The m work my job but gave me my voice. What was your career path . I started in 1999 marketing assistance marketing level and work my way up and held that post for eight years which is a really long time. Became the grand president but was outspoken about Public Schools and after a twoyear conflict there was no place for me anymore. What the job of chief marketing officer . Your responsible for the image and generating demand revenue, profitable revenue ideally. All the communication that goes into establishing the products from the brand and all that, all of the advertising and the search market, its a lot of stuff. Is and was levis a good Corporate Citizen live up to its profits to principles . I would argue absolutely not. Are you part ofin pushing th . I was, i was proud what for people who dont know, we are all about profit and i say we like iy still work there but we can make money we can treat employees fairly. I believe in that. For a very long time for their employee principles i was proud of and integrate factories before they require it,co the first to offer samesex benefits, extending rights to all employees and i would say five to eight years, thats not how it is. Its about performance culture that demands obedience to a single view and everyone else is silenced or pushed out the door. Voted democrat or green party my life but asked a lot of questions about the policies primarily by leftwing governors and mayors and policies around school closures. Not only completely broke but harmful to the people they were claiming to protect which is true. They harm children and disadvantaged children the most. Its what it meant to be a democrat and we were supposed to bend the champions of the underg yet we are punishing them while keeping it for ourselves. I found hypocrisy and it made me feel the dogma platform was a lie. Levis friend president , explain what that is, for you reported to the ceo . I was good i was reporting directly to the ceo which is unusual become president was meant the marketing and communication for all the products, the designs reported and merchandising and a bunch of stuff but thats the main differencece so anything you wod interact with, it came from me and my team. If you saw an ad, put on a pair of pants, who did the. Who is trooper . The ceo of levi. Remaining today . Remarks to the ceo and he will probably retire soon. About 65. Military guy and work that Procter Gamble for 20 years and the ceo of the biden 200011. I think his politics were fairly conservative whenn he joined levi, he said that to me directly. More and more leftwing which im fine. But view, that is not principal. Do you consider him a friend . Did you at one time . Not a friend but a mentor. Did you trust him at one time . Not entirely, no. A lovehate and asked me before, the question. You write a lot, but. Yes. I was grateful the 2011 when he joined, ive been at the company for a lot of years of the time so a young person and managers have the tendency to see you as you work then so a hard time breaking through. I dont know what i was, he was like shes good andnd he gave ma lot of opportunity. He overlooked me for a lot of opportunity that i didnt include in the book because its boring but there were several jobs. No, i didnt fully trust in but i didly believe he really thougt i was good at what i do. By do not get the ceo job in a nutshell . I was outspoken about covid restrictions. You meet on social j media . Yes, social media but also i wrote offense and that rallies to get schools in playgrounds open. I wasnt a keyboard warrior, i was active in the community and took my civic is possibilities seriously and those participating in the process. Did you enjoy your time at levis . I did until the last two years the last two years were very difficult. I sent over two decades, i have a lot of friends. Go to baby showers, windy, people you believe arere your friends and not a Single Person sat by me. In the subtitle of your book you talk about woke mop, i want to quote from levis unbuttoned. Woke capitalism seeks to build Consumer Loyalty through social justice rather than what the Company Makes themselves. Capitalism tries to convince Buyers Companies are in business for good and make the world a better place, not my money. Woke capitalism brainwashed the world with the message that corporations care about employees even when they lay them off at the same time they deliver unimaginable wealth to shareholders and executives through dividends and stock pricing. Sounds about right. Thats the issue, its a lie. Orders in executive Conference Rooms something akin too if we take this and align with their values, being the consumer they will find more. Thats what they say. I was in the room for ten years about what they said. Younger employees believe in it. They are true believers. Executives believe in it. They wrap themselves in virtue, appeal to consumers and we see that backfire to some extent but keep the money for themselves and theres so much hypocrisy and ill give you an example in the book, under the cover, levi laid off 15 of their workforce and said we did it with empathy among thats what the headlines fred. At the same time that same timeframe the ceo cash out 43 million in stocks. Thats the empathy for the common worker. Empathy would be fighting to keep the jobs, fighting to open the stores keep working. That would be the empathetic response. And autobiography because you talk about your life and what you were doing before levis, what did you bring forth . I wrote my first book about experience, a bit of a whistleblower account. I loved it until i didnt kind of like levi, a cruel and abusive culture, physically and emotionally and sexual abuse. The doctor for over 30 years. You are the National Champion, correct grammar correct. How much pain were you in . To make a lot of pain. I one that on a broken ankle. Broken that night. Is that difficult for gymnasts . To perform and that type of shape. Yes do to you as you grew into adulthood . Its soul crushing to live in the physical pain is difficult as long and you are a limp piece of garbage and come on you for something wrong because there was by the coaches, it will make you will unravel emotionally and im lost and ability because i was unraveling and we were starting ourselves, anorexia is very common and it was forced by our coaches cheating you need to lose 3 pounds by tomorrow, i dont care how you do it. They literally would say that. , i was deteriorating by the day and walked away a few months. So two years prior. I was not the National Champion play the community, its very difficult and shes the worst National Champion and conflicted relationship, im a 17yearold kid finished they started to go down in and i had broken my femur only nine months earlier so everybody thought i was down for the count but i was the yocomeback kid. How much of your i identity from age four to 17 or 19] in this . Two 100 . All of it. I didnt have an identity outsides of it. That was what was so difficult outside of living for any elite athlete, have no identity outside of that. Regularly it was a new thing for you . I was traveling all low ground world, i lived on my own. I was so completely immature, ive never been on a date. I didnt have normal social interactions but i went to college, i went to stanford and on a mission to be the not read the a little rebellious. For you on a gymnastics scholarship didnt go that route. I wanted to do it on my own merit. After stanford, what happened . Mckay moved to San Francisco in 1992, the best place i ever lived in my whole life, i loved it so much. It was the home for anyone who felt like a weirdo, i was embracing and everyone was welcome and you could be as weird as he wanted me and i wanted to be weird. I was so obedient as a child i really wanted to push the venerable but i love the filled with artists and young people, thats not true anymore, they cant afford to live there. Now it millionaires have nothing but i loved it for so long. About left San Francisco so my children could attend school and i miss what was the. Thats what you do when you y are young and i worked at and eventually i landed in advertising in 1984 and found myself it was happening what time in your career are you making the money the cmo or president would be making in San Francisco . Probably in 2014 myself compensation and all of that i remember when i became cmo somebody accidentally sentt me a spreadsheet with everyones salary at my levels, you mean to send it to me and i was the lowest a question and i was like what what my doing . I always not been good about. You do to restrain the book about meeting with hr and no increase in pay and i agreed to the it was stupid. So crime did you start to become known as the troublemaker. I dont think i hate to use that word. A nice way to put it. I think the real was be qanon conspiracy theorist is when i became known as. I started, i was outspoken the start like march 2020 question. I didnt get a call early will until september 2020. I knew it wasy controversial ad my friends are like what are you doing . Maybe they are not on twitter, maybe they just didnt notice that i was wrong in the the fiscal 2022 my. Who is the head of corporate clinical and people were noticing and i said so . Your kids areen in school, like this will arrive at school. Public school, your kids still in in public school. At that level, is attempting to go quick and didnt want to limit your children from real, they are neighbors. I want to be part of the city we live in. We are not better than the people we live around. Back to revise will invoice you for this, you can put up we care about them and you think you all the other letters but when the rubber hits the road, its about maintain his will you strength to you will going to work because you seem like they might buy more and spend more and the right person said out loud. Is its refreshing, right things like this . It is refreshing. Obviously i said what i thought on the issue of covid but i look back and proud of how i put myself. Suite in the book. I think its important because any reasonable person things they are personally reasonable and i wanted to make that clear. I would challenge anyone to challenge anything i said. I am diplomatic, restrain, most people who are rational and say i dont get what was wrong with the. But i am more free now on that which is fraying, liberating. Ive also been called every name, im not afraid of what they will call me, i laugh at it now. Who remembers the woke mob you refer to . There various cohorts. There young employees, small minority send emails to hr, a cohort of employees who called me racist, qanon conspiracy theorist and struggle session. I had to do an apology for it and i was briefed before the apology and i was already president and i was told i need to do an apology. Therely is an email that prepad me i found after i wrote the book that basically says you need to prove youou are one of , not one of them, you are one of the good guys not a bad guy. People think you are racist, they think you are his peers he theorist and anti vaccine and you need to prove you are not. Where did the racist part come in with your tweets . Its very convoluted. The idea was if you want schools to open populated by black and brownno children, they did not care if black and brown children died, that was the rationale. Where does qanon fall . I dont understand that one. Im not sure qanon israel to this day but i dont know, i cant explain that. The anti vaccine. , are you vaccinated . I am but i didnt want to be. It was for your job . Yes. Why did you not want to . I looked at my profile, it was very low risk and unnecessary to me. Another quote from the book. Dont get me wrong, im not against capitalism, far from it. I am against the charade that is social justice capitalism. I want too buy stuff because its the best on the market. When the over with your excellence and illl pay for it. I will express my political affiliation, not my sneakers are soft drink of choice. Can you walk around and identify peoples political affiliation by what they wear . Certainly if they are wearing like a Roman Rainbow swish with this a nike symbol with pride month. Very brands that express conservative apparel, i cant think of apparel brands. Thats why i have no job. [laughter] are you financially secure because of your past employment tax is none of my business but yes but i cant not work for the rest of my life, im not that kind of financially secure. Im in no danger of my kids going hungry and i need a job. He left the city of San Francisco after all this happened, correct . I left in the midst because spring of 21 schools bill showed no sign ofde opening, i had a kindergartner who never stepped foot in a classroom, for children my kindergartner had classroom in his first year of school i didnt want to be such a disaster, i wanted him to have a good experience and a good feeling about school so we moved to denver and our offices were closed and we were working virtually so i sent could attend school in person. Why denver . A few reasons. I want to the city still, i wasnt prepared to move i just wasnt ready. Its close enough tofr San Francisco and i still had in person meetings with my team and colorado theret is a bit of a libertarian streak. Its very gloomy right now but they are welcomingi all. I never felt afraid to raise anything and have an open honest conversation. Even the governor he called himself a democratic libertarian so i like the. Do you talk to anyone from levis anymore . Or were you shunned . I was shunned. I talked to a few people who have left since then who have reached out to me. Has anyone said sorry . No. Do you think you deserve an apology . I do but im not waiting for one. How is it you are able to write what you wrote here . I said no nda. When i was told in january that i needed to leave, you need to go now is what they said, there is no room for you at this company. If you sign the nondisclosure agreement, who will give you 1 million. That was the offer. I decided not to do that because i didnt want to sign a nondisclosure agreement so i can write this book not for the money, its not that muchas mony but i thought it was important to tell the story of censorship. If i relate my story in particular, have an open and honest conversation about kids in schools and lockdowns, it would be a different position rather than having an open conversation where people were demonized and the platform and its very dangerous. The fact that you were demonized ratherd than having n open and honest discussion regardless of what the outcome of the discussion would have been, that his innocence . If there had been a society wide conversation with doctors and epidemiologists not just government led talking points, there were people, renowned doctors pushing back. They were censored but if we were committed to have the conversation i think it would be a different answer and our children in california would not have been out of school for so many months. It caused a lot of harm and even if we didnt, we still need to have those discussions. You were demonized as well for what h youre daniel said, s that. Correct . Thats all conjecture but i dont think anybody asking the ceo. Nobody was all that concerned. Lockdowns he was not in favor and was making that noon on social media. He was very vocal and will go to anti valleys. I thought it was a a bridge everybody could get behind, i husband was outspoken more broadly about a range of issues and more pressing but he doesnt work that. Who cares . But apparently if you have a relative with a view the company doesnt like and you dont get to work there anymore and i want everybody to know how dangerous this is. What if he is a trump voter . What he was, does that mean i cant have a job that levi . Is not the world we want to live in . Did you know conservative republicans who voted for donald trump atev levi . No not part of the Company Culture . I will tellme you headquartes are in San Francisco such a not. Its a matter of mainstream candidate for the left, or you bernie or biden . There were no republicans but we also had texas and Distribution Centers in the middle of the country. I am certain there were lots of folks who didnt vote republican or trump. I bet they did not feel comfortable saying that. Back to leave a so puzzling over where i think the lines should be drawn. When is it appropriate for corporations to move beyond employees to take a political stance beyond the walls of the company . Wherever the line is, its pretty clear where we along with just aboutab every Large Corporation in america crossed. Summer of 2020. We are talking about blm rallies and accelerated pronunciation of privilege and the division elevated to influence and have no issue with inclusion, this is not inclusion. If it were inclusive, all disproportionately black and brown so there are so many stories people to canceled in 2020 for some that somehow received as anthony racist. You think you could run through this if you havent been gymnastics and did not cauldron for 12, 15 years and have that pressure on you . Its a good question, i dont think having competed in gymnastics would put me in that position because my peers i will make this, when i wrote my book about gymnastics, the low back in the Sports Community fix, i was really little it took all i felt clear eyed about what i was saying, i was logical and rational i believe its true, i lost my job before the. You bring up what you see as critical behavior harry in the end of especially when it comes to schools. The crazy part is i dont know covid, it shouldnt have been political hundred the children. It became a woke pillar of the Democratic Party and only get trump out of office and i think thats what started the and he kept going and going and going and adams became so great it was so bad, he would stand by policies but there was hypocrisy on the senior exit which is not true, they were flying to europe and hawaii you had workers, it wasnt the case for them but it was a frenzy, so uniform what people believe and they didnt believe they were fighting the good fight. I would stayt home and do nothing, the most purchased person in the world and you dont want to feel for just for doing nothing. You talk about keyboard warriors. I would push back on the. What is a keyboard or your . The keyboard warrior is people to just try to cancel people online and thinks they are doing good work because they are trying to take good people down. Accused because my twitter presencece is but i was doing al of these things attending every School Board Meeting and worked in San Francisco, i led rallies so i was a real life warrior, too. Do yououey still tweak . I do. About . You tweet life, covid . I tweet i dont for myself anymore so i guess whatever i want. I definitely talk aou lot about children, i want anybody to forget about this. This cannot happen again. I tweet about issues, censorship and other liberalisms happening right now in this country. I dunno, anything that interests me in the news. With the benefit of a little bit of hindsight and time, would you change anything you did during this period . No. I think i did the right thing and i was true to myself. I tried to be grateful i can say anything i want now. I am not hurt by the names now so i dont regret any of it. Whos chris and what happened . Chris was my brother. We used to be close or so i thought. We did not agree on policies, he was a fervent lockdown, i was an anti walked down her. We talked about our disagreement but have not spoken in several years, two or three years. His wife is a doctor and find my used to be dangerous to critical of doctors. I find the position of not a doctor individually but doctors of the Public Health collectively can be dangerous and a violation of our civil. I, unlike some, have no real issue with rich people. Capitalism. Some people, very few will make a lot of money. What i do has an issue with his rich people masquerading as social justice warriors and pierced employee advocates laying off 15 of the workforce at the same time they are adding tens of billions of dollars to their bank accounts, they cant have it both ways. People call me a drifter, unfit no but i stand by my and what im doing. What is the width part . Democrat or not, is something stupid they say online. Ik i could notin since agree beliee in what im saying. Of course i believe, why would i give up everything, a lucrative career . Matches job i had the future job of ceo which would be an incredible honor, a brand i love and where. The money is insane. I told you earlier 43 billion in stock and i gave up so i could use my voice. I think it is incomprehensible to some that you would give up money and speak the truth so they think you must be getting paid by someone to do it. The rise unbuttoned is the name of the book. The woke mom to my job gave me my voice. Student camp documentary on the vision is back celebrating 20 years looking forward while considering a pastor asking middle and High School Students to create five to six minute video addressing one of these questions. In the next 20 years, the most important change you would like to see in america or over the past 20 years, whats the most important change in america . As we do each year, we are giving away 100,000 in total prizes for the grand prize of 5000 and every teacher with students participating has the opportunity to share a portion of 2000. The competition deadline is friday january 19,024. For information, visit student camp. Org. Weekends on cspan2 art and intellectual peace. Every saturday American History tv documents american stories and sundays tv brings the latest in nonfiction books and authors. Funding for cspan2 comes from these Television Companies and more including media calm. Whether you live here or here or in the middle of anywhere, he should have access to fast reliable internet. It tasted like to get to be able to do this with you