Captured by the dutch, been captured again off of a ship. When you look at the journey, there were two different points when they were on ships. We know about this from ship records. We also know about the virginia records this from the virginia records. We know very Little Information about them but we have bits and pieces. We know that they arrived and they were not listed as in slaved, they were servants. We know that they came and they were pretty sick when i got off the ship. They lived in virginia. Some of them had families and were the first generations of africanamericans in this country. Host who were they . Guest there were two or three women and the rest of them were men. They had their own families and they established their own communities in virginia. Tore were middle ages, 17 24. Host how did slavery expand from that point . Guest slavery expanded gradually. It was not an institution initially. But as time went on they saw africans were an good source of labor. I dont like using that phrase. But they cannot run away, they were surviving, unlike native people, who they did try to in slave. Africans werehat slaves. Slavery was an institution that came gradually over time. Host what pushed it to become an institution over time. Guest clearing land, finding crops. Sugar, rice, and other crops that they could use to produce the goods that would be sold in other parts of the world. 1793, two generations later, the invention of the cotton gin. The open of a few lands, the louisiana purchase. You have lands that produced more and more goods. You needed more labor so they continue to bring in more people. Host is that what you meant by the economics of slavery . Guest yes. The economics of slavery has to do with the technology, the crops, the technology that was fueling the markets, the desire to purchase and sell and trade to people was also part of the economics of slavery. Host and they put a price on the slave. How did they do that and why, why was it necessary . Guest every enslaved person was given a value. That was often done for tax purposes. They had to keep track of who they owned. They were given a specific value based on what they could do in a given year. Kind ofased on what labor they thought they could do at the time. Every year that would change if they were sick, if they injured themselves. It was a monetary value, it was an appraisal. At the market they were then given a sale price, or a market value. That was one that was valued to trade when people were negotiating. Those guys were higher than the appraised value, but the market value was based on a particular day. Host are there records . What kind of records show these transactions . Guest one of the first records that we historians use our legible items that planters and flavors had. They kept records of daytoday value of enslaved people, the work they were doing, the weather, the crop, how much rice they were cleaning, tobacco, wheat. Most planters did. Or they would group them by five slaves doing this, seven enslaved doing a particular task. They were very meticulous records. We had records about what they were doing and their valuations. Host what kind of prices were they putting on these people . From zero to 10, when they were young, most boys and girls had the same value. Most wereh century, priced around 100 to 200. Which, todays money, its a lot more than that. We look at the value of enslaved people, we see anywhere from 100 to 5,000 in the 19th century. That in todays number is anywhere from 30 to 200 per person. These were human commodities. How often were they sold and bought . Slavedthe average in person was sold four to five times in a lifetime. Having newey were owners and new people they had to work with. It changed the way they looked at the institution of slavery as well. Host in what way . Guest one had a particular owner you live with most of your life, then if you were sold, you dont know their personalities, you really have to connect and find out what that plantation is like and what the estate of that farm is like. You also had to develop by being away from family members you have lived with. You may have been separated from parents, a cousin, uncle or aunt. It is now a new community and they have to adjust to life in this new space. Host how did the slaves see themselves . Do we know . Thethey know their value, price that people were putting on them . People oftened make comments. We have these from records. From narratives, from personal papers, from abolitionist records, from newspapers. You look at these comments from them and they will say things like, my value is 600, i do not care. The monetary value they put on my body was nothing than that value i had on myself. Value. That the soul it could not be monetized. Aved people felt nobody could touch. Theid not matter what slave owners thought or the market people thought. What matters was the soul. Reading those kind of comments, what impact would that have on you . Guest it had a big impact. Erely to thousands, 2000 we did not think about what they thought. We use many quotes from them. With the cabal what happened from their perspective. What happened while we talk about the Auction Block from their perspective. Now we are looking at these questions and looking for answers. What kind of testimonies are people sharing about what that that about the auctioneers, the owners, being on a ship or being traded. It is very useful information and is very personal. Host the title of your book the price for their pound of flesh the value of the enslaved, from wound to grave. Womb to grave. Enslaved people were price before they were born. They will look at the fertility of a woman and put how many children she could have and how many healthy children she could potentially have. Thinking about that, they were arrived from preconception. They were being valued before they were born. Dissection rong distraction try and understand womans menstrual cycle. Were their menstrual cycles irregular. They would put a warranty on their uterus. Guarantee this woman would have x number of children in an x number of years. If it did not happen they would come to see you. There were cases where they have legal records where they would sue you because women did not give birth. There were personal records in county courthouses. There were posted on flyers throughout the south with the women and their names on it and comments about their fertility. Host astonishing how closely these farmers paid attention, and the detail. Guest this was a market with products. Were,products, but these from their perspective they had to make sure they were maximizing their profits on their labors. They had to make sure they made good investments. All these business terms. The investment would be worth the value they put forth the purchase. Host any stories that stand out from your research . Guest what i talked about their internal value, there soul value. One of my favorite stories was the story of a man named isaac, who is planning a rebellion with other enslaved people. Somehow they found out about it and put him in jail. There were trying to find out who else was involved in the planning of the uprising. He would not tell anybody, they pressured him, they asked questions and he kept saying, take me, i am the one. They sent his minister, who had baptized him and brought him to god, they sent him to the jail and had a conversation. They prayed together and they were crying. He said, is in god a god of the black and the white . He said, why am i held in chains . Where is god . The minister was ashamed to did not know what to say so he left. Gallows getting ready to be hung the next day. They put the rope around his neck. They asked if he had any final words and he said, just take me, i am the one, i will die a noble death if you just take me. Before they raised the floor, he lifted up his feet and hung himself. That is isaacs expression of his soul value because he decided when he would die, how he would die and the moment he died. Host how do we know isaacs words . Guest we know from a newspaper article that was published by a reporter that was at the jail and the institution at the execution. Its quoted that is what he said. What is beauty beautiful is that he was buried by a lagoon. It looks like he had a wife and children that cannot attend the execution. The next day they put flowers at his grave site, they said those Fresh Flowers were there every year until his wife passed away. Another example of soul value. How are and why are comments like slaves being kept track of . How can we find this information . Guest there are a couple of different ways we have enslaved narratives. The Workers Progress Administration of narratives were collected in the 1930s by the government. People were going throughout the south and interviewing slave people. Those were the last living descendents, people in their 80s, 90s and they had recollection of what it was like when they were children. Or they had stories from their parents and grandparents. Those are firsthand accounts. We had narrators published in 1825 through 1880 that were done by abolitionist societies, people told their stories and they were published later. Host the last part of your book, the subtitle, building of a nation, what did you intend . Guest i wanted to think about slave people and how they built the nation. How they cleared the land. How they established community. If it was not for their labor, i will think the United States would be what we are today. Host what are you working on next . Guest i am completing a book with my colleague called a black womans history in the United States. Host tell us a little about it. Study on is africanamericans womens experience in the United States from pre1619 through today. We are looking at women of who came andnt came into new mexico. We are looking at women in spanish florida and new york, and looking at their experiences throughout the United States, and understanding their contributions, and trying to uncover the stories of women we may not have heard of. Host tell us what stands out to you . Guest the opening story of a woman named isabel de lavera. She was part african empire indian. She petitioned the political figure in mexico and asked if she could go on an exhibition to help find new mexico. She was granted permission and went on this journey. We think she made it to new mexico. I think she was one of the first black women to come to the United States later. Berry, thank you for the conversation. Announcer American History tv is on social media. Follow us on cspan history. Tonight on afterwards. , former ciat book Intelligence Analyst offers her insight into the inner workings of the agency and her work in tracking terrorists. She is interviewed by the congressman from indiana. Most people know who Osama Bin Laden is. Who hads another figure a connection to your service. Tell us about your experience tracking him and those around him. I was charged with looking at and valuate it whether or not iraq had anything to do with 9 11 and al qaeda. As an analyst we were writing products for policymakers and our bottom line was, iraq had nothing to do with 9 11 and al qaeda. There was not a connection there. After the invasion, when i became a targeting officer, he rose to prominence because he had been attacking people inside of iraq. Then join al qaeda and created it in iraq. My job was to get to his network. Tonight atterwards 9 00 eastern on book tv on cspan2. [rapping] ust rapout to jsu like a Subway Sandwich cspan cities tours in detroit, learning about its culture. We learn about the history from author m. L. Leibler. [singing blues] right now we are in a place called 54 sound. Basically is the main music studio. This is where George Clinton recorded a number of his albums prior to the