who think they can do what joe biden can do and he's the only one, he and bernie sanders, only with the double-digit leads. historically, is there any reason to believe as rare as it is for incumbent to lose, that president trump wouldn't win. >> sure. there are all sorts of paths to the presidency for president trump, whether looking from a policy perspective, if the economy remains strong or his ability to connect with voters in the midwest, winning michigan, wisconsin as republican for the first time in decades. this is going to be a very tough fight, what a lot of early polling shows us and harris, you posted a poll a second ago, is the opportunity for democrats. there is a lot of opportunity for democrats to offer something different than trump has offered, even with a good economy. we saw in the mid-term election, the economy was growing, jobs were growing, wages were going up and voters still wanted something else. it wasn't quite enough.