Transcripts For CSPAN2 Federal Bureau Of Prisons Director Testifies Before Senate Judiciary... 20240713

Along with questions about oversight of the president , she was asked about the death of Jeffrey Epstein. The good morning, everybody. We will get started just in a second. Welcome. I have a very brief opening statement. Thank youa for coming. We will get you sworn in here in a moment. Its important that we have this oversight hearing and there are a couple of areas of inquiry. One is Jeffrey Epstein and hopefully about the implementation of the act and where can we go from there, how can we buildst upon that, those are the three areas that i would like to talk about and they will turn over to senator feinstein. Thank you very much, mr. Chairman. I want to welcome you. Its wonderful for me to see a woman in charge so we can celebrate for a few brief moments o at least. [laughter] you are responsible for the care s d custody of over 180,000 federal inmates, and one of the Justice Departments largest employers with approximately 35,500 employees as of may of this year. As the chairman mentioned, there are two issues i hope that we can focus on. One is the First Step Act which was mentioned in the second is problems with staffing and conditions within your department. Im going to put most of this in the record. I think what i will do in the interest of time is just that the statement in the record. Without objection. Last Year Congress came togetheres and passed what i consider to be one of the most important criminal Justice Reform laws in the generation. The First Step Act passed by overwhelming majority and was signed by President Trump and we now have an obligation to insure that its properly implemented. I think the chair for holding this hearing, but im disappointed that the department of justice refused the bipartisan request to testify today. This is one of the many troubling sign divvied cosines they are not on board implementing the First Step Act. The act of 2010 which i coauthored like senators grassley and the reduced the disparity from 101 down to 181 but the department of justice is persisting retroactive acts for individuals in some cases even working to put them back behind bars. I wrote the provision that reduces these unjust sentences for nonviolent offenders and in a position the Justice Department is taking is just plain wrong. The department of justice should be working to identify eligible individuals and get them out not wasting valuable time. 1600 people have been released because of the application of the sentencing act. There should be more. I would like to recognize to visitors that are here today that have benefited from the First Step Act and in particular i would like to recognize my constituent entities thank you for joining us could you raisese your hand. Received a life sentence by two minor drug convictions and served 16 years in prison and became one of the first people released under the First Step Act. Given a Second Chance, he and others have joined us today are making our criminal Justice System better and more just. Its worth all of our time and effort that it took to pass the First Step Act. I hope it will inspire all of us to search a little harder forj mepartisan solutions in the department of justice to change the mind and join us. Thank you mr. Chairman. Thank you. Doctor sawyer joined in 1976 as a psychologist at the federal Correctional Institute in 1983 named the chief psychologist psychological services. She said increasing responsibility since then. Previously3as served as directof the bureau of prisons from 1992 to 2003. She was reappointed as the director in august of this year. Would you please rise . Do you solemnly swear the testimony youre about to give us the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, so hopsohelp you god . I do. Welcome, and the floor is yours. Good morning chairman graham, Ranking Member feinstein and members of the committee. I appreciate the opportunity to discuss the mission and operations of the bureau of prisons. Ap i thank you for your work with the bureau of her many years. Your support has been in trouble for many decades including the years of tremendous population growth, rapid expansion and opening up of many institution. I also think you and your colleagues for your groundbreaking criminal justice work and bipartisan support in the First Step Act. I look forward to sharing our progress in implementing this critical piece of legislation. Programming to assist those lawabiding citizens has been a cornerstone of. We felt that the reentry journey begins the day they arrive in custody. With the first step ac act act k forward to helping improve the lives of inmates and thereby help keep the i community safer. I was honored for three months ago to be selected by the attorney general to return to lead the bureau and work alongside the finest correctional professionals in the world. I began my career as a psychology intern at one of the prison and helped to include morgan,a associate organ, before my original point is the purest of the director in 1992. A position i held until my retirement in 2003. While much has changed in the 16 years that i was outside of the bureau since i last served as directothe director of the founn of the bureau is still quite down. Weve been challenged by dramatic lows weve experiencedd an insert with a significant budget cuts to follow the tragedy of 9 11 when the shift from the focus to shift came from crime to terrorism and our budget suffered severely after that appear to. Over 35,000 staff play criticala Critical Role in the criminal Justice System and did the great work every day goes largely unseen by the general public. It is inherently dangerous work particularly at the highest security institutions were the most dangerous inmates serve as a responsibility we take very seriously. Cu unfortunately, weve experienced Staff Shortages that make our job even more difficult. In my first 12 weeks, i have placed an emphasis on killing almost 3,000 vacancies nationwide. Since returning as director, ive mobilized the overview to identify areas of strength and weakness and have identified three significant areas that need this. One is staffing, when his training in the third is anew ts in every commitment to the basic practice. Our system is the largest inta e Nation Housing roughly 176,000 inmates across the entire bureau in this return to the bedrock of the corrections is critical to ensure that our staff nationwide are following the policies and procedures that keep staff, inmates and the public safe. The bureau nationwide also continues to face dangerous Security Threats from the introduction of contraband. Illicit narcotics and contraband cell phones are some of the chief threats, the use of drones to drop contraband on prison grounds is an ongoing problems that continues to evolve. Weve deployed contraband technologies and we continue to leverage the new technologies and cuttingedge solutions to effectively detect and interdict prison contraband. The aging infrastructure is another concern. Almost half of prisons over 30yearsold and date back to over 80yearsold and some to the earliest periods of correction. Prison facilities are subjected to heavier than normal wear since they are continuously used 24 hours a day, 365 days a year and this aging infrastructure affects security, as Critical Systems sustain wear and tear as well as premature deterioration. The implementation of the First Step Act is the priority for the bureau of prisons and im pleased to report we have made great progress. Weve updated the policies and implementing the requirements od the act. We are looking closely with the department of justice and independent review committee on the risks and Needs Assessment that it requires. We listened to the important comments from the interested stakeholders from victims to a broad array and the statutory timelines in the act or very formidable. But im proud to say the bureau and the department of the deadline particularly the release of the new risk and Needs Assessment system and we continue to remain focused on the full and balanced implementation of the First Step Act. Ha this concludes my statement and i would be happy to answer any questions that you may have. Thank you very much. As i indicated in my statement, i want to talk about the death of mr. Jeffrey epstein. Do you concur with the opinion that it was a suicide . That was the finding ofr. The coroner. Do you have any evidence to suggest otherwise . I do not. How could this have happened . Unfortunately, the death and the whole situation are under the investigation of the fbi and Inspector Generals Office and im not at liberty to discuss the specifics ofsi the case. I discuss issues around institutional operations, but i cant specifically talk about that particular issue. With the case this highprofile, theres got to be the major malfunction of the system or criminal enterprise to allow this to happen. So are you looking at both come is the fbi looking at those . The fbi is involved in smoking, yes. Do we have people in custody today in this highprofile nature and have we done anything to address this since mr. Epstein stepped . We take every life very seriously. A high profile prisoner is no more significant in terms of our operations than the average in a that comes our way. Highprofile and somebody on a suicidere watch. I have to explai explain a se watch system if i may. I cant talk about epstein tht we have differenbutwe have difff response if we identify those that have suicidal thinking, and i came in as a psychologist and worked with a lot of suicidal inmates and was awarded the facility. I know how difficult it is to always predict who is suicidal and who is not. One is we have a suicide watch operation placement. Its a very difficult setting where everything is stripped from the room except the mattress. They get a course down to where that cannot be twisted in any way they can hang themselves from it. They have one mattress and one blanket and are watched constantly. Theres nothing else in the room. Was mr. Epstein on suicide watch . Yes he was but the average time iss about 24 hours because it is a stark and depressing situation. Ge we then move into another tier r tier of observation which is psychological observation. Did that happen in this case . I cant speak specifically of ensuring this so you understand the procedure. They then can move another tier which is psychological observation where they get their clothing back into the air in a more normalized setting. They are watched and scrutinized every moment of the day but its a more normal environment do they have roommates . They do not when they are on suicide watch because they are being watched continuously. Did mr. Epstein have a roommate . Though he did not. Psychologists see them routinely and interview them repeatedly and once it is determined that the threat of suicide seems to have passed within the inmates can be returned back to open population. Well, clearly it didnte work here, so we will await the report because all of the victim said mr. Epstein have had their hearts ripped out and will never see justice. One was paroled alleviated from the system . I became director in 92 and it was already gone for new cases. The old cases had to move onto this was like the late 80s or early 90s. You have to ask congress. It c was the bodies here that me the decision. Do you have any recommendations as to whether or not we should look at reinstituting parole at the federal level . I was encouraged by the First Step Act. How would it be different than parole plaques it would be different in one respect, the respect i was going to comment on is they gave him instead to want to do well to get involved in programs and to do positive things because they solve a benefit isaw the benefiy could earn earlier release from prison for sure. If the hearing was favorable. For the firstt step act has done is offer new incentives to want to perform well and want to engage in programs because we have a lot of programs out there for the past many years and the numbers enrolled were never as high as we were hoping for because a lot of times they thought they didnt see a benefit for them to the first setback incentivized inmates to want to improve themselves and move forward. What would give the most flexibility in terms of deciding who to release if somebody has been 25 or 30 years on a 40 or 50 year sentence, would it be different than the first step . It allows the group of people to interview him and made periodically with different points in their career and institutions and they would look at the progress and how theyve done somehow theyve benefited and whether they would have recidivism in the future. Should we reinstate parole at the federal level . We would be happy to take a step back and look we would be happy to review that. Thank you mr. Chairman. On november 17, the New York Times published a story called hazing humiliation, care for working while female in the federal prison. Now, given the fact come and i wrote this in a letter inan the other of last year that the bureau has been onn notice since 2010 and it was clear at that time of sufficient steps were not taken to protect female guards and i requested that the department of justice investigate the failure to adequately address the harassment of female guards and ask that they look into the situation. What is the situation today and what has been done to address this issue . When you have women, and im obviously a Woman Working in the system for 30 years now, when you have women with mails you have a lot of knuckleheads in thathe constitution. Just as a woman on a metro car you have to be careful that someone is and when to move up and try to touch or you walk down the street and get cat calls from workers on the side. They are all over the place in terms of the way men treat women. There are going to be times when the inmates behave very inappropriately to the female staff and female staff need to stand up boldly and avarice. Thaddress that. The problem with the Sexual Harassment issues that troubled me greatly is when the female staff did not feel the male raunterparts were coming to their assistance. Thats where we dropped the ball in the bureau. We cant always control the behavior of inmates because they are an institution. You put them in special housing for little while, they come back, but the part of this that angered me tremendously as when the female staff said the male staff for not stepping up to help them so thats where the attention has been with educating all of our staff out there that we are all colleagues and me to b need to be treated professionally and it is never okay tois allow any one to disrespect our other colleagues. We now have different if we hold the rest of the staff accountable. With me ask you this question. Today do managers separate a female correctional staff officer from a senior officer who made sexual comments and propositions . Whenever we become aware of its traditional date ofer a thrt assessment and determine whether or not those individuals can continue to Work Together in the same environment and if there is any concern, then they are separated. What exactly has been done to remedy that situation . How many have you separated and what have you done a i dont have the numbers but we can get them to you. Weve increased the penalties on the inmates behave that way and weve educated our staff in terms of thehe Inappropriate Conduct and if we find male or female Staff Members we will take actionn on those as the situation is investigate investd take appropriate action because that is unacceptable. I would like to see the documentation of what you have done in that regard. So i would request that now i served for six years and decent sentences and got into the proles who ran the womens prison and a so i know a little bit about prisons and ive been in a large number, every one in california as a matter of fact. I am concerned about this on the federal level. I think that it is vague and imprecise and i would like to know exactly what has happened and what has been done to remedy the situation and if you can provide that to me i would be very grateful. I share your concern and we will get that information over. Before i ask questions i want to thank the people that supported the First Step Act for coming here to the Due Process Institute into the prison loca locals. Before i get to the questions about the First Step Act, i want to comment because some critics of the First Step Act have noted the case of Joel Francisco a prisoner of new jersey released as a result of the adjustment in the way that croaking debate coach cocaine sentences are [inaudible] in october he was arrested for firstdegree murder. He would have gotten out of prison even without the First Step Act is that correct and would you agree that the First Step Act will help prevent crimes like this in the future by steering more prisoners away from future criminal conduct . I would hope so, sir. In regards to the act in portland i want to compliment the people at the prison where senator durbin and i visited a couple of months ago. What i get from them is a real good faith effort to carry out so my question is since the First Step Act seeks to reduce recidivism among the nonviolence of this, Congress Passed the law with the intent that they developed a risk and Needs Assessment tool to measure the risk of recidivism andse undetermined programs the prisoner should be enrolled in to reduce recidivism,re a tool s released in july that the Justice Department has acknowledged that the job is only half done because the izbureau of prisons tools to spt include Needs Assessment component. So, question, when can we expect the bureau to comply with the requirements and implement these Assessment Tools . We have been working both in the development of the Risk Assessment, the Pattern Program that has come out is based on our own system that was enrecidivismbased and its now the Needs Assessment in the bureau of prisons weve been using for years. It doesnt quite meet the stringent bar that we would liks it to but we are not required to have it completely finished until the end of next year with the timeframe laid out we will be initiating the assessment come january 15 which is required on the First Step Act and also initiate the Needs Assessment at the same time. We will be continuing to tweak the program toon make sure its explicit and precise on evaluating the needs and its going to involve psychological evaluation in terms of needs, educational needs, health care needs, all of those are identified right now with our existing Needs Assessment that you set a high bar we want to achieve completely so we willf continue to improve the Needs Assessment progress throughout the first year to get it as accurate and high standards as it can possibly be. In doing this, this evidencebased programming as a way of reducing recidivism how will the bureau of prisons and sure that it gives opportunity for faithbased programming . The faithbased programming are critical to the operations. Most of those we have a religious Service Program every institution with multiple faithbased groups represented. What we rely on tremendously or individuals that come in from the community of all of the different groups to provide the needs of the inmates. We have 11,000 volunteers that come into the institutions right now the vast majority of those are faithbased groups and we have a few faithbased groups that have stepped up with the broader programs they would like to offer the institutions and we are advising them on how they can enter their program into this evaluation that is going to be done through the department of justice and outside of evaluators to determine if they truly have evidence to reduce the rates of the sum and those that meet that criteria we would love to have them come into the institutions so that faithbased programs are very critical to the overall operations improving the livesm of inmates. Im glad you came out of retirement to take on this responsibility and i look forward to working with you. I also want to acknowledge the role played by thee colleagues n the First Step Act particularly in the area of prison reform. The First Step Act aims to improve Public Safety by strengthening to rehabilitate inmates. To do this but requires the department of justice to develop the scoring system to assess every inmates risk intuitive programming treatment needs and scoring system makes all the difference in the world then you have many programs ahead of you im particularly sorry that they refused to come to the hearing today. Its critical that it be transparent and accurate and unbiased, but i am concerned the system the department of justice has created falseut short of tht mark. At this moment in the nations history when the clash of race and justice conference us every single day, the foundation of the scoring system iss so stark, sobering and fundamentally unfair that i cannot stand without challenge from the department of justice itself in the test round of the tool that is demonstrated here over half, 53 were designated high risk compared to only 29 . Compared to 7 of africanamerican men. The conviction is a new crime and whether it hass to do with skin color than the previous position would you commit the department of justice risk Assessment Tool will be revised through the recidivism more narrowly and he will explore the challenges totm correct racial disparitiess i want to clarify a point that was confusing when we talked the other day. In terms of the initial Risk Assessment for each inmate we are using the criminal history record that is only conviction. Thats what you and i i were talking about the other day with a friend and coming in. To evaluate recidivism and they are only used on the backend if they returned to custody or they are convicted they will not be utilizing a rest fo the wrist f. I still raised the same point tit isnt a conviction. Absolutely. And we are talking about driving while this and that lets be honest and candid about this today. Its still prevalent. We have a long way to go. It affects the overall numb number. Most everyone in the country cant find recidivism based on the convention but i assure you we hav have to review this Risk Assessment and check the foundation. Every year. The theres an outside group every five years to evaluate and look for things like that and i assure you i agree with you absolutely. Part of bringing these inmates into the position where theres less recidivism so that they are rehabilitated in splitting the service is in front of them that they need while they are g incarcerated o make a difference. The department of justice reported that of 222,000 former prisoners, which you can see here is 49 percent did not complete any type of programming, 82 received no technical or vocational courses and 92 percent did not participate. 57 completed note drug treatment during the incarceration and in my state found to have it, thank you. The second most restrictive federal facility we ask what do you have in place. Its early in the game, i get it but there is nothing that indicates the dedication of resources too make sure they hae a fighting chance to turn their lives around and to be released in the circumstances where recidivism doesnt take place. Do you agree we need more resources and programs . I would invite all of the members to visit. You will find all of the institutions other than the super highly secure weekend education programs, leave 86 we6 residential drug treatment programs across the bureau of prisons. We have the Vocational Training programs, educational training programs. The problem is they choose not to get involved in some of these and we cannot force the inmate program. It is the incentivizing to see a benefit for getting involved. Of getting involved. The industries are the best in the bureau indicted this year before. We had 28,000 inmates. We have 11,000 because we have been cut so badly in terms of the authorities because there was so muc much concern they mit take the job away from a private citizen and i have shared that concern. We cant hurt the industry very much at all that we have been cut from 28,211,000 in the prison industry. So, i assure you our only limitation of providing programs for these inmates will be resources as long as we have sufficient resources we have never had adequate resources toi provide all of the programs for all of the inmates. Im hoping that will change now since you also for the First Step Act. I hope the resources will come along with it to ensure we have the programs available in we are having great difficulty in the treatment we put up so many requests as advertised. We are just going to keep plugging away at it. Can you think of any other incidents that have caused as much crisis as mr. Epsteins death . I can only speak since 1976 when i joined the bureau. I dont know prior to that but its probably gotten the most public attention. There are lots of good patriotic hardworking folks there i get back. This happened in the middle of august, early august and if you are here to testify today and say you are not allowed to speak about this incident. Thats crazy. Can you distinguish among the type of investigations because im aware of at least three investigations. This is a sex trafficking ring inside of the united states. He has evidence, coconspirators and victims that want to know where the evidence has gone. Can you tell us more about the different investigations, i understand there is at least one. Theres two investigations are ongoing. From the fbi investigation or any from the Inspector General, once thos those going to one ofe facilities, we are forbidden from talking to anybody in the institution. We cant send a team we are not allowed to talk to anybody in the institutions about anything happened. With old respect, you have an obligation to speak to the girls were raped by him today. You may not to speak about every particular guard arrested last night buts the fact theres an ongoing attempt by the government touy find out if theres still any evidence that the coconspirator, you do have an obligation to speak to those girls today. You may not speak about the specifics of the charges against the charges against the two guards this morning who were taken into custody, butob more broadly you should be able to ispack can we change any process tbout how the cases of this are handled. Its been more than 90 days and you said we treat every inmates of the same. We believe in america every individual has equaled the navy but notuo every inmate has equal value for the future criminal investigations. Jeffrey epstein was to testify in a case. Somebody thats already been convicted and may be o maybe one watch, theres a lot of reasons to not wanting to kill himself, this is different because it isnt just about the individual inmate who might call themselves, its about the fact that he wasnt able to testify against his other coconspirators. So its wrong as a management matter for you to say we treat everybodys the same. We should be treating people who are yet to testify against others telling us, against other rapists. They have a lot more priority for your institution, dont they ask pretty much any of our inmates in the facilities are pretrial. They are yet to testify, to be involved and share information. I dont know what evidence you are asking of me. You are asking was there evidence in his room or in his possession, that was all come confiscated. The American Public will understand it may not be urgent enough for the department of justice. Its very urgent and its all been confiscated by the fbi as a part of the investigation. Thats why none of that is shared withur the bureau until e investigations are completed. Once they are id be happy to talk with you here. Everything from those investigations, that until we have that information there is nothing i can tell you. If i dont have the information i cannot share anything with you. How widespread is thehe problem . There are a lot of people who think that i this seems a very convenient excuse. So tell us i is it a systemic problem, do we have other people to sleep on the job when they are supposed to be guarding . Weve been monitoring the cameras and the institutions to show how effectively the Staff Members are doing their rounds. We found a couple other instances and immediately refer to boost the Inspector Generals Office, and i am encouraging if people just chose not to do their job, we are hoping that the Attorneys Office will pick up the cases and prosecute them because we dont want those people in the bureau of prisons. They are a danger to everybody, the inmates and staff. We are zealously going about trying to determine which are good employees to doe their job and that is a vast majority of the prison staff, but we do have some i know out there that obviously choose not to follow the policy in the choose not to do their job and we want them gone. We t are exploring those very carefully to identify them and get them out of the system. If it is a training problem they didnt know they were supposed to do, that is our job, we could get a better job training our staff. But if somebody is welltrained and experienced and chooses not to do their job, we want them gone. I assure you of that. I will give a preview of some ive been asking for the recordt you made an important statement about drone drops and contraband veto the institutions. Thats obviously a new and hard problem that we have to play defense but theres also the and sonity for offense with a longterm strategy is about the camera does is something that i think a lot of us would like to hear more about. Epsteins hallway should have been monitored by cameras even if the cards were asleep and we dont have information whether or not there were adequate cameras and a lot of us would like to understand where the Technology Dollars are going. Senator blumenthal is next. Will there be an ig report re what happened . There should be. After the Inspector Generals Office investigates, they come out with a report. People pending criminal charges that wont affect their cases bucases because there is g report we will get a full briefing of the committee. Senator blumenthal. Thank you mr. Chairman. Thank you for your service. I share the sense of outrage and urgency about this issue, not because of any special care about mr. Epstein, but he was the source of evidence to hold accountable other criminals who are as culpable coconspirators in exploiting women and suicide deprived them of their day in court and justice and accountability. So i would like to suggest that we have an oversight hearing directed specifically at this problem relating to mr. Epstein and also were broadly about the problems of proper surveillance and proper oversight. I think it ought to be bipartisan and testimony today suggests that you are as equally troubled about this issue, and id like to ask for your cooperation and commitment that you will. Absolutely. When will the Inspector Generals report be done . They keep telling us soon, but i dont know what that means. They take the amount of time they need to do a thorough investigation and i never know when that is going to end. Im going to write a letter and i hope that others will join me to complete the report as expeditiously as possible. Thereve been plenty of times for himpe to interview, review documents, the document document ive dependably were falsified or not numerous. We are not talking about tons of written documents or testimony, and i think that the Inspector Generals report ought to be dui next week and im going to be writing to the Inspector General and i hope colleagues will join me in that letter. Have you reviewed the documents that allegedly were falsified . Ive not been allowed to see anything. Once they stepped in the are not allowed to do anything so that we do not in any way biased interview with the investigation or affect it in any way. Are the rates of suicide higher in prison than the general population . If you talk about facilities around the country the average rate is 50 per 100,000. If you look at our numbers and our facilities in the last year, we had to and unfortunately one of those days an extraordinarily highprofile case and it paints the prison with a broad brush of incompetence in the system and in the facilities where the northern was 100 inmates if you took it by 100,000 per 100,000 regular institutions are rated 13 per 100,000 if you look around the country they run 22nd. Have been specific changes in policy and practice as a result of the epstein suicide . Policy, minimal because the problem is when we grew so dramatically, when i was director we went from 60,000 inmates to 180, 15,000 deaths to 30,000. That is tremendous. Weve are gettingng decent budgs during the period. We had to grow by 47,000 more inmates but only 7,000 new staff. That means serving Staff Members for every 1,000 inmates we have to absorb into the bureau. One year alone we were required over these in patients with less provisions than the head of the year before. Bo that is the 6,000 drop in position coverage that we had in the bureau. What happens when you are stretched so thin the staff have to make it work because we cant control the population. They dont control who or when they leave, we just have to keep taking them and taking them. We grew so much with the stretched to the limit. My point is the policie poli. They found private prisons have Serious Problems and more frequent reports of violence that could cause death of inmates and they analyzed private prisons between 2011, 2014 and found more safety and security incidents is per capita in the crime facilities and the bureau of prison room facilities. Thfor the critics all programs they indicated that they use would in fact be increasing. If you have plans to increase these . We do not have plans to increase them. Your citation of problems is exactly why we would only low security inmates in a private prisons. We will love this medium at highsecurity us they are not adequate. We always they were a great boon to us when we were growing so dramatically. We couldnt grow them fast enough. We are dow down now to having 10 out of 177,000 in the private institutions into those numbers keep coming down and i think there will be a day as long as we dont get another increase in the population where we will no longer be needing the private prisons. Im going to stop because my time is expired and i have a few more questions i will put in the bucord. One of them you mentioned faithbased programs being imported into the denial of the opportunities to worship a. The subject of a lawsuit i would like to know the explanation for why they denied the opportunity. Thank you mr. Ranking member. I appreciate the testimony today, and id like to go back and talk a little bit about the faithbased programs that we discussed earlier. Could you talk a little bit about those faithbased programs and as described earlier are you offered regardless the demand or the number of volunteers are you equally offering this across your inmates . We are required by law to do that and we have to cover all of the potential followers. We have sweat lodges, we have folks that most of us in the room havent heard of and we also have to provide them for atheists in with the religious freedom restoration act we are required to meet the demands of any state in the inmates comes omr way with and we try to need to those in a special manner and when you have huge numbers of one group and one or two in another, the always get the same number of hours of programming available because the volunteers may not be able to come in as frequently because we can use multiple different groups to address the christian inmates for example or jewish inmates but you have a limited number of the volunteers you can bring for your native americans or whatever it might be. Our goal is to be equitable across the board. That is the way that its orsupposed to be. Do you limit them on the number of the volunteers that are coming in for those programs or is it openended . I would assume the limits on in at the timeme but we have new programs all the time. What would a volunteer have to do. They have to go through a minimal background checks so they do not pose a Security Threat and we also require them to a test in writing. When the come into the institution to make sure they do not bring any contraband or items they shouldnt be bringing in and of them is always a staff member present near the area whether it is a chocolate or correctional officer to guard and make sure nothing else is occurringg during that. Outside of the religiously affiliated, there are others. The First Step Act expected they would expand the program offerings. Can you talk about some of the partnerships with nonprofits and various groups, can you name a few of those and what they are expected to contribute as far as the First Step Act . One talked about bringing in the mentors and to deal with others preparing for reentry. They come in to work with our veterans and we have 11,008 star veterans and we have a very Good Relationship with veterans affairs. They help make sure that they plan to be better than and truly are and not we have three institutions with actual Housing Units with better than the housing unit and a ban together in a very strong way to support each other. They come in quarterly to those institutions to meet. They will come in and work literacy programs or offer support and guide them. We will take anyone willing to come in that meet the requirements that has something positive to provide the inmates into that helps increase theon staff level but when you have no one to provide all those things we try to provide volunteers and outsidere groups become a tremendous resource for us to do more than we can have the resources we have available. I appreciate that. We have a lot of different partners that have elaborated. Before the House Judiciary Committee you testified i they o through a Residential Program because you feel it is a good step for them at least 75 of inmates are released and go through the Halfway Houses are based onia the charge that it seems to 75 is a defense of urine is going through the Halfway Houses. Be that as it may they are really important so september 30, 2019, the only Residential Reentry Program in the entire state of hawaii closed after providing Transitional Services for 29 years. It makes an impact on a facility like this closes the a person that leads a nonprofit that trained people to do these programs wanted to have a person that would be eligible to go through a Residential Reentry Program and we even had a job lined up so its not that it was the result of the lack of money because the bureau did ask for this. Itne isnt easy to get another e up and running but these are important so will you commit them reopening the center lacks we are concerned about losing that Reentry Center as i know you are aware and we met with your staff recently. The incident being sold. We advertised three times for a new Halfway House and got no takers. The problem is the provider it had to be Cost Effective for them so we cannot commit more numbers going in then we have. What we have done is added a couple of things there will be the Halfway House and oversight and then the reporting center which is like home confinement where they get the actual oversight so that would span the workload are asking for a should make it more Cost Effective because the inmates will be paying for it so we are optimistic because we want that in hawaii, too. We are very optimistic we are going to get that. It sounds like a yes. By wouldv would like to havr updates from you so that we have at least one Residential Center open. The thing that happened we learned about the closure of the facility from the residence. So ardent following those requirements . They quit on us so we got the word ar little lat little late i will check back to make sure, because it is our responsibility to make sure that you are aware of that. You testified that you are very committed to implementing the first step for cho there is a recent article in the Washington Post that under the Justice Department to undermine the department by restricting the number of people eligible to be released under the law and the current officials have stated that attorney general has expressed concerns to drive up crime numbers and the administration would be blamed is a something the attorney general had expressed to you next week thats not what i have heard the attorney general say i have never heard those words. Apparently people that are currently on staff and other officials have heard that. That is a major concern to me. You are asked questions about your female employees. I would encourage you to commit to making sure what you provide as training does not count to the aid of the female that you do everything you can to change the culture with this behavior. Thank you senator. Senator kennedy. Thank you chairwoman and madame director we have a federal correctional facility that you are probably familiar with. With huge staffing problems which doesnt make sense. Do you mind if i contact your estaff to see what help we can get. I think it is in the bureaucracy. Right now 94 percent they are down 30. I had thought you would raise this half of that is Correctional Officers problem with filling the positions. I will stop you i want to have a long meeting. And i have a couple other questions. What in your opinion is justice quick. Thats a heavy question. I would assume that people are treated fairlyly and equitable consequences occur if one violatesme the rights we should anticipate that. And somebody gets what they deserve those that deserve to mom liberty in terms of crime and punishment is that sickness that sure would be cured or a consequence that deserves punishment quick. I think the latter is true but the former statement in terms of pedophiles or sex offenders. Some of those whose behavior has been deemed to be at the root is a psychiatric or Mental Health issue it needs to be looked at as both but either way the consequences should match the offense. Tell me the best procedure in your judgment. You have a lot of experience that i can tell from your testimony today that you know what you are talking about. Most people would agree Justice Needs to be tempered with mercy. In the federal prison system how best do we do that and who should do it quick. Senator we have no control over who comes into our institutions or when they get out. Within the current one institution responsibility to treat inmates with mercy and compassion. We believe. The madame director our time is limited that im talking in terms of determining when somebody should get out early. We dont have control of that. But who should quick. The individuals that have been elected or appointed to the top ranks of criminal justice have the responsibility. We dont. Congress didnt. We turn that over to you. Then we turn it over to the Justice Department. You give us authorities , you give us abilities. You exercise the judgment. Thats right but it is driven by specific parameters. No. They are very vague. Out enough i have an answer that is acceptable. How can i put this. What the American People think. Jeffrey epstein does not think he hung himself. And i know that you are not in charge of these investigations. E but you talk to the people who are. You need to take a veryry respectable message. Tell the American People what happened. And dont rush it through the investigation but you and i both know they can make this a top priority. I can pass along the message that they work on their ownli time frame. Ive a feeling you know how to be firm. Thank you Ranking Member and director for your leadership at the bureauat of prisons i have five different questions i would like to try and get through. First the bureau of prisons will expand to demonstrate graphically in ways that many of the recently released prisoners do not have access so we have the Wilmington Hope Commission for Reentry Services and the partnership i am hoping that with the other preparation. So can you tell me about what you really need for funding and what kind of partnership with local nonprofits to allow you to deliver those services. Then reduce the operating cost. One of the things thats always been difficult is the Community Programs to welcome the inmates back. Saw that Community Piece there is a threelegged stool and the community has to embrace them. This has to be on the reentry side to get Halfway Houses and then programs to assist those inmates in the. Ommunity yesterday called Second Chance its very close to the nearbys prison and to have just been released in a supervised setting. Initially 75 million was provided by a congress that i thank you testified recently some outside groups are looking like 400 million to say we wind your active feedback to deliver the services. You would think that it will impede our resources. We are hoping for more than 75 million but under the continuing resolution but that 75 million from the last year does not come from congress so if we dont get the resources we need to make this happen but you can make that things happen. And how much more that you need. Moving to solitary confinement it has serious and longlasting harm only used where necessary not as a default with the use in juvenile settings why do we still have 10000 inmates . Is it the last option quick. We are working diligently to get the numbers down with a need to be. Inmates are in there because they are bad actors they have 30 or 60 days in lockup that is only 3000 of the 10000 the others are protective custody they chose that because they are gangs if you let them out they will kill each other fight each other so we are working for other alternatives. And then for our operational and transition units that try to break down the gangs. Will get more input from you on that. To have a solitary confinement reform act we would love to hear more on that. You have significant vacancies and staffing shortages in those prison guard that may have contributed those that are performing these corrections that are very stressful and demanding . A lot of interest has been raised and it in and of itself is a wonderful thing. We train all of our staff first. I was a psychologist and we had different derby groups and officers and teachers and we dont have officers in the kitchens cooking food. We are enough officers Walking Around with our plumbers as they teach inmates. Were all trained to be workers and we all have that responsibility. When we came from the system, we were all not that awarded. And we have that responsibility and numerous times and it is very bad worried so then the staff they know how to do the job because they are trained to do the job but the other job is limited for what they can accomplish go so we have put such huge strain on the bureau of prisons to accomplish its mission per go and staffing shortages its just been incredible to me over the last 16 years i have been gone the very high level in most respects they are functioning on that severe strain. But we dont have to augment as often as we do spec we lose more officers to suicide their line of duty death im concerned about appropriate support and training and staffing and pushing people obama will pass their ability. Thank you for serving in a tpart of government that is not easy and essential and the safety of our country want to talk to you about the implementation of what we could do to make americans save. s are talking about the Jeffrey Epstein case there are a lot of people that express concern that Jeffrey Epstein did not kill himself it was initially reported he died by suicide but according to news reports are private psychologist im sorry pathologist took a look at the case said he experienced a number of injuries as he put it extremely unusual and suicidal hangings and occur more commonly in homicidal strangulation. I have seen that in the medi media. So those cameras that were in the hallway just happened to malfunction the night that his life ended so how frequently do Prison Guards or security cameras malfunction ntlike this and what are the protocols to check and make sure that doesnt happen quack. Senator with money for improvements as i mentioned in my Opening Statements just in the last year we came up with enough money to redo all camera systems and all institutions berkowitz not completed but we did get upgraded from analog to digital and a lot more cameras now than there used to be. We just didnt have adequate cameras. In new york is one of those record as part way through the reinstallation. So by this Time Next Year we should have all institutions completely upgraded in terms of cameras. When they are faulty they do break down some time. So then you cant see so that they malfunction that night how can we be sure he did kill himself quack. Sometimes you can see some. If it is grainy it is usually the problem you can see what is goingbuhe on its just harder to identify precisely what you are seeing. s what was going on in this case quack. I was not allowed to see the cameras i dont know what is going on in this case would make the fbi an Inspector General are investigating and we are not allowed to touch anything once a situation occurs once they come in we are not allowed to have any interaction until its finished. You have any idea how long that will be quack. We keep hearingn soon. I dont know how long soon is. One of the concerns that i have at the time of his death highsecurity housing unit that was supposed to be checked every 30 minutes and from what i am told it appears hours went by apparently three hours of nobody checking on him. If that is true whether that be a lapse of protocol. A lapse of policy, protocol, a lot of negative things if staff is not doing their rounds. Correlation between death and highsecurity units and the failure to make timelyto checks according to bureau of prisonsy protocols. The average death in a jail facility of pretrial olfacilities it is 50 per 1000 we had to in the last year so the vast majority we are doing things correctly now in special Housing Units we have had a couple instances we went back and looked at the cameras it was not always clear the officers had specifically what they were to do by policy that may call me Inspector General to have an investigation done. If it appears to be any criminal act call the us oAttorneys Office and fbi we will prosecute if people are not doing their jobs. My time is expired may ask one quick short question quack. I will take that as a yes. E [laughter] whatever it says the bureau made to make sure inmates are receiving. Incentives with the program they are currently eparticipating quack. They could get earlier release. Thats identified in the first step to act. Violent offenders or sex offenders are not eligible for the first step that we are trying to build the incentives like maybe extra phone time or next her benefit to purchase an item but it is beneficial to us to make for better behavior by the inmates but those that try to work their way out of the prison system. And then it makes the public safer. Absolutely if we could eliminate the numbers dramatically we would be very happy. Thank you for your willingness to implement the First Step Act. Welcome director. We are the two authors of the reentry part of the First Step Act we have an interest in its implementation and success i will relate to you my experience which is that during the battle for that bill your organization was less then a champion for our peace. That we passed the bill with huge bipartisan majorities which is actually easier and stronger and more bipartisan so i think we send a strong bipartisan signal there was a meeting afterwards senator cornyn could not attend but could send us staff person with Mister Kushner and the attorney general and at the bureau of prisons and people at the white house who were involved working on this bill to send a message that we want toto see this implemented. I hope we are in good shape i think yourmp comments show a seriousness but i worry people who were in the bureau that were not champions perhaps still try to interfere with implementation and the most obvious way is to not ask for additional funding and implying that for not going forward. A recent survey done 280,000 of your inmates as part of developing a new Assessment Tool and the report was 49 percent had not completed any programs before released. 82 percent had not participated in technical or vocational courses in 57 percent needed drug treatment have not received it. There is obviously a huge opportunity to improve on those numbers and you have said in your testimony today the First Step Act provides us with the opportunity to enhance and expand existing programs. I am all for that but at a staff level briefing dod told us they have no plans to expand their program offerings. s i dont know where we are but when your testimony says we we want new programs to implement the bill when you see the need in your own survey and then we hear from your staff you have no plans to do any new programs its hard to figure out what is going on. I am completely mystified i dont know staff who doesnt say were not doing programs i would like to have names because that is not at all where we are. I know my staff well enough to say we are not sayingam those we may not be increasing the funding but absolutely we are prepared to increase those numbers mystified me for those that have never been involved in programs we have some involved in a short period of time also whitecollar offenders come in very successful and they dont need the programs and then some simply choose not they dont get involved in Vocational Training but for the vast majority we have lots of programs out there education or Vocational Training therapeutic programs we dont have enough no question about it and the only thing that will impede as is the resources to offer enough programs. We need to make sure the budget you request the lines with those priorities because it doesnt help us when the administration comes in with a budget that does not support Additional Resources that we need. Its a setback we do though i have those that will not Pay Attention to those recommendations on both sides of the aislelek but it is important with the medicated assisted treatment getting that to prisoners before release would dramatically reduce death by overdose within the population but we use the whole array of approved medical interventions we understand one drug to expand the medication assistant one assisted program really additional Million Dollars but no additional staff to expand the availability and the budget so this is the example its frustrating for us to say we want to do this we have seen the cases out there it saves lives and improves recidivism and then when the rubber really hits the road you undercut yourself and does not accomplish the goals you state you want to achieve. The limitation with the inmates coming into the institution we dont have the authorities for those hhs and dea have strict restrictions we are working diligently with both because it is moving them across state lines and they come from everywhere and released everywhere we are working diligently to get the proper licensure right now we ensure they get the medicine but we review their case with the doctors and we take the downtown to a prescriber to take them to be prescribed. So we just need the licensure for our own staff. Inmates still get the drug that is have to go out of town. St to Congress Help you quack. We thought we would have to do a modification but i think the final approval from hhs and dea. If that doesnt work i will come talk with you. Make sure there is no counterinsurgency going on. There is not if there is and i find it they will be working somewhere else. R roommates so i want to pick it to the staff and the senator started on the policies and procedures for staff handling the highprofile do you have written protocols to be followed Standard Operating Procedure octhat Everybody Knows is that n existence . All of the units are right at the front entry and every staff member is expected to read that. Towe also do regular training wh the staff that are in there and they should remind them of what the requirements are. Staff would have a full awareness of what the expectation is. Yes. Thank you. So then staffing shortages. How is that affecting your ability and then the staffing shortages that you have are you doing to alleviate that and have you changed the recruiting llocess . Thats been my highest priority is getting that position filled. We had people doing good things but hers have the authority to bke things happen. Ive managed to get extra authority from the department of justice to get direct hiring authority so we can hire people. We do not have that authority right now. Weve also added 20 new staff to the Processing Center in texas. A lot of them wealthy retirees because we can bring them back from retirement for the year or two that we need them and then let them go back to retirement. Ive been experienced in that and that would work well for us and we know we will have retirements coming in the next year. We are advancing the Recruitment Strategies today nationwide online recruiting program thats where the young people go looking for jobs. Its not as splashy as it needs to tog attract folks. We are doing everything we can possibly think of to try to speed up the recruitment and hiring process. One of the things that is hurting us that i mentioned we have 15,000 employees and they are now eligible to retire in so many ofar them are retiring at e same time we are trying to hire new staff so we hired a new iraff and then three retire so its hard for us to catch up. Wevef. Hired a 2500 employees, 2500 which should be a lot but when you have ave fair number of them through the retirements or whatever the reason, its been very difficult for us to catch up. As you were hiring the staff, but is the training given before they are put on the job . They have two weeks of training and some have increased up to three weeks. Three weeks of training federal Law Enforcement Training Center in georgia. What the ideal and was pleased to be able to do is link to a probationary employee to a seasonal employees that they caa follow and shadow them for a while to learn the job early. Unfortunately with our staffing shortages we are not able to do that at all of the instances but as we staff up we will be able ro return to that and then we also have annual training every year but every staff member has to go through for the basic of corrections in things they need to know and then we have incidental training throughout the year or implementable throughout the year. Staffing is one of the key issues. A with the budget is cut dramatically one of the things to do with the training budget. If you have trouble filling positions in a lot of new employees but if we cannot train them adequately what you are suggesting earlier, they are on the job and may not know everything that they need to do the job effectively and those are the two areas that im really stressing dramatically to get caught up. I have a question on contraband and i will submit that to youar for writing, but i a ink the fact that you have people like martin was still running his business out of prison or a drawn dropping, this is something that we need to help with and i will submit that for a written response. Let me join my colleagues in thanking you for returning to public service. You talk about the importance of the faithbased programming in the prisons but it seems to me that you are engaged in a faithbased exercise here. Let me remind you like john mccain used to remind here, though more than maybe ten years ago now i remember meeting with a number of pastors in the dallas area, africanamerican pastors and i asked what is the single biggest problem you have in your congregation and they said young man who was convicted felons who after they leave prison cant get a job and cant find a placeti to live. And it occurred to be if you cant get a job or find a place to live, your choices are extraordinarily limited and so, looking at some of the work thats been done at the state level, senator whitehouse and i and other colleagues here it was almost unanimous joined together and passed the first step back and this is an aspirational goal of making sure that people once they leave, once the data which everybody will come of it is another fact that many people haoverlook, people will leave prison to the question is are they better prepared than when they went in and we cannot save everybody. Ist we can save some and the numbers look pretty encouraging from a state experience. But one of the things i want to ask you about is in my state and texas for example we not only looked at what happens in prison, but we look at what happened after people got out of prison and this is the part i want to make sure we dont drop the ball on in congress. Your responsibility is perhaps once they leave the premise, but we need to make sure that they nde followon Services Monitoring and assistance to people who continue to need reinforcement and help because if they go back in the same neighborhood where they are subject to the same old temptations and influences, they are going to end up back in your custody. Do you agree ith with me that is important for congress not to trust pat ourselves on the back and say we passed the first step back but rather we need to also follow through by providing followon services for this population . I mentioned to the senator earlier we can look at the threelegged stool and provide programs for inmates to teach them better themselves. They have to choose to do that but then the third is the communities they are going back into. Theres not a lot that deals with housing and job issues and all those kind of things, then its all going to fall over because the inmates cannot see if they are going back into the same drug ridden or whatever it might be a. They dontol have a place to li, they are not allowed to live in public housing, they cant do this or that. Its very difficult for themm just to succeed. When they look back with education in hand and then they come back because what they found outside is not what they were hoping for. In the runup to the passage of the first step back, we heard from the former attorney general Michael Daisy who i think maybe reallmade areally important poi. He said its easy to get confused by what the ultimate goal is and he encouraged us to keep our eye on the crime rate which was coming down. We were obviously making some progress and if was going on, something obviously was going on. Do you agree with that focus . That is one of the things to look at very closely, yes. And finally, senator whitehouse, as you heard, he and ok on sort of the odd couple prison reform, like senator leahy and i are on the freedom of information issues. I will leave that to others to judge. But we are introducing some additional legislation to promote the reintegration by introducing something that we call the bee and her act. What we are trying to do is provide the federal judges the authority to the discussion really, not requiring and providing them discretion to issue their own certificates of rehabilitation and acknowledge that eligible offenders have finished their sentences and demonstrated their commitment to a lawabiding future. We are looking at the state experience about a third of the states have ali similar program, and im glad just like the First Step Act that seems to enjoy broad bipartisan support, senators leahy, durbin, coons, portman, blumenthal and so far have joined us in the introduction of this bill. Do you see the usefulness of getting federal judges this discretion may be as an additional indicator to the public that thishe individual hs tried to turn their lives around and has taken advantage of the program and is needs to be welcomed back to the community as you point out . Im not familiar with your bill. I look forward to look at it. Still catching up. A lot has happened the last 15 years. Anything that improves the hiocess and makes us all Work Together on doing the right thing, coming back to the community, i want all of your efforts, all of our efforts to make this successful. Thank you again. Thank you mr. Chairman and doctor sawyer for being here and your service. Ahow would you describe the yerale of the folks right now . Its kind of mixed. Ive been trying to get around to talk to the staff and management staff around your house while and its mixed. We have a mixture of staff whoal are tired because we are having to work extra hours at work so hard tha at the staff that ive interacted with, they are still the driven goodquality people who wanted a good job. They know that we are in a profession where they dont get any glory. Thison people only get noticed when something bad goes on. You never read an article very rarely in local papers. Im sorry, would you rate the vast majority of them are they good hardworking people . We want to screen out the knuckleheads that thehe vast majority they are tired and stretched for many years. I want to make sure that is heard by them im sure someone watching the testimony. I was like maybe as a followup to charge that senator durbin put forward i think that it would be very helpful maybe as a response for the record to take a look at that data and decompose it into one of the root causes behind it but its as stark and as bad as it appears to be, are there other mitigating factors because if there are, then that is something that we need to get if theres other mitigating factors that could be helpful for the committee. [inaudible] was kind of attrition are you dealing with . I dont have the numbers with me but most of the staff stick around until 54. They dont run out the door right away. We have added new incentives to try to, Pay Incentives for those who will stick around once theyve reached retirement eligibility and if you stick around another year longer, i did a video of this country simply and one was to try to pay the retirees to give one or two or three more years to stick around a little longer because we need their experience and until we get the positions filled. Im probably going to submit some specific questions for the record around the Reentry Centers. We had a center in Charlotte North Carolina that had a record that recently closed the ticket was probably a combination of funding as well as a drop in the prison reductions, so in some respects it almost sounded like some of the mechanics that you are working through on the questions. Im prepared to answer that for you if you want. Go ahead. We didnt know that they were going to close. They defaulted on their contract. We had a cap of a maximum and the only guaranteed a lower number and after the 75 but we cant control where theyre going to come, or with communities they were going to. We didnt have the numbers to give them so they defaulted on the contract and left us and now we are in the process of trying to do statewide contracts so that we have the same deliverer and multiple types around this date so that if one is embodied the content of shift around and the act is already a more diverse portfolio. That should be coming out very soon. Its coming out very soon and we believe that we have given her his ever going to step up and bid on that and right now in charlotte we have a Halfway House a little further out for the inmates that are from the charlotte area they are going to go to some of the facilities. Something else we will follow up with has to do with communication and probation officers sometimes they feel like they are getting a transfer without adequate notice or communication. We will just follow up and some specifics that have been reported by. I know that you are new to the job and this is something i would just ask you all to look at. I think the First Step Act supported additional efforts of the senator and others i think it would be very helpful you mentioned coming in to work on the hiring practices. It would be very helpful to look at what the expectations are and what the current funding streams are and where the objectives of the first act could be challenged unless you get Additional Authority and resources. Its one thing to have a good policy trajectory and another for the policy. So the operational assessment on the likelihood of you coming before the committee and us being very happy with the implementation. To what extent does the Congress Need to further acts to make to facilitate the implementation come and we will look for that and 80 put together a letter. But basically just your execution strategy. Thank you for being here and your years of service. Thank you mr. Chairman and doctor sawyer for being here. But we continue to ask the staffing issues. I know youve experienced staffing shortages in recent years including at the federal prison facilities in Springfield Missouri in my home state. What measures have been implemented to avoid the staffing shortages, can you give us an update to their . If you want to know where the staffing shortages came from coming as i mentione, asi mentid growth and expansion of institutions, we have had a position cuts dramatically over the years. One year in particular we have institutions more than a year before in a couple of years ago we advised them to be removed from the numbers and then whats happened the last few years is the 3,000 vacancies we would have right now we have certain budgets where we are projected that we were going to get significant cuts again in the budgeting and staffing and so the leaders at the time of this organization were weary because we didnt want to have to risk a whole lott of people is when the budget year cannot the budgets have been cut dramatically. Anadd to that the nutrition that we were having. We had 15,000 in aids, employees to 2,003 and they are now eligible for a retrial. Thats how we ended up where we are today. So prior to my arrival we have to offer incentives. Ive increased the staffing numbers at the office that does most of the screening for the new hires and increased that by 20 former retirees that come in for a short period of time a year or two or three to get us caught up and ready to go and they can start. Weve got new recruitment activities going on is the senator mentioned to develop a very splashy online recruitment package. We are approaching and hiring contractors at the Staffing Levels and we are doing everything that we can possibly think of from the department of justice and one thing about bringing me in as director, attorney general shortly but i did have the full support of the department of justice to get off the ground and theyve delivered on a. Of the new authorities are hiring and we are doing everything we possibly can. Wee 2500 the same time weve afimmed off some other staff. As we are hiring new ones, we are losing others and its hard for us to catch up. We will get there it i. Its just taking a while. Theng federal hiring process is extremely long and onerous and it can take six months to a year from the time yous. Recruit someone or identify someone to get them onboard into the operation. Itst even longer out there. Let me ask about the specifics about the facility because im worried about the center for federal prisoners. Can you speak about the processi that the staffing for the doctors, nurses, psychologists . I dont have the specific numbers on spring heeled to be 56 springfield with me today. Most are th Ardent Health serv. Doctors, nurses, medical profession is stretched pretty thin across the whole country. No one is able to find as many as the need. We are losing their medical providers and so we are competing and we dont pay as much as in a lot of other places. But i can giv can get to the spc numbers. Thank you. Let me go back to the numbers you mentioned a moment ago. The hiring fees caused people to lose 5,000 jobs. In your house testimony you stated they are actively seeking to hire employees for 3,000 vacancies at the staffing level. So in the sens that sense of hol adequately staffed programs at the facilities in the meantime without resorting the positions we lostff were separate from the 3,000 vacancies we have right now. They took the positions and everything away from us. The 3,000 positions that we have her at the end of the phrase affected and the Government Shutdown affects thought. The budget years affected that because we were afraid to staff up for the next year. So that was the 3,000 positions. We actually have to get those positions filled to meet all of the requirements for the new positions we are hoping for to meet the requirements. As i said we are giving as many things as we can think of and come up with to try to get the position filled but its going to be a reach to get all the positions staffed quickly enough and one of the other things we are looking at a summit of the online kind of programs, Educational Programs for inmates can be involved in that are not as staff intensive that we can use other sources to provide the training and education for so they are not relying solely on the Staff Members being present to do that so we are looking at everything we can possibly to get positions filled, get the programs to the inmates, and as i said earlier the only thing that is going to end because his resources. If we can get the adequate resources, we will be fine. Thank you mr. Chairman. You started in your possession nine days after the death of Jeffrey Epstein. What happened with Jeffrey Epstein was an enormous black out to the department of justice. It was disgraceful. Jeffrey epstein was a pedophile, he was a sexual predator who targeted in the prey on young girls come and get he died in federal custody. He died in federal custody before he had a chance to testify about his crimes in his wrongdoings and about the other powerful men who were complicit in that abuse. That was the moment of shocked this country. They were powerful men who want him silenced. As i see there are two i it thed only two possibilities for what happened. Number one, there was gross negligence and a total failure to do their job with a prisoner on suicide watch that led to epstein committing suicide. Or number two, something far worse happened. But it wasnt suicide, but rather a homicide. Outer by a person or persons who wanted him silenced. Either one of those is completely unacceptable. Both of those are profound indictments of the federal incarcerationd system. I understand as an Inspector General investigation into the department of justice is looking at this. You came into being agencies right after this happened, and as far as i am concerned when you came in, that was an agency in crisis. Lets take the more damaging of the scenarios. Based on the evidence of which you are aware, is there any indication that Jeffrey Epsteins case was a homicide . Based upon the evidence i am aware, no. But as ive already told the committee, it is still being investigated by the fbi and the Inspector Generals Office. We are required to move ourselves completely and we are not allowed to talk to anyone involved, look at any of the evidence involved. So i am not aware of very much regarding the investigation until it is completed. There is no indication from anything that i know that it was anything other than a suicide. N as i understand it, two Prison Guards were recently indicted foran falling asleep wn they were supposed to be on watch for failing to engage in the periodic every 30 minutes check on suicide watch on Jeffrey Epstein, and then falsifying their records to claim that they had in fact done their job when the allegation as they are now asleep. Is that right . Thats what i heard on the media today. On ive got no official reporting of that at all. Other than those two individuals, has anybody yet been disciplined or terminated for their conduct that led to the staff . We are still waiting for the conclusion of the investigation. We cant act until we have the evidence andwa information provider sure you if theres any misconduct or if these individuals wereon indicted, we dont want people like that working at the present. They dprison. They do not represent the vast majority of the 335 across the bureau of prisons. Most of our staff are very high quality good people doing the right thing and you are right this incident is a black eye on the entire person and every one takes a single incident and puts it across the entire organization that its in dysfunctional and incompetent and that isnt the case. We want to get rid of the bad staff that dont do their job. We want them gone one way or another either by prosecution or termination. But the good staff are doing extraordinary work everyday imaging 177,000 inmates. You never hear anything about those people because they are doing their jobs and things are running well. The only time we ever did notice is when something bad happens. What we say given what occurred here, there is reason for a great deal of concern, and i understand the sentiment that you want to have to back of your team and the sentiment entirely, but we have two Prison Guards that have just been indicted for literally falling asleep on the job and then lying about it. And my question to you is what have you done leading this organization to determine how many other Prison Guards have fallen asleep on the job, have lied about it, howow many other videoua cameras installed to ensure safety and security are inoperative as i understand the video cameras were inoperative. What are you doing proactively . We have to make sure that this doesnt happen again. Within a couple of weeks of my arriving on the job, i did a video for them not to overwork of you employees making it very clear we dont know for sure what happened in this case because i do not have the information, but if any Staff Members ou offer are not doing their routesah effectively, if the countot doing effectively and if they are signing documents that says they are doing things that they are not going that is not only a dereliction of duty but a violation of the law and we will disciplined them and prosecute them if necessary. I mad made that position very clearly to all of our employees out there. In terms of the camera issue i mentioned earlier we are right in the midst of this past year and next year to replace all of the cameras and institutions going from analog to digital and increasing the number of cameras all of the institutions. In the meantime he knew that they were faulty in some locations. They are picking up whats happening, but its not very clear. Its kind of a grainy analog view which is Never Acceptable in investigation so we are completely replacing all of the cameras and all of the institutions and that should be completed sometime at the end of this next coming year and we are making it very clear our management staff and recordsb have been great clear we sent a letter to the warden in response to their staff they need to repeatedly be telling their staff and reminding them and making sure that its very clear and evident with the responsibilities are and if we have a training issue that the staff doesnt know how to do something, we have to train those people. In instances where people know and they simply choose not to do their job, then i want them gone. I want every one of them out of the institutions because they not i make the inmates on this but they make the employee is unsafe come too and that is completely unacceptable in this situation. Thank you. Thank you very much. We will conclude. Thank you for serving the country yetha again and i think youre the right person at the right time. Thank you, senator. [inaudible [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations]