difference between last presidential election and now, i think, is that the cluster of candidates is on the left. you have other progressives or left-leaning candidates versus in 2012, you had sanders out there on the left lane wide open to himself, and you had a cluster of moderates. o'malley, webb, chafee, clinton, all clustered together. that's why sanders -- >> phil, what will you be listening for? >> just one thing. i agree with the panel here, that is, if you think that we need somebody to go toe to toe with donald trump, i think you need somebody who gets outside of east coast/west coast fringe. i want to see if he moves beyond the last election. my guess is he won't. if he doesn't, that is if he stays to the far left, i don't think he's winnable. >> because the biggest issue for democrats right now is who is best to beat the president in a general election. >> yeah. every poll indicates that -- every voter you speak to when you're out on the trail, they're so hungry for somebody that can defeat donald trump, of course, that's an unknowable right now. that's why democrats are showing up in force to so many