it's irrelevant to me. >> what do you mean you're not qualified to say whether he is or not? >> well, there's been no proof offered. and as far as belief, it really doesn't matter what i believe. >> but how can you say there's been no proof offered? there's a certificate of live birth which was shown by his campaign in 2008 which has, you know, the seal of -- the raised seal of the state, it's signed off on. you know, there's plenty of evidence that he is. how can you say that there's not? >> well, a certificate of live birth is different than a long-form birth certificate. and i think that that's what is intended by the documentation process. >> for better or worse, many people don't believe he's a u.s. citizen. they believe he has loyalties, divided loyalties. i suppose you could say. >> but those people are wrong. i mean, he is a u.s. citizen. >> well, you're telling me that he's wrong. i've never investigated that. if he is, then he has nothing to fear.