private entities have and i think that's a fair distinction but what to me is crucial here are two things. one, it shows that you use the term marketing. it shows how much the nra is ultimately a marketing vessel, the degree to which it is a creature of the gun industry, and it also shows the degree to which they are doing this without anyone's knowledge. i mean, people don't know when they sign up for a class they're turning information over. people don't know when they get a concealed carry permit they're turning the information over. >> well, right. i mean, the bottom line and feldman kind of has it right, the man you quoted in the end, the former lobbyist. the real issue here is that the nra doesn't -- or a large stock of nra members, and i went to the convention last year and have done some polling on this, they don't fear the nra. >> right. >> they do fear the -- they do fear the government. the nra, they would say, is not trying to take my gun away. and whereas they believe the