he's the guy -- he's really the lynchpin here because he can explain what michael cohen says, which is, no, trump knew everything, and there seems to be this incorrigible element to trump that he just can't avoid any kind of little shaving off just to save a few bucks here and there, including in these charges of just giving things as gratuities to save some taxes, so weisselberg can put letter and verse to the transactions, but most importantly, he can say, they knew it. they ordered it, even, as michael cohen says, there's intent there, not just sloppy absence of knowledge of accounting. >> frank figliuzzi, allen weisselberg's son, barry, was also involved in the trump organization. what do those conversations look like between investigators and potentially a reluctant witness?