus he needs to to save his own hide. I think including ultimately his children if it comes down to it. I dont think Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/donald-trump'>Donald Trump will go out of his way to keep anyone else from serving prison time if it means protecting himself from winding up there. And i think thats why the evidence that vance and all the other investigators are assembling. Criminal cases are built on intent. Theyre going to have to show trump himself knew things at crucial points in time. I think one of the significant things about the documents vance got is its not just Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/tax-returns'>Tax Returns, its accountants work product. They can dig in. As much as trump himself doesnt use email, other people in that organization sent emails on his behalf. There are phone records. I would assume theyre going to go tHrough all of this so they dont only have to rely on the testimony of employees, although that will also be important. But i dont think theres going to be any loyalty will not be the first hallmark of this event. Yeah, its going to be interesting to see who cracks first, trump or his children or Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/allen-weisselberg'>Allen Weisselberg. Tim obrien, glenn kirschner, thank you very much. Up next, Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/william-barr'>William Barrs many alternate realities. Remember how he insisted on giving his own dishonest misinterpretation of the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/mueller-report'>Mueller Report before it was released to the public . Well, now hes trying to rewrite his role in the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/big-lie'>Big Lie, even though he enabled some of trumps worst impulses. And Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/ib-ram'>Ib Ram kendi joins me on republicans stoking fear in white people about Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/anything-and-everything'>Anything And Everything thats antiracist. Plus tonights absolute worst. Theyre taking a big right turn off Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/democracy-avenue'>Democracy Avenue onto insurrection street. The reidout continues after this. S after this i can tell that they used your milk, matilda. Great Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/job-moo'>Job Moo youre welcome. Breyers natural vanilla is made with 100 grade a Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/milk-and-cream'>Milk And Cream and only sustainably farmed vanilla. Better starts with breyers. The instant Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/air-purifier'>Air Purifier removes 99. 9 of the virus that causes covid19 from treated air. So you can breathe easier, knowing that you and your family have added protection. Because of the research that ive started to do on ancestry, with documents, with photographs, i get to define myself tHrough the scores of people who lead to me. Bring your Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/family-history'>Family History to life like never before. Get started for free at ancestry. Com thousands of women with metastatic Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/breast-cancer'>Breast Cancer are living in the moment and taking ibrance. Ibrance with an Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/aromatase-inhibitor'>Aromatase Inhibitor is for postmenopausal women or for men with Hr , her2 metastatic Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/breast-cancer'>Breast Cancer as the first hormonal based therapy. Ibrance plus letrozole significantly delayed Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/disease-progression'>Disease Progression versus letrozole. Ibrance may cause low white Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/blood-cell'>Blood Cell counts that may lead to serious infections. Ibrance may cause severe inflammation of the lungs. Both of these can lead to death. Tell your doctor if you have new or worsening chest pain, cough, or trouble breathing. Before taking ibrance, tell your doctor if you have fever, chills, or other signs of infection, Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/liver-or-kidney'>Liver Or Kidney problems, are or plan to become pregnant, or are breastfeeding. For more information about Side Effects talk to your doctor. Be in your moment. Ask your doctor about ibrance. Be in your moment. You need an ecolab scientific clean here. And here. Which is why the scientific expertise that helps Operating Rooms stay clean now helps the places you go too. Look for the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/ecolab-science'>Ecolab Science certified seal. Former Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/attorney-general'>Attorney General Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/william-barr'>William Barr spent most of his tenure in fealty, Absolute Fealty to the twice impeached, disgraced former president s worths antidemocratic impulses. But in some revisionist laundering he wants you to believe he was on the right side of disputing the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/big-lie'>Big Lie, even as it became republican dogma. He told abcs Jonathan Karl in excerpts of an upcoming book published in The Atlantic he knew the claims of fraud were garbage. My suspicion was that there was nothing there, it was all bs. Barr wants to look like he stood up to the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/big-lie'>Big Lie, but he also elaborated on demanding his already sycophantic d. A. By allowing them to investigate irregularities before it was verified. He spelled out that Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/mitch-mcconnell'>Mitch Mcconnell attempted to get him, the sitting Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/attorney-general'>Attorney General, to help republicans win an election in georgia by placating a madman. Look, we need the president in georgia so we cannot be frontally attacking him but youre in a better position to inject some reality into this situation. Youre really the only one who can do it. I understand that, barr said, and im going to do it at the appropriate time. Barr did eventually say something, nearly a month after the election on Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/december-1st'>December 1st when he told the a. P. That the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/justice-department-hadnt'>Justice Department Hadnt seen fraud on a scale that could affect the outcome in the election, underscoring how deranged Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/americas-mango'>Americas Mango mussolini truly is. Following that admission he fronted barr and asked how the f could you do this to me . Why did you say it . Because its true, barr replied. The president responded by referring to himself in the third person, you must hate trump. Unsurprisingly, the poor loser from Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/maralago-wasnt'>Maralago Wasnt pleased with Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/barrs-attempt'>Barrs Attempt at cleanup. Joining me now, Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/congressman-adam-schiff'>Congressman Adam Schiff of california, chairman of the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/house-intelligence-committee'>House Intelligence Committee and impeachment manager in the first impeachment of the former president. You know, i dont know if you found the most disturbing aspect of this interview with barr the fact that he appears to have collaborated with the then Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/senate-majority-leader'>Senate Majority Leader to try to use a Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/doj-investigation'>Doj Investigation that went against policy to try to help Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/mitch-mcconnell'>Mitch Mcconnell Hold On to the senate by winning those two elections. That is how i read it. Is that how you read it . That is how i read it and it is astonishing that you have the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/attorney-general'>Attorney General of the united states essentially conferring with a partisan legislative leader to try to direct the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/justice-department'>Justice Department in a way that will help either the gop or the president. Youre absolutely right, he violated department of Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/justice-policy'>Justice Policy and he did it repeatedly. He was even willing to let durham announce his Investigation Results in the weeks leading up to the election in violation of another doj policy. For him now to try to rehabilitate himself, there is no rehabilitation for Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/bill-barr'>Bill Barr. Not after what he did to the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/justice-department'>Justice Department. Not after misleading the country for weeks and weeks with false claims of Potential Fraud in the election, fraud with absentee ballots. He was singing the president s song for a very long time. And the fact that he stopped singing it because he thought it would be more helpful to the party if he stopped when Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/mitch-mcconnell'>Mitch Mcconnell asked him, he gets no credit for that. And that is such an important point. Its not that he turned against the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/big-lie'>Big Lie because he knew it was wrong and that it was wrong for the president to approach him. Can you imagine a world in which Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/eric-holder'>Eric Holder had known that there was a highly unlikely that any evidence existed that the scales could be tipped in the election in 2012 and then conferred with Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/harry-reid'>Harry Reid, with senator Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/majority-leader'>Majority Leader Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/harry-reid'>Harry Reid and said but im still going to do the investigations anyway. In barrs case, he said he did it just because he knew that trump would ask him and he wanted to be able to say were working on it. I cant imagine how apoplectic republicans and frankly the media would be if that had been Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/holder-and-reid'>Holder And Reid as opposed to barr and mcconnell. Can you . No, i cant. And theres a whole long line of actions and misconduct by Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/bill-barr'>Bill Barr along those same lines. You can imagine if Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/barack-obama'>Barack Obama had intervened in a sentencing of someone who lied to congress to cover up for the former president , what the outcry would be. But thats what Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/bill-barr'>Bill Barr did for Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/donald-trump'>Donald Trump when he intervened in the Roger Stone case. He made the case against Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/michael-flynn'>Michael Flynn go away. These are astonishing actions by an Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/attorney-general'>Attorney General purely political acts to placate, please the president of the united states. If any democratic president did anything like that, there would be such a Hue And Cry about it. So i dont think Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/theres-anyone'>Theres Anyone in the modern history of the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/justice-department'>Justice Department who has done my damage to that institution than Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/bill-barr'>Bill Barr. And for him to now give these selfserving accounts, its too late, Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/bill-barr'>Bill Barr, for you to think about your place in history. It is irrevokably tarnished. The Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/coverup-general'>Coverup General was his nickname that Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/william-sapphire'>William Sapphire gave him back in the 90s. I think it still applies. I want you to listen to Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/senator-mitt-romney'>Senator Mitt Romney because theres a thing thats happening among at least some senate republicans. I wonders if its happening among Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/house-republicans'>House Republicans where they are doing some reputation laundry. Heres Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/mitt-romney'>Mitt Romney on cnn about the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/big-lie'>Big Lie, talking about the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/big-lie'>Big Lie. I do think its important for each person to speak the truth and to make clear that the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/big-lie'>Big Lie is exactly that. This is a bit like wwf, that its entertaining, but its not real. I think people recognize that its a lot of Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/show-and-bombast'>Show And Bombast but its going nowhere. That would sound good if he even voted to discuss the for the people act but he voted with all the republicans to bar even bringing discussion to the senate floor, to talk about protecting the american people from the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/big-lie'>Big Lie, which is being enacted basically every day in the states. Right now we have 14 states that have enacted 22 laws that restrict the right to vote based on the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/big-lie'>Big Lie. Are you concerned that this Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/big-lie'>Big Lie, no matter what Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/mitt-romney'>Mitt Romney tries to say in his own defense, is now going to be the prevailing factor in the 2022 elections and beyond . Well, i am certainly concerned with the use of the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/big-lie'>Big Lie to propel these State Laws to disenfranchise people and particularly people of color. As well to push these laws that would strip independent secretaries of state of their powers and give them over to someone appointed bipartisan legislatures. What the republicans seem to be doing around the country is, number one, trying to decide the election by making it hard for people of color to vote. And number two, if the election still goes against them, to position themselves to overturn it, to be successful in overturning it in a way that they were not successful in the last election. These laws are just all daggers pointed at the heart of democracy. Anyone peddling the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/big-lie'>Big Lie is doing so at great risk to our whole system of checks and balances. Yeah, indeed. One last thing. I would be remiss if i didnt ask you. We now have Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/speaker-pelosi'>Speaker Pelosi having introduced a bill to establish this January 6 commission, i think very important for the country. There will be 13 members. Speaker pelosi can choose eight. Shes seriously considering a republican. The remaining five would be selected and heres the hitch after consultation with Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/kevin-mccarthy'>Kevin Mccarthy. Are you concerned that Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/kevin-mccarthy'>Kevin Mccarthy will attempt to stack the commission in his five picks with people who were part of the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/big-lie'>Big Lie . People who supported the insurrection . Maybe some absolute loony tunes like Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/marjorie-taylor-greene'>Marjorie Taylor Greene in order to disrupt it . Kevin ccarthy is capable of anything. He is purely a political animal. There is no ideology there, except Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/selfambition-and-advancement'>Selfambition And Advancement so hes capable of anything. At the end of the day the investigation will go forward, no matter who he might choose to put on that commission because we are determined to get to the truth. And to protect the country going forward. So youre absolutely right. He may try to make a circus out of it. They certainly have done that kind of thing in the past. But i think under the speakers leadership, the house will make sure to do its duty and that we get all the facts before the american people. Do you think he should be subpoenaed, Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/kevin-mccarthy'>Kevin Mccarthy, since he spoke with Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/donald-trump'>Donald Trump on the day of the insurrection . Ill leave that decision to the commission once it has a chance to evaluate all the evidence. But i do think the commission will need to follow the facts wherever they lead and make sure we do a diligent job. This was an attack on the citadel of our democracy, and we need to make sure that all those responsible are held to account and the public is protected going forward. Congressman adam schiff, thank you for making some time to be with us this evening. Thank you very much. As the search for survivors continues in florida so does the search for the cause of that deadly building collapse. Well get a live update from surfside and speak to an engineer specializing in building failures. Thats next. Stay with us. Building failures. Thats next. Stay with us we can help actively Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/repair-enamel'>Repair Enamel in its weakened state. Its innovative. My go to toothpaste is going to be pronamel repair. [lazer beam and sizzling sounds] the instant Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/air-purifier'>Air Purifier removes 99. 9 of the virus that causes covid19 from treated air. So you can breathe easier, knowing that you and your family have added protection. 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Signs of serious Liver Problems may include yellowing of the skin, Abdominal Pain or swelling, confusion, and unexplained bleeding or bruising. Tell your doctor if you develop symptoms of liver disease. Common Side Effects include headache and tiredness. Now, i can live life cured and feel free. 8 weeks was faster than i thought. Now, its your turn to keep your momentum with mavyret. Talk to your doctor about mavyret. Talk to your doctor about mavyret. You need an ecolab scientific clean here. And here. Which is why the scientific expertise that helps Operating Rooms stay clean now helps the places you go too. Look for the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/ecolab-science'>Ecolab Science certified seal. I think that my family is just really scared because like obviously on day five, theres been No One thats rescued thats alive at this point. Were hoping and praying for a miracle and we are holding on to hope because we really want to be reunited with my mom. Were now in day five of the search for survivors at the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/condo-collapse'>Condo Collapse in surfside, florida. Officially 11 people have died in this tragic incident with 150 still unaccounted for. Im joined by Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/msnbc-correspondent'>Msnbc Correspondent Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/ellison-barber'>Ellison Barber in surfside, florida. Ellison, what is the latest that we know. Reporter hey, joy, yeah, this is the second Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/press-conference-today'>Press Conference Today that started with news that No One wanted to hear, that they had found another body in the rubble. The Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/death-toll'>Death Toll here is now 11. We do not know the names of all of the victims but we know the names of some of them. We know the names of eight people who lost their lives when this Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/condo-collapse'>Condo Collapsed early thursday morning. They are stacy fang, antonio and gladys lizano, manuel la font, Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/anna-ortiz'>Anna Ortiz and her son, cHristina and leon. They are parents, grandparents, precious lives that were stolen in the middle of the night and 150 people are still unaccounted for. Officials, rescuers say they have not given up hope that they can find some survivor. They say there are crevices where potentially someone could be alive but it is day five now. Family members were able to visit the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/rubble-yesterday'>Rubble Yesterday and today. Some of them still have hope that their Loved Ones can be found. Others say theyre not so sure as the minutes pass and days move by. They feel like the chances of people coming out of this alive are just sHrinking by the minute. And some have started to lose hope. But again, officials are adamant that this is still a Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/search-and-rescue'>Search And Rescue mission. They say that they are not giving up hope. They have help from across the state as well as abroad. Rescue teams have come from mexico as well as israel to assist on the ground here. A Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/shift-change'>Shift Change happened not long ago. There are about 80 people, 80 rescuers working in 12hour shifts. When they walk away, you can see it on their faces how tired they are, how hard they are working. That is what the mayor of miamidade said that she thought a lot of families recognized when they were able to visit the sight of rubble. Not only were they able to feel close, she said, to their Loved Ones but also able to see how rescuers hadnt given up hope yet either and she hoped that maybe that gave them hope as well. The mayor told us that she still has hope because the rescuers still have hope and they have been to horrific scenes before. They were at the earthquake in haiti. If they still have hope, she says shell Hold On to hope as well. Theres a makeshift memorial not far from here with photos of the missing. Again, 150 people unaccounted for. Now there are stuffed animals, Teddy Bears that rescuers found in the rubble and carried to that site earlier today. Joy. Thank you so much, Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/ellison-barber'>Ellison Barber, appreciate that report. Over the weekend we learned that in 2018 an engineer warned of failed waterproofing causing failed structural damage to the concrete structural slab. Residents were told that the condo was in good shape. Officials dont know exactly what caused the building to collapse. According to the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/new-york'>New York times, some experts are focusing on a spot in the lowest part of the condominium complex, possibly in an underground Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/parking-garage'>Parking Garage where an initial failure could have set off a structural avalanche. The times reports immediately before the collapse one of the residents saw a hole of sorts opening near the pool. Engineer Rick De Laguardia said the collapse could have started higher than the foundation, possibly on the second floor. A miamibased engineer with forensic investigations of Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/building-component-failure'>Building Component Failure and the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/president-and-founder'>President And Founder of Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/dlg-engineering'>Dlg Engineering joins me now. Thank you for having me. Of course. I have a lot of questions. Question number one, if there were structural issues with this building, there is another building. Should the people who live in the other tower of this complex be evacuating . First of all, let me offer my condolences to those who lost their lives, the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/family-members'>Family Members and appreciation to the first responders. I read that 2018 report. In my personal opinion, that report did a very good job in stressing immediate action for the structural integrity of the building. But ive seen conditions personally very similar to that on a lot of buildings that are 40 year unmaintained. So i dont see that report as a Red Flag for imminent failure. I read that as a standard report of the condition of a building thats 40 years old that has not been maintained properly tHroughout the years. So i wouldnt worry so much. My opinion is that the failure was caused by a litany of issues compounded on themselves. So i wouldnt be so concerned. Certainly i have my thoughts on the process, how to prevent this going forward and i do believe the process is flawed. Well, let me go into this for a second. I lived in florida for 14 years. One thing i learned is that developers have a lot of power in florida. They can build where they want. There have been issues of Building On Brown Fields and there was a huge expose called sickness in the soil, building on places you shouldnt build. This is a Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/barrier-island'>Barrier Island where these condos are located. Is it wise to be building on Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/barrier-island'>Barrier Islands . As you know, they slowly shift, migrate and move. Buildings so close on sandy ground doesnt seem wise to me. Is this a case of building where probably building should not have happened . I dont agree with that. I think we have the technology, we have the knowledge, the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/design-capacity'>Design Capacity to build in areas such as that. I believe this building was built with piles that went deep into the soil. So i dont think the location itself is an issue. I believe the issue is maintenance. Regular maintenance. Unfortunately this building was not properly maintained, as evidenced by the 2008 report. Ive seen evidence of this, but you mentioned the developers having too much power. In my opinion the Homeowners Associations have too much power. They are basically making decisions on the safety of their residents, some, not all, that are based on budgetary constraints instead of the proper repairs needed. Unfortunately, there are some engineers out there that will tailor their proposals for 40year repairs to the budgetary restraints. Homeowner associations if they dont like the fees of one engineer can simply find another one until they find somebody that meets their budget. So i dont think the location is an issue. I think we have good design standards for that. I think the issue is with maintenance and with the process of certification and who has the power. Thats what i believe the issues lie. Well, that is very interesting information and very good to know. Rick de la guardia. Ill share your condolences and we hope there are still survivors there. Still ahead, Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/marjorie-taylor-greene'>Marjorie Taylor Greene is trying so, so hard, so hard to be our absolute worst. Her creepy weird obsession with Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/congresswoman-alexandria-ocasiocortez'>Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasiocortez reached strikingly racist heights this weekend. She said aoc was not an american and called her, quote, the little communist from america, which is in america. Aoc responded by tweeting, first of all, im taller than her. Tip your waiters. Good line. And yet Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/marjorie-taylor-greene'>Marjorie Taylor Greene, the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/qanon-lady'>Qanon Lady, is not tonights absolute worst. The winner or more accurately the loser is enabling a bigger risk to democracy. The big reveal coming up. 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Now they have a new boogieman to latch onto, critical Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/race-theory'>Race Theory. The term has become the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/cause-celeb'>Cause Celeb for republicans across the land. What this is, its a Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/crt-theory'>Crt Theory but it manifests in this antiracism training. All of this stuff is connected. The primary tHread that links them altogether is this. America, institutions are inherently racist. Suddenly theyre finding out that their local school is teaching them that america is fundamental erasist. Thats all a lie. Its all poison and being poured into the minds of our kids. Critical theory is an ideology that says that the united states is rotten to its core. The leaders of this movement think our society is defined by white supremacy. Critical theory in all of its guyses distorts our history, it destroys our common loves and it would leave us hopelessly divided. Critical theory is a whole other thing. Anyway, this weekend Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/ron-johnson'>Ron Johnson told a crowd of republican supporters that hes more panicked than ever about the state of the country and the republicans should, quote, take back our school boards, our county boards, our city councils. We will take back our culture. What exactly is our culture, senator . And who is the our in that sentence . And who decides . You see what these politicians are objecting to is the factual analysis to our history, warts and all. They have taken calls for selfreflection and demonized it into a catchall pHrase. Theyre so obsessed with owning the libs that they make bizarre statements like this one. I thought general milley totally missed the point last week. He says i read now. That has nothing to do with it. We read we read things in school and we werent nazis. Another common feature of the freakout is to name and blame black public intellectuals who are not involved in critical Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/race-theory'>Race Theory. One of them is ibram x. Kendi. Thank you for being here. The whole sort of coopting of the term critical Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/race-theory'>Race Theory and then planting it onto really antiracism has been an astonishing thing to watch. One of the astonishing features of it is that they have decided that you are the main person responsible to doing that. I want to very quickly get this off the table. Are you a critical Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/race-theorist'>Race Theorist . So ive certainly been inspired by critical Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/race-theory'>Race Theory. I certainly admire critical Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/race-theory'>Race Theory. But at the same time i wasnt trained on critical race they are re. I didnt go to law school. And so i dont necessarily identify as a critical Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/race-theorist'>Race Theorist. They dont know what it is either. But here it is senator josh hawley, sort of one of the worst sort of offenders here, slamming you by name. Dr. Ibram kendi wrote this. The only remedy to past discrimination is present discrimination. The only remedy to present discrimination is future discrimination. Thats right, thats what he said. Think about that for a moment. Hes saying that hes opposed to equality under the law. Dr. Kendi and his followers are in no uncertain terms advocating for state sanctioned racism. Okay, now given the fact that they cant seem to quote dr. King accurately, im going to assume that theyre misquoting you or giving the wrong context. Can you explain what that quote, even if its accurate, what it means. Sure. So, joy, we recognized as a nation that elderly people were dying at the highest rates, were the most vulnerable to covid19. So we decided that it was best to provide vaccine to those people first. No one described that as a bad policy. But young people could have said, hey, youre discriminating against us. And we would have responded, well, older people are dying at the highest rates. Should they not receive vaccine first . But if we would have then started thinking about, oh, black people are also dying at the highest rates from covid19. You know, maybe they should also receive maybe they should also receive vaccine first. Maybe we should have a system in which those who have the those who have the greatest needs are provided with what they need, but they call that reverse discrimination. They call that discrimination. Theyre against that. How are we going to create Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/equity-and-justice'>Equity And Justice for all if were providing the same resources to middle income people as were providing to billionaires. This is the same theory in which they have gone after black farmers receiving benefits when they have only 14 of the land at this point. They have been stripped of their land. They say all the benefits need to go to white farmers. Stephen miller is part of that. I want to ask a couple of other questions to make sure were getting everything clear. Do you believe that White Americans are inherently racist . Oh, i do not. And indeed in how to be an antiracist i make the case that we shouldnt believe that anyone is inherently racist or we should identify anyone as a racist. I make the case that racist isnt a fixed category. Its a descriptive term that describes what a person is being at any given moment based on what theyre doing or saying. So if a person is saying black people are lazy, theyre being racist. But then the very next moment theyre advocating a policy that creates Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/justice-and-equity'>Justice And Equity for all, theyre being antiracist. Okay. And do you know of any schools that are teaching that White Americans are inherently racist . Do you know of any schools thats teaching that anywhere . I havent. Indeed, i would speak out against that school if it was doing it. And we now know that one of the groups that is under attack from the same people who are attacking you are military. The military. Particularly military generals, including the secretary of defense and joint chiefs of Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/staff-chair'>Staff Chair general milley. He has been attacked by Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/donald-trump'>Donald Trump, matt gaetz, tucker carlson, lauraing ham, they have gone after him. They have called that as groundlevel fascism. Why are Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/trump-and-carlson'>Trump And Carlson attacking the military . The attack is on woke generals, the brass, and disloyal citizens in charge. Its an attempt to appeal it agrieved troops and vets and its a classic move from the authoritarian and fascist playbook. What do you make of the book that people like trump wanted to use the military to attack black Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/lives-matter'>Lives Matter protesters specifically, he wanted them and milley refused. They got in a cussing match. They dont believe the military should study whether there are racist and white nationalists in the military because some of those folks attacked the capitol. What do you make of that dichotomy . I mean, i think its pure sort of insanity. Thats presented as logic. The fact of the matter is, is American Armed Forces have a white Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/supremacist-problem'>Supremacist Problem and the leaders have rec nice that. Those leaders have decided the which you address that issue is by teaching people to be antiracist, by teaching people to recognize the racial groups as equals. Its fascinate, and we learned this year that the republican Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/party-isnt-procop'>Party Isnt Procop because if they were procop they would have responded differently to the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/capitol-insurrection'>Capitol Insurrection and certainly they are not even promilitary. These are wedges and terms and constructs they use just and they lie about them just as they lie about antiracism and critical Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/race-theory'>Race Theory and the 1619 project. And your book took off after the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/george-floyd-murder'>George Floyd Murder and so did robin Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/deangelos-book'>Deangelos Book white rage. I think that is the name of the book. Do you think the right is using the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/george-floyd-movement'>George Floyd Movement and the fact that White Americans saw what happened to Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/george-floyd'>George Floyd and said, my god, we need to question whether or not there is structural racism in our society, that thats what this is about, White Americans woken up about what happened to Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/george-floyd'>George Floyd and now the right wants to stop that . If you are an elected official, if you are a white elected official who has been instituting policies that have harmed the majority of White Americans and all the while you have been convincing those very White Americans that you are fighting for them, that you are instituting policies that help them, you are teaching them that the cause of their pain or are people of color, you are not going to want them to wake up, to understand racism because they will see you as a Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/problem-and-vote'>Problem And Vote you out. There you go. If you are antiracist, think about what that says that you are. Ibram x. Kendi, so glad you are here. Thank you. Still ahead, this automaker Going Places but make not in the right direction making them tonights absolute worst. The reidout continues after this. Dout continues after this did you know that your toughest Cleaning Problems can be caused by Hard Water Metals . 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Im sure this Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/isnt-something-money'>Isnt Something Money cant solve . What the fudge . Oh my gosh, Oh My Gosh, Oh My Gosh remember when all those companies said they were going to stop donating to the republicans who questioned the Election Results even after the capitol was attacked . Well, turns out that some of those companies went back on their word hoping that enough time had passed for them to continue to curry favor with as many politicians as possible. Now, of course, some companies barely tried to have principles in the first place after the insurrection, toyota played it coy. They told an industry publication, quote, given the recent Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/event-and-horicattack'>Event And Horicattack on the u. S. Capitol we are assessing our Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/pooch-pac'>Pooch Pac criteria. An investigation those that toyota gave 55,000 to 37 respects who objected to certifying the election. Aka the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/sedition-caucus'>Sedition Caucus. Axios pointed out toyota gave twice as much as nearly five times as many members of congress as the number two company on the list. In a Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/statement-toyota'>Statement Toyota told axios we do not believe it is appropriate to judge members of congress solely based on their votes on the electoral certification. Hold on a second. What would be appropriate . Toyota attempted to draw a line between those 37 republicans and others. They say, theyre not donating to because they, quote, undermine the legitimacy of the election. While they may have donated to marnl march Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/qanon-lady'>Qanon Lady green, a majority of the republican Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/politicians-toyota'>Politicians Toyota donated to joined the abscattered Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/texas-lawsuit'>Texas Lawsuit directly challenging the Election Results. And after the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/sedition-caucus'>Sedition Caucus voted against certifying the election republicans did their best to obfuscate any investigation into the insurrection. That Attitude Led to Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/liz-cheneys-ouster'>Liz Cheneys Ouster which is officially introduced by Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/virginia-foxx'>Virginia Foxx who, yep, Got Money from toyota. And in as toyota says not everyone deserved to be judge, what about andy bigs, accused of organizing the stop the steal rally. He has been raising the spector of Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/election-fraud'>Election Fraud from the very beginning. To the extent his own family called him out for it. According to toyota, he should not be judged for that. So for officially caring more been cozying up to power than about America Continuing to be a democracy, toyota, you are tonights absolute worse. And that is tonights reed out. All in with Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/cHris-hayes'>CHris Hayes starts right now. Tonight on all in. We are looking today at temperatures that are going to be 110 in seattle. Thats 37 degrees above average. 107 at Portland International right now. That equals portlands alltime record high. This is just unprecedented Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/heat-wave'>Heat Wave. Climate change becomes the top story. The off the charts Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/heat-wave'>Heat Wave tHreatening lives and businesses across the northwest while republicans push to keep possible solutions off the table. Then clock is ticking for trump as prosecutors give his business 24 hours to come up with a defense. Plus if you have wholesale mailin voting it increases the risk of fraud. After pushing the Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/voter-fraud-myth'>Voter Fraud Myth for most of 2020, trumps Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/attorney-general'>Attorney General is trying to whitewash his reputation. All in starts right now. Good evening from Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/new-york'>New York. Im Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/cHris-hayes'>CHris Hayes. It was 115 Href='https://vimarsana.com/news/degrees-faHrenheit'>Degrees FaHrenheit in