text messages, and tweets. next, a hearing on covid-19's impact on the live event entertainment industry. a senate commerce subcommittee heard from witnesses about their business struggles during the pandemic and issues with the payment protection program. this runs two hours. [indiscernible] >> as the chairman of the subcommittee on consumer protection, i welcomed the participants in this hearing today. examining the impact of covid-19 on the live entertainment industry. the subcommittee will come to order. ill come to order. as covered on the manufacturing community response in the pandemic, covid-19 continues to negatively impact many industries and businesses throughout the american economy and another industry, among the hardest hit, is live entertainment sector. due to airborne transmissions of covid-19, many states have implemented bans on large gatherings of people. this has placed a tremendous strain on the entertainment sector, who requires large gatherings for plays, movies, events, and many other forms of entertainment. companies in this sector have been forced to largely cease operations during the pandemic, leaving these businesses without revenue or alternative means to replace it. without crowds to perform for , entertainers, vendors have been forced to furlough staff they typically employed during a concert season. without stages to light and set up, lighting companies and stagehands have been out of work since march. without entertainers and eventgoers to transport, transportation companies have been off the road for months. without concerts and other operators, owners have been without revenue much of the past year. these are a few examples the way the live entertainment industry sector has been affected. which we will hear more about from our witnesses. in march, congress passed the cares act to help employers of all types, including live, entertainment businesses, weather the pandemic. the small business administration's paycheck protection program provided employers protection program program provided funds to pay employees and cover some business expenses. other programs meant to help employers and employees are the main street lending program and economic administration's grants. for many businesses, these programs were ineffective tools. but these programs in the cares act did not adequately benefit the live event entertainment sector. that is why i and many colleagues introduced and sponsored this act that would authorize the small business administration to make grants to eligible live operators, producers, promoters, and talent representatives. this would offer the struggling businesses a lifeline to continue operations until they can return to doing what they love, entertaining americans. there are a number of other legislative proposals, including the restart act which worked to address the needs of the live event sector. i encourage my colleagues to ensure this industry is supported in the ongoing negotiations around a phase 4 covid relief package. there is a ripple effect on the economy when live entertainment industry is out of work. restaurants, bars, and transportation businesses that thrive bringing people to a community from the surrounding areas are hurting. when lights are dark in the local live event venue, the economy in that community is also dark. i look forward to hearing from our witness panel today who will provide a variety of different perspectives to this important issue. joining us is david fay, from the bushnell performing arts center in hartford, connecticut. mr. adam hartke from wichita, kansas. mr. ron lafitte, president of patriot management in los angeles. officer chief executive of the american bus association and michael strickland of knoxville, tennessee. representatives from the business industry provided written testimony for the record with recommendations for how congress should act to address these issues. i would ask for unanimous consent these letters be submitted into the record. without objection, so ordered. i will turn to the ranking member -- who will join us in about five minutes. i understand the chairman of the full committee, senator wicker, would like to have opening remarks as well. senator wicker. sen. wicker: thank you very much. i appreciate your leadership on this important issue. the senate commerce committee has taken many opportunities to examine the impact of the covid-19 pandemic on american's lives in our economy. in our various subcommittees we have heard about the unique hardships faced by thousands of middle-class, hard-working americans in the manufacturing industry, the transportation sector, and consumers who most -- who are most vulnerable to scams. today we will hear from representatives of the live entertainment industry. a sector that has been hit particularly hard. because the coronavirus spread so easily among large crowds and confined spaces, americans had to essentially give up attending live performances such as concerts and theater productions. this shutdown of live events has been devastating for performing artists and the venues that host their shows. but a lot of the industry also supports an entire ecosystem of businesses including lighting technicians, food vendors, transportation providers, and many more average american workers. live events are part of the fabric of american life. the ability of people to travel across the country and join together to experience the great performance that has been a joy for many americans. the live entertainment industry is of great importance to me. the state of mississippi is known around the world as the birthplace of america's music. before the pandemic began, i was fortunate to see garth brooks perform when he was honored with the library of congress's gershwin prize. no doubt garth brooks and other stars have been financially successful enough to weather the economic shutdown caused by the pandemic. that is not the point of this hearing today. our concern today is about the average men and women behind the lights, food trucks, tour buses, who support their families by bringing the arts and cultural experiences to so many. it is my sincere hope that when i see a performance like the one i saw with garth brooks again, companies large and small and the thousands and thousands of hard-working americans that make up the live entertainment industry will have received the support they need to stay in business. thank you very much, chairman moran. this is an import hearing and i look forward to hearing from the witnesses. chairman moran: thank you for joining us. it is through your encouragement we are able to hear this issue. thank you for highlighting this issue. let me begin with our testimony. we will start with mr. fay, then mr. hartke, followed by mr. lafitte, mr. pentuso, followed by mr. strickland. i recognize mr. david fay. david: chairman moran, thank you. chairman wicker. senator, blumenthal, i'm sure will be there momentarily. chairman moran: i have heard we should wait until senator blumenthal arrives and go to the next witness if you'd like him to be here when you testify? david: that is up to you. he and i have talked about this many times. chairman moran: go ahead. david: thank you. i am david fay, president of the bushnell center for performing arts in hartford, connecticut. i feel like i am in a pandemic induced time warp. our downtown, like so many, has suddenly become a ghost town, all too similar to those of the 1960's and 1970's. the hard work to read vitalized -- to revitalize abandoned city centers like hartford have been driven by the substantial public and private investment in building performance are venues that have been a magnet in attracting people to the downtown. this development of restaurants, bars, clubs, and others have led to residential and commercial development, all of which has brought new economic strength and restored civic pride. it has also led to the creation of an unprecedented touring circuit, supporting tens of thousands of performing artists, entertainers, and shows. an industry that once was centered in a few major cities is part of the uniquely american artistic mosaic that stretches literally from sea to sea. this vibrant industry has provided an essential economic and cultural anchor for communities all across our country. that is until march, when the music stopped. today we face an existential threat. a threat not only to our industry, but to the businesses and city centers large and small that come to depend on us. the cares act was a step, but scaled to cover a shorter time of closure than our industry continues to face. we simply cannot reopen our venues and restart our industry until the virus is subdued. unfortunately, that does not appear likely until next fall at the earliest. our industry is built on venues. new the smallest club where talent is nurtured to the playhouses in regional theaters were local directors, actors, designers, stagehands, musicians, and more learn and develop their craft. to broadway theaters and producers who look to those venues for new talent and half of all the new shows they open each year. it is also built on performing arts centers like the bushnell. we are part of the delicately balanced live entertainment ecosystem. we depend on it to develop extraordinarily talented shows the grace our stages, inspiring audiences, and uplifting the spirit of our communities. without your help, this ecosystem is in grave danger of collapsing and taking with it the pulse of our city centers. this is also about the heart and soul of our country. even after the virus is gone we face a long road of healing and recovery. the irish playwright sean o'casey once said, "all the world is a stage and most of us are desperately unrehearsed." we live in a time when emotional intelligence is being outstripped by artificial intelligence. we look to alexa for information and social media for personal validation rather than pausing to look at ourselves and reflect on what it means to walk in someone else's shoes. music and theater are the lens through which we see ourselves, our society, and our world. it is an avenue to explore the miracle that is the declaration of independence, reveal the repercussions of slavery, and try to make sense out of the often confusing evolution of our great american society. it has been said that everyone dies twice -- once when we stop breathing, and then again when our name is spoken for the last time. we need your help to ensure that our venues and industry will survive this pandemic so that the voices of our great american creative community will have a platform from which to sing to us, to challenge and inspire us to be our best selves. so that when our names are spoken for the last time, it will be to honor the contribution we made to our neighbor, our country, and our world. thank you. chairman moran: mr. fay, thank you. very well spoken. in my isolation in my basement on the weekends, the smithsonian channel has been doing aerial america, and recently focused on hartford, connecticut. assuming i can get your senator to invite me to hartford, i would be glad to come see one of your performances as soon as that is possible. david: you are invited, mr. chairman. [laughter] chairman moran: senator blumenthal, mr. fay was our first witness. would you like to follow him? sen. blumenthal: i would be delighted. first, thank you to david fay, a hero of many of us who revere connecticut's stages and venues. and thank you to you, mr. chairman, for convening this hearing. senator klobuchar has been the leading co-sponsor of the "save act, which she has been on so many efforts to aid small businesses. i want to thank all of the participants who are here today on this critically important legislation. our cultural institutions are the lifeblood of our democracy. they distinguish us as a democracy, as a country, they are examples of agricultural -- of our cultural heritage and treasure. we ignore their needs in our grave peril. i am glad to have heard mr. fay's very eloquent and powerful remarks and i am going to take the transcript with me all around connecticut and to my colleagues. over the past month, i have heard from theaters and stages across connecticut, as well as the country, who are facing life-and-death decisions and struggling to keep the lights on. in september, i visited the palace theater. a 1600 performing arts institution that has been a cultural center of stanford, my hometown, for over a century. in normal times the palace would be hosting "the nutcracker." now, like much of our lives, the ballet is broadcast online. in fairfield, the fairfield theater company turned initially to livestream shows. they recently reopened for the first time since march, but with barriers between the stage and the audience. literally, physical barriers that severely reduce capacity to accommodate distancing. this kind of limited performance is not sustainable. i have been to the bushnell institution, the warner, the schubert, as well as long wharf in new haven, and i have seen for myself the limits that have been applied. i think we need, for the sake of the employees of these great institutions, for the sake of the economic institutions that depend on them, whether they are small businesses like retailers or restaurants that depend on people coming downtown, they are great sources of economic driving impetus as well as cultural heritage. i am proud to be a cosponsor of the "save our stages" act which has been introduced by senator klobuchar. this legislation would authorize grants to theaters to help cover payroll and operate costs, including personal protective equipment as well as the restart act, which is so important to small businesses. we are approaching a critical point when we must save our stages and small businesses that are hanging by a thread. for the sake of the businesses in their proximity that depend on them, whether they are places to eat or venues to shop for the sake of the employees that work stagehandsactors and and lighting assistants, for the sake of our cultural heritage and the great treasures of enjoyment. for the sake of our families that come there to be together and friends and neighbors who regard them as social centers as well as artistic gems. we should pass this measure and i am very grateful to all of our witnesses today for providing the intellectual ammunition that we will need to convince our colleagues to include this in the compromise rescue package now under negotiation. it is in that package now and hopefully will remain. mr. chairman, thank you for bringing us together. chairman moran: senator blumenthal, thank you very much. our second witness is mr. adam hartke, owner of the wave and can tilly and in wichita, kansas. fellow kansan, welcome to the hearing and i look forward to your testimony. adam: thank you. good morning, chairman moran and distinguished members of the commitee. thank you for inviting me to testify. we are here because we urgently need your help. my wife and i are small business people. an advocacy as committee cochair for the coalition of nearly 3000 independent promoters in all 50 states. my early aspirations came from stories of my grandparents working shows at the cotillion in the 1960's. my grandfather managed the facility and my grandmother worked the box office. after attending kansas university, i took a job as a stagehand. i could not afford a car so i caught rides with the business agent that always made sure i got to work. in the following decade, i became operations and promotions director and later operations director of wichita festivals, producer of riverfest. i shared a common experience with my father who set up the infrastructure of the first riverfest in 1960. in 2019, i became co-owner of the wave and cotillion where my grandparents worked 60 years ago. my mother still has memories of babysitting her four younger siblings on nights my grandparents worked shows. becoming the co-owner was the realization of not only my dream, but the realization of the dreams of numerous generations of those within my family. in 2018, i realized another dream -- to design and build a large outdoor venue. this idea started with a drawing and the next year the wave was opened with me and my wife at the helm. in 2019, business blossomed. we pushed more business through the cotillion and wave became a favorite destination for concertgoers. thaose drew tourism and visitors from all 50 states. we were projecting 2020 to be our best year on record. in preparation for the new year, we made large capital investments of both venues. the beginning of 2020 showed increased revenues, and then march 13 came. in response to the pandemic, businesses were mandated closed. operations ceased. we scribbled to understand the impact this would have on our industry and community as a whole. our employees are family, many of whom i worked with. we bleed together, sweat together, smile together, cry together. they were our first concern. we quickly created a plan. we then assessed hard cost. [indiscernible] we received ppp assistance and the funds were used as stipulated with 75% going to payroll. these funds ran out in june and since then most employees have been furloughed or laid off. the amount of ppp was not sufficient for an industry with 100% of its core bills, 95% revenue loss and shuttered for 18 months. we were able to pay eight weeks of payroll and half a month of core bills. the amount of these loans were not sufficient and within three months the funds were depleted. this is a debt we have to pay off for the next 30 years. many of us have personal guarantees on our businesses. we could lose our homes. our children would not be provided for, and everything we work for will vanish. a survey shows 90% of mom-and-pop venues will go under without assistance. these are the same venues the 2019 studies showed generated $12 of economic activity for every dollar spent at a concert ticket on a small venue. nationaln the reopening before we can resume operations around the country. we have no inventory until artists begin to tour again. these are the same artists that sent congress a letter with over 600 signatures. today we have had more than 2.1 million emails sent to congress from our fans, pleading to save our stages. we are asking congress to pass the save our stages act and an extension of pua as part of the next covid release bill. this is what will save us. time is of the essence. after nine months, venues are going under at a quickening pace. we need help now. december 7 of 2020, the cotillion celebrated its 60th year of continued operation. our biggest fear is that we will have to close our doors forever and the institutions for which we have sacrificed so much will be destroyed. we are sitting before you, pleading with congress to help those like us. please do not let the music die. please save our stages so our small family business can thrive someday myive and seven-year-old son, henry, can take over and the music will be passed on for generations to come. we thank senator blumenthal, senator klobuchar, senator moran, and other committee members for their support for the industry as a whole. thank you. chairman moran: mr. hartke, thank you for your compelling testimony. i too hope that your son is able to carry on the family business. we turn to our third witness, mr. lafitte, president at patriot management in california. mr. lafitte. ranking members of this distinguished subcommittee, thank you for the opportunity to appear before you today for this hearing on the impact covid-19 has had on the live internet industry. i'm the president of patriot management, an artist management company owned by live nation. patriot represents over 45 artists, producers, and songwriters including pharrell williams, one republic, the backstreet boys, and usher. i've been part of the music business since i was 14. i started helping local bands by doing things like selling t-shirts and making flyers. fortunately for me, one of those bands was metallica. i was able to turn that opportunity into a career. instead of going to college, i went on tour. that was my education. since then, i have had the privilege of managing many fans, running a record company, and ultimately coming back to doing what i love the most, representing the artists as their manager. before any of this, i was a music fan and still am. from the beginning you could always find me in front of the stage somewhere as an obsessed fan. that obsession has become my life. most of my closest friends are people i have grown up with in this business. people i met on the road, those who promote the shows, those who work in the venues, and those who manage and staff the tours. my story is not unique. a concert is more than an opportunity to just listen to music, it is a shared experience that creates and requires a community. there are many aspects of the covid-19 pandemic that make it an unparalleled tragedy. the lives lost, jobs destroyed, and the social isolation. our industry has been deeply and profoundly affected by this crisis. the pandemic has brought concerts and the vast economic ecosystem that supports those concerts and all other live events to a screeching halt. this ecosystem starts with the artists creating music in bedrooms or garages with the dream of performing in front of a live audience. artists are feeling the pain of this pandemic personally and professionally. they miss performing live, but also feel responsible for the thousands of people who helped make these concerts and tours happen. as you all know, the live entertainment industry in the united states is massive, with thousands of people who make each tour and concert possible, including the road crews, venue personnel, and concessions staff. when you consider the economic impact of the live entertainment these professions. it impacts many local and regional economies. that includes the hotels where the performers, groups and fans stay, the restaurants where they eat and transportation we used to attend these events. the the pandemic struck in united states, live entertainment jobs as appeared overnight. jobs that will not return until we conquer this virus. everyone in this industry is hurting. whether they work in independent venues or the biggest arenas. no venue is immune from the impact of this virus. it is critical congress include comprehensive relief for the entertainment industry in the next covid-19 legislative package. we are one of the first industries to bear the brunt of this pandemic and we will be likely one of the last to get back to normal. this relief should help every venue and every professional working in the live entertainment space. economic impact on our industry is staggering. any 5% of all vendors and a 2020 have either canceled or postponed. lost 100%kers having of their income. workers,ntract everyone has been out of work since march. unlike restaurants or airlines that can operate at a reduced capacity, live entertainment is largely a all or nothing proposition. there are two ways congress can help. all live event workers are hurting regardless of their employer. any relief for our industry should focus on employees and contract workers. lawns should be used for payroll and made available to all venues . startur stages is a great but we can do so much more. all venue employees need your help. extend congress needs to the retention tax credits. with these credits, workers maintain employment until shows return and furloughed employees can continue to receive their employee sponsored health care. thank you again for this opportunity to testify. i appreciate the subcommittee drawing attention to the plate of the live entertainment business, especially our workers. i look forward to answering your questions. ntuso, president and ceo of the american bus association. >> thank you very much for giving us the opportunity to testify today. our message is unique. we represent bus companies that bring entertainers and fans to the venues and events. there are three key points i would like to make today. entertainment motorcoach industry like the entire motorcoach industry is in dire shape. need a lifeline. 142 -- without them, 40 to 50% of industry could be out of business. it is very capital-intensive with high fixed costs and that has a very specialized workforce. the emergency coronavirus relief act of 2020, which included the search act that most of the committee has sponsored or supported is critical to our survival. representoach members private, mostly small businesses including the entertainment motorcoach operators. we also support the travel and tourism industry around the country. the motorcoach industry provides nearly 600 million passenger trips annually, on par with u.s. commercial airlines. 3000 u.s. or coach companies employ approximately 100,000 individuals and generate $15 billion in revenue. but they also support 2 million additional jobs around the country and create over 200 million -- billion dollars in economic activity. today, the industry is operating at 10% of 2019 levels. 85,000 of our workers are unemployed and the path to recovery is another 12 to 24 months away. without any direct financial support, up to 50% of these businesses could close forever, meaning their employees will be out of work permanently. live entertainment performances include advance preparation, on-site activities and postevent activities. motorcoach is play a critical role at every juncture. the entertainment motorcoach thecles are built to serve entertainment needs of celebrities and their crews. they also serve politicians, the media and other specialized customers. these vehicles carry people and equipment for ground-based tours. they are designed to include sleeping, meeting and culinary support facilities. they get celebrities to the event, serve as a support vehicle on-site and get them to the next event. traditional motorcoach companies play very important role in the entertainment industry by bringing fans to the events and venues. all motorcoach companies are a vital component of this nation's transportation network. commuter services, school transportation, charters and entertainment services. the industry also serves the country in times of crisis, moving people out of harm's way during hurricanes and wildfires and moving the military and their equipment for training and deployment. earlier this year, fema and state emergency management agencies hired entertainer motorcoach is to house emergency response personnel during many of the evacuations and hurricane relief efforts in the gulf region. covid is having a significant impact on the motorcoach manufacturing and downstream suppliers. in previous years, up to 1500 new motorcoach is valued at a cost -- a cost of over $500,000 u.s.were sold in the now production and sales of new porter -- of new motorcoach is of all but stopped. goodmpact of hundreds of paying manufacturing jobs and thousands of workers supply engines and tires, seats, electronics and hundreds of other components are affected. this impact will last for years. on top of this, the value of motorcoach is has dropped as much as 50%, making it impossible to sell used coaches or trade them in, severely limiting the abilities of motorcoach operators and owners to borrow money to keep their businesses approach -- businesses afloat. mr. chairman, we appreciate your leadership in identifying the entertainment motorcoach segment. it has been overlooked for a long time and is a critical element of our nation's transportation network. we urge you and your colleagues to pass the emergency coronavirus relief act of 2020, which includes the provisions of the search act when it comes before congress next week. thank you very much. >> there we go. i would like to thank first chairman moran, ranking member senator blumenthal, my own senator, ms. marsha blackburn, senator lamar alexander and all the distinguished members of this committee for all you have done and will do. i am michael t strickland, founder and chairman of bandit lights. we are entertainment lighting companies. garth brooks is one of my best friends and biggest customers. a great gentleman. garth brooks and jimmy buffett and alice cooper, carrie underwood, nascar, these people all count as my colleagues. i have my arms around the entire live event industry from buses and trucks to labor forces such as the ie tse, catering people, rodeos, we are all shut. we are like a band of gypsies. we have no lobby and we have no packs. no representation on the hill. that is why i'm sitting here today. that is what we do. if you member nothing today, remember the word spurs. shot. we have been shot since -- shut. since march shut 13. zero income. andy 7% of our industry is sitting dead in the water. forre $877 billion industry the u.s. bureau of economic analysis. there are 10 plus million people employed as you have eloquently stated across all the different strata of this industry. we are all sitting dead still. ppp. thank you very much for the ppp you gave us in april. it ran out in june. the virus is still with us. that money is long gone. i urge you by this friday and whatever it is you pass, you pass another round of ppp. int will allow all the folks the industry to get through january and february. that is crucial because hopefully in january and february, we can effect a broader relief. , unemployment trade iron jude to continue all the economic relief actions you put forth in the wonderful cares package in april. that was a stunning decision. i applaud you for what you did to please continue those at least through june to allow those people that are negatively impacted and need those pandemic relief funds made available to them. restart, it is why i am here. restart is the only vehicle i have identified that holistically allows anyone that has been devastated to survive. in the case of our industry, our industry is at zero. in order to get a main street lending loan or get a commercial loan, you have to go for a lending institution and you have to have three things. a strong balance sheet, a strong profit loss statement and an income stream. we have none of the above. billion sitting unused in the failed main street lending program. certainly in the future, we could repurpose some amount of that to get that money to the crushed small businesses. i have spoken to senator todd young who wrote it and we realize it needs to be retooled. a the moment it was written, 25% reduction in revenue was phenomenal. a year later, a 25% reduction in revenue is not so significant. i would urge you to retool it up the amount of revenue loss, which narrows the bill, which will allow it to function within a bigger bill. i know we can get there. the last part of this whole thing is s, save our stages. i applaud you for the vision impaired senator klobuchar, senator warren, wonderful job should that is omaha beach. it is d-day for the live event business. you so graciously gave us save our stages. we have to go up the cliff and home to paris. how do we get up the cliff? restart. that is the only vehicle that gets us there. save our stages is a great first step. i urge you to pass it as soon as possible. we must go to the next step and we must have something like restart that will give us some amount of income, 45%, which is what is in restart and it will convert to a seven year loan, which will allow us a path to recovery. as i said, we have no lobby. we have no pac. to quote a friend and client of mine, jackson brown, we are running on empty. our lives in the balance. i urge you to assist small businesses in general, live events and a particular and pass restart and always other wonderful bills. imagine a world with no arts and culture. that is a world with no live events. we coined a word years ago called humanomics. we make a business decision based on the human effect first and the business effect second effecturge -- business second. thank you. even in the absence of lobbyist, you perform very well to thank you for your presence -- very well. thank you for your presence today. demi see if i can take a theme i am intricate in pursuing that resonated throughout all of the testimonies s. the inability of the paycheck reduction program to solve the problem. didard mr. harkey say it not work in circumstances where there is virtually no revenue and it was too short-term in its duration. you talked about the paycheck protection program and asked that it be reauthorized. i would ask all of our witnesses, tell me what has been pinned -- what has been missing in the paycheck protection program to meet your needs. as a separate program as son of be have testified need to enacted or what is it that the paycheck protection program -- we can do to make it work better for all of your circumstances? >> thank you, chairman. that is a great question. paycheck protection program when it was initiated to congress and most of us seemed like that would be the answer because we all believed we would be back to work in june. the fact it was only 10 weeks of income in retrospect was far too little. by the affiant -- by the time we get back to work, it will be 74 weeks. all we have received as small businesses is 10 weeks of payroll. the first issue would be the longevity of it. in perfect world this friday, you would pass a payroll protection plan that provided 36 to 48 weeks of ppp. but is a bit of a stretch the shortness of it -- even now, if you pass an additional round of ppp this friday, that is 10 weeks. that is the last two weeks in december, january and february. the live event industry is not going to be back until the vaccine takes hold and we have heard them unity. that is june, july, august september. so what do we do for the rest of the time? ergo, restart. >> thank you, mr. chairman. the ppp program had great intentions and we appreciate that. we have a valued and skilled workforce so we went to bring them back. the reality is we have no business. and we brought people back for the eight or 10 weeks, they merely came and set, collected the ppp money and left again and back on unemployment. all it really did was transfer the unemployment system onto a private individual using federal dollars for a time. our business is gone to 10% of the -- is gone. 10% of the business is operating across the board. it will be no recovery for at least another 12 months. there will not be another opportunity for people to come back and drive buses for the most part. we need people to keep the industry alive so we can be a vibrant part of the transportation network. to do that, we need to help the companies stay alive either with help covering their fixed costs or capital costs or interest payments they are paying on a bus that is worth five or $600. >> any other witnesses wish to address that question? >> i will jump in with that. just to repeat what peaches said, we have been fully shut for nine months now with no work .or employees many venues are completely out of funds. the amount of ppp and the not save ourwill industry. it will not save the venues. there are people that will completely go out of business whether those -- with those restrictions. the save our stages act is targeted towards our industry specifically and that is what is going to get us through this. chairman moran: let me ask a follow-up question with you. the paycheck protection program -- i think you highlight does not work well when there is little or no income. what about the restrictions on audiences, the size, the distancing, the percentage of capacity? is it possible for the entertainment industry to operate at a smaller volume, fewer people in the audience and still earn a living? >> there are a couple things with that. right now, no. there are notorious. we rely on a national reopening to get back to work. the artists we book in wichita, kansas, they have to go through denver, dallas or kansas city and have those connections across the country for them to get here. we have no inventory. there are no artists touring right now. 70,nd that, we operate at a 80% capacity ticket sales. capacity,g a 30, 40% we are losing money immediately. we tried that in june. we opened briefly for three weeks. we booked a bunch of local bands and we lost more money than being open then we did in hibernation mode. it leads us out quicker. at the end of this, we are going to have to open at reduced capacity but hopefully there is a better understanding of the not evan flowing right now, we are back to 100rictions at a max of people in center county. those were enlisted and reinstated. in the time it takes to book a touring act, there is no way to do that right now. we are pretty stuck. chairman moran: that unfortunately makes sense to me. senator blumenthal. senator blumenthal: thank you, mr. chairman. yield part of myhiel time to senator klobuchar so she can make some opening remarks. she is a leader of this effort and i will save my questions to the end of her remarks or the next witness. chairman moran: senator klobuchar. klobuchar: [indiscernible] guysce everything that you have said in such wonderful words. you have seen the creativity of the state of tennessee coming through in your turn of phrases, mr. strickland and i am more than happy -- with senator cornyn to have led this in your words, this band of gypsies so we can get something done. one of the things we have learned from this pandemic it is all not everyits business and group of employees are affected in the same way. state ofe home jefferson bus lands understands that. you can see it the faces of people utterly starting to cry at the bluestem amphitheater as they were talking about the moral haggard concert or see it in the face of dana frank who heads up 1st avenue in minneapolis as we stood in front of that iconic star of prints. knowing that -- of prince. knowing that he and so many other artists across the country could not have gotten there starts without entertainment venues. i think we all know you cannot go stand in a mosh pit in the middle of a pandemic. to elbow init elbow a small theater, whether it is in big city or a little town. so many of these venues are literally the heart of our community. they are place that people go. since we article quoting a lot of things -- since we are quoting a lot of things, we do not want to be the congress that lets the music died. we do not want this to be the year we let our cultural icons die. with that, senator cornyn and i have introduced this bill. we are working hard to get it in the relief package. we are feeling good about the work that is going on. i am also a big fan and cosponsor of the restart act as ayou spoke to as well act -- as well as an act involving the bus line. i want to remind our colleagues and i know they know this or we would not be doing this hearing, thank you to chairman moran and making member blumenthal, if it was not for that understanding. tech companies are doing great. so many of these small venues are not. my question i guess of you with your cool jump set over there in wichita is, could you explain how it would be really hard to bring back these venues? you cannot stop a finger and they are going to be -- cannot snap a finger and they are going to be up to come back with your low margins. >> many of our venues have taken generations to build. in smaller markets like wichita, this is an ongoing effort that is passed on from generation to generation to get an act to come to wichita kansas has been the work of many decades of people. not only that but to get the spaces that are appropriate for hosting music, you mentioned first avenue. that is a magical place. there is not another space like that in the world. if you lose the 1st avenue, it is going to be impossible to replicate that. you cannot go into any warehouse and have that magic. int is true of the cotillion wichita and all these venues across the country. even if they are not historic, new venues -- a certain theme to it. senator klobuchar: could you talk about how it was hard your venues, being independent venues, some of you competing as we have seen more and more consolidation with some of the big guys in the industry and how the pandemic has put a magnifying glass on this problem. we are not going to talk about antitrust here. but could you talk about how it is hard to get by right now anyway? industry ismusic increasingly difficult due to the consolidation of the industry. mom-and-pop businesses are fighting tooth and nail to ensure they still get shows and are able to route tours through the city. it is hitting secondary markets just as hard as it is heading -- as it is hitting major markets. senator klobuchar: i thing i will end with you, mr. strickland. just words for us as we go into these next few days when everyone is waiting for a result from this congress to be able to do a mac it -- a package at the end of the year. any advice? >> again, consider the humanomics. there are 10 plus million people holistically across this entire industry doing nothing should we are not like restaurants or gymnasiums or hair salons that open and close and have a chance to do something. we are doing nothing right now. 97% of the people are either unemployed or underemployed. can you imagine being a dental assistant and not being a dental assistant for 18 months and having to go work at home depot? that is what has happened. we have a lot of really talented people and we do this for one reason. we love it, for the love of the game, for the love of the music. we have entertainment and event people scattered across the landscape looking at home depot and amazon and it is soul crushing. as an industry, not just venues. as an industry, we will not come back if we do not receive relief because the restart relief is the only thing we have. we cannot go get a commercial loan. senator klobuchar: thank you so much. chairman moran: next is senator blackburn. i was thinking of the wichita lineman. the line is, i want you for all time. the wichita lineman is still online. keeping these folks in business is an important component. i want to keep up with you and your lyrics. senator blackburn. senator blackburn: yes, and there is a unique story the hind how that song was written and how it came to be wichita. in nashville, we say everything begins with a song. indeed, it does and to our witnesses today, i want to thank you for being available to us, to chairman moran and chairman wicker, thank you for working with me and my team so that we could have this live entertained -- the live entertainment industry is vitally important to us in tennessee. it is a complete sector of our state's economy. it is not just a add-on. it is not something that is just there for the fun of it. it is the music business. i appreciate what senator klobuchar has done with save our stages. she and senator schumer and senator blumenthal. that really is the front facing part of the industry. that is what you see when the curtains open. that is what you see in the videos on stage. that is a great. -- that is great. we want these venues to thrive. however, in order to make those shows appealing and exciting and to keep these venues open, there is an entire behind the curtain that takes place. and full disclosure, in the mid-1990's, i led the tennessee film entertainment and music commission. that is when i got to know many of the folks that drive the buses. that is when i got to know the caterers and those that are groups and gaffer's and it is when i got to know mr. strickland and appreciate what and it lights -- what bandit lights does. this sector of the industry does not benefit from what will be passed in save our stages. and to my colleagues on the other end of the dyess, -- the dyess, this is when we need you to work with us so the support these venuesakes work is able to stay live. so that they are able to participate. because right now, i have a lot of friends and neighbors in nashville, that they basically go out and crank the motorcoach every week to be sure that the things are still going to be operational. they go through and they check the catering equipment. they go through and they check the equipment that is sitting in the warehouse waiting for the lights to go back on on these stages so they can gear backup. is no avenueere for that. they did nothing wrong. i think this is an important thing to realize. these folks that support live entertainment did nothing wrong. they did not cause this. hit, whenhe pandemic the economy got shut down, they to afrom running wide open dead stop overnight. that was it. i talked to people that were on tour buses. they turned the tour buses around on the interstate and headed back to nashville. they did not go to the next stop. they boxed up equipment and they sent it back to knoxville. , theyimportant to realize .o not have another source and yes, save our stages is good but you have got to have something to save the stage with and it is the support network. so let me do this. i am running out of time because we are so determined to help with this industry. mr. strickland and mr. harkey, let me come to you with my question. talk to me about what the next six months is going to look like for this industry and how you think you are going to be able to recover. mr. strickland, you first. >> senator -- thank you, senator blackburn. business doese of not teach one how to run a business for 18 months with no money. it is not taught. to answer your question, and the biggest point here is the industries and people within these industries, we are not almost out of money. we have been out of money. 30% of our industry's key is gone. if nothing is done by february, 60% of our industry will be gone. 50% of the people will be unemployed or doing something else. we have no alternative. if the federal government does not step up with a restart style relief for small business in general, for the live event space in particular, we simply have no alternative. companies will all be shuttered. hartke.ckburn: mr. >> without the save our stages act passing immediately, we will not last six months. we will not be here for a recovery period. with a relief bill, we will get back to work and hire staff back and we will start planning for a reopening. but without it, we will not be here. sen. blackburn: thank you. thank you, mr. chairman. chairman moran: thank you, senator blackburn for your leadership on this issue. senator blumenthal. me say blumenthal: let first of all to mr. pantuso. i appreciate you being here. motorcoach industry is often overlooked in its importance to the economy. i recently visited the depakote company in new britain connecticut. it is a family run motorcoach operator, school bus third generation and it is vital are theconomy as companies you or if remarks. i am so glad you are here. a questionmr. fay because i think that you have brilliantly outlined the ecosystem that is at stake here. senator blackburn referred to a the of it but it is also small clubs, the sources of the talent that eventually reach the bush now land broadway. it is also the restaurants that are providing service to patrons when they go there. anchor type of community that will show the lion king musical one evening and a political debate the next. it is also running innovative community-based programming. countless inner-city children. what i would like to know from one,s some examples number of those smaller institutions that depend on the bushnell and theaters in venues like it and also the timeline that is necessary for you to have a production on your stage. you cannot just snap a finger and have it overnight. it takes infinitely difficult planning and if you could speak smallerissue and the parts of that ecosystem that depend on you. >> that is a great question. me address theet second one first. and that is -- has already been pointed no that restarting this business is going to take the entire country opening up and in a way that we can open to full capacity. we have explored the ability to do small performances of different kinds but they do not work. one of the biggest problems with that is our public is frightened and until the vaccine is out and take for tag, even after that, it is going to take months and months for our public to decide it is safer them to come back and they are comfortable doing it. of this is months something we are facing. to come out of that, it is going to take many more months. it is probably going to take two or three years. being in position to open is critical. the challenge of the small businesses around us that we participate with and work with all the time is very real. there are six or seven major restaurants that have closed in downtown hartford since we have reopened. as a result of all the work from home and the digital working, there is a real concern that on the one hand, businesses will never repopulate downtown area with as many employees. work from home is probably going to become part of our economic process. as a result, there will be fewer feet hitting the street at 5:00 or 6:00 in the evening. we are going to be one of the major -- of trying to bring people back to the downtown area as we were back in the 1970's and 1980's when we were trying to rebuild the cities. aspect is frightening for our own mayor who has expressed his concern we be alive and thriving as soon as possible to pull people back into downtown. you mentioned how our venue and others do more than just concerts. they're all kinds of events. hartford hospital raises over a million dollars a year in an event they do in our theater. the smaller clubs, the infinity .all of 450 seats tremendous business under new ownership. months, they shut down. it all works together. there is an ecosystem that is a delicate balance and every one of the people that have testified today represent a sniffing and part of that ecosystem. we -- [indiscernible] it could be decades to rebuild if we do not get this help now. sen. blumenthal: my time has expired but i want to thank you operators.the venue i have been to that benefit. i am a regular and i have also been to the bushnell in the last couple of months when it has been empty and there is nothing so heartbreaking and gun dredging -- and got wrenching as an empty theater, as a venue like yours that is so full of and the kindster of performances that really make memories for people when we know it will take months and maybe as long as a year to reopen. the hartford community depends other venuesnd like it. so thank you very much, esther chairman. chairman moran: senator lee. senator lee: take you, mr. chairman. mr.covid -- thank you, chairman. the covid-19 pandemic has turned everyone into a state of disarray. semis been hard on industries. basically every aspect of our economy has been harmed by it. this misses of all shapes and sizes from the food industry, manufacturers, travel and tourism, energy and transportation, just to name a few. today's hearing with the live entertainment industry is important. luckily, with the approval of a covid-19 vaccine and hopefully more approvals yet to come, along with an effective distribution chain for those optimistic we will soon find ourselves coming into or at least able to see a better outcome in the coming year. while i am confident in our logistics networks and our ability to swiftly transport the vaccine, we know it is going to take some time before all americans are going to have access to it. acknowledgesng there is still a lot left to be done as we consider the full economic impact of the pandemic and the government's response to it and as we carefully consider solutionses we have, that only provide funds but ensure a smooth trajectory toward reopening in swift bounce back to normal, which is what we all crave. live entertainment industry has certainly suffered very severe economic harm during the pandemic and i'm glad we are going to hear testimony today. with the vaccine on its way, now seems like a good time for us to policy solutions of every stripe we can imagine to help facilitate that smooth transition back to normal. regulations, bureaucracy, federal rules put in place by executive branch agencies can be one of many things in an economy that can slow things down. it is especially important right now in considering the funds that have been appropriated and may yet be appropriated for us to look at ways we could get government to not do things it might otherwise do that might be harmful and might slow down our returned to normal. i was wondering if each of you could just identify, is there any regulation congress all to be aware of, that congress ought to be looking at carefully in such a way that could help restore your transition to normally? >> thank you, senator lee. goes a lot of different directions. ie 500 pound gorilla, hesitate to mention it, is the liability indemnity situation. unless and until there is something dealt with on theility indemnity, all of live events business is at risk. let's assume we in one way or another resolve the financial struggles and issues. if the liability situation is not resolved in a manner such that class-action lawsuit are not rampant, then you will find very few venues, promoters, artists, cities, states that will want to put on a large-scale event. go to garth brooks, a client of mine. we have three sold-out 100,000 person stadium shows from last year we have moved to this year. we want to do a lot more of those. 100,000 people in a football stadium with no liability protection is a class-action waiting to happen. you will find 5000 people that will join a class-action. legislatively and administratively, that is probably the next they issue. as i tell people, why did i bifurcate financial relief from liability and and entity echo i learned from what -- and indemnity? i learned from watching what is going on in congress that we keep getting back to liability indemnity as a sticking point. i find it imperative we resolve first andial issue then we start drilling down and looking at what we can do about liability indemnity. are those whoe say states can handle that on their own. what is your response to that? >> it absolutely will not work and here is the reason. as other people have referenced today, our industry is reliant largely on what we call a tour, which is when a large band goes to in most cases all 50 states and does show is paid if you have 8 -- does shows. if you have a patchwork situation you cannot play in particular states because the rules are different, you will never be able to book the tour. when you cannot book a tour, which is the backbone of the live event industry, then you are stuck with no ability to mount large-scale tours such as garth brooks or the rolling u2.nes or smaller acts will not work until there is a singular fit. flood relief falls back on the federal government singly because there is no insurance agency that would step up and take that. there probably is some kind of a workout whereby a situation like the flood relief becomes the pandemic relief. i would leave that to those of you in congress to figure out the details. sen. lee: thank you. mr. chairman, i see my time has expired. chairman moran: senator sinema. unanimousnema: i ask consent to enter into the record a letter from the endurance sport coalition. chairman moran: without objection. senator sinema: i want to thank our witnesses for their testimony on this important topic. arizona has a vibrant economy that feeds thousands of jobs and provides opportunities to enjoy art, pewter, music and sports. these numerous entertainment options also draw tourists to arizona in addition to our excellent weather and landscape. the industry5% of has been furloughed. i am hearing daily from arizonans and small businesses that are struggling to stay afloat as their venues are closed or limited due to the pandemic. i am proud to be a cosponsor of the save our stages legislation, both of which can provide necessary assistance. the save our stages bill will provide $16 billion to support clubs, theaters, concert halls and movie theaters that meet certain criteria. includes a loan program to restart businesses. covid discussion continues, i will encourage my colleagues to provide assistance to arizona's entertainment industry. first question is for mr. strickland to the sport and live athletics industry has struggled. i was looking forward to many events this year such as the boston marathon that were canceled or made virtual. on a large event is canceled, it is not just the british depends who are disappointed. i understand your company has provided lighting for many live athletic events including the country music marathon and the national rock 'n' roll marathon. how would the restart act help companies like yours that provide services to marathons or similar events? >> thank you, senator. you are very correct. we have moved into what i call the less sexy side of the live event business. when you are doing production for a foot race, i was once involved with skycam. when you are doing those kinds of things, it is not anything that is obvious that anyone wants to talk about but it is very vital and as we sit here cameras and microphones, folks working this stuff today are part of the 3% that is working. sports are near and dear to my heart. i sit on the board of the women's basketball hall of fame to one of mine -- hall of fame. one of my mentors was the late pat summit. they are struggling mightily. they are part of the lost set of people that you do not realize are affected by that kid -- by that. these are people who restart realistically and allows the largest number of people to survive. to quote the gentleman that founded a college in tennessee, do the most good on the largest scale. that is what we need to do. i do not think congress intends to pick winners and losers. by passing a bill like restart with high revenue loss triggers, it would allow those businesses including those in the sport sector to survive. sen. sinema: thank you. family chain of theaters has experienced a 95% drop in revenue since the pandemic. the ceo described the difficulty of making payroll, tax and utility payments without taking in revenue. i was told that patrons are so eager to support the business they are buying the theater's popcorn. the rhythm room, which is an r&d venue in phoenix, is supposed to celebrate its 30th anniversary next year. last week, they put up a gofundme page because they are in danger of closing without nine months of revenue. i understand you and your wife cohen two live music venues. -- your wife cohen two live is a venues. co-own live music venues. >> thank you for the question. it focuses on the small mom-and-pop businesses and entertainment venues. of 250nges from venues -- here in kansas, we have a member .hat is 40 as an independent we have an 18,000 capacity that also includes nonprofits. it includes pro for-profits and publicly owned venues. we cover the gambit with the bill. that, it has the flexibility. [indiscernible] we are able to pay our bills that we either have not paid or need to pay now. it gives us little bits of time we could persevere before closure. ,eyond that, if it is a grant many of us are tightly leveraged. it is the nature of our business. we have loans out on our businesses already. taking out a loan is not what people really want to do right now or they have already exhausted that option. those are the main issues. sen. sinema: thank you. stick chairman, i see my time has expired. might i ask one more question? otheran moran: there are members but go ahead and ask. sen. sinema: one final question for you. in 2019, a theater in tucson hosted over 400 shows throughout the year. in a 2020, they only had 68 shows in every single one of those was before march 12. it used to employ 206 staff. the owner of rubble lounge in phoenix, his club has been closed for months and he told us the ppp program did not work well for his business. you shared the same experience. can you tell us why ppp did not work for you and did you have access to other programs or any other access to capital? >> the ppp program did not work for the amount. it was not proficient for an industry that has been closed for nine months and we have another nine months at a minimum ahead of us before we can get back to work. payroll is not our biggest expense. we paid 75% as originally stipulated into payroll and many of our employees did not have a lot of work to do since we were fully shuttered. biggest components of why the ppp does not work. we are trying not to get more debt on our services. sen. sinema: mr. chairman, thank you for your indulgence. chairman moran: you're welcome, senator sinema. senator young. mr.tor young: thank you, chairman and thank you char when essays. every person, business and industry has been impacted. there is no question the live entertainment industry has been hit especially hard. esther strickland, you touch on the fact that 887 -- $877 billion is the size of the live entertainment industry. it has earned zero income since mid-march. yesterday, we saw the first shipments of the covid-19 vaccine delivered to hundreds of disbursement centers across the country. that of course is very encouraging. it is going to provide light at the end of the tunnel to help american people and businesses of all kinds. the live entertainment industry relies on large crowds to operate, leaving the industry in vulnerable place far beyond the first wave of vaccinations. it is going to be a while before the industry can recover. it is not just sports and entertainment venues and field houses and so forth. we have a lot of those throughout the state of indiana. there are small, medium and large businesses across the country that make up the massive supply chain that keep this industry chugging along. i think you and i have discussed systems.st's it is a company based in pendleton, indiana that i visited. in march 2020, they had 72 employees and were looking to hire more hoosiers. today, their picture looks a lot different. they only have -- they are down to -- effort two rounds of layoffs, less than 20 people. melrose pyrotechnics, it is a fireworks company. i've spoken to their owner. they have been forced to lay off 75% of their employees. it is vital we take necessary steps to support the live entertainment industry and small hoosier businesses like melrose and tyler trust during this unprecedented public health crisis. measures additional needed to do that. i want to thank chairman moran who is chairing this subcommittee hearing for becoming the 60th cosponsor of my restart act, which i do believe will provide the requisite solution to the challenges your industry is very hard-hiter industries in the midst of this global pandemic. and subsequent government measures that disrupted industries like your own. i feel like there is a moral imperative for us to act in response. i restart proposal would target our limited resources to help those businesses and provide flexible loans to help employers with a broad set of operating expenses instead of a heavy focus on payroll cost. this is especially important for those who cannot maintain full payrolls due to sustained loss in revenues. mr. stricklin, can you discuss why it is so important to restructure the ppp program to focus more on revenue rather than payroll retention like my restart proposal would do and its benefit to your industry? >> thank you, senator young. we know each other fairly well now. i wish it were like baskin-robbins and i wish we had before us 32 options. the live event industry in particular could do but we do not. i only really see one option. that is restart, which senator young and sandra bennett authored. -- senator bennett authored. it is important because it will give you 45% of your 2019 income. you can use it all for operations and overheads and basically keeping the lights on or you can use some of it for payroll and payroll related expenses, which will be forgiven and the rest will convert to a loan. it is very important that we be able to use a vehicle like this because no one in the live event space today has the ability to secure the main street lending loan or a commercial loan. the banks have turned their backs on us and we understand that. we do not have a balance sheet. we do not have a p&l. we do not have an income stream. we have nothing that is bankable. we cannot get a loan. we are literally here with her hat in her hand begging. -- hat in our hand begging. sen. young: and congress should help you out. i am very frustrated we have not helped you out. a government mandate for understandable and i think appropriate public health reasons is one of the main reasons that your rank and file workers are hurting, and they deserve some help. we believe in institutions. conservatives are supposed to believe in institutions. government is an institution and government should be there in times of emergencies to help americans, or they will lose faith in government and government leaders. with your indulgence, mr. chairman, i have one other line of inquiry. it won't take long. last month during a house financial services subcommittee hearing on pandemic insurance, several committee members indicated that congress should wait until the current crisis is over, before contemplating a program to address any future occurrences. what are your thoughts on the development of a pandemic federal insurance program that covers or industry, in the event of a future government mandated shutdown, due to another pandemic? or other national crisis? word on the street is, because of a number of different factors, increased globalization and the change in the atmosphere, many other factors, trade patterns, this is not going to be the last pandemic that this or future generations will face. what are your thoughts on that insurance model? >> as i stated earlier, we cannot purchase insurance. we cannot purchase liability protection. we cannot purchase pandemic insurance. it simply isn't offered. insurance companies are not interested in it. the only feasible solution as i see is what i mentioned earlier, something like the federal flood insurance program where the government stands between disaster and the affected businesses. as to what that would look like, i would model it after the federal flood insurance program. >> thank you very much. i yield back, mr. chairman. >> you have nothing to yield back. senator rosen. are you with us? senator rosen? senator cantwell. thank you. and for people participating, i want to thank thousands of the independent artists and venues for trying to communicate this issue. when you're talking about issues like macklemore, pearl jam, and many others you can see that music is an important issue to the state of washington. i want to thank senator klobuchar and corn in for legislation -- there is bipartisan support in a stimulus package, but we have a long way to go to make that a reality. a survey by the washington nightlife music association, 63% of independently close clubs would have no choice but to permanently close, you guys have been talking about many of those issues, even in spokane, a staple of the music scene there closed its doors and in dividend venues like spokane arena, the knitting factory, the fox, and many others are impacted by the closures and looking for the relief. when i hear these comments this morning and our colleagues you think this would be a slamdunk, if nothing else we can go ahead and pass legislation for us, 38,000 washingtonians, a two point $4 billion music industry overall. $2.4 billion music industry overall. so, we do not want to see permanent closure because it is hard to start these again. you have been talking a lot about the problem, but could any of the witnesses give us real-life examples of what witnesses are struggling. so much of our state they have been trying to hold on. they know that permanent -- closure probably means permanent closure, but could you give us examples of what people are trying to do to hold on. >> thank you. but to bring up about the great state of washington, i was involved in an endeavor called red alert restart where we lit all the buildings read across the nation. pearl jam made magic, thank you very much, in seattle. i cannot give them enough kudos. they reached out to me and then went out to work in turn seattle read beginning with the space leader and flowing from there. but, i have a 1.2 million person email chain. to answer your question, 30% of the businesses have closed. we are not having a conversation at this moment about what will happen, we are having a conversation about what has happened and what will continue to happen. the smaller companies and what we call the gig workers, those people have shifted out of the space and they are working at amazon or somewhere else. they have left the industries they have loved, some never to return. we anticipate 20% to 30% will never return to the space. some of the smaller companies have folded, and lost all of their assets through auction, and that money does not go to them. so, i wish i could give you a story of happiness and how people have been able to survive, but the simple truth is that no one is surviving, they are failing daily. and, we are not at the edge of the cliff, we have gone over and like the cat in the cartoon, most of our industry is hanging on by a thread. >> that is what we wanted to eliminate. we have got to get our colleagues to understand that we have to act now on this legislation. >> thank you for joining us, let us see if senator rosen is now available. >> can you hear me this time? technology is great when it works, sometimes that microphone gets you. i want to thank all of the witnesses and being here and for traveling across the country for your communities. independent industries are continuing to be a challenge, but the live events industry has been the hardest hit. they are a major draw in nevada and help drive our economy. nearly half a million job are part of our live event and tourism ecosystem, and unfortunately nevada's live events committee is struggling. performers and support staff have seen their work come to a complete halt and things are not able to open during the pandemic. it is no doubt that targeted financial assistance, such as you have all been speaking to, and i will continue to be supportive of those efforts. to revive the economy, aid cannot be a one-time infusion. as we look forward to the future of safely operating, we will also need to implement creative and innovative solutions for venues and other businesses that reopen and give the public more confidence to go back into these indoor spaces. given that live event met venues depend -- event venues talk about large in-person gatherings, can you talk about the importance of consumer confidence to provide businesses with all funding, and ppe and the technologies that make indoor activities safer for the public, and could you speak more specifically to businesses that you work at that have upgraded their hvac or air purification, any of those technologies that improve the air that we breathe, and as we know we do that we can medicate the spread of covid-19 through the air. let us begin. >> thank you for the question. we are definitely in a whole new world and we are rapidly learning what that means for our industry. the answer is yes, safety is number one protocol in our industry. our industry is one that gathers a large group of people together, so inherently there are numerous things pre-covid that we had to plan for. and this is another layer of that. safety first is always a big priority for live events. with that we somehow invested in air purification systems and some do not have the funds to do it. but it is part of everybody's plan to take the steps necessary to ensure that the public is safe when they return to live events. >> thank you. >> thank you. las vegas, not unlike new york, california, and nashville, you mention the economic impact, it is broader than the economic impact on the live event industry, because when you bring a live events to las vegas, you generate hotels and restaurants, and taxis, airlines, and all the ancillary businesses. the effect is far-reaching in all 50 states. when you do not have events, everyone suffers. what we are seeing now, but moving to the safety side, you have two conditions to look at, the medical condition which is vaccine related and exactly how the vaccine does or does not work and what the outcome is. we will plan for the worst and hope for the best. let us assume that the vaccine works and is safe. we then moved to the social or human condition. how safely people feel? how much will you want to go and see a show? that is an answer to 340 million people and they will answer one at a time. we have a lot of information telling us that there is a high degree of confidence. we have three sold out garth brooks stadiums and we have had literally no requests for refunds. the same thing can be said for a number of large events where the refund rate at this moment is low, so that indicates to us a high degree of confidence. having said that, let us discuss that question after the first event is held. >> i understand that my time is just about up but i would like to submit questions for the record and talk more about our air purification systems and how we support that so people can feel confident to go back indoors to our wonderful venues. thank you. >> senator tester, i believe you are are cleaning up. >> any time that i can get on a committee chaired by senator moran, i am there. thank you. look, i came to this late because we have a bunch of conflicts with the senate, but i have heard talk about a number of bills that i am on. save our stage and the restart act and the encores act. and i am hearing everyone saying the right thing. if you are listening senator young, i would be more than happy to work with you on liability insurance for these entities because i think mr. strickland is correct. these venues have unusual circumstances. getting back to what i am going to say, i have heard people talk, and i do not think that anybody has said that you guys are full of bs, everybody that i have heard has said, we feel your pain. and, i do not know if you guys are frustrated because we continue not to do anything, but it frustrates the hell out of me. you guys have been impacted by something that you do not have any control over. you could be the best business people in the world and do everything right, yet you are getting submarine by this dam n coronavirus. and so, i would want to work with a number of folks in my state, sean lynch, they are small venues, and by the way, you are right. for all -- for every dollar in a small venue it results in $12 of economic activity within those regions. you are absolutely right. what you do impacts more than just going to a concert. from the five folks we have, or i see four, but there is five on my agenda, could you tell me what happens six to 10 months from now for your business. let us assume that the vaccine is good and that people go back to the concerts again, but we know that it will be a 6, 8, 10 months. your projections may be that or longer. that is the way i see it. are you guys still going to be around? >> thank you for the question. without help, no, we will not be. we are at a cliff and we have been nine months closed with no revenue, and we still have all of our expenses. without help, the independent venues will not last. if we do get help, then we will be around and we will put all of our effort into a recovery. recovery is important, and super important for the local region. because we will drive tourism and bring people back out. it will be a slow recovery, we will have to hold to reduce capacity to see how it works and that is maybe an 18 month period where we are at severely decreased revenue. not only will the save our stages act help us survive now, it also helps with the recovery and we really anticipate that once we get through this and consumer confidence is back, then we will see a boom. i am really excited to go out and see a show right now, and i think a lot of people feel that way, but that is going to be down the road and not immediate. this not only helps us survive, but it helps us be a part of the recovery period. >> i would like to jump in if i might. that is the value in the restart act. it is very simply that it is a seven year loan with no payments in year one, that is critical. we will have no money in your brun -- year one because if we had restart money in february we are going to be broke. in year one there is no payments. year two, interest-only. year three to seven, we get through the note. we can live through that, that is a path to survival. >> but if we do nothing, which we do not feel like we will do much from the senator's perspective, it is good. but if you do nothing we will -- >> no, we disappear. >> anyone else want to talk about this? >> we want to be part of a solution, part of the recovery, so in terms of how it relates to this hearing? a lot of our companies are over the cliff. i saw a report from the department of transportation not long ago that showed as many as 400 to 500 companies have lost operating authority, meaning that they are closed. as business comes back we want to take people to those venues and stages, but we know that in the travel and tourism industry, that planning process takes a long time. we will lose companies over the next six months until businesses starts to open up again, and that planning process in many cases get people on the buses and tors or back to work and commuter scheduled service may take another year beyond that we need help now and we cannot wait another six months. >> i just want to say you guys have got to be going crazy. your livelihoods are on the line, and you look to have a federal government that has your back and you look back and it is not there. i am going to continue and i will give you my personal word that i will continue to make sure that we get all three of these bills across the finish line, and i think the liability issue is a good one, in the end we have to help the economy. i talked to a good economist and you guys are hurting. this economist says if we do nothing, were going to go back into a recession and potentially a depression. we are not done with the worst part of this pandemic yet. i think that the folks in washington, d.c., and i am concerned about the death too. but, when you have challenges like this, you have to keep the economy down and payoff the debt down the line. i want to thank you for being here and what you do. i think it is important for our society, so thank you. >> thank you. i would highlight for you in particular that i would be happy to be the chairman of any committee you are a member of. we will see if that is the case come january. senator tester, thank you for sharing your frustration. i gave remarks on the senate floor three weeks ago saying just because we cannot do everything, let us do what we can do, let us do something, and then a week or 10 days ago, additional remarks seem to say we are doing something, but it is slow slow, can we speed up the process. what is figure out among our colleagues what we can do. there are some things that seem incapable at the moment but it does not mean that we should not do what we can agree on, i think that is a wide away about dutch array of options and particularly the legislations we talked about today. they seem to be things that we can do with broad, bipartisan support and we need to speed up the timeframe as indicated today, these businesses are in jeopardy of no longer existing. we will conclude this hearing in a moment, but i want to ask a couple of questions of mr. lafitte. earlier, i mentioned the paycheck protection program that was the main relief program treated by congress to retain employees. in your experience did music artists utilize ppp and why or why not? >> thank you for the question. the ppp program was a great program for as long as it lasted, and it has been stated time and again it did not last long enough. i had several clients who qualified, and as a result we were able to take care of some of our crew and essential workers who spent their entire lives doing nothing except from going towards a tour. as you know the issue here is that the money has run out and there is no next tour. >> tell me about the industry you are involved with, how much income comes from touring, particularly for smaller artists? what form of federal assistance would be most effective in helping those people? >> again, thank you for that question, i say anywhere from 70 to 90% comes from live performance, particularly for smaller acts. a big artist and a great songwriter could generate income through radio songs and public performance on the radio and television. that being said most of the income today is earned on the road. so, what i would hope for would be to get help from congress to help keep our works alive. be rtc, ppp program being expanded. save our stages being expanded, we need help everywhere. we are talking about an entire workforce that has nowhere else to go. you know, you are personalizing stories, one of my tour managers has been with us 15 years and is selling a new beverage. he is going from convenience store to convenient store to try to make ends meet. so, again, bringing it back to solutions, please expand ppe and brtx,c, and save our stages. it is a giant workforce that needs help. the ticket taker at the small club needs to put food on the table and a roof over their head, so does the usher at the big arena. we need to help everybody. >> you indicated you support the save our stage act. are there any points that would highlight where the legislation falls short? my understanding that save our stage only covers 30% of the venues that qualify. so, the vast majority, 70% of those are not covered. again, i think we need to expand the scope, we need to get more venues qualified. >> it is my usual practice in hearings in senator blumenthal and i conduct for any witness to add or correct anything they said. is there any witness that would like to add anything to the record before we conclude? >> i would like to follow-up on a question that senator lee had earlier on what the federal government can do. i will give you one example. we are hearing from national parks that they will only allow a bus with 10 individuals to come into the parks. grand canyon is a perfect example. they are not allowing companies to come in that do not already have passes in 2020, or a cua, commercial use authorization permit. which means that as we get to the recovery and people want to bring more people into the national park system, they will not be allowed to because you cannot run a bus with 10 individuals, one being the driver and one being the guide and only eight paying customers. if you have not already been to the park and have a cua, it means you cannot get one in 2021. it is one example where the federal government needs to open the doors up to allow recovery to continue. >> if i might respond, i think that point is well made. in general about the federal government getting out of the way, but more particularly about our national parks and the example of that being a destination for our motorcoach and travel industry. travel agents suffer from the potential closure of many of these venues, and our transportation industry, and i also want to emphasize the point made by mr. faye about it being a source of education and resources for our children in schools. it is part of our educational system. if we use that, we lose a a vital source of culture and education for students. the ridgefield playhouse in connecticut has been serving as a resource of education for stanford and bridgeport schoolchildren, and so, making these venues available are critical for our educational system. thank you mr. chairman, and i want to thank all of the witnesses who are here today and who participated virtually, because you have added a tremendous amount to the understanding that we have of this issue. thank you. >> any other witnesses want to say anything? >> i would like to say thank you to this committee and you folks for doing this and i would like to go back to what senator tester said, we are not upset, we understand that congress has a huge challenge in front of itself, you have to deal with a huge number of bills, thousands of bills, so your knowledge and time is valuable, and thank you for taking it. we understand the process, but we just hope and pray that we have made the lives and plight of the industry known. we very vertically integrated. is that came, jenga, where if one block goes a whole tower falls. what you see at the top is the big star and what you see at the bottom are the manufacturers like senator young referenced. when this thread begins to unravel, the venues, sound people, bus people, radio, and rodeo people and the manufacturers and the birthday party people in the party rental houses falls apart because there is no chain or echo system. and, then becomes the knock on economic effect of the rest of the community. thank you for your time. >> i think you wanted to say something. >> thank you. again i wanted to state the urgency of this. we have employees whose pua has run out, and we have venues that got closed, lots of them, and lots more facing closures. i want to remind everybody that these are locally owned businesses. we live in the communities. it is venues of all sizes across the country that the save our stages act will help. we do not have a week, we do not have two months, the time is now. after nine months people are going under, quick, and it is just going to be over the edge if we wait any longer. that is all i have to say, thank you. >> hopefully this corresponds with the time that the senate and congress are ready to act. thank you for highlighting the importance of these bills and the importance to the american people, employees, and the economy. the record will remain open for two weeks in which the senators asked to submit any questions for the record. upon receipt, the witnesses are asked to submit answers as soon as possible. there may be question submitted to our witnesses and we ask you to respond as quickly as you can. this concludes the hearing and i thank again the witness is for appearing today. this hearing is adjourned. [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. visit ncicap.org] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2020] [inaudible] >> coming up live on wednesday, the house returns at noon for general speeches, than it to :00 p.m. to take up bills regarding veterans health care and missing persons and unidentified remains of migrants. it is also possible members work on a package that funds the government next year. at c-span2, the senate is back to consider a nomination for a u.s. district judge for eastern tennessee. , the senatec-span3 homeland security on alleged irregularities in the 2020 election with ken starr among the witnesses. at 2:00, a senate subcommittee holds a hearing on u.s. refugees from hong kong. >> listen to c-span's podcast "the weekly." this week, zach smith joins us to discuss the race and i was second congressional district called for the republican by six votes. the contest will be decided by the house of representatives. where you getly" your podcasts. >> next, a discussion on foreign policy challenges and top global risks facing the incoming biden administration. james clapper, former director of national intelligence, joined this conversation hosted by the atlantic council. it is 40 minutes. >> i wanted to give you a taste of how we are looking at 2021. myself as well as my assistant director will go through the opportunities we see for the coming year. i have the bad cop role to go through some of the risks, and

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