clients to try and build their lists organically so they can do that through their social media following. they can do that by even their e-mail signature line that you're using for their one-off communications. certainly at different types of trade shows you can build your list that way. speaking. there are lots of ways, text-to-join. there's even an opportunity now to use -- to allow people to use their cell phones to opt in to your e-mail list. >> and how big should your list be when you start segmenting? right, when it's small you don't want to waste your time doing too much segmenting. but at what point do you think, okay, now it's time to give different messages to different people? >> you can start segmenting from day one. from day one. so if you already have any type of crm, or if you're just using outlook to house all of your emmale addresses, however you've got those lists segmented there you can export them and import them right into your e-mail service provider. so i would say from day one. and even when people are opting in on your website you can let them opt in to the list that they want to be on.
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