"the story" with martha maccallum starts right now. >> martha: i'm martha maccallum. think about this. a 3-year-old american toddler whose parents were killed in this attack has been confirmed to be among the nine americans being held by hamas terrorists. this child's parents were killed in the attack. jake sullivan said he will be speaking to the families of the americans. people are asking, why aren't we hearing more about the americans being held? we have talked to one of the families. it's a strange dynamic of all of this that they're not front and center all the time in these pictures with americans thinking about them and focused on them all the time. there's a lot going on. part of that are the protests that keep stealing the headline as the country's hot spots boil over against the white house pro israel policy. watch this. >> you have a whole generation of voters coming up that will be able to vote in this next election. if you don't stop this genocide now, you won't get these votes. >> what do you think about how the president of the united states is handling this? >> he's turning a blind eye. yeah, supporting the genocide. i think it's disappointing. >> martha: that friday rally here in manhattan included this man that was cheered on as he climbed up there, ripped the american flags off of the pole. watch this. so the next day, this was the scene near the president's home in wilmington, dell care. this is happening texas, delaware, new york, washington. the demonstrators chanting "cease fire now" and also this. [chanting]. >> martha: let's go to austin, texas. many protesters on horseback there. others holding from the river to the sea signs in this crowd. watch this in austin, texas. >> it's incredible. i don't think austin has seen this big of a crowd. it's what the people want. >> this was the president and the democrat party in a vice, which way to go on this. how to ride the middle. it is perilous politically. with that, we bring in two experts. karl rove, former deputy chief of staff to george w. bush and robert wolf. great to have you here. you watched the american political scene a long time, carl. let's start with you with your reaction to what we just lacked at in austin, texas this week. feels like the whole world has changed since october 7. >> i list in austin. it's a blueberry in the middle of a deep red sea. we have strange things that go on. that was an extraordinary moment. it's emblematic of what's happening to the democratic party. they have a growing number in some instances of democrats that now side with the palestinian cause over israel. it was after all israel that was brought in into existence when harry truman was president of the united states that gave them support. i'm amazed by the comments. think about what we just heard. they accused israel of genocide when israel has been the victim of neo-nazis in the form of hamas saying we want to kill the jews and kill the state of israel. it's a remarkable testament of how some parts of the democratic party have gone. >> martha: you can feel the unsetting sentiment, robert wolf. let's bring you in here. these comments by former president obama, the public nature of them, and the response. we'll hear bill maher responding to it after we hear what the former president said on a public stage as his predecessor is trying to manage this. watch this. >> if you want to solve the problem, then you have to take in the whole truth. and you then have to admit nobody's hands are clean, that all of us have -- are complicit to some degree. >> him struggling with people's moral equivalency still. barack obama, who has rarely disappointed me did so this week. the attack was only a month ago. there's a been difference between collateral damage and what hamas did. >> martha: robert wolf? >> yeah, i was in chicago. you know, i had lunch with president obama. we've been speaking about it. this is not political for me. this is personal. i remember when i was 4 years old sitting in my grandparents' room where first time i came across the holocaust where they had their relatives from poland and russia there with their star of david and their numbers. i support of what carl said here. this is not about where democrats are or republicans. i think president biden has been very clear. i support his noncease fire unless there's hostages, all 250 being released. i'm also understanding about the humanitarian causes. we need to have that corridor between the north and south gaza where people can get their humanitarian relief. but this is a war. there's no moral equivalence between israel protecting their statehood and their people versus a terrorist extreme like hamas. >> martha: it's interesting the impact. i think for a while we looked at the likely scenario of trump versus biden in the next election knowing that there's something that happens that shakes this dynamic up, right? so now you have this situation that everybody is watching. we're still a year away. there's polls out there that show trump beating biden pretty handily. the electoral college has flipped from what it was in 2020 in favor of trump at this point. you have said though that you think that either party that picks a fresh face in this environment will most likely win the white house. with that in mind, let's watch this -- hold on. we're going to the white house and listen is tour reporter and back to you. watch mark meredith. >> they said they should get the technology back. what kind of response will we see from the president on the spy balloon? >> i'm going to let the president sit down with president xi and speak to him face to face and not being doing diplomacy from the podium. we can report to you consistent with whatever is appropriate to share publicly on these issues. i will say that president biden took steps to take down that balloon once it was safe to do so and out of potential harm's way to civilians. we were able to recover it, exploit it. from our perspective, the critical thing is that because we were able to protect ourselves along the way of that path, we don't feel there was any information gained that was problematic. so so the united states, the president is going to focus at this point on how he stands up to protect american interests going forward. >> you want china to apologize? >> again, i'm going to let president biden speak to president xi. i'm not going to stand here and create threats or raise questions or make particular demands. that won't be the most effective way to security the diplomatic outcomes the americans are looking for. >> how would you relate relations between the u.s. and china since the president's meeting with president xi last year. >> martha: mark mare death in the white house briefing room. a lot of focus on president xi in the days to come. i want to get back to this issue of how this president is handling foreign policy. 50% approve of how he's approving this war. here he is at the laying of the wreath of the tomb of the unknown soldier saturday, veteran's day. i want a quick reaction to this. axlerod and others have pointed to a number of troubling moments like this one where the president appears for a moment to be a little bit disoriented. i don't know what else to call it, robert. what do you say? >> i think a year is a lifetime away. we'll have an election between two choices in my opinion, former president trump and president biden. i think that's a debate i'm willing to have. it will be interesting to see where the economy is, foreign policy is. carl know as year away predicting where something will be, these polls have little meaning today. >> martha: there's a pile-on. axlerod is one of many, karl rove that is putting pressure on the president's age as a big issue here. >> they should, a year is a long time. during that year, joe biden will only get older and more confused and more out of touch. with all due respect, this is not healthy for the country and not healthy for the democratic party. when you have seven out of every ten democrats saying he's too old to be president and a majority saying he lacks the stamina and mental acutie, something is wrong. trump is ahead by four. nikki haley was ahead by eight. a generic democrat beats trump handily. the american people are saying we would like the torch passed to a new generation, an election with a man that will be 82 and a man 78 before the election is not where we need to be in the challenging world that we face today. >> martha: these are all points along the way as we look at the year ahead and the election coming. robert, thanks for being with us, sharing your personal thoughts and experience on what's going on. carl, good to have you as we look at the year ahead. we're less than 12 months away from a presidential election in the united states. thank you both. >> thank you. >> martha: i raised this question earlier. we don't hear a lot about these individuals. we have been in touch with some of their families. these are not names and faces on everyone's lips around this country as everybody watches what's going on here. several are believed to be among those in the hands of hamas for six long weeks now. perhaps they're living in these tunnels what are they enduring and why doesn't america focus on this in a larger way. my next guest, sergeant kevin hermenning has been there. he's an american hostage held in tehran from 1979 to 1981. he spent 441 days in that nightmare. he joins us next. veterans, if you're applying for a home loan to get cash...surprise. some lenders charge hundreds upfront for your appraisal and other fees. not at newday. a veteran shouldn't have to come up with money to get money. the first time you connected your godaddy website and your store was also the first time you realized... well, we can do anything. cheesecake cookies? 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>> there were 52 of us that were held the entire time. there's parallels and it's clear that iran operating through their proxies, hezbollah, islamic jihad and in yemen, they have exported their brand of islamic international terrorism for more than 40 years. this is all about how can they bargain for even more capital, more money, more barrels of cash on the top of a pallet being sent in the middle of the night laugh way around the globe. this is how iran has behaved ever since the mullahs took over from the shaw in 1979. we have to feel for the families. the hostages know what their treatment is like. i'm not saying it's easy. many of my colleagues wendt through a lot of terrible things. solitary confinement for 425 days, beatings with rubber houses across the face. who knows what the treatment is for these americans. not only the americans, but also so many multinational citizens from across the globe being captured by hamas back on october 7. just horrible for the families that don't know what the treatment is like. >> martha: you said some were subject to mock executions. what did they do to you, kevin, if you're willing to share? >> well, i was fortunate that i spent only 43 days in solitary confinement following an escape attempt. i was the youngest. i had fewer things to worry about. i had a family, a mom and dad and siblings and others, but i didn't have a wife or children. i didn't have to worry about were the bills being paid and is my paycheck arriving like so many of my colleagues did. they were challenged in different ways. for me, the younger you are, the easier it is to bounce back from adversity. we have to feel for these folks that are being held prisoner by this islamic terrorist group. hopefully we're not going to see the likes of colonel william higgins, you may recall, that was tortured for seven or eight years identify as a cia operative over in the middle east and beirut or leon clin clinghoffer thrown off the side of a hill in the mediterranean sea. >> martha: we have a picture. they allowed your mom to come -- you mentioned your mom, barbara -- and visit you. we have an image of this. she's smiling. you're smiling. what was that like? what were they trying to do by allowing that do you think, kevin? >> well, certainly it's a very surreal event that occurred. all of a sudden, i was seated in a room with a bunch of iranians and reporters and opening the door, my mom was on the other side. she was one of about a dozen mothers or spouses that were planning to try to travel. she was the only one able to get her visa approved when they arrived in paris. so she arrived, it was just a big propaganda ploy by the iranians. they were looking to humanize the situation and really bargain -- try to get more bargaining power. in any negotiation -- this is the fear that we all have to worry about right now in this situation over in the gaza strip. that is that in any negotiation, you need to have two proxies, two individuals that are willing to step forward and really do a great job at negotiating in good faith. i don't think we have that right now. hamas is not -- >> martha: when you were there, when you being held, there was a failed attempt to rescue you under president carter. five people, five u.s. service members, two marines lost their lives in that attempt. when you learned of that, what was the impact on you as a hostage? >> so martha, i want to say there were three marines and five airmen that perished in the desert. 200 miles south of tehran. so those eight men, they were the heros of the hostage crisis. we were merely the survivors. when we learned about it, that's what gave us hope that at least the united states had made an effort. at least they tried. i met many of the surviving men on that mission over the last several years. they have told me all things considered, even knows the outcome of that tragedy in the desert, they would still step wore ward to try to do it again, to try to bring an end to the crisis earlier than it was. so from my perspective, the fact that they had tried is what kept our emotions and our morale high for the remaining eight months. >> martha: those hostages that are being held now, we pray that they have hope, that they know there's all of these efforts that are being made to save them. i wonder what went through your mind when you say this terrible news over the weekend about those who -- the special forces, five of them killed on a chopner the eastern mediterranean, they were in a training mission. there was a report this morning that they may have been training to be helpful to any evacuation or extraction effort for these hostages, sir. >> no doubt about it. my hearts go out to the families. really shows the character of men that are willing to step up and save people that they have never even met. >> martha: we have one image of you being released. you're the second person from the front here. when you realized that you were being freed, what was that like, kevin? >> well, you know, after 44 days, there were a lot of mental ups and downs. they were telling us negotiations were going well. so we really weren't absolutely positive that that day, january 20th, 1980, was the -- 81, was the day that we would be freed. we had an idea it could happen. the iranians didn't want to give president jimmy carter the satisfaction of being freed on his watch or for president reagan saying that we were freed on his watch. it happened during the inaugural. when we were finally released, we realized the american people and our families, of course, had not forgotten about it. we needed to treat these hostages the same way. >> martha: it was wonderful to have you with us, sergeant. hope you come back. you know more about this more than anybody else. thanks for your service. >> thank you. >> martha: the united states retaliates again for more than 50 attacks now on u.s. forces in the middle east. hamas admits that they want to drag the region in to a permanent war. a speaks person for israel, benjamin netanyahu, joins me next. my thanks to sergeant hermenning with his extraordinary story. we'll be right back. >> if iranian proxies continue to strike american forces, we will continue to respond. new ca? 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[dogs bark] winnie! look at you! thanks again for looking out for me. hey, we're in this together. an aarp medicare supplement plan from unitedhealthcare. smart now, really smart later. >> martha: american forces in the middle east carrying out the stronger assault against iranian proxies to date killing at least six iranian backed fighters sunday in air strikes over eastern syria. u.s. service members have been attacked four times by iran-backed fighters since then upping the total of these attacks to 52 now in less than a month. our chief national security correspondent jennifer griffin reports for us now live from the pentagon. hi, jennifer. >> hi, martha. after near daily attacks on u.s. forces in syria and iraq over the last month, u.s. war planes targeted two locations yesterday in eastern syria. a training and weapons storage facility and a headquarters in syria both used by iran's proxy forces. a u.s. force says six to seven iranian proxy fighters were killed. the training facility was a logistics and weapons historic facility based on the two hours of secondary explosions following the strikes. this is the third set of air strikes that the u.s. has conducted in syria and the first time that they have killed abe rainian proxies. iranian proxies began firing at u.s. bases after the strikes. >> our goal over time is to ensure that our forces are protected and that we respond if we get hit. that's what we have done. that's what we will continue to do. this should be measured over the course of time, not over the course of 24 hours. >> the defense department released the names of the five army special operations aviators with the 160th special operations regiment. the seasoned special operations forces were killed flying a blackhawk helicopter refuelling during a night time training mission in the eastern mediterranean friday night. chief warrant officer, stephen dwyer, shane barnes, sergeant chat wolf and sergeant andrew southard, an enormous loss for their nation. these were the best of the best. iranian proxies fired on syria four separate times overnight as we reported. this was following the u.s. air strikes, including 17 rockets at one u.s. base indicating that the iranian proxies were angry at the loss of weapons at their training facility. martha? >> martha: indeed. we do send all of our thoughts and prayers to these families, these extraordinary heros that were lost in this training mission. thanks, jennifer griffin. israel's military says this video shows an attack on its troops from a hospital in gaza. they say terrorists embedded themselves with civilians and damaged a tank. no israelis were hurt. the military reports that it killed more than 20 terrorists in this mission. israel says that it is another example of hamas using hospitals and other civilian buildings to launch attacks. hall hein rick joins us. but first, to alex in northern israel. >> hi, martha. hezbollah missiles are hitting deeper and deeper in to israel. sirens are going off in the north. prime minister netanyahu is warning hezbollah not to play with fire. >> hezbollah is -- has a more developed military. they developed their warfare since the last war. the military abilities they have. >> we're with the idf in northern israel. these were all field converts in to ammunitions bases targeting hezbollah sites on the other side of the border. this has become the most deadly conflict here on the northern border of israel and lebanon since 2006. for the safety of these soldiers, this location is undisclosed. the idf says fighter jets are striking weapons compounds and infrastructure. on the ground, these troops are constantly watching the horizon for cross-border attacks. >> hezbollah is a different story than hamas in the southern border. >> and here the country's defense minister is still pushing for hezbollah to deescalate the situation with the soldiers on the ground saying they're prepared to fire any defense needed. >> thanks, alex. joining me now, tal heinrich. one of the headlines today is that hamas is losing krof -- control of gaza. what does that mean? >> they're losing control of the strip. that doesn't mean there's no terrorists. they are losing control. some of them already going south wards. we will get to each and every one of them. the idf first encircled gaza city and then we started conducting more deepening raids and we're acting in a very surgical and tactical way because we want to reach each and every one of these terrorists behind the october 7th massacre and their infrastructure. >> martha: i want to play for you -- before i do that, hamas leaders are saying that one of the reasons that the attack on october 7th was so brutal was to incite the response they're seeing. they want permanent war. they're not here for water and electricity in gaza. we want to change the dynamic in the middle east. when you see what's happening in the northern part of israel, how much of a concern is that for the prime minister that you're going to get hit from two or three sides? >> israel has fought wars on combined fronts in the past. we won these wars. we hope that the situation on the northern border with hezbollah will not escalate in to a full-fledged war. we have warned hezbollah, president biden warned hezbollah and said just don't. don't test us, don't test israel. you know who will serve the most? that will be the people of lebanon. just like hamas, hezbollah doesn't care much about the population over there in lebanon. you know how much the lebanese people have suffered in recent years. we don't want another war on another front. so we're telling them, you know, stop this. we're deterring, we're acting very judiciously over there. we see that hezbollah, we know already that they have embedded themselves just like hamas. >> martha: we have spoken to a number of idf officials. they all say they're trying hard to prevent civilian casualties. we see the numbers that are obviously very difficult to think about. we see what's going on in the hospital in terms of how hard it is for the doctors on the ground. trey yingst went into a gaza hospital and an israel hospital to show both sides. he spent to an idf spokesperson. here's a bit of their exchange. >> i can say for sure there's no humanitarian crisis in gaza. the situation is not easy. >> i would push back on that, sir. you'd say there's no humanitarian crisis in gas? >> i'm saying again, there's no humanitarian crisis in gaza. i know the situation is not easy. >> martha: we saw the video that was shot in there in the hospital. it certainly looks like a humanitarian crisis. >> there are challenges. nobody wanted this war. war is a tragedy. every loss of life is a tragedy. this is a war we didn't want or start or didn't even expect. we're doing everything possible to ease the civilian suffering and casualties. hamas is doing everything that they can to maximize the casualties. they want to obliterate the jewish state. >> martha: can you get a hospital ship in there? the prime minister said they have a hospital ship moving in from france. is that going to happen and when? >> i can't pinpoint a date and type but this will happen and the uae and other international partners will erect field hospitals and floating hospitals. there's many initiatives at play. tal heinrich, thanks for being here. the goal of reshaping the middle east is also rocking europe. hundreds of thousands in london with a familiar rallying cry. watch this. 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[chanting]. >> i'm here because of the people of palestine and the genocide of the palestinian people by the israeli government. >> martha: hundreds of thousands of protesters taking to the streets in london where a major government shakeup is now taking place. sueella braverman fired after the protests and now david cameron is returning as a foreign secretary. steve hilton, you hear these people in the streets talking about the occupation which ended in 2005. nobody seems to have told them. what's going on in the u.k.? >> first of all, the level of ignorance is staggering. the level of disinformation and brainwashing is just stunning to see. the terrible thing, martha, it takes me back to the awful terror attacks that we saw in london. we were just working with david cameron and he was the lead of the opposition and preparing to go for an election and then become the government. the shocking thing about the terror attacks, difference from 9-11 here, all of those people that carried out those terror attacks were british. they were home grown terrorists. the question that people asked, how is it that we can have people in cure own country that would do something like this because they're so consumed by this radical islamic ideology. now you see the same phenomenon. these people are not blowing up trains and buses. but the sentiment, the kind of anger and rage against the british government, against the west that we're seeing on the streets hoff london is the same. it just -- it's a wake-up call for all of us. what have we allowed to happen over the past 10, 15, maybe 20 years in terms of tolerating that township of society where people just aren't required to have any kind of loyalty to the system of government, the society, the country that is their home. >> martha: i don't know that you can ever put that back in the bottle. >> perhaps. that's what is terrible about what we're seeing. we see people here ripping down american flags. americans doing that. people who are here in america. you think, well, you know, if you're an immigrants and you can't sign up to the values of this country and love this country and ripping down the flags of the country that is your home what are you doing here? this is a time that we should be confidently asserting these are the values of western civilization, that's what hour country is based on. if you don't sign up to them, we don't want you here. >> martha: former president trump is saying if he's re-elected, he would send people back, do idealogical testing what do you say to that? >> that is a proposal that i can not imagine how you're going to carry that out and practice. the sentiment is right. i think as you just said, this is has been going on a long time. we can stop it in the future, we can stop illegal immigration. that part of his plan, i think everyone would sign up to. what you can do about the situation here is very difficult to see. we have to assert our values and say this is the country, this is what we stand for. sign up to this. that will take a long time. >> martha: steve, thank you. thanks for coming on set with us today. steve hilton joining us. hope to see you soon. lots to talk about. so this also in the news today. former president trump's sister has died. mary ann trump berry was a senior judge on the third u.s. circuit court of appeals, one level below the supreme court. she retired four years ago during an investigation in to the family's taxes. police say she was found dead this morning at her home here in new york city. no word on the cause of death. mary ann trump berry was 86 years old. and jason chaffetz with a blistering attack on what he says are president biden's dirty tricks to help democrats vacuum up voters. this is a very interesting story when we come back. use i know so many of you have served our country honorably. one of the benefits that we as a country give you as a veteran is the eligibility for a va loan for up to 100% of your home's value. if 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disrupt the itch and rash of eczema. talk to your doctor about rinvoq. learn how abbvie can help you save. hello! hello is friendly... hello is open... it's welcoming... everything we want to be when helping people find a medicare plan during the annual enrollment period. so, say hello... to hellomedicare, a one-stop shop for medicare plans, including a range of “all-in-one” medicare advantage plans... from the names you know. learn, compare, even enroll—all in one place. no matter where you are in your search—whether you're just starting out, or already have a good idea of what you want— give us a call. our hellomedicare licensed insurance agents are here to make things easy and help guide you to a plan that fits your needs. because we get it- finding the right medicare plan can be challenging. plans can differ by price... or benefits... they can even differ by where you live. that's why we're here—to put it all together... and be your go-to place for all the latest information... laid out right in front of you, in a way that's easy to understand. it all starts with a few simple questions so we can get to know you better. questions like, “do you want to keep your doctor?” and “which benefits are important to you?” then, based on your answers, we'll match you with plans from well-known names in medicare, giving you a complete picture of your best options. next, we'll help you compare benefits. compare costs. it's easy. and when you feel good about your selection... we'll sign you up. done. and. done. remember, the annual enrollment period is here... and it ends on december 7th. so whether you're looking to save money, or find better coverage... let's do this. let's go find your medicare plan. call us today and speak with one of our helpful, hellomedicare licensed insurance agents. hellomedicare. say hello to an easier way to do medicare. >> martha: so a secret service agent protecting president biden's grand daughter fired at suspects trying to break into a government vehicle. happened around midnight last night. 29-year-old naomi biden was in georgetown neighborhood. agents saw people breaking into an s.u.v. as it was parked and no one inside. one agent opened fire. did not hit anyone. the suspects got away. the secret service there was no threat to naomi biden. regular people deal with this every single day. >> the president has done since day one of his administration, starting with his first piece of legislation that he signed in to law, the american rescue plan, billions of dollars going in to cities and states to make sure that they have the funding available to protect communities and hiring police officers. this is not just here but across the country. >> again, the secret service said no threat to miss biden. this will have a lot of people talking. there's an epidemic of car them in new jersey and everywhere. most people don't have secret service agent to get the people to leave before they steal your car. president biden signed an executive order less than two months after he took office. it was called promoting access to voting. seems like a fair good idea, right? one former republican congressman says the real goal was to use the power of the white house to use get out the vote efforts specifically aimed at getting democrats to the polls. former house oversight chair jason chaffetz is here. let's start with this from president biden in march of 2003 when this kicked in. watch this. >> this fundamental right remains under assault. conservative supreme court has gutted the voting rights act over the years. since the 2020 election, a wave of states and dozens and dozens of anti-voting laws fueled by the big lie and the election deniers now elected to office. >> martha: jason, explain to everybody how the government and the u.s. taxpayer money has spent. any time that talks about election issues gets swept in to the big lie. there is something else going on here. >> he put out an executive voter and wanted to get people wring administered and get out and voted. he specifically named felons, person of certain ethnic persuasions. he wanted to do this. it funneled up through susan rice and they spent millions to get out the vote. the problem is they didn't do it for everybody. they did it for the low propensity voters for the democrats and their constituents. the president and the federal government will not tell the american public what these plans are, but it basically leveraged every federal department, agency and personnel to get out the vote for their chosen constituencies. >> so they looked at the united states government and said to every agency, to the head of the agency, you have work to do. we're going to carve out get out the vote money for your agency and you need to get out there and shake the trees and make sure that you get people that don't vote to vote. it wasn't focused on -- it was focused on groups that would likely lean democrat? is that what you're saying? >> so if you get food stamps, they can look at that person and say, is that person registered to vote? yes or no. let's get that person registered to vote. you think they're going to vote for the republican or the democrat? they go for felons. that's a couple million people. yeah, they targeted democrats. >> martha: when you look at thou thin the margins are, for instance in the virginia election, thin margins in youngkin, the election that youngkin wanted to flip the house and senate in his state. so we'll keep digging in to this. thanks for doing that. thanks, jason. stay on that story, folks. we'll get more into that. did you watch the jets-raiders game last night? i did sunday night. so we're told there might be new hope for jets fans. aaron rodgers said he could be back on a the field next month. he's been training very hard since he tore his achilles tendon in the first game of the season. everything fell apart in a minute of the beginning of the season. so most people with this injury, your son might be over, your career might be over. apparently he's going to try to make it back by the middle of december. stay tuned. we'll see what hans. more to come on that story as well. all right, everybody. thanks very much for joining us on this monday. happy monday, everybody. big week ahead. we'll see you back here tomorrow at 3:00. have a good evening.

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