Transcripts For CSPAN3 Acting DHS Secretary Testifies On Bor

The u. S. Southern border. Good morning, everybody. The hearing will come to order. Ill make an Opening Statement and then senator feinstein and i think senator cornyn and durbin would also like to make a statement. Then well swear in the witness and get on with the business before us. Before i make my Opening Statement, there was a meeting last night with senator shelby and senator mcconnell and the republican members of the Appropriations Committee. And theres a lot of talk about the disaster at the border in terms of humanitarian assistance needed yesterday. So i think the game plan is that were going to take the 4. 5 billion that was in the disaster package that was unfortunately taken out and mark it up next week as a standalone proposition to get money flowing to the border to deal with the Housing Conditions and take some stress, not only off the agents, but the migrants. I think it would be money wellspent as 3. 3 billion for humanitarian assistance increases in the shelter capacity for unaccompanied Migrant Children, those in custody, transportation requirements, safe and efficient Processing Centers and other needs. 1. 1 billion for operation and support on the border, which includes personal expenses, voluntary search requirements, detention beds, transportation, investigatory resources dealing with human smuggling and trafficking. 187 million to carry out the needed Information Technology system upgrades and Law Enforcement pay adjustments to manage the ongoing search. So its my understanding that well be marking this up in the Appropriations Committee next week. And that was good news. So today we have acting director mcaleenan. Did i get it right . Close. Kevin. To tell us about whats going on. And i think we all know whats going on. And we all need to come together to fix it. He can tell you better than i, but the numbers are overwhelming. In fiscal year 2019, from october until now, weve had 600,000 people apprehended at the southern border. And all of 2018 fiscal year, it was 300,000. So we have doubled all of 2018 and we have still got months to go. And as you can see from the chart here, theres been 135 increase of apprehensions at the southwest border. 74 increase in unaccompanied minors. 463 increase in family units. That doesnt include everybody, when you include everybody, its 144,278 in may alone. The total in fy19 is 676,315, which is double of what we did in 2018. So somebody needs to ask the question, why . What is happening . What has changed in the last year or so . Heres whats changed. The word is out in Central America, and this is a Central America problem almost exclusively. That if you make it to america, your chances of staying are pretty darn good if you ask for asylum or bring a minor child with you. This is the Spanish Language advertisement. This is how it looks translated in english. How much does it cost to cross the border . In 2016, it was 3 to 8,000. In 2017, its 8 to 16,000 walking through the mountains. If if you take a boat, its going from 10 to 20,000. Small plane, 16,000 to 30. A vehicle utilizing documents belonging to another person is 20 to 25,000. A vehicle utilizing an accompliced immigrant agent is 20 to 25,000. So the market shows the demand is increased. The prices are going up, and people are walking through hell to get here, dealing with smugglers and every known fashion. Thank you. So the bottom line is, until we change our laws in two areas, this never stops, and thats the purpose of this hearing. As to what President Trump was able to negotiate with mexico, i think it will help. But i do not believe its an adequate substitute for us working together in the congress with the Trump Administration to change the laws that create the magnet. And here are the laws we need to change and this is the bill i have introduced and i hope we can get bipartisan support for it. Right now, if you come to america and you claim asylum, youre entitled to a hearing. That hearing is years away. Contrary to what people tell you, most people do not show up for their hearing. We dont have the bed space to hold people, so we dump them out in the country. If you bring a small child with you, since we dont separate families, weve got 20 days to process the claim. We dont have bed space to hold all the families, so we turn them loose by the thousands. So what am i trying to do . Im trying to say, for a period of time here, have a timeout on the current system, and in Central America, you can apply for asylum in the for the United States, but you have to do it in your own country in one of our embassies or consequence latz or set up a facility in mexico or where you can apply for asylum in the United States. But you no longer can do it at our border or in our country. If you change that, i think 90 of this would stop. As to the flores decision, were trying to give 100 days to process family units with a small child. Just cant get it done in 20 days. And equally important, were going to allow sending back unaccompanied minors from Central America as if they came from mexico or canada since these are noncontiguous countries, we dont have the ability to send unaccompanied minors back and we would like to change that. We want 500 new Immigration Judges, because we have a 900,000person backlog in asylum claims. There has to be a breaking point. We have reached the breaking point at the border. I cannot imagine what its like to go to work every are day where half the team are dedicating their time to dealing with family members, minors and all that goes with trying to deal with 600,000 people in your custody. Half of our resources are being directed away from Border Security to dealing with housing people and trying to meet their basic health care needs. The breaking point long past at the border. This is not sustainable, its not fair to those who have the uniform at the United States, Border Patrol, health and Human Services and all the other agents. Ngos who are helping, god bless you. So i just want to make one quick statement. If youre on the border dealing with this problem, youre one of the most patriotic people in this country. Youre not the problem. Were trying to help you to give you more resources and take the pressure off you, because if we dont, there will come a point where well have complete, absolute failure to control our border, and were getting there daily. So this legislation is designed to deal with the crisis. If it got out in Central America, you could no longer apply for asylum in the United States. They would stop coming. This would be a death blow to the smugglers. It got out in the United States, if you bring a small child with you, no longer is that a guarantee that you can stay in the United States. I am willing to help Central Americas economy. I am willing to help President Trump build a wall. I am willing to work on daca. Im willing to do almost anything and everything to fix this mess. But doing nothing is off the table. So we will be marking up this bill next week. And were going to hear from the director, his view of what this legislation would do to fix the problem, describe in detail the nature of the problem, what happens if we do nothing, and hopefully, hopefully this body can rally around a couple ideas that we need more money for humanitarian assistance, that we need to change our laws, we need to help people in Central America. But i would end with this. All the money in the world is not going to fix this problem in Central America, as long as you can get to the United States and not be sent back. Life here is always going to be better than life there. Our goal is to improve life there and get people some hope in their own country. Whats odd about this disaster is that people are not trying to avoid being caught. Theyre looking for the first Border Patrol agents they can find to turn themselves in. A wall will not fix this problem. The only way the wall would fix this problem is to build it in mexico so they would never step afoot in the United States. But once you put one foot in the United States and you claim asylum, we have a major dysfunctional system. So with that, ill turn it over to senator feinstein, and i appreciate the director and all under his charge for doing an incredible job and difficult circumstance. Thanks very much, mr. Chairman. And thank you for scheduling todays hearing. And acting secretary, id like to welcome you here. I see a few circles under your eyes, but i guess that comes with the territory. But welcome. In looking at the numbers, going back to 1925 to 2018, there have been 15 years where we have had more than 1 million intrusions. So its my understanding that were on track to remain below the historic levels of apprehensions we saw in the late 90s and 2000s. If i might, mr. Chairman, id like to submit this for the record. Without objection. Thank you. There have been approximately 600,000 crossings of our southern border so far this year. Border patrol predicts, i understand, that well reach about 1 million crossings before the end of the fiscal year. Just as we have in 15 other years. We have had over a decade where the country has faced these crossings in the past, and so its not unusual that that would happen again. But theres a different population. Right now the crisis thats being talked about by the administration is not how many people are crossing the border, but its really a change in who is coming. This year so far, over 84,000 families have arrived at the border, fleeing to seek asylum in the United States. Whereas previously the country faced border crossings from single adults seeking employment. Thats a big change. These vulnerable parents and children have experienced violence, abuse and poverty in their whole home countries. Particularly the Central American countries affected. The journey north. With john sanders, the acting commissioner of border, who explain that border control, apprehended 144,000 people crossing the border every day, including over 11,000. Its 11,000 in one month. On may 30th, the dhs Inspector General found that Border Patrol facilities are overcrowded. One facility in el paso, senator cornyn, is holding 900 people in a space with a Maximum Capacity of 125. The ig was concerned that this overcrowding represented, and i quote, an immediate risk to the health and safety, not just of the detainees, but also dhs agents and officers. End quote. Acting Commission Sanders told me that children in border facilities, in many facilities, have no cots or beds. Instead they sleep on floors or benches with mylar blankets. Often this can be the case for days and even weeks at a time. Acting commissioner sanders also confirmed that only a few weeks ago, babies and toddlers were sleeping outside, under a bridge in el paso. Entirely exposed to the elements. We also saw firsthand last week that conditions are deplorable for adults in immigration custody. On thursday, the dhs ig issued a report that, quote, observed immediate risks or egregious violations of detention standards, end quote. At i. C. E. Holding facilities across the country. The inspectors found facilities with moldy vents and concluded that immigrants received contaminated and rotten food. Specifically the inspectors found chicken packets open and leaking in a refrigerator in an essex, new jersey, facility. They found spoiled and unwrapped lunch meat in a facility in otalanto, california. Ultimately, immigrants are held in facilities, and this is a quote, that show disregard for human health and safety, end quote. This is unacceptable. Last week, i introduced a bill to uphold the humanitarian standards our laws require. And ensure that immigration cases can be heard quickly and efficiently. The protecting families and improving immigration procedures act would do the following. End the practice of separating families at the border. And ensure children are not separated from their parents. Ensure that families with children are not forced into prolonged detention in order to remain together. Maintain the protections in flores that require children to be treated humanely, given safe places to stay with adequate food and water. Increase the efficiency of our Immigration Courts, while protecting the basic rights of children by adding 450 staff to our Immigration Courts. This includes 75 additional judges, 75 law clerks and 300 total support staff. This is the number given to us by justice as what they need. Its not a number devised by i or my staff. Conserve resources for all Immigration Judges by restoring judicial discretion to prioritize their cases as needed. And finally, this bill includes a key component of senator her hronos bill, which provides counsel for unaccompanied children. This is important, because too often Young Children, including toddlers, have been forced to represent themselves in Immigration Court. How and by whom this Representation Service is provided still needs to be worked out. The legislation addresses the needs of the system in handling the increase in asylum cases while maintaining the basic rights of children. Thanks again to acting secretary mcaleenan for testifying today. I really hope we can find ways to move forward together. I really strongly feel that whatever we do should be bipartisan. I think for this country to separate children can you imagine how your 4, 5 or 6yearold would remember that for the rest of his life or her life and be affected by it . I can. I have seven grandchildren, and its a trauma ytic experience, particularly if you end up on a freeway with a piece of mylar. So i hope, mr. Chairman, your side would be willing to sit down with us and see if we cant work out some bill of of which we as americans can really be proud. Thank you very much. Thanks, senator feinstein. Senator cornyn. Thank you, mr. Chairman, for holding this hearing and secretary mac aleinonen, thank you for being here and for the work you and the troops are doing along the border, dealing with unimaginable set of circumstances. As i was listening to the Opening Statement of my friend, our friend, the ranking member, she talked about how the numbers historically have actually been higher, and so the numbers are down, but we acknowledge the composition of the migrants coming across is different. And its pretty clear to me that the reason for that as the chairman has pointed out, is that the individuals charging 10, 20,000 a person to smuggle them from Central America across mexico into the United States have found a way to exploit the vulnerabilities in our laws, in our legal system. And they are literally flooding the zone. It is no surprise to me that the detention facilities and the individuals who staff those are completely overwhelmed. And i believe previously you have testified, mr. Secretary, that the Customs Officials that ordinarily are responsible for moving legitimate commerce and traffic across our ports of entry have now been redeployed, trying to take care of the show these children and these families. And thats resulted in congestion, longer wait times, and actually threatening the supply chain of a lot of the manufacturing that goes on cross border with mexico. But even as the New York Times has pointed out recently, on sunday, they wrote, its time for congress to stop dithering and pass emergency funding to deal with this nightmare. So far, weve seen no willingness on the part of our democratic colleagues to meet us halfway and to come up with the spending bill that would provide the ability for you and the people that work with you to address this humanitarian crisis. And thats shame on us. It seems to me that the argument the implicit argument is that we really ought not to detain people, we ought to simply wave them through and across the border into the Great American interior. And that we ought not to have any control over our borders or our immigration system. We are the most generous country in the world when it comes to Legal Immigration. We naturalize 1 Million People a year, roughly. But what we are seeing now as a result of the chaos and the hardship and the crisis that has manifested, because we simply have been unwilling as a u. S. Government to deal with the flow of ilLegal Immigration and the moneymaking machine that this represents for the human smugglers. One of the reasons im very pleased that the president was able to negotiate with the secretary of state and others an agreement with mexico to step up their game and deal with more of a flow of migrants from Opening Statement<\/a> and then senator feinstein and i think senator cornyn and durbin would also like to make a statement. Then well swear in the witness and get on with the business before us. Before i make my Opening Statement<\/a>, there was a meeting last night with senator shelby and senator mcconnell and the republican members of the Appropriations Committee<\/a>. And theres a lot of talk about the disaster at the border in terms of humanitarian assistance needed yesterday. So i think the game plan is that were going to take the 4. 5 billion that was in the disaster package that was unfortunately taken out and mark it up next week as a standalone proposition to get money flowing to the border to deal with the Housing Conditions<\/a> and take some stress, not only off the agents, but the migrants. I think it would be money wellspent as 3. 3 billion for humanitarian assistance increases in the shelter capacity for unaccompanied Migrant Children<\/a>, those in custody, transportation requirements, safe and efficient Processing Centers<\/a> and other needs. 1. 1 billion for operation and support on the border, which includes personal expenses, voluntary search requirements, detention beds, transportation, investigatory resources dealing with human smuggling and trafficking. 187 million to carry out the needed Information Technology<\/a> system upgrades and Law Enforcement<\/a> pay adjustments to manage the ongoing search. So its my understanding that well be marking this up in the Appropriations Committee<\/a> next week. And that was good news. So today we have acting director mcaleenan. Did i get it right . Close. Kevin. To tell us about whats going on. And i think we all know whats going on. And we all need to come together to fix it. He can tell you better than i, but the numbers are overwhelming. In fiscal year 2019, from october until now, weve had 600,000 people apprehended at the southern border. And all of 2018 fiscal year, it was 300,000. So we have doubled all of 2018 and we have still got months to go. And as you can see from the chart here, theres been 135 increase of apprehensions at the southwest border. 74 increase in unaccompanied minors. 463 increase in family units. That doesnt include everybody, when you include everybody, its 144,278 in may alone. The total in fy19 is 676,315, which is double of what we did in 2018. So somebody needs to ask the question, why . What is happening . What has changed in the last year or so . Heres whats changed. The word is out in Central America<\/a>, and this is a Central America<\/a> problem almost exclusively. That if you make it to america, your chances of staying are pretty darn good if you ask for asylum or bring a minor child with you. This is the Spanish Language<\/a> advertisement. This is how it looks translated in english. How much does it cost to cross the border . In 2016, it was 3 to 8,000. In 2017, its 8 to 16,000 walking through the mountains. If if you take a boat, its going from 10 to 20,000. Small plane, 16,000 to 30. A vehicle utilizing documents belonging to another person is 20 to 25,000. A vehicle utilizing an accompliced immigrant agent is 20 to 25,000. So the market shows the demand is increased. The prices are going up, and people are walking through hell to get here, dealing with smugglers and every known fashion. Thank you. So the bottom line is, until we change our laws in two areas, this never stops, and thats the purpose of this hearing. As to what President Trump<\/a> was able to negotiate with mexico, i think it will help. But i do not believe its an adequate substitute for us working together in the congress with the Trump Administration<\/a> to change the laws that create the magnet. And here are the laws we need to change and this is the bill i have introduced and i hope we can get bipartisan support for it. Right now, if you come to america and you claim asylum, youre entitled to a hearing. That hearing is years away. Contrary to what people tell you, most people do not show up for their hearing. We dont have the bed space to hold people, so we dump them out in the country. If you bring a small child with you, since we dont separate families, weve got 20 days to process the claim. We dont have bed space to hold all the families, so we turn them loose by the thousands. So what am i trying to do . Im trying to say, for a period of time here, have a timeout on the current system, and in Central America<\/a>, you can apply for asylum in the for the United States<\/a>, but you have to do it in your own country in one of our embassies or consequence latz or set up a facility in mexico or where you can apply for asylum in the United States<\/a>. But you no longer can do it at our border or in our country. If you change that, i think 90 of this would stop. As to the flores decision, were trying to give 100 days to process family units with a small child. Just cant get it done in 20 days. And equally important, were going to allow sending back unaccompanied minors from Central America<\/a> as if they came from mexico or canada since these are noncontiguous countries, we dont have the ability to send unaccompanied minors back and we would like to change that. We want 500 new Immigration Judges<\/a>, because we have a 900,000person backlog in asylum claims. There has to be a breaking point. We have reached the breaking point at the border. I cannot imagine what its like to go to work every are day where half the team are dedicating their time to dealing with family members, minors and all that goes with trying to deal with 600,000 people in your custody. Half of our resources are being directed away from Border Security<\/a> to dealing with housing people and trying to meet their basic health care needs. The breaking point long past at the border. This is not sustainable, its not fair to those who have the uniform at the United States<\/a>, Border Patrol<\/a>, health and Human Services<\/a> and all the other agents. Ngos who are helping, god bless you. So i just want to make one quick statement. If youre on the border dealing with this problem, youre one of the most patriotic people in this country. Youre not the problem. Were trying to help you to give you more resources and take the pressure off you, because if we dont, there will come a point where well have complete, absolute failure to control our border, and were getting there daily. So this legislation is designed to deal with the crisis. If it got out in Central America<\/a>, you could no longer apply for asylum in the United States<\/a>. They would stop coming. This would be a death blow to the smugglers. It got out in the United States<\/a>, if you bring a small child with you, no longer is that a guarantee that you can stay in the United States<\/a>. I am willing to help Central America<\/a>s economy. I am willing to help President Trump<\/a> build a wall. I am willing to work on daca. Im willing to do almost anything and everything to fix this mess. But doing nothing is off the table. So we will be marking up this bill next week. And were going to hear from the director, his view of what this legislation would do to fix the problem, describe in detail the nature of the problem, what happens if we do nothing, and hopefully, hopefully this body can rally around a couple ideas that we need more money for humanitarian assistance, that we need to change our laws, we need to help people in Central America<\/a>. But i would end with this. All the money in the world is not going to fix this problem in Central America<\/a>, as long as you can get to the United States<\/a> and not be sent back. Life here is always going to be better than life there. Our goal is to improve life there and get people some hope in their own country. Whats odd about this disaster is that people are not trying to avoid being caught. Theyre looking for the first Border Patrol<\/a> agents they can find to turn themselves in. A wall will not fix this problem. The only way the wall would fix this problem is to build it in mexico so they would never step afoot in the United States<\/a>. But once you put one foot in the United States<\/a> and you claim asylum, we have a major dysfunctional system. So with that, ill turn it over to senator feinstein, and i appreciate the director and all under his charge for doing an incredible job and difficult circumstance. Thanks very much, mr. Chairman. And thank you for scheduling todays hearing. And acting secretary, id like to welcome you here. I see a few circles under your eyes, but i guess that comes with the territory. But welcome. In looking at the numbers, going back to 1925 to 2018, there have been 15 years where we have had more than 1 million intrusions. So its my understanding that were on track to remain below the historic levels of apprehensions we saw in the late 90s and 2000s. If i might, mr. Chairman, id like to submit this for the record. Without objection. Thank you. There have been approximately 600,000 crossings of our southern border so far this year. Border patrol predicts, i understand, that well reach about 1 million crossings before the end of the fiscal year. Just as we have in 15 other years. We have had over a decade where the country has faced these crossings in the past, and so its not unusual that that would happen again. But theres a different population. Right now the crisis thats being talked about by the administration is not how many people are crossing the border, but its really a change in who is coming. This year so far, over 84,000 families have arrived at the border, fleeing to seek asylum in the United States<\/a>. Whereas previously the country faced border crossings from single adults seeking employment. Thats a big change. These vulnerable parents and children have experienced violence, abuse and poverty in their whole home countries. Particularly the Central America<\/a>n countries affected. The journey north. With john sanders, the acting commissioner of border, who explain that border control, apprehended 144,000 people crossing the border every day, including over 11,000. Its 11,000 in one month. On may 30th, the dhs Inspector General<\/a> found that Border Patrol<\/a> facilities are overcrowded. One facility in el paso, senator cornyn, is holding 900 people in a space with a Maximum Capacity<\/a> of 125. The ig was concerned that this overcrowding represented, and i quote, an immediate risk to the health and safety, not just of the detainees, but also dhs agents and officers. End quote. Acting Commission Sanders<\/a> told me that children in border facilities, in many facilities, have no cots or beds. Instead they sleep on floors or benches with mylar blankets. Often this can be the case for days and even weeks at a time. Acting commissioner sanders also confirmed that only a few weeks ago, babies and toddlers were sleeping outside, under a bridge in el paso. Entirely exposed to the elements. We also saw firsthand last week that conditions are deplorable for adults in immigration custody. On thursday, the dhs ig issued a report that, quote, observed immediate risks or egregious violations of detention standards, end quote. At i. C. E. Holding facilities across the country. The inspectors found facilities with moldy vents and concluded that immigrants received contaminated and rotten food. Specifically the inspectors found chicken packets open and leaking in a refrigerator in an essex, new jersey, facility. They found spoiled and unwrapped lunch meat in a facility in otalanto, california. Ultimately, immigrants are held in facilities, and this is a quote, that show disregard for human health and safety, end quote. This is unacceptable. Last week, i introduced a bill to uphold the humanitarian standards our laws require. And ensure that immigration cases can be heard quickly and efficiently. The protecting families and improving immigration procedures act would do the following. End the practice of separating families at the border. And ensure children are not separated from their parents. Ensure that families with children are not forced into prolonged detention in order to remain together. Maintain the protections in flores that require children to be treated humanely, given safe places to stay with adequate food and water. Increase the efficiency of our Immigration Court<\/a>s, while protecting the basic rights of children by adding 450 staff to our Immigration Court<\/a>s. This includes 75 additional judges, 75 law clerks and 300 total support staff. This is the number given to us by justice as what they need. Its not a number devised by i or my staff. Conserve resources for all Immigration Judges<\/a> by restoring judicial discretion to prioritize their cases as needed. And finally, this bill includes a key component of senator her hronos bill, which provides counsel for unaccompanied children. This is important, because too often Young Children<\/a>, including toddlers, have been forced to represent themselves in Immigration Court<\/a>. How and by whom this Representation Service<\/a> is provided still needs to be worked out. The legislation addresses the needs of the system in handling the increase in asylum cases while maintaining the basic rights of children. Thanks again to acting secretary mcaleenan for testifying today. I really hope we can find ways to move forward together. I really strongly feel that whatever we do should be bipartisan. I think for this country to separate children can you imagine how your 4, 5 or 6yearold would remember that for the rest of his life or her life and be affected by it . I can. I have seven grandchildren, and its a trauma ytic experience, particularly if you end up on a freeway with a piece of mylar. So i hope, mr. Chairman, your side would be willing to sit down with us and see if we cant work out some bill of of which we as americans can really be proud. Thank you very much. Thanks, senator feinstein. Senator cornyn. Thank you, mr. Chairman, for holding this hearing and secretary mac aleinonen, thank you for being here and for the work you and the troops are doing along the border, dealing with unimaginable set of circumstances. As i was listening to the Opening Statement<\/a> of my friend, our friend, the ranking member, she talked about how the numbers historically have actually been higher, and so the numbers are down, but we acknowledge the composition of the migrants coming across is different. And its pretty clear to me that the reason for that as the chairman has pointed out, is that the individuals charging 10, 20,000 a person to smuggle them from Central America<\/a> across mexico into the United States<\/a> have found a way to exploit the vulnerabilities in our laws, in our legal system. And they are literally flooding the zone. It is no surprise to me that the detention facilities and the individuals who staff those are completely overwhelmed. And i believe previously you have testified, mr. Secretary, that the Customs Officials<\/a> that ordinarily are responsible for moving legitimate commerce and traffic across our ports of entry have now been redeployed, trying to take care of the show these children and these families. And thats resulted in congestion, longer wait times, and actually threatening the supply chain of a lot of the manufacturing that goes on cross border with mexico. But even as the New York Times<\/a> has pointed out recently, on sunday, they wrote, its time for congress to stop dithering and pass emergency funding to deal with this nightmare. So far, weve seen no willingness on the part of our democratic colleagues to meet us halfway and to come up with the spending bill that would provide the ability for you and the people that work with you to address this humanitarian crisis. And thats shame on us. It seems to me that the argument the implicit argument is that we really ought not to detain people, we ought to simply wave them through and across the border into the Great American<\/a> interior. And that we ought not to have any control over our borders or our immigration system. We are the most generous country in the world when it comes to Legal Immigration<\/a>. We naturalize 1 Million People<\/a> a year, roughly. But what we are seeing now as a result of the chaos and the hardship and the crisis that has manifested, because we simply have been unwilling as a u. S. Government to deal with the flow of ilLegal Immigration<\/a> and the moneymaking machine that this represents for the human smugglers. One of the reasons im very pleased that the president was able to negotiate with the secretary of state and others an agreement with mexico to step up their game and deal with more of a flow of migrants from Central America<\/a> across their border is because, obviously, congress has failed to act to provide you and officials the tools you need in order to stop this on your own. So the president has had to resort to these diplomatic efforts with mexico. Well find out whether the 144,000 that the chairman mentioned that came across the border in may, whether those numbers go down in the coming weeks and months. I hope they do. That will be the best evidence of whether this works or not. But theres absolutely no justification whatsoever for congress to sit on the sidelines and watch as this crisis continues to unfold. Originally, we were told there is no emergency, there is no crisis at the border. But obviously responsible people like former secretary of Homeland Security<\/a> under the obama administration, jeh johnson, have said unequivocally, there is a crisis at the border. As you have said previously, president obama in 2014 called it a humanitarian and security crisis. And its just getting worse and worse as congress sits on its hands and does absolutely nothing to give you the tools you need in order to stop this crisis and to address it. And thats shameful. As you know, mr. Secretary mcalien, senator, i have introduced legislation alongside the chairman, called the humane act with my friend and colleague, a democrat from laredo, texas, called a humane act, and many elements are in common with those in the legislation that the chairman has offered. But i hope we can finally come to grips with this crisis and we can do our job on a bipartisan, bicameral basis and provide you and the men and women you represent the tools they need in order to secure our borders and deal with this humanitarian crisis in a compassionate and lawful way. So far, we have been awol. And thats shameful. I hope well change. Senator durbin. Thanks, mr. Chairman. What we see at our border is not just bad luck or a oneoff phenomena. It is the predictable result of this administrations chosen path on immigration. Make no mistake, donald trump takes pride in being the most anti immigrant president in modern history. And at the same time, his Border Security<\/a> strategy is producing the worst results in our history. Lets look at the highlights. The muslim travel ban created chaos at airports across the United States<\/a> and continues to separate thousands of american families. The repeal of daca threatened 800,000 young immigrants with deportation to countries they barely remember. The termination of temporary protected status endangers another 300,000 immigrants. The disastrous separation of infants, toddlers and Young Children<\/a> from their families at our border finally stopped by the courts. The longest Government Shutdown<\/a> in the history of the United States<\/a>, which paralyzed our Immigration Court<\/a>s for six weeks. The tragic deaths of six children who were apprehended at the border and 24 people in immigration detention. And now and now, public reports of attempted suicides by detainees being held in abject, inhumane conditions. The blocking of all assistance to northern triangle countries, el salvador, guatemala, honduras, and driving more refugees to our border. And a gaping leadership vacuum at the department of Homeland Security<\/a>. In less than twoandahalf years, there have already been four heads of this department. We have before us today an acting secretary who has been on the job for more than two months. We cannot face this crisis effectively with the revolving door policy in the leadership of the department of Homeland Security<\/a>. In fact, every position at dhs with responsibility for immigration or Border Security<\/a> is now being held by a temporary appointee who has not been confirmed by the senate. The white house has not even submitted nominations for these positions. Despite all of President Trump<\/a>s tough talk and meanness, our southern border today, by every measurable standard, is much less secure than when he took office. Look at the numbers. In just the last three months, more people have been apprehended at the border than in all of fiscal year 2017. We have to acknowledge the obvious. President trumps immigration and Border Security<\/a> policies are certifiable failures, and we have learned we cannot count on his administration to work with this unrational immigration policy. This committee, the Senate Judiciary<\/a> committee, must assert its constitutional authority. Im hopeful, because i know this chairman, ive worked with this chairman on bipartisan immigration solutions. We were partners in the gang of eight. We wrote a comprehensive immigration bill which passed the senate six years ago. In 2013, by a margin of 6832. A bipartisan bill. Republican senator lamar alexander, who supported our 2013 bill, was right when he recently said, and i quote, if that bill had become law, most of the problems were having today we wouldnt be having. Last year, chairman graham and i crafted a bipartisan agreement, including robust Border Security<\/a> funding and dozens of provisions to strengthen Border Security<\/a>. President trump rejected it. Instead, pushed for a hard line plan with the largest reduction in Legal Immigration<\/a> in almost a century. The senate rejected the trump bill by a bipartisan super majority. Chairman graham and i also were the lead sponsors of the dream act, which would address the daca crisis by President Trump<\/a>. However, as i told the chairman, at this moment the bill that he brings before the committee is one that i cannot currently support, but want to work with him to see if there is a middle ground. Thats why we were sent here. This bill in and of itself i dont believe being proposed by the chairman will solve the crisis at the border. But let it be a starting point. I dont like the fact that this bill would overturn critical humanitarian protections for children, subjecting them to even longer detention and deportation without due process. There is no evidence to deter desperate families from fleeing to our border. And the bill before us provides no assurance that children will be humanely treated or be safe once they are deported. This does nothing to address the root causes that are causing migrants to flee their homes in record numbers. Instead, i would ask the chairman to work with democrats on a bipartisan, smart, effective and humane answer to this challenge. Which would include, assistance to stabilize the northern triangle. Cracking down on the traffickers that are exploiting immigrants. Incountry processing so that migrants can find safe haven without making that dangerous trek to our border. And eliminating Immigration Court<\/a> backlogs so asylum claims can be processed more quickly. Mr. Chairman, this isnt deemed a crisis. It is a test of our meddle as members of the United States<\/a> senate. But its also a test of this nation of immigrants. We are writing a record we will have to explain to the next generation. The zero tolerance policy. We cannot return to that inhumane approach, that deterrent approach, as some call it, at the expense of our values as a nation. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Thanks, senator durbin. Would you please rise and raise your right hand . The testimony youre about to give will be the truth, do you solemnly swear the testimony you are about to give to the committee and the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth so help you god . I do. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Appreciate the opportunity to appear before you again today. I think this hearing is timely and important. As legislative solutions are essential to addressing the unprecedented security and humanitarian crisis were facing on our southern border. Its been over 18 months since the administration asked for the legislative fixes that would have prevented the Current Crisis<\/a> and 40 days since we asked for the emergency funding necessary to manage it. In the last 40 days, 60,000 children have entered into dhs custody, both unaccompanied as part of family units. Last month, as you noted, mr. Chairman, we encountered a modern record of 144,000 border crossers, a record day of over 5,800 border crossings in a single 24hour period. And the Largest Single Group<\/a> ever apprehended at our border, 1,036 individuals. The funding requested in the emergency supplemental, and thank you for the news on the progress on this bill, would be applied within weeks to provide additional facilities for health and Human Services<\/a> to prevent children from having to wait in Border Patrol<\/a> stations and to improve the care of those in dhs custody, while providing Operational Support<\/a> and funding for the men and women of dhs managing the crisis. Without it, dhs will not be able to provide appropriate facilities and care. Migrants will remain in custody at the border longer than necessary. And dhs will ultimately need to reprogram funding carefully appropriated by congress from other critical Homeland Security<\/a> priorities. The impact of that reprogramming will be significant, and affect nearly every component of the department. I want to make clear, this crisis is unlike anything we have ever seen at our border, and it in large part is due to the gaps in our Immigration Law<\/a>s that are driving it, causing a dramatic demographic shift in the flow of ilLegal Immigration<\/a> to the United States<\/a> that is placing children at unique and critical risk. Historically, the vast majority of arriving aliens were single adult males from mexico who could be quickly detained and removed. Now the majority of family units and unaccompanied children, in fact, 42 , were associated with unaccompanied children and family units. These populations require additional care and processing and cannot be effectively repatriated, even if they do not have a valid immigration or asylum claim. In that group of 1,036, all of the members were from guatemala, honduras or el salvador. The group included 900 family units, over 60 unaccompanied children and just under 40 single adults. Thats indicative of the crisis were facing. To put this moment in context, cvps total Enforcement Actions<\/a> in may are more than six times higher in may 2017 and two times higher over the may average of the past seven years. Any men and women on the border can tell you that dhs facilities are overflowing, resources are stretched thin with up to 50 of our agents assigned to processing, transport, medical care, and hospital watch, not securing our border. These increased border numbers and specifically the dramatic increase in family units are a direct response to the weaknesses in our laws that are wellknown and exploited by smugglers, just like the advertisements that the chairman referenced and put children at risk. The administration is doing everything within our power to restore the border to our immigration system, including new agreements with mexico and guatemala designed to reduce the flow reaching the u. S. Border. We will continue to take all available action within our authorities and resources to mitigate the crisis. As part of the business model, smugglers and traffickers who are profiting to the tune of 3 billion a year are smuggling children in inhumane and dangerous conditions and demanding extraordinary sums of money. We have identified now more than 4,800 family units that were fraudulent as they presented at the border. We have uncovered multiple child smuggling rings where children are being used multiple times by different adults to gain illegal entry into the United States<\/a>. We routinely hear from migrants and see advertisements on the radio in local news and social media and by flyers and business cards advising that if you bring a child, you will not be deported. A gentleman in guatemala two weeks ago i met talked about his daughter leaving with her child this year and he said Everybody Knows<\/a> that a child is a passport for migration to the United States<\/a>. The weaknesses in our laws now represent the most significant factors affecting Border Security<\/a> and are allowing the cycle of misery to continue. We are asking for narrow and targeted changes to our laws that restore integrity to the immigration system and remove the the incentives for families and children to cross our border illegally. We cannot obtain effective Immigration Enforcement<\/a> results for the families arriving at our border. Instead, they cannot be held longer than 21 days and do not receive rules for years. The asylum standards are also misaligned with a significant difference between the number of migrants who meet the initial credible fear bar but do not have a valid asylum claim at the end of court proceedings. These types of changes were recommended by the Homeland Security<\/a> Advisory Council<\/a> task force, a bipartisan panel, led by experts from across the political spectrum. This legislation proposed by chairman graham would address these you will havulnerabilitie the crisis. And i appreciate the introduction of this important bill. I look forward to continuing to work with the chairman and members of this committee on this legislation, and i look forward to the committees questions. Thank you for the job that youre doing. The pull factors. Very simply, what are they . Very simply, its our inability to get immigration results for families and to guarantee that unaccompanied children if they come from other than mexico and canada cannot be repatriated and that our asylum system is so back logged that if you meet the initial credible fear bar, youll be release and had allowed to stay in the u. S. Until a Court Hearing<\/a> that could be years away. So the Advisory Committee<\/a> report in april of this year, bipartisan said, by far the major pull factor in the Current Practice<\/a> is the Current Practice<\/a> of releasing with a notice to appear. Most Illegal Migrants<\/a> who bring a child with them. Is that accurate . Absolutely. So what would we need to do is more time to process claims involving minors. Yes. We dont break up families, right . Correct. So if we release the minor, then we release the entire family, right . That is right. We dont have bed space to hold them for their hearing. Were not allowed to hold them long enough for their hearing. Past 20 days, the minor has to be released, we choose to release the whole family, and we lease them into the interior of the United States<\/a>, is that correct . That is correct. And everybody in Central America<\/a> knows that. It is widely known, yes. So the best thing you can do is find a minor child to go with you and claim that person to be part of your family, is that correct . Thats correct. And thats why were seeing enormous numbers of fraudulent cases. That will never stop until we change our laws. Is that your testimony here today . That is my testimony. What mexico is doing is helpful, but its not an adequate substitute for congress acting, is that correct . I agree with that. So mexico cannot solve this problem by itself. Right. As to asylum claims, we have 900,000 backlogged, is that correct . Its 900,000 cases in Immigration Court<\/a>s. Over 350,000 asylum cases. Okay, 350,000 900,000 back logged. 350,000 are asylum claims. Correct. Tell the country what happens when you get here from Central America<\/a> and you claim asylum. Very briefly, what happens . So as a family unit, as you have already noted, mr. Chairman, youre going to be released because you cant be held more than 20 days. And we have to have due process and a fair hearing. For single adults, youll be held pending the termination of whether you have a fear of return. If you meet that bar, and 87 do meet the initial bar of credible fear from Central America<\/a>, youll either be held or bonded out by an immigration judge pending a final adjudication. If youre a child, you will be trfd to hhs and go through a process to be placed with a sponsor in the United States<\/a>. So if youre an asylumseeker from Central America<\/a>, and you claim asylum in the United States<\/a>, youre not going to get sent back to Central America<\/a> any time soon, is that correct . Unless youre a single adult, it is very unlikely that youll be repatriated. What percentage of people show up for the asylum hearing . So it depends on the demographics, the court, but we see too many cases where people are not showing up. We did an expedited pilot with family units this year with i. C. E. And Immigration Court<\/a>s. Out of those 7,000 cases, 90 received final orders of removal in absentia. 90 . 90 did not show up . Correct. Okay. That is a recent sample from families crossing the border. So if we changed our laws to say the following, you cannot apply for asylum if youre from Central America<\/a> in the United States<\/a>. You must do it in your home country or maybe mexico, if we can get a deal with mexico. What effect does that have on this problem . So first of all, it would break the back of the smuggling organization. Theyre profiting from this cycle. It would provide access to asylum incountry in a much safer manner than taking this dangerous journey, and it would stop this flow immediately. How much of it would stop, do you believe . I believe the vast majority would stop. Were looking at about 30 of single adults, criminals and smugglers. The other 70 are presenting themselves if we made those two changes, extend the flores decision to 100 days, so we would have time to process these people and not release them into the interior of the country, change our asylum laws, do you think 90 of the flow from Central America<\/a> would stop overnight . I think between 70 and 90 would stop, yes. Okay. As to the humanitarian assistance were talking about, is it needed . Its humanitarian do you need the money . The 4. 5 billion is essential. 3. 3 billion is for health and Human Services<\/a>, simply to provide appropriate care for children arriving unaccompanied. What percentage of the force now is dealing with the problems of taking care of people versus guarding the border . So in our key sectors, were up to 50 on some days. 50 of the force is now dealing with the problem of dealing with migrants, providing them care, food and clothing and medical assistance, versus dealing with trafficking and drugs and the other duties youre assigned, is that correct . Thats correct. If we do nothing, what will it be like next year . So, this escalating set of crossings from 60,000 a month for the first three months of this year, when i came to this committee in december, i testified about a peak day of 3,029. We had 5, 800 cross the last week of may. We have gone to 144,000, divorced from the seasonal averages and processes we have seen in the past. I do not know how high it will go in terms of the number of families that are willing to come to the u. S. And want to come to the u. S. For a better opportunity right now. But you do know that if we do not change the pull factors, theyre going to keep coming. Yes. Right . This crisis will worsen and deepen. And a wall has no effect on this. Theyre want to go get captured, is that correct . Correct. The wall is for the Border Security<\/a> problem. The adults trying to evade capture, the smugglers and the criminals. So these people are looking for the first Border Patrol<\/a> agent they can find to turn themselves in. Walking directly up to uniformed agents, yes. So will President Trump<\/a> sign my bill if it was passed . I believe that he has already said in the rose garden when he announced the broader package of immigration changes for the congress to consider that your bill would be directly targeted to crisis and would help address the flow. Very quickly, senator feinstein has some legislation. Did you follow what she was saying . I did. Do you agree that some of those things would be good for you and your agents . I think additional judges and support staff is really critical. We have the attorneys. Thats an important piece. I think we could talk about the training for dealing with children. Do you think that more money wisely spent to Central America<\/a> may help the underlying cause . If we have targeted investments with accountable partners, i do think so. And were doing that right now with our security efforts. Thank you. Senator leahy. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Thank you, senator feinstein. It is interesting hearing about allowing this to become so politicized. After republicans blocked money for months, and we were trying to put forth to help with the border. And even when we had a bipartisan bill, republicans took that out a few weeks ago. Its kind of hard to blame democrats. But we did come together a few years ago, when i was chairman of this committee. Republicans and democrats worked on the immigration bill senator graham was central to that. Senator durbin. Senator alexander said had we put it into law, we would be a lot better off. I would note even though we passed by an overwhelming bipartisan majority in the senate, the republican speaker of the house said they couldnt bring it up, because it required a bipartisan vote and that would violent the sacred Dennis Haster<\/a> rule. They were so impressed and wanted to honor Dennis Haster<\/a>, they wouldnt allow it to come forth. Think about that. Now, were willing to put the money we support ensuring dhs can care for unaccompanied minors. We have supported ensuring that cbp can safely process migrants seeking refuge. We just want basic standards of humanitarian care. Now, whether supplemental is up to the administration. You have if they continue to block bipartisan legislation, nothing happens. I hope the republicans will finally realize, we have to do this, republicans and democrats, together. And not block like even a couple weeks ago. We want longterm. Now, President Trump<\/a> recently cut off 500 million in aid that we approved over 14 months ago aimed at reducing gang violence, alleviating poverty, approving the rule of law in the northern triangle. Both republicans and democrats have pointed out this makes a bad situation worse. Now, youve said that the u. S. Is formalizing a number of initiatives to limit pushback. Would you agree that its critical we provide the targeted days that congress previously appropriated in a bipartisan way to address these root causes of migration . A couple key points. Good to see you, senator leahy. I have testified in front of this committee before that i believe a multipronged solution involves working with the governments Central America<\/a> on the push factors. The specific piece that you just referenced about anti gang initiatives, the attorney general just went to Central America<\/a> three weeks ago, and those programs are restarted. Theyre going to continue to be funded. They were blocked for a long time after a bipartisan bill passed. And we have nonprofits that have stepped in to assist. They do extraordinary work. If i could just add, senator, the other programs youre referencing, theyre frozen, but theyre under review to make sure there is a return on investment, theyre targeted in a way that will actually address the push factors and we can partner with the Central America<\/a>n governments to be effective. Basically, even though we had a bipartisan majority, youre saying no. Interesting. We want to make sure they were. Well never find out, will we . Catholic charities is helping a lot. What of if these nonprofits are no longer able to provide services . Would that hinder you . I met with Catholic Charities<\/a> the week before last in guatemala. There are concerns about programs frozen. And thats the kind of consideration well be looking at with the frozen funding to see whats working and if we are able to continue. Are they helpful . I think a number of these programs have been helpful and we have to ensure were investing in the right ones. I want to make sure were doing the right thing too. Ive heard that i. C. E. Has deported many veterans, people who have served in the military, served our country in the military. And they have rules requiring such removal decision be approved by senior officials. They werent. Now, i understand that President Trump<\/a> said that everyone is a priority for removal. And he doesnt understand what its like to serve in the military. He had the ability because of his position to avoid the draft five times. There are people who have served our country, many in very dangerous places. They have had to protect our country. And i. C. E. Is deporting them without being approved by senior officials. Is that wrong . So ive been briefed on that ga report result, senator, and im not aware of deportations that werent approved by the senior official in accordance with the policy. Ill follow up on that, but well, the report said that many of the deportations occurred without a required additional screening, because i. C. E. Was unaware of its policies. But youre saying that they did do the additional screening . They did hire officials that contracts the gao report . Which is right . Ill follow up on that piece of the question. What i can tell you is that all of those individuals who were deported had felony criminal offenses, some of them very serious. And it was assessed by i. C. E. Before they were deported. And i do respect their service. We respect the service of all vernt veterans, but you have to make sure youre protecting 9 communities under the Immigration Law<\/a>s. You said almost 4,800 migrants have reported as family fraudulent units this year. Is that people who have familial relationships, other than people with grandparents or siblings . Were talking about individuals who presented an adult child relationship as a parent or guardian. Thats the primary focus there. I would just like to add, we have put 400 hsi investigators down in our key stations in el paso and rvg. They have only been there five weeks, done 1,000 interviews to date, and identified 242 cases of fraud and 504 fraudulent documents. We also did a dna pilot for three days. Only 109 families. 17 cases where the parent or guaranteeding was not representing and admitted they were not related. One individual was a 51yearold who had paid 80 to rent a 6monthold child to come to the border. Were very concerned about the incidents of fraud, we think its caused by the fact they know if they come as a family, theyll get special treatment at the border. Mr. Chairman, as i said, when you were nominated, you offered you a congratulations and condolences. But frankly, im glad youre there. Thank you. Im glad youre there, too. Senator grassley. First of all, mr. Chairman, id like to enter into the record, and ill describe it right here. For articles about child suggest willi smuggling across the border. One referenced a gault mallan woman who said she rented out or recycled children 13 times for smuggling across the border with payment of 1500 a child. Without objection. Mr. Secretary, thank you for being here. I wrote a letter to then secretary nielsen about a 13yearold girl from guatemala who was seeking entry into the United States<\/a>. This girl was ununaccompanied by an unrelated adult male who named to be her father. His name was ramon pedro. Pedro convinced the girls mother he would take her and provide her a job. An insufficient bed space, they had to be released after 20 days. Over a month later, both pedro and the girl were admitted to a hospital in fresno. At the hospital, doctors discovered the girl had been viciously sexual satellited by this man while she was in his company. Please arrest the man for rape and child endangerment. As you know, mr. Secretary, this happens all too often. So where are we today . Over 600,000 apprehensions so far this year. Cbp facilities are beyond crisis level. I. C. E. Has been forced to release hundreds of thousands of people into the country without status. Hhs facilities of unaccompanied children are beyond capacity. B the house of representatives proposed by the democrats have now proposed a spending bill that slashes the department of Homeland Security<\/a> resources to carry out your mission as assigned to you by this congress. It seems washington has all of a sudden lost all common sense. Mr. Second, i have littmited time, only three or four minutes left. So answer yes or no to these questions. I. C. E. And cbp officials have talked to me about child resick willing, or trafficking the same children back and forth across our dr. Border to help adults gain entry. Is it true that the flores and other loopholes have incentivized child smuggling and child recycling . Yes. Will dna testing allow dhs to determine what family units are fake and in doing so protect the safety and health of my minor myth Migrant Children<\/a> . Yes, we believe it will help. This winter, congress underfunded your department, limited i. C. E. Enforcement ability and cut space. Did these cuts help the department, the American People<\/a> or the migrants . No. Did these cuts make the problem at our border worse . Yes. Does recycling interages energies shaving no, but restricting information sharing about potential sponsors for unaccompanied children, make unaccompanied children safer . No. Senator blackburn, polling and cotton and i have a bill that requires information sharing between dhs and dhhs. Would this improve governments ability to provide a safe and secure home for children. Yes, it would. And i believe senator cornyn has a similar bill. Now, in the few minutes i have left, its kind of outrageous to me, we hear all this talk. And yet we have these obvious mistreatment of children, recycling of children. Being paid to do it. Probably the cartel benefit from it. And there isnt to be the outrage o there out to be. Theyre always finding something wrong that the president is doing. Its just ought oijous. And its outrageous that we cant pass legislation to correct this. And somehow, you know, passing a lit bit of legislation, stopping recycling as an example. That that would be so important that you wouldnt worry about having a bipartisan agreement to get a bill passed. I yield babbling tck the balanc time. Senator feinstein. Mr. Mcaleenan. June 26th will be the oneyear anniversary of the court order requiring reunification of families who were separated under the trump zero tolerance policy last year. How many children, mr. Mcalien, have been separated from their parents since june 26th of last year . So, and thank you, because it was actually june 20th, the president s executive order that ended t. June 26th was the court order, and we have been complying with both directions, both the president and the court order, ever since. Its about him a year, almost. During that time, about. 36 of those families crossing have been separated. Do you have a number of children separated . 36 doesnt do it. We can do the math for you, senator. But were talking about between one and five families a day when we have seen obviously in the last year 1,500 to 3,500 families crossing on average. So its a very rare circumstance. It happens only for the safety and a welfare of the child where we have a concern about abuse or neglect, where there is a communicable disease, an emergency medical issue or serious criminal prosecution unrelated to the unlawful border crossing. I just want a hard number. Be happy to get that for you. Which i cant find anywhere of how many children have been separated since june 26. Would be happy to get that for you, senator. I will hold you to it. Okay. John sanders, acting commissioner of customs and Border Protection<\/a>, i mentioned told me last week that children have no cots or beds, kids are sleeping on floors or benches with mylar blankets. Children were sleeping outside under a bridge in el paso. And my understanding is six have died in the past year while in immigration custody. Wilbur ramirez in may after he and his mother were released. Was Wilbur Ramirez<\/a> one ever those detained under the el paso bridge . I dont know the answer to that question. I would like to get the answer, please. Thank you. Are regular screenings for all children by staff with pediatric training occurring . If not, why not . So weve dramatically increased our medical care at Border Patrol<\/a> stations and ports of entry. With the support of the fy19 bill, its proven inadequate to the flow. We have gone from about 20 medical professionals supporting us at the border to over 200, and were continuing to expand that care. Theyre not all pediatricians, though. Were talking about certified medical practitioners, although we have sought advice from pediatricians from the Homeland Security<\/a> Advisory Council<\/a> and from sanders efforts to engage in the community to make sure were providing the right screenings as people arrive at the border. Can you tell me where those 200 are based . I can give you a breakdown by station and port of entry. Can you do that, please . I can do that. I would be happy to go myself and take a look. Okay. Youre also going to see uniformed health professionals, coast guard medical core. This is a whole of government effort to protect children in this flow. If i could add one other point, senator, you mentioned the conditions in our custody. With respect, i testified to inappropriate conditions in our custody in december when we were at 60,000. Ive gone on record in the press conference. On march 27th, at the border right next to that under over pass saying this is unacceptable. The border is at its breaking point. We need help, legislation, additional fund. Secretary nielsen sent a letter asking congress to support change in the law and additional funds to address the crisis. We sent 40 days ago our supplemental requests, which would alleviate conditions and it has not been responded to. So i share your concern about these conditions. I have been raising that for months on end. June of last year was the first time i called this a border and humanitarian crisis. June of last year. And we have not seen action. Respectfully. Let me say one thing. We have met i am very impressed by your sincerity. I may be foolish, but i dont think i am. And i thank you for that. I think weve got misunderstanding, but weve also got a huge problem with these families and children. And i think that everything you can do to see that theyre linked up with their parents and the trauma of whats happening to them is reduced to the smallest extent possible. Its really what americans should do. Children should not be the victims in all of this. Adults are somewhat different. But children should not. Has dhs conducted a review of conditions at i. C. E. Detention facilities . This is a comprehensive review process thats managed both within the i. C. E. Component as well as at the Inspector General<\/a>s level, office of civil rights and Civil Liberties<\/a> and in response to various court orders. Their standards are very high. We do have issues from time to time. The issues that were identified in the recent gao report, the major ones were corrected immediately and were on path to make corrections to all of the issues identified. So you yes. What is the period . I can get you the entire review policy for i. C. E. Would you please . Yes. There are requirements i think that would be a good thing for us to take a look at. Annually at various levels. Thank you. And what steps are taken to correct violations . So very tailored steps to address the specific violation. Some things are harder than others, right . If you have a situation where the standards require a drain in the barber shop or a specific type of law library, sometimes those are harder to correct over time. But these are the kind of standards and violations were hearing about. Any issue that affects a safety of detainees is addressed immediately. Okay. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Very quickly, senator lee is next. What are the conditions like on the journey itself . They can be tremendously horrific and dangerous. Any medical personnel on the journey between Central America<\/a> . No, smugglers are not very concerned about the welfare of the people theyre trafficking. So when they get here, we would like to make it better, because its inadequate by our standards. But compared to the journey itself, dont you think we need to stop these journeys . Of course. Yeah, we actually see tremendous relief, this is the first safe place these people have been in for weeks on end. Senator lee. Thank you very much, mr. Chairman. Thank you for your service, mr. Mcaleenan. Weve got over 40 140,000 migrants apprehended in may alone. There was unquestionably a problem at our border. Its a crisis. Its not a manufactured crisis. Its not a fake crisis. Its not a crisis that is exaggerated. If anything, its been understated. So i think its time for us to fix the problem and in order to fix the problem, i think we have to fix our laws. Tragically, many in congress have been unwilling to fix the underlying problem. Indeed, even after President Trump<\/a> took significant steps toward addressing the problem with our laws the last few days, some have responded, even within congress, by mocking his efforts. And so i dont think this is a good time for flippancy or for political attacks. We need to get to work to restore the integrity, the manageability of our asylum system. Because of the flores Settlement Agreement<\/a> and other loopholes, only 3. 5 of unaccompanied alien children who enter this country are removed and sent back to their home countries. Acting secretary mcaleenan, do you have any doubt that such a low removal rate tends to incentivize more migration, and more illegal smuggling of these minors . I dont have any doubt. I know its a direct cause. And a related problem is that the humanitarian needs of those who were being used as pawns in this Massive International<\/a> Human Trafficking<\/a> racket also burdened dhs operations. In other words, as we have to devote 40 of the Border Patrol<\/a>s resources to addressing these humanitarian issues, it creates other problems. Do you think that with cbp being forced to use its own scarce resources to process and care for Asylum Seekers<\/a>, are the cartels by chance having an easier time bringing dangerous narcotics and other bad things into our communities . We know they are. Its a specific tactic we have seen used in five different sectors on the border where cartels will use large groups of families as a diversionary tactic to smuggle drugs in behind them. Unfortunately, it happens all of the time on the border. And when you have 50 in some sectors it was 40 when we were back in march at the level of 14,000 in custody. In the last week of may, we hit 19,000 in Border Patrol<\/a> and cvp custody at the border. At that level, youre dealing with 50 of your staff focused on processing and migrant care and not out on the border securing the line. The 20day limit that we have on the detention of alien minors, it forces dhs to engage in what some describe as a catch and release program to ensure there are real consequences for illegal entry. I think we need to be able to detain people who are coming in and claiming asylum long enough to evaluate their claims under our asylum laws. Taking into account the possibility of continuances and the fact that under current regulations, an alien is entitled to a certain number of days at various stages of an adjudicatation to file briefs, how long does it take, realistically, to adjudicate fully an asylum claim . Yeah. Hopefully, this is not a hypothetical question. Because we had this authority in the past administration and secretary johnson at the time established Family Residential<\/a> centers, which provide an appropriate setting for families to Stay Together<\/a> while theyre going through immigration proceeding. The average time for those proceedings was between 40 and 50 days. So we have been able to do this efficiently and effectively before to actually get immigration results. And if someone has a valid asylum claim, release them. If not, to repatriate them efficiently and create that integrity in the system thats necessary. So we have done that. We have done that in the last few years. Yes. We did that not in this administration, but in the obama administration. Correct. Why couldnt it work today . Because were under a court order, single District Court<\/a> in the 9th circuit, that prevents us from detaining families for more than 20 days at a time. Is there any appreciable difference to adjudicate a claim for withholding of removing versus a claim for asylum . I dont believe so, no. So far this year, weve apprehended 444 thoushl,509 mig from guatemala, honduras and el salvador. That translates to 1. 32 of the total population of those countries. And many of those individuals, the more than 444,000 i mentioned, are people who are claiming asylum. If Central America<\/a>n countries or people from Central America<\/a>n countries were required to file refugee applications in their home countries, and were barred from seeking asylum, would the administration see that as a justification to raise the refugee cap currently set at 30,000 . I think that is something that we can discuss. Right now secretary pompeo set the cap for Central America<\/a> at 3,000 and we have not nearly met that total, because people are not applying safely in country. Theyre instead paying smugglers. Because they gain an advantage from coming unlawfully. We think it would be much better if they applied in a safe place, near or at their home country, and then we could consider that case there. Okay. Theoretically, thats possible. Yes. Thank you very much. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Senator durbin. Thank you for being here and thank you for the cooperation in my visit to the border in el paso. I want to address one issue right off the bat here. We live in a political world in washington, d. C. , where inconvenient and embarrassing facts are dismissed as fake news. Now we are hearing that inconvenient and embarrassing information about children is being dismissed as recycle children, fake kids. This is the second time we have had testimony and questions asked about the socalled dna testing for those who are fraudulently representing that certain children are their own. Now, there is no excuse for that and i am not going to make any. I would like to ask you point blank, when are you going to provide us with the information on this, so we know how many tests there have been, how many have failed on the dna side and whether it is an appreciable percentage or a phenomena that should not lead us to dismiss what is happening to children in this process. Happy to answer that question right now, senator. Please. We did a threeday dna pilot. Three days. 109 people were testified in that pilot. These were targeted based on Border Patrol<\/a> observations and concerns there might not be a family relationship. I want to get that clear, up front. 17 admitted or were tested out as fraudulent. Nine of them said this is not my child, i dont want to take the test, as they came forward to take the test. So this is a 15 return. In that same time period youre not suggesting that 15 of the children who are coming across the border with adults are, in fact, fraudulently represented as being the children of these adults, are you . Thats why i was careful to say that these were targeted rer referrals. The point i want to get to can i just add one other point, senator . Please. The other hsi interviews with forensic interview skills down on the border, they have done 1,568 interviews, 242 were fraudulent. Same type of referral based on risk from a Border Patrol<\/a> observation. Again, thats a 15 return. I dont think we can ignore these numbers. No, we should not ignore them. And there is no excuse. None. For misrepresenting that a child is your own in an effort to defraud anyone in our country or any other place. But this notion that we can somehow dismiss the 85 of children, because some are abusing that representation of parental responsibility, troubles me greatly. Did you believe the zero tolerance policy was a good policy . As ive testified in this committee, that policy was not successful, because we lost the public trust and its appropriate that the president ended it almost a year ago. June 20th of 2018. Im not going to quote some things that you said about it before it was implemented, because we all can learn from mistakes. I think the president learned from that mistake and one of the few times i can remember that he said he was wrong in the course of twoandahalf years. But the point i want to get to is this. There were thousands, according to the Inspector General<\/a>s report, thousands who were also detained. Children separated before the zero tolerance policy was announced. Were you aware of that as well . So we have talked about this, as well, senator. The zero tolerance policy lasted six weeks. It was prosecuting adults, crossed with children. How many children were separated from adults in that six weeks . In that sixweek period, we can get you the exact number. Its 2,880. Thats what the judge found in southern california. Youre right, senator. Thats the hhs filing, and thats the best place to respond to those court orders and that specific set of parameters. That was a mistake would you not agree, that was a mistake . Senator, ive already acknowledged it was not an effective policy. So do you believe that returning children now to their countries of origin without followup to make certain they are protected or at least in a safe situation when theyre returned . I think a better would also be a mistake . A better and balanced policy than what were doing today, inviting parents to put their children in the hands of smugglers, would be to allow them to claim their protection safely in their country. And if they avoid that, to be able to repatriate them in accordance and this administration should down the Central America<\/a>n project that allowed that to occur under the obama administration, is that correct . So the problem is, you need to have balance. You need to be able to provide accurate i think a yes or no is in order. You need to be able to repatriate people who you didnt answer my question. Since this administration shut down the obama policy. The Central America<\/a>n minors program, which was a program that resulted in some children getting status, but most being paroled into the u. S. With no future of legal status. Was it shut down by the Trump Administration<\/a> . Yes. Yes. Let me ask you about those who show up for hearings. Asylum hearings. I think its a premise of what the chairman asked earlier. And i think what you told us was that 87 dont appear. 92 of individuals who filed asylum claims attended their Court Hearing<\/a>s between fiscal years 2013 and 2017 of the Asylum Seekers<\/a> released from detention to pursue their claims attend Immigration Court<\/a> hearings nearly 100 of the time. 98 of mothers with children who are represented by Legal Counsel<\/a> complied with Court Hearing<\/a> obligations. Ive been to these Immigration Court<\/a>s. It is hard for me as a lawyer and someone who is focussing to try to figure out the continuances and whats being said at these hearings. Imagine if i didnt speak the native language being spoken at these hearings. What we have found is directly opposite of what you have said to the chairman. Overwhelmingly, if these people are given any counseling about the Legal Process<\/a> or legal representation, they show up over 90 of the time. Its not the socalled and i hate the term catch and release, thats being represented to this committee. Do you acknowledge that . Youre using specific types of data. Im going to give you some additional data. One of the programs this committee has favored is a family case Family Program<\/a> that i. C. E. Administered a yearandahalf ago. Those families did appear for their Court Hearing<\/a>s. But now weve seen 150 with final orders of removal not actually show up to be removed. To be repatriated. They had access to counsel, showed up for proceedings and theyre at large and not following the law. Thats the kind of concern we have here. I gave you the recent numbers of over 7,000 families that we put through a process to try to get court results more quickly. 90 of them did not show up for their hearings last thing i would like to ask is this. Do you recognize the name betty rendon. I do not. Well, ill remind you. It was the Lutheran Seminary<\/a> student, the woman who was a grandparent who was in the chicago land area, recently deported with her husband. She is the grandmother of an american citizen, has been in this country for 15 years. I. C. E. Pursued her through her daughter, who is covered by daca. Arrested her and her husband and deported them from this country. Thats the kind of thing when people read about it as we did in the chicago media, and here request for more money for i. C. E. , we say to ourselves, if you have this crisis at the border, humanitarian crisis, and if you have people who are clearly a danger in the United States<\/a> and undocumented, why are these not the priority instead of betty rendon . Theres always going to be sympathic individual cases when youre enforcing Immigration Law<\/a>. What my responsibility is working with i. C. E. To make sure that their priorities are appropriate. Nine out of ten of their interior Enforcement Actions<\/a> have criminal records. This woman had no criminal record. I understand youre referencing a case im not familiar with. Im trying to explain that by and large, weve got 75 of i. C. E. Intake from the border. 25 from the interior and out of that 25 , nine out of ten have criminal records. Well, these are the cases that come to our attention. Why are we wasting mundy porting this woman instead of dealing with the humanitarian crisis and anyone who is truly dangerous . Senator holly is next. Im going to try to see if i understand what senator durbin was saying. So if you have counsel and theres a system that you feel comfortable with or somebody can interpret it and have counsel, that the attendance rates are greater . Is that fair to say . Dramatically. I think thats fair to say. Theyre not endorsing any specific stats. We would like to present them from the government, yes. Is it also fair to say what youre finding is if they lose the case and at the moment when they are denied that status, they could be deported, correct . Pardon me . When they are denied an asylum status at the end of the hearing, they could be deported at that point, right . They can, but i. C. E. Has to go into a community to effectuate that. Theyre in a hearing setting when this is announced. No, the Immigration Judges<\/a> often dont issue the final order until weeks after the last hearing and say you actually have to get i think youre both right. Senator holly. Id like to talk about the safety of children at the border to go back to that important line of questioning. You testified in your written testimony youve uncovered child recycling rings, quoting you now, whereby innocent children are being used multiple times to help different adults gain illegal entry, and release. Can you tell us more about that . Because it seems to me the exploitation of children by cartels, human smugglers on the scale that youre describing is absolutely unbelievable. And quite frankly, the refusal of this congress to act to do something about this humanitarian crisis is absolutely unbelievable. And absolutely indefensible. So why dont you tell us more about this crisis. So in may we had 88,000 families cross the border. Thats incentivized by the fact they cant be held to the full court proceeding. We know that for a fact. Its not a great leap of imagination to think people might try to exploit that fact and bring a child who is not their own. Maybe even the same child more than once. You referenced the cases of child recycling. Were up to three significant cases now. The charleston case was referenced. We also have one in chicago where we had a single group bring eight children used to bring in 36 adults. These are rings were talking about. Three different instances of recycling rings. Correct. Yeah. That to me is indicative of the challenge were facing, and were very concerned weve only identified the tip of the iceberg in terms of these cases. We need to continue to invest in protecting these children, but better yet, a change in the law would prevent this cycle from happening in the first place. You testified earlier about renting children. And i think was it 89 a child . Is that the figure you gave that i read correctly . So one of the individuals that was subject to dna testing, one of those 109, was a 51yearold. He said, sorry, its not my child. It was a 6monthold child that he stated he paid about 80 the equivalent of 80 u. S. Dollars to rent from the mother. Who is making the money here . Who is making money on recycling children and renting children . Human smugglers. Human smuggling organization. And whats the role of the cartel in all of this at the border . They advertise it, they promote it. Its ubiquitous in Central America<\/a>. Advertisements on radio, advertisements on social media. Advertisements the chairman held up at the start of the meeting. This is a very wellknown fact. So it just strikes me. Weve heard it said that crossing the southern border is an act of love. But for the cartels, it is an opportunity for exploitation of children. It is an opportunity to cash in. It is about profit. It is about money. Its about their criminal enterprise, is that fair to say . Absolutely. And you said just a little bit ago, last june you said we have a humanitarian crisis at the border, is that right . Thats right. And youve requested additional funding, you requested humanitarian assistance, youve requested more judges, and this congress has refused to act, refused to act, refused to act, is that correct . Yes. I dont think failure to act is really quite right. I think thats way too generous. It is refusal to act. Because congress could act. They could act if they wanted to. But they dont want to. Thats the bottom line. And so were dealing with children im the father of two little boys. The idea that you would have children recycled, purchased, used for profit by these cartels and by these smuggling rings and that this congress would sit by and say, were just not going to do anything, there really is no crisis, there is nothing we can agree on, is absolutely unbelievable to me. I mean, it is the worst failure of leadership that i can think of. I mean, its just absolutely its absolutely stunning. Let me ask you about one of the proposals that the chairman has made. The refugee Processing Centers<\/a> in mexico and Central America<\/a>. How much of a difference would that make for Border Patrol<\/a> and dhs if migrants from the triangle were able to apply for Refugee Status<\/a> . Part of the problem, we have a percentage of people that have valid refugee or asylum type cases that deserve protection. And right now theyre caught within that huge flow of others that are just economic migrants who are exploiting the loopholes. If we had a Refugee Processing Center<\/a> incountry, we would be able to do that in a safe place and get a result for those people that need protection, fly them safely to a destination country, could be the United States<\/a>, could be another country that would offer protections, and it would be a much better process. Without smugglers involved, without profits for criminals. And it would remove would help remove those incentives that the cartel smuggling rings have in order to exploit children and to use them for profit, is that fair to say . Right. While still reaching those that need protection. Yeah, because what we have is we do have families that are desperately seeking asylum. We do have some that are going to have a valid refugee or asylum claim. And we have others who just want to escape the conditions of their home country, understandably. And then youve got these cartels, smuggling rings, who are preying upon that, finding ways to violent the law and turning all of that into their own profit, is that right . Exactly right. Ju do you have a view on whether the refugee Processing Centers<\/a> Processing Centers<\/a> should be run by dhs or the state department or how that works. State department and the unhcr are the organizations managing refugee processing foreign. Youd be happy with that arrangement. Dhs has a role with citizenship and Immigration Services<\/a> its a partnership. I mean it should be treated like the situation it is. Like an International Refugee<\/a> challenge. Very good. Thank you mr. Chairman. Senator klobuchar. Thank you. Acting secretary, why do you think those the problem is so much worse than during the Previous Administration<\/a> . Because of the loopholes in the legislation, the regulation interpreted after the last administration started repatriating families and reduce the kriez in 14 was rebrpted by the court upheld by the ninth circuit. Do you think it has nothing to do with the inconsistenties of in Administration Policies<\/a> with the threats with the wall, within the threats about changes in policies, with the tweets, with the limits in foreign aid that this would in fact be something that would be create incentives for people to come up north and then in fact is amplified by the smugglers and they use the president s words and his threats to create even more uncertainty and more people coming up north . Do you think thats a factor at all. The smugglers use wafer they can. Do you think its a factor at all, the president s actions in creating more migration. No, i think this is an unbroken challenge with family units increasing we had a crisis the last three months of 2016 around the election if you recall with the huge. You think the administrations policies have nothing to do with this whats happening now. I dont know how you ascribe the Administration Policies<\/a> to try to secure the border to pulling more people across. Do you think comprehensive Immigration Reform<\/a> that we passed in 2013 in this senate that was supported by president obama that got blocked by the Republican Leadership<\/a> in the house, do you think that would have helped to prevent in from happening with all the funding that was there for the border and also having a much more orderly process for Legal Immigration<\/a> . So, i think there are a number of very beneficial things about that bill, including the Border Security<\/a> investment which i helped advise chairman graham and the is it committee several Committee Members<\/a> on during that time i was Deputy Commissioner<\/a> of cbp i believe lawful access to immigration was posh as well. But i dont believe that this issue was addressed in that bill, this issue. You know there was money for judges and asylum processing. Money for creating a more pordly process at the border. That we now dont have. And i note that that 2013 bill, the cbo score on that the Congressional Budget Office<\/a> nonpartisan score, the reason that Grover Norquist<\/a> supported the bill was it brought the debt down by 158 billion and you think of that cash and what you could do with that money if you took a portion of going into Debt Reduction<\/a> that could have been used for order at the border dunk do you think that would have been moment. Many beneficial elements of the bill. Lets go back to senator durbins question about shutting down, the process that the current energies shut down in 2017 that allow Asylum Seekers<\/a> to be able to apply in their countries. Do you think that was helpful and that was shut down . So i dont think it was inappropriate program because it wasnt it didnt lean to legal status for most people paroled into the u. S. I think what we proposed and in fl chairmans bill would allow us to provide access to protections in country but also to repatriate those that avoid that access or that didnt qualify. But you now so the administration now favors bringing back a Similar Program<\/a> to in. With the protections and the integrity of the system if people avoid it and cross unlawfully anyway, yes. But there was something in place before. And then how about the foreign aid, the president s threat to cut foreign aid to those three countries . Do you think thats been helpful . So the aid has been frozen to ensure that we have accountable partners and targeted programs making impact that have return on investment pmt i think we need to continue to work with partners in Central America<\/a> thats my position as acting secretary recommendation partners at the state and white house and ill advocate that. I go back to the comprehensive reform where g again if we did Something Like<\/a> we would have a way to pay for part of this to try to resolve this problem. When i spoke to you at this previous hearing i asked you if you had any regrets about how the family separation policy was implemented. And you said that when Law Enforcement<\/a> lose the public trust they cant be effective. That was a quote. What is the status of the investigation into those deaths . Will you commit to publicly releasing the results and attempting to earn back the publics trust. So youre talking about which deaths, senator, im sorry. Six children dieing in cbp custody smorlt after they were released since raft december. Okay, yes, there have been three deaths of unaccompanied or children with parents in cpb custody this fiscal year all under investigation. We have the medical examiners reports now for both jacqueline and filip gomez. We do not have the Inspector General<\/a> reportsy yet i will share those with the committee if not shared directly and well fom up on identified recommendations. From those zients weve investedive had i mr. The care of children in custody especially the medical care since that time. Okay. And i would look forward to seeing the reports and ill ask you in writing a question about siblings being separated which i asked about at the previous hearing. According to reports two months ago the president offered to pardon you if you were convicted of having Border Agents<\/a> block Asylum Seekers<\/a> from entering the utehs in defines of u. S. Law has anyone from the white house asked to you violate the law. No one asked me to do anything illegal. Is the president s instructing sboerd knits to fielt the have you and heeleding them by pardoning consistent with the oath of office and requirement of the constitution that he take care the laws be faithfully executed. Ive never asked to do anything unlawful more would i. According to brookingss Institute Report<\/a> released last october the administration has a five success rate when defending agency axes in court Previous Administration<\/a>s including republicans ones have average 69 success rate when defending their actions. Some of these Agency Actions<\/a> have come from the dhs, im not going through all the details. Ewe know what they are with tps, daca, other things. This suggests the administration is taking actions that are far outside of the mainstream. The legal mainstream. Including with republican appointed judges. How do you explain this sharp decline in success rate. I mean we dont have results in all those cases yet. Many under appeal and kurmt in process. I was just using the brookings numbers but thank you. Next we have senator blackburn but ill ask you an important question to me process. If question passed the gang of eight bill did you agree most of the problems were dealing with, not all would not exist sno. Wed have a very different situation. Wed have 20,000 additional Borderline Patrol<\/a> agents. Thank you wed be better off with that bill. Wed be more secure on the border, the elements that would have been supporting cpbp and i. C. E. Senator blackburn. Kennedy. I apologize. Mr. Secretary, i think you are doing a a good job. The best job that you can uts. Ive listened to you in two hearings. I dont think youre a politician. I think youre i think youre doing the best you can to solve this problem. And i appreciate that. Can you tell me what a a Safe Third Party<\/a> or Safe Third Country Agreement<\/a> is. Sure. Its a there is a provision in our Immigration Law<\/a> and International Standard<\/a> as well where you acknowledge that another governments asylum process is full and fair and it should be recognized. So that an Asylum Seeker<\/a> cant cross through another country and then choose to enter yours and claim i lump if there is already a safe place. Does it mean that if youre if youre trying to make it to the United States<\/a> are or strike that. If you are trying to make it to mexico, lets say, but you you step foot in the United States<\/a> first and youre youre seeking asylum status, then the United States<\/a> has to prosecute your asylum status. Right if you are already in a country where you are not going to be persecuted where you have access to asylum you shouldnt be allowed to move to another country. If we made or we insert add Safe Third Party<\/a> or Safe Third Country Agreement<\/a> into the u. S. Mca that would stop this problem cold wouldnt it. Ive long advocated for partnership between destination and transit cspan2. Would that stop the problem. The Safe Third Country Agreement<\/a> with mexico or other countries where we see transit would be an effective i havive way. If we put it in the usmmca applies to mexico, United States<\/a> and canada. Equally is that right. So i would im not sure how the legislation would be crafted or whether it could be or should be attached to the usmca but we do have a safe third agreement country agreement with country o accurate. It doesnt apply between ports and entry. And having one with another partner would be beneficent. The agreement im saying as part of the usmca, if someone is seeking asylum status and in one of the three countries, the country in which any land first so long as it is a safe country is the country responsible for for processing the asylum declaration. I think thats a sensible approach. They can work in north america and it has worked in the context of europe and turkey, to norway and russia and elsewhere in the world. Do you happen to know has your department quantified the cost to the american taxpayer per asylum claim. I dont have that on hand. But we can do some analysis, zblier would you get that for me. Okay. Okay. Can you tell me how much the American People<\/a> have spent in money to the northern triangle countries trying to fix them so people dont wont leave. Well, unthe alliance for prosperity more recentlily been in the raenl of 500 million a year a lot of that money is yet to be deployed. For how long. Thats been going on for three years. So we spent 1. 5 billion. It obviously hasnt worked. Well, thats why i think there is a temporary freeze on the aid to make sure the programs are functioning effectively. How much money would the american taxpayer have to sfend in guatemala, el salvador, honduras to reduce to make their country those countries so much better that 20 fewer people would want to leave. I think the chairmans point earlier, that there is no nearterm ability to make the countries so welcoming that its not still better to try to migrant to the u. S. If we have legal loopholes thats critical. What would we spend the pony on. I think Economic Development<\/a> for the region is beneficial. Security and governance is critical. We have gang activities that are transnational that do affect the safety of americans that originate in the three countries. So we would we should spend the pony on Economic Development<\/a> in the northern triangle zblool ill give you an example of someone that dhs controls in the area. We have the customs responsibility. The countries have very inefficient customs systems. Long delays at the borders. They are unnecessary supply chain barriers causing economic cost. We can give them advise relatively cheaply. Give them system sport and they can increase commerce and activity and create some of the jobs necessary to reduce the gap thats the kind of thing. Whats your best estimate of how much it will cost to reduce the flowpy 20 . Just with aid alone . I dont advocate for an aid only approach. I know. I know. But aid will get imi hear you youre saying or at least some of my colleagues have said that gichg them aid will reduce the flow. It will make people less likely to leave their country. And im saying how much do you think it will take to reduce flow by 20 . Yes, i dont have a sound estimate for you on that. I think there are some case studies we could lack at in el salvador with the 60 drop in the murder rate and reduction in migration might have have been been instructive place to look. I get it. Its hard to estimate. We dont know, do we. Okay. Let me ask you one last question. If if 90 of the people who are in our country illegally are showing up for hearings, how did we get 11 Million People<\/a> in our country illegally. Thats why i recommended we go back and provide comprehensive data on the difference categories. In our experience the marj of people arent showing up for hearings. And those that do get a final order get it in absentia for the most part are not repatriated effectively. Which is why we have this draw and full factor. All right. Last one. When counsel is provided for our neighbors who come here illegally who pays for the counsel . It would be the american taxpayer. Hand do you know how much were paying in legal fees. Were not doing that right now. We did get appropriations in 19 to try again with Family Case Management Program<\/a> to see if they could have successful results. Can you get me a number quantify it on the cost per asylum applicant. If there were kprepsive counsel provided or. Not just lawyers everything. Yes. How much is this costing the American People<\/a>. We can do that. Okay. Thank you. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Senator hirono. Thank you, mr. Chairman. You said that you think that there is a multiprong approach thats needed to deal with in situation of the crisis. And would you agree that addressing the root causes of migration with foreign aid is one of those prongs. Yes. And i think you testified that there is a temporary freeze on in kind of aid of something in the order of 450 million. So and what was the explanation for the temporary freeze on the aid . To these countries. Concerns that it was not being applied effectively, actually meet the purposes of legislation and the appropriation. It could take a long time for a for the administration to figure out that the state did the aid is not airportly utilitiesized. In the meantime we are not getting on with with what we need do which i think as you testified earlier we do need to get to the root causes of what caused what prompts so many of the families to come to our country seeking asylum. So this is a longterm kind of commitment on our part to enable them to become much more economically strong, to institute a rule of law, to and end corruption its taking years. I think part of the what was tried was in columbia where our country sent a lot of aid. And now columbia is has an economy stronger and we dont see the kind of situation that would prompt the columbians to come to our country. So i think that others of my colleagues talked about the importance of continuation of aid is with appropriate par amounter. It rierps a multiprong approach not just changing laws we have different views on that point do you think the Trump Administration<\/a> is following a multiprong approach to good effect. I think so. And if i could clarify that the freeze thats undertaken right now has not yet affected some of the key programs that have been in process and funded under prior year appropriations. We have months to assess which programs are working. And thats going to ultimately be the secretary of states recommendation, the president s determination. How much of the 500 million or so aid that we generally provide is being provided at this point. Ill reach out to the department of state to make sure the committee has that information. Im kind of surprised that you did not anticipate that we would ask these kinds of questions because you testified earlier that its really important to get to the root causes. So there have been times when you have with probably all good intentions to provide us with information and then we dont get that information. So i for one think that a multiprong approach is really necessary. I agree with you on that. And i think that were not doing enough on getting to the root causes. So there is that. Senator feinstein asked you how many children have been separated from their parents since june of 2018. Last year you said you didnt know the exact number. So in is after the zero tolerance policy was ended. So doesnt cbp keep track of the children it has separated from after the zero tolerance policy . We do. We keep careful track. But you. I gave you the percentage this morning. But well get you the exact number. Well, you know the zero tolerance policy resulted in a huge hue and crew and outrage in our country because our administration through this policy created instant orphans of thousands of imMigrant Children<\/a>. I think it would behoove you to come to the committee and give us the kind of information that you know we would want to hear. Because it would enable us to decide whether the current policies are being where you separate we foe you are still separating children. In fact there have been reports that that children are still being separated and not for particularly valid reasons. For example, the government even told a court in san diego that they separated children because they didnt have enough time to confirm parentage to in re satisfaction. So id like to know, how many children are being separated for these kinds of reasons that you just didnt have time to figure out to figure out whether they were with the parents or not. Were talking about 1 one of of one . A rare situation for the safety of and welfare of child that we manage carefully and keep track of. Of course its your Border Patrol<\/a> agents making the initial determinations. So it has to do with what kind of training they have, and you know all of those kinds of issues. There is a multiplicity of concerns that we have particularly for children coming to our country seeking asylum. Nobody wants to support fraud. That is very clear. And nobody wants to support open borders. But as we deal with in the multifacetted problem there are valid concerns that we have about how children are being treated. So lets get one other thing clear. In april in 2019, multiple news reports bakted that President Trump<\/a> offered to pardon you if you if you went to jail for following his desired policy of blocking entry of Asylum Seekers<\/a> to the United States<\/a>. And yes, you testified just now that you have not been asked to violate any laws, et cetera. But but yes or no has President Trump<\/a> ever offered or suggested that he would pardon you if you complemented his legally suspect policies including denying sbroe to Asylum Seekers<\/a>, even if you perceived the offer of pardoning to keep you out of jail to be a joke. Im going to repeat myself, senator ive not been asked to do anything you will unlawful. That is different thats not the question i asked. The question has the president offered eep if you thought it might be in jest, offered to protect you if you ended up going to jail . No, i know you testified uch not been asked to violate the law. So did he . I think my i think my answer stands. As you reported in the news because that would be a source of marilyn concern for a lot of us. I do have mr. Chairman some other questions for the record because there is a very complicated situation. And yes would o we with like to do the humane and appropriate things including by the way we need to to more to stem the cartels activities. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Thank you, senator hirono. Senator blackburn. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Mr. Secretary, thank you so much for your service. I will tell you in past friday as i was in the el paso esectori was really grateful for the men and women that are there and are working. I know you all have brought people in from across the country. I saw a guy from memphis who was down working had been down for a few weeks helping out the coast guard, as you mentioned, helping with health and doing some of those screenings. And this is just such a heart wrenching situation, especially when you look at the children, and the unaccompanied alien children. And we know this is an issue when i was in the house and in 2014 had visited one of the centers raised concerns. And couldnt get bipartisan agreement to do some things at that point. And, you know, being down there and visiting with some of these unaccompanied alien children there was even a 1yearold in that felt, there with her mom who was a minor child. And they were waiting to find out what was going to happen with them. But one of the things that the office of Refugee Resettlement<\/a> one of their actions concerns me. And this is the unreviewable discretion and utilizing that to allow the release of these uacs. Traffickers of these children are really taking advantage of the loopholes that exist, whether its the rent a child policy, or sending a child forward and that child ends up with a sex trafficking or a labor trafficking or maybe into a gang. And many times these adult sponsors that are seeking the custody are themselves in the country illegally. And they are not related to this child. And any do not have that childs welfare at heart. And senator guardiansly mentioned the accountability for care of the uacs, the bill we have filed. And it codifies that existing agreement between dhs and hhs to share that criminal background history. And i would like to hear from you what else you think we need to be doing to support your agents. We know you need more funding. The agents need more manpower and that weve got a lot of agents down there now that are tending to feeding duties. They are dealing in the centers two of the centers i visited, one was built to km date 85, the other built to accommodate 123. And now they each have over 1,200. So tell us what we can do to helpless help lessen the burden. Thank you for talking about the men and women and appreciate the chairman at the opening also acknowledging that we have tremendous Law Enforcement<\/a> prochgsles doing extraordinary work to protect vulnerable populations and work they are not interest trained for and didnt sign up for they signed up to secure the border and now they are caring for families and kids and doing it with honor. I worry its not sustainable. I worry about their health and families. And i appreciate you acknowledging the heart with which they do their job. And we do have 325 dhs volunteers down there now supporting weve got 70 oh cbp from around the country supporting. And then the coast guard what we need from the supplemental is the funding to provide a better situation so children are not waiting in the Border Patrol<\/a> stations that you saw, that they are moving to hhs facilities including that young mother very quickly. Thats their requirement in law. Thats the commitment we should be able to meet. We need the funding to do that. We also need the support for the transportation, the temporary facilities we need to to get the crowding down in stations so that they have room to have a better situation while they are waiting for transfer. And the ability to hold single adults in the i. C. E. Custody as we kpeded beds. We need all that funding. You mentioned hhs and the efforts they undertake to ensure that children are placed with sponsor effectively. I know they work hard alts. The fact you just raised is that most children are being released to parents but parents who are here unlawfully. And thats a continued challenge in in cycle. One of the things that we do need is the ability to share information so that we can make sure that all federal Law Enforcement<\/a> information that might pertain to the safety of that child when released is available to hhs making that determination. And thats a challenge we face right now. But the critical needs are that 3. 3 billion, 7 a of the supplemental going to hhs to provide adequate foothills for unaccompanied children and 25 so that dhs can manage the crisis effectively. Lets talk a little bit about the wall also. When i was riding with the Border Patrol<\/a> within 30 minutes we saw 12 people just come walking right up raise their hands, want amnesty. And theyre coming across where there is no wall. And theyre walking right across that dry river bed. Now if a u. S. Citizen was in mexico and walked across that river bed it would be knelth would be arrested for unlawful entry and disobeying Immigration Law<\/a>s. But with it being someone not a u. S. Citizen we are taking taking them in and the process begins and that at santa theresaa station there are a thousand migrants el salvador, honduras, cuba. A large group of cubans there. Umhum. But one of the things so vital is to have that wall. And i heard it from every single agent. And just for the record, speak a little bit about that physical deterrence, its need and how many miles you have under construction right now. Right. So the request for additional barrier on the border comes from ourths on the ground who need it to control key areas of the border where we have high traffic or ability to disappear on the u. S. Side into the infrastructure or the transportation very quickly. Its a stated, known requirement. Weve had it for decades and weve applied wall or barrier effectively in multiple sectors on the border and we need more of it. Right now we arabling the wall funding airported in 18 and 19 we finished the 17 build already thats 40 miles the 18 funding covers about 85 and already replying the funding for 19 as well going as fast as we can to get the additional barrier up. It comes with cameras sensor lighting roads, with all kinds of important function for our agents to effectively securing the areas of the border and we do need it to address those trying to evade capture. We have the problem with people presenting to agents but we have about 30 with are tried to including rug smug letters criminals and gang members we need to top effectively. My time is expired. I appreciate the work that you and the Border Patrol<\/a> are continuing to do. Yield back. Thank you. Senator blumenthal. Thanks, mr. Chairman. I want to join my colleagues in thanking the very dedicated and courageous members of the customs and Border Protection<\/a> as well as the other professionals who workday in and day out on basically doing their jobs under very difficult conditions. And i visited them on multiple occasions. And have always been impressed with their dedication to their work. So nothing about that i dont think anything said here casts aspersions on them. Yesterday President Trump<\/a> tweeted and im quoting, quote, we have fully signed and documented another very important part of the immigration security deal with mexico. One that the United States<\/a> has been asking about getting for many years. It will be revealed in the not too distant future and will need a vote by mexicos legislative body, end quote. What is the secret deal . So im certainly not going to share something in advance of the president. Is there a secret deal. So the deal with mexico is a comprehensive approach and its more than weve ever had in terms of commitment from mexico both operationally both on the program. And how much it though is. And policy. How much of it is not yet disclosed to the American Public<\/a> . So the the nounlzed operational efforts six thousand at the born fop addressing transportation nodes sharing on the border. Migration protocol is supined all 26 stations. I know what he announced. But the foreign secretary of mexico denies fl is any sort of undisclosed deal. How do you square that statement with the president s . So, i think the president s tweet stands for itself. And the announcement will be oh on his time line. What i can show you is that further actions in the announcement talk about continued assessment over 90 days looking at this secretary pompeo said were going to. With all due respect my time is limited. I know what has been said. If you are unable to disclose anything more about whats in this deal, i think with with all due respect you are failing in your duty to come before this committee and fully disclose what the commitments of this nation are with respect to immigration. And maybe you can tell us what the time line is. Respectfully i would defer to the president s own statements on that matter in coordination with the government of mexico. Let me ask you about reports of a breach of data involving the images of of faces appear license plates taken by apparently a Company Called<\/a> perceptix of tennessee at the border. How many facial photographs and license plate images have been disclosed improperly . So my understanding from cbp and they did disclose and report to congress as required by law as soon as this came to light. This is were talking about a few lanes at a single port of entry, techt attached for a month and a half thats the data its not widespread. Its a land border vehicle crossing. Its something they are investigating aggressively right now. And were going to absolutely disclose our findings and take corrective action. I can tell that you no cbp systems or dhs systems were breached in the incident. It was the system of pennsylvania contractor, correct. Thats correct. Wouldnt you grow that that cbp has the same responsibility with respect to a contractor that its hired and paid to maintain proper security over photographs of travelers and license plates, that have been exposed as a result of a cyberattack . Doesnt your agency have the same responsibility there that it has over its open activities. Yes, thats why it was elude immediately reported and they are following up aggressively. Are you sure its only at one point of entry that the breach has occurred. Thats our information at this time, yes. And what is the time line for complete nag investigation . Well, its a top priority, any privacy breach requires immediate action to understand how many people are affected, what kind of information was disclosed and how we can mitigate that issue. We will give you an update in a matter of weeks on what we have wernd learned in that. But you are alarmed, i hope, that this kind of breach mass occurred about information concerning travelers and license plates that could be very harmful to them and certainly as a breach of their privacy. Right. In data breach is alarming. My understanding is this is a limited impact right now. But we are going to fully review and report the findings. There was a reference earlier to the 2013 agreement or i should say a bill that was approved with overwhelming bipartisan support by this committee and then by the senate of the United States<\/a> and i was proud to be a part of helping to draft it. Did you support it at the time . So as ive noted i was in an operational position. I i provided a lot of Technical Assistance<\/a> on what would be effective for us operationally at the border and a lot of that was included a absolutely spoerpted the provisions that would have made an impact on Border Security<\/a>. En a i recognize because i was there at the time that you provided a lot of expertise and support. Would you support it now. I would support a number of key elements of the bill. I would refer to the white house announcement of a offer to engage in a broad conversation on immigration. And support a bill that would address Border Security<\/a>, issues, port of entry infrastructure. The dhs. What about a path to what about a path earned citizenship for 11 Million People<\/a> who are undocumented . Right. So i think the president s talked about willingness to discuss daca and in the context of a broader security bill. I dont believe the Administration Policy<\/a> has addressed path to citizenship more broadly nor would i suggest that you would not state a position at this point in favor of either a path for daca. Right. Or for the 11 million undocumented individuals. So what i would say is the president s expressed support for chairman grahams bill to a targeted solution to the crisis and has offered to nanl in brought you hadder conversation on immigration with a number of provisions that i think could gain bipartisan support and should be discussed by in body. Let me just ask you finally, what is the dollar amount necessary to address the humanitarian crisis at the border . Weve all agreed there is a humanitarian crisis. Yeah. Inhousing, medical care, education, basic necessities, what is the dollar amount necessary. The emergency supplemental request submitted on her may 1st is 4. 5 billion. 75 of which is the the care and custody of unaccompanied children by hhs. Thats sufficient in your view. At the current flow numbers, you know the flow has continued to go up. So we did submit some revised numbers to the Appropriations Committee<\/a> this we can for the dhs portion of the care. Including a reduction in the need for the fogeltanz single adult beds at i. C. E. Which hopefully gives a more comprehensive picture of what we need and give an updated total. Thank you my time is expired. And senator tillis. Youve been involved in this for a long time like myself. Isnt there generally a tradeoff in a deal where one side gets something the other said getsing. Thats how legislation used to work. Is there a trade i dont have for giving a path with to is it citizenship more nonfelons in return for better Border Security<\/a>. E verify so we dont do this every 20 years hasnt that been the general construct. Im not stating administration positions. Im just saying in the past. Yeah, that was where you had 68 votes and 13. I think if you go back there and look youll find a lot of votes. Senator tillis. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Mr. Secretary. Thank you for being here and for your patience. I want to go back to number one i want to start with Border Patrol<\/a>. I think theyre doing a fantastic job. Im kind of curious recently. How how is there morale in the face of all the things they are dealing with right now . I their morale is impacted. Theyre tired. A lot of them have gotten sick. Theyve been exposed to flu, chicken p. O. Box, meesles, mumps all kinds of challenges in terms of the medical care theyre aspen time waiting overnight in hospitals instead of patrolling the border. This is not the kind of work that they want to be doing, not what they are trained for. And its an impact. There is no question. I think they are counting on us to have a conversation that helps solve the problem and we need to do it. How is recutting going in how many open positions do we have now. Our recruiting actually proceeding successfully this year. Weened last year with more agents than we started for the first time in four years. We have continued to make progress with the Border Patrol<\/a> agents. Our cbp officers hiring is dramatically successful. Hired 5,000 officers in the last five years. Were going to be over 1,200 net gain in fiscal year in cbp officers. Thanks to the congresss support were adding key professional we need for security and facilitying trade and travel. The Border Patrol<\/a> chief estimated that about 40 of the people are doing jobs they didnt sign up for. You mentioned in certain sectors thats as many as 50 . When theyre not doing Border Patrol<\/a> tasks, what additional restrictives do we have in terms of illegal crossings. Its heightened, no question. We know there are crossings we are missing. We no he smugglers use diversion aerotactics. Wanting to present themselves so you got all the resources on a group of people presenting nemesis at the expense of drugs and human trachlkeffickers usint diversion to cross the border illegal and drift in the landscape. Right. Well have a group of agents deployed in a certain area of the border. The smuggle letters then say in rioed grenada valley or del rio send three or four five rafts of families full of families across as they make landing we have to make sure its a safe process. The agents are responding to apprehend, support with to make sure there is no Immediate Health<\/a> needs. Meanwhile, people come around behind them. And theyre criminals. Right across. Smugger letters be with the the same smuggle organization capitalizing on migrants on the ones smuggling drugs. You said i want to get the numbers right. Number one i want to make sure i got the right context. But you were saying nine out of ten and in response to one question have a criminal record. Is that of the total of give me an idea what that means. Nine out of the ten with the criminal record is those interior apprehensions by i. C. E. Enforcement removal operations. So the 25 of their total in custody population that comes from interior operations, nine out of ten of those have a criminal record. And you were saying that 30 of the people crossing the border illegally are evading capture. Why were. Seeking to evade capture. Seeking to evade. Yes. Why would they seek to evade capture give me examples. One they have a criminal record. Two theyre smuggling drugs. Three theyre a gang member. Oh or four theyre just a single adult who realizes thats the one population that we can actually hold and in detention pending immigration proceeding and effectively repatriate. Border deaths, Something Else<\/a> we dont talk about. But i think in fiscal year 18 we had 281 people recovered dead people on american soil. I think in this year were up to about 68 so far. The over the past 20 years i think it was estimated around 10,000 people died trying to cross the border on american soil. Do we have any data on the number of people who are dying on the journey before they even get here . We dont have good data from mexico. Injury the Associated Press<\/a> did an analysis that pegged it at at least 1,000 a year dying in the journey in mexico. And they acknowledge that they had serious information gaps that probably indicated they were undercounting. Its been a deadly last six weeks at the border. We had a 10monthold drown in del rio sector. Two adults basically collapsed almost immediately upon crossing and apprehension. And they were taken to the hospital and died in the last three weeks. This is the kind of situation that were seeing given the flow given the illnesses and given the riggers and dangerous of the journey. The Public Health<\/a> crisis is something that we havent talked about. You mentioned it in terms of the exposure that our Border Patrol<\/a> agents are having. But war we seeing in terms of the population . Over 130,000 in the last month. What are we seeing about the General Health<\/a> of this population when they come into the country . Were currently managing over 250 cases of h 1 n 16789 flu in sun sector roy grenada value valley where we have a outbreak trying to do that safely and effectively. We have two pedestrians deployed to the main station where the individuals are quarantined. Thats just a snapshot. I. C. E. Has 4,000 people in custody that are in quarantine for months. Meaning the bed space in the locations have to be underutilized because they cant bring anyone in or out until the quarantine period expires. These are the daily challenges we face given in flow and given the fact that people are coming with more illnesses and we are we have more children and younger children coming that have acute medical needs all too oft sfloon well thank you for being here. And again, i thank all the people in Border Patrol<\/a> for the work they are doing. We have to provide them relief we have to stop talking past everybody and recognize the humanitarian crisis, a Public Health<\/a> crisis. Congresss inaction is aidingen a abetting i think the increase in illicit drugs and illicit activities crossing our border. And we really have to act. Thank you for being here and for your service. Thank you. Senator whitehouse. Thank you i echo senator tilliss remarks that we do need to get together and help you solve the humanitarian aspects of this crisis. I do not think that a lot of the rhetoric that has been thrown at this issue has been helpful towards making that happen. Two things one you mentioned in your testimony that the Largest Group<\/a> of individuals ever encountered crossing the border was entirely from guatemala, honduras or el salvador. What are the conditions in guatemala, honduras or el salvador create that impetus. I spent four days a week and a half go in guatemala meeting with the government but also meeting with Civil Society<\/a> organizations, ng pochlts working in regions of the country that are struggling. And with individual farmers. Struggling with where a. Traveling. So the number one issue is poverty and lack of economic opportunity. That is the biggest and starkest reason for migration. Really cited by everyone. More than danger. Yes. Actually guatemala is the least violent of the three and all three countries have had significant reductions in the murder rate over the last four years. Poverty is the number one issue in guatemala. Governance and control issues also especially in the rural areas are a factor. There is an area that suffered drought and there is a band called the dry corridor going from the northern part of el salvador through the western part of guatemala and theyve had crop yields go down. Theyve had coffee prices tank doo due to the global market. A lot of economic challenges that have exacerbated the situation. But the reason that im hearing and i had a father come up to me and say my daughter left with her child because we know if she brings the child there is a pathway for migration and now is the time torg to the u. S. Even though there are significant pull factors economic governance and some Security Issues<\/a> what were hearing is the reason to go now is the certainty that theyll be allowed to stay in the United States<\/a>. One of the ways in which you manage the population that has been crossing our border is through for profit facilities. Do you know how much of your network of facilities is for profit versus not for profit or governmentrun. Youre talking about i. C. E. Detention facilities . I dont have that figure at the tip of my tongue here, no. Is it a significant portion. I imagine it is. I dont have that data. Once you introduce a profit motive its a tale as old as time that that profit motive can deflect behavior. And im wondering what you know as an organization about who are the owners and investors of those for profit facilities and what conflicts of interest might be created by those owners and investors. I im not sure, senator, the implication there. But i can tell you the prokurmts are overseen unthe federal acquisition regulations. The standards are required to be met in all facilities. Well the implication is lets just say that you hold children longer in for profit detention facilities on a per per demi basis and thats more interest to investors that gives them a motive to for children to spend more time in the facilities. Thats a selfevident conflict of interest. The question is are you monitoring that in any which, looking out for that to try to make sure this is driven by policy and the best interests of the children and not by the financial well being of investors in these for profit facilities that you utilitiesize. So two key facts on the dhs is side of this question. One, that we dont detain children in custody, right. Were talking about the central problem here is we have to rls families if so accompanied children are released very quickly. And secondly unaccompanied children go to health and Human Services<\/a>. Theyre not held by i. C. E. Two, release decisions are governmental. They are inherently governmental. No contractor can cope a child longer or adult longer than i. C. E. Or another dhs entity says. They can sure push for policies allowing people to be kept longer. Thats a very interesting question. What im going do you haveny visibility into that question at all. So i can tell you where my suggestion that a better system would be to allow us to detain Families Together<\/a> comes from. It comes from experience that that approach worked in 2014 and 2015 under the Prior Administration<\/a> and a court order stopped it and weve had an unbroken flow of increase families coming since then. We do recommend that we go back to approach and get a fair and transparent hearing and an appropriate setting for families and have some integrity in the system thats where my recommendation comes from. As far as you know there is nobody looking at the extent to which the owners or investors the for profit facilities may have an influence on the determinations. Theyre not influencing the department of Homeland Security<\/a>s determinations. I would love that to be true. And i hope it is. Thank you. Thanks, senator hirono you have a question. I have two relatively short ones. I just want to first of all notice you didnt respond to my question whether the president offered to pardon you if you went to jail for following his desired policy of blocking entry of Asylum Seekers<\/a> to the United States<\/a>. So the multiple users reports that the made such of an offer stands. I have a question relating to the provisions of this bill. Under this bill youll be able to hold families in detention for four months as opposed to 20 days. So that would mean that thousands of families will be in detention obviously youre going to need more detention facilities to be built. But you can also consider alternatives to detention. So in december 2018 i asked you about the basis for your claim that alternatives to family detention including the Family Case Management Program<\/a> do not work. You said youd defer to prior testimony provided by immigration appear skmls enforcement i. C. E. Which it did not provide evidence for this claim. Are you aware of the november 30, 2017, report by dhss office of Inspector General<\/a> that found that participants of a Family Case Management Program<\/a>, which you testified that in december 2018 didnt work, complied with i. C. E. Check ins and appointments 99 of the time and attended Court Hearing<\/a>s 100 of the time. What factbased evidence like this report do you have to support your claim that the Family Case Management Program<\/a> does not work . If you have such a factbased basis can you cite me to them. Yes. And im happy to provide the analysis that i. C. E. Has of the initial implementation of the Family Case Management Program<\/a>, the number of families that were in the system, their appearance rate, which was very high. And i acknowledged that earlier in testimony. But the actual results were limited. Tlerp only about 15 repatriations at the enof the process. Now we have a situation where we have well over 10 oh final orders of removal that have been not been philadelphia because the families have not come forward even though they had access to counsel, social services and fuel due process. So i think that that whole process of the Case Management<\/a> program yes i would like to see that actual report and the basis for i. C. E. Or whoever within the administration, whatever entity is saying that this doepts work. Because the indications are that it toes work. So were talking about Case Management<\/a> program that costs significantly less compared to detention per day for a family. The figures i have is the Case Management<\/a> Program Costs<\/a> about 38 per day. Compared to nearly 320 per day for a family detention bed. And congress thought to reinstate the program by appropriating funding for alternatives to detentionfare fiscal year 2019. What if any steps has dhs taken so far to are to reinstate the Family Case Management Program<\/a> as congress sought to fund. Two important points. First is i. C. E. Is planning to appropriately apply the funding in the fy 19 bill to try again on a family Case Management<\/a> approach that would hopefully be more successful in getting results. But you mention that we would have to detain thousands of families for long periods of time. Well under this bill youd be able to. But thats no the the intent. The the past experience shows that we were able to complete these assessments in 40 to 50 days get a result from an immigration judge and effectuate it. And what happened as a result is when people saw they were being repatriated they werent just released into the u. S. As a family. Of course. The crossing dropped dramatically and immediately. You also need a heck of a lot more Immigration Judges<\/a> because you have a backlog of some 400,000 or whatever in that number one for Asylum Seekers<\/a> in the larger group of 800,000 backlog cases. You need a lot more lawyers to do that. One would hope that you can. Right. Speed the process. But im particularly interested in the what you are testifying that dhs is taking steps to reimplement the Family Case Management Program<\/a>. So id be very interested to know what that would consist of. Okay. Well be happy to follow up with the committee. Okay. Thank you. Thank you mr. Chairman. Thank you. Well leave the record open for any insertions or written questions over the appropriate period of time. I just end with this. Its been a very instructive hearing. I hope the president will nominate you to be dhs secretary in a permanent fashion. I cannot think of anybody ive ever met thats more capable of doing the job under difficult circumstances. We will try our best as this committee to get a result that will take some of the pressure off the people in the field. And as to those people, i apologize that its this bad and Congress Just<\/a> cant get our act together. I appreciate what mexico has done. And will do. But thats no substitute for our own country. Changing our laws and trying to find a deal. Thank you very much. [inaudible conversations] well tonight at 8 eerp on the cspan networks democratic president ial candidate senator Bernie Sanders<\/a> appears at George Washington<\/a> university to talk about his views on democratic socialism. See that on cspan. On cspan2, a House Intelligence Committee<\/a> hearing examining the public risks posed by deep fake videos. Its a technology that alters audio or video and the product is then passed off as true or original content. And here on cspan3 at 8 eastern a judiciary subcommittee hearing on the impact of online media platforms on the news industry. Witnesses include officials from various news organizations pan media trade associations groups. All tonight on the cspan networks. Most of us when we think of wints churchill we think of the older man sending young men into war. But no one knew better and few knew as well the realities of war, the terror and the devastation. And he said to his mother after his second war, you know, the raw comes through. You cant gild it. He absolutely knew the disaster that war was. Sunday night on q and a. Historian Candice Millard<\/a> talks about the early military career of Winston Churchill<\/a> in her book hero of the kbir. The bore war a daring escape and the making of winston mcclain. He says give me a regiment i want to go and fight. He ends up going with a regiment to prey torreira on the day it fell to the british. And he takes over the prison. And he frees the men who have been his fellow prisoners. He puts in the prison his former jailers. And he watches as the bore flag is torn down on a the union jack hoisted in its place. Sunday night at 8 eastern on child supports cspans q and achlt. Up next the education secretaries or the school environment. Bill frift is now with the Bipartisan Policy Center<\/a> and hosted former education secretary john king, pennsylvania education secretary pedro rivera appear Healthy Schools<\/a> campaign ceo Rochelle Davis<\/a> in this discussion. Well, good morning, everyone want to welcome all the title is education and health twin pillars for driving students. Good to see all of you. For those of you new to bpc the mission is to actively seek and take the best ideas from both parties to health, security as well as opportunity for all americans. We try principles and politically viable old policy solution through the power of analysis, negotiation and advocacy. Todays event focuses on the bidirectional impact of education and health. 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