which is good, because we've got a lot of news. >> it is. and we like news. >> and we'll start with district attorney fannie willis who is set to lay out the details of her case against president trump. it's part of his former chief of staff mark meadows'ed by to get his own case move to federal court. >> at the same time, trump's legal team will appear in washington, d.c. as part of his federal election interference case. the judge could set a trial date for that case as soon as today. >> well, that as the justice department is now investigating a deadly shooting in jacksonville, florida, over the weekend, as a hate crime. the sheriff there says a white gunman targeted and killed three black people at a store after first going to a predominantly black university and being turned away. that sheriff will join us live just ahead. this hour of cnn this morning starts right now. and we are just two hours away from two crucial court hearings, involving two of the four cases against former president donald trump. one is in washington, and the special counsel's election interference case, the other in georgia, where trump and 18 co-defendants are accused of subverting the 2020 election there. >> in the d.c. federal case, the hearing is over when to hold the trial for donald trump. special counsel jack smith is pushing for a january start. so in just a few months, trump and his team say the trial should not be until april 2026, long after next year's presidential election. and in today's hearing in georgia, former trump white house chief of staff mark meadows is hoping to get his case moved from state court to federal court, and it could be the first time we see fulton county d.a. fani willis sketching out parts of her evidence in the sprawling anti-racketeering case against meadows, donald trump, and the 17 coother co-defendants. georgia secretary of state brad raffensperger, who trump pressured to find the votes on that infamous phone call has been subpoenaed to testify. >> we have full team coverage of both cases. cnn senior justice correspondent evan perez is outside the u.s. district court in washington. but we'll start with cnn senior crime skand justice reporter, kaitlan polantz, outside the fed courthouse in atlanta. walk us through what we're expecting today. >> reporter: today is the opening salvo of any of the criminal cases against donald trump, as far as evidence presentation goes in court. what's going to be happening today in this federal court in downtown atlanta is that mark meadows and his lawyers, his lawyers at the very least, are going to be here. and they're going to be trying to show a judge that what he was doing after the election that has become part of the allegations against donald trump and 18 others in this racketeering case that georgia has brought against them, they're going to try to show that mark meadows was doing his job as the white house chief of staff, something under his official duties, that he was operating in good faith. the district attorney, fani willis, she does not want him to be able to show that. so she's going to be presenting evidence that we know of already, including witness testimony from secretary of state brad raffensperger, from an investigator from georgia, two two lawyers that were affiliated with donald trump after the election. and that witness testimony, what she's going to be trying to do with that show that mark meadows, as he was facilitating calls between donald trump and georgia, georgia secretary of state raffensperger, others, and also as mark meadows was potentially reaching out to state legislatures, all of that effort was political. and it will be up to a judge ultimately to decide who wins. we might not get a ruling today, but it's important here what the judge does and what the judge says, because when the judge makes a determination on this, it is the question of, does this case stay in state court, where the d.a. has charged it, or does this become a proceeding in federal court, where meadows and others who worked for the federal government, potentially even donald trump himself, have protection around them because they were federal officials at the time of this 2020 election allegations. >> it's a critical question. swinging over to the federal case, the federal side and evan perez. what does the trump legal team want and what do we expect the special counsel is looking for today? >> well, phil, what they're trying to do is buy some time for the former president. as you know, he's running for office, he's running for president again, and he is trying everything he can to delay all of these proceedings before he has to stand before the voters in november of 2024. they've asked for an april 2026 trial date. something the judge, judge tonya chutkan has indicated that she is inclined to try to set a trial date at this hearing today, perhaps as soon as today. and we know that jack smith, the special counsel, he's asking for a trial in january of 2024. now, the former president's legal team is saying, look, we're buried under millions and millions of pages of documents that were produced as part of this case, and of course, his other case. this case is very narrow in comparison to the one that was brought in georgia. the one that kaitlan is covering. he's facing four charges. one of them is defrauding the united states, obstructing congress, and of course, disenfranchising voters in the state where the former president was trying to overturn the elections. we expect that judge chutkan is going to force the two sides to perhaps defend why they want these trials, but what we expect, fill and sarah, is that judge chutkan wants to have this trial, perhaps next spring, next summer, before the election. she's already signaled that she believes that this is a case of importance for voters and for the american public, for the determination to be made before the election. guys? >> all right, big day for both of you guys, kaitlan polantz and evan perez, thanks, guys. >> joining us right now, we have a crack team in here with us today. eli honig, national correspondent for "the washington post," philip bump, who also has a great book called "the aftermath," and former press secretary under donald trump, sarah mathewses, as well as cnn political analyst and politics reporter for "the new york times," astead herndon. i will not forget you again, even though you're not in the studio. so happy you're back. >> thank you, i appreciate it. >> i'm going to start with you, eli. what should we expect from these hearings today? hopefully getting a date? also seeing, maybe, a case laid out for us, right? >> yeah, so i think, first of all, starting with the mark meadows motion to move into federal court, we're going to see live testimony -- we're not going to see it, because it's not going to be on camera, but the judge will see live testimony from brad re raffen raffensperger, also from this investigator, frances watson, who was pressured by mark meadows and others to recount the vote. this will be the first time we see live testimony in any of these cases. on the d.c. case, the trial date is so important. there's this wide gap where trump team's has asked for 2026 and doj wants it in january of 2024. both are unrealistic. it does seem clear that judge chutkan is going to set a date before the election, but where does it land? >> astead, somebody who's out on the trail and constantly talking to voters, i care less about -- i guess, i'm less interested at this moment in, what does the republican primary electorate think about trump? for me, campaign organizations, where i think this could really have an effect, the calendar and the money. when you talk about a campaign, even if you're plus 30, plus 40 in the polils, where do you see this having the biggest impact? >> i think you really identified it. it's many that colalendar and i the amount of money the trump campaign will have to spend on this legal campaign. they're really concerned about, where does he physically have to be in the year of 2024, and how much wiggle room will he have to actually get out on the trail, or will it be all wrapped up in these kind of -- in these legal trials. the calendar is usually important, and you kind of zwre overestimate the amount of money that has to be spent here and how much that has weighed on trump and those around him. we know the apparatus of the republican party has lent itself to him as he's faced some of these legal problems, but i think that's going to become more -- that pressure is only going to become more intense. i mean, this is the really necessity of him winning this primary, because i think, if a republican nominee for the next election is standing in front of all of those indictments, that's a little different than the former president standing in front of those indictments. so the campaign sees its legal strategy as political, not just because it puts it in a different mind for voters, but actually foremost because it might lend itself to getting some financial backing and also kind of create some wiggle room on the calendar front. they don't want to be in courtrooms all year during 2024. and that's actually how this is turning out to have biggest impact. >> philip, now to you, you have this article where you kind of went through trump's post-campaign comments, did you see anything in there that you were surprised to learn or was this the same-old, same-old? >> i was not particularly surprised. trump went down to fulton county and he stopped and made these comm comments. what he did is made this pointed political calculcalculation. politics is at the heart of that case. and he makes these arguments that are really centered on how this is the target of this, you know, oppressive force, you know, the elites are out to get him. and it's the same standard pattern that we've seen before, with some very specific things to georgia about this case as opposed to the federal ones. but this is what he's trying to do. he saw this big jump in both support and fraundra-raising in manhattan and didn't see as much after the federal indictments and he's hoping that this local indictment, where he can focus on someone who isn't jack smith, and who is a black woman, he can focus on that -- he can parlay that into money. >> and if you look at the numbers, the first day, 4 plus million, i think $7.1 million up to this point. it's born out that it has been much closer to what we saw after the first indictment. >> and when you talk to republicans behind the scenes, but from the donor perspective, like, they're not getting that money from big donors, and i'm not totally sure how sustainable it is long-term. are big republican donors looking around saying, four indictments, look, we'll be there in the general? because that's the question money wise that i have right now. how sustainable is that when this is all small dlollar and a some point you'll need big dollar. >> i've long believed that trump jumped into the 2024 race, because he knew he was facing legal troubles and he wanted to be able to fundraise off of it. and also he can claim that this is politicization, he can use this as a shield and say that they're coming after him because he's a candidate. but if i'm a big donor, i don't necessarily want to donate to him, because i see that he's using these donations to defending not just his own legal fees but his co-defendants legal fees. i think i would hold off until the general, but these donors are having trouble identifying who they want to put their money into for a primary. desantis was kind of the first person that they were eyeing. and now that his poll numbers have seemed to decline, i think they're looking for someone else to put their money into, to potentially defeat donald trump in a primary. but that hasn't happened yet. >> it will be interesting to see. i want to ask one last question to you, eli. what if everyone in georgia, i know this is a what if, but i couldn't help myself, if everyone says, i want a speedy trial, what happens? how could they do it? two have. >> this is going to be a big problem for the prosecution, because we've had jeffrey clark -- sorry, john eastman ask for a speedy trial and sydney powell as well. that's going to split this into two pieces. we'll have an early trial that's going to be in october of 2023 and later trial. and there's no way to stop that if you're the prosecution. under georgia law, if a person invokes their speedy trial right, as a defendant, you get your trial has to start by november. and all the other people that go second, they sit back, you watch, you take notes, you see all the government's witnesses take the stand, see how they're cross-examined. there's an normal tactical advantage of them going second, but because of the way the speedy trial rights work, there's no way to stop that. i should say, it's chesebro that asked -- >> a lot of different lawyers, a lot of indictments, a lot of different trial dates. >> a lot to cover. appreciate you guys helping us walk through it. astead, we see you, even if sara doesn't. i still see you. >> under the bus every time. >> thanks, guys, appreciate it. also this morning, president biden offering condolences to the families of three marine base killed in an air crash during military exercises in australia. the latest on the investigation. that's coming up. and the sheriff in jacksonville, florida, calling the gunman who opened fire in a dollar general store quote madman who hated black people. we'll have a live update on the investigation from that sheriff, coming up next. >> from years ago to listening to people say, you know, as a black people, we've come a long way, after what happened yesterday, i question that and say, have we really? 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know. and then you took your own life. that's just the cowardly way to go. >> that was a family member of one of the victims of saturday's deadly shooting of three black residents at a dollar general in jacksonville, florida. she described 29-year-old jerold gellion as a fun-loving young father of a 4-year-old little girl. a little girl who still did not know a gunman killed her father as of last night, because her family just hasn't been able to find the words to tell her about it. the sheriff in jacksonville says a madman who hated black people targeted those victims. the sheriff released video of the moments the gunman approached and entered the store. there's a still shot of that there. we're just showing you a still, because it is extremely disturbing to watch and we know what happened next. three people were killed over 11 minutes. two others, another shopper and a store worker then he killed himself as officers arrived at that scene. the sheriff says the killer left behind racist messages and that it was clear he was targeting black people. now the justice department is investigating the shooting as a hate crime and an act of racially motivated violent extremism. joining us now, jacksonville sheriff, t.k. waters. sir, thank you so much for coming on. i know that you are extremely busy and i know that you are heartbroken. i wanted to just get an update on where this investigation is. before i do that, do you think this was a hate crime? because you've read the words of this man, who perpetrated this horrible violence. >> yeah, absolutely. there's no question about it. he hated blacks and he -- i think he hated just about everyone that wasn't white. we've made that very clear. >> you talk about him as a madman. when you say that a lot of people will jump to this conclusion, that he was insane, he didn't know what he was doing, is that how you see it? >> no, i don't want to give him that -- i want to make sure people understand that he is completely accountable, he understood what he was doing, based upon the things that i've read, he understand what he was doing and he understood why he was doing it. >> can you tell us where you are in this investigation? obviously, the suspect is dead and i think you told us that you heard -- that your deputies heard a gunshot go off and he killed himself. where does the investigation go from here? >> so how these things work, we start from that point now, we're going backwards. and every day, we're learning more. i just had one of my chiefs come in, and he's getting ready to update me on some new information. so we're going backwards. and we're trying to learn everything that happened. i try to give more and more as each day passes. i learn everything that happened and led up to that innocent. we gave a pretty detailed timeline yesterday, but i just found out some more information. so we're continuing to learn, but we're going as far back as we can to get to -- we want to find out when this all started. >> sheriff, you know when you said, i just found out new information that the reporter in me has to ask you if you can share any of that with us. >> i can't share it yet, because i'm waiting for the full update from my homicide team and one of my chiefs. when i get that information, we'll get that out. >> sheriff, thank you so much for that. let me now ask you about, when you're looking back, when you're doing this and going back, is there any indication that there were others that perhaps knew this was going to happen or perhaps helped him, whether it be, you know, obtaining the guns, which i understand were purchased legally, or had some inkling of who he was and what he was about to do? was there anyone, do you think, that may also be charged in this case? >> you know, we don't know. that's part of the investigative process. we're still looking into that. our partners at the fbi are also looking at some things to see if things branched out. but as we can see right now, there was no one else involved. he actually claimed to be a lone actor in this himself. but we haven't found anything to indicate that yet. >> he first ended up at a historically black university, the edward waters university. was there anything that you found that showed that he intended to actually attack that university before going to this store? >> no, there was not. so i'll tell you this much, and we learned this yesterday. he had the opportunity to do so and he did not. for some reason, he was focused on that dollar general. he left that parking lot. there were two people in very, very close proximity to him that he did not do anything to and we're thankful for that. he left there and went directly to dollar general and started his killing. >> there are lots of places, lots of states that are either looking at red flag laws or have red flag laws. was there anything that could have been done to prevent this, legally -- >> it's very difficult. you know, the -- it's very difficult. the process in allowing people -- and i'll say this, and this is not my intent to be political at all. the object is not necessarily the issue, it's a tool. what the problem is, is you can't read people's minds. we try to go back as far as we can to figure out what happened, where he went off the tracks. i know there was a bike wreck when he was 15 years old, he was sent for a 72-hour evaluation. the 72-hour evaluation, they released him from that point, but that does not mean he was held as a mental patient. that's probably why that did not show up when our gun dealers ran his information. they did what they were supposed to have done and it just didn't come up. >> do you think that should change? that if someone is picked up on a 72-hour hold for a mental disturbance, that that should be put into a record? >> you're also dealing with the fact that he's a juvenile. there are so many protections in place for juveniles, for medical health, and that's a medical issue. that's far beyond the police and the scope of the police. i think that there are different ways to try to address that, and it's going to take more than just law enforcement. it's going to take government agencies and communities. it's going to take the medical community, the psychiatric community to be involved in working on that problem, on that issue. >> can i lastly ask you, how is the community doing after going through this? and particularly the black community, who was targeted for no reason at all, except for this person apparently had hate in his heart? >> i can tell you, i think that the black community is hurt, but i think they're strong, resilient. i think we banded together very well in this -- jacksonville, this is not representative of jacksonville. and as a matter of fact, this person did not live in jacksonville. he came from a neighboring county to wreak havoc in our community. jacksonville is a strong community. jacksonville is a very tough community. and there are pockets of issues. there are. there's no doubt -- there's no doubt about that, but that's everywhere. i believe this country is a great place and i believe this city is a great place. i believe our community is strong, resilient, i think they've banded together, and i think we're going to get through this and be stronger because of it. >> sheriff tk waters, thank you so much for your very honest discussion on what is a very difficult time there in jacksonville. i appreciate you. >> thank you very much. also in florida, ana marie island looks beautiful right now, but it is bracing for tropical storm dahlia, which is expected to intensify into a dangerous hurricane by the time it hits florida's coast. how the white house is responding, that's next. experts are already warning travelers to brace for a hectic labor day weekend. hey, phil, maybe we should just stay home? you know what i mean? tips on how to avoid the chaos, that's next. carvana has hundreds of thousands of five star reviews and counting. the 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cellular data and up to 4 hours of battery back-up to keep you online. only from xfinity. home of the xfinity 10g network. florida's gulf coast is on high alert this morning as tropical storm adahlia churns towards the state. a white house official telling cnn that fema is pre-deploying emergency personnel to florida today. the storm is expected to intensify into a category 2 hurricane before directly hitting florida wednesday. hurricane and storm surge watches are in effect along the state's west coast, including tampa bay. cnn meteorologist derek van dam joins us now. derek, the time to prepare has to be now, is that right? >> yeah, without a doubt, because we anticipate the earliest arrival of tropical storm force winds across the southern florida peninsula, roughly about 6:00 a.m. on tuesday. and as you head a little further north, north of tampa bay into the big bend area, we're talking about roughly 4 to 12 p.m. on tuesday. you don't want to be setting up your hurricane-proof shutters, for instance, in the middle of tropical storm force winds. so now is the time. it is your last full day for that opportunity to prepare your property. 65-mile-per-hour winds. it's basically splitting the difference across the yucatan channel. this is important. it is now moving north at 8 miles per hour, and that's actually increased in forward speed since the 5:00 p.m. eastern standard update. now, we do have a major hurricane in this forecast. that's important. if you're just waking up this morning, that wasn't explicitly in the forecast this morning, but now it is. we know the waters are extremely warm over the eastern sections of the gulf of mexico, so anything can happen. we've seen this story unfold time and time again. there's some explicit wording from the national hurricane center for rapid intensification, so we'll be monitoring that closely. how will this impact the storm surge? keep in mind, we have a full moon that will be impacting this and the potential there for inundation of up to 10 to 11 feet, right near that big bend area. the other concern is inland flooding, because the potential for 4 to 8 inches, perhaps up to a foot of rain is possible. and notice, this is not just a florida storm, this moves across the carolinas and into southern georgia, as well. timing this out, latest information from the global model from the american model, look at that. that's wednesday morning across that catcher's mitt, the big bend area that will push up a lot of water and a lot of rain. this is an interesting way to diagnose the threat for wind across the florida peninsula and particularly throughout the tampa bay region. we want to see that trek further west, but that's just not the case. the potential for hurricane storms exists, and look a little further north towards cedar key. that's where we anticipate the potential for winds of 110 miles per hour. any jog to the west or east can have major implications. and this is very important, too, phil. notice the wind swath going right through the florida peninsula. gainesville to jacksonville, tallahassee, you also have the potential for destructive winds from this storm. phil? >> keep us updated on all of those important developments there. we also want to note that governor ron desantis and the florida division of emergency management will be holding a press conference at the top of the hour with the latest updates. we'll keep you posted on that, as well. all right. experts are warning travelers to brace for a very busy labor day weekend. that traditionally marks the end of summer, of course, and that's the end of the travel season, and international travel is expected to be much higher this year. cnn's pete muntean is joining us live from washington dulles international airport, where i'm pretty sure you live. so. we know this is the end of the summer travel, what should travelers do? i don't know what bracing for anything means, but it feels like you just stop in your tracks. what should travelers expecting this labor day weekend? >> you know, sarah, i was even a bit surprised by this, because labor day is kind of a driving road trip holiday, but even the road trip kings, aaa, say that international air travel is through the roof for labor day. these are the numbers from aaa. up 44% in international bookings compared to last labor day weekend. maybe not a fair comparison. a lot of people were still discouraged by international travel, the international testing mandate was in place until june, but look at these numbers from united airlines. united says that international bookings are up 35% compared to 2019. kind of the last normal year before the pandemic. here are the top destinations, vancouver, a lot of people trying to get to cooler temperatures. also a big surge in bookings in europe, rome, paris, dublin, london, al of people just trying to go across the pond for the long weekend. so the big point here is just expect really big crowds, and there are a lot of big tips that you can do here. experts say make sure that you build in a buffer day if you are still booking. a lot of people still concerned about cancellations and delays. you heard the warnings about a potential hurricane hitting florida. and then also, make sure that you think about getting the app from the airline. that's the best way to get that information about cancellation and delays. my big tip, sign up for global industry when you come through the airport. the line here is for customs at dulles have been huge. you don't have to make an appointment if you come through customs and go straight to global entry. you can do the interview there without an appointment, typically. it's been a mad house here, sarah, especially in the evenings when people are leaving for those international flights. you've got to do everything you can to try to make it easy and book a morning flight. that's the other big one. if you make a morning flight it, makes it less likely to get cancellations and delays. >> can you go ahead and tell the bosses at nbc that i probably won't make it to work on wednesday, because i'll be flying. just let them know. >> you're also going to vancouver like everybody else. >> yeah. >> thank you, pete. >> yeah. well, this morning, president biden and defense secretary lloyd austin are offering their condolences to the families of three marine base killed in an osprey aircraft accident in australia. president biden writing, jill and i send our deepest condolences to the families of the marine base that lost their lives in this deadly crash. we are praying for those who also suffered injuries. the u.s. military says 23 u.s. marine base were flying in an mv-22b osprey when it crashed. rescue crews worked together to transport the injured from a remote island to a hospital in the northern part of the country. five marines were seriously injured. the cause of that accident is being investigated. on friday, three ukrainian pilots died in a plane crash about 90 miles west of kyiv during a combat mission there. one of those pilots was andrey pilshchykov who went by the call sign juice. that is what he was famous for. he told cnn that his friends d gave him a nickname to the united states because he does not drink alcohol and was always ordering juice instead. the ukrainian pilot appeared on cnn many times in the early weeks of russia's invasion, talking about his efforts to protect ukraine's skies from russian strikes, always obscuring his identity for security reasons. listen. >> it was the first day, we were trying to hold our skies, trying to defend our cities, our families, our hospitals, and our critical infrastructure. so as for me, i am sitting in anti-intercepter russian targets, russian strikes. >> ukrainian president volodymyr zelenskyy called the crash a, quote, disaster and praised juice for his great service to his country. a ukraine spokesman said that he was not just a pilot, he was a young officer with mega knowledge and mega talent. he dreamed of f-16s in the ukrainian sky. the u.s. has just announced that it would start training ukrainian pilots on f-16 fighter jets that they have been asking for months now in october. the ukrainian air force remembered the three fallen pilots in this special ceremony where they enscribed the names of the deceased pilots on a piano that played a brief melody and the piano was set on fire as the, quote, pilot's soul takes off into an eternal flight. well, despite four criminal indictments and a commanding lead over his fellow republican candidates, former president trump has somehow largely avoided criticism from his opponents. harry tenten is here to show us why trump's rival respect attacking him. wake up, achievers. you're making the most of every hour of your life. except the hours that you' sleeping. so why do we leave so much unpped potential on the table? th is a next level bed, for a next level you. my circadian rhythm is kicki your circadian 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gop president's rivals to attack him in an attempt to eat into that support, which stands north of 50% for the primary vote. yet most of his opponents seem hesitant if not totally unwilling to do so. it has been my biggest question, harry enten, over the course of several weeks, if you're losing by a lot, go after the guy who's beating you by a lot. and yet, harry, what's today's number? >> all right, what phil says makes a lot of sense. that's a first for him. this morning's number is minus 44 points. that's chris christie's net favorability rating among republicans. that is the worst on record for any presidential candidate within his own party, dating back since at least 1980 at this point in the primary. minus 44 points. that's why you don't attack donald trump, because if you attack donald trump, you become unpopular with republicans. it's not just chris christie at minus 44 points. how about asa hutchinson, minus 18 points net favorability rating. far more republicans have a unfavorable view than a favorable view. how about mike pence? minus 17 points. will herd wasn't even on the debate stage, even he has a net negative favorability rating at minus 17 points. did you hear the pun intended with the heard and hurd there? so who's gained? who has done well or boosted their favorability? >> who are the two people who have seen the biggest gains in their net favorability ratings? tim scott is really sort of running in his own lane, running on this positive message, not attacking donald trump, but not praising him necessarily either. how about vivek ramaswamy who is basically praying at the cult of donald trump, plus 30 points. so basically, you can't go against trump. you can go down the middle, try not to mention him, or praise him. either one of those pathways work. the other thing i will note, what do republicans want? gop voters, the case trump's rivals should make at debates. against trump, just 9% say they should make the case against themselves, for themselves, 91%. why they're not attacking donald trump, because, simply put, it doesn't work. it's not what republicans want from the candidates besides donald trump. >> well, it's working for the people who aren't attacking, because they're also down by 40. harry, can we hang out a little bit more? >> let's go hang out. >> so this is how you do it. all right, joining us again, they've been so patient with us, sarah matthews and philip bump are also here with harry, who has an unlimited amount of energy so. oh, and -- >> are you for real right now? >> i'm really, really tired. >> just because he's not on set doesn't mean -- astead, we're going to start with you. >> i'm sorry, astead. as somebody who, "a," has always listened to the pod and reads your reporting and doesn't forget that you're here, just because you're not on set with us, but also, i actually deeply respect your reporting and opinion on these matters. nothing is working right now to some degree if you're a republican primary opponent of the former president. when you talk to campaigns, do they have some grand plan to at some point launch something that changes the dynamic? >> i think there's a little bit of a circle i can help square from harry there. the numbers really make no sense, to his point. it is increasingly clear that there are a group of republicans who are looking for an alternative that is not donald trump. and you have these republicans that are unwilling to do there. the other thing that happened, there was an assumption coming into this year that the legal problems of donald trump and the combination of the midterm results would kind of do the work for them. these campaigns thought that he would just naturally drop off in terms of favorability and support because there was such a universal cry from republicans after the midterms that they didn't see the returns they would, and they knew these indictments would be coming down the pike. the idea was some of these would drop off that support. and i think for some of the candidates, the feeling was that once donald trump was a diminished figure, then they could go attack him more fr frontally and see better returns from it. the wild part, that's not born out from any scope of the imagination. and you still have candidates sticking to that message. when you go back to them and say, is it going to be this time or this time? they always punt the ball further down the line. i asked this last at the debate. why aren't people going for donald trump? the thing is, they still want to be this alternative, you want to be the number two before you do it. they keep punting the kind of responsibility down the line. and in doing so, they have not created a permission structure for the voters to find an alternative or coalesce around someone else. it was an idea that was based on a hunch, but has never actually been borne out in the evidence. they were looking for others to do the work for them. >> sarah, i want to go to you. i remember, there was this wonderful analysis by zachary wolf, who writes these great pieces that give you some insight. and he talked about the interview bill barr did. and this is just sort of gives you some sense. he was on a mission to stop donald trump from, you know, ruining democracy. but he said that he may still vote for him. what's going on there? and is that sort of the sentiment of those who worked around donald trump who want nothing to do with him, but, if he's the nominee, they say, already, i'm going to go with the party. >> yeah, it's really disappointing to see a lot of republicans who have come out and said that. i mean, even on the debate stage the other night, they did a show of hands, if donald trump is convicted, would you still support him as the nominee? and nearly everyone on stage raised their hands, except for asa hutchinson, to his credit, and chris christie kind of waffled, not sure what he was doing there. but it is disappointing to see, because i'm someone who believes that, obviously, he'll have his day in court, but if he's convicted of these crimes, then i do not want him to be the standard-bearer of the republican party. but he still have deeply popular with republican voters. so that is what these, you know, rivals of him are going to have trouble with is making the case for why voters should support them over trump without alienating his supporters. >> phil, to astead's point, as an ohio state guy, we don't now much about punting. but the idea, they keep punting, they keep punting, is there going to become a tipping point or >> i think this last number that harry pointed out, only 9% say you shouldn't actually go after trump. if there was something that worked people would be punting, but to harry's point, again, the fact that nothing is working is the disincentive. part of the challenge is the one thing we saw worked after the 2022 midterms we saw people coming out saying donald trump is tanking this party, we are lose and not regaining power and that was the point at which ron desantis came up and tied with trump. that's a hard message to carry over. it's especially hard to say this guy is a looser when you are losing to him by 40 points. how do you make that case? >> i think the loser part is a key part. right now all we have are these indictments. what happens if there's actually a conviction? if that occurs and occurs before actually votes are cast or during the primary it will be a very interesting situation going on in the republican primary. the problem is there may not be a conviction until midway through 2024 if there is one at all and the primary votes are cast, counted and donald trump is the nominee. it's like nailing jello to a wall. i don't know how do you it but the way they're doing it isn't working. >> that was a good analogy, nailing jello to a wall. >> thank you very much. the little league world series for the ages, the dramatic game tying at-bat and the walk off. that's next. : why did we choose safelite? we were loading our suv when... crack! safelite came right to us, and we could see exactly when they'd arrive with a replacement we could trust. that's serervice the way we want it. >> singers: ♪ safafelite repai, safelite replace. ♪ tryingng vapes to quit smoking might feel like progress, but with 3x more nicotine than a pack of cigarettes - vapes increase cravings - nicorette reduces cravings until they're gone fogood. for moms, from centrum. ♪ this new mom ♪ ♪ here i go ♪ ♪ i am strong and brave i know ♪ ♪ with a little time for me ♪ ♪ no doubt i will get through ♪ ♪ loving me is loving you ♪ ♪ new from centrum. the women's choice multivitamin brand. i have been waiting two hours and 54 minutes for this, our morning moment. a little league world series for the ages, el segundo, california, was up four runs against curacao when there was a grand slam. soon the teammates will be swarming him at the plate. coaches going wild, too. america crushed, my children crushed in the bottom of the sixth this happened. >> and this game is over! >> america redeemed. that was louis lappe becoming an instant legend hitting a walkoff home run to win. el segundo crowned champs. they got messages of support from lebron james, several los angeles dodgers playing. the team from japan who was eliminated on wednesday, but stuck around to give high-fives and take selfies with the winners. i love it. i love williamsport. i love the little league world series. louis lappe is 6'1" and just drops bombs. >> crazy. just for the fact that it was california, i'm going back to cali, to cali, i'm literally going back -- never mind. >> i appreciate you. >> going back to cali next week. >> i appreciate you, but i also appreciate the u.s. winning the little league world series championship. >> fair enough. thank you. >> thanks for doing this. listen, i will come back tomorrow. >> yes, you will. >> as long as there's coffee. >> we will bring coffee. >> excellent. just to remind everyone, we are watching tropical storm idalia, we are waiting for the governor, also a presidential candidate, ron desantis, to have a press conference on that. that is ahead. stay with us. "cnn news central," my people, start in just a bit. 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