Through it. Its quite an exciting place. Were delighted to have you back to our second series. Some of you came to the first one, and this is the second one. The first one in january, and the Topic Tonight is biblical influences on religious freedom, but before we get started, so take out your cell phone. If youre in to social media, take a selfie of yourself, and then post it to museumofthebible. Should be right there. A selfie is fine or take a picture of your neighbor. So we placed a few items on your seat, youll see there, and one of them is a membership brochure. My personal favorite because we are a nonprofit. We exist totally on donations and members and so we hope youll consider becoming a member in any category. I think there are 27 different categories. You also have a flier on our February Speaker series, which is coming up next month, and theres a sheet that lists future programs provided by the museum. Were cohosting Tonights Program with the Baylor Institute of studies for religion. Launched in august 2004. The Baylor Institute for studies of religion was designed to initiate Support And Conduct research on religion through a variety of scholars and projects. Our mission here at the museum is to engage all people with the bible. Its history, its narrative, and its impact. Were nonsectarian. We just focus on that book. The bible has made a powerful impact as you know on the world, on its history and on its culture, has influenced the history of nations and people and laws and political structures. Its hidden in plain sight in many ways. In fact, we have an attraction here called washington revelations where you can virtually fly out of the museum and up and down the national mall into the capitol, into the library of congress and a Laser Beam will point out wherever theres biblical text. Its quite exciting, i highly recommend it, but it gives you an idea of how ubiquitous biblical text is in our culture. So 232 years ago today the Virginia Statute of religious freedom was adopted and later served as a model for the first amendment. Tonight we have a group of talented scholars who will success our biblical influences on religious freedom. I now would like to introduce you to our moderator for Tonights Program, his name is dr. Byron johnson, hell introduce the speakers and moderate. Hes a Founding Director of the Baylor Institute for studies of religion as well as a director for the program on prosocial behavior, a leading authority on the scientific study of religion, the efficacy of faithbased organizations in criminal justice. Johnsons recently publications have examined the impact of faithbased programs on resid viz m, reduction, and reentry. Please join me in welcoming dr. Byron johnson. Good evening, the museum of the bible has many wonderful exhibits that i hope you all will get a chance to see. Many of these exhibits are historical. Some are contemporary, and i have to say theyre truly amazing. Well, lectures and symposium like the one were going to see tonight are going to be quite common at the museum, and what were going to find out is consequential ways that the bible is important to american society. Tonight were going to be looking at the connection between the bible and religious freedom. You know, the founders of our nation, and the fore bearers came to this land to begin an unusual experiment, and it had to do with a lot of things including religious freedom. One of the most iconic symbols of that Religion Freedom is the Liberty Bell. And some of you may have had a chance to see a replica of it on the second floor. The Liberty Bell was ordered on november the 1st, 1751 as a commemoration of the 50th anniversary of william penns charter. And when you tour it, you see the replica, the replica was made in 2021 at the same foundry, the white Chapel Foundry in england, and engraved on the Liberty Bell is one example of the connection between the bible and religious freedom is a passage that comes from leviticus 25 10, proclaimed liberty throughout the land. Were fortunate to have three scholars, i have had the great fortune of knowing all of them. I know what a treat youre in for. Theyre each going to be speaking for 15 minutes, and well have time at the end for q a, and im not very technologically sophisticated so i have an ipad up here where i will be fielding questions from facebook. Lets hope i dont botch that up. And let me first start off by introducing our first speaker, Tim Shaw, who is a dear friend and a Research Professor of government at baylor. Hes a senior Adviser And Director of the South And Southeast Asia Action Team with the religious Freedom Institute based in washington, and the director of international research at the Religion Freedom Research Project at georgetown university, the berkeley center, he has written on so many different publications, here are some of the most recent books germane to the Topic Tonight, then a two volume set, christianity and freedom, historical perspectives, and Religion Freedom and gay rights, emerging conflicts in the u. S. And europe. The name of his Title Tonight is address, no genesis, no jefferson, i love it, the real roots of the Virginia Statute for Religion Freedom. Join me in welcoming Tim Shaw [ applause ]. Good evening, and happy Religion Freedom day. I dont know how many of you knew when you woke up this morning that it was Religion Freedom day. It doesnt get a lot of attention. Doesnt get the attention that it deserves but Religion Freedom is such a crucial, important principle. It certainly deserves its own day, and deserves its own conversation here this evening. Congratulations to the museum of the bible, congratulations to the institute for studies of religion for hosting this important conversation about Religion Freedom. Religious freedom is of enormous importance. We know that it was of enormous importance to Thomas Jefferson. The reason that its religious Freedom Day is because it was on this day in 1786 that the Virginia Assembly finally enacted what became known as the Virginia Statute for Religion Freedom. And that statute was authored by Thomas Jefferson. He first wrote the text of the bill around 1777, which means he wrote it around the same time as of course he famously drafted the declaration of independence. And then he kept trying to get it through the Virginia Assembly over many years. It was introduced formally in 1779, but it was not passed until 1786, a number of years later. Thomas jefferson was enormously proud of the statute for religious freedom. If you visit his epithet in monticello, virginia, Youll Notice that there are three items on his epithet, one that he was the author of the declaration of independence, the founder of the university of virginia and the third is that he was the author of the act concerning religious freedom. He does not include that he was president of the United States or ambassador to france. Or any of the other enormously important things that he was. He was most proud among two or three other accomplishments of the fact that he was the author of the act for religious freedom, and we know, too that he was so proud of his authorship of the act for religious freedom that when he was ambassador to france, a position in which he was serving when the statute was finally passed in 1786, he immediately arranged for the text of the statute to be printed, published and distributed in france and elsewhere in europe. And he was enormously gratified that the high culture, the Sa Lonz of paris were impressed and moved, and inspired by the example that the state of virginia had set for the world. And it truly is something for which Thomas Jefferson should have been proud. Lets just think about how different our country would be if we did not have freedom of religion. For all people, regardless of their convictions of conscience, regardless of their religious beliefs, i know for one that my own life would be different. My father left india in 1965, more than 50 years ago. He was of jayne background, and inherent of jaynism, a small religious sect in india. When he made the long journey from bombay, indiana, to madison, wisconsin, he was worried about many things. He was worried about what the weather was going to be like in madison, wisconsin, he was worried about who would meet him when he got off the Greyhound Bus in the middle of the madison wisconsin in the summer of 1965, but there was one thing he did not have to worry about, he did not have to worry about whether he was coming to a country that would not welcome him or be unable to welcome him because of his religion. He was able to make a home here. Able to raise a family here because of what Thomas Jefferson did in the late 1770s and 1780s, so lets remember what the consequences are of what Thomas Jefferson accomplished. Thats what were here to talk about today. We have this extraordinary statute of Thomas Jefferson, and to put the statute in context, and understand the background, and ultimately as i want to argue today, the biblical Seed Bed from which the statute emerged, i want to talk about just seven words of Jeffersons Statute. And to help us understand those seven words of Jeffersons Statute and the whole meaning of the statute, im then going to talk about a number of latin words since you all know latin, i assume. If you dont, you better leave now. But no, im going to help you out. To understand some of the background, the theological underpinning or philosophical underpinning of the seven crucial words of the statute for religious premium, were going to talk about 18 latin words, and then to help you understand those latin words, im going to talk about some hebrew words. And im going to talk about 13 hebrew words, which in fact, i think provide the real bedrock of jeffersons ideas that became so foundational for our own country. And the words, the seven words of the statute for religious freedom, again, passed in january 16th, 1786, are the very first words of the statute for religious freedom, and they are Almighty God hath created the mind free. Almighty god hath created the mind free. And when one reads those words, the first words of the Virginia Statute for religious freedom one is reminded of course from religious words from the declaration of independence which jefferson had written in 1776 of course, a year before he began drafting the Virginia Statute for Religion Freedom, reminded of the great words of the declaration of independence, we hold these truths to be selfevident that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their creator with certain unalienable rights, and among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Immediately were confronted when we look at the text of the Virginia Statute with a claim about our human human beings, all human beings, are irreducibly inalienably made and structured in a certain kind of way. Above all what Thomas Jefferson underlines at the beginning of the statute is that human beings, the mind of human beings was made to be free. Its important to understand what jefferson is doing in the historical and intellectual context of the time. He was not the only person arguing for religious freedom in the 17th and 18th century. You could say there was a growing number of arguments for religious freedom in this context. We know of course that Thomas Jefferson was a man of the enlightenment. We know that he was deeply influenced by European Thinkers such as Condorcet And Rousseau and Locke And Hellvatius and gibbon, influenced by the french enlightenment, by the english enlightenment, and these strands of thought introduced, advocated, put forward many different kinds of arguments for religious freedom. There were three arguments that i think were increasingly common in this period of european history. One was an anticlerical argument, frankly, and jefferson in his time in france would have been very familiar with this anticlerical strand. There were many people arguing for freedom of religion as a way to break the power of the church and of religion, which they distrusted on secularist grounds. Another very frequent argument was a christian theological argument that rooted religious freedom in christian doctrine, that made the case that only religious freedom was consistent with the spirit of Charity And Peaceableness of the christian religion. John locke begins his letter considering toleration by arguing that he submits that toleration, he believes, is the chief characteristic mark of the true church. So thats the kind of christian doctrinal argument. Europe that had struggled with wars of religion for a long period of time, and that argument was that the only way to solve europes consistent, chronic divisions and warfare over religion was to introduce religious freedom, to simply allow people to believe whatever they wanted. Now, Thomas Jefferson in the statute for religious freedom does not make any of those arguments central. What he does instead is argue that religious freedom is an irreducible nonnegotiable demand of our human nature, period. He doesnt argue for religious freedom on grounds of expediency. He doesnt argue for religious freedom on the ground that its going to lead to outcomes that he likes. He doesnt introduce a resultsoriented argument for religious freedom. He introduces to use a fancy philosophical term, a deontological argument for religious freedom. An argument that says this is rooted in the principles of human nature. Human nature is such that it demands always and wherever that the Conscience And Reason and freedom of human beings should be respected in matters of religion. And its quite striking that he doesnt to support these kinds of arguments refer to secular philosophers or thinkers like hobbs or thinkers who were very influential or important in this period. In fact, whats striking is and here im going to talk about my 18 latin words is that the one thinker that Thomas Jefferson cites when hes making an elaborate argument for religious freedom and this is in another work called the notes on the state of virginia. The one thinker that he refers to when hes elaborating this argument that human nature itself requires religious freedom is an early Church Father by the name of tertullian. I discovered this when i was teaching a class at georgetown and one of my students is in the audience. As i was teaching this class on the history of religion, i discovered that jefferson had cited this early Church Father tertullian and the phrase that he cites he quotes if in latin. Its a fundamental human right, a privilege of nature that every man should worship according to his own convictions. One Mans Religion neither harms nor helps another man. It is no part of religion to compel religion to which free will ask not force should lead us those words the Church Father had written not in the 17th century or the 16th century, but in the early third century. And tertullian wrote those 18 latin words because he was inspired by 13 hebrew words. It was because of his reflection on those words that he came to believe tertullian that it was an essential inherent part of the way that we were created by god that we would be free, and of course the 13 hebrew words im referring to are the words of Genesis Chapter 1, verse 27, and god created man in his own image. In the image of god he created them male and female. He created them. God created us in a sense to have the very kind of freedom that he himself has. Thats what it means to be created in the image of god. We partake in something of the liberty and indeed he says of the dignity of god. We have a god like freedom and dignity, and we know that ultimately from what we learn from inspecting and observing the magnificent dignity of other human beings, but its also something we see taught in those 13 hebrew words in genesis, which i believe are the real soil from which ideas of religious freedom grew up from over the centuries. Thank you. [ applause ] thank you, tim. Great job. Next is robert louis wilken, profession of Christianity Emeritus at the university of virginia. An elected fellow of the american academy of arts and sciences, the past president of the american academy of religion, past president of the north american Patristics Society as well as the academy of catholic theology. Hes the chairman of the board of the institute of religion and public life, which is the publisher of an outstanding publication a lot of us read called first things. Among his many books are these three influential books, the first thousand years, a global history of christianity, the spirit of early christian thought seeking the face of god, and the christians as the romans saw them. And then remembering the christian past. Hes taught at fordham, notre dame, the institute of patristicom in rome and the gregorian university in Rome And Providence college. Its a real pleasure to have robert Louis Willken speaking on the christian origin of religious freedom. Thank you very much. Customary to say how pleased one is to be here. So people said to me how far did you come . And i said, well, it happens that i live just down the street at 1317 4th street. And my wife drove me over here this afternoon, and then she came and is going to drive me home, and she said its 0. 8 miles. So im very pleased to have the beginning of a relationship to this fine new museum. Now, those of you who have been through the museum know that there is an exhibit on the great awakening, and the great awakening was a powerful period of religious renewal in the United States, the great preacher, George Whitfield was the spearhead for this awakening, and the great awakening spread all through the country, kind of to bring an inner conversion of people, and when it finally it started further north, it got to central virginia, virginia in the 1770s was an anglican colony. The official was the anglican church, and all of a sudden these baptist ministers started seeping into virginia and drawing people away from the anglican parishes, and they were not happy about that, and they had English Law at the time to enforce, and you couldnt just go out and preach. You had to be licensed by anglican state authorities. Well, it happened that one of the largest revivals and meetings happened near the town of orange, virginia, which is where James Madison lived, and so James Madison knew about what was happening and some of the people that he knew were at the time in jail in culpepper, which is just right up the road, so he had a firsthand knowledge of the harassment of these baptist clergy and their followers. He was only in his early 20s at the time, and he had begun to get interested in politics as his father was, and he was elected to a committee to prepare a declaration of rights, what my friend here Tim Shah has been talking about. The original draft was written by george mason. Contemporary of madison and jefferson, and the language is very significant. He said that all men should enjoy the fullest toleration, toleration in the exercise of religion according to the dictates of conscience. The fullest toleration in the exercise of religion according to the dictates of conscience. Madison, he was only 24 years old, thought that was not adequate because toleration is a form of indulgence, that the ruling authorities grant people who they dont like. And so he suggested a revision to read, all men are equally entitled to the full and the free exercise of religion according to the dictates of conscience, and the key phrase there entitled to the full and the free exercise of religion. In other words, hes implying that it is a right, not something a benevolent ruler grants. But some and the leader on the opposition was patrick henry. Patrick henry pushed for a modified establishment of religion where others besides the anglicans would receive funds for their schools and other institutions, and madison wanted this to be voted down, and he wrote then a document, which is called the Memorial And Remonstrance against religious assessment. And this is what he wrote. Because we hold it for a fundamental and undeniable truth that religion is the duty, which we owe to our creator, and the manner of discharging it, it can only be directed by reason and by conviction, not by force and violence. Hes reflecting what Tim Shah just said, that religion because it is an inner conviction of the heart and mind, you cant compel a person to believe something by using some external means, a sword or a Whip Or Something more violent. And then he says the religion of every man must be left to the Conviction And Conscience of every man, and it is the right of every man to exercise it as his conviction and his conscience may dictate. This right is an inalienable right, and what he means by that is its because the opinions of men depending only on the evidence contemplated by their own minds cannot follow the dictates of others, that you should be able to choose what you believe. It is inalienable also because what is here or right toward men is a duty toward god. It is the duty of every man to render to the creator such homage and such only as he believes to be acceptable to god, and then he says this duty is precedent. We dont use the phrase in that way. It precedes both in order and time and in degree of obligation to the claims of civil society, so what you believe takes precedent in time and in logic to what civil society requires. Before any man can be considered as a member of civil society, he must be considered as a assumption of the governor of the universe, and if a member of civil society do it with the saving of his own allegiance to the universal sovereign, we maintain therefore in madison religion, no mans right is abridged by the institution of civil society. That is the right to confess what you believe is one that precedes and cannot be in any way limited, and that religion and this is a lovely phrase is wholly exempt from its cognizance, wish we spoke that way today. Religion is wholly exempt from the cognizance of the state. That term goes back, John Locke uses it and a great English Theologian by the name of john owen. Now, the memorials of political theologians. Madison does not cite biblical text. But those of you who have some familiarity with the bible certainly can hear biblical overtones in what hes seeing, even a cursory look at the Way Madison puts things, its apparent that the central Ideas Shah has already derived from christianity and can be traced to the bible as it had been understood by christian thinkers in earlier centuries. For example, madison says religion is a duty we owe to our creator, the great commandment of jesus. You shall love the lord your god with all your heart, with all your soul, and all your might. Luke, thou shalt worship the lord your god and him alone shall you serve. Religion is a duty we owe to our creator. Second, he says that the business of government and that of religion must be kept separate. We maintain that in matters of religion, no mans right is a bridge by the institution of civil society, and again, this nice phrase, religion is wholly exempt from its cognizance. The government has no knowledge of what religious people do. Ultimately, this distinction between the realm of religion and that of the state goes back to the words of jesus. Render unto god the things that are of god and to caesar the things that are of caesar, and over the course 16 and 1,700 years before it gets to the time of madison and jefferson, that text had been interpreted and interpreted and interpreted to mean that the world basically is governed by two there are two realms in which people live, one of the state, civil, and to give a good example here, the great reformer john calvin. One realm he said is spiritual whereby the conscience is instructed in piety and in reverencing god. The second is political where man is educated for the duties of humanity and citizenship. What to do with our worldly good, safety, security what the government is expected to provide. When the one is considered, we should call off our minds and not allow the other to be part of the discussion. The civil society it had no cognizance. So ultimately, that language in Madisons Declaration goes back to the words of the jesus in the new testament. Third, he gives conscience a prominent place. He says that religion must be left up to the Conscience And Conviction of every man, and it is the right of every man to exercise it as his conscience may dictate. Conscience then is understood as a natural capacity in everyone to discern designed truth and how one is to live. Now, the Term Conscience was used by philosophers in the roman worlds in the greek world, but it enters the vocabulary of western society through christianity, particularly through the Apostle Paul in the book of romans and in first corinthians. Apostle paul writes, in your actions let your conscience be your guide as to what you should do. For a Persons Liberty should not be determined by another mans conscience, that is another Mans Judgment as to what one is to believe or what is right or wrong. Conscience, as in all of these issues, had a long history of being used and applied in different situations in the course of medieval Christianity And Right through the reformation. In fact, some of the reading that ive been doing, the first time that the Term Conscience occurs during the reformation is on the lips of a franciscan nun, who says because she was her monastery was being shut down by the lutheran magistrate. She says you talk about the freedom of the gospel, and you wont allow us to follow our consciences. So madison stands in that tradition, though hes not citing that. Finally, very quickly, madison says the right to practice religion of Ones Choice is inalienable, that is it precedes the claims of society. Ultimately this goes back to the biblical idea that human beings are created in the image of god, which shah has already said, and what that means is they are free. They are free by nature, freedom is not something that civil society grants. Theyre able to make their own judgments about what to believe and whatnot to believe, and they cannot be subject to the dictates of others. So to summarize, madison was a beneficiary of ways of thinking developed by earlier christian thinkers, and it is that tradition, that christian tradition that is the foundation of our american understanding of religious freedom. This tradition extended over centuries, and in some cases can be traced back to christian writers of the second and third century like tertullian who was already mentioned. But the ultimate is the bible. James madisons views on religious freedom were not the result of his reading of the bible. Thats not the way things work. He was not a theologian. He wasnt a religious philosopher. Nonetheless, it is evident he is adapting ideas developed by christian thinkers on the basis of the scriptures. In that sense, the bible had an influence on Madisons Conception of religious freedom. Thank you very much. [ applause ] thank you, our last speaker, jacqueline rivers, shes the executive director and senior fellow for social sciences and policy at the Seymour Institute for black Church And Policy studies. Shes also a nonresident fellow for the institutes of studies at baylor. Recent projects have focused. On launch bioethics on launching the focus of marriage at the vatican. She holds a ph. D. From Harvard University where she was a fellow and a Graduate Research Fellow of the national science foundation. Shes presented at many universities across the country. Her latest publication appears in the volume not just good, but beautiful in the book the cultural matrix. Jackie comes to share this paper, the black church enacting the biblical mandate for religious freedom. Dr. Jackie rivers. [ applause ] good evening. Im truly honored to be here with you, and im absolutely wowed by the museum. My congratulations go to those who have put it together, and its wonderful to have something like this right here in the heart of washington, d. C. , the nations capital. And professor wilkins talked about having walked up the street or 0. 8 miles. I flew from jamaica. So i am very glad to be here with you tonight. I do want to take a little bit of a different tack, though, in talking about religious freedom, and the connection, its biblical roots. In the two excellent presentations weve heard theres really been a focus on something which is fundamental and which i agree with wholeheartedly, which is its an inalienable right, that it is intrinsic to being human that we have the right to follow our conscience, and out of that closely related to that, fundamental to that, the right for religious freedom, but from the perspective of the black church, its really about what has happened over the course of history. And in fact, if you think about it god doesnt just declare that we have religious freedom. He demonstrates it, and it starts with the story of exodus. Think about it. Moses goes to meet with pharaoh, and what does he do . He says god has commanded us to leave and to go to a place to worship him, and when pharaoh refuses to allow them to go, hes not merely disobeying god, hes abrogating their right to religious freedom. Hes denying them the right to religious freedom because religious freedom is about the right to follow god, and its not just about the right to freedom of worship that we can in our churches and in our bedrooms and in our homes worship, its about the right to act in response to our understanding of gods calling on our lives. Its about the right to do it not just in private but also to do it in public, so god starts with an action that demonstrates the importance, the power of religious freedom, and for the black church that is a central motif that runs throughout our history, the idea of the exodus because for us, the civil war was an exodus. It was a crossing over from slavery to freedom. It was an act of judgment by god, and its rooted really in the understanding of biblical faith because those black and white abolitionists who worked to bring about that exodus, they were largely people of faith, people who believed the bible and who lived it out. Sojourner truth, an itinerant teacher, a whom who was an abolitionist herself, who argued against slavery powerfully, and who argued for the rights of women long before our current focus on equality. Came and all of this came out of her powerful faith, out of her understanding of the biblical meaning of what it was to follow god. The same is true of John Brown who takes on harpers ferry. John browns actions are about his understanding of gods absolute judgment on the horror of slavery. Again, rooted in his exercise of his religious freedom and growing out of biblical faith. The same is true for harriet tubman. Harriet tubman saw herself as on a mission guided and protected by god himself. Rooted in her biblical faith, she has the courage to go back into the south after escaping from slavery, she goes back into the south to free 300 other enslaved people on 19 trips. The power of religious freedom being exercised and in action. But thats not the only Exodus Event in the history of the black church. Think about the civil Rights Movement, an exodus from Disenfranchisement And Terror in the southern United States into full citizenship, and in the words of Reverend Dr. Martin luther king, there is nothing greater in the world than freedom. I would rather die in abject poverty with my convictions than live in inordinate riches with lack of selfrespect. For him, religious freedom was expressed in all of the work of the civil Rights Movement. We were talking about this earlier today, the fact that the importance of Kings Faith in his role in the civil Rights Movement, the importance of the church, the black church, in the civil Rights Movement is fading from view, perhaps being blotted out, and the focus is on dr. King rather than on reverend king. But this was a man driven by his faith, strengthened by his faith. He endured death threats, bombings of his home, endangering his wife and children based on the strength of his faith. See, early in the campaign, the Bus Boycott in montgomery, king is terrified by the rising violence, and in the middle of the night hes sitting in his kitchen trying to figure out what do i do . And he has a revelation. He hears jesus speaking to him and telling him that he must have faith and that he must stand up for righteousness and that he must do what is right. And as he hears this, it becomes a mantra that he goes back to time and time again when he faces crisis in pursuing the civil Rights Movement, hes strengthened by the memory of that experience. In fact, David Garrow who as far as i know was not a man of faith at all writes a powerful biography of king, which doesnt come from a religious perspective. I mean, its completely secular, but the theme keeps coming back, even through the eyes of a secular writer how important that revelation was to kings having the strength to do what he did. But king was not the only one. There was reverend fred shuttlesworth, ralph abernathy, joseph lowry, all of them it was the black clergy, it was men of faith acting on their religious freedom, exercising religious freedom who led the civil Rights Movement, but let us not forget that without the tens of thousands of black church going people, people of faith who took to the streets, those leaders could not have done anything. And the power of the church in this movement is indicated when king is involved in naming the southern christian Leadership Conference, which was going to be called the southern Leadership Conference, but king says no. This has to be the southern christian Leadership Conference because he knows that black people are rooted in biblical faith. He knows that it is going to take those all Night Prayer and Praise And Singing and preaching sessions in black churches the night before they hit the streets for them to have the strength to withstand police truncheons, police dogs, fire hoses without retaliating with violence. The story of the civil Rights Movement, the victories of the civil Rights Movement is the victories of the black church of religious freedom being exercised, and its very appropriate that we talk about this tonight because just yesterday we celebrated Reverend Dr. Martin luther kings day. But even today, the exercise of religious freedom is so critical in the black community because oh, i do want to say one other thing, and that is i want you to have a sense of how important this biblical interpretation is to king because he bases his passionate advocacy for the struggle for civil rights in a biblical understanding, and you see it in the i have a dream speech. He quotes isaiah 40 in describing his vision for africanamericans, i have a dream that one day every valley will be exalted, every Hill And Mountain made low, the rough places will be made plain, and the crooked places will be made straight, and the glory of the lord shall be revealed and all flesh shall see it together. This is our hope. So king is explicitly championing the responsibility of every christian to follow his or her conscience and obey gods calling when any conflict arises between the two, between gods calling and the duty to civil society, which professor wilkens was talking about earlier that religious freedom takes precedence. So in his Sermon Titled Pauls letter to american christians, he says be not conformed to the world, but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind. So this is an imaginary letter. He imagines paul writing to american christians and paul goes on to say in this imaginary letter or as i said to philipian christians, you are a colony of heaven. This means that although you live in a colony of time, your ultimate allegiance is to the empire of eternity. You have a dual citizenry. You live both in time and eternity, both in heaven and earth, therefore your ultimate allegiance is not to the government, not to the state, not to the nation, not to any man made institution. The christian owes his ultimate allegiance to god, and if any earthly institution conflicts with gods will it is your christian duty to take a stand against it. This is a perfect expression of religious freedom and its grounded in his understanding of the biblical mandate. He also this was reflected also in the final speech that king gives, his Mountain Top oration, which was actually made the night before hes murdered, and hes talking about having been to the Mountain Top and seen the promised land, but like moses he may not cross over with us. Its as though he knew what was going to happen the next day. He likens his journey to that of moses and the entire movement is in his eyes, a minor exodus of the southern black person from Terror And Disenfranchisement to full citizenship. But more than that, king saw the whole strategy, the nonviolent strategy of the civil Rights Movement, this winning strategy as consistent with biblical teaching. He said violence creates many more social problems than it solves, and as ive said in so many instances, the negro in particular and colored peoples all over the world in their struggle for freedom, if they succumb to the temptation of using violence for their struggle, unborn generations will be the recipients of a long and desperate night of bitterness, and the biblical source hes using is matthews words, jesuss words in matthew, in the 5th chapter of the gospel as recorded by st. Matthew, we read these very arresting words flowing from the lips of our lord and master, you have heard that it has been said, you shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy, but i say unto you, love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for those that despitefully use you, that ye may be the children of your father, which is in heaven. His entire strategy is seen as coming from the lips of jesus as recorded in matthew. So for the black church, religious freedom, yes, its an inalienable right, but even more, it is exercised. It is freedom. It is our exodus. And so religious freedom and its biblical roots are essential to the faith of the black church. [ applause ] okay. Wow, that was a good session, i have to say, one of the best ive been a part of, and we have about 15 minutes for questions and answers, and were going to start these are facebook questions that are coming in. With technology im seeing this, so rhonda has a question for dr. Rivers. Has the interpretation of what freedom of religion means changed over the last 300 years . And others may answer that if youd like, too, but this one is specifically addressed to dr. Rivers. So i dont feel that i have the historical chops to really take that on, but i think what has been demonstrated by the three talks is, in fact, that there is a thread that runs right through, and that is consistent. Does that mean its never been interpreted differently, i think that that is clearly not the case, but starting from the biblical times, this notion that the right to respond to gods calling is every single person, whether they choose and this was something that i didnt get to because of time whether they choose to acknowledge that calling by expression of faith, christian faith, muslim faith, buddhist faith, hindu faith, whether or not someone chooses faith, the right to respond is inalienable, and so if you are an atheist you still have that right. No one has a right to force you into an expression of faith if in your heart you respond to that calling by saying god does not exist. Great. Okay, karen has a question for dr. Shah. Did jefferson apply his philosophy towards religion when writing the first amendment . Well, jefferson, of course, did not write the first amendment. The first amendment was drafted primarily by James Madison but working with a committee so jefferson was in france at the time of the drafting of the bill of rights, so did not play a direct role on that, but i think its understood that the Virginia Statute for religious freedom played a major role in shaping the first amendment, particularly the two first clauses of the first amendment namely the religion clauses, congress shall may no law respecting an establishment of religion nor abridging the free exercise thereof. I thought you did that very gracefully without pushing back hard at all. So this is a question for dr. Wilken from wes. How does the idea of separation of Church And State relate to freedom of religion . Can i first just speak to the question go back to the first one . The most profound change that has come about you can hear from reading what we read from jefferson and madison, they assumed a world in which people believed in god. We now are living in a world in which many people do not believe in god, and our public life has excluded god. So with each passing decade, its going to be harder to make a case for religious freedom because it looks like special pleading. In fact, a man wrote a book a few years ago, why tolerate religion. Whats so special about that is the profound challenge of our own time. Now back to the question. The question is how does the idea of separation of Church And State relate to freedom of religion . Well, separation means that the religious communities have the right to determine how they are going to worship god and how they are going to live and practice. And that is something that the government has no say in. So unless you have the distinction. The whole struggle for the history of religious freedom was to get beyond the assumption that the king, the prince, the magistrates determined what people were as a community to believe, and there was a saying, a latin saying, in the 16th century. It is whoever is the king, the ruler, he is the one who determines what the religion should be, so the whole development of religious freedom was to break free of that assumption and to say that there are two realms and they inevitably interact, but one cannot determine the other going both ways. Great. This is a question for dr. Rivers from kristen. How would you encourage people to think through where they stand when religious and civil liberties seem to clash . I think that that is a very important question, and i think what i like about the question is the acknowledgement that we have to balance those two, and so i think the difficulty is how profound an infringement on the sense of conscious is being enforced. Are people prepared to pay the price. I mean, king exercises religious freedom, but he believed that in doing so you had to pay the price. And so then we need to look to the courts of the land to help us with that question of balancing because everyone should have the right to live out their religious freedom. Some external arbiter needs to balance those rights and then we as each of us exercises our conscious needs to be prepared to pay the price as king did with it not willing to pay bail in cases where he felt it was unjust. Great. This is a question that i think a number of you touched on in your presentations. Its addressed to dr. Wilkon but i think dr. Shaw can answer it, too. What are some of the earliest examples of freedom of religion around the world . Well, lets take england because thats a case where so much of the influence on this country. In the 17th Century England went through a great struggle because the puritans did not want to conform to what was the publicly acknowledged religion. And over the course of several generations, they were able to make a case and basically the English Rulers sided with the act of toleration that there had to be space for those who were not church of england people. So that would be one very clear example and it has repercussions. There are others in the netherlands and in france and the English Example for us is the most important. Yeah. Just to note one early example which is often forgotten in these kind of discussions and that is we have a very early example in the roman empire at the beginning of the fourth century. Robert has written expertly about this. Namely the socalled edict of milan which was coauthored by the coemperors at the time, constantine in 313, and it is sometimes misunderstood that what milan did was Grant Toleration to christians. In fact, that had been done two years earlier in 311 in the edict of galarius and the socalled edict of milan, socalled because it wasnt published as an edict, but the historical detail. The document, though, and the policy was one of genuine freedom of religion, the text of that edict makes it clear that that granted freedom for all citizens of the roman empire to follow that form of religion or that understanding of god that a case can be made and robert and i have both tried to make the case that that early policy was a reflection of the early arguments of the Church Father, such as tortolian, who we mentioned earlier and a part of the court of constantine as early as the first decade of the fourth century. Now that story can be told in a book thats conveniently located in the back. It is only 340 days until christmas. You dont have much time so get over there. I think we are just about out of time, if im not mistaken. Is that correct . Should i take a few more questions . Two more. Okay. Some silly person out there in the Facebook World has asked me a question. The question is what are some of the greatest challenges facing prisoners in terms of religious liberty. I do a lot of research in that area. There are challenges, but the reality is that weve made a lot of progress with allowing religious freedom for inmates to attend religious services and institutions. If you want to visit a Prison Youll find religion there. Youll find worship services there, and unfortunately, we live in a time when a lot of prisons have cut programs and in some prisons, the only programs they have are religious. So we can at least be thankful for that and i will say there was a Court Case before the supreme court just a few years ago where a muslim inmate wanted to have a beard but was not allowed to have a beard in arkansas. So he sued the department of corrections for the opportunity to have religious freedom and have a halfinch beard. So the department of corrections contended that it was a security risk. No telling what you can hide in that beard. Its a Half Inch in length and so interestingly enough, the supreme court decided the case 90 in favor of the muslim inmate that used a lot of the research that wed conducted on christians to make the case that religion actually helped reduce recidivism and was a good that comes to society, and so with that in mind, maybe well take one last question and this one is from the members of the audience. Its tagged for dr. Shaw. Many clergy from all walks of faith came to the aid of the black church, everyone from rabbis to catholic priests, episcopal preachers to baptist clergy. Whats that do to the biblical mandate alone . Your thoughts on the motivation although this would probably go to jackie. Jackie, do you want to take that . What did that do to the biblical mandate alone and your thoughts on the motivation. Well, i think the biblical mandate was very powerful for a lot of the clergy through cane, whether they were jewish and roman catholic or anglican. But we also have to recognize that a lot of people also came just out of that sense. You know, this idea that we have an innate sense of gods calling. A lot of people came out of their sense of what was right and wrong and not necessarily explicitly religious, at all. So there was the two things were at work which i see as both being very much a part of the right defended by the first amendment and the right to religious freedom because there were college students who came from the north in particular in response to the civil Rights Movement. Were not necessarily motivated by religion at all. So, yes, i think the biblical mandate was a powerful force. But it wasnt the only thing at work. The innate sense of gods calling, i think that was at work, too. Great. Join me in thanking dr. Shaw and dr. Wilkin and dr. Rivers. [ applause ] that concludes our evening. Book signing. There are books in the back. We will migrate back there if any of you will stick around and get some early Christmas Gifts purchased for loved ones. Weekends on cspan2 are an intellectual feast. On Sundays Book Tv brings you the latest of nonfiction books and authors. Funding for cspan2m cops from these television companies and more including charter communications. Broadband is a force for empowerment, and that is why charter has invested billions building infrastructure, upgrading technology and empowering opportunity in communities big and small. Charter is connecting us. Charter communications along with these television companies support cspan2 as a public service. The museum of the bible in washington, d. C. , which opened on November 17th of 2017 has more than 3,000 books and artifacts on exhibit, and the building occupies almost an entire city block. Up next on american artifacts we tour the american bible exhibit. This is the first of a twopart program. Im kerry Summers President of the american museum of the bible. We are standing in what is called the impact floor