of taking on russia and russian forces. and i find it hard to believe at this point that anyone in the united states would want to get in a shooting war with russia. and then you're talking about there's an end game issue here. once you get there, that's a whole different level. >> if you're not destroying all their aircraft, just shoot one down so you ground it and create these safe joans, if russia decides to challenge you in that, the risk of an escalation to matthew's point is enormous. >> it's huge. and i would counter senator mccain and lead more towards concongressman multien in an over arching strategy. we have used the military -- i'm