no relation. they are really amazing folks and the leading effort and community leading effort behind moving voices and behind this evening tonight. it is amazing to have worked with them the last few weeks in putting together this event. dee dee is a daughter of street a nam war refugees. she's an attorney. she is also an alum. and this makes me really, really proud. she will enter the army j.a.g. for this friday. this is really her last big event in civilian life. >> [ applause ]. and she will ship out to forth benning on friday. so that is it. good-bye to civilian life here for a while. >> and u of l alum and masters from kent school of social work. and she came as a refugee as well with her family in 1994. so without further ado, please welcome our two moderators. and i'm looking forward to an exciting evening. ladies and gentlemen, my name is dede and my colleague is tao. we are not related. it's just a common last name. we are both with moving voices. moving voices, it's our mission to bring more attention to the south vietnamese message. south vietnam risked everything for freedom. it's often a perspective that is overlooked in our public discussion about vietnam war. so we are so thrilled tonight to help the university of louisville put together unheard tales of the vietnam war, south vietnamese perspective. >> we have a great panel here with us. they serve in the republic of vietnam. they have amazing stories of the vietnam war and their journey to kentucky. so i'm going to go ahead and introduce our speakers. dr. gary tran was a cabinet member for the republic of vietnam during the vietnam war. today he is a veterinarian and operates a reading school in louisville, kentucky. he is also the first vietnamese american to be a kentucky colonel. [ applause ]. next we have mr. wen, an american trained pilot in the air force of the republic of vietnam. today he works for catholic charities where he helps refugees in louisville. [ applause ]. mr. lee was an american trained pilot in the air force of the republic of vietnam. today he is an aunt in louisville and haefl involved in the vietnam veterans activities and community service. [ applause ]. dr. quay tran was in the army of the republic of vietnam. today he works as a doctor at fort knox. [ applause ]. and finally we have mrs. hou tran when she married during the war. today she and her husband reside in elizabethtown, kentucky. like dede said before, we have five people up here with the name of tran. none of us are related. >> except for the married couple. i hope they're related. but not in that way. all right. so we want to begin tonight's conversation with a start of the vietnam war. dr. gary tran, you were a veterinary student at the university of oklahoma when the vietnam war broke out. how did you learn about the war overseas and how did you feel about your country going to war? >> thank you, dede. before i say anything, i would like to take this opportunity to convey to our brave veterans, our deep appreciation and profound gratitude for your noble sacrifice during the war. [ applause ]. i learned from the war from tv as a student at osu, like most americans at that time. it was the first tv war, as you remember. every day at 7:00 i would go to the tv for news of the war. and i was very worried for my family because we live in the countryside where the war was happening. of course we saw daily death and destruction. and the feeling was very -- very sad and very a apprehensive. and i was remember i was trying to study so is hard to finish the program. i studied as fast as i could so i could go home. >> you mentioned that your family was from the countryside. you're the son of a farmer. eventually you went back to vietnam to serve as a high-ranking bureaucrat. can you tell us about why they were important to the war. >> my father was a poultry farmer and raised chickens. so when i came to this country i wanted to be taught in poultry science and later veterinary medici medicine. we were the first in what they call the leadership training program sponsored by usaid. at that time every year they send is a dozen young vietnamese that just graduated from high school to go and study different field in the united states. it was called leadership training. there were about a dozen of these programs a all through the war years. of course there were other students sent here to study other fields also. but our group were very special. because from these groups a lot of high officials in the government were selected. i was lucky in the way that all the major agricultural programs of the republic of vietnam at that time were either supervised or reported to me directly. and later on i will mention a few of these programs for you. the one program that was the most important and the most striking was the land reform program. and it was so revolutionary that taylor, the professor of vietnamese studies at cornell university, said that it was the major achievement of the republic of vietnam. the details of that program i have to wait until my colleagues have a chance to answer so that i can have time to go over that program with you. >> so as the vietnam war escalated, south vietnam, like the united states -- sorry. can you hear me better now? so as the vietnam war escalated, south vietnam, like the united states, enlisted the draft. you were drafted into the military as a military doctor. how did you and your family feel when you were drafted? >> i think that before we get into the draft in vietnam at that time, we need to understand the atmosphere in which the vietnamese live at that time. every family has people in the army. nobody is spared that. by that i mean if you are a teacher or professor at school, you have to be in the army to learn about military training. and after that they reassign you to work in the university or do certain school or you go back and become a doctor. so everybody in the 60, 70, 80 families have people some way, somehow connected to the army at some time. so i grew up in that atmosphere. and then i finished med school. the reason i was able to finish med school is because i have a waiver to go to school. if anybody feail during the yea then you are drafted into the army right away. i had friends who were drafted in the middle of the year. and so i finished medicine school in '74. in early '75, after i recently married my wife at the end of '74. i was drafted in january of '75. so that's the way we live. and a little bit anxious but not very surprised. and then my family said because everybody in the family, my father was retired at the time. my brother was already in the army. so there is really nothing particular -- >> so it was very normal for that time period? >> yeah. everybody is in the army. >> mr. lee, you had a different experience. you actually volunteered to join the air force after you graduated from high school. so why did you decide to volunteer? >> yeah. you know, as the doctor has said about that, every family, young people, some way, somehow have to get into the medical field or with any connections. according to the army, you have to be drafted. but for the navy and air force, it's not draft. it's volunteer. so if you were drafted into the army and after you finish the military training, you then apply for the job in air force or in the navy. so that's why for me directly volunteer to the air force. that's my case. >> okay. like most pilots, you were sent to america to finish your training. just as mr. wen to your right did. can you talk about some of your military training in america, mr. lee. >> okay. when i was young, i think i was about 11 or 12 years in middle school. in my neighborhood there is a lot of member of the air force. they have a pistol and on the other side a knife. it looked -- >> frightening. >> sunglasses. ray-ban, yeah. >> cool. >> it was very cool at that time. so i dreamt to be a pilot at that time. and when i went out to high school, i present that to my father. my father is 15-year veteran of the army. he advised me, okay, if you want to join the air force, it depends on you as your future. you have total decision about that. but you have to study hard. you have to exercise more so you can get physically fit. and finally in 1972 they got the campaign at that time. they have the last member for the air force. and i applied for that. after five days of physical examination with a group of 150 people, only 23 people got into the air force. the rest will be going to the army school. the army officer instead of air force officer. i love that you have to be sent over to america for training. that's a good thing. so you can open your mind to the world. when we join the air force, we have more opportunity to learn about american culture. we were sent to lackland air force base under the management of the air force. to train over there. and after four months and we passed several exams as well. and they send us to flight school. >> so after you both did your training, you mr. wen did your training in america. you came back to vietnam to serve. 60)!(psq back to serve as a gunship pilot.to serve as a can you tell us about your most memorable combat experience. >> i was the first in south vietnam air force. we provided fire support to all four military areas in south vietnam. let me tell you a little bit about i flew. i flew one night in a gunshot. it was an aircraft converted to gunship. this aircraft provided low fire support for south vietnamese with the ability to fire up 6,000 rounds per minute from its guns. very deadly. submission was to attack. one night on november 27, 1971, it was thanksgiving day. we found a convoy of five jets. this is a rare catch for the black raven. the test disappeared in the cloud of dust. and i cannot forget was when the gi about to be over were in the air fighting. we didn't want an f-5. get me a black raven. that was happened one night in the summer of 1972. after our boss was on the border of cambodia and vietnam. the vickram attacked. we were outnumbered. there were about 100 in the camp. we came in, dropped a flare to identify our attackers. i saw hundreds of them who tried to get in the camp. i heard on the radio our friend's voice. closer, closer, closer. they had anti-aircraft guns. i showered them with thousands of rounds until i ran it of ammunition. another black raven came to replace us. when i went again back to the base, we found we had been hit. there were four holes on the aircraft. and on this morning i knew we were going to pay a very, very high price for the attack last night. the message we heard on the radio was we won't be here with you. and it made us feel very good when we heard that. thank you. >> [ applause ]. >> as many know, the vietnam war produced huge number of casualties. when we talk about south vietnam actually around 250,000 of south vie aetna vietnamese soldiers were lost. mr. lee was a cia operative and member of the south vietnamese special forces. in this clip he will talk about losing his friends. do you want to turn down the lights? no lights. okay. all right. for anyone on our panel, what are your thoughts after watching this clip? actually, to this clip, i want to give my opinion that the war is always bad. but we have to fight a war if it come. and right now the war has several faces. by intelligence or i.t., something like that. so be careful about that. we have to fight the war, any war, to preserve the peace like that. we prevent the war by preparing for the war. and right now aft people, vietnamese people see it now. they try to fight with the communist government right now. to get the freedom of speech, the freedom of religion. we don't want to fight them but we want to find any means so we can get the freedom for your people in vietnam and everybody in the world as well. thank you. >> with us, we will fight. you know, sometime in the morning we sit together. we have breakfast. we drink coffee. we're joking. but, you know, at noon, i heard he got shot down. he got shut down. never come back. so you see your friend in the morning. at noon, afternoon, you heard he got shot down. this is terrible. so that is the world. the world no one wants to go, yes. but with us, we have to do it. we have to stand against the communists because we have to fight the communist aggression. but unfortunately we lost the war. >> i would like to share with you some of my experience when i worked for. i had the privilege of taking care of many american soldier who come from afghanistan, iraq. and many, many suffer from ptsd. that's what i see the most. and what hurt me the most is many of the wife, when these people come back, they don't recognize them anymore. these people come back really a different person. and many left them. that's what i find out when i take care of these people. even though they come back alive from the war, but this will probably affect them for their whole life. it's lying the men that you see in here. at this age we are still affected through the war that we went through. >> the cause of the war was very high. so the united states military withdrew its support of south vietnam in 1973. for dr. gary tran, how do you feel when the -- america withdrew? >> for us, it was a very puzzling situation. because all along we were told that the united states would support us in our life and death, struggle against against the evil empire, which is communism. but all of a sudden we're left without a lot of low gist cal support to fight during the last year of the war. and it was very disheartening. because i think if we would have had the support that president nixon promised to the support us if the communists violated the court he would retaliate, he would retaliate severely. but that was not forthcoming. so even though we have the will and the manpower to carry on, we could not because of the lack of logistical support for the end of the war. imagine we could not even get $300 million through congress to buy gasoline for our airplane and ammunition for our soldiers. our enemy military got aid from russia, the soviet union. this is why one of the big reasons we lost the war. >> eventually sigh gone, the capital of south vietnam, fell on april 30th, 1975. that date marked the end of the vietnam war. it's a very important date that's engraved in many of our minds. mrs. tran, on that date, april 30th, 1975, where were you and what were you doing? >> i lived in saigon since 1954 when the geneva treaty decided to have our country in two parts. the north we lost to the communists and the south to the nationalists. and my family since they had heard about experience with communist. my parents at the time were very young. 36 and 32 with seven children aging from 11 years old to 4 months old. we left our home from the north and moved to the south to be able to live in freedom. we already had experience with the communists even struggling to start a new life in the south. after a few years my parents would be able to prosper. and all of us went to college. i was in the second year of pharmacy school when i met my husband in med school, who was a medical student through the catholic youth. we waited until we got through with college. in married in may 1974. my husband was dropped after he finished school. so he eventually became lieutenant. and the fall of saigon came before the full five days we heard from his father that an uncle who worked for the cia, and he offered that we can go by plane to the u.s. but there's a lot of people on the list. so we wouldn't be able to go on the first day. it was friday. so we came back home. and then on monday, april 28th, his son called and asked us to come back to waiting for the bus to go to the airport. so it was on tuesday, the 29th. we were in his office and waiting for the bus. but around noon we listened to the radio that the south vietnam government surrendered. so we hurried back home to my parents's home. and at that time the whole big family, my parents, my uncle, my two aunts's family, grandparents, we all prepared to go to the commercial pier to -- where the ships dock to find a way to get on the ship to feed the country. because we have a big family and we had just cause, so we divided by two groups. the first group went to the pier first. and then planning to go back home to pick up the rest of us. but when the first group came to the pier, they saw the atmosphere. it appeared everyone wanted to flee the country. so at that time my father thought about the rest of us still at home. so he decided to go back home. that was on the 29th. on the 30th of april, the communist army invade to the presidential palace. the situation at times was not settled. so we still -- everyone still want to go to flee the country. because there is a rumor that the 7th fleet of the america still in the south china sea. but there's some hesitation because they say the communists might caught us before we get out of there. so we, for a second time, decided to stay. and then life goes on. i came back to the pharmacy. and my husband, he went to his's office to practice for a month. and then in june 1975 the communist government called all of the soepblgs of them to be present and after three days to release them. >> you bring up a really important point about the reeducation camp. on our panel we have two people who went to the great education camp. and the reeducation camp was a way fort north vietnamese to seek revenge upon those who served for south vietnam. they would imprison them. they would torture them. they would forcibly indoctrinate them. we would like to ask mr. wen, after the war you were placed in a reeducation camp for four and a half years. can you describe what life is like in a reeducation camp. >> yes. i was in prison for four and a half years in the reeducation labor camp in north vietnam. while there, the enemies controlled the visitors by using what they call the technique. a bowl of rice with one tiny piece of meat once a month. the technique was decide to keep everyone so hungry they could only concentrate on their hunger, not escape. the prisoners, including myself, were forced to hard labor from sun up to sun down every day under the harsh conditions. first, i was on the team where we plant all kinds of vegetables. and then they put me in the cutting, cutting wood. there were about 15 of us. we went in the forrest early in the morning, cut the trees, carried the wood back to camp in the afternoon. we worked from 6:00 in the morning until 6:00 in the evening. then there are seven. all of us were locked up in one room. there were about 60 prisoners in one room. we slept on the concrete floor. there was no restroom in the room. just one big bucket at the back of the room. it was terrible. and i don't know how i am still alive. my 120 pound weight dropped to 70 pounds before i was finally released. and during my time in the labor camp, i watched many of my friends die beside me. we had to wrap the dead in paper and bury them in unmarked graves. and i can't forget that. it is still a nightmare to me. thank you. >> dr. tran, you also had a similar experience. you were also in reeducation camp for three years but you managed to escape. how do you escape? >> i think that before we talk about the escape i need to have some correction about the term reeducation camp for people who never lived with the communists or for the young people born in the 80s. maybe we talk about reeducation camp like, you know, people go to certain place and have some kind of education, dinner, lunch, then have a break. actually, it is a correctional labor camp in the full sense of the term. but we keep using the term reeducation camp because that's the invention of the communists. it has nothing to do with reeducation. in doctrination. and you came there to work. you work like he described. and then you have indoctrination. when i was in the camp, this was almost three and a half years already. most of my friends are released after two years. we need to understand the atmosphere in which i had to escape. because i have seen people escape and never heard from these people again. and i have seen people who escape and when they caught them, they put them in the connect -- if you know what i mean. these are containers. some -- the shipping companies put people -- the communists put them in the sun and put them in there. so in the years '77 and '78, there's a moment outside in saigon that the communists they let chinese people go. at that time the communists they want to get all the money from the chinese. so they say that if you give me some money, i will let you go. so a lot of people tried to get some paper saying they are chinese, that kind of thing. i lived in the camp at that time. and then my wife, she came and she would tell me that people are going -- some of my family already succeeded in escaping vietnam by that route. so she came and she tell me whether i want to escape. because i was so hopeless. i don't see any way that i can get out. so i decide to go. but i don't know how to escape because it's in the middle of the jungle. and i'm not really a real soldier. i don't know which direction to go. so i said i have to get some help. so i have a chance to talk to one of my friend. they are really soldiers. they know which way to go. and then they -- he was able to get out at the time and go a different direction we usually go to in the morning. and then he agreed to escape with me. so he had a chance to talk to my wife, and then she decided. on the day that we decided to escape, both of us, we go. so the day that -- because every day, i have to go out and work with the other people. as a doctor, i carry some sulfa and other things. medication. it's all we have. some band-aids. then we do out and as soon as we go out, we don't join the group. we go into the jungle. i just follow the other, you know, my friend. then we walk in the jungle for, i don't know, for an hour or two. then we come to a place. we don't see my wife yet. she came. then we keep walking. i think in about an hour or so, finally, we see her with the motorbike, along with his brother. then we escape. >> can i add a detail? i had a permit to visit him every three months to provide supply of food and money. because they don't have enough money to give them food. so the last time it was on -- in january 1979, and he already there three and a half years. so i came to the camp on wednesday, and then we stayed together during the night on wednesday night. i told him the plan, and then i will come back on monday. four days after. so the next day, when he had to go back to the camp with other people to go to do labor, then he told his friend to meet me at the -- on the way to the labor. i talked with his friend about the plan.lied on the friend. he's a professional soldier. he already went out to that area to do labor work a couple months before, so he knew the way. then on monday, we came back. i had to ask my cousin to ride a motorcycle. then the friend's brother, he ro rode another one. when he came to the place, we didn't meet him and his friend. then we saw two men with the clothes. they had to wear military clothes in the camp. the two men carried a bag like on the road, and then we picked them up. just rode back in saigon without any problem. they don't have any intelligence guards on the road. >> very good plan. very good. i admire you. >> i have no choice. >> i admire you. >> we, in the hopeless situation. i don't have any other thing that i can do for my husband, so that's what -- i don't know whether the holy spirit gid edg me to do it or not. [ applause ] >> as the conditions worsened, many tried to escape the country. doctor and his wife eventually escaped by boat and came to america. mr. lee also tried to escape vietnam ten times unsuccessfully. then continued to live in vietnam for the next 30 years. can you describe what life was like under communist vietnam? >> i'm the unlucky people. try many times but fail. i still have lots of friends still in vietnam right now because they don't have any chance to get out. i've been here 13 years. finally, i find my luck. i'm not in a camp. but my friends like the doctor here, in a camp, they try to escape. some of them escaped several times but failed. when they got back to the camp, they tried to kill them. actually, several people have died because of that. is that right? >> yeah. >> yeah. so in the situation of dr. tran here, he's very lucky. it's like playing a game. not a nice game. for me, i'm living under communists 28 years before coming here. you know, the first ten year is very terrible. the whole country, i mean, the south vietnam, i don't talk about north vietnam because i don't know anything about that. i don't think that they are better than the south vietnam people. they don't have enough food for eating. even in the north. and in the south at that time, we don't have enough food, we don't have enough medicine, and we lack everything in the first ten years. you know, the fuel, the kerosene for burning the lights at night and for cooking, as well, we lack that, as well. at that time, nobody want to play with the communist. and the people in the south vietnam, they tried to get out. the western country outside, they don't want to play with them, the communists. so finally, the first year, the second year and then the third year, we don't have anything left. so that's why i put that, about ten years. the first ten year is very, very terrible for the whole south vietnam people. after ten year, it's a little better. after ten year, after ten year, after ten year. in 1975, 20 years later, the vietnam and the united states, they got diplomatic relationship again. so from '95, it got more improvement. >> we're glad you were able to finally make it here to america. like most of our speakers here, most ended up in kentucky through a federal resettlement program. today, more than 5800 vietnamese americans live in kentucky. we expect more that are currently living here. we think tank the speakers for sharing their stories with us. our time is limited. what we'd like to do is open up our panel for questions from the audience. just a reminder, again, you do have to speak into the microphone. there is only one in the room, so please wait for the microphone to come to you before you ask your question. the lady in the front. >> thank you. the three gentlemen to my left, were you able to bring your families? is this on? >> yes. >> yes. >> yes. >> congratulations. >> the question was, for the three gentleman on the left, were you able to bring your families over? >> thank you for your wonderful description. is this on? okay. thank you very much for your service and your -- >> the mic is actually for c-span, so it's just picking up for their mics. we'll repeat your question. >> okay. there's been a great deal of discussion about agent orange. there are two sides. it's something that was used in war, and as said, war is always terrible. others feel it saved american lives. i'm curious, as americans who came from the south of vietnam, what are your feelings about this? i would tell you, i've been working for 30 years in vietnam on this topic. i'm curious to know your perceptions and thoughts about agent orange. >> can you repeat that, just the question? >> it's about agent orange. the gentleman has been working on it. it saved people's lives, but asking your opinion on agent orange. >> the question was about agent orange, and do any of the panelists have any experience or opinions about agent orange? and your perceptions, as well. we'll take one question at a time. we'll do the agent orange question. anybody on the panel, go ahead. >> well, i feel -- >> speak into the mic. >> i feel deeply indebted to the american soldiers who fought and died for our country. and i saw the courage when i -- you know, when we fought along with them, you know. because he flew with us. he flew us on combat missions. i very appreciated that. i feel that i owed the american soldiers. they are far away. they came and fought for us. they died for us. i'm very grateful. >> yes. we are grateful about the american soldier and officer to come to our country to fight against communism. but the communists, they used the term fighting against the imperialism of america. actually, it was a civil war between the -- two different idealism. it's not fighting american, but they used that term to draw young people to go with them and fighting against the south vietn vietnam. >> did any of our panelists have a response to the gentleman's question in the back about agent orange? if not, we'll move on to the next question. >> i don't have much knowledge about the agent orange. the only thing i know is that, in vietnam, they have some kind of center because they wanted to get the money, compensation, for the united states, so they -- everything that they say that this is from agent orange. i don't know more about that. the only thing i know is they wanted to get the money for the americans. the people who have compensation, they say it's from ajegent orange. that's all i can think of. >> i want to add a little bit more about agent orange. according to my knowledge, the american soldier came to vietnam and back here, and now a day, they have the agent orange. they got compensation. they got treatment. i think so. but, you know, in vietnam, the people there, from the north, from the south, or the civilian in the war, they still are affected by the agent orange, as well. but they don't have anything. they don't have any compensation. they don't have any treatment. that's what i want to bring up. thank you. >> you know, the agent orange was used in remote area where there's no people living there, except the communists. in jungles, in places where they can hide to ambush our forces. we have to use these chemicals to defoliate, so you can see who's hiding where, so we don't die from their ambush. i don't think the americans used -- not chemical in places where there are people li iving. hardly anybody live, except the communists. if the communists are poisoned by that, so be it, you know? because they come to kill us. >> they were enemies. >> yeah. >> next question. >> we are the ambassadors of singapore, six months ago, spoke to the world affairs council. he made an argument, talk to you about domino theory and what happened after the u.s. left vietnam. what he said is during the mid-'60s, when singapore had been independent, trying to decide whether to go communist or capitalist, he said based on the u.s. participate in vietnam, they went the capitalist model. i never heard that. what would your reaction be? >> the ambassador of singapore was here, and he talked about the independence of singapore and whether or not they were going to be choose to be a free country or some nis kocommunist. they looked at vietnam -- >> they looked at the u.s. participation in vietnam, which what he said was influential, and they went the capitalist model. >> they looked at the u.s. involvement in vietnam, and they decided to go with the capitalist route. have any of the panelists heard of this before? have thought on that? >> i was too young. really, i don't know much about politics. >> but i think a million people lacked the home in the north to the south that speak out about whether we like communism or not. most people in south vietnam and even some of the vietnamese who stayed behind in the north, they don't like communists at all. we have no freedom. they kill people, and they use the term of killing people who have possession. they're praising the poor. after we stayed behind, after 1975, everyone became poor. no one had anything. there was no freedom to do anything. they destroyed the seymmetry no just in the area, but all around, as well. everyone had to create family members who were deceased, they used the symmetry in the center to become a garden. so you can believe what the communists say, just watch them. >> i agree. that's what our last president said. he said that, listen to what they said and what they have done. if you look at the facts, north and south vietnam, we are the south. we did not invade the north. the north came and invaded us. with the south vietnamese people. the communists, they did not like we do that. we have to stand up to defend ourse ourself. i think the lack of fear in vietnam, but the fear in the united states. we lost the war. i was a pilot, but i have -- i was rerouted for years, because no gas, no fuel. no ammunition. of course, we lost the war. not in vietnam, the u.s. the front line of the battlefield in here, the united states. but in vietnam. we lost the war because the people in the united states, because the congress, because of congress, starved, you know. support for us. the north had support from russia and china. >> nobody would want to live under communism in their right mind. once the people know what communism is, they usually flee. that's why more than half of a million -- most people die trying to escape from communism. if they let people go freely, the whole country could leave vietnam right now. except the few thousand or hundred thousand communists. that regime had to use police to force people to live there. >> we'll take a question in the back. i think i saw a hand in the back. >> there was a vietnamese orphanage run by vietnamese nuns. what happened to the vietnamese religious people? the ministers, priests, nuns. >> what happened to the vietnamese religious people? >> as i understood, because i live in saigon, so i would be able to go to the church and have activity and a choir, but people who live in the countryside, they have to wake up very early in the morning to go to church on sunday. because they forced them to work on sunday. later on, i heard about many places. they tried to take on the properties of the church, even the symmetry. so they still have a lot of struggle between the government and the religious people. some of the priests are bishop. if they speak out, and they have to put them in prison. >> next question, please. >> thank you. there is a film making rounds on pbs called "last days in vietnam" by rory kennedy. my wife and i saw it and it made a great impression. have you seen it and what was your general impressions of the film? more specifically, there is an assertion in the film that north kr vietnam intended to honor the peace accord, because they were afraid of richard nixon. when the watergate scandal broke, and he was weakened politically, that encouraged them to invade the south. what is your opinion? >> this gentleman say the film "last days in vietnam," and what were your impressions, if you've seen it? also in the film, there was an assertion that the north vietnamese invaded after they saw that the nixon watergate scandal. what are your thoughts on that? >> i agree with that assertion. because if there were no watergate, probably president nixon would respond, would retaliate to the fragrant violation of the paris accord. >> but i have another thought about nixon. when we see president nixon have agreement with china, and at that time, probably vietnam is not the front line for the freedom country anymore, so the people in america, because of the loss of 58,000 american soldier, and losing money, so they don't want to lose more people and money anymore. i think that's the -- which is a pawn on the chess board. we have nothing to fight besides the aid from the americans. if the americans withdraw from afghanistan now, i think it will be terrible. so when the president came over here last week to call, to have 14,000 american soldiers stay behind in afghanistan, to ensure the freedom of afghanistan. >> all right. next question? >> dr. gary tran, you said everyone in vietnam would leave except for a select few people. if given the opportunity to right now. i know in recent years, over the last couple of decades, we've opened up relations with vietnam. do you all agree with this policy of the united states? >> the gentleman said that dr. gary tran said that if people could leave vietnam, they would except for a select few. recently, the united states has opened up with vietnam. what are your thoughts, dr. gary tran, on that? >> with the presence of the american embassy in vietnam, and with the foreign contact that came to vietnam to invest, i think the life over there gets better because the communists tend to pay attention to world opinion. for international aid and such. that's why, you know, with the western presence, tend to be better. compare vietnam with north korea, which is, you know, very c contrasting difference. in north korea, there is hardly any western presence. that country is pure and unadulterated hell. vietnam, at least people don't have freedom, don't have human right, they don't have a lot of things that we enjoy here, but still, life is better than other places. so i think, opening relations like this is helpful for the people's lives over there. >> i think the worst thing in vietnam now, if you -- you can see it, corruption everywhere in vietnam. so the worst thing in vietnam now. and you can see the difference between the rich and the poor in vietnam, and a big gap. so the minority, the communists, the communist party. they got rich because they got corruption. a lot of people, so many people, you know, very poor. very, very poor. >> next question? >> this is a question for dr. gary tran. you were agricultural commissioner, whatever the title properly is. my understanding was -- or is that vietnam was a largely rural, fundamentally agricultural country before all the trouble, so to speak, and was a net exporting country for rice. a very rich agricultural economy. you talked about some of the programs that you were starting there. i'd like to hear more about that and what the consequences of the war were for agricultural. and the nation's self-sufficiency in terms of food. >> before you answer, i'll repeat the question. dr. gary tran, you were the agricultural specialist in the country. before the war, vietnam was largely rural and agricultural. a net exporting rice country. what consequences did the war have on the economy? agricultural economy. >> land reform and agricultural development are the two major achievements of the republic of vietnam, but nobody talk about it. in 2012, cornell university invited about a dozen of us high officials in the government, you know. i remember there were four cabinet members and two -- one general and one admiral and a few politicians and parliamentari parliamentarian, who were all there for a symposium. there is a book to come out, and i wish you all read about it, because these are the things that nobody talk about in the 3,000 books and novel published on vietnam and the vietnam war. okay? i want to read -- because the achievement in agricultural is so massive, that it would take me at least a day to talk about it. because when i gave the talk at cornell university, they give you three days for the whole bunch. my feel, it took a whole day, because of that. please, if you're interested in that, get this book. i will leave one book. you guys can use it. let me -- code one -- a couple sentence from the introduction of the book. from the only vietnamese study professor in the united states. this is what he said to introduce the book. the stereotype among americans at that time and later, even to this day, of the second republic government as dictatorship that eserved to be defeated is, perhaps, a convenient slander, but it is a slander nevertheless. the effort of vietnamese to create a democratic government under adversity is a story that has yet to break through the self-serving american myth that has shrouded what is probably the most revived, abandoned ally in u.s. history. the aim in compiling this volume is not only to retrieve vietnamese voices from the second republic before they're gone, but also to give americans the options of finally, after half a century, seeing more clearly the ally for whom thousands of americans gave their lives. so the section on agricultural development and reform is 50 pages long out of this 150-page book. to tell you how massive the achievement in that field is, you have to read this book. >> thank you very much. i'm going to take the privilege of asking the last question, because i know all of you live here in louisville. so if you could say here in one or two sentences, please, we're running out of time, how you came to louisville, leaving vietnam as refugees and escaping camps or otherwise making your way out of vietnam. then afterwards, i would like to invite all of you to ask further questions outside at the reception, where there's chance for conversation and also for the chance at the exhibit, to learn more about the conflict and those memories. first, how did you come to louisville? >> me? >> any. >> i was lucky because when i came here -- when i came to the united states, one of my classmate classmate classmates offered me a job. i came here to work for him for ten years. after that, i split off. then practice veterinarian medicine on my own. then 25 years ago, i started to train louisvillian kids to be good in math and english. see how good she is? she's one of my 3,000 smart kids that we trained throughout school. that's why i became a kentucky colonel. not because i did anything in vietnam. actually, i did a lot in vietnam, if you read this book, you will see. but because i trained 3,000 children in louisville to be super good in math and reading, and they later had the awesome college education. >> thank you very much. thank you all for coming. [ applause ] our coverage of presidential candidates at the iowa state fair continues saturday with a couple of republicans. new jersey governor chris christie is scheduled for noon eastern. a little later, louisiana governor bobby jindal is at 1:00. you can go to c-span.org to see our coverage of the iowa state fair, including democratic kond dates, bernie sanders, hillary clinton, jim webb and martin o'malley. at the end of the vietnam war in april 1975, after the last americans had been evacuated from saigon, a small destroyer escort ship, the uss kirk, was given orders to return. its mission was to rescue the ships of the south vietnamese navy and tens of thousands of vietnamese refugees. coming up next, jan herman, historian and author of "the lucky few, the fall of saigon and the rescue mission of the uss

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