kim jong-un's planned and very rare trip to russia. what it could mean to ukraine, and what a former american four star general makes of that and other key developments in the par. plus, is it passover already? the exodus is on from the burning man desert, where tens of thousands have been stranded by a plague of mud. good evening. john berman here in for anderson. we begin this labor day evening with a picnic, presidential politics, and polling. they all came together in new hampshire. several republican candidates stumping at the same picnic, and new polling that's no picnic for all but donald trump. it matters, the experts say, because now is when voters really start paying attention. and this is attention getting. trump now has the race nearly to himself. 59% report support from republicans. his nearest rival, ron desantis, now 46 points behind. as for a potential trump-biden matchup in the general election, it's 40-39 and a large number, 17%, undied. head to head without third parties forced to choose, the two were tied at 46. jeff zeleny is in new hampshire tonight. how many of the republican candidates were there tonight, and what are they saying? >> reporter: john, about half the republican field was in new hampshire today holding a variety of parades and picnics, as you said. so, about four or five candidates. we just finished an event in new hampshire with former vice president mike pence. and he gave a message that certainly many of his rivals could agree with. they hope the campaign is at the starting point, not the ending point, making the case that labor day is the traditional launching pad of a campaign. so, that is very much an open question. yes, of course, the former president has many supporters, as you were just saying, in those national polls. but state by state, the surveys are a little more competitive without question. and the burden is on many of these candidates to make it even more competitive. when you talk to voters, when you talk to republican voters, of course, and here in new hampshire, the all-important independent voters, there is a sense of many more open minds here trying to see what the field is doing, trying to see who could perhaps, you know, confront the former president in a one on one race. but his former vice president mike pence here just a few moments ago was answering a question from an independent voter here in new hampshire. and john, if there's not a democratic contest early next year, those independents, all important here, could vote in the republican primary. that's, of course, what chris christie is hoping for. mike pence was even trying to woo that independent voter. so, that could be a wildcard. but there is no doubt whether the campaign is the beginning stage or somewhere in the middle, donald trump has an overwhelming, commanding lead. >> independents obviously do matter in new hampshire. you are there. what else are you picking up on the ground? as you do note, it's a state by state campaign to the republican nomination. iowa first, then new hampshire. what is the specific state of play in new hampshire? >> look, the state of play in new hampshire is similar to iowa. the former president certainly has a sizable lead at this point. but there still is a sense that some republicans are window shopping, are eager to win the general election. and they wonder if donald trump is the person for that. i was having a conversation earlier today with the new hampshire governor, chris sununu and he pointed out how donald trump fared here in the general election back in 2020. lost to joe biden by some 60,000 votes. four years earlier, he only lost to hillary clinton by 3,000 votes. so, he believes if there was a rematch between trump and biden, that this simply would not be good for the republican party. so, yes, there is no doubt donald trump has a lead in this race. but even some trump voters with trump hats on, trump shirts on, still say they are sizing up this field of candidates, paying careful attention to the debate. so, the burden is on someone or perhaps a couple people to, you know, certainly increase their standing here. so, yes, he's the leader, the front runner. but, you get a sense of some open minds here as well, john. >> jeff zeleny in new hampshire. jeff, great to see you. joining us now, former republican congressman joe walsh, host of "the white flag" podcast, also stuart stevens. he's currently an adviser to the lincoln project. his upcoming new book is "the conspiracy to end america: five ways my old party is driving our party to autocracy." director of syracuse university's institute for journalism and citizenship. stuart you have seen a lot of labor days heading into primaries and general elections. at this point, do you see any evidence that any of the republican candidates are doing anything to puncture donald trump's lead? >> well, john, you'll remember when we first met in 2000, i was part of the brain trust that took a 60-point lead for george bush in new hampshire, and we lost my 19. you really have to work at. so, i think anything is possible. there's going to be a race here. trump isn't going to just walk away with this. the market demands a race. to me, the question is, the person in second or third, are they going to be offering an alternative vision to trump? and right now, the top three candidates in the republican nomination all support putin's position in the war. they really -- all of them say they will pardon trump and the insurrectionists. there's really no difference. there is trumpism whether or not trump is the messenger or ramaswamy or desantis is the messenger. so, that, to me, is the question. can someone who offers a different, very different, view of where the party should go and the country should go, do they have a fighting chance in this primary? i think the answer to that is, no, but we'll see. >> congressman walsh, i've heard you say the idea that it's a race at all is an illusion, it's trump's party, his nomination full stop. that said, what advice would you give to someone along the lines? what advice would you give to chris christie, what advice would you give to mike pence, what advice would you give to the people who are campaigning in new hampshire tonight have to any chance of beating trump? >> john berman, it's always good to be on with you, and it's always good to be on with my friend stuart stevens. there is no race here. i don't want a full stop because i'd like to say a little bit more. but i'm going to repeat myself. i'm a broken record. so many people in this country, so many people in your business, john, so many people in my business, pine for and pray for some kind of a race. and they just can't accept the fact that this is different, that my former party is not a party, that it is a cult. and donald trump is a cult leader. there's no race here. nobody -- stuart said it, john. nobody in the field is trying to beat trump, nobody. if you are a critic of trump, you have no shot in the party. if i were giving advice to anybody who wanted to run for president, it would be to go after donald trump with everything that you've got. but if you do that in this republican party, you're done as a republican. >> i don't want any full stops in this conversation. let me just be clear about that. to that end, margaret, let me try to go about this a different way. the latest republican polling is nt wa in "the wall street journal." they do paint a tough haul, a long road for any republican not named donald trump. four indictments and skipping a debate won't hurt him. is there anything that you think could? >> i think you've summed it up correctly. i mean, what republican voters in this survey are saying is that they're really treating trump like he is still the incumbent and that he's just running for re-election rather than, sort of, treating him like you would see the ex-president who lost the last election and tried to overturn it. that's not what the surveys suggest. this "wall street journal" shows desantis crashing, a slight uptick for candidates like nikki haley. one unknowable -- and i think this is what stu was, sort of, alluding to -- is that we haven't seen what would happen if every gop rifleval held hand and said, donald trump can't be the guy anymore. maybe it wouldn't make a difference. maybe his numbers would continue as they are. the reason they won't do it is because nobody wants to step out and have everyone else step back. and consultants are telling them, it's a death wish, don't do it. if you add up every other rival's support plus ron desantis' support, trump is just as solid if not more solid than he was before the four criminal indictments. and suggests that joe biden has a real race on his hands for the general election if it ends up being a trump-biden contest. i think that's why we're starting to see biden ramp up the criticism on the union stuff and the economy. >> we're going to get to that in just a second. stuart, margaret brought up something i wanted to talk to you about. she mentioned the idea of everyone else dropping out of the race. you mentioned you worked for george w. bush in 2000. i also covered you when you were working for mitt romney in 2012. he wrote an op-ed where he suggested that the other guys running against trump need to get out. he said, get candidates they support to agree to withdraw if and when they're past the nomination or close. that decision should be no later than february 26th, the monday following the contest in iowa, new hampshire, nevada, and south carolina. based on what you're seeing, do you think these candidates should think about getting out if they're in the low single digits? and if so, when? >> it depends on which candidates. i want someone who will oppose donald trump. i want someone who's going to go out there and say that donald trump is a huge danger to the country and trumpism is a huge danger. you know, i've tried to organize these things before, and i can say i've had 100% failure rate. you know, people run for president because they want attention. they want to be on the debate stage. and campaigns never end because, like, somebody just gets tired of running. they end because you run out of money or you run out of time. a lot of these campaigns are going to live off the land, be on debates. a lot of them are running for four years from now. some are running for cabinet positions. some are running, probably action for veep. most of the people in this race aren't really running for president of the united states. but you know, john, the thing is we just have to accept donald trump represents where the republican party is. he didn't hijack the party. he revealed the party. and that's why he's doing so well. >> joe, there had been conventional wisdom that donald trump maybe couldn't lose the primary but can't win the general election. "the wall street journal" poll has his neck and neck with joe biden. do you think that conventional wisdom needs to go out the window? >> john, if we haven't learned anything in the past seven years it's that every aspect of conventional wisdom ought to go out the window. when you poll republican voters, they particularly believe that trump has the best chance of beating biden. look, i think mitt romney is living in la la land. this is craziness. these people just can't accept -- none of us -- i have a hard time accepting it and i come from the base of the party. the base of the party is not where mitt romney is. it's where trump is. stuart's right. a candidate should come out and say, donald trump is an existential threat to this democracy, because he is. but if you say that as a republican today, you're done as a republican. i think the country needs to understand that. >> joe walsh, stuart stevens, margaret, i look forward to speaking much more with you in the future. next on patrol with the ukrainian drone team searching for targets. plus the impact their new defense minister could have. and what the possibility of north korea supplying arms to russia could mean on the battlefield. later, james taylor on the passing of the truly original, sadly irreplaceable jimmy buffett. . .....in real time. 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[ speaking in a non-english language ] >> reporter: ukraine's security service preparing for a raid across enemy lines. in a war of artillery and drones and plenty of creativity. >> it looks almost like a toy. >> it's chinese toy with some upgrades and some innovations, with some magic. >> reporter: enough magic that this specially made drone will travel far beyond the zaporizhzhia front line. in search of a russian air defense system, it flies deep into enemy territory towards a town that is one of the main objectives of the southern counteroffensive, tokmak. [ speaking in a non-english language ] >> reporter: at the other end of the phone and watching the same screen, a himars unit is ready to launch. a call center is back here, a reminder of his life before the war when this land was still ukrainian. >> now you can see on the road, this is russian vehicles moving. this is check point, russians. you can see in tokmak. [ speaking in a non-english language ] >> reporter: but tonight they've been unlucky. the air defense system they wanted to hit is no longer there. [ speaking in a non-english language ] >> reporter: home for tonight is a field about 15 kilometers north of the front line. using only red lights to avoid detection, they've got a bird's eye view of the battle below and what's happening beyond. >> we are hunting for them for some time. we have some results. we know where they're hiding. we know where they are moving. so, it's a question about time, just to find them. >> reporter: and each time it flies, the drone records precious information, the state of russian defenses, vehicles, and systems being moved. even if tonight a russian air defense system and its four to five officers were unbeknownst to them, spared. >> are you disappointed? >> no, no. i'm not disappointed. this is our service, it's our work. and we will continue to do it. >> reporter: until, he says, every last inch of ukrainian territory has been freed, however long that takes. >> and melissa bell joins us now. melissa, what kind of effect are these drones having on the counteroffensive writ large? >> reporter: well, they play an extremely important role from the point of view of the ukrainians, of course a surveillance role, but also an attack role. and this drone that night, of course, ended up doing surveillance. its plan had been to be at the helm of himars being launched. they're used extremely effectively, but they're used exstensively by both sides, and that makes things difficult. you saw how pain staking and slow that mission was, not yielding much as far as surveillance information. but imagine on that front line. we've been speaking with some of these soldiers, john, that have been responsible for the recapture of rebot na, considered a huge strategic gain for ukraine, a small piece of territory, but a big gain strategically. what they explained to us really was these were apocalyptic scenes. the terrain is flat and open. you have very little cover. one of them described the sky as being black with drones, russian drones, attack drones, kamikaze drones. >> the sky black with drones. melissa bell, you and your team, please stay safe. thank you. joining us now, cnn military analyst and retired army 3 star general mark hurtling. how significant would a meeting between kim jong-un and vladimir putin be? >> john, interesting developments today based on the defense minister shoigu's initial visit to north korea. it's going to be interesting. i don't think it will be as important as many people are saying it will be. certainly putin will be able to get a lot of artillery ammunition, which is what he craves. at the same time, he's willing to trade off a lot of technologies having to do with ballistic missiles and nuclear strikes. what you're seeing is a quid pro quo between two leaders that are both considered pariahs on the world stage. and they have no one else to turn to. china has relegated north korea to someone they don't want to deal with. same thing with putin. we'll see what comes with this and what the u.s. government and nato may do against korea to advertise some of the things they might be doing and giving up intelligence to show the world what they're doing in violation of many u.n. mandates. so, you know, they will both be able to try and get a partnership solid. but i don't think it's going to have much of an effect on the ukrainian battlefield. >> there's also this new -- probably new -- ukrainian defense minister. he's reportedly been involved in prisoner of war exchanges. he served as negotiator in the black sea grain initiative. how do you see him fitting in to the broader ukraine counteroffensive? >> it's interesting with him. you know, i think minister reznikov, who is the one being relieved right now, who's been the defense minister for a couple of years, the entire time of the operation, the illegal russian invasion of ukraine. he's tired. he also has, unfortunately, some of the aftereffects of corruption within the ukrainian government. and this is what a lot of americans don't know about, john. you know, when i was in europe, we had some real problems with dealing with ukrainians because they were corrupt in many operations, in the balkans, in iraq. they have -- the military itself has overcome that, but some of the government officials have not. mr. zelenskyy did not have much of a choice other than to relieve reznikov. now, umerov, the new defense minister, or what will likely be the new defense minister, as you said, he's a crimean tartar. his family was exiled to uzbekistan before he was born. he has a patriotism toward ukraine and understand what is russia has done in terms of occupying the territory of crimea. he went back to be the co-chair of something called the crimea platform initiative, and he was involved in high level negotiations for the release of prisoners from the 2014 war. so, i think mr. umerov is going to be a good replacement for minister of defense reznikov in the near future. and you add to that the fact that he's a muslim and he was part of ukraine's delegations with saudi arabia to bring the early stages of the peace process going. so, i think this is across the board, gives ukraine a fresh face in the ministry, and also lives up to zelenskyy's promise to eliminate corruption inside ukraine. >> certainly has a compelling résumé. that is for sure. general mark hurtling, great to see you. a quick note about someone whose name brought hope to -- captivity overseas, ambassador to the yatd nations, bill richardson, who died over the weekend. he helped secure the release of dozens of americans over the years from some of the worst places imaginable. bill richardson was 75. just ahead, law enforcement still on the hunt for an escaped inmate. who they turned to for help. that's next. that starts working in 30 minutes, while other allergy sprarays take hours. with astepro's unbeatably fast allergy relelief you can astepro and go! choosing a treatment for your chronic migraine - 15 or more headache days a month, each lasting 4 hours or more - can be overwhelming. so, ask your doctor about botox®. botox® prevents headaches in adults with chronic migraine before they even start. it's the #1 prescribed branded chronic migraine treatment. so far, more than 5 million botox® treatments have been given to over eight hundred and fifty thousand chronic migraine patients. effects of botox® may spread hours to weeks after injection causing serious symptoms. alert your doctor right away, as difficulty swallowing, speaking, breathing, eye problems, or muscle weakness can be signs of a life-threatening condition. side effects may include allergic reactions, neck and injection site pain, fatigue, and headache. don't receive botox® if there's a skin infection. tell your doctor your medical history, muscle or nerve conditions and medications, including botulinum toxins, as these may increase the risk of serious side effects. in a survey, 92% of current users said they wish they'd talked to their doctor and started botox® sooner. so, ask your doctor if botox® is right for you. learn how abbvie could help you save on botox®. loving this pay bump on our allowance. wonder where mom and dad got the extra money? 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[ cheers ] yeah! woho! running up and down that field looks tough. it's a pitch. get way more into what you're into when you stream on the xfinity 10g network. the hunt for an escaped murderer is now into its fifth day in eastern pennsylvania. and authorities have enlisted the mother of 34-year-old danelo cavalcante. they are broadcasting her voice, urging his surrender near the prison where he escaped. authorities are focused on a two-square-mile area of woods where they say there have been four credible sightings. authorities released video on saturday. they say it shows cavalcante at about 12:30 a.m. approximately one and a half miles from the prison. cnn senior law enforcement analyst andrew mccabe joins me now. andy, what does your gut tell you about how this guy has been able to avoid law enforcement for five days, especially if he's still in the area? >> john, my sense of this is this was likely an escape of opportunity, so not the result of a long-term planning, working with a confederate, developing, you know, assistance from inside or outside the facility. it was rather an opportunity presented itself and this guy ran. if that's the case, right now he finds himself without money, without transportation, without any sort of communications device, telephone, internet, anything like that, no food, no shelter. so, that would explain why he's not been able to get very far away from the prison. it also explains why he's been able to evade law enforcement in the more technical ways. typically you put surveillance on known associates and family members and residences and you listen to phone lines and hope that contact will be made in an effort to find assistance or money or transportation. he probably isn't capable of doing that right now, so he's literally living off the land in this heavily wooded area, surrounded by private residences on massive pieces of property. and he is just living from minute to minute. >> does the search get harder with each passing day, or does it get more likely he will make a mistake, slip up? >> i think both of those things can be true. typically, as the days go on, it gets harder and harder because that's built around the assumption that your escapees are continuing to move further and further away in a direction you don't know. this guy, because you had four sightings in the same area in the last few days, they can be pretty confident that he's still in the area. and then the mistake factor weighs in, right? if he picks the wrong house to try to break into or puts down -- he probably is moving at night and then sleeping during the day. if he puts down to sleep in the wrong place that just happens to get come across by law enforcement or others, those sorts of mistakes can really bring an end to this thing. >> what about the message from the mother that's being played from speakers. how much of a difference can something like that make? and what do you think went into the decision to try it? >> you know, my guess, john, is that they tried it because it was, you know, why not? it doesn't cost them anything. they have those patrol cars and the helicopters out there anyway. they're banking on the chance that this young man is so desperate and hungry and sleeping out in the woods, get getting devoured by bugs and suffering from the heat that he becomes so desperate that maybe the sound of his mother's voice could convince him to give up. the opposite is probably also true. he's so desperate to stay away from the prison he was sentenced to spend the rest of his life in. >> andrew mccabe, thank you so much for being with us tonight. appreciate it. >> thanks, john. just ahead, the escape from burning man and all that mud. before and bath fitter. now's the time to call bath fitter to get a beautiful after. with our unique tub over tub process, there's no mess or stress. bath fitter, it just fits. visit bathfitter.com to book your free consultation. i'm a bear. i'm coming out of hibernation after the best nap of my life... and papa is hungry. and while you're hittin' the trail, i'm hitting your cooler. oh, cheddar! i've got hot dog buns! and your cut-rate car insurance might not pay for all this. so get allstate, and be better protected from mayhem, like me. roar. (sfx: family screams in background) after rain, mud, dwindling food and water supplies, and a lot of online jeering by people who really like to mock the burning manifest value, drier weather today allowed thousands to finally get their trucks and rvs moving and leave. camilla bernal has the story of how burning man became a muddy mess. >> it's a real sloppy mess out there. >> putting a mote around the bar. >> reporter: tens of thousands of people stuck at burning man in a nevada desert over the weekend after heavy rains made a mess of the dirt roads. >> we drove out and got stuck and made one bad decision. it was up to here. >> reporter: hundreds of cars ended up stranded on roads leading out of the black rock desert in the northern western part of the state. >> everything was shut down and getting out was a nightmare. >> reporter: paul and his wife left maui's devastation for what was supposed to be a minihoneymoon. >> it was impossible to function, impossible to move around, impossible to communicate. entire camps became pretty much destroyed. >> reporter: less than an inch of water fell over one 24-hour period from friday to saturday. >> so much water. we are flooded. >> reporter: organizers of the week long festival asked attendees to shelter in place and to conserve food, water, and fuel. >> it's been fairly festive. everybody's taken it in stride. >> reporter: some so-called burners say the mood was festive until supplies started running out. >> everybody took their shoes off, started dancing in the mud. it was great. then the reality sunk in that we couldn't leave. >> reporter: there was one death over the weekend, which authorities say is not weather related. no serious injuries have been reported. >> everybody was helping each other out. >> people were making mud sculptures. >> reporter: deejay diplo and a few others, including comedian chris rock, managed to walk out and hitch a ride. >> i think sidney crawford, austin butler. it was a challenge but it was a highlight of the trip. >> tens of thousands are now slowly inching their way out of the event grounds. and the man burn and enormous totem effigy set on fire at the end of burning man each year has been delayed until tonight, making this year still an epic event. >> it is kind of a bonding thing. this is going to be one of those years when you look back and be like, oh, i was there in 2023. >> and camilla bernal joins us now from the site of the burning manifest value in nevada. so, how long has it been taking people to get out? is there a long line? >> reporter: a very long line, john. organizers saying on average, five hours, and it could be more. i talked to one man who told me he was in that line and decided that he was just going to walk because it was a lot quicker. organizers telling people not to walk and to be patient. they're also saying at last check, 64,000 people were still here in the desert. a lot of them staying for the burn tonight. but whether you leave today or whether you leave tomorrow, you're going to be in this long, long line. now, it is normal to wait a long time to leave the festival, but this time around, people leaving with a lot more mud and of course very happy to finally be out after two very difficult days, john. >> all right, camilla bernal, keep us posted. appreciate it. next, james taylor remembers his longtime friend and fellow sailor, jimmy buffett. ♪ good times and riches ♪ ♪ some bruises and stitches ♪ ♪ i see more than i can recall ♪ ♪ this is a g-rated show ♪ so caramel swirl is always there for the taking. ♪ ♪ wake up, gotta go! c'mon, c'mon. -gracie, c'mon. let's go! guys, c'mon! mom, c'mon! mia! 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(we did it) start today at godaddy.com ♪ ("un monde pliable" by jeongpill song) ♪ (♪) [camera shutter] (♪) (♪) (♪) (♪) (♪) fans and fellow musicians continue to share tributes to jimmy buffett, who died friday of a rare and aggressive form of skin cancer. he was 76. last night at a concert on long island, james taylor sang his hit song, "mexico" in honor of his longtime friend. >> so, we wanted to dedicate this song to him. he covered this long of mine, one of two songs of mine that jimmy covered. and it's just my favorite cover ever. this is -- so, this is for jimmy. >> he and buffet sang that same song on stage together a decade ago in boston. take a look. ♪ oh, mexico ♪ ♪ sun so sweet i've got to go ♪ ♪ i forgot to go home ♪ ♪ guess i have to go now ♪ >> and james taylor joins me tonight. james, thanks so much for talking to us tonight. i'm sorry it's under these circumstances. what went through your mind when you heard your friend, jimmy buffett, had died? >> well, i was actually on my way down to long island, and i was hoping to visit, you know. so, just what went through my mind is that i was too late. >> you first got to know him -- i was just reading this lovely piece you wrote for "rolling stone." one of the first times you met him in person was in the early '70s sailing. you mentioned long island. i think this was martha's vin guard where you first met him. when you first met him, what were your impressions? >> well, you know, i -- his reputation preceded him. you know, he was -- we just -- we had a lot in common. we knew a lot of people in common. and, you know, he was just known in the sailing community. that's really where his popularity really started among people on their boats. and that was somehow somewhere near the heart of his, sort of, zeitgeist was that sailing world and the caribbean and the sea. you know, that's where he was happiest, and he kept coming back to it. >> we're looking at pictures of the two of you singing together. and you did perform over the years. what do you think made him so special to audiences? >> it was a, sort of, generosity of spirit. and the degree to which he shared his unbelievable joy at being who he was, where he was, where his audience, just, he loved being jimmy buffett. and he loved living that life, you know, sort of, writ large. >> he loved being jimmy buffett. people would go to the concerts, the parrot head spins to the left, spins to the right. people love that margaritaville lifestyle. was he the same in person in real life as people, i think, wanted him to be, the life they felt he embodied? >> yeah, to a remarkable extent efs he was the person that he, sort of, offered up as a character, you know? he was just exuberant and energetic and adventurous, always looking to push the envelope. and, you know, he was a pilot. he was a surfer. he was all of those things. and, you know, he was -- but, you know, obviously he wasn't an abandoned, dissipated partier all the time because he was definitely in control. >> how did he change over the years? i have to believe the life of jimmy buffett in the early 1970s versus the last ten years has been a little different. >> no, it's amazing how little he changed really. i think he just applied that, kind of, enthusiasm and generosity of spirit to pretty much everything he did, you know, business or performing or just any of the enterprises, the books he wrote, his musical -- you know, everything he did. i think of him as a -- and i think of myself also as a band leader. and he loved that musical community that he basically had assembled around him. and that -- you know, he just loved being with them, being on stage with them. you just always got the sense that he was having a great time, you know? >> you said you were headed to long island and you thought you might get a chance to see him. i'm so sorry that you didn't. what would you have said to him had you had a chance to see him one last time? >> i have no idea. i don't -- i don't know. j just, good to see you, man, good to see you. >> and i'm sure it would have been good to see him because i think by and large it must have always been good to see jimmy buffett. i know it was always good to see him when i went to his shows. james taylor, thank you so much for being with us. i really appreciate your time. thank you for your loss. >> thank you, john. sorry for all of our loss. next, the legacy of another music legend, a preview of the cnn film "little richard: i am everything" and anderson's conversation with the filmmaker. ♪ meet arexvy. 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(vo) learn more. it's your vision, it's your verizon. the beatles were not the only rock and roll pioneers. there was little richard. in just a few minutes, the cnn film, "little richard: i am everything" takes a look at his remarkable life. >> watching it happening, don't have to stand there. use the whole stage. richard would work that audience, get them up out of their seats, swaying, shouting, waving their arms. >> all right! >> responding stuff. >> all right! >> so, i saw little richard 30 times, you know what i mean? every time i realized he was doing -- in the theater in northern england, basically. >> a quick preview of "little li richard: i am everything," again, just moments away. anderson spoke with the filmmaker, lisa cortez. >> what was it about little richard that got you interested in doing this? >> when richard passed away in the spring of 2020, it's the pandemic, we're all at home eating chips and dip. and i realize that there had been no documentary on this person. because i wanted to learn more. and i also felt that, as i continued to work on the film, it became increasingly important to make certain that all of our histories were told with depth and complexity at a time when increasingly there are many places that want to especially tamp down the telling of black histories. >> it's so interesting about little richard. and this really comes out in the film. you know, when somebody dies, everybody knows the name little richard. they know "tutti fruity." they know "long tall sally." they know songs. they think they know him. but when you start to scratch away, you talk about this complexity. he was an incredibly complex character. >> well, you know, little richard is sitting at this moment in history in 1955. he comes on the scene with "tutti fruity." it's also the same year that emmitt till is killed. it is a time post-world war ii of aspiration and great movement and change. it's the growth of the teenager. and here comes a black, queer, unapologetically loud rocker disrupting the stillness and bringing this an ark cal, rebellious spirit that brings so much joy, but it also challenges people too. >> how was he able to do that in the jim crow south? >> well, it's a really good question. but, you know, there's been a lot of other gender nonconforming artists, you know, who are queer and out. liberace is having hits in the '40s. and if we look at american history, there has been gatherings of drag kings and drag queens that go back to the victorian time. >> seen in the 1920s in harlem, there were huge drag balls. they were covered in papers and it was very public. >> yeah, i mean, americans are not as conservative as we often times want to think. >> and yet he also -- i mean, he had white audiences. he had -- i mean, sometimes his audiences were integrated in areas where there was not allowed. >> and, you know, he liked to say that he broke down segregation. well, i don't know if we can go that far. but there is something about being in spaces that had only been strictly black or strictly white, where young people come together and find this commonality through the music. >> you also forget how big he was. the beatles opened for him for a while. >> he brought them to hamburg. he introduced billy preston, who some call it will fifth beatle. the rolling stones were a bar band and opened for him for 30 days. >> that's amazing. for 30 days, really? >> yes. and, you know, mick jagger is really fantastic in this film explaining what he was able to learn from observing richard 30 days in a row. >> wow. that's interesting. and i mean, you look at prince and little richard, i mean, you see, sort of, things that prince was borrowing from little richard. >> well, there's the performance. there's the fashion. there's the, kind of, unabashed sexuality on display with your lyrics. and i would like to posit that little richard's dna continues. it continues with artists like lil nas x or saucy santana. it continues for people who are non-conforming and are, i think, in a space now where they have greater freedom to present their full selves. >> did he -- i mean, was the end of his life, his career, did he have money? how was his end? >> well, his end was with family. he was comfortable. and i think there still, though, was this lingering desire to really be recognized correctly in the

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