i'm i'm christiane amanpour in london. we will ask the tough question, tackle the big problems and let history be our guide. here is where we're headed this week. up first, after the slaughter, what happens when the dust finally settles in israel and gaza? i ask two women for a road map to peace, security, and rights for all. also ahead. >> we will forget about this. the camera will not let it happen. >> the only journalist to witness the fall of mariopol at the start of putin's brutal war. he warns the west not to forget ukraine with his powerful new documentary. then, from the archive, back to 1990, there's no place like home, for rural romanians who rebuilt their lost way of life after the iron curtain fell. >> and finally -- ♪ >> from harmonies to international stardom, the many voices of musical rod ji jacob caldwell. >> everybody has a voice and everyone is different and that's beautiful. welcome to the program, everyone. i'm christiane amanpour in london. for israelis and palestinians, what happens the day after tomorrow? this horrifying cycle of blood letting has left some 1200 dead in israel, on october 7th, according to the government, and more than 12,000 palestinians dead in gaza, according to the palestinian authority, ministry of health in ramallah. so if and when this current violence ends, what can be done to stop it from happening all over again? more and more of israel's friends and neighbors are making it clear, even now, that a two-state solution is the only solution to this endless war. >> i can't tell you how long it is going to last, but i can tell you, i don't think it all ends until there is a to two-state decision. >> the vision since 1993, when the oslo accords provided a framework for peace, but is that the only way? joining me to discuss this is may funda, an israeli human rights lawyer, and chief executive of the peace organization called a land for all. her father took part in the oslo peace accord negotiation, and now, she has a dream for what she calls two-state solution 2.0. and also with us, rahna salman, co director of combatants for peace who shares that dream, and she is joining us from bethlehem, in the occupied west bank. now, our colleagues of "the new york times" first told their story, and now we want to learn more. so welcome to the program. your organization is called got ants for peace, and you're working, i think, with people who actually were actual combatants and who now want to do things in a different way. >> yes, so i work with the combatants for peace, which is actually started in 2006 from ex combatants, so israelis who served in the israeli army, and palestinian fighters who spent time in israeli jails, for many years, and they both recognize that there is no military solution for the conflict. they both decided to lay down their weapons and join their forces to have a front against occupation and oppression, on the owe pppressive system. and the fighters have experienced conflict for many years, so they know there is no solution afterwards. and because of this experience, we have been looking at the nonviolence principle of the main dna of the organization, the sea change, for resisting occupation, for many years. >> and may, your father, as we said, was one of the negotiators in the oslo peace accord. what did you learn from him about occupation, i.e., palestinian rights, and what would make israel safe and secure as well? >> yes, well you know, we see now that there really is no military solution to this conflict. i mean there's no military solution that will ensure israeli security and definitely not palestinian security, so i think that's one of the realizations, and i hope that everyone understands, since october 7th, there will not be a military solution. and also after investing billions of dollars of a huge wall and putting all of the idf technology in, they still haven't gained security for israel. so i think that we learn a few things from that. a, we won't have security and safety or any viable future if we don't choose, right now, a political solution, and that the netanyahu government has invested in hamas as an asset, instead of investing in peace and negotiation, i hope that is number one that we learn, and the other one is that, you know, even if you separate and build a huge wall between israel and palestine, the palestinians don't have security, if they don't have security and safety, and their interests met, of course, side by side, with israel, having their safety and security, safety and interests met, we won't have security together. we are tied together in this homeland, which is one. we are two people, but this land is very, very small and in interconnected and inter dependent and that's what we need to understand and realize and thinking about my father, what i have learned is that i treasure, i treasure my values, i treasure my jewish tradition and history, but with the values of equality and justice, with being committed to my people, and my own liberation, i know that that is dependent on my partner liberation and peace and security. i know those two have to go together. and if we disintegrate those two, if we punch a hole in this boat, we will all sink together. >> it is incredible to hear you, as a jewish israeli talking about your own liberation, and how dependent that is on your neighbor. >> yes, well, i think that first of all, i hope the one other thing that we've learned on october 7th is that there is no shrinking this conflict, there is no managing this conflict, we can't normalize this conflict, and the only maybe silver lining is that conflict can and should be solved, and i think the international community has also been a part of not solving this conflict, not understanding that it has to come to an end. but the palestinians behind a big wall and not take into consideration their interests and of course israel and jewish interests, that just won't cut it. we have to think together. we have to co-create. and come together. to build the sustainable, viable future that we all deserve. >> so ronna, from your perspective, palestinian perspective, what is your vision for how you can implement what you're both talking about? >> i think it is coming along now basically that a two-state solution might be basically impossible to implement. because of how long the occupation has been going through. and the facts on the ground that have been created, especially about when we talk about the west bank, there are over 500,000 israeli settlers in the west bank. so politically now, i think realistically we have to talk beyond the two-state solution and discuss new strategies and come up with an alternative and a solution that would guarantee that all people will live in peace, security, and dignity, and civility. and actually of the conflict, and the occupation. >> so i know that may has talked about kind of a confederation. what is a confederation, what does it mean? >> so i think that maybe the best way, to try to imagine the impossible, which i know is really difficult to imagine right now, but i think it is really important to imagine a different future. i would go to the european union, and i would, if you would ever imagine france and germany being an open border, i don't think anyone 80 years ago, would be able to imagine that. what we started by saying, you know, there are two people, but we all have a very, very strong commitment and sentiment to this homeland. and that's the beginning. and what we're talking about is what we call two states, one homeland, so yes, two independent sovereign states, but mutual recognition, and a mutual infrastructure, in a way similar to the eu, and with the heavy bombs happening, so i'm a little distracted by the bombing -- >> are you all right? are you okay? >> yeah, yeah, i mean we're safe and okay, just, it is just, you know, intense days, and we're so lucky to be here and safe right now. as opposed to other people. so we're talking about a shared infrastructure, so mechanisms for taking care of things that we have to share, like human rights. like resources. like jerusalem. like in a way, even security. so it is very important for us to convey this message now. the day after is now. >> do you also, do the people who you talked to, the palestinians in your circle, understand that israel also needs its security and that it does feel like it is under threat? do you all have to understand the story of the other in order to make this happen for the future? >> yes, i work where there is a joint community, we are a community, a group of palestinian and israeli activists, working together, and coexisting together, because what may talked about, also, the collective liberation, we also want the israelis to be free from the fear and to have their sense of security. but as long as this keeps happening, neither a palestinian or an israeli will have a sense of security at all. definitely within the pain of the other, we see the other. and we work together. our lives are inter-playing. so definitely, the people are, the knowledge of thousands of palestinians, actually work inside israel, but since the war, they have been deprived like to continue their work. so there is already like some mixed cities within israel, so people already have been living together in a way, but the problem is with the system itself, the oppressive system, and the discrimination that is happening between the palestinians and israelis. >> it is really amazing to hear from you both. it really is incredible to hear your optimism and your realism. thank you both for being with us. now, while this war rages, ukraine's grinding fight for freedom continues as well. when we come back, the only journalist left in mariupol to witness the start of putin's full-scale invasion, and the obliteration of an entire city. >> the russians have been through the city. the war has begun. we have to tell the story. as we watch for what some analysts describe as a score wered earth policy in gaza, my next guest reminds that you is exactly what vladimir putin is doing in ukraine. pulitzer prize winning ukrainian journalist witnessed the dawn of russia's full scale invasion from the first city to be destroyed, mariupol. he remained there with a small team as the only eyewitnesses. here is a clip of the new film, "20 days in mariupol." >> this is painful to watch. but it must be painful to watch. >> the documentary is taking film festivals by storm and it is developing some major oscar buzz, as ukraine has officially entered it for the academy awards. welcome to the program. in some of the voice-over, you say, because the film obviously focuses, like many of our work, on civilians, and on the distress caused to civilians, you say note to editors, graphic content, this is painful, this is painful to watch, but it must be painful to watch. >> that's the nature. if we don't report everything as it is, if we don't show to people across the world, to our viewers, to our audience, the reality of war, it becomes acceptable. it is a big danger in not exposing the war for all of its absurd -- and if it is polished, if it is sanitized, then it is acceptable, and that shouldn't be the case. >> there was an information/disinformation, and the russians may say these are actors, these are ukrainians shooting themselves and blowing themselves up. how did you deal with that? did you even know that was happening? >> when i saw this horror that happened in the maternity hospital after the bombing, i knew that there would be such an important story, and i already knew that there was going to be contested, questioned, and i knew as journalists, we shouldn't try to fight any of that, we just keep working. that's the only way. >> let me put, you know, one of the kits, it is the kit around the world of the woman carried out of the maternity hospital. let's watch this for a moment. >> so i see you watching, and essentially, you're back there. >> yeah. i don't even have to watch. i remember the moment. every drop of blood. i want to say that's exactly why we need these document ris. first, it adds very, very necessary context of a part of news which are very short form, and the context give viewers, and the audience, the possibility to make the wrong judgments, and also, with all of the horrifying, and very important tragedies that are happening, when we are bombarded by them every day, these important stories are just watched, so the only way to preserve a memory of the arena, of galena, of ilya, of all of the children, they have died, it is to make a film about it. so to be sure that the memory is there. >> did she survive? >> no. the child also died. >> so what do you want to leave the world with? particularly as the world appears to be taking its eye off ukraine? >> look, i have a feeling, i have a feeling that when i'm on the ground in ukraine, and this is russian news as well, and for ukraine and the world news, i frequently come to the u.s. and europe, to just speak to audiences, one thing, one thing i started to notice, first of all, everything is connected. and although very different conflicts, israel, gaza, and russia attacking ukraine, there are the universal stories, that contextually, they are different and complex, all again connected. but also, i have a feeling that there are people who don't really realize what -- how russia sees the west, and this whole war right now. you see, russia is building its policy, its ideology, right now, since the full-scale invasion, as they are at war with the u.s. and with europe, so imagine this. the russian government, and the majority of russian people, right now, are at war with europe and the u.s. they're fighting the ukrainians, but the core ideology they have is they are at war. and i feel that that's not really coming through. and it's very dangerous. >> so do you find this is resonating with the audiences? what does the audience say to you at festivals, and i know there is a big oscar push as well? >> surprisingly, i thought ukraine is going to be less, in the last several months, as a big and dramatic conflict, and the middle east is raging, but actually, especially a story of mariupol, because of its symbolism, because of its visual and the dramatic similarity to what is happening right now, actually it gains in more meaning now. so people realize more and more that the world around them changed, and they have to react. the worst thing that people do now is to be indifferent. >> this certainly, certainly is not a film that you could be indifferent about. thank you very much, director of "20 days in mariupol," it is a really powerful, it is one of the best war films that i've ever seen. congratulations. and the film is available online now, there's more from ukraine, later in our program, when we have a special report on the 10-year anniversary of the pro-democracy uprising which set putin off on the bloody chain of events invading, and annexing and culminating in this, his full-scale war of today. my next guest knows all about the unifying power of people speaking as one. ♪ >> the audience choirs, up next on the show, my conversation with the teen sensation, catapulted to international fame, jacob. in order for small businesses to thrive, they need to be smart, efficient, savvy. making the most of every opportunity. that's why comcast business is introducing the small business bonus. for a limited time you can get up to a $1000 prepaid card with qualifying internet. yep, $1000. so switch to business internet from the company with the largest fastest reliable network and that powers more businesses than anyone else. learn how you can get $1000 back for your business today. comcast business. powering possibilities. welcome back to the program. a letter from london this week is the story of a home-grown hero. the five-time grammy-winning musician, jacob collier, became a star with his virtual arms, namesake ledges like quincy jones and herby hancock, the prodigious and complex style sees him layer sound upon sound, including his own voice to create cathedrals of sound in music. just take a listen to one of his latest singles. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ >> remember that is all him, and now he is set to release the fourth and final installment of his djesse album. i have been speaking to jacob about making the whole world his instrument. jacob collier, welcome to the program. >> thanks for having me. >> your latest album is called djesse. >> that's correct. >> and it is a spin on your initials, jc. >> my friends would call me jc when i was a kid. >> you have sean mendez. that is called "witness me" ♪ >> i'm with you ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ >> the thing that i think is really fascinating for me is that this is one you say is about the human voice. the others are r&b, jazz, folk, et cetera, this is about the human voice. and that is your thing, right? that's how you started. >> i've been reflecting a lot on how i began my journey as a musician, and the first instrument i ever really played with, the voice, and the thing about the voice, everyone has one and everyone is different and that is beautiful and to me, that is so important. i started my journey as a musician heavily layered aq capella, with many voices at once defined my fascination in the early days and more recently, i have become obsessed with the idea of the scale, and i have been toying on the concepts and talking to other people, and the thing that i find in all situations that really hits the spot for me, and really feels like the center piece of what this album is about, and what, maybe what i'm here to do at this time is to really give people a voice. >> and i'm going to play and then we will play it from "isn't she lovely" one you did very early which dem vats what you mean. >> okay, sure. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ >> i see you rocking to it. >> i haven't heard that for years. >> and you're so young. how old were you there? >> 17, 18 when i made that video. that was the very, very early days. what i was interested in is how can my voice be many different voices? you know how can i be the bass singer and the top singer. and tell a story that feels compelling, authentic. i was so interested in chords. the magic that happens when you put multiple notes together. and musical disharmony. >> i'm looking down and i see you wearing crocks, you have a pair of yellow crocs on, the ukrainian flag, and you put that up there. and so everybody can see that. yellow. okay. for you, one of your sessions, and i think you call it logic session, layer upon layer upon layer upon layer, you show a spectrogram of a croc and it produces a sound and it is a sound that i can't describe and you can barely -- >> yes. like this. >> yes. so explain that. the croc, the sound, the layers. >> i've always been interested in how how far you can stretch certain concepts and one of the things, one the tools you use as a musician is you start playing music, it is a speck trogram, a graph, high frequencies at the top and low frequencies at the bottom and every sound in the song exists on this graph, and it will go like this, right and there will be other terms as well, so i basically put this on my computer screen, and then i played it to see how it would be, and i found some kind of converter, where i put the image in and out came this crazy sound and i kind of like that and i will put it in my song. >> that's like double dutch for me. but i'm sure there are a lot of people who understand. and i appreciate the finished product. >> thanks. >> yes. >> it is difficult to understand it for a lay person. >> yeah. >> are you self-taught. >> i would say fundamentally, yes. i have many teachers along the way, mostly my heroes, who are my teachers, people i listen, to my mother is an incredible teacher to me. >> tell me about her mother. she is a musician. >> yes, she is a phenomenal f