Democracy. Correct nasa administrator bill nelson testified on President Biden 2025 budget request for the agency before the house science, space, and technology committee. He was asked to comment on a number of topics including u. S. russia space relations for de orbiting of International Space station, competition with china and Public Private partnerships. This is two hours and 15 minutes. The committee will come to order. That objection shares authorized to declare recess of the committee at any time. Welcome to todays hearing entitled an overview of the teBudget Proposal for the natiol aeronautics and Space Administration for fiscal year 2025. I recognize myself for five minutes for an opening statement. Today we hear testimony from administrator nelson about the president s25 Budget Proposal fr nasa for fiscal year 2025. This committee plays an Important Role in nasas mission by providing policy direction authorizing activities for the agency. While we make progress with language included in the 2022 chips in science act, it is been more than seven years in the last comprehensive nasa reauthorization bill was signed into law. I am certain everyone in this room including the administrator can agree seven years is far too long. As many of our experts have highlighted in Committee Hearings this year, a lot has changed for nasa since 2017. You must approach an authorization bill with these changes in mind and address a few major topics. The first topic is artemis. I speak for members on both sides of the aisle when i express the strongest support for americas return to the lunares surface. Tough questions about the execution of the program. Second topic is nasas role in low earth orbit International Space station is retired. We heardbu several prospects on this topic in february look forward to continuing this dialogue as we move forward. A third topic is nasas management of Science Missions within the agencys portfolio. We support nasa during to do big things particularly in science how can congress ensure particulate Flagship Missions remain on schedule and within budget . A sweet deliberate on these topics we consider this important reauthorization legislation we must also keep in mind recent budgetary issues. Nasa does not lack plans for future exploration efforts. By this returning astronauts to the moon or developing new aviation technology. However these ambitions come at a cost at may of 2023 President Biden sign fiscal responsibility act capping federal Discretionary Spending fy 24 and fy 25. One of our challenges would be to draft a reauthorization bill that complies with that law or providing sufficient support for execute these all inspiring missions. Failing to do so will force nasa to do take on more work than they have the funding to accomplish which will not only set nasa up for failure by asking them to do too much with too little. By providing proper oversight and authorizing language. This committee Adequate Funding for the agencys activities. Important u. S. Competitivenessis and research and Technology Development globally. And today is no different. U. S. Remains the Global Leader in Space Exploration we face increasing challenges internationally. Just last week china reiterated its commitment to planning to astronauts upon the lunar surface by 2030. Later this week china intends to launch a mission to retrieve samples from the far side of the moon if they are successful china will be the first country to dosu so. We cannot allow china to become the front runner in Space Exploration. There are too many consequences for competitiveness, or National Security, our continued ability to explore space. With clear direction from Congress Nasa willsp ensure the u. S. Remains Global Leader inth space continues to inspire millions of people around the world. I want to welcome administrator nelson back to the committee he served for many years. I look forward to working with you as we move forward with our nasa authorization bill. I now recognize the Ranking Member at the gentlewoman from california for ane opening statement. Thank you,fo mr. Chairman. I joined chairman lucas and joining administrator nelson back to the committee to discuss the president s Budget Proposal for nasa. We appreciate your leadership at nasa and that you are here again today. What can be times of geopolitical economic and environmental strife nasa continues to be a bright spot. A northstar that sparks wonder and curiosity about our planet, our solar system and the universe. Nasas mission to advance space and Earth Science, human exploration, aeronautics, Space Technology and Stem Education continues to bring us together and that is something we need. Here in congress is brought bipartisangy support for the mission beyond the United States nasa continues to lead us in activities that serve the peaceful exploration and utilization of outerspace. The value of these intangible benefits cannot be underestimated. Nor can we forget the direct value nasa r and d has had on societal challenges such as climate change, space, whether even on tracking, characterizing potentially hazardous near earth asteroids todays discussion provides an important opportunity to examine nasas ns progress towards meeting our policy goals for the United Statess. Civil Space Program to identify opportunities for improvement and understand what nasa means and budget tort workforce and Infrastructure Resources to accomplish its inspiring mission. The president fiscal yearr request is 25. 384 billion about a 3 increase in the enacted fiscal year 2023 appropriations. I believe this request allows us keep the artemis to demonstration on track advancing moon to mars activities and investing in Sustainable Aviation among other activities. However, last years agreement does impose caps on Discretionary Spending and that presents challenges to all our federal research and develop an agencys. Nasa is no exception. S on the 2020 request highpriority science recommended National Academy acy surveys cannot be initiated. The timeline for a mars sample return is to be determined. Previously selected Science Missions are being pushed to the right or even cancel other productive signs observatories such as the chandra xray observatory proposed to be phased out. Humaned exploration nasas plans call for transitioning from use of the International Space station to commercial lower platforms at the end of the decade were at the same time nasa plans to begin an annual cadence with Artemis Missions to the moon. In short a wave is building for there is no sugar coating the current Budget Proposal. I recognize the tough decisions need to be made. It is essential this committee understand the decisions and proposals over others as we evaluate tradeoffs and it is imperative nash nasa has clear plans for action on the other side of thede budget horizon. Lot is at stake. Im especially concerned is a charm and mentioned about reductions in orc force including those in my home state ofac california resulting from prolonged mission timelines. Losing skilled talent as a further setback that cannot be erased. We need to work holistically at the implications of the 2025 proposal on the health of nasati now and in the future. How will we positioned nasa to meet the future . Will we stay on the tail is other nations that do not share our values advance as a charm and has expressed . As Ranking Member i will continue to ensure we positioned nasa for success. And that the United States continue to lead in the exploration of outerspace. I want to thank you administrator for your extraordinary leadership of nasa. We welcome you back and thank you for your service. I yieldnt back. Thank you Ranking Member but let me introduce our witness for todays hearing mr. Bill nelson has served 14th in administering the National Aeronautics and Space Administration. Administrator nelsons career includes over four decades in public service. He represented florida in both chambers during his 30 years in congress. And i committees Space Science and application subcommittee. Thats a real resume item mr. Director. Mr. Chairman, with your permission to submit might my writtenstatement in the reco. And if i may just give you a couple of thoughts and then lets get to your question. Without opposition absolutely. Nasa is a storied organization. Inin this agency does Amazing Things. A lot of the things we do is right on the edge. And next monday night about 10 30 p. M. We are going to launch another vehicle. It is human rated this is the first time america has ever had three human rated spacecraft. On the one that will go to the moon which is o ryan on top of the big rocket sls. The dragon which flies on the falcon nine and is part of the commercial crew and Cargo Services to and from the International Space station. And now the third one, boeing star liner. This is the first test flight. We have two test pilots. Butch wilmore and sunny williams that are applying this test flight. And if successful then we will have three. Thats the first time this has ever happened. It is all a part of us continuing to, and the human Space Program, explore the heavens. We are learning so much on the International Space station. It is an International Space station. Fifteen nations participate. There is science that is just coming of age. Some of the pharmaceutical research is just going to knock our socks off. We are also going back to the moon after a half a century. We are going back, not just to go to the moon but for the reason of learning enough so we can send humans to mars and the decade of the 2040s. Nasas science program, you read about all of the time. The James Webb Space Telescope, look at what it is discovering out in the universe. And i could go on and on for the Aviation Program we are going to fly the needle nose jet this year. Proving a different design that we can fly passengers supersonic across popular areas and not have the big bang bang of the sonic boom. It would be more of a muffled roar. And so it goes on it on. I will stop right there well before the five minutes mr. Chairman and be delighted to try to answer your questions. Thank you director nelson of your testimony of the chair recognizes himself for five minutes. Administrator nelson it was racially reported nasa is considering changing the Mission Profile for artemis three. Thee Mission Schedule for september of 2026 which is currently intended to land humans on the lunar surface. The potential change in profile would result in a mission where astronauts do not land on the lunar surface but rather remain in low earth orbit. His nasa actively considering an alternative Mission Profile for artemis three . What is going on mr. Administrator . Mr. Chairman, this is part of our commercial program at spacex has signed up to land in september of 26. Next year, september of 25 we are going to launch a crew of four. Three americans and a canadian. And they will test out the spacecraft. And it will circle the moon and come home. I year after that comment spacex has signed up to provide a lander were we would go into a new kind of orbit. A polar orbit, and irregular or elliptical orbit. The crew will transfer into the lander. Now that is what is in the contract. The article that you are referring to is speculation. What happens if they are not ready . Well, naturally people think about these things. But the plan is to land. It would be to astronauts of the crew of four that would get into the lander and go down and land. And i might say, think about the toapollo program. And the Artemis Program. Artemis three, the first lander spacex is contracted for, is the equivalent of apollo nine, apollo 10, and apollo 11. So it is a very accelerated program. Very much so mr. Administrator for the 2023 strategy for Planetary Science suggested a total cost 5. 3 billion for the mars sample return. Significant increases to the estimate have several project reviews including ongoing efforts to reassess the program. As nasa reconsiders the approach for the mars sample return is nasa still targeting a total project cost 3. 5 billion . 3. 5 is unrealistic. But i pulled the cord on it mr. Chairman about two weeks ago because the independent review boards had said the cost was going up to 11 billion. It was very possible we were not even going to get the sample back until 2040. And that simply unacceptable. And so what i did was i said i want to go out to all nasa centers which includes the jet Propulsion Laboratory. I want to go out to industry which we now have done with a request for information to come up with new ideas. By the way i checked in yesterday with the head of the jet Propulsion Laboratory on how theirch ideas are and they are quite excited about coming up with new ideas. That can bring the cost down and get the sample back earlier progress with enthusiasm to those. Domestic supplemental request to congress requesting funding for usd orbit vehicle to safely decommission the iss as well as funding to help rebuild the nasa facility in guam and the Armstrong Flight Research center. Congress is not past eight supplemental package yet to date. As the funding for the guam hurricane package included an fy 25 budget request . And no, sir. Its just like the department of defense. That request for the guam dishes is to request an emergency supplemental. That is a result of a typhoon. Our request is 400 million of which we have been cutting and pasting and chewing gum with bailing wire as an interim solution. Our request pales in comparison to the dod. An dod is Something Like 2 billion request ours is 400 million. But also in that request is the request for the funding for the d orbit vehicle. Why is it an emergency . And it should not be in the regular request for appropriations. Because we do not know what Vladimir Putin is going to do. We built the International Space station with the russians for be operated with the russians. We have had no hiccup whatsoever with the russian cosmonauts. Nor moscow. Mission control and Houston Mission control of which we have both the russians and americans in both. We do an integrated crew on the soil use up a desert american astronaut on the dragon. There is a russian cosmonauts. But we dont know what the president of russia is going to do but we could be in an emergency situation that we have to get this structure that is as big as a football stadium down and down safely in 2031. That is why i am making the request i am pleading to you all in the Appropriations Committee to put that in the emergency supplemental bill that will be coming up later provokes how much money are we talking about mr. Administrator for the d orbit vehicle . Fiscal year 24180000000 for the total cost over six years is going to be a billion and a half. My time is exported turns the Ranking Member for her questions for five minutes. Thank you very much mr. Chairman and mr. Administrator. You have to make some tough decisions given the budget and i do not envy you for that. It was interesting to hear about the mars sample return decision and i understand it better now that youve given us your testimony. T are we really starting over with a clean slate on this . Or what is the need for additional Technical Analysis . Where are we on this . We are not starting over. As a matter fact i am just saying we cant do it at 11 million per. For. And not disagree with that prick is a sample and not even a return until 2040. So, let me give you an example of what the director of the jet Propulsion Laboratory said. They are looking at instead of this huge mars lander that would then have an Asset Vehicle which was the original concept and one thing of many that was running the cost away up. Use existinghi legacy proven techniques a