we have less rance on foreign sail in two decades. >> what is it? >> it is the refineries that we see -- we see the big five coming in, putting the smaller refineries out of business and drying the prices up. >> jonathan, the refinery system, how about we haven't had a new refinery built on american soil in 30 years because of what? the epa and regulation. >> yeah. those are the same refineries that have dealt with over $100 billion in regulatory costs since just the early 1990s. regulators don't build anything. they don't create any plants. all they do is destroy. they prevent progress. they prevent energy in this case from being pumped. i think the energy regulators, environmental regulators in particular are quite nee fairious. we use this fossil fuel to better our lives. oil and natural gas. it powers our modern world.