Director and former secretary of defense and former white house chief of staff leon panetta. Before we begin, i want to tell you that we will have questions from the audience at the end of the session, and you can ask them by going to the rndf app, which is www. Rndf2017. Org, twitter is rndf, and we will take some of the questions from there at the end of the session, and we will hear from you. I want to start the questions. I was told i have Carte Blanche to ask anything. [laughter] dir. Pompeo dont forget, you have two italians. [laughter] dir. Pompeo i was also told i can refuse to answer any question. [laughter] bret let me start with this. If you were secretary of state for the trump administration, how would you handle all right. [laughter] dir. Pompeo my former friend, bret bair. [laughter] bret understanding with the president tweeted in, and understanding you serve at the pleasure of the president , have you had talks about another job . Dir. Pompeo i am very focused on doing what i am doing, bret. In spite of what former dcis who had it all the time and now saying it should be parttime, it is all that. Im incredibly focused on it. There is lots of work to do. I have been privileged students for 10ileged to serve a months and served with the finest Espionage Service in the world and look forward to continuing to work at it. Bret lets do an opening set to table with the state of the world. The title of this is impacting defense from outside the pentagon. Give your sense of where things stand and i will get you to weigh in as well. Dir. Pompeo thank you for being here. Great to be with you, mr. Secretary. He reminded me. I called all of the then living former directors when i was nominated, and he reminded me the last time we had met he was a witness at the benghazi hearing. [laughter] dir. Pompeo so, its great to be with you again. [laughter] [applause] dir. Pompeo look. One of the things i get asked often is what surprised me when i became the director, i had some experience as did secretary panetta serving as a member of congress, its the incredible nexus between what we do and how we inform the department of defense and provide some of the parts working alongside our dod partners in lots of different ways. Certainly, in the intelligence cycle delivering to them information that we have garnered so they can perform their function and make good decisions. The cycle comes back. The dod has lots of information on the ground that feeds our intelligence and theres places where our Paramilitary Forces in the dod forces are working alongside each other truly handinhand. We couldnt do much of what we do in the Intelligence Community without an enormous commitment from secretary mattis and the department of defense, and i would like to thank think they depend on us as well. Bret secretary panetta . Mr. Panetta i also want to thank the Reagan Library for holding this great Defense Forum. A lot of very distinguished speakers and great people in the audience. I have a lot of former colleagues here from the cia as well as defense who are now using their experience to make a buck. I understand that. [laughter] mr. Panetta i want to also pay tribute to h. R. Mcmaster because i think he presented some excellent points at lunch with regards to the strategy and the things we have to look at in todays world. We are looking at a world that at least in my experience i have never seen as many flashpoints in the world, probably since world war ii. When you consider we are fighting a war on terrorism. Youve got failed states in the middle east. We are dealing with iran, north korea, russia, china. We are dealing with what i call the battlefield of the future, which is cyber, and the potential for Cyber Attacks that could paralyze this country. There are number of flashpoints out there and the reality is you cannot deal with these crises without good intelligence. Thats the bottom line. If you dont have good intelligence, you cannot conduct effective military operations and you cannot implement effective diplomatic relations. Youve got to know what the hell youre talking about. And you have to know what youre going to see in trying to implement the mission. So intelligence is absolutely critical. We have lived in a time in the past where intelligence was important, but it is absolutely critical today and also this thetionship between intelligence and the military. That partnership is more important than ever. Prior to 9 11 i think it was more stovepiped. After 9 11 there was a recognition that you have to Work Together as a partnership and we have built a Strong Partnership and im sure mike has continued that between intelligence and the military. Both of them have to Work Together. We provided intelligence on targets. The military went after those targets. We were doing Counterterrorism Operations in iraq and afghanistan, elsewhere. I am sure they are continuing to do exactly the same thing. I will tell you that the height in my experience of watching that relationship really work was on the bin laden operation because we put together the intelligence. We did all of the backup work. We looked at the compound and we knew that in order to conduct that operation, we needed the particularly the seals, to do that. And they did that based on our intelligence and they did a great job. That is a great example of the kind of partnership i think is absolutely going to be essential if we are going to confront these flashpoints we are talking about. Bret i know you cant get specific to many places but can you explain how the cia is ramping up operations against terrorism . Comba dir. Pompeo i inherited an organization that had been at this site for an awfully long time added straight on for 15 plus years after 9 11. And the counterterrorism machine was well in place. Theres no doubt about that thinks to the good work of lots of my predecessors. But the fight has changed in material ways. We were in front of a set of terrorists in syria and iraq that held a lot of real estate. The intelligence apparatus had to change to reflect that. We work to continue to build that team so that our partners around the world could continue to take down terrorists wherever we find them. Its also the case that the president made the decision to have an indefinite commitment in south asia. That is not a permanent one but to recommit to being there until we could bring the taliban to the negotiating table in a way that would not give them the ability to think they could win it on the battlefield. For us to deliver intelligence so dod partners can deliver that to secretary tillerson is incredibly important. Bret you mentioned afghanistan. Obviously, the president has committed more troops there. The real pressure is to get pakistan to move off the ball and to affect the taliban. How do you do that effectively . Are you going to continue strikes on terrorist groups inside pakistan . How do you move that . Dir. Pompeo you begin by seeking their assistance. Secretary mattis is traveling in the region here before too long and is going to make clear the president s intent. I think secretary mattis will deliver the message that says we would love you to do that. The safe haven inside pakistan has worked to the detriment of our capacity to do what we needed to do in afghanistan. In the absence of the pakistanis achieving that, we are going to do everything we can to make sure the safe haven no longer exists. Bret secretary panetta, you dealt with that as secretary of defense. I want to acknowledge secretary schulz in the front row. Its great to have you here, sir. [applause] bret he was talking about how afghanistan is treated as a whole country but in reality is controlled as we know by these kind of warlords in different pockets of afghanistan. Talk about the challenge of dealing with a place like afghanistan after all these years. Its the longest war that we had in america. Its one hell of a challenge and frankly thats the reason we are still there and still fighting. Because its not easy. Afghanistan was the place where al qaeda came together and developed the plans for 9 11. Mr. Panetta we drove into afghanistan and a lot of the leadership from al qaeda made its way into the tribal areas in pakistan. So we then had to take them on in pakistan. I think thanks to the agency that we were involved with we did a hell of a job going after their leadership. But afghanistan remains a continuing challenge. For a lot of reasons. First of all, the challenge of being able to go after the taliban effectively and to do it in a way that not only goes after the taliban, but ensure s security once youve done the job. The problem is weve often gone after the taliban and once we get out, trouble occurs and the taliban goes back in. We have worked with the military in afghanistan. We have worked with Intelligence Forces to develop their capability. I think theyve gotten much better at the job they are doing. I think they really have improved a great deal. At the same time, they need to have u. S. Support in that effort. Otherwise, if the u. S. Is not there assisting them they are not going to do the kind of job that needs to be done. Thats why its important that the u. S. Be involved. Thirdly, it remains a country that continues to have a lot of corruption. And the Central Government as a result of that corruption doesnt have a lot of sway with the tribal leaders and the various other leaders in afghanistan. Until they get that act together , youre going to be dealing with different tribes who have different approaches to dealing with the taliban and the enemy. Lastly, its pakistan. Pakistan has always been a problem. It is been a safe haven for terrorists to come across the border and attack in afghanistan and then go back into pakistan. And we have made every effort possible during the time i was there to convince pakistan to stop it. But pakistan as mike knows, pakistan has this kind of twoedged approach to dealing with terrorism. On the one hand, they dont like terrorism or the attacks from terrorist in their country. But at the same time, they dont mind using terrorists as leverage to deal with afghanistan and to deal with india. Thats the policy that they have been involved with. So pakistan has always been a question mark. I hope that mike and jim mattis are successful in making clear to the pakistanis that theyve got to be able to seal their border and they have to be able to go after the terrorists within their own territory. Unless that happens, we are going to continue to have problems in afghanistan. Bret has something changed significantly in recent months on that front . Dir. Pompeo not yet. Period. [laughter] bret ok. [laughter] dir. Pompeo while you are so forthcoming, lets talk about north korea. [laughter] bret we spent a lot of time talking with general mcmaster about the threat from north korea and historically our intelligence is not perfect in north korea. Is there a sense do we know how close north korea is to mastering reentry technology for their icbms . Dir. Pompeo we do have a pretty good feel for that. I cant talk a whole lot about it other than the closer every hour every day that goes by their working diligently to achieve the capacity to hold the United States at risk. Our intelligence on that is good. I think we have a pretty good understanding of the scope and scale of the program and how far they are making progress towards being able to reliably deliver that system against the United States. Bret i mean, these are ominous statements. That we are closer to some kind of military action potentially with north korea. Its entirely possible that diplomacy doesnt work as we have seen it unfold and that china wont or cant control kim jongun. The question is, is america prepared militarily and politically to go to war with north korea to protect the u. S. And our allies in the region . Dir. Pompeo the president has been pretty clear about the mission statement. It is to denuclearize north korea. He has been unambiguous about that. Our efforts are economic and diplomatic to convince them. We, in the Intelligence Community, have said that kim jongun is rational. Its also the case that we dont think he has an understanding about how tenuous his position is. Domestically and internationally. Those around him are not feeding him the truth about the place he finds himself and how precarious his position is in the world today. Its probably not easy to tell kim jongun bad news. [laughter] bret family members can attest. I have learned the art of nuance in my 10 months. Suffice it to say, we are hopeful that this economic pressure and that china will exert its power and we will be able to resolve this in a way that doesnt require the military outcome that no one is excited to advance. Bret secretary panetta, i talked to a bunch of people and there is this fear that we are getting closer. Your sense of all of this . Mr. Panetta i think the National Security director was right. Its probably the most dangerous threat in a series of dangerous points in the world. Its one of the most serious threats we are facing right now. Why . Because its pretty clear that north korea is focused on getting that icbm, developing that miniaturized Nuclear Weapon that would go on top of the icbm. The bottom line is, they continue to improve the flight of those icbms and they are i think very close to being able to develop an icbm that can reach the United States. Thats a direct threat to the security of the United States. And admittedly, as mike has pointed out, there arent a lot of good options here. We have developed all kinds of military options and im sure that jim mattis has done exactly the same thing. The problem is there are risks involved, and the risk is destroying seoul and killing a Million People in a nuclear war. Thats why its not easy to figure out how do we do this. Youre left with frankly containment and deterrence whether you like it or not. Its containment and deterrence. That means essentially weve got to continue to strengthen our position there. Weve got to continue to strengthen our military. Weve got to continue to strengthen the south koreans. I would deploy more thads. I would give them greater capabilities. The same with the japanese. At the same time, you have to improve the intelligence capabilities of both south korea and japan, as well as our capabilities. Mike knows more about this, and he probably cant tell you. This is a really hard target. North korea is tough. Not easy to get inside and try to figure out what this guy is going to do. We have tried to do that. I think we have had some success at trying to penetrate it but its tough so we need to constantly improve our intelligence and continue to squeeze on the sanctions and put pressure on china to try to convince north korea to come to the negotiating table. Those are the levers we have got right now, and we have to keep pushing. I do think one of the most important things we have to do is develop a missile shield. Shield, an effective missile shield. Not only using south korea and japan, but obviously our own capabilities so that these missiles that take off we have the capability to hit them quickly, and make sure that we can do an effective job. I think at some point they have to pay a price for this kind of constant testing that they are involved with and the only way were going to do that is if we improve our missile capability , which i think is absolutely essential to our ability to protect our own security. Bret speaking to a home crowd, Missile Defense at the Reagan Library. Long history. Yes. Dir. Pompeo i think secretary panetta is right about this idea. We shouldnt forget its an enormous conventional power as well. To the extent kim jongun gains the capability to hold america at risk, it may be the case that he not only uses that as a shield we often talk about his imperative to be maintenance of the regime. When he has that capacity, he may well use that in a way that was offensive. He may use the Nuclear Umbrella as a conventional sword to attack other places to gain control and exert greater influence. Its not simply the threat of the use of Nuclear Weapons but kim jonguns capability to use any Nuclear Capacity he has to further other things besides Just Protection of the regime protection of the regime that you may have on his mind. Bret i asked general mcmaster. In this environment is it ok to go to the olympics . Dir. Pompeo yes, of course. [laughter] dir. Pompeo you just have to run fast. Lets turn to iran. Bret in congress, you were one of the congressman who spoke out about iran a lot to end all of the things they were doing beyond just the nuclear deal. You also spoke about their support of terrorism around the region. If President Trump ask you today is iran in whole Technical Compliance with the iran deal , what would you tell him . Dir. Pompeo i would tell him the intelligence we have seen to date indicates they are in substantial compliance with the nuclear provisions of that agreement. Indeed i have told him that. ,bret as far as the other things iran is doing it has only increased in your eyes . Dir. Pompeo theres no doubt about that. You need to only look to the past few weeks and the efforts of the iranians to exert influence in Northern Iraq as well as other places to see the effort to be the hegemonic power throughout the middle east continues to increase. There was a news story. It didnt get a lot of attention here. It got a lot in iran. I sent a note because he indicated that forces under his control might in fact threaten u. S. Interests in iraq. Bret the head of the kurdish force. Dir. Pompeo his commander has also indicated an increased willingness to potentially attack u. S. Forces that are in iraq with the consent of the Iraqi Government. He refused to open the letter. It didnt break my heart to be honest with you. What we were communicating to him is that we will hold him and iran accountable for any attacks on american interests in iraq by