Get informed straight from the source on cspan. Unfiltered, unbiased, word for word. From the Nations Capital to wherever you are. To get the opinion that matters most. This is what democracy looks like. Cspan, powered by cable. House and Senate Lawmakers testify on the potential for a Bipartisan Fiscal Commission to address the National Debt and Government Spending. They also talk about the need to protect Social Security and medicare from becoming insolvent and why its important for congress to Work Together to fix the countrys debt problem. This House Budget Committee hearing is about two hours 15 minutes. [background noises] the hearing will come to order break todays hearing will examine the need for a fiscal or Debt Commission. Well hear from a panel of experts including current and former colleagues that have been through these battles and have lived to talk about them. In fact extra special to have my mentor and friend steve who i am now literally serving as chairman and the shadow of his beautiful portrait behind us. And so it is an honor to have you back here in your chamber. Sender rob portman, ambassador portman is from ohio. We are delighted that you are here. He was a member of the bipartisan bicameral Super Committee established by the budget control act of 2011. He also served as director of omb during the Bush Administration which is where i got to know him. He has given a lot of thought to these issues over the years. Ambassador, thank you for your time we welcome you here. What is he . An alumni of the peoples house. That is why we have you here because you are one senator we can trust great but we have to actually. [laughter] chairman conrad, welcome our friend from north dakota has also worked on budget issues for a long time. I was the former chairman of the senate Budget Committee from 2001 until 2003, 2007 2013 with the principal authors legislation served as a template for the creation of the Simpson Bowles commission he served on the Simpson Commission and worked to advance their recommendations in the senate. Chairman, we are delighted youre here with us today. Again, chairman womack my dear friend from arkansas it was because of him i served as a joint select committee on budget and appropriation process reform. He shared that he is a cardinal on the appropriation committee. And has served again as Ranking Member and chairman of the Budget Committee from 1821. Last but not least our friend and fearless leader once upon a time here on the Budget Committee chairman from the commonwealth of kentucky spent most of his time in Congress Working on these very issues that we will be discussing today. He served as Ranking Member and chairman on this committee from 17 23. Its also the joint select committee and thank you for your service. Im now going to yield myself such time as i may consume and im going to try to consume just a brief period of time because we are going to be oppressed i think to leave here by noon for a vote on the floor. Im going to speak just offthecuff here. We have had a lot of conversations on our side, jimmy, over the last few weeks as it relates to the leadership of our conference. And i am proud to say that we are wrestling with things of the greatest imports. Which have to do with our Fiscal Health and the deterioration thereof in this country. The important and difficult things we have to do to address it so we can right the ship. So that we can ensure that our children are in good financial stead they will not have to dig out of a hole trillions upon trillions of debt. It is not rights, it is a moral and ill think anybody on this Committee Democrat or republican thanks its acceptable. We laid out the reverse the curse budget resolution. It is our job. I think one of the problems with this place is we dont do our job who do not do it very well but we dont do it on time for we dont take it seriously. We do not the process that encourages or forces us to do this job and so we just dont. We avoid this difficult conversation just getting more difficult was easier to avoid them. And by the way both sides do it. We dont pay for things. We do not authorize before refund things. It is just a big ball of dysfunction and it is no wonder we are at a place where we are at a 2 trilliondollar annual deficit cliff that will double in 10 years. Were at an almost trillion dollar Interest Payment that will triple in 10 years. It is no wonder what the dysfunction in the mess of this process. Here is one thing i believe. We have to address a mandatory spending. While we are obsessing over one half of one third of one years discretionary budget i do not want to dismiss we have to get our fiscal house in order there is waste and unnecessary spending on the discretionary side and we have to get after it and be stewards of the taxpayers here. It is not to diminish but the mandatory spending and entitlement programs that are really driving the debt. If we do not address the middlel truly bankrupt this country. Here is the deal paid the unfunded liability over the next liability over the 30 years at 100 trillion, 99 of the cost the unfunded liability are two programs. Social security and medicare. Social Security Medicare are critically important to our seniors. In this budget window we have to address the solvency we have to address for not only Seniors Today but for the future. It is my strong belief the Republican Party unilaterally will not be able to solve those issues. Nor will the Democrat Party in this chamber are either chamber solve the issues of Social Security and medicare. They went to politicizing weaponize over the years. I think we need a Debt Commission of some sort. We have to have a commission, a framework, a model that works. The reason we have you here is to share with us your experience and your wisdom so that we can apply the necessary contours to whatever Debt Commission we can pass so that in the ultimate analysis and outcome we have a solution that we can hold hands together in a bipartisan way and not only move that issue but move the country forward with some peace of mind and confidence that our country is on a better path. So that is the fundamental question as i see it. Good gentlemen, how do we do this learning from all the different commissions the one we served on, steve 2011 Super CommitteeSimpson Bowles the greenspan, how do we do this . So that it works. Not just for this institution but most important for the American People and with that i yield to make Ranking Member for as much time as he may need to be a quick thank you, mr. Chairman. I am on a personal level very excited to welcome you back. Served as chairman of this committee in congress with great distinction. And also was a wonderful friend. Someone who was really a role model for me. Thank you my friend i would not be here without you. Its great to have you back. Undo steve that when my really good friends on the other side of the aisle its also great to have you in this position as well. We were approached unjustly say this. The way you approach maker where the most well respected members in the house. That is on both sides. Of time like this we need that more than ever so thank you for being who you are and doing what you do into the two former senators while i have not had the opportunity to work with you before you both enjoyed great reputations attention is your from all four of you today. What you thought worked well on the respective commissions in which you served and ultimately what didnt work about them. I appreciate and i know my chairman is sincere in his belief is an answer thus not my position im keeping an open mind about it im more than a little bit skeptical that a commission would work frankly given the history of the last dozen years. Or that the commissioner straight up vote that is the ballgame. Announce the process by which we get to resolve the ultimate question appeared where you take the date the cbo uses her Social Security trustees use either 2033 or 2034 we crossed the rubicon when it comes to Social Security and go over in terms of insolvency. Pablo being able to pay 75 of the benefits. Before that date but one of the Medicare Trust funds as well. So, we have some time but not a lot of time. Ultimately that that big question is going to be do we raise revenues of Social Security and medicare . Or do we cut benefits . I come down very clearly i do not make a secret about that. I practice what i preach. And the author on the house side with sheldon on the senate side of a bill that would raise enough revenue for Social Security and verified this. From the year 2100. I want to share it just some data to remarkable pull data june 2023 thus asked the American People which approach do you prefer . Raising taxes on rich and large corporations including closing tax loopholes, using that extra money to pay our bills. Our current project Social Security and medicare and using that money to pay our bills . Results were 82 seven. I have never seen polling results like that. 82 opting for raising taxes on rich and large corporations. 7 cutting programs like Social Security and medicare. So whether you talk about a commission or not a commission, ultimately we know there is a choice its going to have to be made per bet the end of the day is going to members of congress, elected officials who will be voting what it looks like. On the positive about a commission the 2018 commission on which you serve mr. Chair and on which you serve german yarmouth there was specific bipartisan look at budget reforms that could happen that would improve the process. Some pass of the Senate Committee did not ultimately become law. Im really interested in following up on the work you guys did. There are some things they are that we could turn into law and make personally part of the process prep especially interested in crying about 2018 2018not cemented debt commissior se it was more about budget process. I think we have a real opportunity in this congress. We have talked about this before to make that law and get support from at least three quarters of the respective chairs and Ranking Members. Without welcome and welcome back and i yield to the chair for a quick thank you Ranking Member i agree also we have to have the political courage to ask that decision i would hope it commission would foster some serious conversation try to depoliticize that conversation we have to have it. Once again in the interest of time if any other member organizations written statement for the record i will hold the record open till the end of the day to accommodate those have not been able to prepare their statements. Id also like to welcome our distinguished panel. And at this time i would like to yield five minutes to send portman. Quick thank you chair and Ranking Member thank you for your comments chairman, he laid out the challenge very well offthecuff i appreciate your knowledge when it comes to this also appreciate you inviting lesson is in a hearing room he was chairing it on a Budget Committee i was from this side of the table he was tough im glad to have them on this side of the table today. As you know i spent a lot of my career work on the budget issues. And also a member of this Committee Finance Committee and yes member the socalled Super Committee in these roles ive havehad an opportunity to see something thats a current budget process. Which we talked about. And the inability for congress to address the impending fiscal crisis. Between my source of house and house andsenate i did serve as t and budget i got to the same thing on did menstruation side. The inability to address the fiscal crisis from the executive branch perspective. Why these are tough issues a lot of political landmines. My experience ive made the conclusions time to try Something Different try something it gives congress the American People to understand its going on and have trust in that but also provide balance bipartisan way forward. Thats why believe a commission with memberships from congress and experts is necessary and timely right now. I want to commend the members of this committee piloted all of your backgrounds everyone it seems has offered legislation we crated solutions to the crisis Ranking Member talked about some. A number of bipartisan and this legislation. Include the Fiscal Commission on the budget resolution which expert position cochair of the bipartisan format. The Fiscal Commission act and te most recent continued resolution did not pass but got a vote. The fcas cosponsored by representatives and i apologize if ive missed others on the committee who been similarly engaged. This morning will hear from your former chair will have his own Commission Proposal. Want to thank members of this committee for taking the lead on that. You are well aware of the economic challenges a fiscal thl challenges that we face will not going to detail 33 truly begins to add up to a huge issue. In a tremendous at borden on the future generations it diminishes our standing in the world. Ive traveled and talk to people negatively impacts our economy. No coincidence we have had this debt and deficit grow and grow be followed by high inflation. There is no question that affects longterm rates and our constituents are suffering for that right now. And provide political coverage. What is our goal . Making tough choices including conducting top to bottom of the federal Government Spending asking hard questions about the federal role rooting out parochial spending that is not help the national interest. Fighting revenue in a way that minimizes Economic Growth and opportunity impacts. Reform of the critically important but currently unsustainable entitlement programs which was talked about in a charm and you had it just right. We have got to save these programs if we dont as the rank member said Social Security benefits will be cut substantially in 2023 or 2024 24 general fill benefits bankrupt the country we know that in terms of budget reform it would be great if the commission took a crack at that. And if you would agree thats needed. The first step of any commission is a tell the American People the truth about what is going on. They know that something is not right for they know the current trajectory is unsustainable. Theyre looking for an honest assessment and it kind of honest dialogue about the way forward. One that is right down the middle. That is maybe the most important part of the commission. Theres a lot of valid structures for a commission. Some of you again have your own proposals not saying one is better than the other. Having members of congress and some external folks involved who are real experts is important. I think to brute the commission would report the lame duck session of congress after the 2024 elections that is assuming it keeps going soon. The question was, what has worked and what hasnt worked . I think the law establishing the commission will fasttrack consideration culminated with a vote without amendment for a solution by qualified majority. That is the important thing of doing a Statutory Commission as opposed to others that have been tried. This base realignment and closure process for them in five backgrounds you know each round created an average of 12 billion in savings. That was tough going. But it did work in that sense but another model would be 81 Greenspan Commission was a Bipartisan Group of experts and members of congress. They say the government one is 65 billion extended to life in Social Security by 30 years. That is not bad. This had been extended for longer than that 30 years is not bad. We mention their competence of package reforms as you know is not pass in the congress. Its estimated by 2015 congress had enacted around 60 of reductions in spending those reforms that were proposed it did make a difference. We can talk more about that. We look from the failures to what did it worked it was established by executive order without congressional approval there was no enforcement mechanism to ensure a vote would occur but also the Commission Said he had to get 15 18 members to agree pra