And www. Cspan. Org. As candidates what the fairgrounds and speak at the candidates soapbox. Today, scott walker, followed by carly fiorina, and then lindsey graham. Tuesday morning, senator marco john kasich30 and if i look like. On wednesday, rep. Will speak at 11 00. On friday afternoon at 2 30, take cruise. Ze. Ted crui join the twitter conversation at dmrsoapbox. Campaign 2016, taking you on the road to the white house. Washington journal continues. Host joining us is Michael Farris, cofounder of the convention of the States Project. Here to talk about their efforts to amend the u. S. Constitution. Tell us what profit you to get behind this effort. I have been working around government for about three decades. Specifically here in washington d c. I became convinced that the combination of big ceilings eight cities, big media, and y and Big Government the burden of Big Government on us will never be solved inside the city. If we are going to do that, we need to get outside of washington. The only way to do a structural change is through article v of the constitution to limit the power of the federal government. Point, letsarting take a look at the fifth article hethe constitution at what is talking about. Theays if two thirds of states call for a amendment, it shall be valid. It also says it would take 34 states it would now take 34 states to call for a convention of the states. In 2015. Have filed this effort has passed and four states, georgia, alaska, alabama, and florida. Define this Term Convention of the states. Between afferent convention of the state and a Constitutional Convention . Congress,opposed to a you come together as one state, one vote. It is for a particular purpose. There have been over 30 conventions of state and the history of the american republic. About two thirds of those prior to the constitution, and one third since the constitution. Convention ofthe the states as you get together for a single subject and you discuss that subject and you come out with a proposal that is relevant to that. Constitution, for the constitution, they came together with the purpose of revising the government. Here, it is coming together for a particular amendment. There have been 400 applications for conventions, and we have never had a convention of the states because we have never had two thirds on the same subject matter. The starting point is you have to have two thirds of the states say we want a convention for this purpose. The purpose we are asking for is a convention to impose this restraint on the federal government, limit the power and jurisdiction of the federal government, and impose term limits on federal officials. It does not mean all those things will survive the process, but it means those things are what can be lawfully discussed at the convention. Host why wouldnt you do these things through the normal amendment process of the institution . Guest there is no way in the world that congress will propose any amendment to limit the power in washington dc. Model that isone bipartisan increase washingtons power, increase its influence. Host when was the last time the constitution was amended . Guest the 27th amendment was in the 1990s. It was proposed as part of the original bill of rights. That is an anomaly for the 18yearold vote amendment. Host we talking about amending the constitution. Amendoups efforts to some issues. You can join the conversation for republicans, 2027488001, democrats at 2027488000. For all others, 2027488002. Send us a tweet cspan. Head of the wall street journal in the Washington Times says what is involved in a campaign to start a convention . Guest we are trying to get grassroot participates of at least 100 people in each of the states. There are 4000 that are primary targets. If we can get 100 people and 75 of those districts, we believe that kind of pressure will allow state legislatures to feel free to vote in favor of a convention of the states. We hope this will get done in a couple of years. It will not take six months, it will not take 10 years. We hope that in about two years we will see a convention of the states. Host as the effort to call a convention of the states ever been undertaken . You said we have never done this before. Has anyone ever tried to call one . Guest there have been 400 applications. An organized grassroots approach has not been done very much. It has mostly been more inside politics were a group of state willlatures legislators say less try to do this or try to do that. It is not enough political punch within effort of only state legislators. You need both of them and grassroots participants to make this a reality. Host what is the situation in american legislators these days . Who controls a majority of the legislatures . Guest if you count nebraska who is officially nonpartisan but if you counted as republican which is the reality, there are 32 states where the republicans control both houses of the legislature. An additional six states where the republicans and democrats each have a house. 11 states my numbers are off by one. 11 states were the democrats control both houses. 32 plus seven plus 11 gets you to 50. Host georgia, alaska, alabama, florida, alter controlled by republicans . Guest correct. We were able to pass in a single house last year. We passed it in the iowa house this year, didnt get it through the iowa senate. There was a party shift from these house from the house and senate. Host is there a time limit for this . ,uest it is good forever unless one of two things happens. Either the legislature rescinds its application, or they put a time limit within the application itself. If they do that, then it expires according to its own terms. Host we have calls for Michael Farris on amending the u. S. Constitution. In North Carolina, go ahead. Caller good morning, mr. Farris. Do toan ordinary citizens get behind this to get this underway . Guest you can sign up on our website, convention of states. Com. We need health and north help and north caroline a. We had a committee this year. I came and testify. If there are enough restaurants backing, North Carolina is a state that should really pass a convention of the state. We got close to getting the votes there, but they werent quite there. We pulled back and are waiting for next year. Priorities again on what you would like to see addressed. Guest limiting federal spending, limiting federal regulation, balanced budget, some realistic checks and balances on the federal court, particularly the Supreme Court. The Supreme Court has said approximately 20 times that there is no realistic check on their power other than their own internal sense of selfrestraint. Either term limits or legislative overwrite oversight where something is done to check the Supreme Court. I was thinking when he was saying he was going to amend something, i thought he said he was going to amend Citizens United or something about congress representing the people rather than corporations. When somebody says Less Government to me, that says corporations. Passing, that would give them an enormous control over everything and everybody. Control, so whatever happens, he is in charge. They give very much. Guest i certainly agree that god is in control ultimately. The way to get money out of washington dc and money out of politics. Corporate welfare is not good for this country. The kind of corruption we see going on through the financial practices is because people can make money in washington dc by regulating. Where spending and regulation is located in washington dc, there is money to be made. If we fix the general welfare andse, the commerce clause, have those decisions dispersed throughout the country, the ability to manipulate the process efficiently goes away. The ability of big corporations to run this country effectively goes away. The diffusion of power will help the problem that lives at the heart of Citizens United. Host david in new jersey, independent line, good morning. Caller thank you for taking my call. My understanding is that paid benefits, pensions, for all federal employees, states, county, whatever, its constitutionally protected. Considering the status of so many states, if this is true, i think that protection should be a limited. Be a matter ofld state constitutional law, not federal constitutional law. There was an illinois decision on that subject. I was the decision. There was a state constitutional protection. I am not aware of any other state having that. If there is, it is very rare. There is certainly not a federal constitutional revision on that point. Government pension reform has to be a part of balancing the budget and getting the problem under wraps. Were not going to see this. Ountry get fiscally sound if we think the problem is 18 trillion, it is more like 100 trillion when you consider what we all people taking out of the Social Security trust funds, medicare, medicaid. The Unfunded Mandates are far greater than the stated national debt. Host david, stall echo any followup . Caller what i understand the guest is saying is that it is statebystate but it is very rare that the state actually protects employees and pays them pensions an . Guest as a matter of state constitutions, that is rare. Politically, it would be a difficult thing to undo pension plans. In fairness to people, you need to wind these things down. If youre going to change benefits to people, you cant do it with someone who is 59 years old. You have to start over and say if you are 59 years old, your plan is going to be different when you come out of the other side. You have to treat People Fairly who in relying on the system for a long time. Groups strongly oppose the effort of states to call a Constitutional Convention. Looking at the group democracy 21, they released a statement saying he call for a convention would place all of the Constitutional Rights and protections of individuals up for grabs. What is your response to that . Guest that is the same position taken by the john birch society. It is the not cases on the other end that take that viewpoint. There is no law behind it. We have 400 applications for a convention of the states that says you have to have an agreement on the subject matter. I actually litigated a case that is on the other side of that. Can you change the rules and the middle of the stream . The all rights amendment was originally given seven years for ratification. Congress reported to change the rules in the middle of the stream. I filed the first lawsuit challenge of the constitutionality of that change of process of the Washington State legislators 30 years ago. We won that case. The role from the Federal District court was that you cannot change the rules in the middle of the stream. If you have an agreement on the subject matter to start with, and you cant change the rules, then the fear mongering from the extreme left and right is nonsense. Power of the convention is no different than congress. You can call a convention for a particular purpose. Commerce can propose an amendment for a particular purpose congress can oppose i think we should have more of a socialist federal government. It is evil to think the states will fend for themselves. Guest he wants a socialist government, so that reveals his perspective. For a person who once a socialist government, it does not make sense. The epa issue in seattle, for example, is facing real problems and job layoffs because the epa has adopted a fish eating standard to Washington State they eat more fish per capita than any other state. They have higher mercury discharge levels. They are losing jobs in seattle jobs are threatened in seattle from the boeing Airplane Company because the people there are not able to get equal achievement by the epa. I think Washington State legislature could pass appropriate environmental for the state of washington. We dont need the epa to make edex for Washington State. Washington state can do it by itself. Edicts. Host from illinois, independent line. Caller thank you. Are you familiar with article 26 . Guest article 26 of what . Caller the constitution. Guest there is not. If you meant amendment 26 . Caller amendment 26, im sorry. Im not a constitutional expert. Im a citizen. Guest what about it . Caller i wanted to make note that unless the public gets angry, nothing happens. The people in power, especially the attorneys that come out of law school need to feel the power. This article to propose an amendment to the states march 23, 1971, was the fastest ratified amendment because the 21s of the day who were not could not vote but still he drafted still be drafted. My generation. I am a veteran of the did era of the vietnam era there were schools that were so concerned about control. You cannot vote but you could get drafted. I could die for the great legislatures who come up with a stuff but i cant vote. Is the only action way to any legislator anyplace will move is when the grassroot action becomes so powerful that their own livelihoods are put at stake. Do you agree with that . Guest i agree absolutely that grassroots action is the key. If i am recalling it correct, Jerry Springer had a lot to do with that. He made a popular. It is grassroots activity during that is exactly right. If people think that washington dc has aggrandized too much of its own power and is building up its power base to the detriment of both the people and the states, then we need a grassroots asked to list dismantle this. Convention of the states. Com is a way they can connect with us. Host orlando, republican line, hello there. Caller my question is when this convention is called, how do you envision it would operate . How would it organize itself and do the things it has to do . Guest we have a draft, a set of rules, that we are circulating around state legislatures run out. The principal rule is this. One state, one vote. States ase nature of opposed to congress. The delegates vote. And a convention of states, states will. One state, one vote. Central principle. I hope it would be organized in the middle of the country that would be symbolically helpful. Anyplace other than washington dc would be all right with me. You can keep that from tearing off the topics that you are calling a four, a balanced budget, money out of washington, and other issues. A man is being proposed by states that are not part of the original plan how do you keep a amendment guest theoretically, it would be nongermane to do that. They Political Forces that brought the conventions, the 34 states that brought the conventions would all be coming with instructions. You stick to this topic. The states will be under instructions to stay to the subject matter. The other 16, 17 states that it is that dont have instructions would not be able to carry the day. Ultimately, you can file lawsuits. I filed a lawsuit challenging the constitutionality one Congress Change the rules. We could file a lawsuit if delegates try to change the rules as well. Rules will be called, they will be called for a particular purpose. You have to stick to that purpose. Host our guest is Michael Farris, cofounder of the Group Convention of the States Project a state in for convention to address constitutional issues. Democrats line, missouri, hi steve. Caller thank you. I wanted to say that i spotted this right off the bat as soon as he stood up and said this is deregulation. That is the problem. We need regular shimon everything. We have we need regulation on everything. We have an out of control government. It is like donald trump talking about Ronald Reagan and how great he was. Ronald reagan the regular did everything and lower the taxes on the rich. He said he would close the borders in 1986. It never happened because they got cheap labor. This is all fraud and that is all i have to say. Thank you very much. Host the caller is selfinflicted. Guest he says the government is out of control but we need more radiation. Regulation does not regulate government, regulation regulates private people. That is the problem in the country is theres too many inflicting regulations. The basic genius of the founders is that one level, and only one level of government should deal with each issue. If we achieve that sure we need some radiation, some laws, but do we need sure we need some regulation, but do we need conflicting laws . Do we need a law on every level about the same issue . Do we need one level of government regulating laws, one on education, one on prices . Host a question on twitter. This one says we need a totally new constitution in line with reality. If it is broken, do not fix it. Steve says im for a convention of the states to fix the constitution. Rewriting the Second Amendment is long overdue. The federal government these to be more powerful. You cannot have 50 different state laws on marriage, abortion, or marijuana. Another one says we need a convention of the states asap. Texas, republican line. Good morning. Sam marcos. Caller i would like to clarify a couple of things. I think it is great what he is doing. Second of all, i am from new york but im from texas i live in texas. I think that anything that takes power away from the federal government is good. That being said, i think we need a few basic laws at the federal level that regularly all of the states. Regulates all of the states. I have seen in arkansas they have terrible roads. And other states they have privately smooth highways all over the place. Perfectly smooth i get there is a certain level of difference between each state and the way that it runs things. We need more power given to the individual and not corporations which, for some reason, are defined as people. Benefit foriggest limited government is that it increases the power of the people. The more government