they were interviewed and hosted by politics to washington d.c. >> good evening, everybody. on behalf of everybody, thank you very much for coming. enjoy joining forces upon author events at this cultural center, 15 years old and it founder and staff deserve a lot of credit. [applause] it's a vibrant community today. jodi kantor and megan tooley. [cheering] they revealed to the world harvey weinstein's reviews. there book is the reviewing account of how they developed their blockbuster story. the "me too" movement. as i note in the wake of the weinstein exposé which broke in october 2017, it wasn't as if allah had come down. women not just in this country but around the world to tell their own stories of mistreatment. in addition to the pivotal impact their reporting is have, they went about confirming a story at others before them had tried to now but by a terrific case study, it goes into investigative journalism. people often think it just falls into the laps of the reporters. in reality, what's involved is a lot of painstaking reporting for all sorts of leads, running into dead ends, coaxing details on of reluctant sources. substantiating information, dealing with skeptical new patient editors, all while enduring intense efforts by the subjects of the investigation to even threaten. this example of tough journalism and the effect this kind of reporting can have stands as a powerful counterargument to skepticism about news media today. jodi and megan brought to their past years of experience. she joined the times 15 years ago, spent time as a reporter and work a book about barack and michelle obama that came out in 2012. recently, her work is focused on the treatment of women. megan concentrated on the treatment of women and children. 2014, a reporter, she is a investigative reporting exposing an underground network that gave away adopted children they no longer wanted to strangers they met on the internet. megan and jodi's work on the weinstein story led to the new york times along with the new yorker, public service last year. [cheering] [applause] their review remarked that the book reads a bit like a femini feminist. [laughter] is particularly fitting that they will be in conversation this evening with bob woodward. [cheering and applauding] he's been observing and reporting major development for nearly half a century. he shared into surprises, first uncovering the larger scandal, the second 2003, coverage of the 9/11 terrorist attacks. he hardly begins to reflect his enormous journalistic legacy. fear is devastating the trump presidency, came out last year and it was his 19th book, all caps on national bestsellers and i wouldn't bet against another one coming out in the not-too-distant future. [laughter] joined me in welcoming megan twohey and bob woodward and jodi kantor. [cheering and applauding] >> thank you, it's great to be here. let's get right to it. first of all, this book is a massive piece. a landmark. [applause] journalism and people who were not journalists, it's about how you sort out information, publish and share with others. i loved it, i have my copy here. the first question is, what was the origin of the collaboration between you two? >> we would like to start by thanking everybody, this is the launch of our book tour. [cheering and applauding] we are grateful we have not only friends and family but also the sources in the audience tonight. we want to thank them for being here, too. >> i think when it comes to question and answers, there may be people if they want to get up and identify themselves. that's a good question. the truth is, in 2017, the new york times decided it wanted to diving reporting on sexual harassment. so the weinstein story, the investigation was one of many reporting projects that started that year, silicon valley and restaurant industry and auto plants in chicago and we were really moved by the work of our colleagues, emily and mike schmidt had done something remarkable earlier that year. they had broken the bill o'reilly story and they paid out millions of dollars to silence women who came forward with allegations of sexual misconduct against him. >> let's pretend it's a movie. is it in the newsroom of the new york times where you kind of, did you know each other? >> megan was very new at the paper and i saw this woman like in 2016, who i could tell was very submitted book because she was doing these difficult trump stories and as the stories were difficult, this was what was happening and i had two kids at the time and i knew what she was doing was not easy. but we didn't know each other well. we had only met a couple of times. megan was on maternity leave in the spring of 2017 when i started working on the weinstein story. as part of this question of the editors asked, are there other powerful men in american life who have perhaps abused women and covered it up? i was trying very hard to get people on the phone and engage them. getting these actresses phone numbers was like an investigation in itself. then there's the question of what you have them on the phone, what you actually do to earn the trust? and at first 40s five seconds that you know. i called megan for advice and she was in full on maternity leave. she had just set the baby down for a nap. she was telling me about the reporting she had done on allegations of women against donald trump. stressing the argument she often think to them was look, i can't change what happened to you in the past but together, if we work arm in arm, we may be able to take your pain and put it up for constructive process. >> this was the standard line to use. the outreach line. >> right. this is the first real conversation jodi and i had while on maternity leave. i had been reporting on sex crimes. it was something i found, what reasons does a woman have to open up about this? >> when did you know you were a team or even when did the editors think of you that way? >> rebecca corbin, might editor told me to call megan. i didn't think that much of it but now i realized she sort of understands the newsroom and i understand she was feeling out a potential -- >> you are kind of tricked into it? >> when megan said that on the phone, something in me changed. i did not want to get off the phone with her. i wanted to have the same sources but megan still had another couple of weeks of maternity leave and she had twice in terms of what she was going to cover when she came back. >> on the weinstein investigation, i had to take a day to think about it. [laughter] have been covering trump until having this baby and i watched the fourth month as i saw investigative work and not have an impact. so this is a real question, whether or not, you're not just right interesting stories, you want stories that have an impact. >> and weinstein, lots of people haven't heard that. we look i myself -- >> you made him famous. >> i myself had doubts. i wondered, jodi started to talk to me about some of the allegations she heard, i had a hard time conceiving of these famous actresses as victims and to start to comprehend, giving voice to the voiceless. i had a hard time wrapping my head around hollywood but jodi said fact that this is happened, suggest that no one is immune and if we can cracks these stories, we might be able to make a difference. >> when was the first real breakthrough? your book you got the chronology and so many characters and so forth, in the moment where you set off, this is different, this is something? >> three really prominent actresses, ashley judd, not in communication with one another, totally separately, they tell us these terrible weinstein storie- >> they were not on the record? >> so far from the record. >> far off the record. >> it put us in a bad position because it immediately created this on the one hand, while, these are high valued sources and their stories are very convincing and their stories match. on the other hand, none of them are ready to go on the record. so what do we do? >> what do you do do? >> we realized the story would have to be with evidence and not just -- we have this theory that maybe we can persuade actresses to hold hands and time together and their safeties in numbers but because of the actresses who we were talking to, it's very hard to get them to do that. also, it created what the traditional he said "she said" dynamic with a story would have sparked a debate. >> so what about went into making this difference? >> we realized right away we would need records and evidence that went beyond these accounts we were hearing. this is one of the ways in which we turn in allie and mike, they had done something remarkable there. they basically helped teach us how to try to track down these secret settlements that have been paid. >> the key here is settlements? some sort of agreement to be signed. >> there were women who were reluctant to tell us their experiences with weinstein. there were also women, at least eight who were legally prohibited from telling us what happened because weinstein forced secret settlements on them. this was not the case up weinstein but in cases of sexual harassment and assault across the country. women are often told their best option is to accept money in exchange for silence but -- >> what you think about? it seems your big breakthrough is mccullen where she had $100,000 settlement. that was concrete. weinstein or the company had paid her. right? >> we were basically able, in the course of our reporting to chuck that we were able to trace the financial trail of payoffs made. these secret settlements used to basically hide the truth to allow people to cover their tracks, we realized we could basically unearth the fact that these settlements had been paid, that would be evidence in itself. we were able to track down settlements that stretched from 1990 to 2015 and there were varieties of ways to document that. i was just one of many. >> among the wonderful lines in the book, you say knowing about documents is good, having seen documents is excellent. but actually having copies is a celebration. >> you know that one. [laughter] >> when was the first time i actually got or saw documents that showed women had been paid off to be quite? >> i go to london at summer to meet with a former assistant who had a settlement. megan is basically emoji texting me as i leave for the plane. she's like, you're going to see the papers. >> so she's a culture? >> well i mean even in the scenes in the book words really one of us, something we are both really there because we are preparing beforehand, strategizing, etc. so when we laid eyes on these papers, it was so shocking. they went beyond standard settlement agreement. these very young women were easily overpowered if they were essentially prohibited from talking about their own life experiences. if they wanted to tell a therapist, they needed special permission. they wanted to talk to an accountant, they need to special permission. one of these women could not tell her future husband about what happened to her. the women were not even allowed to retain copies of these settlement papers, he casually put them together but imagine being told have to abide by an agreement, that you cannot even have your own copy of. >> or you break that? >> very brave because from the beginning, she was thinking of just breaking her settlement which is a courageous thing to do because it exposed her to potential liability. i felt i couldn't push her into that because it wasn't a big risk and remember that we act now like me to was inevitable but it was not or deemed idle, any of this played out the way it did. without it may publish a controversial story and they might be vulnerable so what we basically said is, even if you can't go on the record, there are so many other people who know about this settlement. there other people who know you've disappeared, no you got money. there are lawyers, lots of people we can talk to. what if we just write about this in the document everything we can that happened and you don't go on the record? that's what she agreed to. >> did you ever use the argument if you're silent, you're enabling? >> i think the truth is that for women who have experienced sexual harassment and assault, they've already undergone so much pain in their life that we are not trying to bully anyone into doing, we know coming forward, we don't think that's an effective strategy and we don't think it's the right thing to do. it's worth noting the women -- [applause] that there are women who have entered these settlement who still have not gone on the record, they are still terrified. it's one thing to ask a source to speak about something painful from the past but it's another thing to ask to break something in which a legally binding document in which weinstein can come after them for serious money. >> don't think they are liberated from? >> weinstein is preparing to go on trial for criminal charges. so he's got other issues right now. they are seeking financial compensation hasn't gone after everybody but they would be mistaken. >> you say they are women who have charges against weinstein, how many of those are public now and how many of them are off the record or the next volume? >> i believe there are women including a few we read about in the book who have not come forward about weinstein. but the key thing to remember, especially as this trial comes up, the accusations vary. some of them are accusations of rape and assault, assault within the purview of the criminal justice system or should a lot of them are charged with sexual harassment. that's illegal but it's a civil violation. this restitution for that is lawsuit. you can sue for that but they can't be rested. as part of the question whether they will have any accountability at all. the criminal trial is a big? and a combined civil lawsuit is also a big question. >> this is an important question. you two are experts on interviewing and going down explaining people's experience and all of your work, did you find anyone who made up allegations? >> 's in the course of our reporting in weinstein, we have not come across any fabricated allegations but -- >> that's very important. >> writes. >> the tweet said to donald trump. [laughter] >> our book starts with the reporting i did on trump in 2016 and the many men who came forward with allegations against him. while we hadn't come across fabricated allegations, we include in the book some of the instances in which we didn't report allegations because not because we didn't believe but because we hadn't been able to obtain cooperation. there's one foreman, a former beauty pageant contestant who told me a story about being sexually harassed and groped by donald trump when she was in the pageant and provided, steered me toward potential cooperation that didn't materialize. i didn't mean i didn't believe her but it meant we go to pain staking details to describe all the due diligence do to move forward with publishing on strike. >> talk about rebecca hartman, roll up the sleeves editor because an article is seen in the book where he takes you to a quiet barr and tell us what "she said" to year. >> this is the summer of 2017, we been reporting for weeks and weeks and we know so many things. we've spoken to several actresses were convincing. don cooperation of the accounts. we know about a whole bunch of settlement. employees have said this was a terrible problem. i had some knowledge of it at the time. >> so if you are feeling good? >> we are feeling nervous. >> what she have to say? >> we were nervous because we had this feeling of response ability and we want to know if we can plant this story. she listens to everything we have and she says, is any on the record? we said no. "she said" you do not have a publishable story. >> how did you feel? >> we felt devastated. it was one of the more memorable moments. one of the ones we worked so hard author so much that goes on. there's a lot of trauma on the stories and also drama behind the scenes. we will grateful to finally be able to show readers what it's like not just working with sources but also in the newsroom. we don't have a story. >> was the strategy for getting out of the hole? saying not publishable and as we all know in the news business, that's what counts. that is the job. so how do you navigate out? >> we kept calling weinstein company employees and finally got a hold of the sky and -- >> talk about him. he was very important. >> one thank you never know in journalism, who will end up helping and who isn't. it's almost impossible and there's a lot of surprises in this for those who helped reveal and conceal. he has essentially been harvey weinstein company accounted for 30 years. he's done the books on all of these famous movies we've seen. is a relatively unassuming guy. he short, in his late 50s. he has been outer exit. he describes to me as kind of a graph loyalist. i thought he was unlikely to help but finally, somebody said to me, he hates harvey weinstein. [laughter] that was our opening. >> did you tell it to rebecca? >> yes. i called the sky -- >> doesn't also make you nervous? [laughter] i'm sorry. >> well, here's what i was nervous about. i was worried he could be a spy. as you know, to get information, you have to give at least a little information, at least in terms of what you are writing about. i worried he was a set up, we now know a lot about what highbury weinstein was doing but megan and i are imagining it. one thing he could have done this position the company insider to play a source and be a spy. or even worse, keep information in the story which would've been the most devastating thing of all. so he gets off the phone quickly and gets me his e-mail address and we start corresponding and even the fact that he's writing back and we are gathering over e-mails and he said he would take the weekend to decide so this is the book but we kept e-mailing and since we are in a synagogue, maybe i should say irwin is the brainchild and it turns out we grew up in the same places in our families even spent summers in the same bungalow colonies. [laughter] does anybody know the word klansman? we were cantering over the weekend and i'm waiting to see if he's willing to meet in person so low and behold, he says he's willing to meet and on the monday or tuesday, we had our first -- >> a great day for reporters. it's monday were everyone is running around, what you did is the knock on the door strategy. without an appointment, 8:17 p.m. on a tuesday night is about the end. >> yeah. so to answer your question, i started asking about all these things that happened in the 90s and he looked like he had a little information but not that much and he finally said, why aren't you asking about more recent events? it turns out unbeknownst -- it becomes public for two years within the weinstein company in 2014 and 15. there was a series of problems that have become more and more visible to the company leadership. i didn't know it then i was actually talking to somebody who tried to stop things internally and failed. so let us the best kind of whistleblower because they feel like they've already taken action and hasn't come to fruition stop talking to the press becomes a last resort. >> talk about the editor, he has an appearance in about three or four scenes in the book. >> we were so glad we had an opportunity to show a true team effort. it's been the executive editor, had really been in his office and it said he had exchanges with weinstein in the past and he basically said walkout. the sky welcome out you. expect private detectives on your tail. we didn't expect them to be former israeli spies, that came out later but he really was useful and able to help us spell out serious ground rules. to be very careful how we handled ourselves every step of the way but also to make sure we didn't have any conversations with weinstein off the record. he just said no conversation. >> he also said -- >> until we were ready to go to him. he said don't engage him off the record. when we come to him, when you've got the goods and ready to go to him with your findings, that has to be on the record because if you go off the record and come in here and do his i'm an important man in sherry the real truth, he will smear your sources and engage in a lot of dirty. >> every conversation is being secretly taped. >> that's right. >> when did you say -- >> the new york times, we and our colleagues are working on a secret investigation and institutions all the time so we weren't surprised by that but it was useful to us, what we showed was you really have to make sure the reporters and editors might even all the way up to the publisher because weinstein was trying to call the publisher of the new york times to make his case and everybody from all those top guys say the reporters. so they didn't give him any opportunity to come in the back door and intimidate or bully us out of the story. >> it's now the time i can ask this question. tell us about the biggest fight you two had. [laughter] >> we never had a big fight -- >> big disagreement them. >> it wasn't even so much a disagreement as much in 2017, two months before we published the story, megan finds out about this really irregular sort series of transactions, he had been very involved in this. things look really questionable to her. i'll tell you things about my partner, when you really get into something, you don't really let go. [laughter] is a suggestion which turned out to be true, that weinstein had improperly used a fancy charity auction and the money the donors thought they were getting paid were really going to help weinstein in a business capacity so this was like leaving it in front of megan and the disagreement we had is that i certainly thought it was interesting but on the other hand, these women are telling us these stories about the hotel room and the settlements and you have to remember at this time in the investigation, we are getting a new tip a day. there are so many rumors coming at us, we are hearing a lot of these things turning out to be true. angelina jolie has a story but we can't nail it down. you have to talk to her because she has a story and you can't nail it down so the story, in a sense already felt too big for only two reporters. megan put could not pull herself away looking at the charity and i thought i was under investigation -- >> i thought was under investigation and weinstein all this people are trying to cover it up. [laughter] >> megan took time to do her story but it ended up being squaring off with weinstein in person, the story was extremely surprising and second of all, it became a guide to his playbook that weinstein was very successful in creating his own reality. getting a lot of fancy people to march behind him when he wanted to do something. and also making nailed what happened in that story and published that before the investigation about the women was published so it was sort of like weighing down a marker of we are going to hold you to our account. there is a sense that if we were on to this and weinstein engage with us about it, we had to basically show our sources and the people in his company we meant business and we were going to report the truth when we found it and not be intimidated. >> you spent all this time on him, you have to ask the question, which you really don't address in the book and that is why he behaved this way? i know you're not psychiatrist or psychologist but share with us the why. what's driving him? there's so many strange things he does. he comes to the new york times and he says to you, you think i'm bad, i am worse. it's almost like he's waving a red flag door. it's almost like you are going to catch me. >> i think that's a good question. i think we could spend, we could have spent days or weeks or months trying to get to the bottom of it i'm going to tell you what we think is more important with the people around him. what were they thinking? how do they respond? what you do when you get a glance up promptly? especially his brother, bob weinstein who was his only sibling, somebody who had been in business with him, they found two companies were decades during the time he was involved in this alleged predatory behavior we came out of a story wanting to know, what did bob know? what did he do about it? he finally opened up the series of interviews and it's a very interesting psychology we saw time and time again. >> well, harvey did. my reading is, that was the turning. he crossed the line so there was a letter he sent in which he lays out the parade. >> and what we learned, a letter in 2015, two years before the truth spelled out to the public, he basically said i was aware of allegations of sexual misconduct going back to the 90s and two cases i provided money used to silence women but i, like a lot of other people in his orbit chose to believe him and he was only engaged in extramarital activity like i'm bad ntr my wife but in the case of bob weinstein, he had a rationale rooted in his own battle with abuse. he toast to believe his brother was a sex addict. >> you are dodging the question. why? there's something -- >> i'll tell you what we know. this story is power and how power works. >> that's what the evidence says. what i would say that part of the way that it's about power, it's about work. these women, they were actresses or former sisters -- they showed up, some of them on the first day of work, there are so many women in this book who were harassed or assaulted on their first day of work. they show up with their ambitions and aspirations and hopes and dreams but we you see again and again is that weinstein is able to turn those against them. i think it's about whether these women are going to have a shot at achieving what they want to in the workplace and whether those hotel room stories, their bait and switch whether women go in expecting one thing and get another. >> i understand but there's some perverted sexual drive he has, no? >> i think one of the things we realizes that in 1990, when we were able to identify who we considered almost the patient zero of the weinstein investigation, it won't who went to work for miramax right out of college and was allegedly sexually assaulted by him on the top and silenced through one of these settlements and when we were able to start to look at what happened around that, we found out john schmidt was the chief financial officer of the company and aware of this. this is 1990 and harvey weinstein went into his office and said i've done something horrible, i promise it won't happen again. it was remarkable for us to realize this was not somebody -- time and again he was basically confronted with his behavior and even 27 years before the investigation claiming have to have knowledge and promising to change -- >> so why? i'm sorry, i want to persist on this. what is driving him? not to go too far but it's really important to understand, at least for you in your search for what his behavior and what was likely an obviously it was compulsion but why? if we had on here sodium, it might take a while and we asked, what's this about for you? i don't think he will say power. >> his power was as a movie producer. part of what you see in the story is the way he weaponize so many everyday aspects of the workplace in pursuit of this alleged predation. going to say something totally gross but it's important, especially in the later years, he would have assistance, female assistance procure supplies of this penile election erection drug, sort of like, more than one assistant in more than one country, tells stories of keeping supplies, especially with one of them who worked in new york, and it to him more than once a day. so this was a prestigious company, a company that was making movies that we all thought. what's remarkable is the way he was able to deploy so many elements of this company, its contract, as assistant, lawyers and sometimes offices in pursuit of whatever this thing he wanted was. >> what was it? >> -- >> i'm sorry, it's some kind of weird foreplay -- well, inject this into my, it's business? >> i think it's beyond our knowledge. >> we thought the big question we wanted to tackle in this book were not for the psychology of weinstein who had engaged in a long pattern of predatory behavior not against actresses but women who worked in his company but we wanted to tackle those questions. [applause] i think those are some of the things we are all wrestling with, how did lisa bloom, one of the most prominent attorneys in the country cross over to the other side to work with weinstein in 2016 and 17? >> that's great. and i understand you are dodging the question. what's really important is the behavior and impact on these women time and time again. tell me a little bit about the lawyers. how did the lawyers? >> lisa bloom, i will pause on her for a second, this was, there were a variety of high-power attorneys who i came into weinstein's orbit and helped him conceal the scrutiny. lisa bloom, we knew she worked for weinstein. we encountered her in the course of our reporting and "she said" she went because she was only aware he made inappropriate comments toward women and she wanted to help him apologize. in the course of reporting this book, we were able to obtain confidential records to show she had much knowledge of serious allegations against him and she played a much darker role. we had a model that we produced, people can read for themselves what the lawyer was saying in 2016 and when she thought all of the other tactics she would used to help him undermine one of his accusers and it really is basically like a play book and how she will have all of her experience to help him work against them. we've seen her billing records which are hour by hour that shows she was working with them, she was working with them and david boyce in one of the most prominent attorneys in the country, somebody who won the case of gay marriage before the supreme court but he had also been one of harvey's biggest offenders over the course of 15 years. we really thought it was important to eliminate what these lawyers played. >> what you think of these reputation managers? one of my favorite lines in the book is when he says i'm tired of this. >> weinstein hired so many attorneys and spinners and that was actually, he got to the final showdown, it was almost confusing because it was like who is representing you? would we even call if we want a straight answer? it's clear they did not agree with each other but i think our experience, the lesson for us was that all of the high-powered legal help and pr help in the world does not really do anything when you have brave sources, a lot of facts you've documented, 25 years of allegations and when you've got great institutions willing to stand up for the vulnerable. [applause] [applause] >> it didn't help him because it was kind of the tipoff, wasn't it? >> you are in trouble. you know, the best pr people are the people who help journalists. he did end up helping us in some ways. he was pretty open from the beginning about the fact that his client was really difficult. [laughter] >> you ask a really potent question. that is where we are now in the need to movement. you say, has there been too much change or not enough? what your answer? >> we didn't want to stop with the publishing of the weinstein story. we wanted to push through into the year that followed the "me too" movement about that. we actually were grateful enough to have the opportunity to report behind the scenes as christine boz a ford and testifying in washington. it became one of the more controversial moments. >> you say in the book you interviewed her. dozens of hours. do you believe her? >> i can tell you christine boz a ford is probably the most precise and diligent stores, that i have ever reported on. in re-creating for the readers, what was happening behind the scenes she was on her way and even the day before she testified, she had some of her advisors trying to approach her before the committee and she refused to be coached. she knew the answer to the questions and she even was upset with writing and free writing to make sure she had the language just right. i can tell you in her account and her experience, i haven't really encountered somebody who appears to be as precise and of test with getting the truth right. mark. >> precise memory on when this happened or where and so forth. that has been used to undermine what she testified and said. i think the interesting question now, all that's available about christine blasey ford in allegations in kavanaugh, if he would just say a judge here in the district of columbia and somebody gave you that information, you think it's enough to publish a story? was insufficient? would have met your standard to publish that? >> i think the reason it's interesting is because in your paper the washington post, it did publish that story -- >> but it was in the midst of the important nomination. i'm asking a different question. i really mean this, i took a journalism seminar and assign it as a manual about going through a really difficult case. the kavanaugh case unfolded was very difficult. i wonder whether everything we know, the precision and there is some precision but there is imprecision and they are not the cooperating witnesses that you wanted in your work on weinste weinstein, i'm asking, would you have published that in the new york times? >> i think i was part of why we wanted to write about it. the story ended up being a case in which there is so much overwhelming proof that we felt we had to sort of take on a much harder case. the first thing i would say in answer to your question, the fact that christine blasey ford doesn't remember everything about that night is a sign of lack of credibility. i would say the opposite. [applause] i'm going to get to your question, so i think when somebody is willing to acknowledge they don't remember, we generally see that as a strike but the reason we were so drawn to this is that they are questions about what is unresolved and controversial which are backed number one, what's the scope of behavior under scrutiny? are we only talking about graphic sexual assault? i think good and that question which is how far back are we going? it's very powerful to go back a long time but the further back you go, the harder it is because it passage of time. number two, how do we get to the bottom of what happened? especially when it's the high school era incident for many years ago and the number three, what is a counter be like? >> you'd be disappointed in me if i didn't press you to answer. >> i'm getting to your question. it was so newsworthy, but supreme court justice who's about to be appointed, this is a woman who is a research scientist whose business is precision. we are not the editors of the new york times, we wouldn't have made that final call but i would tell you we tried very hard to speak to christine blasey ford even before this came a political story because we did. >> they decide what it was. >> christine blasey ford did not come forward with her allegation when kavanaugh was a lower court judge. it was really when he was considered one of the most powerful jobs in the entire country that she felt she had a civic duty to report that. so there's questions about the kind of judgment in terms of news organizations and when we publish stories and allegations and why in some cases, you're looking at up pattern of predatory behavior, he worried that person is still going on and if you don't report the truth, they will keep hurting other people. he almost think it's a public safety issue and then there are other considerations when it's somebody in a position like the supreme court. >> you posed this question in your book, which i think is very interesting, would she have been better off staying quiet? in her own life? you posed that question and don't answer it. >> we know kavanaugh, after these wrenching testimonies on both sides, he is now on the supreme court and christine blasey ford is back in california so he will continue to be up visible public figure and we can trace what happens to him but i think it continuing to wonder how she's doing and in our experience -- [applause] when i came to the first interview with her month after that, she was still living in hiding. she did not yet feel like they were safe enough. >> you posed the question about whether she was trying to retain control of her own story and obviously she was unable to, correct? >> she became a vehicle and in the many hours we spent interviewing her, this is clear it was not somebody what interest catapulting herself to become a major figure in the me to move it and i think one of another reason we wanted to write about her is that she did become the vehicle, people came to he see her as a hero and others as a felon and the vehicle and we want readers to see this is a very real person and behind the scenes, it's so much more complicated. >> the gathering, when you've got your sources and actresses together, i think it's fascinating and i would ask, you were there and did all this work and wrote the book, what did you learn about yourselves? [laughter] >> that's definitely the hardest question. >> you're going to tell me i'm not answering your question but i really am. [laughter] [applause] i believe in the journalistic process. it's not about megan or me or you, we've been fortunate to do these gigantic stories. but the tools we describe in this book are the tools that journalists across the country and across the world use every single day. if you follow the process and use the judgment, they really, really do work and megan and i certainly are happy about certain decisions we made but i feel like fundamentally, that's what we -- >> that's a brilliant answer because the answer is, you picked the right profession. [laughter] what did you learn about yourself? >> well, i think i learned -- i've been a reporter for 20 years and i've done a variety of stories and i think for me, one of the things i learned in the course of the reporting, starting and i from the first phone call while i was on maternity leave and i didn't even know her until we start working together, my first day back to an a half years ago, so for me, i think one of the things happen in addition to the subject matter and paternalism from authors also an incredible partnership platform so i think for me, learning to work so closely with a fellow journali journalist, that has been probably one of the most unexpected and fantastic treat about doing this work. [applause] >> is a microphone. [laughter] i'm old enough to remember. >> i think we would be bothered if we did not ask you a question or two. i have a hypothetical for you, you are the investigative editor of the universe, what is it as an investigative journalist that you most want to know about how they used their office and other foreign leadership, what do you think most needs to be investigated and what you think we do not understand? >> i think there's so much and we have to remember the ukrainian story, which there's been a lot of attention given to and rightly so, just looking through the keyhole at the trump administration. there's much more to look at. i'm going to send a copy and i hope you will sign it and adam schiff who's running the investigation. it's how to run an investigation. [applause] you can't do it in two weeks or into months. you can't say oh, we found three women who were assaulted or harassed. you have to look at the whole total universe infects the obligation. that's what you did in this case and hopefully in this internet age, there is a way to slow down everything including trump, the people who work for him, a full investigation of what you did, the ups and downs and you two went on the most wonderful ride of any. [applause] >> want to know about what trump did and didn't do. >> i think it's why, why do you? one of the things with trump is, from nixon to trump, 20% and i once went to a junior high school with a friend, raise your hand and said what he's he doing? [laughter] he said all presidents are isolate. trump might be the most isolated president. he had no government experience. self validation that no one here does. he made it to presidency on his own. you see this confidence that he goes publicly and in private with advisors. people can say whatever he's hey, i'm here, you're here because of me. as far as he is concerned, he's in control and what's happened is unfortunate for him and the country. the treacherous curtain death. it comes oh yes, mr. president. we agree with you. in reality that's out there -- that's why he took the washington post and new york times so much because we are bringing this. >> you want to know what he did and all of that self-confidence. >> i want to know what we are facing a governing crisis. i have all kinds of information, 99 out of 100 make no sense at all. the north korean policy in a war with north korea, all of basic and economic policy issues, how did we get there? what is the impact? what might be the outcome? my wife and i were in south korea last week and people in south korea, there next to conjunctions weapons. he went with a certain amount into they are worried, what's going on? what's the strategy? the issue in one of these, national security, when he's on this about why are we spending all of this money? we be so rich if we didn't do this. mr. president, we are doing all of these things to prevent that. the president has to be told this is why we have these alliances, this is why we have the defense system. that's one of my moments as a reporter. >> i look forward to finding out about this. [laughter] [applause] >> thank you. you and megan can interview me. [laughter] >> you got it. [applause] >> i really can't hear, you have a longitudinal study. i want to know, you think three times is a charm? >> i think one of the things i was pointing to, when christine plaza forward christine plaza report came forward, there would be a hearing that is this incredible opinion piece, they were trying to negotiate what that hearing would be and she noted so many years after her experience coming forward testifying from this committee still has not put up a protocol an allegation of sexual obligation or assault. so many years after she came forward, i think what's clear is that you are tracking the attitudes, there's no question that anita hill, while thomas was confirmed and that she did play a huge role, cultural attitudes toward sexual harassment, i think you will see the impact that christine had. [applause] >> over here. >> thank you for all the work you've done, hearing you repeatedly interrupt these wom women, it's your assumptions of what they were about to say. i think there's some position and justice kavanaugh and let them finish. i'm really interested in heari hearing, is women doing this work, have you emotionally dealt with the information you had and living through the kavanaugh hearings, i couldn't believe it and statistically we know both of you have been victims of sexual assault. what's it been like for you as women? >> megan and i have a firm rule, it's all about our sources. want a place for the women we talked to and we are doing our jobs when we talk to them. they are in a unique relationship, we are not their friends, we are journalists trying to bring stories to life. when you're doing the work, you're trying to be study. victims want to feel compassion but they also want to deal they are in firm and steady hands. i did not want to speak to a reporter who was an emotional mess so we had a lot of feelings and reaction during this work but i think it's also all about having each other as partners because you need to be professional and interviews. >> we tend to trade off the emotion. we are lucky enough to be able to help hold each other up. >> i think my final answer to question is that in reporting, it is ultimately empowering. it's very difficult in your standing in a river of pain. there's such force and desire and it's sort of moving in the right direction. i would say fund would not be the right word. it was galvanizing. [applause] >> i'm a journalist and we saw your book. the change that happened. [inaudible question] [inaudible] how do you draw the line when you are reporting about sexual harassment? >> first of all, congratulations to your. [applause] would love to hear more about that specific reporting you did. i can tell you is that after we broke the weinstein story, are phones were flooded with tips and women coming forward with their accounts and we had to come up with the triage system to figure out how to build other stories coming in and there was group products. we were even doing ground sessions with some of the reporters to explain. it was one thing to watch it spread across the news organizations across the country and around the world, it's been energizing. we can't be sure of what's going to happen next. we can't change hr department. not only for us to know but for companies and bad guys to know that there's this project happening across journalism. it's really been thrilling to watch. [applause] >> i would like to thank you. decades of searching for the truth. [applause] history repeats itself. [applause] do you have a question for them? >> i want to thank you. [applause] >> over here. >> i have a question. i was waiting for the punchline but i'm definitely putting both of you on my list. i wanted to talk about the women who were the sources for your book. ... >> who has predictions but there are a number of women she talks about in this article who has lost their jobs, not a lot of money, they are separated from the children i'm just wondering while the movement to uncover these cases. i am hoping there is some thought of the moment to protect. like we have protection programs are witnesses to be trial across the world. i think that if that is something, how do we move that into the moment. >> i think you are putting your finger on it's what's been frustrating about this whole discussion about whether these accused men will come back or not. will we see or and more come back, because you are putting your finger on the more interesting question which is what is going to happen to these women. some of them suffered severe consequences with the workplace or psychological and from this happening the first place. i can tell you the woman we wrote about in his book, did not do anything to get harassed or get assaulted. they were doing the equivalent of walking down the street is this happen to them. you are going to jobs, etc. so something very unfair about this kind of reporting because why is it women's work to have to tell the stories. [applause]. why is the women who have to undergo this messy and painful process of being tortured about whether to go on the record or not. the one hand it can be so high in effect and so and then you never know what the cost will be. this is something we have to think about what these heights and builds about how the work woman in 2016 hub allegations against president trump. she really convinced some of them to go on the record. some hundred times pretty long but, this is what we do for a leaving. we help people and telling the truth. it's a public service. make the argument that will hopefully help other people in some way. then make it happen. some of these women, will attacked. really separately. >> threatened to sue us. it was a tough conversation. there was at the end of today, we can't go into quote on their behalf. there are things that are outside of our control and this is the really tough calculation. but these women make pretty. >> but in the last chapter of the book, is the sort of gathering of women of all come forward. their experiences of coming forward are so varied. some of them are treated like heroes. and some of them paid a really significant price something that is so term or precious about it is that you never really know what the effects will be until you do it. >> i'm sorry to see we are over in time. two more questions. >> hello, i wrote my question on my phone so please excuse me but as a survivor, a college campus advocate and a huge fan of everybody up on stage for years. thank you for everything. that testament is echoed throughout this room. this book in this article changed my live and obviously i knew as well as everybody else, i went through a small cornfield in kentucky. and now that school is very different because of ami to limit and the harvey weinstein scanlon everything. so my question is, do you have anything to see to the future i guess to the young survivors, to the advocates, the activists, to those sitting and do milk dominated fields. those facing harassment, whatever it may be. do you have any advice or encouragement. >> melissa, thank you. [applause]. thank you for coming tonight. and coming up to the microphone. we appreciate that. if you or sounds to me like you have turned your private pain into working towards collective strength. your advocacy work. hats off to you for that. [applause]. one of the things that we will actually, we had talked last week and there was an 11 year girl who got up and asked what things will going to be like for her generation moving forward. i can't we obviously can't look into a crystal ball. we can't tell you, we don't have predictions. if you would've told us when we will driving home from new york times two nights before our stories published. it was like one part in the morning we turn each other however so immersed in reporting and try to get this to the finish line and make * sure the story was airtight. we weren't even thinking about what the impact might be. return each other said, do you think anybody's going to read the story print (and i think it was just sort of, we had no idea. about the impact that this story and others like it, would have. in the year that followed and beyond. while we can't predict, all we can see is there's been a lot of people we've encountered in, the sources our investigations and are reporting have been motivated to act because they want to help protect younger generations. and that was also something that is come out in interviews with christine leslie ford, that when she came away from testifying, she said listen, i didn't come to washington to derail a nomination. my hope was that hug to my story with integrity that might make it easier for younger generations come forward. >> news one at that one of the people who work very closely, is here, please sit points, while christine was eight boards. [applause]. [applause]. i think he wrote in the book and so much of what, obviously a year ago today today that everybody in this room was leaving through that they were talking about this at the time. they dealt with this very stressful senate hearings. it was that hope that it was part of me being annoying and asking them questions because they're trying to go back with their work but even from that moment i think everybody was so conscious of what this legacy is widely for people like you. thank you. >> for saul, thank you all truly. i'm a nervous friend is asking. but who do you hope the individual or group, redirect what you hope they learn from it. >> hope and write it. you know. [applause]. every reader needs to read it. our information economy in this country has brought really healthy right now. and the idea of leaders to make to book into and nearly hundred thousand words, of a very complicated material means so much to us. so really thinking to anybody who comes on that journey with us and beyond. [applause]. thank you. >> do you want to introduce family. >> chart. i would have to. my parents, are here. [applause]. my brother-in-law stephen is here. [applause]. [inaudible conversation] my dearest and oldest friend, i am really excited to see them. [applause]. >> real quick and final question. alternative titles. what else might you have called this because as i read it, a couple of times, you refer to the reckoning. that there has been a reckoning in this and indeed, there has. anyway. title. >> when she said, it was on the table, there will no others. there will another no other horses in the running for the title. it just felt like such the right title. >> i guess it's actually just staying, that's a nice quote, they only tackle you we do appear in the ball. >> yes christine blasé ford. >> and from the side lines for me to have carried the ball, and over the finish line and i think we owe you. [applause]. >> thank you thanks so much. [applause]. thank you. [applause]. thank you guys. >> thank you so much for joining us. if you would like to have your book signed, please stay seated for just a few minutes and if you are looking for an exit, you can use the main lobby or the corner lobby to my right. thank you. [background sounds] >> cspan2 washington journal, live every day news and policy issues that impact you. coming up saturday morning, as authors week, author and columnist chelsea discusses her book our broken america. it looks at the political political cart divide. >> will be on to talk about the impact impeachment could have on the youth vote in campaign 2020. be sure to watch cspan2 news washington journal live as seven eastern saturday mornings. join the discussion. and be sure to watch authors week, all this week, starting at 8:00 a.m. eastern cspan2 live campaign 2020 coverage continues. saturday at 4:00 p.m. eastern. with a white congresswoman gabbert and hudson new hampshire. sunday at 2:00 p.m. eastern, former vice president joe biden, and peterborough new hampshire parade monday at 2:00 p.m. eastern, entrepreneur andrew yang, and new hampshire. and tuesday at 11:00 a.m. eastern, senator elisabeth warren in boston. watch the presidential candidate live on cspan2 online@cspan2 .org. or listen live on the freaked cspan2 radio app. >> new impeachment of president trump continued to follow the process on cspan2 leading to a senate trial. live unfiltered coverage on cspan2. on-demand is cspan.or cspan.org/impeachment. and listen on the free cspan2 radio app. >> up next up on both tvs afterwards. often political columnist michelle malkin, offers her thoughts on u.s. immigration policy. she's interviewed by republican congressman shipwright of texas. afterwards, is the weekly interview program with relevant gas hose interviewing top nonfiction authors about their latest work. >> locally to be with you michelle. let's get ready to talk about your book open borders link. >> thanks. >> first part of your book really captured my attention. it's really important to me to wish the extent that cartels have operational control of the border. of into the water numerous times i love getting your perspective of that. the $2 million a week at the gulf cartel is just making just moving people across. you know this fall, and is the real problem, they're the ones profit-sharing on the backs of women and children and migrants. can you talk a little bit about that. as for the opening we do make in your book pretty. >> your white you are right, the marketng

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