freedom means the ability to say two plus two equals four. what i'm getting at is the more we permit hacking, particularly hacking that -- of disinformation, the less we have reliance on a common set of facts. once you begin to lose that, norms begin to fall in a terribly quick and decisive way. >> i want to pivot to north carolina. we have been talking about it. it is perfectly legal what is happening in north carolina. but it doesn't feel in the spirit of ending an election. the north carolina legislature have a veto-proof majority. they can pass laws and the governor can veto it no matter what. but they decided to strip the governor -- the executive branch of powers that they had given to a republican governor and took it away from a democratic governor. >> i believe in state power. much of this is do to a nasty