could not have been more wrong on about the job of iceberg, which he described as quote, the most insignificant office that ever the invention of man contrived or his imagination can see. >> now, just expected john adams. it just never occurred to him that america would have a president like donald trump. trump, it can be argued, sees the job of vice president as very significant. >> good evening. i'm jim acosta and for laura on this friday night? the last time donald trump had a vice president, it ended like this with a mob of trump supporters storming the capitol, demanding day hang mike pence, punishment for not going along with trump's plans to subvert the 2020 election. as we all witnessed, trump saw the job of vice president as an aide he said the whole for maintaining the presidency, no matter what the voters decided. this time around, trump is likely applying a pence proved loyalty test before he picks a running mate, someone who won't let them down, no matter what. and it appears trump has maybe started to narrow down the shortlist cnn is reporting that senator marco rubio senator jd vance, and north dakota governor doug burgum are considered the top contenders, at least for now and behind the scenes, it turns out they each have a network of influential voice is bending trump's. you're trying to convince them to pick their guide for senator rubio. he has fox news host sean hannity and kellyanne conway it's corner not bad. they argued he'd helped trump with latino voters in key swing states. rubio, even recently won a straw poll at a high-dollar dinner last month at trump attended jd vance has some maga originals backing him. the president's son, don junior's, steve bannon and tucker carlson all pulling for the senator from ohio, seeing him as a fighter for the mega cause governor burgum. meanwhile, is getting backing from big business, the rupert murdoch news empire has been praising him with flattering editorials from the new york post and the wall street journal. not flashy, but mature they wrote a burgum. the governor has something else going for him. he appeals to trump's love of central casting, picking people who looked the part and according to fox business, burgum really looks the part katie pamphlets, you just matter. >> yes. yeah. this is bark. she says, you look like george washington. you look just like george washington focus in on him don't know if we have a handy picture of george washington. she claimed k is a very smart woman and my only question is how long have you looked like george washington barely about second use to be george washington john adams you have to wonder especially for rubio advance, if trump will be able to look past as he would put it, the nasty things they have said about it they can't stomach trump. >> i think that he's noxious and is leading the white working class to a very dark place. >> you know what they say about men with small hands you can't trust them. >> would you ever do business with donald trump i don't think so why i would i just think that it's important that you're judged by the company you keep are joining me now, former republican congressman joe walsh when we're obama campaign adviser or miescher cross. >> and washington post columnist philip bump you guys tried, didn't think we're going to do but john adams reference on a friday night. but here we are burgum rubio and vance are the top contenders. it seems right now, joe, a lot of people are in trump's here. >> i mean, what do you think? what's going to happen here? >> i actually think that unlike can 16, jim, i think trump thinks he's going to win. so i think he's kind of unchained. i think he's gonna do whatever he wants, not listened to who is advisers. what we know is this whoever he picks is going to have to say trump won in 2020 and is going to have to say the deep state is after him now outside of that, i don't think it matters. >> yeah. i mean, emission joe's got a good point. i mean, in 2016, it seemed donald trump needed mike pence to some extent and folks have been applying the mike pence model to doug burgum this time around and that he kinda fits the same old, but maybe if joe's right and down from thinks he's going to win, maybe he does go for our jd vance, somebody who appeals to the next generation of maga folks. >> i think that's right. the ground game has changed significantly since trump first ran at this point because he is the leader of the party that has been proven multiple times over. he also has such a strong hold on the base that he doesn't necessarily need someone to help him pull along some of these moves we're hard to reach things and i don't think he's worried about that. what he wants is someone who will be a strict loyalist. he wants someone who will not shake the apple cart too much because even wants to be the star of the show. he also wants someone and who will not run in 2028 because they think he's looking to have his son hoisted up, next election cycle. >> that's interesting and fill up i mean, you and i observed a lot of this a trump presidency. there is no other human being on the planet who could have been more loyal to donald trump than mike pence. i remember remember when they were going around the cabinet room table and they would all we would call it the dear leader treatment that they would give donald trump. they would praise him and no buddy prays donald trump like mike pence. it was, it was just something to behold and i have to think trump likes that and wants that this time around as well. i don't know what set me straight. what do you think? >> no. i mean, that's very true. i mean, i remember that it's time when done from moved his water off the table and mike pence moved his motorbike off the table. >> that synchronicity i think jewelries is an important point here, which is, this is donald trump. this is the guy who sees people on fox news and it's like, hey, this person should be in my administration are walking along with his valid plane and tap some first senior posts, like, who knows, right we go through the machinations of talking about who, who's on a shortlist. but he could throw someone on the shortlist 24 hours before he actually, now, it's just it's always up in the air with donald trump. i think that all the observations are correct, that he doesn't want some to overshadow him we want someone who's going to nod along with him wherever he goes. but there are lots of people who fall into that category. i think that until we actually hear a name, i would be pretty much just no one would sprite basically is anything short of hillary clinton would not, would not an opinion surprise that might be a little bit of a surprise i get your point. >> and joe, i mean the thing that i wonder about is that those clips we were playing earlier, they've all bashed trump in the past, especially rubio and vance. i mean vance has made hitler comparisons to donald trump with the best marco rubio is talked about donald trump saying those are things that he absolutely hates. dr. doug burgum maybe i wouldn't have done business with them. that doesn't i mean, that's, you know, not exactly on the same line. >> that's a great point. yeah those three went after him. and even when burgum says, i would never do business with them, that's a really big deal. but here's what else trump loves. trump loves when you that's something bad about them. and then you come to them and you're on your true and now you're the greatest thing in the lindsey graham example, these three are all that, that's me should, i mean, who? should the obama excuse me. >> freudian slip there. >> biden harris, a team worry about this time around. >> what do you think? >> i don't think they need to worry about any of the vp candidate. they think that they need to keep in donald j. trump because he is a wily fellow. he said someone who was completely unpredictable and looking at even with the felony convictions, it seemingly has only helped him in terms of fundraising capacity and it hasn't shrunk polls are to believe be believe it hasn't shrunk his capacity to maintain gains in the battleground states. yeah, the biden campaign has to be most worried about turning out younger voters black voters, ensuring that they show up in november yeah. >> what don't you make of this trump floating this idea of giving green cards to foreign students after they graduate. i mean, you here's what steve bannon assange about it. >> how about this is alternative we cut in half the number of foreign students we take in the country and allow american kids to get into those engineering school the exit visa should be clipped to the to the diploma. the exit visa now, i mean, apparently trump has walked back some of these comments saying there should be an aggressive vetting process, but i mean, it also really clashes i felt with what trump is set out on the campaign trail about migrants are poisoning the blood of the country and so on. >> what did you make of that hole 24 hours of news that that generate that comment? >> i mean, if it was really revealing, it was donald trump recognizing that people who immigrate to the united states have value, which is something you generally doesn't say, right? and i think the most telling example and i wrote about the state for the post was the fact that he has spent over the course of the past several months he keeps talking about military aged males, trying to imply that younger people were coming to the country or dangerous somehow, he literally said that china was sending people to the country to set up a secret army within the united states. but the people who we're talking about here are obviously military age because they're college-age students. >> the the one of the largest countries that is represented among the foreign student population. >> united states is chinese people it is the case that there are young chinese people who are attending universities who he understands have value and add value to the united states in the context of going to school. but he refuses to acknowledge that immigrants otherwise do. and so i thought it was really revealing because it showed the contradiction at the harb immigration policy yeah. >> joe, i don't know what you want to say in response to that, but there was a moment that flashing light hit that. maybe trump is thinking about marco rubio and putting it on the ticket because that idea from trump's sounded as though he's trying to moderate his tone on immigration just to touch. and it made me wonder if rubio maybe making some inroads here. i maybe i think you're giving trump too much credit, right? >> thinking this through, i think he look the base of the party is not there. the base of the party and look what trump did for four years when he was president, he limited as best as he could legal immigration. >> that's where the party is. unfortunate. >> family separation. that was among many policies, draconian policies that absolutely number that i would say republican lids and phobia and nash, white nationalism. this does not walk in locks, lockstep with donald trump when he was president or anywhere on the campaign trail up until this point. but i think he's being more responsive to the recent policies out of the biden administration moving towards creating pathways for for a daca recipients more so than anything else. i don't think that this has much to do with a potential vp pick as much as it is. hey, the president just released this a couple of days ago. let me jump into that new cycle on that front as well. it is receiving pushback from the base that he created that really doesn't want to to see any form of immigration reform. >> yeah, and fill it could be just as simple as something that flashed in his head one moment right before he said it publicly. i mean, this week phil i did want to ask you because i still have this on my mind for my show by 10:00 a.m. show yesterday, van joel segall, joe biden has a bad night during the debate. this could be it do you subscribe to that idea when you talk to folks, what are you hearing? and i did we have time quickly, just ask each of you that yeah. >> i don't think so. i mean, it is still early and obviously depends on what the bad thing is, but there's lots of time to recover i think a lot of the age stuff is frankly baked in jail. >> i agree it would have to be a horrible night. yeah. and you just don't see job? i don't see that. what do you think you can make sure? >> i don't see that happening either. the expectations are obviously higher for the sitting president than they are for donald trump going into this. but i do think categorically and historic we've seen sitting president in their first, their first debate, not necessarily knock it out of the park, but we know that joe biden is putting in so much effort here he is. he has some of the best the prize training him, walking him through this process. he knows what he's doing. he's not going to want this early, but he's got a lot of pros that that's true. the biden folks didn't want this early and you do you get the sense that the trump folks including donald trump, realized that they set the expectations too low for joe biden reason we've just everyday talking about his wandering mr. they turned him into mr. mo gu and if he doesn't perform like mr. mo gu, next thursday night, obviously he's gonna he's gonna have a good night and somebody whispered trump's here and said maybe we should knock this off all right, guys. thanks a lot. really appreciate it. just ahead religions entering the 2024 campaign with the new controversial endorsement from don trump will talk about this in just a few moments, less than a week away from the first presidential debate on cnn could change the minds of voters who are undecided at this point we're going to talk to two of them just a few moments. they were this for that thursday night live from atlanta the most anticipated moment this election biden renren read america isn't future because that's where we are a nation of possibility, trump. we had the best economy, we had the best border, we had the best of everything. and now we get to do it all hello, very good. we're gonna do it even better. two very different visions for america. >> one unprecedented night moderated by jake tapper and dana bash, the cnn presidential debate crews the net it nine live on cnn and streaming on max this is the one, this is what we call a question. >> student body math proficiency. but he said good, fair, satisfactory, like a percentage if you had to guess understood great student-teacher ratio we, bring, you, the real in-depth school info. what were you thinking? 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i want to bring in two undecided and independent voters to weigh and caitlin wander of florida and brandon nelson of minnesota, guys, thanks to both of you for coming on tonight, staying up late on a friday night for us i appreciate it. brandon, let me let me just start with you first. you voted apparently you voted for president biden four years ago but you're undecided this time around. why? >> that is correct i voted for joe biden for president in 2020 with my hopes that we would chart a path of courageous moral leadership and the oval office and several issues since that time have led me to regret that vote at this point such as my principal issue right now is the ongoing conflict between israel and hamas i recently became the new fec no, keep going, please. >> sorry for the audio delayed that's okay. >> i recently became a new father and that's come with a whole wealth of new responsibilities. and one of the big ones i find myself thinking about is what kind of a world i want, world i want my daughter to grow up for my entire adult life and most of my childhood, america has always been at a war-footing. and i was hoping that we could perhaps shift more towards a time of peace that's the world i hope that she'll grow up in i don't see the current administration taking the steps necessary to make that happen. >> and kaitlan, let me what's holding you back now you know, to be honest, i try to keep an open mind. >> i think that there's a lot of expectations on how to vote just from i wanted to really understand what was happening and look at the issues side-by-side and not just be fueled by emotion before starting to draw my conclusions. >> and i really am looking forward to the debate next week as well. just to hear the candidates speak, i think there's so much misinformation available today and again, it is so emotionally charged that it makes it difficult for us to discern the facts from the feelings and kaitlan, what are you going to be looking for in the debate well, on a very superficial level, i think that there is a lot of misinformation about joe biden and calling him sleepy joe and saying that he is in capable of filling the role of the presidency, which is being supported by videos that don't really represent his capacity, right? or his ability to lead. and i think looking and hearing and seeing how he presents himself live on that stage next to trump is going to be really important. for a lot of viewers myself included just to really validate and reinforce if he still has the capacity and what his stance is, what is he going to be changing are doing differently? in the next eight years, four years yeah. and burn. and what are you looking for at the debate? what are you gonna be watching for i think debates in the past, but i've