here when you're asking what did a president do with the interpreter and with the interpreters' notes, you're putting the interpreter in a very difficult position here. an interpreter is supposed to be the neutral party here, just simply passing information back and forth. if they suddenly become witnesses in a criminal or congressional investigation, that puts them in a difficult spot. again, alex, i don't want to be defending the president's conduct here, which is truly extraordinary. but the presidency is decided -- is entitled to some protections here. and we need to keep our eye on that big picture. donald trump will come and go. but presidents will be here forever. >> yeah. well, i do appreciate you making the distinction and also appreciate as always your insights. thank you so much, nelson. good to see you. >> thank you. a lonely feeling. why everyone clapped as ivanka sat silent at the munich security conference. the stony-faced story is next. e.