garri garrick, they were investigating the va long before i got into the picture. and he has diligently worked against the va stonewalling him all the time and without his efforts, again, you wouldn't know my name. elizabeth: you know, you had brought up an interesting point, you said 15 years ago there were, what, 900 va administrators. today, how many are there, sir? >> close to 10,000 and very few of them contribute to actual clinical work. the overhead is just tremendous and i would not see that in the private sector. you need more worker bees and less supervisors. elizabeth: that's sort of what-- that's what i'm going for here. with would the florida congressman go in that direction? if so, what would he be up against? >> he would be up against the va bureaucracy who has been hard on the last three secretaries to say the least. but i really do think that he could drain the swamp there and