Statement. On october 18th, f dardai s announced its independent lab detected talc in johnson and johnsons baby powder. They issued recall for one lot of its talcum powder. I sent an invitation to alex gorsky requests he appear before our subcommittee to discuss the Public Health concerns regarding j and j baby powder. Im disappointed that j and j has refused to comply with our request. While hes not refrained from making multiple public statements on this topic including offering written statements and speaking with media outlet, he has now avoided voluntarily testifying under oath before congress. In fact, this subcommittees very first hearing earlier this year examined possible carcinogens in talc based products. Johnson and johnson objected to the hearing claiming it had not been invited to participate. In a Media Release subsequent to our hearing johnson and johnson stated the subcommittee did not hear the preponderence that supports the safety of our product. We wanted mr. Gorsky to come forward with j and j side of the story but he declined. We can only speculate as to why im speaking to an empty claire. Here are the facts. Theres evidence that for decades tests have repeatedly found that johnson and johnsons talc based baby powder contained asbestos. More sense tifr teitive testing have tested asbestos and talc. In a memo from 1975, employees discuss suppressing the use of sense tifr asbestos med stating and i quote we want to avoid promotion of this approach. Mr. Gorsky is not hear to speak to that. Theres evidence to suggest that when citizen petitions to the fda in the late 1980s and early 19 19990s demanded that j and j with a warning, the company pushed forward with the same time period with an aggressive marketing plan for communities of color as its sales to caucasians declined. Mr. Gorssky is not here to speak to that either. Johnson and johnson commissioned research international. A Market Survey to conduct a Consumer Survey to determine Public Perceptions of its powders name. The Company Learned then that women preferred the corn starch based powder over the talc based powder and that women had a particularly aversion to the worlds talc and talcum with one resp respondent stating i dont like what that word brings to mind. As you can see behind me the company made an intentional decision to prominently feature corn starch on the front of its corn starch based bottle while failing to do the same by labeling the word ta clrlc on i front based baby powder. Mr. Gorsky is not here to speak to that. His company has chosen to speak out and push back against every instance over the last two months in which asbestos has been detected including the fdas own analysis. At this very moment im sending a document request to johnson and johnson seeking answers. We are asking the company to explain its decisions to disregard Consumer Preferences to corn starch over talc. Why the Company Continues to keep its talc powder on the u. S. Market when countries like canada are issuing fines and why the company refuses to attach an adequate carcinogen warning to the label of its tarks t aal based baby powder. I now recognize mr. Comer. Thank you. I want to thank the witnesses that is here today to testify. The issue were discussing today is important. Any possible risk from widely used Consumer Products should be a concern for every one. Im confident that every one in this room use some type of Consumer Products this morning, the safety of which we all take for granted. I believe its important that the committee hear from experts about possible ta clrks contamination. The state of Scientific Understanding about the issue and whether there are regulatory changes that should be considered with regard to the fda and other agencies. However, there are several things regarding this hearing today that im uncomfortable with. First, id like to address the witness listed by the majority for todays hearing. The witnesses. There will be a second panel today featuring johnson and johnson ceo alex gorsky. However, since the majority was well aware in advance of the days hearing that johnson and johnson did not believer the ceo was the appropriate witness for the subject matter specified by the majority and he would not be appearing today. Todays proceedings as they relate to his testimony appears to be for the ben fits efit of media and audience. The company has operated the good faith to provide a witness for this hearing. He does not have first hand knowledge of such methods. Given the hearing topic identified by the committee majority, johnson and johnson offered a recognized expert on testing methods. When the witness was rejektd, the Company Proposed that kathleen woodmire, the chair of johnson and johnson be allowed to appear. Shes the high e level executive who is knowledgeable about the topic of todays hearing. Committee democrats again rejected johnson and johnson proposal. In a supposed change of heart just a few days ago the majority asked if she would be able to testify after all. Johnson and johnson refused to rearrange her schedule. They didnt rush to rearrange her schedule so she could appear as they had originally proposed. Later that day democrats changed course and said she was not acceptable after all and they insisted on mr. Gorsky who the company has stated is not an appropriate witness for the topic of the committee of this Committee Democrats choosing today. If they needed more theater on the day they announced their partisan impeachment. Mr. Chairman, johnson and johnson has for the past year shown a willingness to cooperate. Its provided briefings and its produced documents requested by the majority. The company has produced nearly 10,000 pages of requested information and offered to provide an additional 300 pages. This offer was declined by the majority for unspecified reasons. I worry that the activities related to witness invitations and document produgs may result in the perception that the committee is rather is about trying to publicly shame or embarrass a company and seek out got ya moments to aid in ongoing litigation. Something the committee has been doing over the past year. I worry the committees actions raise questions about whether its using investigative tools to interfere with ongoing litigation. More than 15,000 lieblts lawsuits have been filed against johnson and johnson over its talc based products. This hearing is another example of abiding by the trial bar by Holding Hearings and requesting documents that are critical and otherwise difficult to obtain to plaintiffs attorneys ability to litigate and file additional lawsuits. I hope the subcommittee will submit to doing itst best of appearing with ongoing litigation as we move forward. I hope we can approach with a spirit of fairness and witness who is can provide the best available science and not those engaged in ongoing litigation. I thank our witnesses for appearing. Mr. Chairman, i yield back. Thank you very much. Thank you so much for holding todays critical hearing. Thank you for your subcommittees dedication to protecting Public Health. In october 2019, fda announced it detected asbestos in johnson and johnsons baby powder. Leading the company to recall more than 30,000 bottles. Since then johnson and johnson has publicly questioned the integrity of fdas findings casting doubt on the accuracy of the testing that was conducted. The American People need to have faith that the products that they are safe and that is part of fds critical role. Unfortunately, as the chairman explained, the ceo of johnson and johnson has declined to subcommittees invitation to testify here today. He has spoken to the press, issued public statements and testified in litigation but he apparently does not want to defend his companys actions here today. That is unfortunate and frankly unhelpful. I hope and encourage the subcommittee to continue its important work on behalf of the American People and i pledge my support add they do so. Thank you, mr. Chairman for this important hearing. I yield back. Thank you very much. I would like to recognize Ranking Member jordan for an opening statement. Thank you. Im fine. Our Ranking Member mr. Comber has said what needed to be said. Thank you. Really. This is the first time ive heard you say that. Thank you, mr. Jordan . Well, our first panel today should have had the opportunity to should have been our opportunity to hear from alex gorsky, the ceo of johnson and johnson. He was aware of our interest back in march and said our committee needed to hear their side of the story. We invited him to come before us one month ago. Yet, mr. Gorsky is not here. He can still make this right. He can respond quickly and thoroughlily to our document request and he can come testify before us in a future hearing. This issue is not going away. Too many people are demanding answers to important questions and the safety of johnson and johnsons talcum based cosmetic products is now in serious doubt. Too many people have come forward with evidence of being harmed by these products. We will adjourn this panel and ask that the expert witnesses come forward to commence the next panel. Thank you. Thank you. We will now resume our proceedings. Today we are joined by a panel of witnesses that will help us examine the best methods to detect asbestos and talc. Dr. William longo is a scientist. He will share his disturbing findings. Shes the director of the neheah queens World Trade Center program and the director of the new york state funded occupational and environmental medicine of long island clinical center. Dr. Rod metcalf is a geologist from the university of nevada las vegas. If you would please all rise and raise your right hands. I will begin by swearing you in. Do you swear or affirm that testimony youre about to give is the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, so help you god . Let the record show the witness answered in the affirmative. Thank you and be seated. The microphones are sensitive so please speak directly into them. Your written statements will be made part of the record. Dr. Longo, youre recognized for five minutes. Let me explain the lighting system here. Press the button to speak. Green means go. Yellow does not mean you stop. It means speed up and red means please conclude. You have five minutes to speak. Thank you, chairman and Ranking Members of the subcommittee for giving me the opportunity to discuss the best me methods for determines talc. Ive been involved in asbestos analysis for over 30 years. Independent labs have documented the presence of asbestos in consumer top products including johnsons baby powder, our own lab and johnson and johnsons own consultants, Colorado School of minds, dartmouth university, macron associates and others have documented asbestos in johnsons and other manufacturers top products over the course of decades. They report no detectable asbestos. These reports are very misleading as they result from an literalytical techniques. Why did testing methods adopted and used by the cosmetic talc industry have regularly failed to detect asbestos through test methods can ensure were doing our best to find it. We should have analytical methods that achieve the highest degree of sense tifrty. Let me explain, the first thing to understand is that asbestos fibers have very small and virtually weightless. Good analytical sensitivity is extremely important when looking at very small samples at very low weight percentages. Analytical sensitivity is how much asbestos fibers must be present for the analyst to see a single fiber. The laboratories used by the talc industry have very poor analytical sensitivity with detection limits of 10 million to 14 million asbestos fibers per gram. It must sl gohave good sensitiv. There are 600,000 top particles. This prevents analysts from being able to see the asbestos. This problem can be solved with heavy liquid separation. The industry analytical sensitivity is between 10 million to 14 million per gram. We have detected ample asbestos in approximately 65 of all the cosmetics we have analyzed in the last three years. The hls method is not new to johnson and johnson. In the early 1970s the Colorado School of minds and dartmouth developed the hls method. The Company Never adopted the method stating in the early 170s memo that may be too sensitive and not in their best worldwide interest to employ. If the cosmetic powder manufacturers insist on using their talc in cosmetic products its vital to the Public Safety that the most sensitive method must be required. Theres no dispute that this is the hls preparation method with analysis by tem. Even using the best method one can state it does not contain asbestos. The only true solution is to ban the use of talc in cosmetic products. Thank you, representatives. Thank you. Next dr. Malin. Good afternoon, im honored to be here today. Im a Board Certified physician specializing in occupational and environmental medicine which deals with the impact of exposure on the health of individuals including asbestos. Its caused thousands of death in the United States. The fibers are microscopic. Once the fibers are breathed in, they can penetrate deeply in the lungs and move throughout the body. The most devastating disease is mesothelioma. Its considered the signature disease meaning the diagnosis almost always indicates asbestos exposure. For men the evidence is easy to identify. Many sought care because they knew they worked with asbestos. For women, they sometimes lived with men wo woho worked with asbestos and laundered their clothes. Theres no sound scientific reason for a gender discrepancy and could not be explained merely by chance. This has been solved. The presence of asbestos in kos metsic talc, most commonly used by women is more likely to cause womens mesothelioma and mens mesothelioma. This talc exposure was their only exposure to asbestos. I published an article in the journal of environmental medicine. My colleagues and i reported on 33 individuals whose only source of expouz yosure was cosmetic t. It was stated the asbestos might be related to their use op contaminated talc. She had a plural plaque that is a hallmark finding of asbestos exposure. She passed away two years after her diagnosis. She had worked in various Industries Including extiles and tobacco. She did have exposure to cosmetic talc in two settings. She worked parttime as a harr dresser and she applied talcum powder on her customers necks after she cut their hair. She later used it on herself. She stated there would be a puff of smoke and it went everywhere. Asbestos can linger. It was not confined to one brand. There were 22 brands used. Fortunately, mesothelioma is vary. Around 3,000 new cases are diagnosed in the United States yearly. Unfortunately, its not curable. Five year sur vie svival is les 5 . In 2019, it was stated that asbestos fibers have a thickness of 3 micrometers rr less. Any part of the asbestos thats small enough to be inhaled is three times longer than is wide. It can cause disease including mesothelioma. Using terminology to differeniate whether its cleavagement obviscates the issue. Millions of individuals have been exposed to asbestos. Theres safer alternatives on the market. Thank you. Ill be happy to take questions. Thank you. Votes were called. Were going to finish up the Opening Statements and recess briefly. Good afternoon. Apparently quiet news days are hard to find around here lately so i especially appreciate your presence today and your interest in this important topic. Im a virginian and for most of my life a presbyterian pastor, husband and four of two and more recently a grandfather. At the age of 56, i was diagnosed with rare and deadly type of cancer called peritoneal mesothelioma. Because the only cause is exposure to asbestos, my doctors and others quizzed me about my potential exposure. They asked about the places i had worked and lived and schooled. Where my family members worked and which dorms were my home during my stay at the college. Trying to find some point of exposure to asbestos. They asked hundreds and hundreds of questions but found no explanation. As it turned out my mother was a liberal use of powder. She used it on herself. She used talc based johnson and johnson baby powder on me quite liberally from the day she brought me home from the hospital until the age of three, she and my older sister covered me with baby powder every time that they changed my diaper. As adult, trusting the product that had been used on me for so long, i used johnson and johnson baby powder on myself for a time and my sister also used the powder on herself and now she has ovarian cancer, which makes you wonder, doesnt it. Ive learned when ever talc is mined from the ground it has impurities that are mined along with it including asbestos fibers. It was these fibers that got into my system and migrated to my peritoneal cavity which caused a slow growing tumor that debilitated me at the height of my career. Baby powder contained talc was the source of my asbestos exposure and the cause of the cancer that will kill me. Awaiting treatment, doctors with drew six liters of fluid from my peritoneal cavity. This so i could breathe until the surgery. Dr. Paul sugarbaker performed an 11 hour surgery on me removing my spleen, colon and six and a half pounds of cancer. He washed my insides with a strong solution of chemotherapy and sewed me back together for a 20day stay in the hospital. On my 57th birthday they sent me home with a tube in my arm for the liquid food and antibiotics that would keep me alive. I then endured 15 weeks chemotherapy. I lost 50 pounds. After six months away from the church i e serserved, i returne work. Nine months later more cancer was found. Cancer that cannot be remedied or radiated or cured. I resigned my position and ended the service i felt called to since the age of 16 and i made my preparations to die. I understand that you are all friends who have cancer. I realize that 1600 people die every single day from cancer. Im thankful that mes