but we're not telling them to take a position for or against mubara mubarak, so far as i know. >> i get that you have to be careful diplomatically. and when this stuff was breaking last week and i was covering it lye, i said look, i understand you have to be careful here. it's an important ally. you don't want to go in there blustering away, et cetera. but doesn't there come a time when we say hey look, shouldn't we stand on the side of the protestors as opposed to mubarak? >> i think we should stand on the side of democracy and reform. but in order to do that we're going to have to be behind the scenes and help put in a structure in which there can be an orderly transition of power. whether mubarak and the government to collapse tonight, who knows what happens in the future, we don't know who would emerge as the power brokers in europe.