Transcripts For CSPAN3 Presidential Debates 1976 Presidentia

Jimmy carter focused on foreign and military issues. The debate is best remembered for president fords statement that there is no soviet domination of Eastern Europe. Good evening. Im Pauline Frederick of npr, moderator of this 2nd of the historic debates of the 1976 campaign between gerald r. Ford of michigan, republican candidate for president , and jimmy carter of georgia, democratic candidate for president. Thank you, president ford, and thank you, governor carter, for being with us tonight. This debate takes place before an audience in the palace of fine arts theater in san francisco. An estimated 100 million americans are watching on television as well. San francisco was the site of the signing of the United Nations charter, 31 years ago. Thus, it is an appropriate place to hold this debate, the subject of which is foreign and defense issues. The questioners tonight are max frankel, associate editor of the new york times, henry l. Trewhitt, Diplomatic Correspondent of the baltimore sun, and richard valeriani, Diplomatic Correspondent of nbc news. The ground rules are basically the same as they were for the first debate two weeks ago. The questions will be alternated between candidates. By the toss of a coin, governor carter will take the first question. Each question sequence will be as follows, the question will be asked and the candidate will have up to three minutes to answer. His opponent will have up to two minutes to respond. And prior to the response, the questioner may ask a followup question to clarify the candidates answer when necessary with up to two minutes to reply. Each candidate will have three minutes for a closing statement at the end. President ford and governor carter do not have notes or prepared remarks with them this evening, but they may take notes during the debate and refer to them. Mr. Frankel, you have the first question for governor carter. Governor, since the democrats last ran our Foreign Policy, including many of the men who are advising you, country has been relieved of the vietnam agony and the military draft, weve started arms control negotiations with the russians, weve opened relations with china, weve arranged the disengagement in the middle east, weve regained influence with the arabs without deserting israel, now, maybe weve even begun a process of peaceful change in africa. Now youve objected in this campaign to the style with which much of this was done, and youve mentioned some other things that you think ought to have been done. But do you really have a quarrel with this republican record . Would you not have done any of those things . Well, i think this Republican Administration has been almost all style, and spectacular, and not substance. Weve got a chance tonight to talk about, first of all, leadership, the character of our country, and a vision of the future. In every one of these instances, the Ford Administration has failed, and i hope tonight that i and mr. Ford will have a chance to discuss the reasons for those failures. Our country is not strong anymore; were not respected anymore. We can only be strong overseas if were strong at home; and when i become president well not only be strong in those areas but also in defense a defense capability second to none. Weve lost in our Foreign Policy, the character of the American People. Weve ignored or excluded the American People and the congress from participation in the shaping of our Foreign Policy. Its been one of secrecy and exclusion. In addition to that weve had a chance to became now, contrary to our longstanding beliefs and principles, the Arms Merchant of the whole world. Weve tried to buy success from our enemies, and at the same time weve excluded from the process the normal friendship of our allies. In addition to that weve become fearful to compete with the soviet union on an equal basis. We talk about detente. The soviet union knows what they want in detente, and theyve been getting it. We have not known what weve wanted and weve been outtraded in almost every instance. The other point i wanna make is about our defense. Weve got to be a nation blessed with a defense capability thats efficient, tough, capable, well organized, narrowly focused fighting capability. The ability to fight, if necessary, is the best way to avoid the chance for, or the requirement to fight. And the last point i wanna make is this, mr. Ford, mr. Kissinger have continued on with the policies and failures of richard nixon. Even the republican platform has criticized the lack of leadership in mr. Ford and theyve criticized the Foreign Policy of this administration. This is one instance where i agree with with the republican platform. I might say this in closing, and that is that as far as Foreign Policy goes, mr. Kissinger has been the president of this country. Mr. Ford has shown an absence of leadership, and an absence of a grasp of what this country is and what it ought to be. Thats got to be changed. And thats one of the major issues in this campaign of 1976. President ford, would you like to respond . Governor carter again is talking in broad generalities. Let me take just one question that he raises the military strength and capability of the United States. Governor carter in november of 1975 indicated that he wanted to cut the Defense Budget by 15 billion. A few months later, he said he wanted to cut the Defense Budget by 8 or 9 billion dollars. And more recently, he talks about cutting the Defense Budget by five to seven billion dollars. There is no way you can be strong militarily and have those kind of reductions in our military appropriation. Now let me just tell you a little story. About late october of 1975, i asked the then secretary of defense, mr. Schlesinger, to tell me what had to be done if we were going to reduce the Defense Budget by 3 to 5 billion dollars. A few days later, mr. Schlesinger came back and said if we cut the Defense Budget by three to five billion dollars, we will have to cut military personnel by two hundred and fifty thousand, civilian personnel by a hundred thousand, jobs in america by a hundred thousand. We would have to stretch out our aircraft procurement, we would have to reduce our Naval Construction program, we would have to reduce the research and development for the army, the navy, the air force and marines by 8 . We would have to close 20 military bases in the United States immediately. Thats the kind of Defense Program that mr. Carter wants. Let me tell you this straight from the shoulder. You dont negotiate with mr. Brezhnev from weakness. And the kind of Defense Program that mr. Carter wants will mean a weaker defense and a poor negotiating position. Mr. Trewhitt, a question for president ford. Mr. President , my question really is the other side of the coin from mr. Frankels. For a generation the United States has had a Foreign Policy based on containment of communism. Yet we have lost the first war in vietnam, we lost a shoving match in angola. The communists threatened to come to power by peaceful means in italy and relations generally have cooled with the soviet union in the last few months. So let me ask you first, what do you do about such cases as italy . And secondly, does this general drift mean that were moving back toward Something Like an old cold coldwar relationship with the soviet union . I dont believe we should move to a coldwar relationship. I think its in the best interest of the United States, and the world as a whole that the United States negotiate rather than go back to the coldwar relationship with the soviet union. I dont look at the picture as bleakly as you have indicated in your question, mr. Trewhitt. I believe that the United States has had many successes in recent years, in recent months, as far as the communist movement is concerned. We have been successful in portugal, where a year ago it looked like there was a very great possibility that the communists would take over in portugal. It didnt happen. We have a democracy in portugal today. A few months ago, or i should say, maybe two years ago, the soviet union looked like they had continued strength in the middle east. Today, according to Prime Minister rabin, the soviet union is weaker in the middle east than they have been in many, many years. The facts are, there the soviet Union Relationship with egypt is at a low level. The soviet Union Relationship with syria is at a very low point. The United States today, according to Prime Minister rabin of israel, is at a peak in its influence and power in the middle east. But lets turn for a minute to the Southern African operations that are now going on. The United States of america took the initiative in Southern Africa. We wanted to end the bloodshed in Southern Africa. We wanted to have the right of selfdetermination in Southern Africa. We wanted to have majority rule with the full protection of the rights of the minority. We wanted to preserve Human Dignity in Southern Africa. We have taken the initiative, and in Southern Africa today the United States is trusted by the black frontline nations and black africa. The United States is trusted by other elements in Southern Africa. The United States Foreign Policy under this administration has been one of progress and success. And i believe that instead of talking about soviet progress, we can talk about american successes. And may i make an observation part of the question you asked, mr. Trewhitt . I dont believe that its in the best interest of the United States and the nato nations to have a communist government in nato. Mr. Carter has indicated he would look with sympathy to a communist government in nato. I think that would destroy the integrity and the strength of nato, and i am totally opposed to it. Well, mr. Ford, unfortunately, has just made a statement thats not true. I have never advocated a communist government for italy. That would obviously be a ridiculous thing for anyone to do who wanted to be president of this country. I think that this is an instance of deliberate distortion, and this has occurred also in the question about defense. As a matter of fact, ive never advocated any cut of 15 billion in our Defense Budget. As a matter of fact, mr. Ford has made a political football out of the Defense Budget. About a year ago he cut the pentagon budget 6. 8 billion dollars. After he fired james schlesinger, the political heat got so great that he added back about 3 billion. When Ronald Reagan won the texas primary election, mr. Ford added back another 1. 5 billion. Immediately before the kansas city convention, he added back another 1. 8 billion in the selfDefense Budget. And his own office of management and budget testified that he had a 3 billion cut insurance added to the Defense Budget Defense Budget under the pressure from the pentagon. Obviously, this is another indication of trying to use the Defense Budget for political purposes, which hes trying to do tonight. Now, we went into south africa late, after great britain, rhodesia, the black nations had been trying to solve this problem for many, many years. We didnt go in until right before the election, similar to what was taking place in 1972, when mr. Kissinger announced peace is at hand just before the election at that time. And we have weakened our position in nato because the other countries in europe supported the Democratic Forces in portugal long before we did. We stuck to the portugal dictatorships much longer than other democracies did in this world. Mr. Valeriani, a question for governor carter. Governor carter, much of what the United States does abroad is done in the name of the National Interest. What is your concept of the National Interest . What should the role of the United States in the world be . And in that connection, considering your limited experience in Foreign Affairs, and the fact that you take same pride in being a washington outsider, dont you think it would be appropriate for you to tell the American Voters before the election the people that you would like to have in key positions, such as secretary of state, secretary of defense, National Security Affairs Advisor at the white house . Well, im not gonna name my cabinet before i get elected. Ive got a little ways to go before i start doing that. But i have an adequate background, i believe. I am a graduate of the u. S. Naval academy, the First Military graduate since eisenhower. Ive served as the governor of georgia and have traveled extensively in Foreign Countries and south america, central america, europe, the middle east and in japan. Ive traveled the last 21 months among the people of this country. Ive talked to them and ive listened. And ive seen at first hand, in a very vivid way, the deep hurt thats come to this country in the aftermath of vietnam and cambodia, chile, and pakistan, and angola, and watergate, cia revelations. What we were formerly so proud of the strength of our country, its moral integrity, the representation in Foreign Affairs of what our people are, what our constitution stands for, has been gone. And in the secrecy that has surrounded our Foreign Policy in the last few years, the American People, the congress have been excluded. I believe i know what this country ought to be. Ive been one whos loved my nation as Many Americans do, and i believe that theres no limit placed on what we can be in the future, if we can harness the tremendous resources militarily, economically, and the stature of our people, the meaning of the constitution, in the future. Every time weve made a serious mistake in Foreign Affairs, its been because the American People have been excluded from the process. If we can just tap the intelligence and ability, the sound common sense and the good judgment of the American People, we can once again have a Foreign Policy to make us proud instead of ashamed. And im not gonna exclude the American People from that process in the future, as mr. Ford and kissinger have done. This is what it takes to have a sound Foreign Policy strong at home, Strong Defense, permanent commitments, not betray the principles of our country, and involve the American People and the congress in the shaping of our Foreign Policy. Every time mr. Ford speaks from a position of secrecy in negotiations, in secret in secret treaties thatve been pursued and achieved, in supporting dictatorships, in ignoring human rights, we are weak and the rest of the world knows it. So these are the ways that we can restore the strength of our country, and they dont require long experience in Foreign Policy. Nobody has that except a president who has served a long time or a secretary of state. But my background, my experience, my knowledge of the people of this country, my commitment to our principles that dont change those are the best bases to correct the horrible mistakes of this administration and restore our own country to a position of leadership in the world. How specifically, governor, are you going to bring the American People into the decisionmaking process in