That changed a world series on a missed call. And im sure they probably wanted it back then too. Itd probably changed their lives a little. [smith] what do you think about limiting mound vits. That was an innovation within the last year or so, right . They intro hced that you could one six mound visits in a game. [clemens] yeah, right. So, i kid out trying to do the speed up in the games. [smith] cause all of our kids have no attention span. They want everything over faster. They think its a video game. [clemens] well, it is, it is. But, you have the, you know, you havei tease my boys about everybodys gotta have a walk up song now so you can walk there and be cool. And all this stuff. You gotta have a walk up song, you gotta have, of course, and your sponsors and everything. So thats gonna take time, too. So, theyre trying to speed it up. In the Minor Leagues they have a pitch clock. But, i just got off the phone two days ago with three minor league guys theyve tut from reallygood pis because that 15 second clock hits, grab the ball and they just throw it. They dont exercise their mind or do anything [smith] so thats not positive. [clemens] its not positive but you really have to be jon the spot and understand what youre trying to do at the plate. [smith] now i see, if i ad the news right, that with next season theyre now going to say that ye a minimum number of batters you have to face if youre brought into the game. E saying that if a reliever comes in itll no longer be one and done, but you have to face a minimum of three batters, unless thereinjury, or the end of an inning. So what do you think about that . [clemens] ween you ask the question i think about two of my teammates that could throw right or left handed. And ad to declare. They had six fingered glove and it was hilarious. The guy would stand in lefthanded, myould put his hand on his left hand, and the batter would sneak back over to the righthanded box. He swick over. Whos gotta declare . You know, whos gonna declare which way were gonna go . [smith] why are we monkeying with baseball . Baseball survived all these years without this engineering of an outcome, and engineering of a clock. Ns] my sons team are two different teams, too. One of my sons teams want him, they want him making his outs in the air. And trying to hit homers. My other guy wants himoking ups putting the ball in play. So, it becomes, you know, gotta understand which team youre playing for also. Ng so theres a lot gn. Know, theres a lot thats going on now with television. I can go, and the work i do with the astros, ill show up ithe astros, i can go down to their video room, we have stationary cameras. See the catchers cadence. So you gryta be careful of eing that you do on the field as far as guys giving pitches, folding their arms at second base, and maybe putting their hands on their knees r a pitch away. Thats why you see, again the baseball fanatics youll see a catcher not move. Hell give the sign a fastball away but hell sit, sit, sit, and thenedime i get my leg stap, then he jumps to the outside corner. Which is a problem for two things, most umpires lean put their arm on the back of the, for balance, on the catcher. Ive had some fantastic catchers over the years. Still, trust your hands. But if my catcher drifts just a little, that umpire, thatborderlinh im not gonna get, he thinks its outside. So theres a lot of stuff that goes in. Its not just see ball, hit ball, throw ll, theres a lot going on. [smith] i just like simplifying it. Now i want it to be, i just wanna believe its simple. But again, to your point, [clemens] lets go down to this Little League fieldown here and well just, well spit seeds and drink gatorade. crowd laughing [sthats gonna be the greatest day ever, i know, with rer clemens. Who was the best hitter you ever faced . This will be like a game show speed round. Who was the best hitter you ever faced . [clemens] well, they ask me who the toughest guys and similar to that question, again, what comes to mind when you ask the question, evan, is i wanted to make it to the mor leagues to face reggie jackson. Reggie was the guy kinda i watched with the yankees. And when i got to fenway park, reggie was coming to the plate now batting number 44 for the california angels reggie j, and i caught myself, my shoes werent untied but i was retying and untying, and retying my shoes as he was going to the batters box. Im like, oh my gosh. Im in the big leagues, im fixin to face reggie jackson. So, and tohis halfshield helmet and those glasses on and, so thats who i wanted to face. My toughest hitters were the contact guys. The big power guys like i would tell, like albert pujols, that albert knew that each at bat he was probably was gonna get one very good pitch to hit. And if hed it or fouled it off, i gotcha. [smith] yeah. [clemens] the contact guys. [smith] but he would get you sometimes also. [clemens] solutely, absolut. A long way he would hit it sometimes. You pitch rs, ive given up some yardage and homers. [smith] right. [clemens] but, the contact guys because of the proximity ofhe ball parks, the biggest foul territories, oaklands colosseum. So, if you make a really good pitch and the guy tries to, you know, guys are so od in the big leagues with their bats. I tell people, it doesnt matter how hard you throw, guys in the big leagues can put wood on a bullet, i mean, theyre that good. And they will foul off a very tough pitch, youre hoping it d go in the first or second row, so your pitch count goes up, so you gotta breful with th. Especially, how hard theyre watching pitch counts now, you alluded to earlier. You not gonna see to many complete games anymore. And that was, in our generation, i saw the pitching coach come to take me out of the game, im giving him tst look that you could ever see. [smith] well, the fact is i think you still hold the record, do you not, for the complete g . Im giving him tst look that you could ever see. 18 complete games in, [clemensnt know that. [smith] no, i believe you do. And thats extraordinary to me because you think about now how rare it is to see a complete game. To see one complete game. [clemens] it is very rare. [smith] right, the coaches are happy to pull you t and put in a Aroldis Chapman or a Trevor Hoffman inare. At the last because they know guys fresh he can knock em all down in the, you know, one, two, three in the end. Why would we lettthe pitcher stay in a bit longer . 18 complete games, roger. [clemens] similar to having a really field goal kicker, you know . So, and youre right, six innings, sometimes five innings, the starters loover his shoulders because you have three, a seventh inning guy that throws 97, an eighth inning guy throws 98, and your closers coming in throwing 100. And youre trying to protect me on pitch count because of the dollars youre paying me to make sure that im fresh and ready in september and october for a playoff run. [smith] who is the team that you hated playing the most . No matter where you played, you were about to no play those guys played, you started to get all itchy . [clemenswell, i never t itchy. I mean, i was fired up on a wednesday afternoon business special game in milwaukee or [smith] diatter. [clemens] no, it didnt matter. [smith] was there a team you hated to play . [clemens] well, i was taught to when i beca a red sox, to hate the yankees. And then when i went to the yankees i was to hate the red sox. Right exactly. [smith] so, its asoring as that. The old rivalries. Is when both teams are competitive. When i was with boston, yankees were not very good. I mean, they had don mattingly, a few other guys. But, the blue jays were our kinda rival cause they were really winning in the late 80s, early 0s won a couple world series. Then when i went to new york and the ownership changed in boston and they got extremely competitive. Thats whe thats when you see the great competition because you are competing for a championship. And if you have pride in what you do and the city wear on your chest, which i was tadmht by a mother and grher who raised me when i watched my mother work three jobs, work her tail off so i could have, we werent rich by any means, wobut she would work and d have this sweet pair of cleats like the guy down the street, and a really cool red glove so i thought wewere it, yo . So, but i was taught that way and watching my mother work those three js so i had pride when i did that work for those teams. [smith] hodnt make a differenceou were playing you were happy to playing no matter what. [clemens] i was fortunate, [s tth] from the first last. [clemens] yeah, two of the most historic teams and then retire and have t opportunity to come home sleep in my own bed and play, have three wonderful years at my vanced age with the astros, goo the world series. Tried to retire again and then yankees called e more season. I told the general manager when he called me, are you crazy . He goes, what are you doing . I go, atching yall get swept in cleveland. He goes, well, how long will it take you to get ready . And rsgo, cash, im 45 yld. And he goes, i know. I need you in my fourth and fifth, but i need you in the locker room and the clubhouse, too. [smith] it was as much about what you did off the field. [clemrns] yeah, so just the ery and keeping teammates on the same page, and you know, hang fun. [smith] so more than 4,600 strikeouts in your career. Anonly Randy Johnson and nryan l had more strikeouts than you did. Er three, all time. Was there any one strikeout over the course of that that you think about maybe your favorite strikeout. Was there a moment over the course of those 24 seasons where you isolate out one time that you faced a batter, or were they all good . [clemens] they were all good. I mean, anytime you can get a strikeout. The ones that are more [cl meaningful, of course,od. Is one out man on third and you need a strikeout to keethe inning alive. Get a strikeout after one of your teammates have made a ero you get a fourth out, per se, and keep their nam out of the paper for making a big error. [smith] yeah, people forget about that if you get out of the inning. [clemens] thats right, your teammates thank you lot running off the field. But you know what . Again, i bring up bill fischer. My pitching coach that i had with tom seaver and what a luxurit was. You again, talked about it earlier, having that opportunity at 21 yearsold, 22 off the campus here at texas, haviwi the opportunity to pla tom seaver and watch him as the truest of power pitchers. But bill fischer still to this day holds the, he did not walk a guy in 89 innings. I think its 89 or 90, i should know exactly, but its right in that area. [smith] well, just something crazy. [clemens] heever walked a guy. And, so in both 20 strikeout games he w and he called me on the second, after the second one. And he called me smokey after okey joe wood, the great smokey joe wood. And, said thk i love it that you strt 20 and set the major league record, love it even more so you were throwing at that high rate of speed and you didnt walk anybody. [smith] didnt walk anody. Thats a pretty good measure of success. [clemens] those are pretty good. [smith] so i go through l the statistics. I mentioned 354 wins, more than 4,600 strikeouts, seven cy young awards. No one will ever, i mean thats probably a record that will stand for all time. Why are you not in the hall of fame . [clemens] well, writers vote on it. [smith] well, you know what im asking about. So seven consetive ballots. Your percentage of the vote each has gone up. I think this last year when you were not voted in you got just below 60 . Youre eligible for three more years, you gotta get to 75. May be that you dont get in. Now, the only thing i could think of is that people have decided, despite what youve said, despite what the court said, despite that you had no failed dr tests, you had no suspensions. People think that you used performance enhancing drugs and they wont vote you in the hall of fame. Am i wrong to think that . [clemens] you are if youre looking at facts. But, i cant control, like i said, [clemens] you are if they asked me about the hall, i cant, i have zero control over that. Number two is, i didnt really play thgame to worry about making the hall of fame. [smith] that wasnt the point. [clemens] yeah, so after my first couple of years. The first couple years i was wanting to make a living. [cland i saw that i could my make a great livings. For me and my family. Nnter that it was about g championships. But, as far as the voting goes, i ll the guys that vote r you, thats great. In my situatn what i did, we went at it the proper way. Like i said, it was, the stuff that i went through was similar to what kavanaugh and all this stuff i see that goes on now with trump and kavanaugh, and all this oth stuff. But, it was pretty much a circus. And it was great that we stopped a couple guys from making money off my name. They were out there claiming they were thisr that, they did this for me, they did that for me, they were out there claiming thed they had book deals and they sold my name to a Vitamin Company for 300 grand. But nobody writes about that. But we went about it the right way and we handled it properly. [smiuve been adamant from the very beginning, the accusations that were made in the mitchell report and the individuals who made those accusations, was, i didnt do it. [clemens] yeah, but there was only one individual and we gave them everything thathey wanted. And we went through it. It was pretty trying, not only, like i said if it have my boys and family and sisters and brothers they were really upset about it all. And, but we handled it the proper y ke i tell people if it happens, if they want to vote it doesnt really matter to me either way, like i said. Its not something that i played for. The guys that look at the facts and do it all isreat. But you have zero control over it, like i said. I think that for me the hall of fame when somebody says, hey hes a hall of famer, its kind of a selfish thing. E would be so many people i need to thank including the all the catchers i talked about earlier, players that i played with, man, theres just, its like i said, not only your family and people that helped you get there, but again the guys that ive been talking to over the last week [smith] people who never get the cred. [clemens] thats right. Theyll never have a chance to be in the hall of fame but they were hall of famers to me bethey were fantastic teammates of mine. [smith] so you dont feel cheated . Right, you went throug the legal system, you went through the process. First trial was a mistrial, second trial you were found innocent. [clemens] yeah. [smith] like i said, never failed a drug test, never suspended freball. And the allegations against you really only apply to latter parof your career. Even if you lop that part off the numbers you put up in the firspart of your career we a hall of fame worteady. So you have no regrets . You dont feel cheated by this . [clemens] solute not. And i cant lop off the second half of my career cause it was a wonderful second half of my career or twilight of my career. And, you know, i did it to the fullest. I played the game hard and i played it the right way. So, again like i said, its like people that for some reason they can say som thing negative about yse days and it gets on the website or Something Like that and it sticks. So, but again, we went about it right way and i dont think i would change it for a minute. And,i said, we put and made people that were makingccusations, we pm in their place where they needed to be, and they made a lot of money off my name. Its a shame, like i said, it was just short of preter much of a jerry sprihow. And i like Jerry Springer, i met Jerry Springer and i had fun with it, but it was [smith] that by the way will be the headline of this interview. You like Jerry Springer. Th be the craziest thing youve said all day. [clemens] yeah, oh yeah, yeah. Mith] yeah, okay. Your boys, the naming all ur boys with names that begin with k, i get it. Thats pretty good. [clemens] it started with the first one and it just started happening. t[smith] you just coulet, yeah. [clemens] and if wed tried for a girl id be living with you right now shed kick me right out. Well, come on over. Its a little bit like George Foreman naming all of his kids george. Alth igh, yours is more clevhink actually. [clemens] and i think hes got about eight georges. [smith] he does, its very confusing at dinner time there in the foreman house. Two of your boys played for the university of texas, followed you here. One in the Blue Jays Organization now, one in the tigers organization. Were you a good sports dad . Or were you a helicopter parent. [cle tns] yeah, so i just gbe dad until they or their friends io ask me a pointed que or, a coach asks me to come in to address the team. Ill do that. [smith] but thats now. [clemens] yeah. [smith] were you a good sports dad when they were much unger . [clemens] i was the dad that was in charge of the video and wiping the tears and doing the baaids. And i loved that part of it. [smith] just like the rest of us, sort of, weirdly. [clemens] yeah, yeah. [sth] there was nothing ecial about the fact that their dad happens to be Roger Clemens. [clemens] no. But i was always the one that hado throw the kids pitch cause the coaches couldnt throw a strike. So then i went out there and found out just how hard it was to throw a kids pitch. [smith] yeah, but honestly if youre seven years old and you stare up the person throwing kids pitch and its Roger Clemens. [clemens] they dont know that. They just know im a dad that throws strikes. The other kids now, ill tellim a you a quick story. Ikes. I thought pitcn game 7 of the world series was pressure. Pressure is when you get six pitches in dads pitch and youve thrown five balls and the moms screaming at you up there at that, throw my kid a stl. Ke, youre a professio thats pssure. Youre trying to aim it perfectly at his bat. [smith] why cant you do that . [clemens] meanwhile, ive got my youngest one whout seven in the little circle with me, that after the kid hits it gotta run off the field. And hes like, dad, dont let him hit this one, dont let him hit it, dont let him hit it. So he wants me to throw it past m. So ive got all kinds of stuff happening. [smith] hes just a regular kid. [cleme] oh yeah. [smith] did you encourage them to play . Would you have been able to stop them from playing if theyd want to . [clemens] they played a little bit of all the sports. Would you have been able to stop them from playing teach you how to get along with others in the work field. I told both young boys i love it that theyre chasing theidreams in professional baseball but i love it even more that kacy went through the mccos Business School here with colors and kody the communications school. My oldest one, kody, played 10 years. Was fantastic never break to make it to t