Transcripts For CSPAN2 House Hearing On White Supremacy Infiltrating Police Departments 20240712

Live now to hearing on White Supremacists infiltration of Police Department. The House Oversight and reform subcommittee on civil rights and Civil Liberties is hosting. This is live coverage on cspan2. Good morning to the chair of the committee, ms. Maloney has joined us. Good morning to our Ranking Member mr. Roys whos with us and good morning to the vice chair and all of our wonderful members who joined us. I want to take a moment to extend a special welcome to rashida to leave of michigan come to our subcommittee. This is her first hearing with our subcommittee and were delighted to have her choice. Welcome, ms. Tlaib. I wanted show a video to set the stage. Please play the video. White supremacy permeates every corner of society and our institution. Please agencies to the fbi to department of justice, all of them. The Southern Poverty Law Center combover is engaged in those groups wherever that might lead. We have outed a number of Law Enforcement officers who have connections to what supremacy, primarily we discovered that through their social media accounts. Check of the social media posts. Its a good day for a chokehold, or hope that this piece of is dealt by street justice by police gunfire. Or f these muslim you can read it. Bad inning situation but what if i told you all those inflammatory words were posted by current or former Police Officers in phoenix, philadelphia and in st. Louis . Just a sampling found by new study called the plainview project of officers around the country using social media to endorse violence against criminal defendants complex, muslims, women. The study can vest more than 3500 court or former officers in eight jurisdictions of various sizes and geographic areas. It found posts that appear to endorse violence by officers or members of the public, show bias against minority groups, use dehumanizing language calling protesters or people of color animal or savages and the attitude went beyond mere words a deeper dive into the records off officers here in philly where posts were flied out almost onethird of those individuals have been subjects of civil rights and brutality complaints coming into in some of its or verdict for the plaintiffs. Offices wanting to ramp people with obama bumper stickers. Of this condos and the black lives Matter Movement racist pieces of explicitness. Their sexism, bigotry, threats of violence and calls for executions of protesters allegedly written by sworn officers. Tonight three wilmington, north carolina, Police Officers have been fired after routine audit of the patrol car came or uncovered what authorities described as extremely racist comments towards africanamericans. And interval probe by the Wilmington Police department revealed hate filled conversations with three veteran officers come officer kevin is her telling corp. Of the purchase was certainly to a civil war and that he is ready. He goes on to tell more is going to buy a new Assault Rifle and soon which is going to go out and start slaughtering them expletive in the words. He says a civil war is needed to wipe them off the expletive map. That will put them back about four or five generations. Later during a phone call with him, a woman he arrested as the nword and says she needed a bullet in her head right then. Donnie williams is the new police chief. He fired the officers on his first day. You talk about killing people in generations, thats disturbing. The officers blame their comments on the stress of todays climate in Law Enforcement. A veteran please officer five over his treatment over a criminal trespass suspect last summer. That officer caught on his own body worn cameras reveal using the nword and other profanities during the rest of a young black man. For what . , on a Police Body Camera an officer uses a horrible racist slur. The alabama porch monkeys. Begin with swift action, Rookie Detroit Police officer fight over his posts on snapchat. Thanks for being with us for the news at five. The officer will be off the table effective tomorrow morning. Thats after he posted this photo with the caption come heres a quote, another night to wrangle up these two animals in reference to detroit resident. If you want to prove Committee Relations we would do all we possibly can to to root out officers who have a bit towards criminology. The problem of White Supremacists come violence in america since the murders of george floyd and Breonna Taylor weve also held a separate set of briefings on Police Brutality in communities of color and rapid violations of the First Amendment at civil rights protests by the Top Administration. Today we will examine how these different threats to the American People intersect, namely how white supremacist organizations, ideas and attitudes have come to infiltrate and target certain domains of Law Enforcement. The bloody trail of violent White Supremacy is now splattered across america. Charleston, south carolina, where white supremacist dylann roof slaughtered nine africanamerican parishioners at worship in the emmanuel african methodist episcopal church. Charlottesville, virginia, where hundreds of neonazi and klansmen rioted and wounded dozens of people and killed heather higher in that terrible attack by automobile. Pittsburgh, pennsylvania, where i neonazi showed 11 people and wounded six of the tree of life synagogue as they worshiped. How way california another antisemitic rampage, el paso, texas, where a white supremacist hyped up on antiimmigrant heat killed 23 23 people and wounde3 others in the rampage at a walmart. According to the Antidefamation League, 75 of all extremes related murders between 2009 2018 were committed by rightwing extremists. The center for strategic that which analyze over 900 politically motivated attacks in your since 1994 found that been nearly six times as many victims of violence from white wing groups and as some others. In 2020 they found over 90 of political attacks were conducted by rightwing groups. These are the facts. Like covid19, this virus of violent White Supremacy is spreading. The Southern Poverty Law Center documented a record 30 increase in the number of hate groups nationwide over the last several years, and hate crimes are also trending up. What as with covid19 the Trump Administration has decided to mislead the public by downplaying the problem. The department of Homeland Security whistleblower has dated specifically modified draft language of White Supremacy to make quote the threat appear less severe and to include information on the prominence of violent leftwing groups. The spread of violent White Supremacy is a threat to everyone but disproportionally to the threat to black and brown communities, but it is also a threat and purposely underestimating this problem is a threat to first responders. In this case, two Police Officers. According to Antidefamation League white supremacist and other far right extremist groups have killed 51 Police Officers since 1990, 1990, 83 of studes between police and extremists involved right wing extremist with White Supremacists being responsible for more than half of those. The unredacted memo we released today from the fbi states that quote, white supremacist presence among Law Enforcement personnel is a concern to the access they may have to restricted areas vulnerable to sabotage and to elected officials or protected persons that they could see as targets for violence White Supremacy is a deadly threat to the safety of Law Enforcement officers as well as to Public Safety generally. In may, far right extremist killed David Patrick underwood, a federal Law Enforcement officer, one of the Boogaloo Boys tied in his death is a former air force sergeant also suspected in the murder of a santa cruz sheriff oleg are this year. In february what supremacist killed officer nico in alabama. In 2006 the fbi released and intelligence assessment warning of quote, White Supremacists come white supremacist infiltration of Law Enforcement. The fbi identified to make distinct problems. First, the fbi noted the problem of White Supremacy as groups infiltrating Law Enforcement. Weve seen a lot of evidence of that in the 14 years since the fbis assessment as officers across the country have been dismissed for active membership in the kkk and other similar groups. We will hear testimony also identified a second problem, Law Enforcement officers have no formal affiliation with racist groups, but who sympathize with the racist ideology. This, too, has been in plain view in this period a resurgent racist violence across america. In 2019 a team team of investigative journalist published the plainview project which collected over 5000 postings displaying White Supremacists xenophobic and violent facebook material from Police Officers in eight different cities. We invited the fbi to come today. The bureau refused to, claiming it has nothing to say because they have no evidence that this is a widespread problem in demanding the fbis attention. Whats more theyve attempted to disavow their own 2006 intelligence assessment which is every sign of being an authentic document. It did provide as an unredacted version of that 2006 assessment which i am releasing today so the public can better understand how the fbi understood this threat and judged it subsequent actions or lack thereof accordingly. The redacted passages include privacy of warning for the American People. The fbi once that quote, white supremacist infiltration of Law Enforcement can result in abuses of authority and passive tolerance of racism within communities served. The fbi also cautioned that Police Officers who are might quote volunteer their professional resources to the white supremacist causes with which they sympathize. These are chilling conclusions but rather than clearly spell out this threat for the American People, the fbi has suppressed them from public view for 14 years. For the first time we can now see the fbi believed integrally that White Supremacists infiltration of Law Enforcement departments was a serious problem, source of potential abuse of power and authority on the street and a source of potential violence against the civilian population. This summer as the country was shocked to watch videos depicting a brutal and vindictive treatment of black lives matter protesters, other videos emerged the Police Officers treating armed white militia as friends and is allies. Please give a polite wording to group of armed white man asking them to discreetly stay inside the buildings after curfew so it would not look like police were playing favorites when they teargas protesters. In albuquerque officers were caught on a Police Scanner referring to white vigilantes as armed friendlys. In kenosha, wisconsin, officers pushed protesters towards a group of armed white civilians. Please offered water to those armed men and one of them [inaudible] trooper got away despite what you have to police with his hand in the air with the murder weapon strapped to his chest while onlookers identified him as the killer of two innocent americans. The social contract depends on fair and neutral enforcement of the law to protect the whole citizenry against criminal violence and state violence. We must work to disentangle the police power of the state from groups and individuals that subscribe to violent white supremacist ideology and seek to inflict harm on africanamerican, asian americans, latinos, jewish americans, lgbtq americans, in anyone who stands in the way of race war and the civil war that the extreme right is calling for in america today. If local or state Law Enforcement were being infiltrated by isis or by alqaeda or any other terrorist group we would consider it an immediate Public Safety emergency. Infiltration by violent White Supremacy is no less of a threat and no less to confront effectively what we must understand that is the purpose of todays hearing. So i now would like to recognize the distinguished Ranking Member, mr. Roys of texas for Opening Statement. Please feel free to take equal amount of time that you need. Well i appreciate the chairman, chairman is always gracious. Thanks so we have equal time and handle that in that respect pics i appreciate that encourages you from afar. As you know this hearing is the fourth in a series on White Supremacy. Without a number of good exchanges and dive into some of the factor in the course of the previous three hearings and i think its a book for to do so. As you remember i was particularly moved and wanted to understand the situation in charlottesville. Obviously that includes talking to another lost her daughter, sitting there in the downtown mall in charlottesville by you to go as a student and seeing this events unfold. It was important to see how that conversation happened. Its important for us to have this conversation. I would note and the chairman knows, ive been asked repeatedly for last year for us to have hearing, for example, on Human Trafficking. Theres 40 Million People around the world suffering from Human Trafficking, some 20,000 in the United States where we have had actual Law Enforcement engagement within which is a fraction of we know is occurring, upwards of 300, 400,000. We should find time for hearing such as that and as a chipper will knows its an important issue. Take about three or 400,000 people for us to be engaged or the victims of Human Trafficking and the United States, we ought to look at that. Look, i think were asked the question, what is this now important . I dont question the motives of the chairman, but it would have to acknowledge that it is fairly obvious over the last x number of months that my democratic colleagues really want to perpetrate a narrative that american Law Enforcement, these are systemically racist or compose a white supremacist. I just categorically reject that characterization of it almost 800,000 Law Enforcement personnel who are standing out on the thin blue line for each and every one of us every day. As a former federal prosecutor i believe we root out crime where we find it. We root it out and we root out hate, we root up racism wherever we find it. That is our job to go pursue it. I wholly agree with that but it is a dangerous path, it is a dangerous path that my democratic colleagues are pursuing in defining our Law Enforcement personnel as systemically racist. Thats whats happening. Thats what these things are doing. Thats what this focus is doing. And by the way it would matter if this thing is just focused, that this hearing is just focus on Law Enforcement. My democratic colleagues have made it abundantly clear that the United States of america is in and of itself systemically racist. Thats the position of the modern democratic party. That our nation is systemically racist, and that to me is fundamentally at odds with what this nation actually has stood for. And what this nation actually has done. Like i come from a family with history and Law Enforcement. My great, great grandfather was a texas ranger in the county im sitting right now in 1870s. In travis county, lincoln county. Im proud of that. My grandfather was chief police of the small western town in texas, sweetwater texas. By all accounts. But i talked to my grandfather was good and faithful Public Servant who was is not racist y way. Everything i understand from a family, my grandmother, when my grandmother was a single mom in west texas, the first women county clerk when my grandfather died of cancer. And i stand by my grandfather. I stand by all the love for the office i work with when i was the assistant United States attorney working in the u. S. Attorneys office in the Eastern District of texas. All of the fine Law Enforcement officers who work for me of varying races when i was the First Assistant attorney general. When i was the First Assistant attorney general, they at 4100 employees. I will wholly acknowledged that irrespective of race for moment, if 1 of of the 4100 are doing anything crazy, insane, mean, hateful, racist, illegal at any given moment, 1 of that 4100, thats 41 people. Its my job as First Assistant attorney general to contract these things down, have an investigation, looking forget whats happening. I wholeheartedly embrace and believe in that. But when the institution of Congress Makes like it statements using viral videos to define a classic human being standing on that wall for us everyday, i am troubled by that. Are there significant amount of evidence that suggests there is not structural bias in the criminal Justice System regarding arrests, prosecutions or sentencing. Theres 70 million interactions roughly, obviously these are estimates, 70 million interactions between Law Enforcement and civilians every year. If a million of those are troubling, problematic for varying, Different Reasons than one of which might be race, one of which almost certainly is race, we should route that out but when you categorically define 70 Million Police interactions with 800,000 Law Enforcement personnel as systemically racist, then you are undermining our entire rule of law. We are seeing this unfold right now in front of us. The past few months have brought police into the limelight and sparked resurgence of antilawenforcement rhetoric from the left and many intermediate. What is been the result . More Police Officers killed in the line of duty. More americans many of them in low income committees are suffering because their communities are crumbling at the hands of lawless mobs. They cant use the bus stop. They cant get to work because somebody smashed to pieces. They cant get local bread from the local corner store because routers ransacked it and force the owner to close up for good. 45 blackowned businesses have been decimated since beginning of both the virus and all of the unrest in our streets. There are real consequences to whats going on on our street. In many cases they cannot call police for help. Just yesterday there was a thing where somebody was running through the whole foods in downtown austin where everybody is getting salad, someone running through it and would about and call the police. Guess what, theres no place to get there. Why . Because the city council slash the Police Department by a third. Look, data chose when please clash follows the viral video, Law Enforcement can speak less aggressive in pursuing resulting in increased in crime and homicide. Of which victims include all races. Two weeks following the death of mr. Floyd more than 700 Police Officers were injured. Many lives have been lost, hundreds of millions of damage. Across when major city the murder rate averaged 37 higher than it was at the end of may. The murder rate. User murderers. What about the Police Officers shooting with intent to kill we recently saw in los angeles and legal in the name of defending social justice . Two officers killed in louisville at least one of whom was black. Defending the place for getting broad false narratives about Law Enforcement and encouraging Wireless Industry in the name of politics is harming our communities. You cant defund the police. For example, for total homicide you over your for the 15, austin in the district i represent ranks first avenue city 4 increase and just a few months ago the city of austin defended onethird of the Police Department. For example, 43 increase modicum 70 increase african 30 3 increase that stricken. 4 increase in arson, i increase in vandalism notably these are the funding a canceled the 140 Fourth Police cadet class. Half of the graduate minority. They canceled it. Its gone. All those people who want to serve in Law Enforcement, want to help protect their community again over half minority, that class is gone. At least 46 Police Officers and killed in the line of duty this year. I read all of the names on the floor of the house of representatives last week. Where the hell is the nba wearing their names on the back of their jersey court where the hell is the outrage for the lawenforcement officers who lost their lives in a line of duty standing up on the thin blue line for us . 24yearold officer catherine designs was dragged by a car said Police Officer brian did was also killed wife vehicular assault, gone. Ambushed, shot and killed, gone. 20 for your officer who was shot in open for responding to Domestic Service gone come just to name a few. We havent over 50 increase of flonase officers killed in the line of duty with three remaining months left this year. Cities are defining the Police Department. This committee and my pain is getting a platform with the idea of safe streets while hurting safety and security should be nonnegotiable, nonnegotiable to me as a father and special as a member of congress. I think i understand what whate doing in the conversation were having. These are important conversations but we ought to be mindful of those 800,000 minute women who are going to suit up today to stand on that line for us. And it always entertained by those around the streets and something happens and theres violence because theyre having some protest in the next scene of a go where are the police . Thats happened to members of this body. Looking around, where are the police . I guarantee you the thing would be asking is what are the place if we continue to go after and assault the meant like italy and in them as racist as an institution of racism, as opposed to doing our lawful duties as members of congress or is Law Enforcement officers to go root out every single crime, every single action one case at a time. With that, mr. Chairman, i yield back. Mr. Rowley, thank you much for your thoughtful remarks and i hope i get a chance to respond to some of things a bit better. One thing i want to say right now is there is nothing in anything that i said and assessing about this hearing which describes all Law Enforcement as racist or racist threat. On the contrary, my full opening was about how violet White Supremacy is a threat to the public interest, including the lawenforcement itself. We will be able to discuss this more with the witnesses as they come through, and i thank you for your remarks. With that im going to recognize the chair of the oversight committee, ms. Maloney, for her Opening Statement. Please unmute if you would. [inaudible] we are not hearing ms. Maloney. Unmute. Tell them we have technical problems. We have got you, madam chair. Okay. First of all, i want to start by thanking my good friend chairman raskin for convening this important and timely hearing. The subcommittee has already held three hearings focused on violet White Supremacy, and chairman raskin is leadership on this issue has been inspiring. As chairman raskin said racism is not new to america. It is particularly not new to black americans. Since our nations founding racism has been used to treat black americans as secondclass citizens. Or no class citizens. We must never forget that policing in america started the slave patrols. Many slave patrols evolved into Police Department that for decades have been used to ensure black americans could not exercise their full rights as citizens. We are dealing with that legacy today. Many Police Departments face the continued infiltration of White Supremacists and to the ranks. As the fbi found, and i quote, militia extremists come White Supremacists and sovereign citizen extremists often have identified active links the lawenforcement officers, end quote. This year we have seen millions of people marched in the streets. They are asking for the end of state sanctioned killings, and calling for the dismantling of systemic injustice. Their mission is straightforward. They are asking for the very minimum that our nation be a place where the lives and deaths of black americans matter. But those protests have been met with violence, and in many instances police sanctioned violence by white supremacist groups. This hearing is not about good officers versus bad officers. This hearing is about making sure we as a nation acknowledge that White Supremacy has no place in any Police Department. The idiom does not in with quote, a few bad apples. The saying is, a few bad apples spoil the bunch. We cannot let White Supremacy continue to spoil the bunch. Instead, we should all condemn the behavior that chairman raskin described. Im honored to begin this hearing. It is shameful, absolutely shameful that the fbi chose to ignore the committees request to attend, and instead disavod their own terrifying findings about the pervasiveness in White Supremacy and Police Department. I look forward to hearing from our witnesses about their extremely important work, and i hope we remember the wise words of chairman cummings, that we are better than this, end quote, and i yield back. Thank thank you very much. I now want to introduce our witnesses. First witness today is going to be michael german who is a fellow at the Brennan Center for justice, then vida johnson who is an associate professor of law at Georgetown University law school. Well also hear from and often activist and then well hear from mark napier who is the sheriff of team at county arizona and finally will hear from Heather Taylor who is the president of the Ethical Society of police in st. Louis. The witnesses will now please unmute so i can swear you in. Please all of you raise your right hand if you would. [witnesses were sworn in] thank you. Let the record show the witnesses have all answered in the affirmative. Thank you, and without objection your complete written statements will be made part of the record. You are given five minutes within which to give your oral presentation and then all of the distinguished members of the committee who have arrived, including ms. Tlaib was just joined the committee, are going to ask you questions. With that, mr. German, you are now recognized for five minutes. Thank you for inviting me to testify today about white supremacist and far right militant activity in Law Enforcement. In 1992 1992 when i was an fbit preparing to go undercover against neonazi skinhead groups in los angeles my colleagues warned white supremacist often have relations with Law Enforcement and that i would have to strengthen my undercover identity to withstand lawenforcement scrutiny. I work closely in the operation and in later one of us getting militia in Washington State with officers from several different federal and local law in force agencies who had more than i did. None suggested this was an unreasonable concern. I was not surprised when the fbi released its 2006 intelligence assessment and time white supremacist infiltration of Law Enforcement, and alerted agents to infiltration by organize groups and quote, by selfinitiated infiltration by Law Enforcement personnel synthetic to white supremacist causes, unquote, as it was the same morning i received a decade earlier. At least 2015 policy that makes the case more directly. It was agents fbi domestic terrorism investigations focused on militia extremists white supremacist extremists and sovereign citizen extremists often have active links with Law Enforcement officers. But when William Lacy Clay asked the chief Michael Mccurdy whether the bjork remains concerned about white supremacist infiltration of Law Enforcement since the publication of the 26 2006 has been at a june hearing of the subcommittee, he indicated he has not read. As for john about this infiltration, he said he we suspect that white supremacist please officers but the ideology was First Amendment protected rights. The 2006 assessment addresses this concern by summarizing the Supreme Court precedent on the issue. Quote although the First Amendment freedom of Association Provision protects individual rights to join whites from this group for the purpose of lawful activity, the government can limit the Employment Opportunities of Group Members who hold sensitive Public Sector jobs including jobs within Law Enforcement winter membership would interfere with their duties, unquote. More important, the fbis with 15 counterterrorism policy which mcgarity was responsible for executing indicates not just the members of Law Enforcement might hold White Supremacists, but domestic terrorism investigations have often identified quote active links, unquote between the subjects of these investigations and Law Enforcement officials. Its proposed remedy is inadequate however. It instructs agency protect their investigation using the silent feature of the terrorist screening watchlist so that Police Officers could not ascertain whether they were under fbi scrutiny. One does need access to secret fbi terrorism investigations to find evidence of explicit racism within Law Enforcement. Since 2000 come lawenforcement officials with connections by supremacist groups are far right axis of been exposed in more than a dozen states run the country. Theyve uncovered hundreds of federal, state and local Office Officials participating in racist and sexist social media activities which demonstrates that over buys is [inaudible] lawenforcement officials actively affiliated with white supremacist or militant groups pose a serious threat to people of color, religious minority, lgbtq people and antiracist activists. But the Police Response to protest following the murder of george floyd includes a number of lawenforcement officers across the country flaunting their affiliation with far right militant groups. Please officers casually fraternizing with armed far right militia groups at protest this confounded because many states including california, illinois and pennsylvania have laws that bar unregulated paramilitary activity. Far right militants have often killed Police Officers. As a chairman stated its report of far right militant acts have killed 51 Police Officer from 19902018. The ambush shooting, vomit incoming lawenforcement officers in oakland and a local sheriffs deputy in Santa Cruz County california by far right militants highlights the threat that please engagement with these groups pose to the Law Enforcement partners. My written testimony includes detailed recommendations to Congress Come for prosecutors and for federal, state and local Law Enforcement and i look forward to your questions. Thank you. Thank you very much or your testimony, mr. German. Professor johnson you are now recognized for your five minutes of testing. Thank you to the subcommittee members and chairman raskin, chairman pallone and Ranking Member roy for the honor of speaking to you today. My name is vida johnson an associate professor of law at georgetown law and of right about procedure in policing. Before i begin a lively to make it clear i believe the vast majority of people who become Police Officers do so for all the right reasons including members of my own family. Nevertheless, it must acknowledge theres long history of explicit racism on Police Departments and sadly this legacy of racism continues today. Its diverse offers need to protect and serve everyone in our community. In 2006 the fbi barred white supremacist department of Homeland Security worden 2009, the white supremacist and called it one of the biggest domestic terrorism threats in the United States. Warning from these agencies [inaudible] in 2014 members of Police Department in florida were out as member of the kkk. In 2016 in alabama officer was of benefit is being a member of the in 2017 and Oklahoma Police chief was discovered to be one of the most influential White Supremacists in the country. In 2009 team a prospective homebuyer and saw a plane kkk application or entities the office of a delphi with these racist groups so officers hold explicitly racist views about any the Department Justice from ferguson in chicago midplane that officers use the nword along with other discouraging with the people of color in the communities they work and, of course, they share white officers are caught on tape looking for a race war. Texting scandals in some procedure, miami make clear this is a problem nationwide. My law review article i compiled the accounts of 170 incidence of racial bias news stories we know this is for some officers in the upon the news. In confidentially many states make issue so they dont make the news. And, of course, the blue wall of silence puts many of these office on the first because others dont report them. We care about this problem because [inaudible] we know officers disproportionately stop people of color. We know the biggest torture scandal in chicago over 100 africanamerican men be used as cattle prods and other torture. An officer in little rock, arkansas, was honest when applied to Police Department that he had attended a klan rally. He. He was hired anyway. He later went on to shoot and kill a a 16yearold unarmed bk boy. What are some solutions to this terrible problem . A more expansive view of [inaudible] ferret out some of these officer brady versus maryland makes clear the government must turn over information unfavorable to the accused [inaudible] information in please possessio possession. Prosecutors would have to investigate the officers and turned that information over for use at a trumpet other solutions will include better background checks [inaudible] searches of officers we know who text keywords, social media policies which officers [inaudible] better screening and preventive officers from going from one department to another. We must we that officers who hold racist view rather than [inaudible] professor johnson, thank you very much. I now recognize mr. Nick for his five minutes the testimony. Good morning. Thank you. Mr. Chairman, and members of the committee, im a a former white supremacist neonazi gang member. After us or by time in prison in 1994 i decided to leave the skinhead movement. Now with the i spent the last 25 years speaking out against racism. I conducted hate crimes training for Police Officers can fbi and Homeland Security agents. I volunteer the des moines Police Department as an announcer at their annual fundraising hockey game. I am also an activist for black lives matter. Black lives matter. I have spoken out about the fact that white supremacist leaders encourage their followers to join the police force as a means to cause harm to people of color. I was there when it was said. I was in the room where it happened. I am here to bear witness to my own experience. I grew up in a lower middle class tough Irish Catholic neighborhood in south philadelphia. I had a mother who was a drug addict and an abusive stepfather. I feared going home so much that some days i tried to get hit by a carpet at the age of 13 i was kicked out of my mom sold and moved in with my dad who live in a mix, very as new kid a skinny punk rock white boy an allblack middle school. This is when my fear turned to hate. That summer i went to visit my cousin in lancaster county, pennsylvania. Although my family was not amish, and i promise you theres no amish new notches, i thought my cousin and his friends were cool. They were older they were neonazis. I would hear them make races comments even though they never spent any time around black people. When you heard what i went to school i became the urban innercity expert and i begin to feel i mattered. The day that i decided to join this movement was a day i saw other people fear my group of friends. I saw them dash of that point i might be a teenager but inside i was a sevenyearold scared little boy who feared everything. I feared my parents, my stepparents, my school. I feared [inaudible] i wanted people to fear me so became a member of the neonazi movement. I got a swastika tattooed on my neck to prove my undying loyalty. I joined the movement for survival which made me grasp onto every word that was set in the movement. And heres what i heard. In 1991 i attended in bidding run by the White Student Union at Penn University a a monthly meeting of the 1520 members. They were mostly college guys so they were career minded. They would use words, say to us that we need to grow out our hair, stop getting tattoos and get ready to go into the military or police, to make people the rat that meeting later on became cops. That same year i attended a meeting in baltimore went by the National Socialist movement and a group called sds action. I heard the same rhetoric there. They told us to join Law Enforcement so we can give black people felt it so they will not be able to legally armed themselves and it would not be able to vote. Later in Lehigh County pennsylvania i did a hitler birthday party. This was put on why the christian and at the party mark thomas talk to us about how he was happy with our numbers. We had a lot of members. But he thought we were too rowdy and said we need to chill out and get rid of our tattoos and be better soldiers for the movement. Mark thomas hill bible study regulate. We all gathered inside the military tents and in his backyard and we would read the bible, shoots and guns the repair to destroy sodom and gomorrah. This expense was meant to militarize us and push us to get more professional training in Law Enforcement testing experience. In 1992 i attended a meeting meeting of about 100 people in montgomery, alabama. This meeting was run by the urged us to join the military so we could get real training. In late 1992 i went to arian says in in a desert town in california. At the time i still had a big swastika tattooed on my neck. I hope by me speaking out and with gods help we can start stitching this wounded america and putting bandaids on it, black lives matter. Thank you for your compelling testimony and sheriff napier, you are recognized for your five minutes. My name is mark napier, lawenforcement profession shares the concern that any bad actors contribute and Community Outrage at the conduct of the few members of our professional dealing with violence and racial animus. These are the actions of a very few members of Law Enforcement, every day in communities large and small thousands of Law Enforcement officers make 1 million contacts with the public that result in no use of force or give rise to the appearance of any racial bias. And they we doubt that actors. We conduct comprehensive background investigations, oral interviews, polygraphs and written examinations, we scan social media looking for troubling poles and questionable associations. Successful candidates in extensive academy training, this training includes cultural awareness training, racial bias training and use of force training, new officers go through training where he or she is evaluated, and Field Training the office is on probation are appear go for one year, his or her performance is reviewed and observed by field supervisor. The officer is evaluated for the duration. We do every step possible to weed out bad actors and bad candidates and into professionally trained, observe and evaluate officers throughout their career. It would be dishonest to suggest that actors do not slip through despite our best efforts. Every profession risks the prospect of a bad actor infiltrating its ranks and tarnishing its standard, isolated occurrences in any profession should not be used as an indictment of its membership or as a catalyst, the isolated bad acts are evidence of systemic prevalence. As americans we do not believe the bad acts of a few members of any group provide justification for bias, stereotyping, prejudice and discrimination against all members of the group. This is always wrong even when cast toward Law Enforcement officers. Ive been a lawenforcement officer since 1981, i hold a bachelors degree in social psychology, i do understand the manifestations of implicit racial bias. Moreover i believe racism, socioeconomic inequality exists in the country and constitute a serious problem. Racism has been a star on its country since its founding is still alive today. And and to make me believe. And assertions to the contrary i believe to be false not out of naivety, ignorance, or lack of personal exposures to the profession. I have not been exposed to any evidence that would lead me to reasonably believe that systemic racism and infiltration of White Supremacy into the profession in which i dedicated four decades of my life, for presentday Law Enforcement. I appreciate the opportunity to testify, and welcome any questions. Thank you for your testimony and for joining us and the president of that Ethical Society of believe in st. Louis, missouri. You are recognized for your 5 minutes, Opening Statement. Thank you for having me this morning. I would like to start, and National Politics Police Department, on behalf of the Ethical Society of police, the Ethical Society of police in 1972 by Racial Discrimination in the community, we have 320 members in the st. Louis city and st. Louis county, we are 97 africanamericans. Im here to get my perspective on white supremacist ideology and Law Enforcement. The fbi reports 2006, white supremacist infiltration, affected the Police Department greatly which expose racist content by Police Officers, a clear example of a problem and racism in Law Enforcement. I want to provide perspective by telling a true story. For nearly 7 years i have repeatedly reported an officer for his racism, and making racist statements about black people on social media. A black man being shot in his head, you can take him out of the ghetto but cant take the ghetto out of him. A black woman accused him of saying only prostitutes and drug dealers, another time he made a racist statement about black people and welfare, this officer was also reported for racial profiling by a citizen and a Field Training officer training hundreds of officers in the Police Department. He has never been fired for the statements and complaints, a sworn officer making these complaints. The statements, this officer and other officers killed a black man under questionable circumstances. I was a scene investigator on the case. Abandoned chokehold, another officer shot a man 6 times, 6 times. The officer violated numerous policies, one of the officers used the in word during this incident. Others stated the victim resisted arrest. Use of the nword, always in statements relate to me, all questionable actions by the officers placed in a police report, an official document. The report was turned over to the internal dvrs for criminal charges. I was told the officers returned to duty, no charges were filed. I delivered a copy of the report to the circuit Attorneys Office. It is finally done. I couldnt believe there were no charges, there was nothing. I dont know if the grand jury ever reviewed any form of charges, dont know the discipline of that case. The same officer use that band chokehold using an insensitive Facebook Post about another black man. This is george floyd, and more extensive backgrounds, is necessary for hiring. They support White Supremacy. They are corrupt in any way. These officers should be removed immediately. It is clear, anyone saying you can train away racism is wrong. You cannot train away racism. You need to fire them and terminate them. Whistleblower protections need to be, priority. I risk my life by reporting officers. I received Death Threats from officers. Officers, bleeding out on a call by myself. It is impossible to break the hold of silence if there are no protections in place that empower officers. I would like to state that in 2017, in the innercity to become an officer, shot in 2017 by a white officer. The racial undertones about that incident in 2017. Brutally beaten in his own words, rodney king, by four Police Officers. Those officers have been federally indicted. I would like to state covid19 is a leading cause of death for Police Officers and suicides. A leading cause of death, losing officers by covid19 and suicides. Officers who was shot and killed that have been shot and killed by force, use of force. It is important to address that sympathizing with White Supremacy, a problem within Law Enforcement community if that is a reality and what we see with officers im speaking about in my example, he is a Field Training officer training other officers to become officers. There is no way he should be allowed to continue in this field. I would like to add there was a recent study by the city group that lifted that 16 trillion as a result of racism in our country. 16 trillion is what we have as a result of racism in our country, that includes Law Enforcement, settlements that have been made for racist officers and sympathizers in the Police Department, any questions. Thank you and with that we completed our witness testimony and we enter questions, now we recognize myself as chair for 5 minutes of questioning. I want to start with professor johnson to address the First Amendment implications of this. There are Supreme Court decisions that say you cant discriminate against people in public hiring based on their political ideology, but i wonder if you would speak to the speech conduct distinction and some of the things Sergeant Taylor talked about in terms of officers letting their beliefs influence their actions either toward citizens or fellow officers. It is important to know Public Service limited in terms of speech, federal employees, judges and all sorts of ways to do that. And one in officers speech, it is in the interest of the First Amendment confirms Police Officers, famous case that took place in new york city, expressing very racist stereotypes and ultimately the circuit is needed. Thank you professor johnson. Dozens of officers have been killed by white supremacist says you point house. The unredacted fbi documents we released today mentioned different threats of White Supremacists going out onto the Police Forces, they talked about the risk of sabotage, the risk of having access to elected officials, having access to weaponry and opportunities, what are the biggest risks infiltrating Law Enforcement . It is policed by white supremacist groups and racist behavior in the fbi has disavowed behind closed doors. 13 assessment is nearer in time. And white supremacist ideas, with domestic terrorism investigations and the reason i am concerned about that, to the prioritize the investigation of White Supremacists, and disparages the work come along and effective fbi agents to work these cases despite the fact they are not a priority. They ran an operation that identified two correction officers involved in a ku klux klan plot to kill a black and made. These cases are critically important and there are many of them. I could go on and dont want have the fbi creating a Chilling Effect in an agency that would slow down the investigation like this when we already have civil rights cases, the declination rate upwards of 96 . Imagine how hard it is to continue working with that kind of attitude from your superiors. Let me come to you, Sergeant Taylor may have voiced skepticism whether you can train somebody out of their racism and that seems right in the abstract. On the other hand your career or your own evolution is counterexample to that. We know sheriff napier spoke about racial, cultural sensitivity training. Do you think that is enough to make it work and how do you get out of the way to premises ideology you were so steeped in . Thank you for the question. Anything that gets more people involved with other human beings will help. That changed my life, to take the spiritual path. What i know about how i changed this, i learned empathy plus humility evils humanity and i must give service to people at all times and that has changed my life dramatically for the better. The more important part about the policing is we need to take this seriously and the fact that im talking about events that were 30 years ago. Do you have any idea how movement of done the same thing since then . It is a real problem. We are finding more stories. Since my article came out in the daily beast more and more officers have been outed and we will continue to do that. But training is a great option. We need more people to get involved in communities they once hated or are afraid of, officers are coming from the suburbs, coming to cities or suburban Police Forces getting a lot of men there, i looked in the face of that man on George Floyds that, he had arrogant fear written all over, that leads to racism and that is racism. Thank you very much. I yield to the Ranking Member for his 5 minutes of questioning. You got to unmute. Appreciate all the witnesses, thank you for your testimony particularly those who served in Law Enforcement, not to be little those who didnt, and appreciate you being here. I want to put into the record an article in the wall street journal. And around here, the journal. Out the issues, with racism, with racism and sexism and other issues. With the final questions. And they are focusing heavy on it. Can you describe for the current difficulties, with diversity and training and hiring process . Hiring is a significant challenge, the National Rhetoric around Law Enforcement especially trying to recruit as we from socioeconomically disadvantaged backgrounds is exceptionally hard and the expression seems unwelcoming to people of color and economically disadvantaged backgrounds. To retain before we get into this profession it is more difficult to retain them. My son is a Police Officer, what will touch all of your hearts, when he became a Police Officer he said i was willing to lay down my life for my community. I realized that was what i signed up to do. He said i never signed up to be treated like an animal and the execution and ambush of lawenforcement officers has a disquieting effect pushed on lawenforcement officers to recruit these young people. It is not Getting Better anytime soon. There are economic processes, not helping our recruiting efforts, those who would like to recruit better. Would you find it troubling in texas, the city of boston which i represent, the city of boston is cut, upwards of 150, they reroute and take folks from one, the drug units moving people off of that for regular patrol and they canceled the recruiting class which was the most diverse in history. Would that be a nationwide Program Beyond what i am seeing in austin, texas . We are not asking lawenforcement to do that. In 1981 lawenforcement is Pretty Simple by comparison to 2020. We are asking lawenforcement to be health professionals, Substance Abuse counselors. We are asking more and more but the idea you would remove funding are asking more about Law Enforcement than we ever have is nonsensical. And read the finding, what provides the community and the manner in which services are providing. That is sensible dialogue, but that result in greater funding of Law Enforcement, not less. I approached my board of supervisors to have additional engagement specialists which would be people who have significant Substance Abuse training to respond to calls that the deputy would respond to. We are going the opposite direction. I want to be mindful of the clock. You touched on an important issue that there is a long conversation about. The added nature of having Additional Resources and Mental Health counselors, supplement lawenforcement versus a blunt whacking of Law Enforcement because reaction to issue undermining Law Enforcement. I yield back. The community is rightly concerned about what role lawenforcement fills. We are better able to fill that in the indiscriminate arbitrarily cutting of Law Enforcement is nonsensical and does very little to enhance Public Safety or the ability of Law Enforcement respond to the evolving needs and desires of the community for Public Service. Thank you. I now recognize the chair for her 5 minutes. Please unmute if you would. Can you hear me now . Thank you. I want to 0 in on your august 2020 report. You said the fbi identified the main problem of White Supremacy and lawenforcement as, quote, a risk to the integrity of the fbi investigations and security with agents. What do you mean by that . Thank you for the question. I believe my concern is when you look at the 2006 assessment in 2015, counterterrorism guide, the fbi identified the primary problem of white supremacist infiltration, Law Enforcement, the risk it poses to fbi investigations and lawenforcement personnel rather than recognizing the fbi officer has a mandate for civil rights and i believe the primary problem with white to premises to and alteration of lawenforcement is the threat it poses to the community, officers, police, that even with redactions removed, that is not the primary the concern reflected in those documents. It seems the fbi disagrees with you, refused to provide testimony to this hearing and repeatedly told us the 2006 threat assessment is an irrelevant and outdated document. In your report you know the fbi does not address the potential harm white supremacist Police Officers pose to communities of color, the police to society at large, what is the impact on communities of color, can you elaborate tolerate racism in their ranks . The criminal Justice System, there are Racial Disparities at every step, who Police Stopped whose get searched to who gets arrested to how they are charged to use of force issues. You see disparities persist over many decades. As long as there is a continuing persistence of white supremacist involvement and racist behavior and lawenforcement is going to color the perception particularly in the communities that are most heavily policed. That disruption between Law Enforcement and the communities they serve undermines the security of all of us. The fbi stated, quote, white supremacist infiltration of Law Enforcement can result in abuse of authority and passive tolerance of racism in community served. Do you believe observation has been borne out by Current Events we have been absorbing the past few months . Fbi agents across the country doing good work on this topic but that is prioritized in the fbi, difficult for them to be as successful as they need to be. And the high rate of declination. Irresponsible of the fbi to ignore this problem. The fbi and the department of justice to protect the public from these officers and i totally agree this is a small minority of Police Officers engaged in this behavior it affects the whole system. Thank you, you gave an interview to the daily beast describing how multiple members of your gaming had infiltrated the Police Department for what would you say to those who think white supremacist infiltration is not a real threat . I know there are people i used to run with, not spiritually people who are racist from the court and if i was a black person being pulled over on the side of the road knowing people i know who became cops i would be fearful too. I yield my time. This is my last question. Given your experience do you believe there is a real problem of white supremacist infiltration of the Police Department and i yield back. Thank you. To give you some experience i was a hockey coach when i got out of the neonazis and the reason i bring that up, a guy who goes out, no matter what, they stand up for them. In a precinct, they want to back him up, they will protect one another. I worry about that, they will protect each other because the blue line like a cocky team. The gentle lady of the back. I recognize mister clay for five minutes. Mister clay is not there. Debbie Wasserman Schultz looks like she may step away. You are recognized for five minutes. Thank you, mister chairman. You have given your disturbing attempt to fbi 2006 assessment, white supremacist leaders have shown an interest in Law Enforcement community use, tell us how the assessment squares with your professional experience. Coming up in the neonazi world, and never had a full on hatred toward the cops, learning how to become Police Officers we perfect our community better. That is the disturbing fact and trend you see for the Police Department right now. By the subcommittee, concern about unreported instances, further noted the possibility that it has gone undetected is a great concern. Someone who has been in the room, do you think the fbi is responsible to discount the likelihood that infiltration goes unreported. What we have always talked about was getting around their tests to see if we have neonazi past, talk about how to try to get around, becomes a goal to get around this process, that is talked about in the rooms all the time. These groups of White Supremacists, is there often more than one or 2 . How many would be in a particular Police Departments at the click within that department or that station . That would be projecting on my end. I cant give you dont want to speak out of turn. The reason im axing that question, in los angeles county, the Sheriff Department has a long history, some people call it clicks, that dominate station houses, terrorizing black and brown communities. It was something, fort apache. Something i witnessed myself. New members after they involved in shooting by giving them a part where they are tattooed with nazi imagery. How do these clicks, with Law Enforcement. One man has the problem and when you see these instances with civil rights lawsuits or investigative journalism, with Law Enforcement understood this was an issue long before and investigative journalists or victims of the abuses, the solution advised agents rather than having a comprehensive National Strategy in the community and the department, and proactively, with any other terrorist group. The Sheriff Department in la has different clicks, some are multiethnic and if you dont join the click, members joining Law Enforcement and deputies say they wont be protected if there back is on the line, they have weird pressure to join. Not to an ideology but the department and its ability to protect and serve the people of the community. I appreciate you being here. And we have, and lawenforcement. The district that exists out there. For hiring the right people for the diverse city in hiring. This very hearing does not help that. When you allege there is systemic infiltration of white supremacist and racially biased ideology in the profession it is not welcoming to people of color and that is not understandable. Not going to innercity high schools and trying to recognize these people early on in their sophomore freshman year of high school, trying to recruit to say you have to go home with the family and establish those relationships very early on but this continual assertion that there is systemic infiltration of White Supremacists and people of racial animus does not help that, from an academic perspective. The Current National dialogue. And and constant drum beating to defund the police. Even this committee, the title of this hearing, what is that doing to Law Enforcement to race relations, an example of what it is like. It strained our relationship with the communities we struggle historically to bond with. It is an ongoing struggle. It is not a purely partisan issue. The concern about better relations with people of color to better reach out and understand the communities. That is the responsibility Law Enforcement needs to embrace without respect to partisan ideology but these things are not helping our relationship with people of color and disenfranchised communities we struggle with. We supported many parts of criminal Justice Reform especially sentencing and things like that, sentencing, that i believe we need more minority Law Enforcement officers but i do believe the constant attacking of Law Enforcement is heavily overweighted in democrat rhetoric right before an election but every profession has bad apples and lawenforcement is no exception. What challenges do you face with respect to weeding out the bad apples once they become employed as lawenforcement officers . There is tremendous due process that makes it difficult to weed out these bad apples, people have frightening disciplinary histories and it is hard to get them out the door. It is an ongoing challenge, and the employment environment but to some extent these protections have gone too far and i too constraining on executive like myself to recognize a problem and think this person is better equipped to be in a different profession. I completely agree. Thank you for your service, those who put their lives on the line to keep us safe. I do believe if youre looking for bipartisan opportunities for us to work together, would be to eliminate the barriers that let lawenforcement in making it easier to get rid of the bad apples in Law Enforcement. It is difficult to fire someone once they get tenure and once they get married, shouldnt be that way when you are dealing with a few bad cops. I yield back. I now recognize you for question. Mister chair . Mister clack, recognize for five minutes. Ranking member roy, the justices hearing, let me congratulate Sergeant Taylor for your retirement and service over the years, we appreciate that. The project identified, reflect racism, antihispanic racism, islamohphobia, transfer be a and violence, Sergeant Taylor, our city was one of the cities explored by the project and as head of the st. Louis Ethical Society of police, can you talk about how these attitudes translate . Thank you for your question. The attitude, translating that, you are 91 more likely to be stopped and pulled over if you are africanamerican versus white and how it translates, africanamerican officers are 60 more likely in their first 7 years. We also know that africanamericans in our Community Overwhelmingly apply in this environment. Africanamericans want to be Police Officers. The catch is the hiring process is not fair so we have all those systemic factors in play and they limit the opportunities of africanamericans to become Police Officers. Think about how it exposed biases of racism and in a Bigger Picture is systemic problem. 16 trillion as a result of systemic racism do you have any idea how much st. Louis paid out misconduct and any idea about that q over 1 million for racism and discrimination and brutally beaten by four white Police Officers working with him undercover. That is going to be a settlement. Bowling green who was shot by another white colleague, officer coming to the aid of those officers, it is in the billions. The taxpayer in a disproportionate way, circuit attorney kim gardners exclusion list where she does not say certain cases from officers who are on this list, noticed some of them match up with posts from this article. What does that do to the more row morale of Police Officers, for the good officers . What does that do when these cases are not being taken and the whole thing about these racist posts . It is very difficult. In one sense you are clapping that shes refusing to take those cases. On the back end we work with these people, with people who are homophobic, racist or making violent threats. My believe is a good majority of this are coming to work to do their job or do it fairly, have to stand up, we have to stand up, black and white, when we see posts by other officers and corruption, we have to stand up and it is a memorial, your spirits are down. Thank you for your service, my time has expired. I yield back. I now recognize miss watson. Thank you, mister chairman. The threat of White Supremacy has become more dangerous than ever and the premise of White Supremacists in Law Enforcement makes it more difficult to counteract threats from violent hate groups, counsel and Police Officers collaborating and protecting members of the Traditionalist Workers Party and neonazi groups. In order to target antiracist activists after a clash in sacramento. In february of 2019 a Police Lieutenant in portland was discovered to have a longrunning correspondence for the leader of patriot prayer, a far right extremist group. The south Florida Community is not immune to hate in its own Law Enforcement. In 2015, four Police Officers were found to exchange violently racist Text Messages leading to the dismissal of 3000 cases against black defendants. I dont want to give the impression this is representative of all Law Enforcement but these examples alone i too many and they undermine our nations comments of equal justice. My question is can Law Enforcement response to White Supremacists be blunted by sympathetic officers who dont receive rightwing terrorism ever threat. The solution is to as professor johnson advocated, by then, Sergeant Taylor suggested protecting the good officers who report their colleagues when they engage in racist behavior. They have a system that good officers are able to report the misconduct of their colleagues without themselves being targeted and prosecutors can make sure those officers testimony is not being used in a way that would undermine the rights of the defendants. Sergeant taylor, the difference between how your colleagues obsessed by violent extremists as opposed to those of other groups like individuals protesting george floyd . Colleagues white and black believe george floyd was murdered but we do have and justify, the need of George Floyds was justifiable going with my Opening Statement that the officer was part of them. That it brings in on opposite ends when it comes to things like that along racial lines, to do our job. Last okay. Our video of police in kenosha providing water, appreciated their presence even though they are heavily armed and out after a curfew, militia members, killed 2 protesters. You think these extremists believe Law Enforcement implicitly or explicitly is more aligned with their worldview . It is more my frustration is Law Enforcement, the danger of colleagues. And the department operated like that in Santa Cruz County sheriffs deputy attacked far right militants, we havent seen a change in police behavior. That poses a threat to the community of Police Officer served but Law Enforcement officers. It is time we acknowledge the danger of Police Culture the compromises its ability to address violence rightwing extremists by tolerating it within its own ranks even if by a small minority. I was glad that we need to go after those bad apples but by failing to fully tackle what internal Law Enforcement studies flagged have a problem, Public Confidence in our police is further eroded at a time when we can least afford it. I appreciate the opportunity to have this hearing today. I recognize miss Ocasio Cortez for questions. Thank you to all our panelists and Witnesses Today for your testimony and insight. I would like to ask unanimous consent to submit to the record the department of justice report on hate Crime Victimization and cnn article that summarized it. Without objection. Far too much discussion around the issue of white supremacist infiltration and policing focuses on whether this problem exists at all. We have known four generations it is not a question whether this problem is an issue but it is a matter of how we have allowed it to sustain for so long. Congress as well has been complicit and our silence has allowed more violence and generational trauma in our communities. The question was raised by the Ranking Member earlier, why do we keep talking about this . This problem i want to make clear when you talk about systemic racism, litigating individual attitudes of any one officer. We can all exist dont have to be racist, we are consciously racist in order to participate and i think it is quite evident when you look at the outcomes of the war on drugs, systemic racism is about the laws on the books, the types of enforcement that happen, how many officers get designated to some communities more than others, real Racial Disparities in their outcomes. Doesnt have to do with litigating each and every individual officer. That is the issue at play. One of the things i wanted to discuss, you have to stop asking about if way to premise he and policing exist, how we better determine the scale of this problem. How big is this issue . In your report you write about the unbroken chain of Law Enforcement involvement in violent organized racist activity up to the present day. Did you note only rarely do these cases lead to come all charges y is that . Thank you for the question. I believe it is difficult to prosecute Police Officers partly because the way the civil rights laws have been interpreted by the Supreme Court, there is certainly room for congress to work on fat. How the fbi investigates these crimes, the alleged Police Brutality, the fbi will often investigate that narrowly much like they do hate crimes, that there is some kind of bias, intention to violate civil rights in this case, looking comprehensively at the Police Officers passed to know if that can be proven by other means. The vast majority are declined for prosecution so it is a matter of road. They just chinese cases offer declination. Sergeant taylor, in your decades long career in Law Enforcement, how often would we see officers harbor and act on white supremacist views hold responsible for their actions. Very rarely an officer who made a statement about chineseamericans, covid19 being spread in san francisco, have a citizen reporting decades before he was disciplined for 30 days for using the n word and is still on the street. We have testimony that this is a problem and it is systemically not being addressed. One last question. We talk about the Legal Mechanism by which that perpetuates this issue. Lets talk about qualified immunity. How does the legal system in general including falsified immunity protect racist Law Enforcement officers from accountability and how can we hope to evaluate the true spread given those barriers. I think Police Officers civilly liable and also have the fact that interests align between police and prosecutors, to see a situation where officers are held responsible in their own ranks, prosecutors are not being held responsible. Miss Ocasio Cortez recognized for five minutes of questions. Thank you for convening this hearing. It is worth repeating history and the roots of policing are linked to the antebellum slave patrol to the south of the to the establishment of allwhite Police Departments and since the fugitive slave act criminal Law Enforcement met the subjugation and the humanization of lack lives. I believe a lot of the old neonazi groups have now become more groups like the proud boys and a lot of those proud boys are flying the cops like at all the rallies and in their homes. The proud boys used to be what i would consider and are the neonazis of the early 90s and 50s, are planning to gear up to become Law Enforcement. They see the damage they can do and get away with it. Thats why they want to join. They know the war on drugs, the one drugs and allow cops to pull us from cars come to searches when was not committed the crime and where the citizens. I yield my time. Thank you. Its clear from historical record we cannot simply rely on trade and to address this problem. Across the country racism is official and unofficial Police Training. Take the case of trappist gates. As the minneapolis mayor and warrior training for city cops to reduce Police Violence yates offered to trade Minneapolis Police for free. This summer in the wake of George Floyds murder. [inaudible] support is saying shoot africanamericans then theres john and asked that the agent who is described as notorious muslim bashing conspiracy theorist, end quote. He has provide Law Enforcement training for at least seven states since leaving the fbi in 2008. Sergeant taylor, have you heard of or had any experiences with these kind of racist violence training . They do exist. In example i use in my Opening Statement that officer defensive Tactics Training officer, he trains another jurisdiction, and after we complained on it, thank goodness they no longer use them to train other officers. Yes, he is steeped in violent ideologies come racism towards africanamericans, muslims, you name it, and he trained other officers. That is present. It is very much present in Law Enforcement with these officers, and they are allowed to fester and faster and faster in the policies allow that. I appreciate the enthusiastic affirmation in support of the need to in qualified immunity. Ive introduced a bill with justin amash to do that to address the callous impunity and disregard for black and brown lives. They can be no Justice Without the candidate and there is no accountability as long as the doctrine. Have you seen of instances where Police Training has emerged as a Pressure Point for spreading whats a premises . I identify, even in implicit buys training, which we expect to be the most comprehensive and antiracism. I quote three separate trainers who say the specifically avoid mentioning explicit racism in Law Enforcement because they want to offend their audience. That i think is a bigger part of the problem is willingly turning a blind eye to this problem we allow it to fester rather than taking it had on and making sure we understand that we cant stop or direct implicit bias, unconscious buys if we dont address overt and explicit bias. Professor johnson, given the sequence of events in kenosha, wisconsin, with Kyle Rittenhouse murdered and injured black lives matter actress can you give us that you on the evolution of american Law Enforcement as asa protector an ally of white supremacist groups . Your question illustrates how significant this history is. Him being organized to catch people, to the liturgy that took place for decades without him pe held responsible by Law Enforcement, to a lot of the unrest that we saw in los angeles in the 90s and elsewhere, this is something that is consolidated power within the state that is being used against people of color and poor people. Thank you. Time has expired. Thank you, miss pressley. I turned out to the representative from the District Of Columbia ms. Norton. You are recognized now 45 minutes. Can you hear me, mr. Chairman . Yes, you, touching. Thank you. This is a very important hearing that and not the first one weve had on the subject. I am concerned that despite identifying this problem, going back to 2006, we are in 2020 now, the fbi has done nothing to address what has become a growing threat. And now there appeared to be an argument that doesnt make this at all. I note that that two fbi witnesses did come forth last year. They gave us more than 2000 words of testimony. They didnt even use the words White Supremacy once. So thats after charlottesville of heather heyer. Even more concerning for me is that theres been a recent whistleblower report that alleges that senior Top Administration officials had to suppress a segment of the dhs threat assessment that predicted an elevated threat environment from white supremacist groups this year. That is what i mean by a growing threat that is still being denied by the fbi. But, mr. Chairman, i would like to put to the other side of this issue because i am concerned in recent years the fbi has released a report on what apparently all experts agree is a fictitious Movement Come what they call black identity [inaudible] i have found no experts that says any such thing. I would like to ask mr. German. Black identity extremism and what does it mean to you that the fbi would rather focus on what experts seem to be his and imagine threat of black identity extremists but not on the threat of White Supremacists in police . Its an example of systemic bias that existing Law Enforcement. The fbi remains an overwhelmingly white and overwhelmingly male organization. So when their guidelines are altered to allow them to investigate police without evidence of criminality, evidence of wrongdoing, i think they target people they are free to because of bias rather than focusing on evidence that shows some [inaudible] thank you. Professor johnson, can you talk about barriers inside of federal Law Enforcement that make it difficult to give the issue of White Supremacy the attention it requires that . I think we just last political will. There was an abc poll in 2017 that found 10 of americans [inaudible] the things you have to imagine that there may be a similar number of Law Enforcement officers that feel that way. And so we [inaudible] real pressure from the outside to address the issue, its going to continue to fester. Thank you. I would like to ask Sergeant Taylor, as a local Law Enforcement officer come what are you looking for from the federal government . Thats what we have to focus on here as members of congress. What are you looking for from the federal government to help you come what can we do . I think that its fair you cant [inaudible] the very people that are in the field that have experienced these atrocities that are black, white, homophobia, racism, all these different extreme views that officers have. We have to have those people at the table to discuss of these things. If you dont have them there with these of use that go for our communities as well, if we dont have them present, everything cant be white and male. We have to have diversity to bring these views interplay to actually address them. It has to come from a wellrounded perspective. Thank you, ms. Norton for your questioning and finally we come to ms. To leave her five minutes of question. Thank you so much, chairman raskin, for allowing this courageous hearing to happen. I do want to take a moment and recognize Sergeant Taylor incredible courage as well. I know it hasnt been easy for you to speak the truth about what was going on while you were serving there. Im sure it something even at the retirement so we really do appreciate especially in my community that is 85 black, i so appreciate you speaking up. The issue were discussing is not speculation. We normally worry we continue to say in some sort of three. Proven our reality today and White Supremacy as you all know has not been confined to Facebook Posts. Its just evident that what is actually bleeding into our communities and that is making us all unsafe right now. Recent horrific events of occurred in my district that if raise concerns for me and so professor johnson, i want to start with you. Yes or no should we be concerned some white extremist groups see Police Departments as allies . Yes, absolutely. This is something ive seen firsthand imagistic the last year a detroit Police Department escorted on neonazi group waving nazi flags and wearing swastika armbands as a disruptive upright of silver in the aftermath the police chief defender the protection of his department that he gave to armed White Supremacy with regard at the races counter protesters quote sides were wrong which drew outrage in our community. The treatment of black lives matter peaceful protest of five Detroit Police recently were met with beatings, tear gas and arrests. They had to go as far as to get a federal judge which agreed that they have to stop using batons, chemical agents like teargas on protest. How does this kind of protection for neonazis versus the violence towards those protesting whatever black lights in detroit, civic and that is 85 black, make us safer . I think its evidence of [inaudible] thank you so much. One of things that is of concern to me come the fbi does not believe this topic is worthy of testimony today, even though their own report and assessment states that white supremacist infiltrated please departments and could lead to tolerance of racism against black communities. When i hear your testimony, sergeant, our captain, sergeant i believe, are you there . I am, yes, sheriff. Sheriff come so sore that one of the things that concerns me, you talk about your son, and i am of course concerned about a lot of things when it comes to policing in my community. But of what to take a close look at something with what happened in your district. Last november when it officers were caught on camera tackling a black teenager to foster care who lived without arms or legs, sheriff. He was tackled by an officer under your leadership. He was also seen abusing another black teenager who is merely filming the incident. That officer was not charged. Im wondering if that is a case of why you havent been able to diversify your team and or similar concerns. I truly believe, trees on your end, what kind of treatment that officer get . Was he held accountable . Fours, we presented as we should put the office on immediate relief and present that matter to the county Attorneys Office who made the decision come to decline criminal charges. He was never charged . That was a basis is a leading to people not to want to work for a police force that is constantly involved in criminal activity and assaults of innocent civilians . It was deemed not to be criminal activity because the police i did that make the decisions for i know. The system is broken and no, you dont want to face the fact that you and your son are in in a sm right now that is broken at a no, you are doing with him talking about in that way. But you know, going back to Sergeant Taylor, one of the things i know black lives matter protested imagistic have been crying out is please invest more in our schools. Invest more into our committees and neighborhoods. One of the things i hear from my Police Officers is they were not trained to be nurses or social workers or Mental Health care workers. They want to see more investment in that because that keeps them safe and that keeps the community they are supposed to be keeping safe safer. Can you talk about that . I feel like what many of these protesters are out there is demanding was just a shift in recognizing their lives matter and recognizing the have to have investment in their quality of life which again makes the job of Law Enforcement obviously much more at ease versus right now where there criminalizing communities of color. Thank you for the question. I think most law for the officers would prefer having social workers in our jobs. Because we dont want to respond to a lot of these cops are illprepared for. I studied psychology and im still illprepared for even with empathy in these ideologies about Law Enforcement are accurate in the sense that we have a problem with addressing out into the problems, first off, then we have a problem with how we respond to these goals. Because we want to put force in place workforce is not necessary. This is what we are taught, hot to be these warriors were we should be guardians. Even within the guardian we are illprepared for that. With people talk about defunding the police come with a talk about reallocating these resources its necessary because we need more conflict resolution. We have lack of that involve force become a lack of deescalation and so when you bring people that have these thirdyear degrees which most of us do not have, you bring those people in who have these specialties and these skills, they can offset us respond and shooting a 13 year old in the back. So its important with these people in these jobs and most of the time most Law Enforcement officers will agree that they dont necessarily want to respond on these calls anyway because we are illprepared for. Thats exactly what im here. Thank you so much. I will pray for Sergeant Taylor, not extreme a difficult it is for her to come up and speak the truth about this and really so much respect for you today. Thank you so much. Thank you. In closing i want to thank not just Sergeant Kelly but all of our panelists today for their extraordinary participation, michael german, Sergeant Kelly, professor johnson, mr. Meeink, sheriff napier from arizona, thank you all for coming of participating so intelligently in this important conversation. The question of the neutrality and the purpose of Law Enforcement all across america goes right to the question of our social contract. If you read any of the social contract, john locke or tom assads or russo, all of them said that we enter into society because well be safer inside the social contract and outside of it which hobbs said was a state of nature, a state of war and violence, nasty brutish and short. We enter the social contract but we expect that the police who we pay to protect us will act with neutrality and fairness and respect for everyone in the community. We know the vast majority of officers into with that idea. So the infiltration of White Supremacists members, activists, ideas and attitudes is a threat to Public Security and Public Safety, and it is a threat to the repetition of the Law Enforcement function which i think all of us agree, that it is when you consider it a few bad apples or a lot of bad apples, not those bad apples can spoil the reputation of the whole barrel. We hope the fbi will stand up and take credit for the things that it is saying and doing to identify the problem, come up with a National Strategy for making sure that we dont have that kind of infiltration of white supremacist attitudes and ideas, and action Law Enforcement. With that, without objection all members will have five legislative days within which to submit additional written questions for the witnesses to the chair and we we will forwad them to the witnesses for the prompt response. I ask all of our witnesses to please get it back as soon as you can and with that i thank you all for your participation. This hearing is now adjourned. Medical analyst preview the first president ial debate and discuss how Foreign Policy issues impact voter choice. This event hosted by the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace and we hope to get to their live shortly here on cspan2. I live picture from the site of dies first president ial debate and this is the pavilion part of Case Western Reserve University and the Cleveland Clinic on the side of cleveland. The next debate will be hosted by Chris Wallace of fox news. You should know will open our phone lines after the debate to get your thoughts and observations. The first president debate between President Trump and former Vice President biden is tonight at nine eastern from cleveland to watch live on cspan. Biden is recklessly campaigning against this sexy pink his campaign is really reckless and all of this is for political reasons. Political reasons. Biden, his whole deal is catastrophic shutdown. And again in his own words, recorded by bob woodward, the president knew back in february that this was an extremely dangerous to medical disease. Think about it. How may people across the iron ranch come how many integers about those dinner tables because of his negligence and selfishness. Watch the first president ial debate live from cleveland tonight on cspan. Stream stream live or ondemandt cspan. Org debate or listen live on the free cspan radio app. With the ongoing Global Pandemic and many school shook and Online Learning cspans studentcam competition continues to provide students with a platform to engage in a National Conversation were asking middle and High School Students to produce a documentary exploring the issues they most want the president and new congress to address in 2021. We are awarded one or 1000 l cash prizes including a grand prize of 5000. The deadline to submit videos is junior 20, 2021. For competition rules, tips and more information on how to get started go to our website