>> science tells us that zombies will only eat human brains. >> well, i don't think science knows, actually. >> brains! brains! no brains here. >> it's "a late show with stephen colbert." tonight: insane in the campaign. plus, stephen welcomes janelle monae! and jacob soboroff! featuring jon batiste and stay homin'. and now, live on tape from the ed sullivan theater office building in new york city, it's stephen colbert! >> stephen: hey, everybody, welcome back. you have something you need to tell me. tell me later. good to see you. hey, everybody, welcome to "a late show." i'm jur host, stephen colbert. and you are? evyy's here. right over there. there are only 49 days left until the election. time really flies when you're too scared to fly. with the days counting down, there's been a huge role reversal. for the last year, donald trump has been amassing the largest campaign war chest in u.s. history. with the r.n.c., he's raised a combined $1.1 billion-- yes, billion with a capital "illion." but, reportedly, team trump has blown through more than $800 million and may run out of cash before the november election. that's why he's changed his hat to say "will scream for food." in fact, with the days dwindling, biden is outspending trump on tv. yeah! good luck finding donald trump on tv now. trump says, "nuh uh," tweeting "we are advertising all over the place, but as much as we do, the fake news likes to say we aren't. just being smart. we have much more money than we had at same time in 2016. also spending on other, and different, elements of the campaign." yes, they're spending it on other and different elements. like paying poll workers, specifically porn stars who worked on his pole. but trump gets plenty of free air time. this morning. he phoned it in to his friendly friends at "fox & friends." the friends asked trump about bob woodward's book, and trump assured them that he had totally done the reading: >> he only writes bad books, and i actually got to read it last night. i read it very quickly, and it was very boring. >> stephen: uh, i read it too... now, boredom-- is that the thing that keeps you up at night staring at the ceiling in a cold sweat fearing for our nation? is that boredom? because if that's boredom, this thing is a total snooze-fest. trump had a warning about the book: look, you-- you-- if you want to remain sane, just don't read it, because what they do is disgraceful. >> stephen: so, he says this book will drive you insane, and he said he's read the book, so-- yeah, that makes sense. he must have gotten an advance copy! like, 40 years ago. in the book and in an exclusive clip on this show last night, woodward proves that trump lied to the american people about the seriousness of the covid-19. but trump says he had a good reason. >> i don't want to create panic. people say, "oh, you should have gone out there and say, you know, jumped up and down, 'you're going to die.' 'you're going to die.'" >> stephen: mr. president, no one expects you to jump up and down. we're amazed when you stand up and down. but, of course, there's a long history of presidents not knowing how to break news to the american people without panicking them. we all remember f.d.r.'s inaugural. >> let me assert my firm belief that the only thing we have to fear is... you're going to die! you're going to die! >> stephen: now, after 47 long minutes, the friendly fox interview finally wrapped up with trump making it clear that he wants to do it again soon, and repeatedly. >> yeah, we're doing it every week, every monday i think they said. and if we can't do it on a monday, we'll do it on a tuesday, like we did today. >> sounds good. >> mr. president, thank you very much. you may want to do it every week, but fox is not committed to that. we're going to take it on a kaips by case basis. ( laughter ) >> stephen: wow! that is cold! that's like ending a date with "so i'll see you next saturday! and every saturday after that." and she says, "uh, you may want to see me next saturday, but katie is not committed to that, we'll take it on a case-by-case basis." no tongue. mr. president-- too far. too far, no tong? >> yes. >> no, it's no tongue. that's too far. it's very kekouros. i think steve doocy's just not that into you. one group trump is working hard to win over is hispanics. yesterday, he held a "latinos for trump" roundtable, though many people said it looked less like a roundtable than a sneaky way of holding a rally, to which trump said, "uh, yeah?" >> the fake news, they say this is supposed to be a roundtable but it looks like a rally. well, it is a rally because we love each other. ( cheers ) no, it is a roundtable, and we're here to really listen. >> stephen: that's like a bank robber saying, "the fake police say i'm committing a crime. well, you know what? it is a crime to hide my beautiful face behind this ski mask. but, no, actually, this isn't a crime. i'm here to really listen to the code for the safe. give me the money, nobody gets hurt." no tongue. . ( laughter ) it's not appropriate in that situation is it? while he was thanking his supporters by endangering their health, trump took a shot at biden for not doing that. >> he's coming up once every three or four days. i've been in every state. i've been to so many states the last few days. >> stephen: (as trump) "no way biden can spread covid like i can. i'm in every state, no social distance, no masks, i'm spraying down the crowd with my spittle like a pathogenic lawn sprinkler." shucka shucka shucka! it makes the shucka sound. i have never seee n a lawn spray do any lawn work. no tongue! ( laughter ) no tongue. trump again implied that coronavirus is a plot by democrats, and that after the election, governors who had shut down their states to protect their citizens would prove it to him. >> you know what's going to happen? on november 4, they will open up everything. on november 4, they'll announce "everything is open now. we were only kidding." >> stephen: so, you're saying this was a big prank on all of us? well, i'll say this: it does feel like the worst episode of "jackass." the campaign may come down to the debates, and trump previewed his strategy over the weekend with fox news anchor jeanine pirro, seen here losing a debate to ernest and julio gallo. ( laughter ) when the subject of biden came up, trump was suspicious that his opponent might be getting a little help. >> you know, everyone thought he was going to be killed by bernie, and it was tie. it was nothing-- it wasn't winston churchill, but it was fine. but i've also seen him in some of the other debates where he wasn't even coherent. he couldn't utter a-- in his-- >> how do you think he goes from incoherent to coherent? >> i think there's probably-- possibly drugs involved. that's what i hear. i mean, there's possibly drugs. >> stephen: (as biden) "you caught me, don! i've been juicing: tomato, beet, prune-- i'm as regular as the atomic clock, jack!" ( laughter ) now, this isn't the first time trump has accused biden of using drugs. in fact, a couple of weeks ago, trump called for himself and joe biden to submit to drug tests before their first debate. it would be the first real test of the general election: which septuagenarian is capable of producing enough urine to fill a cup? ( laughter ) in a phone call to the "washington examiner," trump rationalized his insanity. >> we're going to call for a drug test, by the way, because his best performance was against bernie. it wasn't that he was winston churchill, because he wasn't, but he-- it was a normal, boring debate. you know, nothing amazing happened. and we are going to call for a drug test because there's no way-- you can't do that. >> stephen: trump thinks that anyone who shows basic competency must be cheating. (as trump) "wow, did you see biden jog up that ramp without tripping once? he's gotta be 'roiding. plus, he drank his water with just one hand. it's like they ground up lance armstrong and injected it into his neck!" trump explained why performance- enhancing drugs are perfect for a debate: >> well, it is a prizefight. it's no different than the gladiators, except, you know, we have to use our brain and our mouth. >> stephen: you're not a gladiator! they fought lions! you brag about identifying one on a piece of paper. ( laughter ) the first presidential debate is just two weeks away. so this year, you won't have to wait until thanksgiving to hear two grampas argue about politics. but there may be a major format change, thanks to podcast host and cue ball being pulled out of a claw machine, joe rogan. on a recent episode, rogan's guest, tim kennedy, proposed a different kind of debate. >> would you do a debate? >> would i? >> you be the control mechanism to the candidates, like a biden-trump debate with joe rogan hosting. your questions. >> we should have that. this is 2020. i mean, we have the ability to have that. we're not talking about 1979, we're talking about 2020. if they wanted to do that, they both wanted to come here in austin, sit down, and have a debate, i would 100% do it. >> my god. >> i would 100% do it. >> stephen: hell, yeah! it is about damn time we had a debate noderated by the former host of "fear factor." "fear factor." ( as rogan ) "gentlemen, you've got three minutes to outline your plan for comprehensive infrastructure reform-- while you eat donkey testicles. go!" rogan's guest even tweeted this out: "on my podcast with joe rogan, he offered to moderate a debate between joe biden and donald trump. it would be four hours with no live audience, just the two candidates, cameras, and their vision of how to move this country forward. who wants this?" and the president of the united states responded, "i do!" don't get your hopes up, rogan. trump has a long record of not meaning it when he says "i do." ♪ ♪ but trump seemed serious about it when he was asked about his accepting the debate on this morning's "foxy friends": >> so, you've accepted that. joe biden, no word on whether or not he'd be interested in doing that joe rogan debate. >> joe is lost. joe is lost. we can't have a president that's mentally lost. >> you mean joe biden? i thought you meant joe rogan at first. joe biden. >> stephen: (as trump) "joe is lost, and by "joe" i mean biden. but he gets help from joe in the media. i'm talking about scarborough, rhymes with marlborough, one of the great cigarettes. bottom line: i will debate joe camel." well, tonight, i, stephen colbert, am hereby offering to moderate a debate between joe biden and donald trump. it would be eight hours, locked room, no names, no cameras. only one boardwalk caricature artist. winner is whichever candidate has the biggest head! let me sweeten the pot a little bit, gentlemen. i'm talking one stage, one podium, on wheels, zips back and forth. two competitors, two shields, one man has a sword, the other has a net and a trident, one hungry lion in a colosseum. each man will get 30 minutes to make one meal from the ingredients found in our mystery we've got capers. we've got twizzers. we've got pork loin. and a bottle of weller 12 busch. that's for daddy just to make it through the ( bleep ) show to november. we've got a great show for you tonight. janelle monae is here. but when we come back, "meanwhile!" join us, won't you? that is the real deal. ♪ i like big jeans. itty-bitty jeans. ♪ your shoulder seems to be healing nicely. well, dr. farrell, it feels really good... that's good. and... i'm sorry. baby, don't touch that... i don't want you to play with that... (singing) twinkle, twinkle little star. how i wonder what you are... (still singing) up above the world so high... like a diamond in the sky. i'm so glad that your shoulder is feeling better. but, how are you doing? i'm hanging in there... schedule a video visit with your doctor. and get quality care with no copay. kaiser permanente. thrive. ♪ ♪ >> stephen: hey, everybody, welcome back to "a late show." let's say hi to our friend, jon batiste. hello, jon. >> jon: hello, stephen, what's the word? >> stephen: the word is vote. we're going to tell everybody how to vote in just a minute. you're going to vote, right? >> jon: oh, sure. everybody should vote. this is a very, very important election. >> stephen: i agree. it is an important one. >> jon: yes, yes, indeed. >> stephen: jon, we can voting music last night. what music is on your mind tonight? >> jon: oh, my goodness. we have to do some loving music. ♪ ♪ ♪ we need some love in the world love in the world. ♪ love in the world >> stephen: jon batiste, everybody. folsk, we are just 49 days away from the election, and i don't have to tell you that this is an important one-- this is an important one! and it's not just important to vote. it's important to have a plan for how you are going to vote, because covid will make this election unlike anything before it. and if that wasn't enough, the rules regarding how to vote vary drastically from state to state. for example, some states do not allow you to cite coronavirus as a reason to vote absentee. some states automatically send you an absentee request form but not a ballot. and some states put chili on top of their spaghetti. that has nothing to do with the election, but come on, cincinnati, it's confusing! ( laughter ) so i wanted to help make things easier for anyone who should be voting-- which is everyone. which is why "the late show" has created a new website, betterknowaballot.com, that contains easy-to-follow voting information for each state. just click on your state and get the information you need about registering to vote, requesting an absentee ballot, or voting early in person. i will even be posting a video for every state to help explain how to vote easily, early, and safely where you live. there are eight videos up already for the states where you can start to receive ballots the soonest. we'll be rolling out the rest in the coming days as other states get ready to send out absentee ballots. so go to betterknowaballot.com. and even if your state's video isn't up yet, you can still go there to get the info and the links you need to start voting in your state now. take a look at it and share it, because i'm serious about people voting. how serious? i'm making jokes about it. and i'm announcing a challenge right now: whichever state has the highest voter turnout per capita in the 2020 election will get to come on my show! what does that mean? your state will have to win to find out. also, i do not know what that means. but it is a promise and i will somehow fulfill it! go vote! you know, he vade, transitions. i spend a lot of time mining the news-scape for the shiniest gems of stories pairing them with the most precious topical diamonds, and carefully slotting them into the priceless silver tiara that is my monologue. but once in a while, i grab some soiled newspaper from my dog's pen, watch six minutes of youtube origami videos, then down a case of schlitz to slap on the dunce cap of news that is my segment: "quarantine-while"! quarantine-while, "taco bell is now selling its own custom wine." that's gonna be an intense hangover given how drunk you already have to be to order taco bell wine. taco bell wine is called "jalapeno noir and is made to pair with its toasted cheesy chalupa." of course, every palate is different, but i find the toasted cheesy chalupa actually pairs best with sadness. ( laughter ) quarantine-while, the "fresh prince of bel-air" mansion is now on airbnb. perfect if you got in one little fight and your mom got scared. it's the 30th anniversary of the tv show, and to honor it, airbnb put one wing available for rent on the platform. only one wing? i want the full experience, the whole house, carlton, jazz and both aunt viv's. oh, you think you can change actresses in the middle and pretend like we won't notice! it's too many vivs! quarantine-while, rihanna's secluded london mansion is up for sale for $41 million. though, like a lot of high-end real estate, the listing does come with one warning to potential buyers: >> bitch better have my money. >> stephen: quarantine-while, a lock of abraham lincoln's hair has sold at auction for more wow. that seems particularly high, especially considering ebay bidders won't go above three bucks for my jar of taft's toenail clippings. tafts toenail clippings is hard to say. we'll be right back-- oh, we're not done? there are more jokes? there are more jokes. >> yes. we don't know who has it, because no information about the buyer was disclosed. ooh, an anonymous wealthy buyer has secretly acquired abraham lincoln's genetic material. that can only mean we're working on opening up "the hall of jurassic presidents." ( drumming fingers ) sure about that? oh, there's more! don't change-- don't cut any of this! this is magic. this is what the show should be. >> you produce it, you know. >> stephen: i'm not producing. i'm just failing with panawch. i know what your question is: what if they produce. great care has been taken to make sure all the presidents are male. we'll be right back with janelle monae. ♪ ♪ wet dishes? residue? spots? it's not your dishwashers fault. simply add finish jet-dry 3in1 to rinse dry and shine your dishes. solve three problems at once with finish jet dry 3in1. another bundle in the books. got to hand it to you, jamie. your knowledge of victorian architecture really paid off this time. nah, just got lucky. so did the thompsons. that faulty wiring could've cost them a lot more than the mudroom. thankfully they bundled their motorcycle with their home and auto. they're protected 24/7. mm. what do you say? one more game of backgammon? [ chuckles ] not on your life. [ laughs ] ♪ when the lights go down [ laughs ] your bank can be virtually any place you are. you can deposit checks from here. and you can see your transactions and check your balance from here. and pay bills from here. because your bank isn't just one place. it's virtually any place you are. just download and use the chase mobile app. visit chase.com/mobile. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ >> stephen: welcome back, everybody. my first guest is a grammy-nominated artist and actress you know from "hidden figures" and "moonlight." her latest film is "antebellum." >> we must choose wisely. but until then, we keep our heads down and our mouths shut. do you understand me? >> i know you, and i know that you are my only way out of here. >> stephen: please welcome, janelle monae! jannel thank you so much for being here. >> are you kidding me. you are my favorite. thank you for having me. >> stephen: we where have to get you on more often janelle monae-- i have in my hand-- i'll show it to you and i'll show it to the camera-- this is a photo of you dancing on my desk. it's been almost two years. >> oh, my goodness. come on. we should be flat for not seeing each other sooner. that was so fun, and we danced when our, like favorite president barack obama was in the white house. we always danced together. it's long overdue. >> stephen: it's guests like you that make me miss being in the ed sullivan theater rye now. i know the audience would be excited to hear you perform. you are a performer. how are you dealing with not beingably to be with the audience right now? >> i definitely cried when a lot of my tour dates got canceled. i was supposed to be on tour right now, headlining the hollywood bowl. but i-- i'm still connected, you know. i'm trying to-- i'm not on social media as much as i would like. but i'm just trying to connect to the community as, like, a citizen. how can i be better helping orgers amplify their voices with the work that they're doing? i'm connecting in different ways, and different ways that to me are more important than just, like, performing on stage. >> stephen: i want to ask you about your friend chadwick bozeman who we lost last month. he was a lovely human being. i got to interview him once, and i was impressed by his vulnerability and his humanity, aside from, of course, the talent and all the promise that was lost when he died. tell me about your friend. how did you guys get to know each other? and how will you remember him? >> well, i met chadwick through one of my good friends, lupita, and they were on location in atlanta, georgia. evidence recording "dirty computer," my album, and i just said i would love to host you guys. and they all showed up one night in the evening. we ate, we listened to music. and i just remember chadwick that night being so present, like, we were not talking about work. we were not talking about the past. but we were just right there. he was playing drums. we were dancing. and him just being so kind and so loving. and i was really nervous about releasing my album, so i had played them songs that nobody haded to and just, like, the encouragement they got from him, seeing him smile, see him dance. you could feel that his spirit was one of wanting to give, give people, like, the feeling of love, the feeling of hope, even at parties, you know where we're supposed to be, like drinking and, you know, just acting wild and crazy. he still took that time to tell me that he was proud. he was excited, and to dance with me and make me feel like, yeah, i can release this project. so i will really miss him. i feel like his spirit lives on forever through the incredible work he has done. i had an opportunity to dance with him one last time this year. it was an oscars party, and he tapped me on my shoulder-- i'll never forget it-- he tapped me and he said, "let's have this dance." and we danced for a good three to four minutes smiling. we both love james brown. obviously, he had an opportunity to portray james brown in the film, sowe would figure out who could out-james bown each other dancing. i will always remember that moment and i'll always hold that dear to me and i'll always try to live in the present because i saw him living in the present. i aw him do that a lot of times whenever we encountered ooch other. >> stephen: the last time we were together in 2018, you actually talked about what the movie "black panther" meant to you in that interview. what does it mean to you now in 2020? >> it's still revolutionary. is it still is afrofuturism, seeing ourselves in the future thriving, being able to tell our stories from our own words and mouth. and to see, you know, just that phenomenal cast coming together is just-- it's iconic. and i think we're all waiting for-- for 2, and whenever ryan, you know, can-- can finish it, and i think that chadwick's legacy will live on through "black panther." it's global. it's just like this universal, like, i guess like rocket or big bang that just exploded, and it just let people know that being black, being creative, we are so many things. and there's really nothing that we can't do on screen, nothing we can't do. >> stephen: well, let's talk about what you're doing with your music. your new song "turn tables" is out now and it's in a stacy abrams documentary, "all in for the fight for democracy" it's about voter suppression. what inspires you these days to write your music? >> well, honestly, i was not-- i haven't really been inspired musically. it was because stacy abrams and the directors of the documentary reached out to me. i live in atlanta, georgia, and i had an opportunity to vote for stacy abrams, and i was there when bryan kent stole the election from stacy abrams, you know him being over-- as secretary of state, being over the vote, overseeing it, also running a gangster for governor. that's a conflict of interest. and there's already proof in data that shows that. i said, "whenever you need me, call mement. and she did. i watched the documentary, and just like my film "antebellum," it pooled the past and present and what could be our future and what's at stake for our future if we don't act in the important and become prointerest and rally fight this voter suppression, and understand all the tactics they're using to make sure our voices are silenced. i said, "you know what? if i can't pull it together for me, i'm going to pull it together for her. and the people who are fighting for marginalized voices, fighting to make sure black folks don't have to stand in line for 20 hours just to vote, like, really trying to make sure that we own and take back our democracy. so i went into the studio. i had a week, and i worked with nate, my producer, we worked together for many years, and this is what we came up with. you know, it's not a song about me leading a movement or i have something to say. it's really energy. it's like energy in the form of a song because all of us are fighting and all of us will get and have been and are emotionally fatigued. this is a long fight. woe don't know how much energy we're going to have to use. and so this song is just energy to the revolutionaries. and i always say, "what is a song without a revolution and what is a revolution without a song?" >> stephen: let's talk about your new movie "antebellum," without giving too much away-- and i know there are surprises here-- tell us what it is about. >> so i play veronica henry. veronica henly is a successful author, she's a mother, she's a wife and a best friend and a thought leader in her community. veronica find herself trapped in this horrifying reality that forces her to confront the past, the present, and the future before it's too late. there are scenes that are so timely and so up to date-- this does deal with white supremacy and microaggression. and it also celebrate black women, and globally it gives a electrocute, you know, what it's like for a black woman to carry the burden of dismantling, you know, systemic oppression on her back every single day and come out triumphant. >> stephen: well, jannel, it was great to see you again. thank you so much for being here. >> it's always great seeing you. thank you so much for having me. >> stephen: "antebellum" is available on demand this friday. janelle monae, everybody! we'll be right back with "new york times" bestselling author jacob soboroff. ♪ ♪ never run dry of... killer attitude. good moves. or hydration. neutrogena® hydro boost. the number 1 hyaluronic acid moisturizer instantly delivers 2 times the hydration. and keeps hydrating all day long. running dry of supple, bouncy skin? never! hydro boost. pair with hydro boost wipes to cleanse and hydrate. neutrogena® my wife and daughter had been killed in an automobile crash, and lying in the bed were my two little boys. i couldn't have imagined what it would've been like if i didn't have insurance to cover them immediately and fully. forty years later, one of those little boys, my son beau, was diagnosed with terminal cancer, given months to live. i can't fathom what would have happened if the insurance companies had the power to say, "the last few months, you're on your own." the fact of the matter is health care is personal to me. obamacare is personal to me. when i see the president of the united states try to eliminate this health care in the middle of a public health crisis, that's personal to me too. we've got to build on what we did because every american deserves affordable health care. i'm joe biden and i approve this message. this is hal's heart. it's been broken. and put back together. this is hal's relief, knowing he's covered by medicare from blue cross blue shield. and with coverage you can trust, backed by over 80 years of healthcare expertise, we'll be there when it matters most. this is medicare from blue cross blue shield. this is the benefit of blue. this is medicare from blue cross blue shield. ♪ top down, the city riding with me ♪ ♪ been through the storm and the gritty ♪ ♪ do it for the mom & pop on every block ♪ ♪ new day, sunshine on every block ♪ ♪ windows open, i'm yelling unity ♪ ♪ side by side with my community ♪ ♪ celebrate, let's have a jubilee ♪ ♪ it's bigger than you and me ♪ ♪ they've been there for us ♪ ♪ let's be there for them ♪ ♪ they've been there for us ♪ everybody. my next guest is a correspondent for nbc news. his new book, "separated: inside an american tragedy," is a "new york times" bestseller. please welcome, jacob soboroff. jacob, good to see you again. >> good to see you, stephen. here's the book "separated." and it's specifically about the family separation policy instituted by the trump administration. it's only been a few years sense you first started reporting n this, but it's dropped out of the news in a large way. just remind us about this extraordinary-- extraordinarily cruel act of policy that was used as a deterrent against people. >> it was an event that united the country. i'll never forget covering it myself, and seeing you talk about this to your audience. i mean, it's something that got people outraged in a way that i haven't seen in a reporter before. and when i say, you know, i saw myself, i was inside those facilities. i was inside the former walmart, 250,000 square feet. you had 1,500 boys, 10-17 years old, living inside for 22 hours a day. went outside for recreation two or three hours, depending on the day of the week. they were watching "muwana" on the loading dock. they were doing tai chi. a couple of days later, father's day, 2018, i went to the epicenter, and that's where the kids were laying on conkrept floors under the blankets and supervised by, you know, security contractors in a watch tower. and i could not believe what i was seeing with my own eyes. and that's why i wanted to do the book because i didn't understand. how did america do this? how in our name was the united states of america doing this to these children? i think it was the same questions you were asking at the time. and i did this for myself and for everybody else, too. >> stephen: let's talk about how we got there. the trump administration decided to use this cruelty as deterrence, didn't they? >> yeah, they called it-- they called it, as such, john kelly said that on cnn in march of 2017. and what they ended up doing was torturing, in the words of physicians for human rights, which won a nobel peace prize, 5500 kids. and the american academy of pediatrics called it government-sanctioned child abuse and they did it on purpose and did it to scare people from coming to this country. >> stephen: is this policy over? >> no, no, it's not. the a.c.olympic ump says since the so-called end of the policy, that over 1,000 kids had been separated. and i don't think trump wanted this to end. in fact, i report in the book as much when he was going to visit tornado victims, he whispered to sd said we have to weep doing it. and melania said no, no. and he said, "we'll see am. can he bring it back worse than it was before? i think the answer is yes. >> stephen: that is' chilling reminder of what the stakes of this election are, in some small way donald trump might be fettered by trying to reach out to voters right now. but if he's reelected, he has no constraints over any act of cruelty he wants to inflict on these people. and the lasting damage you talk about in here is extraordinary. there are still children who haven't been reunited with their parents, correct? it's almost unbelievable to think about. literally, on the ground, in central america, are not-- the government doesn't want to do it. the government turned over phone numbers and addresses and you have nonprofits going around elfsalvador, and they basically have to stop it because of covid, looking for kid. there is an entire additional group that we still don't know who they are or where they are or if they have been reunited yet. >> stephen: do you have any sense of how many kid it is? >> over 1,000. that group is over 1,000 children. and that's why they're on the ground. because, literally, they did this without a plan. they didn't have a plan to reunite. in fact, there were people who had plans. i mean, and i call them heroes, civil servants who pushed back on the policy, tried to stop them from doing, this because they knew this was going to be the result. ultimately, the trump administration pushed forward with this anyway, and it was the disaster these folks predicted. >> stephen: is it true that there was no there is place to keep track of the kids, partly because they started doing it before the policy was announced? >> yeah. >> stephen, therefore, they couldn't have a record of it? >> yes. by the way, it goes back to the obama administration, when this was happening in very limited circumstances for the safety of the kids. there was a guy, jim dela cruz, keeping track on an informal spreadsheet. he said if we're going to separate the best way to reunite is not separate at all. the systems aren't talking to each other. when they got to the point, the list this guy was keeping, leaked to "the new york times," scott lloyd, the trump-appointed head of the refugee agency of the federal government, his first instinct was to get rid of that list, and he told subordinates he wanted to get rid of the list. you can read about the encounter. and because of the heroes that cared about the kids over trump policies, they refused to do it. to me that was such a critical point that could have been far worse, this critical linjage between parents and kids would have been destroyed and who knows what would have happened to those 700. parents were deported without their kids were deported. >> stephen: children were expelled from the u.s. because of the pandemic. is trump now using covid as a cover to further his immigration agenda? >> bingo, exactly. and what he's want uponned to do, stephen, all along. during family separations, including the woman who is stephen miller's wife, told me-- she was a spokesperson for d.h.s.-- the goal was to kick kids out of the country as soon as they got here, no matter where they came from, and hold families in ice prisons indefinitely, and now using covid as the excuse, they locked up families and they're not letting them out, despite judges saying letting them out because of covid. and over 800 children have been expelled immediately because of public health. there has been reporting done that shows kids deported don't have covid. they're using covid as this excuse for the restricted image dreams they've had all along and they wanted family separations basically to make happen. >> stephen: jacob, we have to take a quick break. stick around, everybody, we'll be back with more jacob soboroff. safe, you could be joyful. lt safe and, if you wee everybody has a coogan's. and almost half those small businesses, they could close if people don't do something. we have to keep our communities together. that's how we get through this. ♪ proof i can fight moderate to severe rheumatoid arthritis. proof i can fight psoriatic arthritis... ...with humira. proof of less joint pain... ...and clearer skin in psa. humira targets and blocks a source of inflammation that contributes to joint pain and irreversible damage. humira can lower your ability to fight infections. serious and sometimes fatal infections, including tuberculosis, and cancers, including lymphoma, have happened, as have blood, liver, and nervous system problems, serious allergic reactions, and new or worsening heart failure. tell your doctor if you've been to areas where certain fungal infections are common and if you've had tb, hepatitis b, are prone to infections, or have flu-like symptoms or sores. don't start humira if you have an infection. humira is proven to help stop further joint damage. want more proof? 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ugh. ♪ ♪ >> stephen: hey, everybody. we're back with the author of "separated: inside an american tragedy," nbc's jacob soboroff. there's more i want to talk to you, and i hope you can shed some light on it. i know alexandria ocassio-ortez talked about this today, and a whistleblower, dawn wooten, and she says that the people in detention are not being properly screened for covid, and perhaps the most alarming acquisition of the whistleblower complaint, is there are unusual high rates of hysterectomy, essentially, these women without knowing what's going on, are undergoing sterilization procedures. >> i talked to miss wooten today. it's horrific what's happening there. and not only is she detailing how women came back to her and said they didn't know what happened, but there are lawyers saying their clients corroborated the accounts of miss wooten. and the doctor that performed these procedures, of course, is, you know, under the microscope at this point. but what i think this really gets to is the lack of oversight throughout the system as a whole. the fact that this can happen, the fact that covid is spreading rampantly, and the fact that family separations could happen virtually undetected until journalists that were following thi far closer than i was uncovered it shows that we have a problem here. it's the same reason i wrote the book. we're not paying attention to what is happening inside our own immigration system in the united states of america, a place that's supposed to represent refuge for those folks. many of those women are there to seek asylum, and this is the case, allegedly in this case, what's happening. >> stephen: jacob, thank you for what's coming on. >> stephen: his book "separated: inside an american tragedy" is available now. jacob soboroff, everybody. we'll be right back. in just a few months, we've learned a lot more about the covid-19 virus. it's real. and it's dangerous. so, on behalf of all of us working on the front lines, please take it seriously. and while we don't yet have a cure or a vaccine, we do know how to keep you and your loved ones safe. wear a mask. wash your hands. stay six feet apart. do your best to stay out of crowded spaces. and get a flu shot, it's even more important this year. we can do this. if we do it together. ♪ ♪ if i could, baby i'd ♪ how can i, when you won't take it from me ♪ ♪ you can go your own way ♪ ♪ go your own way your wireless. your rules. only with xfinity mobile. late show," everybody. tune in tomorrow when i'll be joined by drew barrymore, and musical guest, long long. james corden is next, but first, let's say good night with some music from jon batiste and stay human. captioning sponsored by cbs captioned by media access group at wgbh access.wgbh.org ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ captioning sponsored by cbs ♪ the late late show, oh, oh the late late show, ooh ♪ the late late show, oh, oh

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