mouth about meghan markle and prince harry. his thoughts are almost too bizarre to believe, but we begin "the reidout" tonight with the question you've been asking that i'm sure you've been asking for an entire year now, when will we return to normal life? we have the first sign that some aspects of the pre-pandemic lives are on the horizon with the cdc giving the green light for fully vaccinated people to gather with other fully vaccinated people without wearing masks or social distancing. getting to see our loved ones again to share a meal indoors with grandparents, parents and friends is the best thing we've heard in a very long time. we're also seeing grim numbers that have haunted us all year with newly reported coronavirus and hospitalizations on the decline. the reason for this progress boils down to science in the form of three vaccines. the problem is there's a segment of the u.s. population that insists on rejecting science while clamoring that their so-called personal freedom means more than the 530,000 americans who are no longer here. >> it was pretty natural to have a sensitivity to freedom-loving americans that say we'll do the right thing. we know what to do, just give us our freedom back and lift some of these mandates. we can't protect everyone all the time. >> it's time for us to break free from the cycle of failed experts and frankly unconstitutional orders. a year later it's time to retire or just ignore the control freaks. it's time to declare victory and move on. >> those people are not doctors, by the way. according to a new poll, 23% of americans say that they have suffered the death of a close friend or family member because of covid-19, and as we know, the deadliest year in u.s. history did not have to be so deadly and those lies that you just heard are now feeding a staunch resistance to the vaccine among the folks who watch and trust right-wing outlets like fox news. according to a pew research poll republicans are 27% less likely to get or to have already received a vaccine compared to democrats. joining me now is dr. ashish jha and christina grier associate professor of political science at fordham university. dr. jha, the idea of masks and vaccines becoming a purely political thing s it hyperbole to say that we have half a million americans or at least that's part of the reason why we have half a million americans dead? >> joy, thanks for having me on. it's crazy. we have not politicized drinking and driving. we don't say, well, it's freedom. we have not politicized largely like wearing seatbelts. there is a set of public health things we do that are good for us and are also good for people around us and the fact that we have turned these things into a political issue, vaccines, masks and basic social distancing is not just baffling, but you are absolutely right and it is contributing to so many unnecessary deaths and suffering in this pandemic. >> dr. abraham, you testified today about all of these realities. let's just look at some of the reasons and there's a pew research poll that says why americans say that they're not getting vaccinated. there's a concern about side effects which is a pretty big part of it. vaccines are developed and tested too quickly say 85% of people. they want to know more about vaccines and i've heard that from family and friends and distrust the system entirely which is weird. they don't get the flu shot, et cetera. one thing that we've notice side that's less and less true among african-americans and a majority of black americans say they do plan to get a covid vaccine or have already gotten one. how do you get around those kinds of objections? >> yeah. i'll just say first and foremost, i mean, what was missing on that list is where are my vaccines? i haven't been offered a vaccine and that is what my community says every day in south los angeles, and i did not see that as a response in that pugh study. where do i park? i don't have paid time off. i don't have child care for my children. those are real reason, but that's not to be confused for hesitancy and that's the truth. there are real questions we all have about these vaccines, whether you are black or brown, white or yellow, these are new technologies. it is scary. we need to meet people where they are and we need to answer that medical health literacy question and we need to make sure that americans understand basic science and aside from that there are real issues and as dr. jha has today mentioned, supply may soon outpace demand and so we will have to find those arms and we need to meet them where they are, engage them, answer their questions and gets them vaccinated if there are no contra indications. >> christina, while we see resistance among african-americans declining, you do still hear, like for instance a lot of chatter about the johnson & johnson, the j&j, vaccine. people feel that's the vaccine being pushed on black people, that's being pushed on the working class and that the elite vaccines are the moderna and the pfizer. like that kind of thing. we had in detroit a situation where initially the mayor was, like, don't send us the johnson & johnson, send us the good ones and the science says that isn't true, there isn't one better than the other, but there is some hesitancy. the hesitancy is not all gone. >> right. that's where we need to have a multi-pronged approach, thought leaders or people that are leaders in their various communities to articulate the fact, right? and the facts are this. pfizer and moderna aren't the fancy vaccine and johnson & johnson isn't the ghetto vaccine that we've heard people talk about. the johnson & johnson is one shot and it is better for some populations like the homeless population that can't come back for the second vaccine or having doctors like the two here tonight and several other doctors especially doctors of color who can be leaders in their community and who can talk to deacons at churches, janitors at schools, who can get that message out. it doesn't just have to be celebrities. it doesn't have to be politicians. it can be regular folks who have the reputation and respect in their communities. if you belong to a church home or some sort of synagogue or a temple, whatever it is. sometimes that's just a regular, it could be a teacher and it could be a housekeeper who is someone that the community respects and if they believe that this is something for their community, they are probably the best advocates for this, and i think it's about, joy, you've been saying this from day one. it's all about listening to the science and the facts so that people can make the best decisions for themselves and their families. >> indeed, you think it's scary? try covid. covid is terrifying. rachel maddow talked about the fact that her mother-in-law got the j&j. rachel maddow's mother-in-law got it and she's fine. the other thing i hear among people in my circle that was initially reluctant. i can't get at it. there's none left. you know, i heard dr. abraham say supply will exceed demand, but right now demand feels like it's really exceeding supply. >> yeah. absolutely. by the way, just a quick shout out to dr. abraham on that testimony today. he was unbelievable. so dr. abraham, thank you for that. i was inspired by you, but let's get to your question, joy. it's so frustrating. states have made this so incredibly complicated for people. people are spending hours trying to navigate complex websites and it's unnecessary. we can make this simple and straightforward. i do think that we will have a point probably late march, early april when we will have plenty of vaccines, but we've got to make it ease per people and one of the ways you build inequity in this system is by making it complex and by making it hard and that's what a lot of states are doing and i think that's a huge problem. >> dr. abraham, per your testimony, can you talk a little bit about and it's important to notice, as well, what are people feeling like they can get back? here's what you can have back. is that message working when you're talking to people about getting vaccinated that these parts in your life can come back. >> i think it was very important that i went to congress in person and this was essential, work-related travel and getting vaccinated and doubly vaccinated like myself means we get back to work. we get back to school and get back to loving our loved ones, hugging and kissing them and doing all of the wonderful things that we missed since before this pandemic began. there's still a lot we have to do and we need to get everyone vaccinated and i appreciate what dr. jha and what today's senate panel mentioned. there's still plenty to do right now and every one of those barriers must not stand in the way between people and their vaccines. not having an appointment, not having internet, an email address or a phone or a home address, those are not barriers that not getting a vaccine. we must figure out why those systems are in place and we must break those barriers down and that's what we're doing in south l.a. and that's why we're so effective. 52,000 doses into arms as of tonight. >> yeah. congratulations on that, and christina, can you talk about it on the other side? because while we're having this conversation that's very positive and making people feel hopeful, in the other universe on earth two they're telling laura ingram, she is not a doctor, who is she to do that? they're putting people on tv saying forget everything, burn your mask asks do social distancing and just do what you want and governors also saying dismantle all of the restrictions. forget the cdc, just go wild which feels like it will kill more people and set us back and i wonder if you have thoughts about how people can break through the information bubble. >> joy, sadly, it's the politics and the partisan politics aren't following the science and so many republican governors are putting the citizens of their state in severe danger. we're seeing this texas is open for business and what does that mean for people who will sadly follow a politician with zero medical credibility and not wear a mask and social distance and go back to business as usual without having been vaccinated and we might see spikes in particular areas even though vaccinations are getting into the arms of particular people, we are so far from herd immunity and we know that there are going to be certain stakes where there will be spikes and sadly, also, because the coronavirus is so odd. for some people it takes them out quickly and for others they have flu-like symptoms and for some people they didn't know they had covid. so you have republicans saying it's not that serious and not that many people have died and so politically, when you're trying to politicize something that should be based in medical science, it's really hard to combat that because we have so many levels of government who are competing for that, and for some people it is serious. no, it doesn't kill everyone, but it could take out your parents or your grandparents or someone you love and we've seen that time and time again and we've seen many republicans saying i've lost loved ones and it's just a figment of the democrats' imagination to work against us. and we are still in the djt era of that. >> yeah. and a lot of these people who are saying that, these governors are getting vaccinated and trump got vaccinated. they're talking a lot of stuff, but they got their vks. dr. ashish jha, thank you very much, and the president tightens his grip on the gop urging the republicans to start sending him the contributions like a ratchet crime boss. >> tweeting out an image of a sex worker along with a white nationalist motto. america first. it's all weird and creepy and the ghost czar is not even worse. the hint that involves the royal scandal and "the reidout" continues after this. reidout" continues after this e planning . as carla thinks about retirement, she'll wonder, "what if i could retire sooner?" and so she'll get some advice from fidelity, and fidelity will help her explore some different scenarios, like saving more every month. ♪♪ and that has carla feeling so confident that she can enjoy her dream... right now. that's the planning effect, from fidelity. right now. ever notice how stiff clothes can feel rough on your skin? 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>> well, i was talking just this afternoon to someone who was in regular contact with the post-presidential trump, and according to my friend, here are some things that are true. trump desperately wants to be president, again. he never understood how much he'd like the job when he had it and now that he doesn't have it he wants it again. he wasn't focused enough on what matters and clearly since the impeachment, and the trial and the new administration, he has been very focused on one thing, which is just what you said, making sure that the streams of money in the party flow to him. >> right. and so so, adrienne, if you have these things working together, you have trump saying i'll help you with this one thing, voter suppression. you need to not let hr-1 pass so you need to make sure that you suppress enough votes to make it impossible for me not to win and that's being done, check. on top of it, saying send all of the money to me, it is a stranglehold and it's odd to me is republicans don't have to be, and they're choosing to be in it. >> you're exactly right, joy. this is the problem that the republican party's had since trump became the nominee and in 2016 they leaned in to him. they sort of fought him off and they weren't quite sure what to do with him and once he became the nominee they leaned right in. we knew this would bite them and a series of challenges in the long term and now you're seeing that come to fruition. he is the republican party's cash cow. if the nrc and nrcc cannot raise mono with donald trump how will they raise money and it's not like mitch mcconnell and kevin mccarthy has the fund-raising prowess that donald trump has. if he tells his donors you have to give to me and not the party committees they'll be in some real trouble. >> well, i think that is clearly true. david frum, it's both sad that, right? just as stimulus checks are going to be going out that donald trump has got his eyes on them to have these people send their money to him and they'll be sending it to him and five republicans who are the old-school type republicans retiring and you'll have five mini trumps running. you have one guy who may be running in missouri and his name is eric greiton and he resigned after sexual misconduct allegations came out and he's an ardent trumper and he tried to blackmail a woman he was having an extra marital affair with a photo he took without consent. he has a shot. you have old-fashioned republicans with that and then what is the party? johnny cobb wrote, the federalists ceased to exist. is this a death spiral? >> the greiton story is such a terrible human tragedy. this is a guy who one would have thought was once the future, a former navy s.e.a.l., and a rhodes scholar and someone who wrote books on the supremacy of character and who won a race to be missouri governor at a young age and the first jewish governor of missouri and that this remarkable person would succumb to scandal in the way that he did which is so offensive and upsetting and tragic and then say the solution for me, who once studied the greek philosophers is to become the trump of missouri. >> it's amazing, adrienne and describes josh hawley who has an ivy league education and this highfalutin education and he's a highly educated guy and they've all become trump. in the end they think that the only way to do it is they all try to be him. even people like ted cruz who he has belittled and mocked -- he can't even defend his own wife and it's more important to defend trump. lindsay graham, and is there another party on the other side of the democrats and if this is over what they want to be. >> joy, in the past however many years we've all seen times