Transcripts For CSPAN Washington Journal 06142019 20240714

Briany Justice Centers kelsey discuss efforts to legally challenge labor unions. And we will take your calls, and you can join can join the conven facebook and twitter. Washington journal is next. Host good morning. It is friday, june 14, 2019. Welcome to washington journal. It is flag day, President Trumps birthday and he considered continues to regardingiticism information on political information coming from a foreign country, information on a political opponent. We will play you the president s comments in a moment. How concerned are you more broadly on the issue of foreign meddling in campaign 2020 . If you are concerned, the line to call is 2027488000. If you are not all that concerned, the line is 2027488001. Already a number of tweets on the issue. We will read some of those in a moment. That is cspanwj. We welcome your posts on facebook as well. Front page this morning of the analysis ofes, and the story with the headline three words revive fervor over trumprussia ties. With some offthecuff remarks in the overall office, he has thrust his relationship with moscow into the debate. Mr. Trumps defiant declaration that i would take it if russia offered campaign help and his assertion he would not necessarily tell the fbi about bipartisan condemnation, fueling calls for legislation requiring emboldening democrats seeking impeachment. The furor shifted the conversation in washington away from obstruction of justice back to the original issue that dog original since his campaign in 2016. Comments renewed questions about his willingness to profit from the aid of a hostile foreign power. That is part of the story from the reporting of the new york times. Are7488000 if you concerned about foreign interference in campaign 2020. If you are not all that concerned, 2027488001. Istwitter at cspanwj, here what fred had to say. So is hillary, she bought information from a foreign source about her opponent and you know it came straight from the russian government. He has openly admitted he welcomes foreign and ference interference in our election. He must be impeached. Your comments at cspanwj are welcome. The interview with George Stephanopoulos is set to air in its entirety on abc sometime in the coming week. Here are the comments in the interview that are getting the attention. [video clip] position. Rself in a you are a congressman and someone says i have information on your opponent, do you call the fbi . I dont think in my whole life i have ever called the fbi. You dont call the fbi, you throw somebody out of office. Al gore got a stolen briefing book and he called the fbi. This is somebody that said we have information on your opponent. Let me call the fbi. Give me a break. That doesnt happen. Isthe fbi director said that what should happen. The fbi director is wrong. Should they accept it or call the fbi . I think maybe you do both. I think you might want to listen. If somebody called from a country norway, we have information on your opponent, i think i would want to hear it. You want that kind of interference in our elections . It is not interference. They have information, i think i would take it. Posted, tweeted by the chair of the federal election commission. This is ellen who tweeted i would not have thought i needed to say this. In a statement regarding illegal contributions from Foreign Governments from the federal election commission, let me make something 100 clear to the American Public and Anyone Running for office, it is illegal for any person to receive anything of value from a Foreign National in connection with a u. S. Election. Election intervention has been considered unacceptable since the beginnings of our nation. Our Founding Fathers sounded the alarm about foreign info foreign interference and influence. When Foreign Governments seek to influence politics, it is always to advance their own interest. Anyone who accepts foreign assistance risks being on the wrong end of a federal investigation. Any Political Campaign that receives an offer of a pull prohibited donation should report that to the federal bureau of investigation. If you are concerned about foreign meddling, that line is 2027488000. If you are not all that concerned, that number is 2027488001. This is mike in new jersey, good morning. Caller good morning and thank you for your show. Windtr wind trout aub information your guest conveyed was where the narrative goes wrong is information. First of all, trump said he would accept information. What, for example, would happen if a Foreign Government said Bernie Sanders was an active member of the communist party in the 1960s. Would that be deemed in the same light that this criticism of trump is essentially viewed . The assumption being is that the information a Foreign Government is conveying is nefarious. It could be useful. I think that is the reason you wait to respond before contacting the fbi to know, essentially the nation of nature of the information before jumping the gun it is russian influence. Host lets hear from willy next. Annapolis, maryland. Caller the first caller must be screwed out of his head to make a comment like that. A country like russia, you should not take that kind of influence. What this president did, i have always believed everybody is innocent until proven guilty. I think this president has hung himself and i think it is time these chicken livers in the Republican Party stop acting like chicken livers and stand. Our country and democracy comes first. Not pat is next in ohio, all that concerned about foreign interference. Good morning. Caller good morning. He was asked a hypothetical question and gave a hypothetical answer and the media went wild with it. E said nothing wrong if it is something serious, call. He fbi the media takes it and runs with it. It is such a nonstory. You watch any of the cable shows sunit is walltowall from up to sun down, nothing but russia and negative trump. Storynnot find a positive on those two networks and this is just another nonstory. That is my comment. Host this is the front page of the Washington Times. Democrats pursue trump or on taking foreign dirt. House lawmakers calling for impeachment. Writeses right democrats pounced after trump offered more proof the president is ethically deficient. They try to speed a bill to the senate that would require president ial campaigns to report to the fbi any offers of foreign assistance. Republican said the bill was overly broad and ill considered. Democrats said they would try again last week because the comment was too outrageous to go by without response from congress. With thel story headline clinton opened the Opposition Research help from abroad. Hillary clinton endorsed the idea of obtaining political dirt from overseas saying her campaigns kremlin source dossier was part of what happens in a campaign. President trump is taking heat from democrats for telling abc news on wednesday he would listen to negative information from foreign country about a political opponent, that is basically the same position clinton took when interviewed on november 1, 2017 on the daily show. A week earlier the nation learned the Christopher Steele dossier with a dozen conspiracy charges was financed by the Clinton Campaign and the Democratic National committee. Read more at Washington Times. Com. This is gary calling from california. Caller hello. How are you today . Host fine, thank you. Is any my question here candidate weather for president of thiss been convicted crime . Has anyone ever been charged and convicted of this crime . Secondly, we can take what of whendon said to everybody he said we need to clean the swamp. I would say the swamp goes deeper than everybody thought. Joanne. Chigan, go ahead with your comment. If , yes, i am concerned, but not only about the foreign, but i am also concerned about the domestic, like the democrats. As far as the fbi i am sorry. I dont trust them anymore. I would love to see term limits. Have a good day. Host this is from the wall street journal this morning, campaigns face risk of hacking. We are asking broadly how concerned are you about foreign meddling in campaigns. Campaigns face risk of hacking and they write many 2020 president ial campaigns face challenges buffing cyber attacks. Later in the argue article they write they have already assigned Foreign Forces that campaign are surfacing. Microsofts Threat Intelligence identified hacks become advisors to campaigns. Microsofts Senior Vice President of Customer Security and trust said we are seeing activity by the same russian actors that we saw target 2016 and 2018. Read more at wsj. Com. This is anthony in new york, not all that concerned about foreign meddling. Hi, anthony. Caller hi. Passing concerned about the law because how many Illegal Immigrants and authors that are not supposed to vote because of the law are going to be able to vote . Host is that it . There . , are you still caller yes. Host go ahead. Comments on immigration reflected in a tweet by mylan burke at cspanwj. He is watching breitbart with the story half a million illegal aliens expected to be freed into the u. S. By trumps dhs this year. Politico. Com, Republican Trump for being open to republicans h trump for being open to gop senators vowed they would immediately turn to the fbi when approached if approached with foreign dirt. There is what Lindsey Graham had to say. [video clip] that is not the right answer. If a Foreign Government comes to you and offers to help your campaign, giving you anything of value whether it be money or information, the right answer is no. I have been consistent about that and i am hoping some of my doubt democratic colleagues will take more seriously the act Christopher Steele was Foreign Agent paid for by the Democratic Party together dirt on trump. We do not want to send a signal to encourage it. That is why i think looking at process is important. What are the implications of the president of the United States saying it is okay to accept foreign dirt about an opponent . I think it is a mistake. I think it is a mistake of law. I dont want to send a signal to encourage this and i hope my democratic colleagues will be equally offended by the fact that this did happen in 2016. Suggestedsident also members of congress do the same thing by accepting foreign information. I can only speak for myself. I have never had a government, up to me and say i would like to have i would like to be in your campaign. You have got a situation in 2016 that don jr. Sat down with somebody to have information and that was a mistake. It is not a crime to have a meeting, it is a crime to have information and apparently that did not happen. Christopher steele was hired by fusion gps as paid for by the Democrat Party and his dossier. As unverified to this date i want to look at all of it and i want us to come out of the election with bright lines that no party should be hiring foreign nations Foreign Agents to look at their opponents. Host how concerned are you about foreign meddling in campaign 2020 . 2027488000 if you are concerned. If not so much, 2027488001. We go to john in chantilly, virginia. Caller good morning. Thank you for taking my call. Am i concerned . You are damn right i am concerned. I am so deeply offended by this president saying he would get information from a Foreign Government. I am 57 years old and there are two countries i have always always known my life are against america, china and russia. And when we ask for information about how to damage our elections and people from ohio just like that caller from ohio, this talking point about Hillary Clinton needs to be stopped. Furthermore, i am crying inside that when i listen to mitch he willl yesterday not answer one question about the reporters. This is not how we run our country. The gentleman who worked for the state his soninlaw worked for the white house. We need to wake up america. This is not how our country is and we need to stand up. Every senator yesterday, how they respond to the question. I am disappointed in our lawmakers defending what they have seen, they are twisting everything and i am tired of it. God help us, that is all i have to say. Host lets hear from jerry in texas. Caller thank you for taking my call this morning. I was forked in it enough in 2014 to catch the 95th communist Party Convention at the university of chicago, illinois. I am wondering, are you going to have it this year . 21st, 22nd, 23rd of june in chicago. Host you are asking if we will cover that . Caller yes. Checked on google and found out where it is at and when it is going to be. Host i suggest you check out our website and you can sign up for email alerts. It is possible. We cover all sorts of Political Party gatherings and conventions and it is getting to be that time of the season. Keep your eye on cspan. Org. The communists in this country versus the communists in russia or china . Host what was your question about that . Caller wouldnt that be interfering in our elections here, the communist party in usa more so than russia or chinas communist parties . Host we will see what some of your fellow callers think. Thank you for calling. This is miley. Good morning. Molly, hi, my name is and i agree with the lady that called earlier from michigan. I am originally from michigan, but i have been down here 45 years. I dont believe our president meant that he would take foreign interference. He said if he got a phone call, he would answer the phone, listen to what they said and if it was wrong, he would probably call the fbi. I think our biggest interference in the elections is the media and the democrats. If anybody was to vote for a democrat, they would be crazy in their head because they are children. E spoiled that is all i have got to say. Host we will get our first look at the president ial candidates in the debates coming up the end of june. Candidates. Bate the dnc said three candidates failed to qualify for the june 26, 27 debates. Steve bullock, seth moulton, and wayne met some. The two nights of debates will feature 10 candidates and could help win over the large field of contenders. The first debate, first republican president ial debate attracted 24 million viewers, offering an indication of the potential viewing off audience. Nbc news, which is broadcasting debates, plans to reveal the two groups for debates on friday. Both nights will include a mix of leading contenders including joe biden, Bernie Sanders, peteh warren, meet buttigieg, and Kamala Harris and canada to have been struggling to poll above 1 . Just a quick note to qualify for the first democratic debates, candidates had to garner at donors65 65,000 including a minimum of 200 in each of 20 states or 1 support in a national or early primary poll. That is the qualification of the 20th the order they will be shown or facing each other in miami on the 26th and 27th. Asking you about election interference, foreign meddling. This is robert. Good morning. Thank you for letting me call in. I tell you what, i can just not understand this country anymore. Mr. Trump is trying all he can do to get this country straightened out. He does or says, it is always taken ass backwards. Democrats, i would never vote for any of them. They are nothing but trouble. They are talking about global warming. This is in the last day because god says all of this is going to happen. They are blinded to the truth and that is what we have today. Host we welcome your comments on twitter. cspanwj. One viewer tweeting russia already infiltrated the executive branch and senate. Foreign nations pursue their own interests, not our own. Political fix, politics fix says russia sent the Trump Campaign a dossier full of rumors and the campaign leaked that campaign. Would that be illegal . Giving a free pass to any democrat working with china while republicans work with russia. There was a move to introduce legislation prohibiting some level of foreign information. It was introduced tried to be introduced by senator mark warner of virginia. Here is a look. [video clip]. Think for a moment think for just a moment about what donald trump said yesterday from the oval office. And a president s words from the. Val office still carry weight the president of the united thiss said everybody does goodness gracious, the modern father of the Republican Party, ronald reagan, must be spinning in his grave. Mr. President , i am not here to relitigate 2016. I am here to make sure we do our to and we honor that oath protect and defend the constitution against all enemies, foreign and domestic. I dont know about you, but i recall the actions of russia over the last few years i would call the actions of russia over the last few years the actions of a foreign enemy. We also have the obligation to make sure we protect the integrity of our election system. Lets take off our democratic and republican hat and lets Work Together to pass legislation. Lets pass some basic guardrails around social media so we are not manipulated on future elections and lets go ahead and put an obligation on all president ial campaigns Going Forward that if they see evidence of foreign intervention, they report it appropriately. Host that was democratic senator mark warner trying to introduce legislation on the senate floor. The effort was blocked by republicans. [video clip] while the goal is to make doe that never, ever, ever we have a Foreign Government interfering. It was wrong in 2016. It was wrong in 2018, it was wrong about 2020. That is why we need to make certain we do not have this kind of interference. No one wont, foreign interference of any type in our government in any way, shape, or form. To my friend across the aisle, we did not like it when we heard former president obama say to david medvedev tell vladimir i will have more flexibility after the election. We did not appreciate that. We did not appreciate when the Clinton Foundation and uranium 1 and all of that was transpiring in 2015. The legislation presented is overbroad and this is something that should be done in a thoughtful way, i partisan way, and i yield the floor. Host our live Senate Coverage on cspan 2. Asking you how concerned are you about foreign interference in the 2020 campaign . If you are concerned, 2027488000. If you are not all that concerned, 2027488001. Some other stories we are keeping their ion on. U. S. Planes i tack attack on iran. An attack thursday on two International Oil tankers left off the iranian coast, which left one ship billowing black smoke and forced crews to latest ship only the in a series of attacks instigated by the Islamic Republic of iran and surrogates against americans and allied interests. There is an updated piece to this that happened overnight or early this morning. This is from reuters reporting on if the u. S. Released video, it says that shows irans military recovering a mine. The military released a video that said showed irans revolutionary guard removing an unexploded mine from the center of a japanese owned oriole tanker. Oil other stories this morning overseas from the Financial Times and who is next in the prime ministers chair. Johnson clears first hurdle to be next u. K. Prime minister writing that he won an initial vote of the conservative party. As a result they say leaves 6 other contenders battling for second place and the prospect of going headtohead with mr. Johnson in the final stage of the contest to be decided next month by about 160,000 party members. One more piece from you Sarah Sanders, the president sector press secretary stepping down. This is a look at the Washington Times with Sarah Sanders on the dais with the president yesterday. The press secretary who defended President Trumps policies ishts with steely resolve stepping down from her post at the end of the month. She told reporters she would not rule out a run for governor in arkansas. On her departure, the president tweeted she is a very special person with extraordinary talent who has done an incredible job. I hope she decides to run for governor. She would be fantastic. Thank you. Great job, well done. Lets get to your calls on the 2020 campaign. Your calls on foreign interference. Caller i just find it funny i thought it was russian terming, but they use the meddling, its almost like steel or aluminum or Christopher Steele. According to devon nunez, the department of justice has been to create or prosecute people. If you read all these reports beple put out, we should looking at uranium 1, which is a meddle. Sold uranium fields to the russians so maybe that is meddle or dirt. Dirt. I feel like we are focusing on the wrong thing. Hillary is just as guilty as russians. Ing with the they were trying to be president and that is what a president does. He is a foreign representative. If you represent the state of california or any other state, are you considered foreign or what about the u. N. . Host we will go to maurice next in florida. Good morning. Caller appreciate your show. Just wanted to say i think a lot of this is overblown and overdone and rife with political angling. If you look at the mueller report, it does not really come up with any substantial specifics and even the indictments of the russians was ,lmost entirely minor nonspecific things such as attempts at identity theft, setting up some failed rallies and some social media posting. Bob muellers report only came up with some really light, insignificant indictments. I think that tells us the whole foreign meddling thing is much ado about not much. Pointed out i believe on facebook there were rallies organized by foreign entities now traced back to the russians. This is a new element into campaigns over the last couple cycles. Do you think the responsibility to fix those issues lie with Companies Like facebook and google or do they lie with us . Do they rely with government regulation and more oversight of those entities. Caller that is a tricky question. I think the social Media Companies have an obligation to not let completely fraudulent, fake personality identities, organizations set up on their platform and basically commit some level of fraud. Ultimately, it is kind of buyer beware or Facebook User beware. I think people are becoming more educated and in general, the population is pretty sophisticated as to identifying fake news versus reality. It all comes down to once again, i dont think there has been a Single Person identified. Surely there would be one person or 10 people that would say i was influenced by facebook ads or i went to that rally and changed my vote. There has not been a Single Person identified as influenced in any way. Host point our viewers and listeners in the direction of a hearing. I believe yesterday we covered what are called deke fake deep fake videos, a hearing looking into phony videos on youtube, facebook, and elsewhere. Another story from the campaign trail happened in washington. The headline from the you the associated press. The democratic president ial candidate John Hickenlooper on thursday attacked Bernie Sanderss vision of an america remade under democratic socialism and chastised others in the 2020 race for not repudiating that political philosophy. The former colorado governor said sanders was wrong to call for policies such as medicare for all that would dramatically increase public spending and government involvement in americans lives. We covered that speech yesterday at the National Press club. Bethlehem, pennsylvania. Caller hello. The gentleman that spoke said there is nothing in the mueller report. Obviously he never read it. It shows there were over 100 offenses of drunk people speaking with russian government agents. Government officials. What i wanted to say mostly was when they had the democratic vention, mostdonald trump is the dangerous person in the United States. He is the worst citizen of the state of new york. He refused to pay people, has no credit, cannot get credit from the american bank. What is wrong with the right wing . Host we will hear from glenn in oakfield, maine. Not all that concerned about foreign meddling. Good morning. Caller good morning. I kind of agree with the caller earlier who asked whether it was the government. I agree that it is buyer beware. If there is dirt on an opponent or on anyone and if the information is true, i believe the American People have a right to hear that information. Maine. Hat is glenn from a story about politics in maine, headline at thehill. Com. Susan collins announces senate bid. Former maine gubernatorial candidate betsy sweet announced she is challenging senator Susan Collins for her senate seat. She has directed the maine womens lobby expressed support for abortion rights, health care for all, and fighting Climate Change in her announcement speech. We say good morning to carol. What are your concerns about foreign interference in our elections . Caller hello. Host you are on the air. Go ahead, carol. Caller i think President Trump was right. You had all these paid lobbyists from Foreign Countries in d. C. And all those senators take. Tuff from them they go into office, some of them, modestly rich and come out billionaires. Where does all the money come from . Callsedly on what they meager salary always asking for raises and here you have them leaving office as billionaires. To jason innext albuquerque, new mexico. Caller i appreciate your show and the conversation we are having altogether. I am curious as to when did hypotheticals become Headline News . If youd asking someone found a suitcase with 1 million should you take it to the police or take it home . I would call the police, maybe i should, maybe i should not. Should that person go to jail . When did the facts not come into play anymore . Journalism the paper and the reporters and the investigative reporters would get the facts before they run with the story. Look at watergate, there is no way they wouldve been able to catch Richard Nixon if the reporters did not do their homework. There is not any homework being done on both sides. People are running with torches and setting places on fire. I am disappointed in our journalistic organizations and especially with all the hypothetical talk we are hearing like saying he should be impeached based on hypotheticals. I think this story is ridiculous. Host the issue has come up in several capitol hill hearings. Most recently in the judiciary committee. I want to show you Patrick Lahey questioning Christopher Wray about foreign contacts with political groups. Here is a look. [video clip] if a Foreign Government offers assistance to a political , what would you, as director of the fbi, if you discovered it, ask that campaign to do . As i think i said even back to my confirmation hearing before the Senate Judiciary committee. That isat is white why i asked the question. If any public official or number of a campaign is ortacted by any nationstate anybody acting on behalf of a nationstate about influencing or interfering with our election, that is something the fbi would want to know about. They did not make such things available to the fbi and you found out about it later, would that trouble you . As i said, we like to make sure people tell us information promptly so we can take appropriate steps to protect the American People. Host how concerned are you about foreign meddling in campaign 2020 . If you are concerned, 2027488000. If you are not concerned, 2027488001. Inside the washington post, their continuation of the story with a research stance. Trump upends election norms. A spokesman for trumps Reelection Campaign told cbs ands red and blue thursday night the campaign viewed the president s words as a directive to deal with offers of foreign assistance on a casebycase basis read he said he would likely do both, listen to what they have to say, but also report it to the fbi. Candidates have historically shied away from foreign associations governed in part by federal election law, which prohibits Foreign Nationals from contributing to u. S. Campaigns or making election expenditures. Those restrictions are bit built on the longstanding principle. Elections should be fear from foreign interference. We also want to remind you the actual president ial campaign of donald trump for reelection is getting underway. He will officially kick it off next tuesday night, the 18th and we will cover that in Orlando Florida coming up tuesday the 18th. We will have live coverage. Caller thank you for taking my call this morning. I am on the opinion laws are on the books that prevent Foreign Countries interfering with our elections or purchasing representatives to support that. I feel these laws are on the books for a reason. I would point back to your comment of the Founding Fathers making these laws way, way back. The problem i see with this interference is number one, it breaks the law. Number 2, it eats away and erodes the foundations of our democracy and furthermore, i feel these this erosion of our democracy is a slippery slope that erodes the rule of law in our country and i feel donald trump has probably never stopped taking advice from Foreign Countries and i would point to helsinki and why there is so much secrecy around his conversations with the likes of host your choice of words, erosion of the rule of law, where do you think this erosion began . Did it begin with donald trump . Caller i certainly think it has begun far, far back in our nations history. Withched this take place nixon. I have seen this take place with the likes of goldwater and it seems to me republicans will do anything to win an election regardless of whether it is gerrymandering, taking foreign contributions for elections. This is just plain wrong and i think there is a long history on the side of the Republican Party in terms of doing anything to restrict voters from actually voting and i think this erodes the confidence we have as a nation and our elections and wants that confidence once that confidence that they will be free and clear takes place in our national psyche, we are falling into putins plans for our country. Host we will go next to pat in new jersey. Caller good morning. I would like for someone to define in this age of globalization what is meant by foreign interference and foreign meddling. You have Foreign Television stations on our cable systems. We can watch bbc, russia today. What is meant by russian interference when people can go across borders, talk to anyone, anywhere . What if someone from canada came down and said i have information on soandso. You are going to call that foreign interference . Host what do you think crosses that line . When do you think information from a sorin foreign source, whether a country or a person to a political candidate, whether it be president ial or candidate for senate or the house . Caller i think it really is based on situations. You dont know what is happening. Christopher steele, british national. No one is upset he was interfering in our elections. What do you call interfering . Arent americans able to consider all sources, foreign and domestic, and makeup their minds . As long as we are not voting on the internet, i dont see where the interference is going to come. Host jay in North Carolina says trump is far from perfect, but the other choice is a democrat who hates the country and wants to undermine its founding. Anything for trump justifies the illegal means. This is fundamental to understanding the man without scruple. This viewer says i am so concerned i am not donating to any little activity or campaign. Struggle to see don answer questions. Anthony says this is accepted by party, who used to be the Republican Party. Thisny is talking about story in the new york times, federal agency urges trump to fire conway over violations. Government agency recommended President Trump fire Kellyanne Conway for repeated violations of an ethics law barring partisan political politics from the workplace. Conway ay called mrs. Repeat offender of the hatch act, which prevents political employees from engaging in politics at work saying her defiance of the law justified her dismissal from the white house. To woodbridge, virginia, we hear from kim. Caller hi, good morning. Host good morning. Caller i first want to comment on the caller talking about erosion of our norms and national institutions. I think part of this stems from the fact that we have not had good civics classes in schools for years and years and there is a generation of people and maybe people kinda forget what the Founding Fathers did and why they did it. These institutions that are meant to protect us are mostly holding today except when a president or someone in power throws things out to undermine that authority. Yes, there are issues with the fbi, but the fbi who are we going to trust . If we get information from a foreign country, are we the ones that are supposed to decide if it is true or not . At least people like steele. They keep bringing him up related to hillary, he did go to the fbi. He said here is this information, let me handed over to the fbi and you guys deal with it. Fbiave a nonpartisan whether people believe it or not. They are nonpartisan believe career people. We need to have a central person to do that. Can i make another comment . Host sure. Isler with regard to what interference and what is foreign issue relates to whether or not our country can. E compromised someone running for president of the United States, certainly. Congressmen, senators, anyone that can be bought from a foreign country, namely an enemy of the United States who could therefore influence our policies. Someone who could influence our policies by their vote in favor of that foreign country, that is where you cross the line and information is the same as money. If the president of the United States appears to be super friendly and cozying up with russia and he is a businessman who frankly, did not appear to want to be president , but really wanted to boost his business, why wouldnt he protect russia . Russia must have something on him. Fishys why it seems so and hard to understand why half the country does not see that. Thank you for taking my call. Host to las vegas next, candace. Caller hi. Hank you for taking my call i am not really as concerned with foreign meddling in our elections as i am with how negative we have become as a nation. We spent so much time and effort tearing apart our Foreign Relations and instead, we focus on the positive aspects of what ifse global powers could do we were able to use these Foreign Relations to fight things like global poverty and the diminishing education levels. It would be so much more beneficial for the entire globe. Host in terms of president been, has President Trump beneficial for our Foreign Relations, at least with our major allies or has it had a negative effect, in your view . , i feelmy personal view like, overall, he has been beneficial with meeting with different powers and kind of bonding together the Foreign Relations. However, his own citizens spend so much time tearing him down that i also feel like he cannot really accomplish too much without the support of his own people. Host appreciate that. Michelle is next in michigan. You are on the air. Caller thank you. I cannot hardly believe people that dont care if other countries are interfering with our elections. I cannot fathom that. To have your country turned into a russian socialist state because of russian interference like a prime example is giving away our uranium for personal gain. Beyond me why that has not been brought up in court because that blatant, buying off elections for specific treatment. I dont know. I just dont get it. I dont understand why people arent concerned about that number one issue, having somebody take away our freedom in any way, shape, or form. Host another story this morning from fox news with their headline, duncan hunters wife pleads guilty to corruption charge and faces five years in prison. The wife of representative duncan hunter, of california, faces up to five years in prison after pleading guilty thursday to one count of corruption in a case that has cast a shadow over the congressmans career. Margaret hunter and her husband are accused of spending 250,000 dollars for golf outings, trips to italy and hawaii, school tuition, theater tickets, and other expenses between 2009 and 2016. Both were indicted on 60 criminal counts and trying to conceal illegal spending. Initiallyssmans wife pleaded not guilty, but she decided to change her plea at the last minute. A little more than five minutes on your calls and comments on campaign 2020. How concerned are you over foreign meddling . We hear from william in massachusetts. Caller hi. This logic on russia is kind of strange with russian meddling. Look at elected officials. We have elected officials here and Hillary Clinton, for example. Has plenty of contacts over the decades with russia. Deals with russia, talking with russia, et cetera. You have anide, unelected official, donald trump, who has no politics policy talks ever with russia. Of course russia would want to try to contact in the trunk campaign to find out what their stances are. One more point for logic reasons, look at kelsey gabbert. Biden contacting russia means he cannot be elected . William. Y, among the many responses, president ial candidates and others on this story. The leading democratic candidate, joe biden, the former Vice President tweeting this, President Trump is once again welcoming foreign interference in our elections. This isnt about politics, it is a threat to our National Security. An american president should not seek their aid and abet those who seek to undermine democracy. Lets go to mary in pennsylvania. Caller yes. You dont let foreign people get involved in your elections. What is wrong with these people . Foreign peoples opposition is us. They are against us. Other than that, it could be false information. It could be a poison pill for you. If trump was smart, the first tell thewould do is fbi. What is wrong with these people . The more important fact is when you listen to them call or talk about it, i am astounded how they believe things that are untrue. I am also astounded how you dont call them out on it. I hear people talk about uranium 1, they are listening to this bubble and they think it is a democrat media inspired conspiracy. This is crazy talk. He went on National Television and said he would welcome help from russia and said his own fbi guy is wrong and they go on fox news and almost say he did not say it and these people believe it. It is crazy talk. Host that is larry from pennsylvania. We will hear from bob in texas. Caller good morning. I am worried there is not one person who represents us who is not violating the constitution. We have a specific contract. And every500 words one of them is violating it. The ignorance of our populace is dontstounding and we hold them to the written words of our constitution. The main thing i am getting at is in the preamble, there is 5 words. It shall provide for the common defense and article 4, there is 7 words, protect each against invasion. There is not one legislator anywhere in america. Federal, state, any state that oath toviolating that protect that part of our constitution, the reason our states united and heaven knows we are not a democracy. Democracyrs speared host appreciate your input. Get a couple more calls before we wrap this segment. We go to gloria in indianapolis. Morning. Ood i cannot believe these people would not be concerned about. Nterference in our elections a lot of these countries want to overthrow the United States. Why would they be coming to somebody with some information . It seems like the people arent even thinking clearly. Why wouldnt you be concerned about the country and people interfering. I dont understand this. It is crazy. I agree with the other caller that called in saying this is crazy, they believe everything. Trump is not god. He cannot say what people are host greg from wisconsin, not that concerned about foreign meddling. Lastr to address the caller, we need to look no further than Hillary Clinton and the dossier. I am more concerned about domestic interference, george soros and marijuana. All he wants to do is follow the money. Northern virginia, the two congresspeople that were just elected, and in this next election, everybody on the democrats side will want to legalize marijuana. It is all money behind george soros. Its is the problem we have. It is not foreign interference. George soros funded groups are trying to destroy the republic democratic system we have and take things over. Host appreciate that. More of your calls and comments ahead. We are joined by pete winner, a , aeran of 3 peter wehner veteran of three president ial campaigns. Later, we will be joined by mark janus, the lead plaintiff in the case janice v afscme, and we will talk about labor challenges to labor unions. The house will be in order. Cspan hasears, providing america unfiltered coverage of congress, the white house, Supreme Court, and Public Policy events from washington, d. C. And around the country, so you can make up your own mind. Cspan is brought to you by your local cable or satellite provider. Cspan, your unfiltered view of government. When we think of Winston Churchill, we think the older man sending young men into war, but no one knew better, and few knew as well the realities of devastation. Or and he said to his mother after the second war, the raw comes through. You cannot tilt it. He knew the disaster that war was. Sunday night on cue and day, Candace Malan talks about Winston Churchill in her book. He says, give me a regimen. I want to go and fight, so he ends up going with a regimen to pretoria on the day it fell to the british, and he takes over the prison and he freeze the men who had been his frees the former had been his dutch fellow prisoners, and watch as the flag is torn down and the union jack is hoisted in its place. Sunday night at 8 00 p. M. Eastern on q a. Washington journal continues. Wehner,at thus is peter thats with us is peter wehner, with us is peter wehner, out with a new book. Ae cover of your book is picture of a freed flag. Frayed flag. Fraying of think the politics in our country started . Guest i argue in the book that a lot of these trends that are troublesome in politics, the polarization, anger, acrimony, deathmatch mindset predates donald trump. I do fault him for having accelerated all of the worst friends. Most of the worst trends in american politics all of the worst trends. Most of the worst trends in american politics have occurred in the last 30 years, and i do not recall a time with this much antipathy when the temperature has been as high as it has been. Host you wrote in the book that day one, you were opposed to donald trump as president is a veteran republican. When did you come to the conclusion that politics are dead, and what do you mean by the death of politics . Guest i am a person of the Christian Faith so i believe in life after death. There is an alarm bell to this book, because what i mean by the death of politics as some of the best of the american traditions are dying. My supposition in the book is that politics matters a lot. Politics is a complicated thing. It has downsides and dark sides. There are people who lack integrity. At the same time, there are people with integrity who were trying to help the country. Politics is finally and fundamentally about justice. The only way to pursue justice and an important way to do it. If a country gets its politics wrong, there will be a huge human cost. So much of what we love can be swept away if politics goes, and if you get politics right, that allows for Human Flourishing and Human Dignity to be advanced. What i am worried about is a sense i get from people and you may too just from cspan, listening to callers a sense of cynicism and fatalism, there is nothing we can do. Explainook, i try and what we can do on a practical level, but in a deeper sense i try and untangle what politics is, and the attitudes toward it and how we as citizens have to andge our view of politics what we can do to recover it. Host you are with the ethics and Public Policy center. You spent time with three Republican Administrations with reagan, bush, and george w. Bush , but when did your interest in politics start . Were you a republican from the start . Guest i have had two abiding passions since i was yet i was a young kid, politics and sports. Growing up, i grew up in Washington State and we had a cabin in the Cascade Mountains and we used to go there every weekend. ,e would listen to the radio the news, and i would talk to my parents about what was on the news, just fascinated. When i was growing up, the vietnam war, the impeachment of war inthe arabisraeli 1973, on and on. Those things interested me. In junior high and high school, social studies classes were the most interesting to me. I remember having debates with my teachers. I was conservative, mostly because my parents were, and often happens. My teachers were liberals. We had good discussions, interesting discussions. That is when my interest began. Book, the story in the when i went to the university of washington, which is where i went to school, and i used to go to the library which is majestic , the library at the university, and often on friday and saturday nights when other people are out doing social things, i would listen to speeches by john f. Kennedy and bobby kennedy, because i was struck by the beauty of their language. I began to memorize some of those speeches unintentionally. It wasnt like i didnt have a social life, but parts of politics interested me. Some people get involved in politics because they like the competition, they are interested in the party apparatus. They become a democrat or republican for life and are loyal to the party. For me, politics was about the human drama. I was fascinated by the intersection of ideas and people , and how ideas can shape history. I was a conservative before i was a republican. Host peter wehner, his new book the death of politics, how to heal our frayed republic after trump. Republicans, 202 7488001. Democrats, 202 7488000. Independents and all others, 202 7488002. You can also send us a tweet. Ever a part you opposed President Trump from the beginning but once he was nominated do used to back and say, i am open to giving him a chance, as a republican . Host more even as an american than a republican. Anybody who cares about their country of loves it once the president to succeed and do well for the sake of the country, and i hope i was open to having him prove me wrong. I am certainly willing even now as a critic of trump to acknowledge that he has done things that from my perspective have been good. His Court Appointments have been very good. Increased spending on the military has been helpful. His deregulation policies have been somewhat helpful. I think he has made some serious errors in policies and has hurt the country and the social fabric. When i went in, i was hoping he would do well and hoping that he would surprise me. He has not. One of the first prominent republicans to say that i wouldnt support trump under any conditions i write a bimonthly column for the new 2016 and i january said, i wouldnt vote for trump under any circumstances. There was a variety of reasons. One is that i thought he was intellectually and emotionally and psychologically not fit to be president. Second was the way he practiced politics, the inflammation of our politics. Host inflammation. Guest this is a person who would have a divisive presence in our country for sure. Bute andrew jackson, certainly in modern times we have not had anybody who seems to thrive on the visions in acrimony in the country. There seems to be psychic satisfaction that donald trump gets out of causing divisions. The demonization of his cruelty, that has radiating effects. Republicans and conservatives use to agree with me back in the day. They talked a lot about the importance of character in politics and politicians, and also how a culture, a political soldier is dutch culture is central to the health of a country culture is central to the health of a country. Host getting information on foreign entities . Guest that is an illustration. Those are outrageous comments. If any other president had said that, it would be a furor. It is illegal, unethical, unwise. It can trigger mutually assured destruction in our politics because if you have one person, president of the United States who gives a green light to interference by hostile foreign nations and elections, the other side may say we will do it too, and where does it end . I was listening to donald trump give the interview to George Stephanopoulos and the thing that struck me, those comments were a window into his, what i would say is his inverted moral world. For him, what helps him is right by definition and what hurts him is wrong by definition. He doesnt seem to have any kind of objective moral boundaries. There is a moral narcissism. Everything involves, his human relationships, all his actions revolve around whether they help him or not. He is a oneman battering ram against our institutions, against our norms, against integrity. That has a big effect. George will come at the other day host who likewise has a new book out. Guest i have just started it, and it looks very good. Columnist, has been a columnist since the early 1970s, and is a dean of conservative writers. He is a man of distinguished pedigree and intellect, and he said in an interview that the trump is doing to america exceeds what nixon did, and that trump has rung bells that cannot inwrong in terms unrung terms of politics. Line inr independent medford, massachusetts, bob, go ahead. Caller i just wanted to tell a story about my parents. I am in my 70s, so this was a while ago, but they started voting for Franklin Roosevelt back in 1932 and continued until he passed away in 1945. Then they switched over to hermie Truman Harry Truman and voted for him until he lost in 1952 to Dwight Eisenhower. Father,mother and lifelong democrats, swung their support in behind Dwight Eisenhower because as my mother said, it was our country and he was our president. Today, that feeling is gone. It is completely erased from our attitude. Agenda,w our party, our and nobody can object to our plan and our philosophy. It is just out. Nobody listens to each other, and it is very sad. I dont know what the answer is. You go up and down the channels and you know which stations will be pushing out their agenda. It is plain and simple. Trump,ot vote for donald but i support him because he is our president until he does something totally outrageous, but i would ask your guest if he thinks trump has an inverted moral agenda, what did he think of bill clinton . Clinton, i will take that one first, i was a critic of bill clinton actually. I said so at the time publicly. Vocal about those criticisms. Because i made the argument on character matters, i dont think if you look through my history that i have moved at all in terms of the standards that i apply here. A lot of conservatives and republicans have, the same by four touse a two bash bill clinton upside the head and argue integrity matters, and now donald trump, that is not the case with me. I have been a lifelong republican and conservative, so whatever is wrong in my analysis and whatever criticisms one might have of me, hypocrisy is not one that is merited. In terms of the political tribalism the caller describes, i agree and i talk about that in the book. It is more accentuated than at any point. Let me say one thing and i do this in the book and it is important in part because of the criticisms that i have, concerns i have. We have to keep historical context. There is a tendency for all of us to think, whatever age we are in is the worst or best there has ever been. American politics and politics and every free country has always had its rough side. Election wastested a rough fight and almost toward the young republic apart. You had the dual between burr and hamilton, where hamilton was killed. Countrypeople dead in a of roughly 30 million people. Earlyte 1960s and 1970s, riots in the streets, universities being taken over and burned. Kent state, the National Guard shooting. The Democratic National convention in chicago where there was blood in the street. The vietnam war. The research for the book, the 1972d between 1971 and there was an average of five domestic bombings in the United States per day. Odshave had other rough peri and having said that, the tribalism is difficult. Ultimately what we have to do, it is really up to us. The political system is responsive and if citizens at every level stay local and national, and in their put adual lies eyes, premium on integrity, decency, and ethics, we will get that. If we dont do it, then we will get the politics we have. I think a lot of times people say, a look at our politics and say the political system is broken and the country is fine, and that is not right. We have angry and divided politics because we have an angry and divided country, and politics is the arena on which that is playing out. I get a sense from the country there is kind of an exhaustion with this kind of politics. Sometimes in the life of an individual and in the life of a country, there are certain qualities, virtues you take for granted, but when they are stripped from you you realize why they matter, and then you are willing to fight for them and reclaim them. I hope and believe the country will be doing that. This country has a tremendous capacity for self renewal and it is within our power to write wonderful new chapters of the american story, but it is up to us. Ont lets hear from james our democrats line in baltimore. Caller i hope you give me a little bit more time. Has come to perform 40 of americans have in them. It is about greed. I dont care about somebody else. It is not mine. I dont care about you and i dont care what happens, even if there was someone uniting the country. He divides the country. Them, they will tell you lies. They will say, what about obama . That is the only thing that ever bring up, that is the only lie. , what hasd sake Hillary Clinton ever done . You cannot mention a sentence without mentioning that womans name. She has the audacity to run for president and support her husband. Bringing up uranium host i will let you go. Andt to some extent, james people all over america are indicative about the state of politics. You can sense the anger and passion and feeling that one size one side has. The other size does side does not understand, maybe. There is a sense that people who disagree with us are not only wrong but are morally defective. They are by definition almost corrupt. In a sense, this is the deathmatch mindset i was referring to earlier, the feeling that if the other side wins our country will die and wipe away all that we care about. I think that is one of the problems we have. I know the struggles of this. I have been involved in politics a long time. I care about politics. My passions have been stoked up at times and i have had attitudes when upon reflection, i wish they changed i tell of of aecdote i had relationship with joe klein. , very fineolumnist columnist and beautiful writer for newsweek. We met in the 1990s. William bennett. Host the former education secretary. Guest and drugs are for george w. Bush. He was more drug czar for george w. Bush. He was more liberal than i was. I went into the Bush Administration for a variety of reasons. I was Deputy Director of speechwriting and became director of the officer office of admissions. Joe felt i had gone to the dark side and he was critical to me. When i got out of the administration in 2007, i was free to write, i responded, and we had backandforth. You can google our names and see the backandforth. He got angry and there was antipathy and some of the exchanges got too personal. Some people were cheering me on because they agreed with me, disagreed with joe, but i felt like there was something about it that was not right. People who knew me best like my wife thought ultimately that needs to be repaired. Several years later during the obama presidency, i reached out to joe and we had a nice exchange. We met at the Jefferson Hotel in washington, d. C. , and as we were walking, we came from different sides from the hotel, which is probably fitting, and we embraced on the Street Corner almost before a word had been said. We had a wonderful breakfast in conversation and reconnected, but that is an illustration of what can happen when you go out each other politically and have different views. It takes intentionality and real effort. In the book, i tell a lovely greatthat cs lewis, a medievalist and author of childrens stories in 20th century england, he started a group of intellectuals. Hisis book, he talks about first friends and second friends. A first friend is a person who is your alter ego, where if i start a sentence, you can complete it. We all need first friends. That is part of having community. For him, there was a person named arthur graves. He talked about the second friend. The second friend is the antiself. That is the person that reads all the same books as you do but draws all the wrong conclusions. We used to go at it late into the night, trading punches, and almost without knowing it beginning to hear the other person and what they said. The key thing as it relates to politics, the reason i tell the story in the book is both treasured their friendship, in part because they saw the world in a different way. They felt like there were things the other person could teach them, and angle of vision on issues come on reality, on truth that they issues, on reality, on truth, that they wouldnt be able to see otherwise. He said they did not debate for victory, they debated for truth. That is an entirely different way of viewing political debate. What we have to recover is the sense of listening to other people, not necessarily changing your point of view, but trying to learn from them, what might they see that i dont . Host anthony in huntington station, new york, republican line. Caller good morning and thank you for taking my call. I am calling to say a few things about the gentleman here. He is a never trumper. I understand these never trumpers would prefer hillary. You talk about conservative and republican politics, the election of donald trump was a rejection of politics as it was trending. It does not seem to be understood by your guest. You talked about moral narcissism about donald trump. There is a narcissist culture in washington that was redirected, and this man was duly elected by the people of this country to be a wall against that. I just want to know, if you are will voteper now, you for Bernie Sanders or Kamala Harris . I dont get it. I dont get you never trumpers. You call yourself conservative republicans but prefer eight years of hillary. Guest let me try and untangle some of that. In terms of Hillary Clinton i was a critic. I did not vote for her. I did not vote for either one. I am a conservative but i am a critic of trump, and you can be one at the same time. What i have argued in the book and outside the book is precisely because i am a conservative, in some respects i am critical of trump. I did not vote for a liberal. One anthony said i did not understand the election of donald trump was a rejection of politics, i say the opposite in the book. That is part of the explanation for what happened. And i talk about the failures of the Political Class and that there is an enormous amount of frustration in the public with the way politics is practiced, and that is understandable. A lot of things have gone wrong. Culturalout massive and demographic changes, economic shifts on the scale of the industrial revolution. Has gone on increasing polarization in the country. I understand for trump supporters, they viewed him as a wrecking ball against the political system. The question is, is it going to be worse or better because of him . My argument is it is going to be worse. Host on the Political Parties, right that both Political Parties are exhausted and devoid of ideas. Do you think the Republican Party now is the party of donald trump, and the Democratic Party right now it is there is no question that the Republican Party as the party of trixie. I would say his hold on at least a large part of the base is in some respects deeper than even ronald reagan, which is astonishing. This is a man whose entire life prior to becoming the republican nominee was not in the party. He supported democrats, a person of liberal views. He has no acquaintance with conservative ideas. Spend time in politics preview can see in the primaries, he couldnt string together three coherent policy sentences. Party, andn over the as i wrote about and predicted, the party would be transformed into his image, and i think that is problematic. In some respects, and i will just take one issue, say protectionism versus freetrade. That is one conviction that trixie has had pretty much his entire life that trixie bank that trump has had pretty much his entire life. He is against freetrade and is a protectionist instinct for that is why the main aero in his quiver is tariffs. The republicans for decades and decades has been a freetrade party. He is transferring it. He is transforming it. Of the editors of the atlantic, and about a realization of the Democratic Party, and i agree there moving left at and a remarkable rate. You take a person like Bernie Sanders who almost beat Hillary Clinton, did not in part because of the establishment was for her and not for him, but it was a challenge. He is a selfproclaimed democraticsocialist. If you go back and read about his views in the past, they were more radical than today. That is the center of gravity increasingly of the democrats prayed you see it with joe biden. Hadek or two ago, he supported an amendment that said federal funds would not go toward abortion. Roe v. Wade is the law of the land, but no federal funding to go. Biden says he still supported it. Within 24 hours he flipped his position, i think that both parties are in a bad place right now. I think theres a sense they are both exhausted, and they dont have it within their toolkit, policy toolkit to meet the challenge. Having said that, these challenges are enormous. We are going to huge transitions. Anytime a country goes through transitions that we are, there is dislocation. Politics cannot solve all of that. Host our guest, another half hour or so on his new book the death of politics how to heal our frayed republic after trump. Democrats, 202 7488000; republicans, 202 7488001, independents, 202 7488002, and all others, 202 7488003. We welcome brian. Caller we have globalized everything on the economic front, and now i would like to talk about how it has affected our Political Parties, and it seems like we have these internationalists that control vast pools of wealth, and they are not really having any allegiance to any country. They just float around the world doing business, making profits. They are putting lots of money into the american electoral system. I have read many stories about all of the saudi money floating around washington and how that affects our foreign policy, plus the is release. It used to be plus the israelis. Our two parties used to be more like. When my dad was a young man in the 50s, eisenhower really wasnt a right wing, yes he was prolabor unions in some respects. Now we have sold out the american worker. You are for freetrade, but we have traded our jobs away for cheaper goods. Now for most americans, their standard of living is not improving. It is harder to make a living as an average joe here. Our Political Parties dont care about average joe. They think average joe is just some ignorant person, doesnt really understand anything, all we got to do is when his vote when election comes. Meantime, but politicians are focused on is money, get money. Host we will hear from pete. There are a couple of issues. I agree with what brian has said about the perfect asian, its called the purification of parties. Purification of parties. Purified, they are more polarized that it in the more provide then since the civil war. When i first came to washington, in 19 the 80s in the 1980s and in the 1990s, you had overlaps. Bob packwoode like and chuck percy, liberal republicans, Daniel Patrick moynihan, some democrats who are more conservative peer that allowed parties to engage each other for a variety of reasons that has changed. Makes compromise compromise more difficult. There are other factors. In terms of globalization, i appreciate that. I would be a little less cavalier about cheap goods. Bad thing. Is not a consumers would rather pay for things that are cheaper than more expensive for the globalization of the economy is Going Forward whether we want it or not. There are a lot of benefits to that. As you make advancements in an economy and as some kind of professions die, it creates dislocation. When he went from the age of the horse and buggy to automobiles, generally most people say that was good. But if you are in the horse business, it would be a difficult time, and you would have to have some help. Money and politics, i am open to this idea, the fact is this is about free speech could there have been efforts to try to get money out of politics. Believe, i believe in the law of unintended consequences. A lot of times you try to do something, and are unintended consequences. One of these of people who wanted to remove money from politics, now there is a lot of dark money. ,roups that are out there committees that we know much less about them then when Political Parties were involved. There has been a weakening of the Political Parties which has opened things up to a kind of wild west show. You cant get rid of money and politics. The question is how to keep it in ways that are sane. Election that the 2016 proved, money and politics is not dispositive. It doesnt control. President trump spent, to paired to the others, relatively little money. Bush had a lot of money, and he did not win. I dont think money was what drove the outcome. Note, this is on the Kellyanne Conway, the violations reported yesterday, the president was telling fox he will not fire her over the hatch act violations. They have tried to take away her speech, and i think youre entitled to free speech in this country. What is your take on that story . He wont fire people originally, no matter what they would do. They have been some exceptions if he feels like they are harmful to him, but in terms of ethical violations, that doesnt seem to bother him. In terms of that story and the hatch act, its not a violation of free speech. Act is a rule that basically says for federal workers, there are certain lines you should not cross pretty what to keep workers from being overly politicized. If youre on the federal payroll, and everybody in the admin assertion, as i was, we are all the mayor with the. The mere with it. A general matter, this is a wise thing. I think there is ambiguity on when you cross the lines or not. Kellyanne works for a man who transgresses lines on a daily basis, and they really dont care. They dont care what the rules are. They dont care what people say about the rules. We see that with subpoenas from congress. They say, screw it, we are not going to do what you want. President trump would fire Kellyanne Conway or that she would care, that is not the ethic of the presidency. Their view is might makes right. Our way or the highway. We do what we want. Catch us if you can. Portland onl go to the democrats line. You are on the air. Had, still focusing on the thesis of your book. There have been feelings of the Democratic Party as feeling polarized by the big politics. One cant go very far without seeing that. , the are some efforts things that go through congress, and no one hears about that i l like might help to l. A. Allay some of this rift. I do a fair bit of advocacy work in preventing global poverty. I have been keeping up on bipartisan things like the includects, and they big proponents from both parties that can Work Together to sign on that. I feel like these are important efforts that do things all over the world, global leadership. Thats just one example of bipartisan things like this. Do you have any thoughts on how we could publicize this more to the public to help rebuild this lost sense of confidence and help people feel like we are working together, and the most support and things are getting done. Theyre just a couple areas that we are still fighting on. Host i would like to ask you the medias role on this. His point a week ago, Congress Passed four pieces of Climate Change legislation that dealt with Carbon Dioxide and the oceans. They passed overwhelmingly. There was barely any reporting on that. This is somewhat of the issue he brings up. Caller those are good questions. I deal with some of this in the book. I think the media has some responsibility here because as politics has gotten polarized, so has the media. There is a way in which the press decides to cover the most inflammatory comments. They are drawn like moths to a flame when there is conflict. The most outrageous things that are said are the most publicize. You have social media, which is history ofnew in the politics, and i have a friend, i talked about this in the sections on the media, that says as things speed up, we need to slow down grade one of the things i write about, i think the press needs to do, is to slow down and calm down. I wish fewer reporters, not necessarily conlon musts were on twitter columnists were on twitter because they so often antagonize things. I think there is within the towards conflict and division. As logan said and as you pointed out. There is a lot going on low the radar. Legislation is being passed all the time, often with a fair amount of bipartisan support, and we need to publicize that. I think we need figures in the media, frankly and politics, who defend what politics is, who talk about why it matters. Ive got a chapter in the book on the democratic virtues of moderation and civility and what those things really are. They get tangled up sometimes. One other thing which logan dimension, the global poverty work he is doing, i appreciate that. We have seen advances over the decades in this, and in some respects around the world and even our own country. A lot of the trends are actually by encouraging come and president bush one of the great achievements of his, says his effort to combat malaria on the african content, so there are good things going on. John, from mclean virginia. Comments are ic tend to agree with you. I would submit for your consideration that the structural problem that we have in our political system is that we gerrymandered districts with regards to an right or by race. We probably should not do that. We probably should gerrymander or draw districts to balance extremism,xtremes, balance them, draw them so that they are balanced as close as possible. Happens when we draw them to favor a democrat or a republic, which are merely the two parties that we have in our country. Secondly, i would suggest that what we are dealing with today over the last 20 years is a move , classic western liberal thinking to one of Central Planning and socialism versus individual freedoms, and those are the battles we are seeing on capitol hill when we elect our president s and in the activistsn we look at judges versus conservative textual reading of the law passed by the legislatures. Host we will hear from pete wainer. Peter wainer. Ner. Ete weh his point, when you gerrymander these districts, this is done all the time because they want to create districts so they are not challenged. A distinguished scholar at brookings, who worked for president clinton, indulged a flick of theorist, and he has gerrymandering and has said it is not as much of a problem as people often ascribe. He is worth reading about on that. The other thing that bill says is that politics is divided not just in terms of the house races , but you see it in the states themselves and in the senate, which of course gerrymandering is not relevant. There is no question in my mind, i think it is common sense, if you get these districts and produce people like nancy pelosi or aoc for the democrats or jim jordan or some of the Freedom Caucus guys for the republicans, they come at politics with a bigger and intensity with a intensity that can sometimes cross the line and make politics worse. If you dont have people within the district that offer a kind of mitigating influence, that is a problem. The reality is that some people live in districts honestly in areas of the country where there is not a lot of diversity. There is something social scientists called called a big sword. People begin to sort themselves andin all sorts of ways, thats part of, as i said, the mantis manifestation of that is going on. Host you mentioned you are a christian. I want to ask you about a couple of numbers. The recent gallup poll over all the president ial approval numbers, 90 we talked about the party, but this number, among 78 approval rating, does that number surprise you . Caller yes and no. That is complicated. Person of that i am a Christian Faith. My faith is more important than my politics. I have a chapter in the book on politics and faith in what i think it can contribute to politics and why i think it can hurt politics. Does that surprise me . Most selfproclaimed evangelicals are conservative, in their ideology and their politics. The president represents the Republican Party, which has traditionally been the more conservative party. The president is advocating policies particular in areas that evangelicals traditionally care about. It would make sense that they would support him in large numbers per they voted for him in huge numbers. For trixie then forge w. Bush more voted the president then for george w. Bush. I no longer consider myself an event shall call, but still a kurdish christian. My criticism is not that they support the president or his polities. I did not vote for clinton or the president. Where i criticize a lot of the evangelicals, especially the is thatip in politics, they wont hold donald trump to account. They will not say that we appreciate his Court Appointments. They think is policies are good. The fact that this guy is in the dehumanization his appointments opponents. Man was an undivided unindicted conspirator on hush money payments to a pornography star. He was having an affair with her on his third wife after their son was born. If that had happened to a liberal democrat, bill clinton or barack obama, can you imagine what the evangelicals would say about that . Trump, theyresident go silent, or they defend him. That to me is the indictment of not all evangelicals. I have friends who are evangelicals, people who are convicted on the president , who are generally troubled by him, but there too many who are enthusiastic supporters, and they view this as an existential struggle. The danger of that is that you make deals with the devil to thatt satan if you think is the struggle. A quick programming note, we will be covering the president this afternoon on Small Business and health care. We go next to Long Beach California and hear from laurie on our democratic line. I appreciate this guest. I agree with everything he says. I am a democrat and he is so he is explaining everything so well about the media, about the evangelicals, about jim jorgen, which i really appreciate, because this guy i dont know what he is. Anyway, you are calm. I am not. I am just totally for joe biden. I dont care how old he is. I watched his speech the other day, and he was strong. He was humorous. He was very effective. He is just great. He talked about finances, foreign policy. I am 65. I have been a nurse for 40 years. I watched him for decades and wanted him to be president. Ive always admired him. Aside from that, i so appreciate this guest. He is saying everything i would but to say but cant say, this is joe on the independent line. Hes from maryland. I am an independent, i have been in the Republican Administration at the state level working for the governor as a finance attorney. I have the benefit of working with republicans and democrats, and what i think you are set on her dead on is the attack on truth. I want to know if you believe we are in a religious war. I say that because people have their theologies, whether they call it a religion or not, and the attack on that the republicans have positions themselves to be the vanguards of faith, but what you pointed out is there is a lack of integrity to truth. It intersects with a belief color regarding people of that harkens back to slavery that used religion to oppress black people. When trump has spoken so much on color and divisiveness but has clouded it around religion, and so i really see we are in a religious war. The question is, what you said, and i appreciate it, truth and integrity is being slayed as the sacrifice of politics. I went to see if you see that on both sides. I see the democrats swinging to far have just a couple minutes left. Caller there are two elements that i want to talk about, one on the religious war and the other on the attack on truth. I do not believe we are in a religious war. Thing in say one defense of faith in the realm of politics. If you look through the history of the United States, some of the greatest movements, social movements and political movements that have emerged were really driven by faith. The antislavery movement, the antisegregation movement, the prolife movement, this book is about ideas, but also about stories and people. Person that i spent some time on is Martin Luther king jr. I think he had so much to teach us. He was a doctor but also a reverend, and he used the language of the power of scripture to make the case for the dignity of all human beings. That was such a huge element of civil rights, and it was true. I write about Harry Beecher Harriet Beecher stowe, she was a christian. Whens said reportedly that lincoln met her, he says this was the little lady that started the great war. It is a beautiful book. Harriet Beecher Stowe took a different tack. She reached the hearts of people to her characters. Religion at its best, faith at its best, can be grace and reconciliation, Human Dignity and human hope. We have seen that. We have also seen the downside, which i talked about. Politicsr of faith in is that politics is passionate enough. If you have an overlay of faith and it becomes disconnected from what i think are its best at buttes, it can take on a struggle. You can say, this is now the children of light and of darkness. Politics becomes almost a theological battle. That is the danger. On the assault on truth, i have a chapter called white words matter. I spent some time on that. Why words matter. If you ask me about my may concerns about President Trump, the first is that i think is he has a disordered personality, that he is emotionally and psychologically ill equipped to be president and dangerous. That is one. The other is not just what i would say is an attack on truth, but an effort to annihilate it, the categories of truth and falsity. President , the first thing was the crowd size for the inaugural ball inaugural. He sent his secretary out earlier, sooner than sean spicer would have gone usually, to tell us his crowd was larger than obamas. Was it a big deal . In some respects its not. The reason it was important was that we had empirical evidence that obama crowd was larger. Trump numbers, and yet and his people went out and said dont believe your eyes, believe me. This has gone on and on, this attack on through. When that happens in a free republic, this assault on truth, that is dangerous. What politics needs to be is some semblance of the truth. A man wrote a wonderful essay about this, and he talked about how you have to live within the truth, not within the lie, and you have to revolt against manipulation. We have one quick call from mike on the republican line. Caller i believe President Trump is healing our nation because he loves babies, children, and he is not slaughtering them, and he is prolife. This is what this man is overlooking. This president loves our children and our nation, and that is the most important thing to understand of our whole healing process, which are going through, his rallies prove it. The media does not like to show the crowds host final thoughts . Prolife, and, and i favor policies that advance life. President trump for the record, east to favor partialbirth abortion and is extreme on the issue as you can get. I dont think he has deep convictions on this. Host where do you change came from . Caller i think it was a change of convenience. I am happy for the policies i want to say one thing on this issue. Me do look at the let a thought experience that. 1992, told mike back in lets fastforward to 2016, you have 16 years of liberal democratic president s and only eight years of a conservative republican, what is the number of abortions going to be if youre in 1992, 22016. At that point they were roughly 1. 8 may and abortions. Two and half million, three and half million, today the number is at the lowest number since roe v. Wade in 1973, below one million. As someone who is prolife, it is complicated, but as a general matter, i am prolife, but i think there is still far too many, but far fewer than there have been. I think sometimes people on the right make it kind of simplistic and say liberals, democratic president equals more abortions. It is complicated. Culture is deeper than politics. A lot goes on, and there are some positive signs. The president himself, i think his record speaks for itself. I dont think he is a person has manifested a deep love for the country. I think he is dividing it, and i think we will be worst for having him as president. His book, the death of politics how to heal our frayed. Public after trump we are joined by mark janus, the lead plaintiff in the supreme case, janicen, the versus afscme, and we are talking more about legal chances to labor legal challenges to labor unions. In 1999, cspan opened the doors to washington policy for all to see, bringing you unfiltered content from congress and beyond. Idea has changed, but the is more important than ever. Cspan is your unfiltered view of government so you can make up your own mind. It is brought to you by your Public Service providers. Weekend liveis today coverage of the annual Gettysburg College Civil War Institute summer conference. Peartng saturday at eight eight pop 8 30 with a Virginia Commonwealth University the combatn, and experience of civil war soldiers with peter carmichael, then a Panel Discussion on the artifacts of the civil war, moderated by brian lasky. Our live coverage continues sunday with a discussion on preserving Gettysburg National Military Park with Jennifer Murray of Oklahoma State. , andnce in the civil war then a look at the civil war and emancipation in the heart of america with ed ayres of the university of richmond. This will be followed by discussion on seeing the conflict through the eyes of leading historians with gary watch theand others annual Civil War Institute summer Conference Live this weekend on American History tv on cspan3. Tuesday the president holds a ratty rally in florida officially launching his run for a second term. Watch live on cspan2, online at cspan. Org or listen live on the e cspan radio app area app. We will talk about legal labors challenges to units. We are joined by mark janus. Year, andettled last we are also joined by brian kelsey, a senior attorney with the Liberty Justice center. Mark, take us back to the original case, why did you bring this case against the union . Theecause when i joined state of illinois in 2007, nothing was ever said about a. Nion, about a pledge card my position was covered by a union and the collective are getting era, and i did not learn about the agency fee that i had to pay as a nonmember until i got my first paycheck. I learned that in order to have my job at the state, i had to paid this agency fee even though i was not a member. It was approximately 80 of a l Union Membership, but i i did not have a right to vote or have any say in the matter. It did not sit right with me. I did not like it. At the time, like a lot of people, you want to be a good employee, so you just kind of go with the flow. Thereafter didly you begin investigating the Legal Process . 2014 wasnt until about that i pretty much had enough because i paid all this money into the union, definitely did not agree with their policies and politics, and so i kind of felt that something had to be done, and so for chili i found the Liberty Justice center, a Public Interest law firm. We began a dialogue, and the next thing i know we are filing a case in the federal courts. It worked its way all the way through to the Supreme Court. Are you still working for the state . No. I retired last july, and now working for Liberty Justice center as a spokesperson and senior fellow. Host brian kelsey, you are a senior attorney at the center. How did you connect with mark . The work that Liberty Justice does. We had a mutual friend that mark heard about, and he came to us, and we were thrilled to be able to provide this representation. For all our clearance, we provide this free of cost. We have a Wonderful Service that we provide, and in general we promote economic liberty interests and in particular the first admin rights of people like mark who have the right for free speech, but they just need a voice, they need one in the courtroom especially. Attorney with and his case through this process. I have joined since his case, so i just get to listen to the stories. This case was really just the beginning of our protection for workers rights because there been a number of cases that have come since then. Host lets look at the decision. We were talking before about the decision. 2018 it held that Public Employees cannot be forced to contribute to labor unions representing bargaininglective and contract negotiations print the majority ruled that forcing nonmembers to pay fees to unions opposews they might violate their rights and , on the the precedent board of education, and what was that . That is more of the legal area there. Bookss had been on the for 40 years, so the victory from last year was really the single greatest victory for workers rights in a generation. What it said was that these fees, that government workers no longer had to pay those agency fees. This decision affected 5 million government workers in 22 different states, and it said that for those who want to join the union, they can continue to pay their dues, but for those who dont want to join, in those states, they were still being forced to pay these fees, anywhere from 75 to 100 at times of the dues. So now the decision of the Supreme Court was that you no longer have to pay those because this is a First Amendment free speech issue. Mark was being forced to support organizations that were promoting interests different than his. There were decisions that he disagreed with. Reasons ithe disagreed was no one even ever asked me if i supported the policy. Positions thate afscme was taken . Absolutely. If anybody knows anything about illinois, it is on the cusp of bankruptcy. It owes so much money and just daytoday operations. Askingon at the time was for me to go on strike to support increased wages and benefits that the state could not afford and cannot afford. Host but you are not a member, correct . Even as a nonmember, they wanted me to not work or not cross the ticket line, at the time. Host you said you were paying about 80 of what the dues would all inen, where you at any way represented by the union . I was covered under any of the agreements that they did, in other words, whatever they negotiated in the contract, i was forced to accept, even though there may been provisions in it which i did not agree with. Host we are talking about legal challenges on labor unions. We welcome your calls and comments. Democrats, 202 7488000; republicans, 202 7488001, independents, 202 7488002, and all others, 202 7488003. And if you are a union number, 2027488003. When it says enforcement, what is your organization trying to do . Differentre several types of cases that we are working for people on. If you want to let us know about those, the two particular types are what are called opt out windows and then also receiving back agency fees. Marks case is one in which you would think most people think, you went to the Supreme Court, this is all over. In fact what usually happens is the court makes its decision but then sends it down to the lower court, so his decision continues on the question is can we get for mark these unconstitutionally paid agency fees. This up in court has said in many other cases that they are not creatingng new rights, simply discovering Constitutional Rights that were there than that he had all along. Therefore those rights can be applied retroactively into the pastor that is our argument. Host is that the bulk of what you are looking at in most of these cases, getting the fees back . Yes, but there is another group of people who are faced with the same decision that mark was faced with, either pay the pay union fees, or they can 85, 90 percent of the fees and get none of the benefits, and they decided to go a different direction. They decided to become members, but had they been given the decision to pay nothing, they would not have done that. It went out of the union now. They have asked to come out, and they have been told, youll have to wait until the opt out window comes up every year. Host what does that mean . State and byby union, but it can be anywhere from 14 days to 30 days, and it says that you have to wait until a 14 day. , and when that comes open each year. If you miss the window, you have to wait another year. A the center we represent special education teacher, and he went to the union, asked to come out. Three separate times he asked. The third letter, he personally headed to the president of his union. Still, the union said we will not let you out pretty came to us and filed a lawsuit. They did let him out, and gave him some of his dues, not all that we asked for. That is ridiculous that you have to call a lawyer to have your rights recognized. Life like, what was for you in the workplace once this process started . I had quite a few people that came to say thank you for the decision and for standing up for our rights. Unfortunately most of that was in, if you will, under the table, very quietly. As far as the actual union people themselves that were full members, they pretty much just ignored me as if i was a ghost. You say hello in the hallways they would just ignore me. There have been threats, and we preferred not to discuss that if at all possible. They have been numerous threats. Of callshave plenty laneng period on our mcats line, wayne from pennsylvania. On our democrat line, wayne from pennsylvania. You ought to be ashamed for yourself, if it wasnt for the union we would not have any kind of income. There are people that depend on the pension. Im going to tell you, h you got anything better to do than worry about taking things from people that worked all their lives, i cannot believe this. You ought to be ashamed of yourself. My only response, we are not taking away anything from anybody. They still can collectively bargain for they can still tinue to collective represent themselves by the union pit they still get their pensions, their wages and benefits. The thing that you have to also look at is we are just saying, let the individual decide for themselves what they want. That is all this decision did. If you choose to be a member of the union, god bless you, join, support it, do what you want. If you decide that the union is not your course of action, dont join. Just have the freedom to make the choice for yourself, which is what we do in this country all the time. That was guaranteed by the First Amendment. Maine. His is martha from teacheri am a retired from the Salem Education Association in salem, New Hampshire. I would like to say it is perfectly fine if you want to opt out. But i get tired of is i know many people who opt out, and then when they run into trouble, they want to use the union. You opt out, negotiate your own salary, your own benefits, and outcome crying to the union when you want support for things that you think are being done unfairly. You are on your own. Its not like that now. Even if youre not in the union, i have a friend who is in the postal service, when she got in trouble, that union protected her and kept her job for her, and she would on to have a nice career. You will lose all that, and you should if youre not paying into the union, should not get the benefits. Without unions, just like the color before said, you can kiss your weekends goodbye. Host let me ask about this point on that unions, represent those who opt out. You had mentioned that you are covered under the agreement. Is that typical that they unions would still represent a member who had opted out . It is ph she makes a fair point. For those who choose to opt out, they are on their own and that instance. But perhaps she does not know, it was the unions themselves who actually used money that they took from people like mark janus to lobby for these laws to be put into place. These laws now say that unions have to represent everyone in the bargaining units. What is also interesting because the unions have asked for that allinclusive collective bargaining in many states, the problem now is that they dont have these fees coming in, and now they are crying foul in the fact that theyre not getting support monetarily. They asked for it originally. ,here has been some legislation in a few states, illinois one, where there has been the request to not have to collectively bargain for the nonmembers. What i find interesting, they unions are fighting the legislation. They have the opportunity not to represent the people that are nonmembers, but yet they fight it, and they want to continue to collectively bargain for everybody. Its kind of like an oxymoron. They cant have it both way. This headline, after the Supreme Court decision, pennsylvania is a hub for antiunion lawsuits. Of the suits that you are pursuing, at the center, how many are in pennsylvania. One in particular, we represent one woman who works for the commonwealth, and she peoplerovide services to who desperately need those services from the state. She had been forced to be paying these fees or to join the union she decided to join. As a member, she felt like the union was not listening to her. She felt like they were and do a sing endorsing policies that she did not agree with. So she is trying to get out. We are representing her, doing everything we can to get her out. There are times at which unions have done the right thing, as i mentioned with the case in california, and there are other cases which they are not doing that. From a worker in pennsylvania where they came to her classroom perch he was a teacher. They said you need to support candidate x, and she said no, i believe i have my own right to support who i want. They visited her classroom three times trying to put pressure on her to vote for their candidate. No, im going to vote how i want to because it is a free country, they even started her calling her husband at home and said you need to get your woman in line basically. I found that abominable. That is the kind of pressure that some of these locals put on these individuals. Host this is the democrats line in wisconsin. Caller proud teamster, best thing i did in my life, it supports women an equal pay. If you guys would like to discuss the unequal pay for women in this country, what legislation are you working on for that . We are a Public Interest law firm. We dont work on legislation or pursue it. What we do pursue is respecting and protecting workers rights. Thats why we have created stand with workers. Org, and we would ask that any of you, if you are being oppressed by your union, please go to stand with workers. Org and let us know. Youre specifically working with government unions. Thats right. This only applies to those who work for the government. What the court has said, this is issue foradmin issue hitting certain action by governments and has said, in regards to the question about illinois, these are inherently possible policy decisions. Any time a Union Negotiates in the Public Sector, whether it be the local vigilance village, that whatever they negotiate is political inherently because that decision that is made on that agreement then affects taxpayers it becomes a political policy type of decision. Therefore that was one of our arguments per thats one of the things that the union admitted in the testimony and the oral arguments. They said what we do is inherently political. Host this is the republican line. Caller i was wondering if you could talk a little bit more about how this case benefits government workers. Say your point again, olivia . Caller i was wondering if you could talk more about how this case benefits government workers. Benefit tosay the government workers is the fact that you now have a choice and a voice as to whether you join or not join your union. If youre not a member, you dont have to pay to have your government job. I think brian has a letter from the union that said if you dont pay us, we are going to go forward and ask for your termination and that position. It was this ruling that we fought for that prevented that type of coercion and effort just because you dont pay, you cant have a job in the Public Sector. , this type of example why decision, while it was while it was a victory, its the beginning of our work. This letter came to her worker in california. She worked for a school district. She wanted to be represented the union that wanted to represent her was the National Union of health care workers. She thought they cant really help me in a school district. She refused to join. Just this year, they center this letter, and it says, if you fail to respond in joining our union by may 1, we will begin having you removed from your job. That is the type of lightly unconstitutional coercion that is still going on by scent of the bad actors out there, and that by some of the bad actors out there. Tj is in new jersey im sorry, we will go to tj next. I am a union member, retired, and the transportation field. In the old days, i had coworkers coworkers that would work 1000 hours a week, believe it or not. Work ethic, American Indian girl, she had no problem that youre going to go home when you were supposed to go home, and she worked, and now she is retired in las vegas. The thing is the millenials today that work for the union, they dont even want to work 40 hours. This is something that i guess both sides need protection, those that want to make overtime and those that dont. Industry, there are risks and hours of service is important. I thank you for your program. Lynn fromave maryland. Maryland, and i was a dues paying member. And i wasn rockville, injured on the job. I was working they had given me a year before this happened, they gave me a third position. I was working like 70 hours a week, just my 40 hours a week, and i was an hourly employee. I got no help from the union. I have a brain injury and lung damage from toxic air in the building, and even when i was on benefits,out pay with they would make me pay 100 of all of my employee benefits. Then i got a temporary disability through workers comp, went to court, and then they appealed it. It took a year, and when it went to court, the circuit judge ruled in my favor, and they fired me the next day. Ive gotten no help. My lawyer, the last time i went to court, he went in a back room and talk to them. I have had no help. I would say to a doctor, i need help, i need someone to advocate for me. Unfortunately, that story is tragic. At the center are doing our best to protect workers who feel like their rights are not being respected. The idea that you would be fired after a situation like this is horrific, and we feel bad for you. We welcome you and others to go to stand with workers. Org. I think we have heard from several colors on either side of the issue, and it shows that some people are happy seeing members being members of the feel like thers union does not represent them that is understandable in this country, and that is all we are asking for. We are not trying to put unions out of business. Youre just wrong to respect the rights of workers and let them decide whether or not they want to join. I reiterate. That is the only decision that has any weight, the decision of the individual and making their choice and voice in what they want to do. That is all we are doing. Yourewe are not antiunion, we t anticollectivebargaining. We are just along workers to make the choice for themselves which was guaranteed under the First Amendment of the constitution. Host you are working for the city of chicago . Guest state of illinois. Host the efforts continue in illinois, the tribune, state oup union fees in a class action. We talked about the efforts of your organization, but this as a former governor of illinois behind this effort. Tell us about his role. Guest he was originally involved in mark janus lawsuit, but then the court decided that he was not the right plaintiff to bring forth that claim. We are now representing an individual named like. D the agency fees, and we are trying to get them back, which he was forced to pay unconstitutionally. Blake is a purple heart veteran, a real hero. He want nothing more than to serve other veterans. He worked for the Illinois Department of veteran services, but had his money taken out of his paycheck each month without his will. Ago, this month the decision comes down from the Supreme Court to federal courts. How does that get codified into regulation, into law, so it is enforced at the state or local level . Guest in many cases, there is an awful lot of law that gets codified through National Labor relations board, federal side, such as hours, health care, safety, and so on. Because the unions fought for this over the years and did a now the amount of things that unions have to negotiate for have been reduce greatly, because a lot of this is just public law. The thing you have to remember is, that is why i believe they have gone on to using these other policies and politics, you know, because what they have to work on has been reduce greatly because of federal and state law. In warrington, oregon. Guest good morning. My first question would be to the cspan host. Why are we giving mr. Janus a platform . My second question would be to mr. Janus. Are you still employed by the state of illinois . If you are, i would like to hear the conversation around the watercooler in your duty section. Janus, question for mr. Why didnt you simply moved to the right to work state . Plumber, retired, and my wife is a part of the afscme. Im really puzzled by you and your dimestore, scissor bill attorney. Have a good day. Host care to comment . Guest no reason to comment. But were trying to do is get workers the right and choice. No, i retired from the state of illinois. I now currently work for Liberty Justice center because i saw, once the decision came down, this fight was not over. We are try to help and support workers across the country. We are not seeing that happening. Actually we are seeing the opposite. Unions using all sorts of methods such as misinformation, varietywindows, and a of other things, to keep people in the old against their First Amendment rights. There was a case settled not long ago where a lady was having come out of her paycheck, and she didnt want to be a member of the union. She couldnt figure out how this happened. In the court case, it came out, the union had forged her signature on a pledge card come in order to keep the membership. That was very blatant in that regard. There are lots of other cases of likable coercion and all kinds of bullying. Host to the callers question as to why we have mr. Janus and mr. Kelsey on, we cover Public Policy broadly, specifically the Supreme Court. This was a major Supreme Court decision. We covered the oral argument of this case last year, which you can find at cspan. Org. We covered this to janus view, and the unions view with richard trumka. Here is some of what he had to say. First of all, the attacks on us are nothing new. They have been attacking us forever. Janus solicited was solicited from justice alito. That is the worst kind of justice activism. The Supreme Court is more corporate friendly than any other court in our history. A recent study was done by one of the judges, who said this Supreme Court, before Brett Kavanaugh was the most corporate Friendly Court that we have ever seen. Working people expect the Supreme Court to be the most fair and independent branch of government in america. That is what we would like to see. Host part of a discussion with aflcio president richard trumka. Mark janus, on his allegation that your case was solicited by justice alito. It sounds that you have heard that before. Guest that is the most absurd, wrong, erroneous comment. I have never been solicited by justice alito, never solicited by anybody to bring this case. I brought this case on my own because i felt my personal First Amendment rights were being infringed on, you know, by the union forcing me to pay a fee i did not want to pay. They never asked me if i wanted to pay it. And the fact that i felt like i was not being represented correctly by the union at the time when i was working for state government. Ka to make that kind of decision, so blatantly false, and error. The absurdity of the comment itself speaks for itself. Is talkingtrumka about corporate interest, but this is not about corporations versus unions. This is about the government versus government unions. That is an important distinction from even the prior caller, mentioning why doesnt mark moved to a right to work state . He doesnt have to. The constitution applies in all 50 states. For yourthe long game organization, do you see additional areas of constitutional challenges when it comes to unions workers versus unions . Certainly a lot of work left to be done in courts and law firms like Liberty Justice center. We are working with workers to bring those cases. We have cases going on in all kinds of different states to run the nation. What the Supreme Court said in workers havease, to give affirmative consent, permission for the unions to be able to take that money. We are now working through the court system, what is that permission, do they have to affirmatively say each year . You can still take dues out of my paycheck . In particular, there are some horrific examples. One that we represent, in california, a woman went to the union. I heard about the janus decision, i no longer want to pay any dues. They told her you cannot be let out. You have to wait almost four years to be let out of the union. Surely, that is not constitutional. We have to work that out through the court system. Host lets go to the phone lines. Tim in michigan. Good morning. Caller i started out in junior high and high School Working in the tool industry. Hadund the nonunion shops to compete with the talent in the union shops, so they paid wages and benefits to compete and ite other shops, made a good working environment for all hourly workers, union and nonunion. Thank you for letting me speak. Host lets go to severn, maryland. Republican line. Yoursure you mute television or radio. Go ahead with your comment. Caller yes, i want to say the union has been around for me for my lifetime. My father was in the union, i am in the union. They took care of us. But there was a union that did not take care of the people, and it was amps company. They made them work 32 hours a week, which cuts their benefits. So when they retired, they may have gotten maybe 101 to live on. A lot of people look at one thing, but the majority of them have been good for the country. Host i want to ask you about a headline in politico. One year after janus, the unions are flushed. As the anniversary approaches, a review at 10 large public until unions employee unions payerses they lost fee in 2018, but all but one reported more money at the end of 2018, and collectively, the [noions reported a gain audio] and provide this information to their membership. The one thing we also have to look at is the transparency of unions. Where does all this money go, how do they spend it . What we found during our case, our discovery, if you will, you know, there was a line item i was given at one time called advertising. What is advertising . Is that the teachers and a keychain they give out at work all the time . That hang oncards office walls to support the Union Position . Or is it the inkind money and contributions that they give to Political Parties to support a particular candidate . That is one of the things that i did not particularly care for, that there was no transparency. I had no clue as to where my money was going, how it was being spent. When i asked about it, i was basically rebuffed, not answered. Host chicago, independent line. Bill, hello. , we all know that unions built the middle class in america. Say, we workers have no are looking at many industries. It is not just unions that are being attacked. It is the privatization that is taking place. They want to privatize the post office. Privatizing some things in the military. We want to privatize public education. Civil service is under attack in america. Right to work is ridiculous. We need unions. We have to have collective bargaining. If we dont, working people in america lose. Host brian kelsey, are there issues that come up with unions that your organization in socalled right to work states . Guest there are certain instances in which those rights are being abused, but for the most part it is in the 22 states that were affected by the janus decision. I agree with mark. Unions had a monopoly for 40 years and they did not have to prove their worth. Now they are going to have to go back and prove to those workers that they provide benefits, services. In many instances, we will see the Services Provided by unions improve. It will be that much better for the workers. Unfortunately, there are instances where there are bad actors out there. In the state of new jersey, we have heard from cafeteria workers were the union is trying of their numbers because they are losing members like mark janus. They have a meeting, and then at the end, they say, if you want more information, sign up here. Low and behold, they are signing them up to be members of the union. Once they found out that they were tricked, they were told host this is since the janus decision . Guest yes. There is still plenty of work to be done to make sure these constitutional freespeech rights are protected. Host on a different topic, how does it feel to have your name associated with a fairly landmarks up in court case . Guest number one, it is barely humbling. To be at set out Supreme Court plaintiff, get a decision of this magnitude. I was just fighting for my rights, other Public Sector rights. Said,nd of mine back home after the decision, you know, you are now a noun, verb, and adjective. I never thought i would be in that position. Quite frankly, from what im hearing, what brian is hearing at Liberty Justice center, and other likeminded organizations, we are finding this has opened up a very large area for people to exercise their First Amendment rights that they have been denied for over 40 years. It was even made public that the original abood decision was considered bad by a lot of lawyers across the country, even some of the Supreme Court justices. Guest the one thing that mark has successfully taught me is that we can no longer refer to the cases that come after the janus decision as postjanus. Mark is still around. Host frank, california. Good morning. Caller good morning. I have been a union member for 25 years, American Federation of government employees. I am a federal Law Enforcement officer. Rights ifnd we have you dont want to join, but i want to make it clear. Federal unions and state unions may be different, but we dont force people. We ask people if they want to join, and the majority do. I want to make it clear. Listening to the tv saying you have to. In the federal sector, it is a little different. On,nderstand mr. Janus opni but unions i am a legislative guy. I go up on capitol hill to fight for what we need for Law Enforcement officers to get stuff that protects us. Sometimes it is a little difficult, what we do, but it is something you have to love. I understand his decision. I dont know about illinois, but when you pay dues, we get it back at the end of the year because it is taxdeductible. The problem i have with the janus law, i hope they dont use it down the road as unionbusting. They are trying to gut our v. A. We are trying to help people. I just wanted make it clear to people out there, it is a little bit different from the state unions to the federal unions. I am proud to be a union member. Guest he is absolutely correct. On the federal side, they have not had forced agency fees for years. Public unions on the federal can still collectively bargain, they are still out there, they still do their job, but you are not forced to pay the fee. We were deciding was primarily for the state and local area. Host one caller was fairly critical of you and said something to the effect, basically tearing down Civil Service and our country. What do you think the aftermath forour decision means Public Employee unions, Public Service in general, on the state and local level . Guest i dont think it will have any effect whatsoever, at least illinois and other states i have seen. You still have collective bargaining. The state of illinois just completed a contract in the last week or so. Butdetails are not out yet, they did negotiate and settle a contract. That is not going to change. Publicsector unions will continue to bargain, have members, and they will have their rights to do what they need to do. The problem as i see it is that you have this group of unions that are bashing myself and what i did, strictly for the right of the worker to decide for themselves their own course of action. Everybody has that right on a daily basis wherever they are in this country. Host outside of supporting political candidates in a union, the caller mentioned some of the work that a union does is inherently political, whether it is here on capitol hill, or in broomfield, in illinois case, that union is there representing that body on things of interest to afscme or afg, or whatever. Guest that is true, and they do. But did they ever ask rankandfile . I was never asked. When i talked to my fellow workers, were you ever asked about this point, whether we wanted to support this legislation . Were you asked if he wanted to endorse or support that candidate . Literally, 90 plus of the responses i received were no. It was to agree the management of the union that made those decisions for us, without our consent. That is the part that i disagree with. Guest this is actually the exact point that the Supreme Court made a year ago and mark janus case. This work is inherently politicallybased in its nature. When a union is going to negotiate a Bargaining Agreement with the government, they are making tough decisions about Public Policy. Has hade of illinois trouble balancing its budget for years, and they are faced with difficult decisions. , hire peopleises and pay them less . These are tough decisions, and the Supreme Court said, if this is what you are bargaining for, you cannot just take money from people because they may or may not agree with your policy positions. Guest the other thing you have to look at is, you have to remember, publicsector workers are also taxpayers. Whatever the union does, whatever affects the individuals, also affects the taxpayer, of which they are a part of. How does that blend together and work in the general good or bad, in whatever position you want to take . Host kyle is in ellicott city, maryland. Democrat line. Caller the irony is mark probably receives a pension and health care from illinois, in part, because he has had collective bargaining. 25 years ago, 80 of americans have a pension. Forother and father worked giant and had a pension after they retired. The private sector has destroyed all of our pensions because they are trying to destroy the collective bargainings and the unions. Folks are all giddy over their winning this case. It will have an effect on collective bargaining and unions. Give it 10, 15, 20 years, and youll see the same thing that happened in the private sector happen in the Public Sector. You will look back on this and realize these two can say what they want. If there is a way to change things in the union, there is a way to do that without destroying the union. I work for an agency [no audio] and you are told you are part of collective union and you dont want to be in a union, just dont take the job. If part of the job has a union. Dont blow it up just because you dont like not having a voice, or they want to vote for for people that are prounion. It makes common sense that the union should not vote or support candidates that want to have a right to work state, who doesnt want unions. Host thanks, kyle. Guest we are not destroy unions. Unions since the decision still continue collectivebargaining, they still have their membership. Nothing in that regard has changed. This rhetoric that we are destroying unions, destroying collectivebargaining, again, just another false accusation that is not there. This decision did not affect those in the private sector, only government workers and their dealings with government unions. Perhaps the caller is right, the union has done a great job bargaining for benefits. If they want to pay union dues, they can continue to pay union dues. But i think mark can speak for himself. He had bargained for jobs in the private sector and thought he was doing a better job. Guest here is the other thing. He talks about pensions, that they are destroying pensions. They are not destroying pensions. What they are doing is changing them to a different form. Orther that is a 401 k whatever else is out there, the fact that pensions are being destroyed is wrong, from the standpoint that they are just been changed into a different form. A pensiono remember is very limited in what it can do for the individual. If you just change jobs, for example, in many cases, you cannot take that tension with you. If youre in a different type of system outside of a defined transport it to your new job, roll it over, and you have more flexibility. Host you are now serving as a spokesperson for the Liberty Justice center. A number of cases involving unions. How is your Organization Funded . Guest thankfully, by many generous donors throughout the country who are willing to give their own paychecks, so we can do the work of protecting workers rights, so that we can ultimately represent people like mark janus without charging him. Host are you based in washington . Guest chicago, illinois. A union memberto in chattanooga, tennessee. Caller good morning. Member. Etired union we have closed shop. They take of money out of my check, i dont even miss it or think about. About thing is host im losing you, sorry. Lets go to bradenton, florida. Republican line. Caller how are you doing today . Host go ahead with your comment. Caller i am glad the caller from tennessee was before me, because he said what i wanted to touch on. First of all, i work in an unionsy where i watched destroy the industry. No what is the word balanced with unions anymore. They used to represent, they used to be a good thing, but i changed professions, and i was an underwriter for a bank. I see loan applications come through for teachers, truck drivers, farmworkers, factory workers, and the amount of dues, out and cut their paychecks down from 1300 every 600. Eks, down to it is ridiculous. That is not representing workers, that is filling your pockets. I just read something a couple so unionwhere 150 or president s made 13. 1 million in compensation over the year, when the average worker was making some 37,000. How is that right . Host how much per paycheck did you pay in agency fees . Guest it varied over the years but seemed to go up every year. I am going from memory. About 27 per paycheck. Suing to get are all those agency fees that. Where is the case . Guest that is still on its way from the District Court level back up through the appeals system. Through the federal court of appeals. Perhaps it can make it to the Supreme Court again, probably not. The caller pointed out something important. The union dues vary. But the saddest story i have heard, one worker that we are representing, she said, i am going to have to stop paying for my chemotherapy pills because these union dues are being taken out of my paycheck. These are government workers. They are not huge salaries to begin with. Host a quick look at the rate of Union Membership among u. S. Workers, from the bureau of labor statistics, tracking from 1984 through 2018. Just under 12 Union Membership, according to the chart. Is in new mexico. A union member. Caller i have two points to make. The first point i want to make is the whole right to Work Movement was founded by a fascist, someone in the south who saw blacks and jews organizing, and saw them as a threat to management. The second point i want to make, mr. Janus, your case was shopped by this rightwing organization. When i looked at your work history before, it indicated that you did this job before in a nonunion capacity, but that you chose to work for the state in a union capacity. Goanizations like brians kays shopping, and it is insulting. The Supreme Court, which isnt increasingly rightwing which is increasingly rightwing, are taking these cases that dont have general merit. Mr. Janis, i just find you reprehensible. Host we will let you follow up. You mentioned this earlier about case shopping. Guest that is false. D byn, i was not case shoppe anybody. I have been dissatisfied with the union for several years that was on a total loss. Afscme is a nationwide union that has large, deep pockets, multimillion dollars available to it from all of the dues they collect. How is an individual like myself going to stand up against this huge union . I could not do it. Fortunately, i found the Liberty Justice center. They were the people that were able to represent me. Otherwise, i could not do it on my own. The earlier comment that some of these Union Representatives make 6, 7 figures. They complain about the private sector individuals making this kind of money. It is also made in the Public Sector unions like afscme, seiu, teachers, etc. They are lambasting these private corporations. They are just as bad an equally reprehensible, in my opinion. Janus, the lead plaintiff in janus v. Afscme. We cover the oral arguments of that. You can find that at cspan. Org. Brian kelsey, senior attorney with the Liberty Justice center. That will do it for washington journal. We are back tomorrow morning at 7 00 eastern. [captions Copyright National cable satellite corp. 2019] [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. Visit ncicap. Org] joined us later today when the center for new American Security holds a Panel Discussion on intelligence oversight priorities during his National Security conference here in washington. Live coverage starts at 12 15 eastern. Also like today, President Trump will be speaking about Small Businesses and healthcare coverage during an appearance in the rose garden. It is scheduled for 3 30 eastern. We will have live when it starts on cspan. Road to the white house coverage continues saturday, when the virginia Democratic Party holds its gala, featuring Amy Klobuchar and pete buttigieg. That starts at 7 00 eastern here on cspan. Finally on tuesday, President Trump announces his plans to run for a second term. Hes expected to make that announcement at a Campaign Rally in orlando, florida. Pence, firstt mike lady melania trump, and second lady Vice President pence will also attend. This weekend, American History tv has live coverage of the annual Gettysburg College Civil War Institute summer conference. Starting saturday at 8 30 a. M. Eastern with a discussion on the union this cause, with katie shively. A look at that turners rebellion. The combat experience of civil war soldiers with peter carmichael. Then a Panel Discussion on the artifacts of the civil war, moderated by West Virginia university. Sunday, live coverage continues at 8 30 a. M. Eastern with a discussion on preserving Gettysburg National Military Park, with Jennifer Murray of Oklahoma State university. Withnce in the civil war Louisiana State university. Then a look at the civil war and emancipation in the heart of america, with university of richmond, followed by a discussion on seeing the conflict through the eyes of leading historians with gary gallagher, and others. Watching the annual Gettysburg College Civil War Institute summer conference, live this weekend on American History tv, on cspan3. For 40 years, cspan has been providing america unfiltered coverage of congress, the white house, Supreme Court, and Public Policy events or washington, d. C. And around the country, so you can make up your own mind. Created by cable in 1979. Cspan is brought to you by your local cable or satellite provider. Cspan. Your unfiltered view of government. Remarks from 2020 president ial candidate tim ryan. The Ohio Democratic congressman recently appeared at the New Hampshire institute of politics and new England Council politics and ask breakfast. This is about one hour. Good morning, im the executive director here at the New Hampshire council. Welcome to another in our wonderful series of politics and eggs which goes back many years to 1997. Some are surprised to know, if you ever saw the west wing, politics and eggs is in the show at one point when the president is signing something in the oval office. A couple of quick things